| --- Log opened Mon May 26 00:00:15 2014 | ||
| @fenn | what is precision | 00:06 |
|---|---|---|
| @fenn | i think it makes most sense to talk about precision in percentages | 00:07 |
| @fenn | holding micron tolerance over 1mm is different than over 1m | 00:07 |
| @fenn | i wonder how hard it would be to make a solar pumped laser crystal from scratch | 00:08 |
| kanzure | i mean something that the machinists would actually use | 00:08 |
| kanzure | some of them seem to be of the opinion that if it costs less than $50k, they don't want it | 00:08 |
| @fenn | paperbot: http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1994SPIE.2121...58L | 00:09 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/714461f5883f507aef53984efb3eb007.txt | 00:09 |
| @fenn | what machinists | 00:09 |
| @fenn | paperbot: http://www.mill-creek-systems.com/HighLift/Climbers/solar_laser_SPIE1.pdf | 00:10 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/aca4ba49fe7ebfb272f2c19bd78c4fd6.pdf | 00:10 |
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| @fenn | geoffrey landis is some kind of space technology god | 00:11 |
| kanzure | fenn, http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/cnc-machining/why-cnc-machining-so-expensive-263261/ | 00:13 |
| kanzure | fenn: these guys laugh for like 9 pages of text at this guy for even asking | 00:13 |
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| kanzure | wouldn't it be better overall if a metal-capable cnc machine cost less than $200k? | 00:15 |
| kanzure | why is that idea laughable | 00:15 |
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| @fenn | He has published 400 scientific papers in the fields of photovoltaics and astronautics, holds seven patents on photovoltaic device designs, ... flown the human-powered airplane "Chrysalis", was a member of the Sojourner Rover team, driving the rovers "Spirit" and "Opportunity", published Hans Moravec's speculative essay "Pigs in CyberSpace", and Vernor Vinge's article on The Technological | 00:15 |
| @fenn | Singularity, and perhaps more importantly posted a lot to usenet | 00:15 |
| @fenn | kanzure there are plenty of big iron machines laying around, the bigger the cheaper | 00:16 |
| @fenn | i guess you want a "new" machine tho | 00:16 |
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| kanzure | "and perhaps more importantly posted a lot to usenet" does it really say that | 00:17 |
| @fenn | no | 00:17 |
| kanzure | foo | 00:17 |
| kanzure | all these "capital goods" are expensive for no good reason | 00:18 |
| kanzure | why should lab equipment, machining equipment, semiconductor manufacturing equipment, medical equipment, etc., all be so expensive | 00:18 |
| @fenn | yes i was going to say something about the "somebody else's money" problem | 00:18 |
| @fenn | nobody would plunk down the price of a house if it was their money | 00:18 |
| @fenn | "oh guess i'm gonna have to get a mortgage on my CNC machine" | 00:19 |
| kanzure | it looks like there are tax benefits to purchasing "capital equipment" | 00:19 |
| kanzure | lots of tax writeoffs | 00:19 |
| kanzure | or tax benefits | 00:19 |
| @fenn | whatever | 00:19 |
| @fenn | even air conditioners are expensive | 00:19 |
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| kanzure | are they? how expensive? | 00:19 |
| @fenn | i dunno, cost per pound is probably the same as a cnc machine tho | 00:20 |
| kanzure | i imagine air conditioners weigh less | 00:20 |
| @fenn | 4-ton 13 SEER heat pump/AC Amount: $3,450 | 00:20 |
| kanzure | so anyway, for most of the "capital goods", i don't see a reason for the high prices | 00:20 |
| @fenn | that can't be right | 00:21 |
| kanzure | "low volume" is a poor justification for higher pricing.. maybe if it was 10,000% cheaper, you would sell more. | 00:21 |
| @fenn | ok "4-ton" is just a normal house sized AC | 00:22 |
| kanzure | semiconductor manufacturing equipment has apparently been increasing in price from $30k/device to $300k/device for a hwile now | 00:22 |
| kanzure | and everyone complains about multi-billion dollar fabs | 00:22 |
| kanzure | well maybe if you actually focused on cheap equipment, you wouldn't have to spend a few billion for every facility | 00:22 |
| @fenn | but they already have cheap equipment... the old fabs that still exist | 00:23 |
| kanzure | $32 billion/year is spent on semiconductor manufacturing equipment | 00:23 |
| @fenn | is that 23nm or whatever, or is there spending on new "old" technology | 00:23 |
| @fenn | stupid words | 00:23 |
| kanzure | yes i think it includes spending on old technology | 00:24 |
| @fenn | what proportion of spending is "experimental" "testing" "stable" "oldstable" "deprecated" | 00:24 |
| kanzure | well, all of the devices are manually built, so it's hard to tell if it's just "old inventory" or "built to order" | 00:24 |
| kanzure | super-deprecated equipment in that industry probably gets donated to universities for their foundries | 00:25 |
| kanzure | and then i'm sure there's a refurbishment lifecycle of crap | 00:25 |
| kanzure | like in the life sciences | 00:26 |
| @fenn | i doubt it.. i see a lot of high tech crap getting shredded in scrapyards | 00:27 |
| kanzure | "capital equipment" is stuff you use to do more stuff | 00:27 |
| @fenn | right | 00:27 |
| @fenn | that's the definition of capital | 00:27 |
| kanzure | and basically every industry that has any relevance to transhumanist industry has "expensive" capital equipment | 00:27 |
| @fenn | .wik capital | 00:27 |
| yoleaux | "Disambiguation: Capital" — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital | 00:27 |
| @fenn | .d capital | 00:27 |
| kanzure | and it is stupid and wrong | 00:28 |
| yoleaux | capital¹ (/ˈkapɪt(ə)l/): n. 1. The city or town that functions as the seat of government and administrative centre of a country or region: Warsaw is the ⁓ of Poland; adj. 1. (Of an offence or charge) liable to the death penalty: murder is the only ⁓ crime in the state; excl. Used to express approval, satisfaction, or delight: That’s splendid! Capital! — http://is.gd/TwJuce | 00:28 |
| @fenn | ugh words | 00:28 |
| kanzure | .d capital good | 00:28 |
| yoleaux | kanzure: Sorry, that command (.d) crashed. | 00:28 |
| @fenn | .wik capital (economics) | 00:28 |
| yoleaux | "In economics, capital goods, real capital, or capital assets are already-produced durable goods or any non-financial asset that is used in production of goods or services." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_(economics) | 00:28 |
| kanzure | what would be so bad about $3k equipment that builds 10 micron wafers, for example | 00:29 |
| @fenn | who would use it? | 00:29 |
| @fenn | i mean, it would be a great kickstarter project | 00:30 |
| kanzure | people who don't have $6 billion for a wafer fab, or who don't have $100k for MOSIS, or who don't have $20k for an asic run | 00:30 |
| kanzure | lower prices means that more people have it because of the long tail of poor people | 00:30 |
| @fenn | you could sell one to at least ten hackerspaces | 00:30 |
| kanzure | *more people have at least that much money | 00:30 |
| kanzure | *because there are more people with less money | 00:31 |
| @fenn | les says that rich people optimize for the number of checks they have to write | 00:31 |
| kanzure | i'm down to 0 so i must be doing something right | 00:31 |
| @fenn | if they can write one check for ten times the amount vs 10 checks for one tenth the amount, they'll go with the one check | 00:31 |
| kanzure | (fuck checks) | 00:31 |
| kanzure | what's interesting is that it's cheaper to hire someone to build a cnc machine than it is to buy a new cnc machine | 00:32 |
| kanzure | and you can fire the person when they're done, which is easier than paying off a mortgage or something | 00:32 |
| @fenn | yep | 00:33 |
| @fenn | this is what you call an economic crisis | 00:33 |
| kanzure | why not undercut everyone- hire someone and build cheap cnc machines; hire someone and build cheap thermocyclers; hire someone and build cheap AFMs, etc. | 00:33 |
| @fenn | are you functioning as a user of the machines, or re-selling them? | 00:34 |
| kanzure | let's hypothetically sell them | 00:34 |
| @fenn | ok then you have to add some profit margin to it (right? (?)) | 00:35 |
| kanzure | actually, let's assume no | 00:35 |
| @fenn | ok then there's at least overhead of "doing business" for example taxes | 00:35 |
| kanzure | that's normal | 00:35 |
| @fenn | so let's estimate overhead at 50% | 00:35 |
| kanzure | paying employees, material costs | 00:35 |
| kanzure | wasn't there a mass-produced car that cost less than $1k? | 00:38 |
| @fenn | i can't believe those practicalmachinist guys cited "toilet paper" as a reason cnc machining is so expensive | 00:39 |
| kanzure | the operator's time is "expensive" (only $60-$80/hour, pretty cheap), but they missed his other question about the equipment | 00:41 |
| kanzure | and they cite all the $200 lego cnc machine things, which are obviously not in the same market | 00:41 |
| @fenn | This guy will be laughing all the way to the bank when he takes 10 500$ cnc machines, put larger motors in them, then pay a single operator to run all 10 of them as they run pretty much unattended 24/7/365. He'll put us all out of business with his 10$/hour shop rate, expand the size of his shop to 50 500$ machines, while adding a second operator, and will be a billionaire before long. | 00:41 |
| kanzure | but if there was a $200 hextatic thing, i bet they would use it | 00:41 |
| @fenn | i'm assuming this was meant as a sarcastic comment, but i don't see anything wrong with the plan | 00:41 |
| @fenn | if an operator is running 10 machines that's only $6-8/hr in "shop time" | 00:42 |
| @fenn | let's say $10/hr with overhead | 00:42 |
| kanzure | your machinsts cost $8/hour? | 00:42 |
| kanzure | *machinists | 00:42 |
| @fenn | no, the machinist costs $60/hr | 00:42 |
| @fenn | or am i misunderstanding how they quote things | 00:43 |
| kanzure | i bet they bill by machine time + operator time, so that operators doing non-machining things can still bill | 00:43 |
| kanzure | ("trying to understand your shitty dxf: 5 hours") | 00:44 |
| @fenn | that's too logical | 00:44 |
| kanzure | they aren't stupid | 00:44 |
| @fenn | who was it that had the website that automatically validated your cad files so you wouldnt waste their time? | 00:44 |
| kanzure | emachineshop? | 00:44 |
| @fenn | yeah that might have been it | 00:44 |
| kanzure | hey look i fucking knew something for once | 00:44 |
| @fenn | oh, no you have to use emachineshop's software | 00:45 |
| kanzure | was it nick pinkston's cloudfab thing? | 00:45 |
| kanzure | would have been for 3d printing only | 00:45 |
| @fenn | i dunno. could have been cloudfab. anyway, the idea makes a lot of sense | 00:46 |
| @fenn | let the customer waste their own time if they're morons | 00:46 |
| kanzure | so you prefer the "sell a service" instead of "sell equipment" model of http://transcriptic.com/ ? | 00:47 |
| @fenn | i'm reading the "why are cnc machines so expensive" thread and it's mostly about running a machine shop, not selling cnc machines | 00:47 |
| kanzure | they mention the cheap machines deep in the thread somewhere | 00:48 |
| kanzure | it's either (1) elitism, or (2) there genuinely isn't a good cheap cnc machine anywhere to be found | 00:48 |
| @fenn | "Why not use high speed brushless motors instead, like they do on remote controlled airplanes? You can get a $500 motor with 6kw of power or so and it weighs less than 2 pounds." | 00:49 |
| @fenn | 6kw? | 00:50 |
| @fenn | that's kinda a lot | 00:50 |
| kanzure | for the low-end $400k cnc machines, i think they get away with those prices because of maintenance and service contracts | 00:52 |
| @fenn | "'d answer more of your points but i'm busy and its not worth my time trying to convince you that you are way off base in your cost analysis and the ability of machines to just do everything for you" this is what's wrong with the world | 00:52 |
| @fenn | maintenance and service contracts are required | 00:53 |
| @fenn | you aren't allowed to open the machine yourself, under penalty of death | 00:53 |
| kanzure | mazak cnc machines are, apparently, the most expensive http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-utdCwdJRDcI/UfFuDqHPEjI/AAAAAAAAAG4/wzY4M7VZf3k/s1600/maza1.jpg | 00:53 |
| kanzure | those control panels are so stupid- why are they still around? | 00:54 |
| @fenn | some pics of a $5k 1980's mazak i worked on: http://fenn.freeshell.org/retrofest/default.html | 00:54 |
| @fenn | not saying it's the same thing, but when a $5k machine does everything you need why spend $500k | 00:55 |
| @fenn | whats with the guys in jumpsuits chemically bonded to the control panels | 00:55 |
| kanzure | it's to make them look important | 00:56 |
| @fenn | they are like lego figurines | 00:56 |
| kanzure | cnc jumpsuits... hah. | 00:56 |
| @fenn | the claw snaps onto the control panel's locking bar | 00:56 |
| kanzure | "this equipment is so fucking expensive that you have to wear the special uniform" | 00:56 |
| kanzure | cnc rangers http://www.comicpalooza.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/powerrangersimage.jpg | 00:57 |
| @fenn | lame | 00:57 |
| @fenn | you'd think they would be wearing white jumpsuits to match the machine | 00:57 |
| @fenn | with red-orange trim | 00:58 |
| kanzure | nah they are matching the floor | 00:58 |
| kanzure | to indicate their social status | 00:58 |
| @fenn | so the guy with the blue tie is the insecure middle manager? | 00:58 |
| kanzure | well insecurity breeds excess adipose tissue, so it's the fat one | 00:59 |
| @fenn | all this communist/capitalist symbolism is so awkward, like people still believe in this stuff? | 00:59 |
| kanzure | "well it costs so much, so it must be basically magic" | 01:00 |
| @fenn | those membrane keyboards are so awful | 01:00 |
| @fenn | "chips get in your keyboard? make it smooth vertical, because everyone loves microwave ovens!" | 01:00 |
| kanzure | "usb? never heard of it" | 01:00 |
| @fenn | can you imagine if your job was to push numbers on a microwave oven all day, and if you screwed up it cost $100k to fix it and possibly kills someone | 01:01 |
| @fenn | like wtf, chips in your keyboard? get a new fucking keyboard! | 01:01 |
| @fenn | throw the old one in the trash with the $500 endmill you just broke | 01:02 |
| @fenn | now bill the customer $5000 for "shop time" | 01:02 |
| @fenn | problem solved | 01:02 |
| kanzure | if these industries are competitive, why don't prices fall dramatically? | 01:04 |
| kanzure | they really can't figure out how to make a $10k cnc? really? | 01:05 |
| @fenn | i think there's a big potential for concrete framed machining center kits | 01:05 |
| kanzure | does the concrete experience stress | 01:06 |
| @fenn | then you just have to ship some bits of metal and instructions and bags of concrete, instead of some delicate thing | 01:06 |
| @fenn | there's something called epoxy granite which is basically crushed rock in resin. it doesn't warp the way portland cement does | 01:06 |
| @fenn | but honestly a month's cure time before you grout the ways is enough for most things | 01:06 |
| @fenn | (if using portlant) | 01:07 |
| @fenn | portland cement* | 01:07 |
| @fenn | the concrete is mostly there for mass and vibration damping | 01:07 |
| @fenn | the steel framing is what provides the rigidity | 01:07 |
| Viper168_ | and jimmy dean provides the sausage? | 01:08 |
| @fenn | do you have anything constructive to add | 01:08 |
| @fenn | getting enough sass from this practicalmachinist thread | 01:09 |
| kanzure | i'm trying to imagine the equivalent biology thread | 01:10 |
| kanzure | a bunch of postdocs saying "this is a real industry boy, where everyone is paid $8.50/hour to slave over $100k equipment" | 01:10 |
| @fenn | well not really, they can't afford the $100k equipment | 01:10 |
| kanzure | labs? sure they do | 01:11 |
| @fenn | "everyone takes out a loan for the privilege of working over a sweaty lightbulb and some jello" | 01:11 |
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| kanzure | and the biotech companies just use leases, loans, mortgages, etc | 01:11 |
| @fenn | heh sorry i was thinking academia | 01:11 |
| kanzure | academic labs often have expensive toys | 01:12 |
| kanzure | sometimes still under service warranty etc | 01:12 |
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| @fenn | wtf world do these people come from "once you move out of mom's basement you'll realize that $60/hr is not enough to live on" | 01:13 |
| juri_ | heh. | 01:13 |
| @fenn | seems like the real problem is they are busy making parts to 0.01mm because that's the default setting in the cad program and the customer doesn't know any better, "oh well, i guess CNC machining is just expensive!" | 01:15 |
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| juri_ | i really wish my hands still worked reliably. you and kanzure have been talking about a lot of things close to my heart. | 01:16 |
| jrayhawk_ | What's wrong? | 01:16 |
| @fenn | juri_: have you tried speech to text software? | 01:16 |
| @fenn | jrayhawk_: rsi | 01:16 |
| juri_ | carpel tunnel RSI etc... | 01:16 |
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| juri_ | fenn: takes keyboard time to try the stuff. | 01:17 |
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| jrayhawk_ | I used to get that occasionally, but it's pretty rare since I switched over to a non-immunogenic diet. | 01:18 |
| juri_ | i also only use free software, so... not hopeful. | 01:18 |
| juri_ | ... | 01:18 |
| jrayhawk_ | I have to be *really* asking for it with stupid bouldering maneuvers now. | 01:19 |
| @fenn | there are a few out there like "simon" | 01:19 |
| @fenn | i thought it was called "julian" actually | 01:20 |
| juri_ | i really need a button on my keyboard mapped to "i'm terribly sorry, but my hands hurt too much to continue talking" | 01:21 |
| jrayhawk_ | there's also stuff like dasher | 01:21 |
| * juri_ ... | 01:21 | |
| @fenn | juri_: just mount it on your forehead so you can bang your head against the wall repeatedly | 01:21 |
| jrayhawk_ | haha | 01:21 |
| juri_ | LOL! :) | 01:21 |
| @fenn | my mom used dragon for a while after hand surgery, it takes a couple weeks to learn your voice and then all of a sudden it starts working | 01:22 |
| juri_ | i'm continuing to build strange 3d printers... | 01:22 |
| @fenn | "Julius is a high-performance, two-pass large vocabulary continuous speech recognition (LVCSR) decoder software for speech-related researchers and developers." | 01:22 |
| juri_ | fenn: free software? | 01:23 |
| gradstudentbot | My experiment was working a second ago, but now it doesn't even work. | 01:23 |
| @fenn | it's in ubuntu | 01:23 |
| @fenn | i wonder why theres no "license: " field in the .deb metadata | 01:24 |
| juri_ | 'revised BSD style license' | 01:25 |
| juri_ | ... | 01:25 |
| juri_ | "i'm terribly sorry, but my hands hurt too much to continue talking" | 01:25 |
| juri_ | keep hacking. | 01:26 |
| @fenn | i guess this is "unmodified BSD" http://julius.sourceforge.jp/LICENSE.txt | 01:27 |
| @fenn | When you publish or present any results by using the Software, you | 01:27 |
| @fenn | must explicitly mention your use of "Large Vocabulary Continuous | 01:27 |
| @fenn | Speech Recognition Engine Julius". | 01:27 |
| gradstudentbot | I could never be a PI. | 01:28 |
| @fenn | she was a tall cool stack of affinity bead gel, sauntering into my office on a hot summer's day. the fan ticked off the minutes, the cover page of her report rustling uncomfortably on my desk. | 01:30 |
| @fenn | "baby, you still haven't answered" she moaned. how did i ever get into this mess. try to please everyone and you end up with no-one on your side. i just hoped for her sake that bad vinny never found out. | 01:31 |
| juri_ | when i said that i would rather die than accept non-free software into my life, i did not expect the universe to come up with a nearly worse than death option: software developer/IRC addict without useful hands. | 01:32 |
| @fenn | it was a two-car-garage operation. we supplied the brains, they supplied the space. how it ended up with litigation in patent court is a story for another day. | 01:33 |
| @fenn | - excerpt from "truth hurts, or: how i learned to stop worrying and become a private investigator" | 01:34 |
| @fenn | .title http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olimG2HJ3ys | 01:41 |
| yoleaux | Picard Getting Shot At | 01:41 |
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| @fenn | post-singularity ersatz homoerotic existentialist canon: http://youtube.com/watch?v=vZ7CGBM4JJo | 01:52 |
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| dingo | i tried to get you that doc kanzure, failed | 03:33 |
| dingo | JSTOR is replacing Literatum with a new homegrown in-house platform under development now. So they moved most of the developers to the new project and we no longer have access to anything to do with Literatum (including code , wiki,documentation, etc). So I know the project still exists but I can't access those wiki pages or code. | 03:33 |
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| dingo | so the very person who wrote it | 03:34 |
| dingo | no longer has access to it haw haw haw | 03:34 |
| dingo | anyway things got a lot worse since i left, quoting | 03:34 |
| dingo | The app is still active. AT team removed the RDAS server (decommissioned it), but JSTOR still need to get the data to google scholar. So I think XXX (do you remember him? JSTOR fired him last year too) wrote a massive shell script to pull the data from Literatum instead of RDAS. So the app now only serves the generated files to google. | 03:35 |
| dingo | so metadata is now gently served using shell scripts | 03:35 |
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| jrayhawk_ | posix shell is the best cgi language | 03:42 |
| jrayhawk_ | nothing quite like elaborate and fragile nested "while read" loops with different IFS settings and printfs to parse query strings | 03:44 |
| jrayhawk_ | profound regret builds character | 03:45 |
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| seba--- | kanzure, i will work for free | 03:51 |
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| kanzure | seba---: can i get that in the form of a blood oath? | 07:16 |
| seba--- | lol | 07:18 |
| seba--- | kanzure, well if i would get 25k/y i would be super happy | 07:18 |
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| kanzure | what skills do you have again | 07:19 |
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| seba--- | kanzure, i don't know, i'm finishing my BSc from chemistry, writing my BSc thesis, will go to a MSc now, also in chemistry | 07:21 |
| seba--- | i like to do DIY shit and i did a lot of programming lol | 07:21 |
| kanzure | no no, i said skills | 07:22 |
| kanzure | programming counts, but a degree doesn't | 07:22 |
| seba--- | kanzure, i can make scientific equipment i guess, i know electronics, i can improvise a lot lol | 07:22 |
| seba--- | made a geiger counter before fukushima, that is without using 32423423 schematics from the interwebz | 07:23 |
| seba--- | or kits | 07:23 |
| chris_99 | surely it does if you made cool stuff during it kanzure | 07:23 |
| seba--- | which are highly available now | 07:23 |
| chris_99 | whatcha use it for? | 07:24 |
| seba--- | chris_99, oh, well it was funny, in the week i've made the first prototype, fukushima happened lol | 07:25 |
| seba--- | i've used it to show the people that there's no difference in radiation lol | 07:25 |
| kanzure | anyone who can say "fukushima happened lol" in a sinle sentence is hireworthy | 07:25 |
| kanzure | *single | 07:25 |
| seba--- | lol | 07:26 |
| chris_99 | do gieger tubes, use around 200V or something? | 07:27 |
| seba--- | mine uses 400 V and i think it's the lowest | 07:27 |
| chris_99 | aha | 07:27 |
| chris_99 | what kind of PSU does it use | 07:27 |
| seba--- | i've made it | 07:28 |
| seba--- | it's very simple | 07:28 |
| seba--- | uses all of the shelf components | 07:28 |
| seba--- | not like common designs which need a special transformer | 07:28 |
| kanzure | "profound regret builds character" | 07:30 |
| seba--- | what do you mean by that? | 07:34 |
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| eudoxia | something about using shell scripts as a web application | 07:37 |
| seba--- | lol | 07:38 |
| gradstudentbot | Let's have a pset party. | 07:41 |
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| kanzure | way to be a buzzkill, gradstudentbot | 08:32 |
| gradstudentbot | The fluorescent microscope is broken. | 08:32 |
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| chris_99 | nmz787, is your project on hackaday.io | 09:44 |
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| delinquentme | kanzure, I missed that conclusion? I definitely don't remember saying that they wern't passwords | 10:08 |
| delinquentme | additionally we're setting a solid precedent | 10:09 |
| delinquentme | ParahSailin, if you want to get in on this | 10:09 |
| kanzure | if they are passwords, then they shouldn't be in there | 10:09 |
| kanzure | i don't know what we're talking about | 10:09 |
| kanzure | or why ParahSailin is being brought in | 10:09 |
| delinquentme | ok cool so then its settled. | 10:13 |
| delinquentme | libgen is treating these as some kind of login creds and if we expand on the codebase at all we'll want a way to add in additional passwords so external files work fine by me | 10:14 |
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| kanzure | fenn, why is shopbot more expensive than a new car? | 11:18 |
| kanzure | also, what about just using waterjets | 11:18 |
| gradstudentbot | Who used the last of the growth medium? | 11:21 |
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| kanzure | brikwars has rules? | 12:00 |
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| kanzure | [2014-05-26 14:40:05] BlackArrowBitFuryGPIO failed to modprobe i2c-dev (256) - | 12:40 |
| kanzure | you need to be root? | 12:40 |
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| kanzure | is it asking me or telling me | 12:40 |
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| kanzure | (i'm not actually mining, i promise, i was just checking if i had cgminer installed) | 13:11 |
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| jrayhawk_ | re: brikwars: after a fashion | 13:32 |
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| kanzure | i see | 14:10 |
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| kanzure | https://github.com/OogieM/sheep_eid_hw | 15:49 |
| kanzure | "I met the author of this software over the weekend -- she runs a single-breed sheep farm in the North Fork valley in Colorado, and gathers data for the USDA, tracks the genetic lines of all their sheep, and so on. She was telling me that the commercial alternatives for the electronic tag-reading hardware can cost $1000+, but they were able to build a reader that communicates via Bluetooth with an Android device for less than $100." | 15:49 |
| kanzure | http://lambtracker.com/ | 15:49 |
| kanzure | http://www.volokh.com/posts/chain_1240849478.shtml "The invention of the sewing machine in the antebellum era was an achievement on par with the latest high-tech or pharmaceutical discovery today. This paper presents the first comprehensive empirical study by a legal scholar of the invention, patenting and commercialization of the sewing machine in the nineteenth century. In so doing, it challenges many assumptions by courts and scholars ... | 15:51 |
| kanzure | ... today about the alleged efficiency-choking complexities of the modern patent system, revealing that complementary inventions, extensive patent litigation, so-called “patent trolls,†patent thickets, and privately formed patent pools have long been features of the American patent system reaching back to the antebellum era. This is particularly significant with respect to patent thickets, as there is a vigorous debate on whether ... | 15:51 |
| kanzure | ... patent thickets exist. The sewing machine patent thicket -- called the “Sewing Machine War†-- confirms that patent thickets are not just a theoretical construct. But the Sewing Machine War also reveals how patent-owners have strong incentives to resolve patent thickets." | 15:51 |
| kanzure | "With respect to the mechanical issue, the invention of a practical and commercially successful sewing machine comprised ten complementary elements. These ten elements were first explicitly identified by Andrew Jack in an oft-cited 1958 article: (1) the sewing of a lockstitch, (2) the use of an eye-pointed needle, (3) a shuttle carrying a second thread, (4) a continuous source of thread (spools), (5) a horizontal table, (6) an arm overhanging ... | 15:53 |
| gradstudentbot | Sorry about that. | 15:53 |
| kanzure | ... the table that contained a vertically positioned eye-pointed needle, (7) a continuous feed of the clothe (synchronized with the needle motion), (8) tension controls for the thread that give slack as needed, (9) a presser foot to hold the clothe in place with each stitch, and (10) the ability to sew in either straight or curved lines. The first sewing machine to incorporate all ten of these elements was the famous “Singer Sewing ... | 15:53 |
| kanzure | ... Machine,†which was first sold to the public in the fall of 1850. But Singer was neither the first person to invent all ten elements nor was he the first to patent them." | 15:53 |
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| kanzure | JayDugger: hi | 18:45 |
| JayDugger | Good evening, everyone. | 18:46 |
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| kanzure | .title http://www.nature.com/news/video-reveals-entire-organism-s-neurons-at-work-1.15240 | 19:05 |
| yoleaux | Video reveals entire organism's neurons at work | 19:05 |
| kanzure | paperbot: http://www.nature.com/nmeth/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/nmeth.2964.html | 19:06 |
| kanzure | .title | 19:06 |
| paperbot | http://libgen.org/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1038%2Fnmeth.2964 | 19:06 |
| yoleaux | Simultaneous whole-animal 3D imaging of neuronal activity using light-field microscopy | 19:06 |
| kanzure | "Vaziri and his colleagues engineered C. elegans so that when a neuron fires and calcium ions pass through its cell membranes, the neuron lights up. To capture those signals, they imaged the whole worm using a technique called light-field deconvolution microscopy, which combines images from a set of tiny lenses and analyses them using an algorithm to give a high-resolution three-dimensional image. The researchers took as many as 50 images per ... | 19:07 |
| kanzure | ... second of the entire worm, enabling them to watch the neurons firing in the brain, ventral cord, and tail." | 19:07 |
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| kanzure | "Altruism: The argument for altruism is limited as an explanation because though some exists, the programmers do not focus their kindness on more charitable causes. If the generosity of working for free was a viable motivation for such a prevalent movement, it is curious why such a trend has not been seen in industries such as biotechnology that would have a much bigger impact on the public good.[32]" | 21:23 |
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| --- Log closed Tue May 27 00:00:16 2014 | ||
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