| --- Log opened Mon Oct 06 00:00:01 2014 | ||
| -!- hypron [~hypron@p8120-ipngn100105yosemiya.okinawa.ocn.ne.jp] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 00:00 | |
| -!- sheena [~home@S0106c8be196316d1.ok.shawcable.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 00:57 | |
| -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lfcvrticwavezmod] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 01:02 | |
| -!- Viper168_ [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 01:27 | |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 01:30 | |
| -!- Viper168_ is now known as Viper168 | 01:33 | |
| -!- delinquentme [~dingo@74.61.157.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 01:56 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 01:56 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 01:56 | |
| archels | streety: yeah, an e-mail account for usage via the tor network | 02:12 |
|---|---|---|
| archels | kanzure: where's that neuro stuff pasted from? | 02:20 |
| -!- dbolser [~dbolser@nat8021.ebi.ac.uk] has quit [Changing host] | 03:21 | |
| -!- dbolser [~dbolser@unaffiliated/faceface] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 03:21 | |
| superkuh | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8413393 partially. | 03:53 |
| -!- kenju254 [~kenju254@static-41-242-0-196.ips.angani.co] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 03:58 | |
| -!- kenju254 [~kenju254@static-41-242-0-196.ips.angani.co] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 04:07 | |
| archels | yeah was just wondering if there was a neuroscience channel on IRC that I wasn't aware of | 04:14 |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 04:25 | |
| -!- juri_ [~juri@vpn166.sdf.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 04:33 | |
| -!- juri_ [~juri@vpn166.sdf.org] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:00 | |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r179-25-154-236.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:02 | |
| -!- cpopell [~cpopell@c-76-26-144-132.hsd1.dc.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:12 | |
| kanzure | archels: from pm | 05:13 |
| kanzure | archels: i know simonster because of zotero things | 05:13 |
| -!- juri_ [~juri@vpn166.sdf.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 05:17 | |
| -!- juri_ [~juri@vpn166.sdf.org] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:17 | |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r179-25-154-236.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] | 05:20 | |
| archels | ah | 05:26 |
| -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:32 | |
| kanzure | http://nelenkov.blogspot.it/2014/10/revisiting-android-disk-encryption.html | 05:36 |
| kanzure | "Android has included full disk encryption (FDE) support since version 3.0, but versions prior to 4.4 used a fairly easy to bruteforce key derivation function (PBKDF2 with 2000 iterations). Additionally, because the disk encryption password is the same as the lockscreen one, most users tend to use simple PINs or passwords (unless a device administrator enforces password complexity rules), which further facilitates bruteforcing. Android 4.4 ... | 05:38 |
| kanzure | ... replaced the disk encryption KDF with scrypt, which is much harder to crack and cannot be implemented efficiently on off-the-shelf GPU hardware. In addition to enabling FDE out of the box, Android L is expected to include hardware protection for disk encryption keys, as well as hardware acceleration for encrypted disk access. These two features should make FDE on Android both more secure and much faster." | 05:38 |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 05:47 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:47 | |
| kanzure | 21:36 <kanzure> that's not encouraging at all | 05:51 |
| kanzure | 21:38 <simonster> no, not really. this is why no one has done anything with primate opto besides show that it sometimes works | 05:51 |
| kanzure | 21:38 <simonster> it's possible ultrasound could work better, since it could affect more cells at once | 05:51 |
| kanzure | 21:39 <simonster> but it works by making things vibrate so there are more confounds | 05:51 |
| kanzure | 21:40 <simonster> if you're recording from a neuron and it starts firing when you turn the transducer on, it could be because you're making the electrode vibrate or because the monkey can feel the vibration | 05:51 |
| -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] | 06:23 | |
| -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:43 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 07:38 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 07:39 | |
| kanzure | "The Sigma-Aldrich website is currently off-line due to unforseen technical difficulties." | 07:40 |
| kanzure | hehe merck can't maintain a website | 07:40 |
| drethelin | pharama is surprisingly un net savvy | 07:41 |
| drethelin | like, would you think invitrogen owns lipofectamine.com? | 07:42 |
| kanzure | am i supposed to think that? | 07:42 |
| drethelin | I guess not if you don't know anything about the transfection market | 07:43 |
| kanzure | seems to be owned by some jerk named drethelin | 07:43 |
| kanzure | oh wait | 07:43 |
| kanzure | oh | 07:43 |
| drethelin | it's the market dominant company and the name of their biggest reagent | 07:43 |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 07:43 | |
| kanzure | well, it's not like biologists are sitting behind computers 24/7 looking up reagents | 07:43 |
| kanzure | as much as i'd like them to be | 07:43 |
| -!- drethelin2 [~drethelin@71-87-115-157.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 07:45 | |
| drethelin2 | also: we once got early word of a lawsuit due to mirus putting a page about it on a google crawlable staging server | 07:45 |
| kanzure | who is "we"? | 07:46 |
| drethelin2 | my dad's company | 07:46 |
| -!- drethelin [drethelin@71-87-115-157.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 07:47 | |
| kanzure | go on | 07:48 |
| drethelin2 | fugent llc | 07:48 |
| drethelin2 | it didn't end up mattering much, I think | 07:48 |
| drethelin2 | but it was still pretty funny | 07:48 |
| drethelin2 | to get a google alert and go "huh, I didn't know we were currently being sued" | 07:48 |
| kanzure | don't i know you from a bitcoin thing.. | 07:49 |
| kanzure | let's see.. | 07:49 |
| kanzure | oh i met you in 2012? | 07:49 |
| drethelin2 | if you were at one of the pre-cfar minicamp things then possible! | 07:49 |
| drethelin2 | possibly | 07:49 |
| kanzure | nope seems to be something in 2012 about bitcoin and lesswrong | 07:49 |
| drethelin2 | otherwise you might remember me from #lesswrong | 07:49 |
| kanzure | and quantified self | 07:50 |
| kanzure | drethelin2: sounds like an interesting company | 07:51 |
| kanzure | "Fugent, LLC develops and manufactures biotechnology reagents, particularly new reagent products for the health, research, and science markets. The company was founded in Madison in 1995, and now employs 15 people, including researchers in the areas of organic chemistry, molecular biology, transfection, and chromatography, including HPLC columns development and manufacturing. " | 07:51 |
| kanzure | drethelin2: have you seen the dna synthesizer projects floating around here? http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/nucleic/fbi-diybio-dna-v1.pdf | 07:52 |
| drethelin2 | bleh my interent is being wretched | 07:53 |
| drethelin2 | that pdf is taking forever to load | 07:53 |
| drethelin2 | and no I have not, thanks | 07:53 |
| drethelin2 | ooh I like that chart | 07:54 |
| drethelin2 | remidns me of how my dad thinks | 07:54 |
| drethelin2 | "find a bottleneck and solve it" is his business model | 07:54 |
| kanzure | well how about this, licensing is a bottleneck | 07:55 |
| kanzure | specifically i mean in the reagent space | 08:00 |
| drethelin2 | hmm | 08:10 |
| drethelin2 | I mean, I think we currently sell fugene with no licensing stipulations | 08:10 |
| drethelin2 | but I'm not sure how everyone else does it' | 08:10 |
| JayDugger | Good morning, everyone | 08:11 |
| kanzure | drethelin2: well there's at least two things i can imagine there, one is when you sell the actual reagents you might be selling a license at the same time, but the other is one where other companies are licensing the tech without actually receiving supply from you | 08:13 |
| drethelin2 | hi | 08:13 |
| drethelin2 | Kanzure: that wouldn't work for us, due to trade secrets but I could see it being a legitimate thing for other manufacturers | 08:13 |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 08:15 | |
| kanzure | drethelin2: everything is trade secrets at fugent? | 08:15 |
| kanzure | ParahSailin: ping | 08:16 |
| drethelin2 | kanzure, yes | 08:20 |
| drethelin2 | well, and trademark | 08:20 |
| drethelin2 | and probably for the foreseeable future considering how little my dad trusts the IP system | 08:20 |
| kanzure | trademark law seems to work surprisingly well | 08:22 |
| kanzure | and also does not seem to be stupid | 08:22 |
| kanzure | compared to copyright law problems and patent law problems | 08:22 |
| drethelin2 | yeah | 08:25 |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 08:25 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 08:30 | |
| -!- delinquentme [~dingo@74.61.157.78] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 08:32 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] | 08:32 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 08:38 | |
| -!- delinquentme [~dingo@74.61.157.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 08:59 | |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 09:17 | |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 09:30 | |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] | 09:32 | |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 09:38 | |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 09:46 | |
| -!- Shehrazad [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 09:46 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] | 09:49 | |
| -!- ryankarason [~rak@opensource.cse.ohio-state.edu] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 09:56 | |
| -!- |a| [~|d|@ip68-107-37-158.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 10:16 | |
| -!- sheena [~home@S0106c8be196316d1.ok.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 10:34 | |
| -!- Coldblackice [darkblue@gateway/shell/bouncerstation/x-jlamtyqidrlgckva] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] | 11:07 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 11:32 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:44 | |
| -!- Coldblackice [darkblue@gateway/shell/bouncerstation/x-wfksonreqnjmgwvv] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:57 | |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.218.74] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:00 | |
| -!- lichen [~lichen@c-50-139-11-6.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:01 | |
| -!- nmz787_i [nmccorkx@nat/intel/x-nhoxydhvfaczamiu] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:33 | |
| nmz787_i | http://www.oxford-instruments.com/OxfordInstruments/media/nanoanalysis/brochures%20and%20thumbs/EBSD-Application-Note_T-EBSD.pdf | 12:33 |
| kanzure | 12:32 <+LadyJessica> I cracked up at the idea of Charlie Stross being the fat IT dude from Scotland in the Fellowship. | 12:35 |
| -!- drethelin2 [~drethelin@71-87-115-157.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] | 12:36 | |
| nmz787_i | http://www.azom.com/article.aspx?ArticleID=10950 | 12:45 |
| nmz787_i | .title | 12:45 |
| yoleaux | nmz787_i: Sorry, that command (.title) crashed. | 12:45 |
| nmz787_i | 'Using Transmission Kikuchi Diffraction as a SEM Based Method' | 12:46 |
| -!- HEx2 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:56 | |
| -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 12:57 | |
| -!- HEx2 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 12:59 | |
| -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:59 | |
| -!- HEx2 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:01 | |
| -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 13:01 | |
| -!- HEx2 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 13:06 | |
| -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:07 | |
| -!- top4o [~chatzilla@93.152.162.95] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:35 | |
| -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 13:39 | |
| -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:41 | |
| -!- drethelin [drethelin@71-87-115-157.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:49 | |
| kanzure | paperbot: http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/1590347 | 13:55 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/Mycoplasma%20gallisepticum%20Vaccination%3A%20Effects%20on%20Egg%20Transmission%20and%20Egg%20production.txt | 13:56 |
| -!- delinquentme [~dingo@67-207-118-226.static.wiline.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:16 | |
| delinquentme | kanzure, "world-to-chip" is a solved thing right? | 14:17 |
| kanzure | depends on your definition of solved... | 14:17 |
| kanzure | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/microfluidics/ | 14:18 |
| delinquentme | I was talking to a guy whos doing mVLSI or " really dense microfluidic arrays" ... and then carlo q showed me some images of quakes labs | 14:18 |
| delinquentme | and the "shit that runs the devices" was just blargh. | 14:18 |
| delinquentme | huge, stupid, unnecessary | 14:18 |
| kanzure | lots of pumps. yep.. | 14:18 |
| -!- |a| [~|d|@ip68-107-37-158.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:18 | |
| -!- |b| [~|d|@ip68-107-37-158.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:18 | |
| delinquentme | so a large number of those pumps could be replaced w valves | 14:19 |
| delinquentme | valves could be operated w solenoids | 14:19 |
| kanzure | valves don't pump | 14:19 |
| delinquentme | true! | 14:19 |
| delinquentme | but valves can direct the existing pumping force | 14:19 |
| delinquentme | btw im sitting in The Interval | 14:19 |
| delinquentme | its cool | 14:19 |
| kanzure | i don't know what an interval sitting is | 14:20 |
| delinquentme | but lots of flies . lulz | 14:20 |
| delinquentme | https://longnow.org/interval/ | 14:20 |
| delinquentme | this guy | 14:20 |
| kanzure | .title | 14:20 |
| yoleaux | The Interval at Long Now - The Long Now | 14:20 |
| kanzure | argh | 14:20 |
| chris_99 | a bar? | 14:21 |
| delinquentme | anyways. i was thinking if we've got people who are working on these massive arrays ... THOSE arrays can be used for routing ... and w the wild complexity we want in moving liquids ... that layer can be replaced by just compressing certain channels combinatorically | 14:21 |
| delinquentme | its a coffee shop during the day... bar at night | 14:21 |
| delinquentme | but if you guys want me to start drinking ill take donations | 14:21 |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.218.74] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] | 14:22 | |
| kanzure | i prefer the design that genehacker pointed out about picoarray synthesis through dmd projection | 14:22 |
| kanzure | valveless design, just continuous flow | 14:23 |
| delinquentme | anyways solenoids are cheap as shit and can be used to compress certain channels in these arrays and thus route fluids around | 14:23 |
| drethelin | I want to go to the Interval sometime | 14:23 |
| kanzure | i mean, the microfluidic chip itself had no valves, but there were macroscopic valves elsewhere of course (in the dna synthesizer machine) | 14:23 |
| delinquentme | solenoids way cheaper than peristaltic pumps | 14:23 |
| kanzure | routing fluid around on-chip is not as important as you might think | 14:23 |
| kanzure | especially in the case of dna synthesis | 14:23 |
| drethelin | If there ever was a bar that a transhumanist should make an eternal habit of visiting presumably it would be The Interval | 14:23 |
| kanzure | non-synthesis tasks, maybe | 14:23 |
| delinquentme | sure | 14:24 |
| delinquentme | im just talking about getting adoption / usage of microfluidics up | 14:24 |
| kanzure | why | 14:24 |
| delinquentme | bc I think they're cool | 14:24 |
| delinquentme | link to this picoarray dmd projection? | 14:25 |
| kanzure | much rational | 14:25 |
| kanzure | very wow | 14:25 |
| -!- |b| [~|d|@ip68-107-37-158.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 14:25 | |
| kanzure | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/microfluidics/synthesis/Synthesis%20-%20Microfluidic%20PicoArray%20synthesis%20of%20oligodeoxynucleotides%20and%20simultaneous%20assembling%20of%20multiple%20DNA%20sequences%20(10%20kb).pdf | 14:25 |
| delinquentme | kanzure, so you're only looking at this for synthesis? | 14:32 |
| kanzure | well, the setup can create non-synthesis-related circuits | 14:32 |
| kanzure | because photopolymerization stuff | 14:32 |
| kanzure | photomasking etc | 14:32 |
| delinquentme | this is simply just "any photolithography " operation | 14:34 |
| delinquentme | microfluidics is a version controlled machine | 14:35 |
| delinquentme | this is why its interesting | 14:35 |
| delinquentme | its our tecan ... but without all the proprietary shit | 14:35 |
| delinquentme | relocating bc The Interval is small | 14:35 |
| drethelin | so the interval is not optimized for hanging out in indefinitely? | 14:37 |
| kanzure | seems sort of contrary to the long now foundation's goals | 14:37 |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.219.92] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:39 | |
| -!- delinquentme [~dingo@67-207-118-226.static.wiline.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 14:40 | |
| -!- nmz787_i1 [~nmccorkx@134.134.137.71] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:47 | |
| -!- nmz787_i [nmccorkx@nat/intel/x-nhoxydhvfaczamiu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 14:51 | |
| ParahSailin | kanzure: yo | 15:12 |
| kanzure | ParahSailin: stalk drethelin | 15:12 |
| ParahSailin | drethelin: whats your mother's maiden name? | 15:12 |
| kanzure | no, i mean, read the backlog | 15:13 |
| kanzure | ParahSailin: also, is there an antibody or antigen against mycoplasma gallisepticum that sheena can inject into her chickens | 15:14 |
| ParahSailin | disappointed that cathal didnt have anything to say back to me | 15:14 |
| ParahSailin | did someone here tell him that vegans are dumb? | 15:14 |
| ParahSailin | er, that i said that vegans are dumb | 15:14 |
| ParahSailin | why would someone inject something into a chicken | 15:16 |
| ParahSailin | you get like a new chicken from an egg in 6 weeks | 15:17 |
| kanzure | because it requires killing your whole flock | 15:20 |
| drethelin | parasailin why do you ask | 15:22 |
| drethelin | oh I see | 15:22 |
| drethelin | I'm super easy to "stalk" | 15:22 |
| drethelin | all it takes is mostly google | 15:22 |
| kanzure | drethelin: we are going to hijack your antibody company | 15:24 |
| kanzure | just fyi | 15:24 |
| drethelin | we don't even haev one of those | 15:25 |
| kanzure | what | 15:26 |
| kanzure | why not | 15:26 |
| drethelin | hmm | 15:39 |
| drethelin | well the reason we don't sell most inventions my dad is capable of making (according to him) is IP and malicious law suit risks | 15:39 |
| drethelin | but I don't know if he has any actual ideas in the field of antibodies | 15:40 |
| -!- nmz787_i [nmccorkx@nat/intel/x-ltmtkkiwpgauhrmt] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 15:40 | |
| -!- nmz787_i1 [~nmccorkx@134.134.137.71] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] | 15:42 | |
| kanzure | drethelin: it's pretty simple, lots of "make some antibodies, sell for 10,000% the cost" | 15:42 |
| nmz787_i | of course when I'm here to respond to delinquentme he's gone :/ | 15:42 |
| nmz787_i | heading to an FEI FIB usergroup meeting tomorrow and the next day | 15:43 |
| nmz787_i | I think they're feeding me too, tomorrow | 15:43 |
| nmz787_i | also AFAIK world-to-microfluidics doesn't exist as a product | 15:43 |
| kanzure | lots of chewing gum solutions | 15:44 |
| nmz787_i | but that is pretty much my first task when my drift-correction stuff works | 15:44 |
| nmz787_i | since it will also allow me to step through different fields of view in the FIB and stich them together | 15:45 |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 15:46 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 15:52 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] | 15:57 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 16:00 | |
| drethelin | kanzure: yeah but what do you do if roche decides to sue you out of the market? | 16:07 |
| drethelin | based on an overbroad reading of one of the thousands of patents they own | 16:08 |
| chris_99 | nmz787_i, did you manage to parse that image from the FIB btw | 16:08 |
| kanzure | drethelin: they can do that anyway even without a good reason (they just have to make the lawsuit last longer than you have a budget) | 16:18 |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 16:20 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 16:26 | |
| drethelin | Kanzure yeah | 16:32 |
| drethelin | that is in fact a big worry for my dad | 16:33 |
| drethelin | last time someone tried it the case was dismissed with prejudice but that was a relatively small dog, if an order of magnitude or two bigger than us | 16:33 |
| drethelin | another worry is that a judge can theoretically ask us to disclose formulae for existing products even in an unrelated case | 16:34 |
| kanzure | public disclosure or just disclosure to the judge/court? | 16:35 |
| drethelin | that's functionally the same if the judge/court have insufficient opsec | 16:35 |
| drethelin | he's been screwed by the patent office before | 16:35 |
| kanzure | have you eyelooked at https://www.transcriptic.com/platform/ ? | 16:36 |
| drethelin | hmm | 16:37 |
| drethelin | is it just pseudocode outsourcing of lab work? | 16:37 |
| drethelin | or is there actually a machine doing all the different operations? | 16:37 |
| kanzure | their facility has the equipment that executes the "code" (really it's just api calls and stuff) | 16:38 |
| kanzure | so you mail in your samples | 16:38 |
| drethelin | so you have to trust transcriptic.com and also the entire mail system not to fuck you up? | 16:38 |
| kanzure | yes. | 16:39 |
| kanzure | i'd trust well-maintained machines over a postdoc any day | 16:39 |
| drethelin | I eant more in terms of security | 16:39 |
| drethelin | than in execution | 16:39 |
| drethelin | our own techs often fuck up execution | 16:39 |
| kanzure | i imagine it's exactly the same as the "private cloud" craze, i suppose | 16:39 |
| kanzure | big pharma will just want their own private implementation | 16:39 |
| kanzure | "can it run openstack?" while drool gushes out of their mouth | 16:40 |
| drethelin | that sort of thing can be surprisingly hard to actually implement | 16:40 |
| kanzure | sure. | 16:40 |
| kanzure | yes. | 16:40 |
| drethelin | we have a machine that only fills, caps, and labels vials | 16:40 |
| drethelin | no specific programming or anything | 16:40 |
| drethelin | and yet it's taken tons of effort to get up and running | 16:40 |
| kanzure | it is especially hard when you have to reverse engineer each machine separately | 16:40 |
| drethelin | and still has like an 8 percent error rate | 16:40 |
| jrayhawk_ | 8 percent? holy damn | 16:41 |
| kanzure | because the vendor has never heard of linux or some shit | 16:41 |
| drethelin | jrayhawk_ yeah it's ridiculous | 16:41 |
| drethelin | at least most of the errors are like, miss-cappings | 16:41 |
| drethelin | rather than vials shattering | 16:41 |
| drethelin | but you pretty much have to watch the machine like a hawk | 16:42 |
| drethelin | or it will stick a label straight onto the flywheel | 16:42 |
| drethelin | or whatever the fuck | 16:42 |
| kanzure | so now you have to pay off for the machine plus an extra employee, hehe | 16:43 |
| drethelin | pretty much | 16:43 |
| drethelin | Roche apparently used to do dispensing into vials by hand | 16:44 |
| drethelin | as of even just a few year ago | 16:44 |
| drethelin | years ago | 16:44 |
| drethelin | because the machines that exist can be so awful | 16:44 |
| kanzure | well, i imagine their problems are a little different in scale | 16:44 |
| drethelin | they had someone whose full time job it was | 16:44 |
| kanzure | because they have this huge long-tail library of bullshit nobody has ever heard of | 16:44 |
| drethelin | well no I meant specifically when they were one of our distributors | 16:44 |
| kanzure | so something about reconfiguring the pipelines every once in a while based on actual orders or something, i assume | 16:44 |
| drethelin | since that's the only part I heard about | 16:45 |
| kanzure | also, most of the biotech hardware i have seen, for anything that doesn't appear on everyone's bench in all labs, tends to be from the 70s or 80s | 16:45 |
| kanzure | and stuff that nobody has ever touched since | 16:45 |
| kanzure | "what do you mean ram is cheap these days?" | 16:45 |
| kanzure | those abi synthesizers are still based on the same designs from the dude that got the nobel prize for the concept, more or less | 16:46 |
| kanzure | nobody's touched it | 16:46 |
| drethelin | we use centrifuges from the 40s | 16:47 |
| drethelin | because they don't make em like they used to | 16:47 |
| drethelin | we retrofit them with modern temperature controllers and rpm meters and stuff | 16:47 |
| drethelin | our lab equipment is actually like 99 percent used stuff that we've fixed up | 16:48 |
| drethelin | because labx stuff is like an order of magnitude or so cheaper per unit | 16:48 |
| kanzure | the auction site? | 16:48 |
| drethelin | yeah | 16:48 |
| kanzure | drethelin: here is a toy i bought recently https://www.takeitapart.com/guide/94 | 16:50 |
| drethelin | heh I have a very similar photo set somewhere back in my photosetream | 16:52 |
| justanotheruser | paperbot http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/je900105g | 16:58 |
| justanotheruser | pls | 16:58 |
| paperbot | http://libgen.org/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1021%2Fje900105g | 16:58 |
| justanotheruser | thx | 16:58 |
| ebowden | paperbot: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23900721 | 17:01 |
| paperbot | http://libgen.org/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1007%2Fs12031-013-0075-8 | 17:01 |
| -!- nmz787_i [nmccorkx@nat/intel/x-ltmtkkiwpgauhrmt] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] | 17:01 | |
| drethelin | is paperbot a jailbreaking bot? | 17:07 |
| kanzure | drethelin: https://github.com/kanzure/paperbot | 17:10 |
| kanzure | dbolser: haha http://www.wired.com/2014/10/overstock-com-assembles-coders-build-bitcoin-like-stock-market/ | 17:10 |
| -!- Shehrazad [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] | 17:11 | |
| kanzure | jrayhawk_: well i guess byrne is at least consistent | 17:17 |
| kanzure | too bad he didn't take my phone calls, though. it's not like i'm /not/ a counterparty dev.. i've committed. | 17:17 |
| -!- delinquentme [~dingo@74.61.157.78] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 17:18 | |
| jrayhawk_ | huh, cool that he actually grabbed reputable developers | 17:22 |
| jrayhawk_ | not to belittle you, i mean to disparaged all the jackasses that ran with their own blockchains | 17:23 |
| jrayhawk_ | s/disparaged/disparage/ | 17:23 |
| jrayhawk_ | as you were complaining about with expertise, it's hard to work out what experts look like from the outside | 17:24 |
| kanzure | not entirely reputable, to be honest | 17:27 |
| kanzure | i mean, yes they have something that works | 17:27 |
| jrayhawk_ | and isn't a blatant cash grab | 17:27 |
| kanzure | but look at the shit they write: https://github.com/CounterpartyXCP/counterpartyd_build/blob/master/setup.py | 17:27 |
| kanzure | this is their installation procedure -_- | 17:27 |
| kanzure | i called them out on this and they told me they have "10 years of professional experience writing python" | 17:28 |
| jrayhawk_ | it shows | 17:28 |
| kanzure | huh? | 17:28 |
| jrayhawk_ | they are clearly very deep into being programmers, because they sure aren't OS maintainers | 17:29 |
| kanzure | that's the sort of code you write when you have spent zero seconds following standards or nothin' | 17:29 |
| kanzure | it also means they have literally never seen any good implementation, too | 17:30 |
| jrayhawk_ | eh, this is the sort of reason distributions exist | 17:31 |
| jrayhawk_ | consistent policy is important, but everybody's never going to agree on the same policy | 17:31 |
| kanzure | i can't even see the windows side of this; there are install wrappers on windows too... | 17:31 |
| kanzure | that's fine, but this seems to be "ignore all possible policies" | 17:32 |
| jrayhawk_ | that's right, take the most naive solution possible because anyone who cares about it being done right will presumably either be using or maintaining a distribution-provided solution | 17:32 |
| jrayhawk_ | programmers are lazy, as well they should be | 17:32 |
| kanzure | except that you can export a standard interface that the policies usually take advantage of | 17:33 |
| jrayhawk_ | not sure that's true with the database stuff | 17:33 |
| jrayhawk_ | a lot of this should be done in pip | 17:33 |
| kanzure | yes, and then the separate distributions can do pip2deb or whatever insane hacks they each maintain | 17:34 |
| kanzure | (of course, pip is really the insane component in that equation, but there's really nothing much better in python land, and i dunno if i can count wheels yet...) | 17:34 |
| jrayhawk_ | may be insane, but at least it's a standard and expected sort of insane | 17:35 |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] | 17:42 | |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 17:48 | |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.219.92] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] | 17:49 | |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 18:10 | |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:10 | |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:17 | |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Client Quit] | 18:17 | |
| -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lfcvrticwavezmod] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] | 18:27 | |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:32 | |
| -!- night is now known as night|pub | 18:35 | |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.220.214] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:36 | |
| -!- nell [~alu@unaffiliated/alusion] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:36 | |
| -!- nell [~alu@unaffiliated/alusion] has left ##hplusroadmap ["WeeChat 1.1-dev"] | 18:37 | |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.220.214] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] | 18:41 | |
| kanzure | .title | 18:43 |
| yoleaux | counterpartyd_build/setup.py at master · CounterpartyXCP/counterpartyd_build · GitHub | 18:43 |
| kanzure | .title http://itbbs.pconline.com.cn/diy/50643668.html | 18:43 |
| yoleaux | 【任俺行黑科技系列之一】一步一步教你用3D打印机制作“巧克力迷你PC”，全部更新完毕！！_DIY极客营论坛_太平洋电脑网产品论坛 | 18:43 |
| kanzure | .title http://itbbs.pconline.com.cn/diy/50710602.html | 18:43 |
| yoleaux | 【MIY任俺行黑科技系列之二】MAC PRO for ITX！完成度100% 手绘原稿+发布视频+MIY过程+最终效果图！_DIY极客营论坛_太平洋电脑网产品论坛 | 18:43 |
| -!- Athrelon [~Athrelon@207-172-207-66.c3-0.upd-ubr1.trpr-upd.pa.cable.rcn.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 19:04 | |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 19:07 | |
| -!- nsh [~nsh@wikipedia/nsh] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] | 19:09 | |
| -!- drewbot [~cinch@ec2-54-161-210-121.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 19:17 | |
| kanzure | Athrelon: hi | 19:18 |
| -!- drewbot [~cinch@ec2-54-237-186-7.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 19:18 | |
| Athrelon | hi kanzure | 19:21 |
| Athrelon | sleep time, unfortunately | 19:21 |
| -!- Athrelon [~Athrelon@207-172-207-66.c3-0.upd-ubr1.trpr-upd.pa.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 19:25 | |
| -!- lichen [~lichen@c-50-139-11-6.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] | 19:27 | |
| ebowden | Can anyone identify this condition? http://images.t-nation.com/forum_images/5/f/5f651_ORIG-ATM0hcc.jpg | 19:36 |
| kanzure | too much irc, try starting with small 10 second breaks every 20 minutes | 19:36 |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 19:39 | |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.220.77] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 19:40 | |
| kanzure | "My favorite instance of emergent mailing list behavior was when a trouble maker named GUMBY created a "PLEASE-REMOVE-ME" mailing list, just for people who sent email to another entire mailing list asking to be removed from it, instead of sending their request to the administrator at mailing-list-name-REQUEST." | 19:53 |
| kanzure | "Whenever somebody would make that faux-pas, he'd add them to the PLEASE-REMOVE-ME mailing list, and the emergent behavior was that those people would discuss amongst themselves the fact that they really wanted to be removed from the PLEASE-REMOVE-ME mailing list, until they eventually learned that the way to get removed from a mailing list was to simply send email to PLEASE-REMOVE-ME-REQUEST, instead of the entire mailing list. Worked like a ... | 19:54 |
| kanzure | ... charm!" | 19:54 |
| kanzure | from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8415603 | 19:54 |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:11 | |
| kanzure | "Hi All, we (Berkeley Biolabs) are helping the team at SOS ventures and they've just launched their new DIY Bio accelerator in Downtown SF and they're accepting global applications. It's super exciting to finally see a real accelerator for DIY Bio in SF, the first class starts this Jan and applications are due soon, so if you have an idea that you're working on and want to get funding SOS ventures is definitely worth applying to. The first ... | 20:23 |
| kanzure | ... batch of companies out of Indie Bio (previously synbioaxlr8r) have been really successful, 4 out of 6 raised their first rounds (between $500k - $2M in the case of Muufri). Congrats to all the teams and apply :) talked to Arvind and he said the he'll be looking at applications as they come in so earlier applications have a better chance of getting funded." | 20:23 |
| kanzure | http://indieb.io/apply-to-sf/ | 20:24 |
| kanzure | funny how they are using diybio as a vehicle for biotech ventures now | 20:24 |
| kanzure | might as well just drop the diybio aspects | 20:24 |
| kanzure | seems like it would be easier | 20:24 |
| kanzure | "Indie.Bio is a startup accelerator which focuses on entrepreneurs building technologies in or around the field of Biotech. It offers seed funding ($35,000), lab space as well as mentorship to help take an idea to a product." | 20:24 |
| kanzure | $35k in sf? uh... that's very little. | 20:24 |
| -!- Coldblackice [darkblue@gateway/shell/bouncerstation/x-wfksonreqnjmgwvv] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 20:37 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 20:45 | |
| -!- top4o [~chatzilla@93.152.162.95] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91 [Firefox 32.0.3/20140923175406]] | 20:47 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:48 | |
| delinquentme | oh look. another accelerator. | 20:51 |
| -!- lichen [~lichen@c-50-139-11-6.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:51 | |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 20:57 | |
| kanzure | "I think this is attempting to fix one particular instance of the more general problem: soft forks are a bad idea that we should just stop referring to. Indeed we should be building ways to prevent soft forks and turn them into hard forks. One way to do that would be to introduce a new rule that simply rejects blocks with an unknown version. In the event that the majority switches to making blocks of a new version this would trigger Matt's ... | 21:02 |
| kanzure | ... fork detection logic and potentially shut down the node or at least ensure it no longer serves work, shutting down any attached miners." | 21:02 |
| kanzure | "I believe I've laid out the argument for this quite a few times in the past and nobody has really disagreed, but still, the notion of a soft fork keeps cropping up. This patch attempts to fix the fact that in the case where we're no longer following the majority rule set we might accept transactions that the majority would reject, and thus end up mining blocks that (from our perspective) get re-orgd out. Effectively at that point the node ... | 21:02 |
| kanzure | ... would have SPV-like security. But finding ourselves in this situation at all is the problem, not the interpretation of specific opcodes." | 21:02 |
| kanzure | "Mike, I strongy disagree with your remarks on soft forks, and I'm unclear as to why you would have taken this position. Extending functionality by precluding otherwise meaningless transactions is a polite and reduced risk way to do new things which maximally respects people's ability to choose to not participate. Making it so that ever possible new feature requires universal flag day deployment for all wallets, miners, full nodes, merchants, ... | 21:03 |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 21:04 | |
| kanzure | ... etc... would be a great way to deadlock progress and create additional centeralziation (e.g. where local patches or forks carry additional cost). Some things may best be done that way, in spite of the costs, but for many the soft fork approach is simply superior even if you ignore most of the freedom of choice and consensus costs related to a hard fork change. So long as the soft fork behavior confines itself to activies which are ... | 21:04 |
| kanzure | ... non-standard in the widely deployed network the risk of accidentally forking yourself is avoided. Avoiding issues like that is part of the planning cost of any softforking change." | 21:04 |
| kanzure | "As I don't have any more potent way of adding sentiment to the stack than what Gregory Maxwell stated, i'd like to simply add: "Yeah, what he said". Bitcoin is still highly experimental is an observation in the standard disclaimer of the LTB network podcast and that is a GOOD thing. Agility and affordance to build Bitcoin is at stake and soft-forking is a tool with discrete utility to the development of this experiment that should not be as ... | 21:04 |
| kanzure | ... casually dismissed as your earlier contribution, there are voices with a different stance and silence is not an indication of positive support of your position. It could simply be a preference for civility, calm and conflict aversion on the part of the silent." | 21:04 |
| -!- night|pub is now known as night | 21:08 | |
| -!- Lemminkainen [uid34064@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zouhqarlbytiphaw] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 21:27 | |
| Lemminkainen | paperbot http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/abs/10.1089/10430340360535751 | 21:27 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/4bf5e84afe1c558a429246bf94835ae1.txt | 21:28 |
| -!- justanotheruser is now known as jau87 | 21:30 | |
| -!- jau87 is now known as justanotheruser | 21:44 | |
| -!- delinquentme [~dingo@74.61.157.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] | 21:55 | |
| kanzure | https://www.genebygene.com/pages/research# "GeneByGene offers a similar test to 23andme for $200. They won't analyze it for you. They just give you the raw data. I don't think it's the exact same chip that 23andme uses but it should be pretty compatible. They also offer exome and whole genome sequencing if you're interested." | 21:59 |
| -!- nmz787_i [~nmccorkx@134.134.139.76] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 21:59 | |
| kanzure | "I was talking to one of the guys at retrogen that work with next-gen sequencing, and he said that they could probably get your entire genome in a single 900$ run. He also said that some other places would be better, but I believe those were academic centers" | 21:59 |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 22:08 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.41.138] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:09 | |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.220.77] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] | 22:35 | |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.222.27] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:52 | |
| -!- nmz787_i [~nmccorkx@134.134.139.76] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] | 23:05 | |
| -!- kenju254 [~kenju254@static-41-242-0-196.ips.angani.co] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] | 23:20 | |
| -!- kenju254 [~kenju254@static-41-242-0-196.ips.angani.co] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 23:24 | |
| -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cfwrflndwcwtzhxs] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 23:30 | |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.222.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] | 23:38 | |
| -!- Lemminkainen [uid34064@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zouhqarlbytiphaw] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] | 23:39 | |
| -!- sheena [~home@S0106c8be196316d1.ok.shawcable.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 23:43 | |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.220.139] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 23:58 | |
| --- Log closed Tue Oct 07 00:00:02 2014 | ||
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.0.dev0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!
