| --- Log opened Thu Feb 05 00:00:45 2015 | ||
| -!- Beatzebub_ [~beatzebub@d162-156-12-57.bchsia.telus.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 00:39 | |
| -!- Beatzebub [~beatzebub@d162-156-12-57.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] | 00:43 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 01:29 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] | 01:29 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 01:38 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] | 01:38 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 01:40 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] | 01:40 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 01:40 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] | 01:41 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 01:41 | |
| -!- FAMAS [~FAMAS@103.250.71.249] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 01:48 | |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 02:25 | |
| -!- gene_hacker [~chatzilla@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 02:43 | |
| -!- nmz787_i [~nmccorkx@192.55.55.41] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] | 03:13 | |
| -!- DumpsterD1ver [~loki@vpn166.sdf.org] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 03:42 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] | 03:53 | |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r167-57-22-51.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 04:14 | |
| -!- weles [~mariusz@wsip-72-215-50-243.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:21 | |
| heath | heath test | 05:40 |
|---|---|---|
| heath | irssinotifier | 05:40 |
| heath | useful | 05:40 |
| heath | https://irssinotifier.appspot.com/ | 05:40 |
| -!- Viper168_ [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:49 | |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 05:51 | |
| -!- Viper168_ is now known as Viper168 | 05:56 | |
| -!- archels_ [charl@toad.stack.nl] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:08 | |
| -!- archels [charl@unaffiliated/archels] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] | 06:10 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:26 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 06:28 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:28 | |
| -!- Beatzebub__ [~beatzebub@d162-156-12-57.bchsia.telus.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:30 | |
| -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rhvwwbrnwgmtgusi] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:34 | |
| -!- Beatzebub_ [~beatzebub@d162-156-12-57.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] | 06:34 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 06:43 | |
| -!- top4o [~chatzilla@93.152.162.95] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 07:10 | |
| -!- top4o [~chatzilla@93.152.162.95] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 35.0.1/20150122214805]] | 07:20 | |
| kanzure | where is everyone | 07:25 |
| kanzure | this is unacceptable | 07:25 |
| eudoxia | beep | 07:25 |
| kanzure | 22:13 <jonano> I losted my life insurance because of my disease | 07:26 |
| kanzure | 22:14 <jonano> I cant be a member of CI or Alcor because of the lack of my money | 07:26 |
| kanzure | 22:14 <jonano> I return to school to get a better job | 07:26 |
| kanzure | (jonano showed up in #bitcoin and i spotted him yesterday) | 07:26 |
| kanzure | ((he didn't fucking remember me. argh.)) | 07:26 |
| ParahSailin | what | 07:37 |
| kanzure | jonano was a troll that used to show up in here | 07:41 |
| kanzure | he has been known throughout the internet since the beginning of time as "the ebola virus of cryonics" | 07:41 |
| kanzure | http://web.archive.org/web/20080303013838/http://www.cryonics.org/immortalist/november05/ebola.htm | 07:42 |
| eudoxia | i'd never heard of him | 07:47 |
| -!- sheena [~home@S0106c8be196316d1.ok.shawcable.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 07:49 | |
| kanzure | eudoxia: you haven't read /all/ the logs? | 07:50 |
| eudoxia | kanzure: i know, i know, i'm in a state of sin | 07:50 |
| archels_ | haha, still doing his thing eh | 07:58 |
| cluckj | trolls be trollin' | 08:05 |
| -!- balrog [~balrog@discferret/developer/balrog] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] | 08:18 | |
| -!- balrog [~balrog@discferret/developer/balrog] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 08:29 | |
| -!- Merovoth [~Merovoth@gateway/tor-sasl/merovoth] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 08:34 | |
| -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rhvwwbrnwgmtgusi] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] | 08:38 | |
| -!- JayDugger [~jwdugger@pool-173-57-55-138.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 08:52 | |
| -!- nmz787_i [nmccorkx@nat/intel/x-sfkgowxpjnbxzznw] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 08:54 | |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r167-57-22-51.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 09:08 | |
| kanzure | v8 (as the js engine) firefox https://hacks.mozilla.org/2015/02/introducing-node-firefox/ | 09:16 |
| andytoshi | i forgot who asked about whether alcor will take your life insurance benefit in the case that you get splatted and they can't use it...but the answer (from reading the life insurance assignee policy) is definitely yes | 09:33 |
| andytoshi | if this is a concern you can likely arrange otherwise through additional contracts "optional modes of settlement" which once agreed upon alcor cannot change without your consent (changing optional modes of settlement is explicitly excluded from the assignee's rights) | 09:34 |
| -!- erasei [erasei@x.kaw.cc] has left ##hplusroadmap ["."] | 09:40 | |
| -!- Merovoth [~Merovoth@gateway/tor-sasl/merovoth] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 09:46 | |
| -!- Merovoth [~Merovoth@gateway/tor-sasl/merovoth] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 10:25 | |
| -!- nmz787_i [nmccorkx@nat/intel/x-sfkgowxpjnbxzznw] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] | 10:44 | |
| -!- drewbot_ [~cinch@ec2-54-147-195-199.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 10:51 | |
| -!- drewbot [~cinch@ec2-54-82-62-198.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 10:51 | |
| -!- delinquentme_ [~delinquen@162-245-22-166.v250d.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 10:52 | |
| delinquentme_ | http://www.ebay.com/itm/SPIN-COATER-/301477690218?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4631787b6a | 11:04 |
| delinquentme_ | crazy cheap spin coater | 11:04 |
| -!- nmz787_i [~nmccorkx@134.134.139.74] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:06 | |
| kanzure | let me know if i sould grab this | 11:06 |
| delinquentme_ | kanzure, its being sold as is, IDK what shape it is in ... but judging by the look of it, thats a steal | 11:07 |
| kanzure | if i buy this i will probably have to ship it to nmz787 | 11:10 |
| kanzure | what's all the other stuff in their pics? | 11:10 |
| cluckj | goats | 11:11 |
| kanzure | oh wait | 11:12 |
| kanzure | here is another pic http://cdn.globalauctionplatform.com/e6a875ee-6f05-4923-be51-a3aa0120e921/7d829bf8-0a98-484f-e36f-d54019de8a16/original.jpg | 11:12 |
| kanzure | http://www.bidspotter.com/en-us/auction-catalogues/bscmr/catalogue-id-bscmr10036/lot-6add5394-465d-40b9-aa53-a3b9017b401e | 11:12 |
| nmz787_i | hmm? | 11:13 |
| kanzure | spin coater | 11:14 |
| kanzure | it's huge | 11:14 |
| nmz787_i | that is indeed huge | 11:16 |
| nmz787_i | it would fit in my garage though | 11:16 |
| kanzure | i think this is the manufacturer http://www.origin.co.jp/rd/pdf/rd06_2014.pdf | 11:16 |
| kanzure | well. i think a smaller spin coater would work just fine. | 11:16 |
| kanzure | i don't really see the point of this? | 11:16 |
| -!- sandeep [~sandeep@117.254.219.164] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:17 | |
| nmz787_i | that big thing is a spin coater or injector molder? | 11:17 |
| -!- sandeep is now known as Guest30843 | 11:17 | |
| * nmz787_i looks at pdf | 11:17 | |
| kanzure | claims to be a spin coater | 11:17 |
| delinquentme_ | kanzure, we should go in on a warehouse | 11:17 |
| delinquentme_ | just do a sale / resale of high end equipment | 11:18 |
| kanzure | not in sf | 11:18 |
| delinquentme_ | ^ | 11:18 |
| delinquentme_ | http://www.pi-usa.us/products/images/Hexapod-Parallel_Kinematic_Positioners_top-image.jpg | 11:18 |
| delinquentme_ | hexapawdz | 11:19 |
| kanzure | those are called stewart nerd snipers | 11:19 |
| nmz787_i | thta pdf seems like it's mostly talking about electrostatic printers and cd/dvd stampers or something | 11:21 |
| nmz787_i | there does seem to be a small section that shows a spin coater | 11:21 |
| nmz787_i | but it is indeed small | 11:21 |
| nmz787_i | like 1/100th the volume of the entire thing | 11:21 |
| kanzure | what else is this tho | 11:22 |
| -!- Guest30843 [~sandeep@117.254.219.164] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 11:24 | |
| delinquentme_ | lel. DVD burner ... sell as spin coater | 11:24 |
| -!- sandeep_ [~sandeep@117.254.219.164] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:24 | |
| -!- Merovoth [~Merovoth@gateway/tor-sasl/merovoth] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:26 | |
| -!- sandeep_ [~sandeep@117.254.219.164] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 11:27 | |
| nmz787_i | delinquentme_: i believe I can make a proper spincoater for around/less than $100 | 11:27 |
| nmz787_i | place around here with the rotary vacuum bearings for like $5/10 bux | 11:28 |
| delinquentme_ | nmz787_i, yeah there are some on ebay which used to be $90 ... but now are $500 | 11:28 |
| -!- saurik_ is now known as saurik | 11:32 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 11:36 | |
| ParahSailin | you can get a precise motor/controller that will do programmed ramp up downs for <100? | 11:40 |
| ParahSailin | or something that will suck and spin | 11:40 |
| -!- sandeep_ [~sandeep@117.254.220.167] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:41 | |
| kanzure | i don't see any specs for this 2UC model.. i wonder what performance it gets you. | 11:41 |
| -!- narwh4l [~michael@unaffiliated/thesnark] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:46 | |
| -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:51 | |
| -!- sandeep_ [~sandeep@117.254.220.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] | 11:52 | |
| -!- FourFire [~FourFire@2a02:270:2015:cafe:710c:867b:a317:355c] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:06 | |
| -!- sandeep_ [~sandeep@117.254.220.167] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:08 | |
| -!- sandeep_ [~sandeep@117.254.220.167] has quit [Client Quit] | 12:09 | |
| -!- justanot1eruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 12:09 | |
| -!- sandeep_ [~sandeep@117.254.220.167] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:09 | |
| -!- cluckj [~cluckj@c-71-225-211-210.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 12:09 | |
| kanzure | http://www.wearableworld.co/ | 12:09 |
| kanzure | motorcycle helmet http://www.skully.com/ | 12:10 |
| kanzure | skateboards? http://boostedboards.com/ | 12:11 |
| kanzure | .title https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9004705 | 12:11 |
| yoleaux | YC for Hardware | Hacker News | 12:11 |
| kanzure | http://blog.ycombinator.com/yc-for-hardware | 12:11 |
| kanzure | "We’ll be posting some new hardware RFSs as well--we’re happy to see all sorts of hardware companies, but we especially like the ones that are fundamentally new ideas that Kickstarter might not support (and we don’t shy away from expensive hardware--we’ve funded companies building things like nuclear reactors and rockets, which will require hundreds of millions of dollars in funding to succeed)." | 12:12 |
| -!- narwh4l [~michael@unaffiliated/thesnark] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 12:18 | |
| nmz787_i | ParahSailin: well you'd have to build one, but I think that just means back-emf sense or an encoder on BLDC | 12:18 |
| -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qejrvstydzlmpqje] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:27 | |
| -!- FourFire [~FourFire@2a02:270:2015:cafe:710c:867b:a317:355c] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 12:30 | |
| -!- narwh4l [~michael@unaffiliated/thesnark] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:41 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:44 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has quit [Client Quit] | 12:46 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:46 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has quit [Client Quit] | 12:50 | |
| -!- weles [~mariusz@wsip-72-215-50-243.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 12:58 | |
| -!- FourFire [FourFire@2a02:270:2015:cafe:710c:867b:a317:355c] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:09 | |
| -!- archels_ is now known as arhcle | 13:17 | |
| -!- arhcle is now known as archels | 13:17 | |
| -!- archels [charl@toad.stack.nl] has quit [Changing host] | 13:17 | |
| -!- archels [charl@unaffiliated/archels] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:17 | |
| archels | asfhqwiogeh | 13:18 |
| kanzure | agreed | 13:18 |
| -!- FourFire [FourFire@2a02:270:2015:cafe:710c:867b:a317:355c] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 13:18 | |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:21 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:25 | |
| maaku | :( -- http://waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artificial-intelligence-revolution-2.html | 13:37 |
| maaku | after a fair and balanced part 1, it's basically "let me summarize what I read on lesswrong!" | 13:38 |
| -!- narwh4l [~michael@unaffiliated/thesnark] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 13:40 | |
| * archels marks 'AI takeover' in his calendar for 2025 | 13:44 | |
| kanzure | my calendar only goes backwards | 13:45 |
| maaku | the year 10 B-AI | 13:50 |
| kanzure | did we get a mouse connectome? | 13:50 |
| kanzure | did that happen yet? | 13:50 |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] | 13:53 | |
| kanzure | .title http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-31145520 | 13:55 |
| yoleaux | BBC News - Planck telescope puts new datestamp on first stars | 13:55 |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:56 | |
| -!- FourFire [~FourFire@2.149.189.221.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:07 | |
| archels | Texas Instruments | 14:13 |
| archels | <Encrypted Library> | 14:13 |
| archels | grr what is this? | 14:13 |
| archels | (spice) | 14:14 |
| kanzure | texas instruments is the spice maintainer? | 14:17 |
| archels | encrypted spice doesn't flow so well | 14:18 |
| nmz787_i | 'spice spice baby, (chorus cries 'simulaaate')' | 14:20 |
| archels | I bet they're just going to redirect me to their own spice implementation, "TINA-TI" | 14:26 |
| -!- p_h_m4_2 [~zzz@boole.london.hackspace.org.uk] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:31 | |
| kanzure | debian science team is looking for new members | 14:38 |
| kanzure | enthought should do it | 14:39 |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 14:48 | |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 15:05 | |
| -!- FourFire [~FourFire@2.149.189.221.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 15:11 | |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r167-56-7-249.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 15:16 | |
| -!- sandeep_ [~sandeep@117.254.220.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 15:17 | |
| fenn | "Wearable World, Inc. Moves into San Francisco’s Iconic Palace of Fine Arts" what a shame | 15:18 |
| fenn | how can they afford to buy the palace of fine arts but not a silly .com address | 15:19 |
| kanzure | fenn is there likely a way to get large amounts of motion and force out of a planar mems-style device? like to lift and push stuff around. | 15:21 |
| fenn | motion*force = energy so probably not, unless you have a stupidly efficient prime mover | 15:21 |
| kanzure | actually by mems i mean the planar aspect i suppose. large flat sheets on the scale of multiple meters might be okay. | 15:22 |
| kanzure | *planar aspect and spatial-light-modulation-manufacturability | 15:22 |
| fenn | ok now you lost me | 15:22 |
| kanzure | just a continuation of my vlsi thinkings from the other day | 15:22 |
| fenn | you want to move things around on a micro scale mosh pit? | 15:23 |
| fenn | tiny hands | 15:23 |
| kanzure | eh my question is more general than that | 15:23 |
| kanzure | so there's vlsi manufacturing of tiny motion stuff, thanks to mems and whatever | 15:23 |
| kanzure | tiny motion isn't going to get you very far for maing certain types of things | 15:24 |
| kanzure | the advantage of spatial light modulation is how ridiculously simple it is to use in a manufacturing process | 15:24 |
| kanzure | so it would be useful if spatial light modulation can produce things that can make "large" scale motion | 15:25 |
| fenn | i think you'd need to route tension elements on a macro scale, like a chinese finger trap but made out of spiderweb | 15:26 |
| kanzure | maybe giant 2d springs | 15:26 |
| kanzure | heh | 15:27 |
| fenn | another approach would be nested structures, linear actuator stages like [[[]]] | 15:27 |
| kanzure | how do you spatial-optically make a linear actuator? | 15:28 |
| fenn | except it would be more like |{[<->]}| | 15:28 |
| fenn | comb actuators are just zigzags of metal, basically | 15:29 |
| kanzure | .wik comb drive | 15:29 |
| yoleaux | "Comb-drives are capacitive actuators, often used as linear actuators that utilize electrostatic forces that act between two electrically conductive combs. Comb drive actuators typically operate at the micro- or nanometer scale and are generally manufactured by bulk micromachining or surface micromachining a silicon wafer substrate." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comb_drive | 15:29 |
| fenn | you still need high aspect ratio etching though | 15:29 |
| kanzure | http://matthieu.lagouge.free.fr/mems/mems_pict/actuation/combdrive.gif | 15:29 |
| kanzure | hmm. | 15:29 |
| kanzure | does this work at mesoscale | 15:30 |
| fenn | no | 15:30 |
| -!- drewbot_ [~cinch@ec2-54-145-10-150.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 15:30 | |
| fenn | not without stupidly high voltages at least | 15:30 |
| kanzure | i might accept some sort of solution involving a gas/whatever engine that snaps or heats together from separate layers | 15:31 |
| -!- drewbot [~cinch@ec2-54-82-62-198.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 15:32 | |
| fenn | oh your question was wrong | 15:32 |
| fenn | you want a DLP 3d printer | 15:32 |
| kanzure | i'm not sure any dlp 3d printer has produced a mesoscale motion actuator thing | 15:33 |
| fenn | i would be surprised if they haven't | 15:33 |
| kanzure | dlp counts as spatial light modulation right? | 15:33 |
| fenn | yes | 15:33 |
| maaku | fenn lives | 15:34 |
| kanzure | laser sintering can probably sinter you a conventional gas or steam engine, but the DLP 3d printers that i have seen are only quick-to-melt plastics | 15:34 |
| maaku | fenn i need to meet you at some point, now that you're in the bay area | 15:34 |
| fenn | ok | 15:35 |
| kanzure | andytoshi is in the area this week i think | 15:35 |
| kanzure | so go meet him too | 15:35 |
| fenn | i'm tired | 15:35 |
| kanzure | in fact, bring the entire blockstream crew to fenn | 15:35 |
| kanzure | oh, maybe ot then | 15:35 |
| kanzure | *not | 15:35 |
| fenn | i may be in sf tomorrow, depending on some craigslist thing | 15:36 |
| kanzure | i am bad about saying sf when i don't mean sf | 15:36 |
| fenn | yeah you only go to boring places like san jose | 15:36 |
| kanzure | that place sucked dude | 15:37 |
| kanzure | i see a few 3d printed engines that work when assembled with other parts | 15:38 |
| kanzure | i wonder if i should allow for assembly steps | 15:38 |
| kanzure | (i am thinking no) | 15:38 |
| fenn | this is the thing i'm buying XD http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/clt/4867936747.html | 15:38 |
| kanzure | .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rX4xv5-NvE | 15:38 |
| yoleaux | Jet Engine made on a 3D Printer - YouTube | 15:38 |
| kanzure | .title http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/clt/4867936747.html | 15:38 |
| yoleaux | Life-size paper replica of AK-47 Kalashnikov | 15:39 |
| maaku | yes, andytoshi is out here saturday - friday I think | 15:39 |
| kanzure | i wonder how easy that's to damage | 15:39 |
| fenn | unfortunately there are no cad files for it | 15:39 |
| maaku | hey i live in san jose! | 15:39 |
| fenn | my condolences | 15:39 |
| kanzure | i spent many weeks in san jose while i was contracting for rivermeadow | 15:40 |
| maaku | haha well i feel that way about oakland/berkeley | 15:40 |
| kanzure | well, not the entire time. i nfact less than 10% of my time. but still sucked. | 15:40 |
| kanzure | next to that casino off of el camino | 15:40 |
| maaku | ugh that is like the boringest part of san jose | 15:41 |
| fenn | is there any part that is not boring? | 15:41 |
| fenn | there was a museum that was pretty cool i guess | 15:41 |
| fenn | the tech museum | 15:41 |
| kanzure | wait why didn't i say airport | 15:41 |
| kanzure | airport is a more obvious landmark | 15:41 |
| maaku | fenn: willow glen is not a bad place to live (it's where I am), and there's good vietnamese food at least | 15:42 |
| kanzure | also el camino does not seem to exist here | 15:42 |
| fenn | camino real | 15:42 |
| maaku | san jose is not a bad place to live. just not much to do for a tourist/visitor | 15:43 |
| -!- narwh4l [~michael@unaffiliated/thesnark] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 15:43 | |
| kanzure | maaku: where are the other blockstream peoples? also san jose? | 15:44 |
| maaku | i'm the only one in san jose. we have two in mountain view, three in SF proper, two in oakland, then some in montreal, malta, spain, and switzerland | 15:45 |
| maaku | they're all out here for the week though | 15:45 |
| maaku | well, plus andytoshi in austin, which you know | 15:45 |
| kanzure | why do i not see a flat engine when i search for flat engine | 15:48 |
| kanzure | these are definitely not flat | 15:48 |
| eudoxia | still looking for tiny stirling actuators | 15:49 |
| kanzure | http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/22/ULPower_UL260i.jpg | 15:49 |
| kanzure | http://8w.forix.com/engines/1235.jpg | 15:49 |
| kanzure | what's the right word for "one-pot" or "single print"? | 15:50 |
| kanzure | "one pass"? | 15:50 |
| -!- p_h_m4_2 [~zzz@boole.london.hackspace.org.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 15:50 | |
| -!- narwh4l [~michael@unaffiliated/thesnark] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 15:51 | |
| kanzure | .wik monobloc engine | 15:52 |
| yoleaux | "A monobloc or en bloc engine is an internal-combustion piston engine where some of the major components (such as cylinder head, cylinder block, or crankcase) are formed, usually by casting, as a single integral unit, rather than being assembled later." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monobloc_engine | 15:52 |
| nmz787_i | jrayhawk: perfect for... all the [broth](?) you drink https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/northdrinkware/north-drinkware-mt-hood-the-oregon-pint-glass | 15:54 |
| nmz787_i | 'USGS 3D data of Mt. Hood in the base of the glass' | 15:55 |
| kanzure | a uniflow steam engine looks close... http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4a/Uniflow_steam_engine.gif | 15:56 |
| kanzure | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uniflow_steam_engine | 15:57 |
| -!- DumpsterD1ver [~loki@vpn166.sdf.org] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 15:57 | |
| jrayhawk | jrayhawk@richardiv:~$ curl -s https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/northdrinkware/north-drinkware-mt-hood-the-oregon-pint-glass | grep -i boro | 15:59 |
| jrayhawk | jrayhawk@richardiv:~$ | 15:59 |
| jrayhawk | no thanks | 15:59 |
| kanzure | oh weird, flat engine is the name of something else | 15:59 |
| kanzure | .wik flat engine | 15:59 |
| yoleaux | "A flat engine is an internal combustion engine with horizontally-opposed pistons. Typically, the layout has cylinders arranged in two banks on either side of a single crankshaft and is otherwise known as the boxer, or horizontally-opposed engine. The concept was patented in 1896 by engineer Karl Benz, who called it the "contra engine."" — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_engine | 15:59 |
| kanzure | so that is why i was not getting actually flat engines | 15:59 |
| kanzure | jrayhawk you blow up lots of engines right? what should i be looking for :/ | 16:00 |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] | 16:01 | |
| -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 16:01 | |
| nmz787_i | https://github.com/bauerca/gridfloat | 16:02 |
| nmz787_i | jrayhawk: no thank you because it isn't "boro" (big, in bengali)? | 16:02 |
| delinquentme_ | fenn, you around? | 16:03 |
| delinquentme_ | wait. who else is a decent EE around here? | 16:03 |
| kanzure | jcline | 16:03 |
| jrayhawk | I'm not interested in putting boiling hot foods in glassware that is not borosilicate. | 16:03 |
| nmz787_i | oh, well they /are/ marketing it for beer | 16:04 |
| nmz787_i | so you'd need to limit it to cold broth I guess | 16:04 |
| jrayhawk | I have a great respect for my epithelium and I wish to provide it all the resources it needs to continue doing its job. | 16:04 |
| jrayhawk | I have less respect for other people's epitheliums, though, so I guess those glasses will make for fine gifts. | 16:05 |
| nmz787_i | your epithelium is sensitive to the food vessel? | 16:05 |
| nmz787_i | or you don't drink cold things? | 16:05 |
| jrayhawk | Explosive shards of got glass are generally not conducive to proper epithelial functioning, but YMMV | 16:06 |
| jrayhawk | s/got/hot/ | 16:06 |
| nmz787_i | " It isn't made of Pyrex, so it may break if it undergoes rapid temperature changes. So... don't pour boiling hot water into a cold glass." | 16:07 |
| jrayhawk | kanzure: in terms of MEMS engines, I really doubt you're going to do better than that rotary design. | 16:10 |
| kanzure | i have expanded to non-mems. can be large-scale. | 16:11 |
| kanzure | "large" | 16:11 |
| jrayhawk | oh, okay | 16:11 |
| kanzure | just has to be single-pass manufacturable. ideally with spatial light modulation. | 16:12 |
| jrayhawk | small-block chevy's are cheap | 16:12 |
| jrayhawk | ah, hm. | 16:12 |
| kanzure | i'm actually a little surprised that nobody has optimized for single-pass engines... seems like this would be stupidly cheap to produce.. | 16:12 |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] | 16:14 | |
| jrayhawk | If planarity of the whole system, including output, is desirable, I guess an inline or flat engine is pretty good; in general inline engines have slightly more problems with balancing, but I doubt it matters much at that scale. | 16:17 |
| jrayhawk | I guess you should still talk to that rotary engine guy and pick his brain. | 16:17 |
| jrayhawk | He probably knows of other similar projects. | 16:17 |
| kanzure | ah yes i should send harassing emails to that person. good plan. | 16:17 |
| jrayhawk | Most fully or partially opposed engines use a central cam and pushrods; for a planar design you'd probably want to switch over to geared remote cams. | 16:18 |
| jrayhawk | Diesel is also a simpler design than gas. | 16:23 |
| jrayhawk | In that ignition is purely compression based and does not require spark. | 16:23 |
| kanzure | maybe someone tried this and the efficiency was too stupidly low to compete with more dimensionally inclined engines | 16:27 |
| kanzure | but i would still expect this to be an obscure novelty or something | 16:27 |
| jrayhawk | If you start doing research on power using volumetric efficiency as a metric, keep in mind that the displacement figures for rotary engines are about half of what an equivalent four-stroke would be. | 16:30 |
| jrayhawk | At least, for wankel-vs-otto/diesel | 16:31 |
| jrayhawk | i guess there are more exotic rotary designs | 16:31 |
| fenn | someone tried this and then they dumped a lot of academic research on it and that's the last i heard. it was supposed to replace batteries in cell phones with methanol-burning micro turbines | 16:33 |
| kanzure | jrayhawk found a good microengine diesel thingy. | 16:34 |
| fenn | micro "diesel" engines like on RC airplanes don't actually burn diesel fuel, they burn ether | 16:34 |
| kanzure | http://sem-proceedings.com/03s/sem.org-2003-SEM-Ann-Conf-s52p01-Invited-MEMS-Rotary-Engine-Power-System-Project-Overview-Recent.pdf | 16:35 |
| fenn | a brayton cycle engine makes more sense for a planar engine i think | 16:35 |
| fenn | compressor, combustor, turbine. how simple can you get | 16:36 |
| kanzure | i have been using mems as my search query because i'm not sure how else to get planar things (since planar doesn't seem to be the right term....) | 16:38 |
| jrayhawk | sterling uber alles | 16:38 |
| fenn | waste heat would be an issue with a cell phone | 16:38 |
| jrayhawk | what is the endpoint for this, anyway | 16:39 |
| fenn | TO TRY AND TAKE OVER THE WORLD | 16:39 |
| kanzure | photolithography-style manufacturing of large-scale-motion devices | 16:39 |
| jrayhawk | such as? | 16:39 |
| kanzure | photolithography can do microelectronics and microfluidics and you get lots of efficiency out of this | 16:39 |
| kanzure | compared to manually putting together large circuits/devices | 16:39 |
| kanzure | as far as i know there's no way to get large-scale motion like that.. you have to involve other bulky manufacturing processes? | 16:40 |
| kanzure | or stuff that has to be assembled | 16:40 |
| kanzure | anyway if you had to manually assemble every transistor in a microchip you'd be doomed | 16:41 |
| jrayhawk | i am bad at science and can only sortof do engineering, so some sort of solid goal would greatly help me conceptualize what solutions would look like | 16:41 |
| fenn | microfluidics is not efficient, but it does scale with complexity | 16:41 |
| kanzure | yes by efficient i meant the engineering/assembly concept... not energetic efficiency. | 16:41 |
| kanzure | jrayhawk: i apologize for being so vague but i really don't know what i'm talking about here | 16:42 |
| fenn | please keep your efficiencies sorted when talking about power generation | 16:42 |
| kanzure | and i suspect fenn is on to me already | 16:42 |
| kanzure | fair enough | 16:42 |
| fenn | i think it's a subject worth studying, and apparently so does D. C. Walther and A. P. Pisano | 16:43 |
| kanzure | jrayhawk: from a manufacturing perspective you need lots more equipment to make actuators... and a single process would be interesting and helpful. | 16:43 |
| kanzure | "lots more" might be overstating it | 16:44 |
| * fenn mumbles something about a scroll compressor | 16:45 | |
| kanzure | .wik scroll compressor | 16:45 |
| yoleaux | "A scroll compressor (also called spiral compressor, scroll pump and scroll vacuum pump) is a device for compressing air or refrigerant. It is used in air conditioning equipment, as an automobile supercharger (where it is known as a scroll-type supercharger) and as a vacuum pump." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scroll_compressor | 16:45 |
| -!- AmbulatoryCortex [~Ambulator@173-31-9-188.client.mchsi.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 16:45 | |
| kanzure | "a vacuum pump is just the thermodynamic inverse of an engine" i wish i remembered my engine stuff. | 16:45 |
| kanzure | "A scroll compressor operating in reverse is known as a scroll expander, and can be used to generate mechanical work from the expansion of a fluid, compressed air or gas. Many residential central heat pump and air conditioning systems and a few automotive air conditioning systems employ a scroll compressor instead of the more traditional rotary, reciprocating, and wobble-plate compressors." | 16:46 |
| eudoxia | didn't drexler write about something like this | 16:47 |
| eudoxia | or maybe i'm assuming because, of course he must have | 16:47 |
| fenn | .title http://youtu.be/M0SucWF6B1o | 16:49 |
| yoleaux | Scroll Compressor (dynamics mesh test animation) - YouTube | 16:49 |
| fenn | they stopped it too soon | 16:49 |
| nmz787_i | there's a recent brlcad scroll compressor model | 16:50 |
| fenn | eudoxia do you flip to the back of the book to see the solution | 16:51 |
| eudoxia | fenn: no, i usually have two evince windows of the same PDF open, open viewing the problem and another viewing the solution | 16:52 |
| fenn | touche | 16:53 |
| eudoxia | that last open should be a 'one' | 16:53 |
| kanzure | no it worked | 16:53 |
| jrayhawk | .title http://www.nature.com/nphys/journal/v8/n2/full/nphys2163.html | 16:54 |
| yoleaux | Realization of a micrometre-sized stochastic heat engine : Nature Physics : Nature Publishing Group | 16:54 |
| jrayhawk | With enough lasers, anything is possible! | 16:54 |
| jrayhawk | (sorry, not actually useful, but sorta neat) | 16:54 |
| kanzure | "Here we demonstrate the experimental realization of a microscopic heat engine, comprising a single colloidal particle subject to a time-dependent optical laser trap" | 16:54 |
| jrayhawk | http://bettigue.blogspot.com/ | 16:55 |
| nmz787_i | couldn't the laser just be replaced with a sealed elastic chamber with water in it, on top of a resistive heater? | 16:56 |
| kanzure | laser trap | 16:57 |
| kanzure | i think they were trying to be intentionally fancy | 16:57 |
| kanzure | *optical trap | 16:57 |
| fenn | kanzure how about just hooking up fleas to a harness | 16:58 |
| kanzure | what about a rotary expander | 16:58 |
| kanzure | i'm not sure what thing you're suggesting that for but it sounds like a fun friday night, i'm in | 16:59 |
| fenn | to power the flea circus, duh | 16:59 |
| eudoxia | fleas are circus animals, they are just gonna flail around and try to do stunts with the ropes | 16:59 |
| kanzure | little leds | 16:59 |
| eudoxia | they are not good at coordinated movements | 16:59 |
| kanzure | not with that attitude | 16:59 |
| kanzure | you have to encourage them while training | 16:59 |
| kanzure | is a rotary expander a thing that exists | 17:00 |
| fenn | yes | 17:00 |
| fenn | usually called a pneumatic or hydraulic motor | 17:00 |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r167-56-7-249.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 17:00 | |
| fenn | .wik rotary vane motor | 17:01 |
| yoleaux | "A pneumatic motor or compressed air engine is a type of motor which does mechanical work by expanding compressed air. Pneumatic motors generally convert the compressed air energy to mechanical work through either linear or rotary motion." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneumatic_motor | 17:01 |
| fenn | meh | 17:01 |
| fenn | hm this is new (to me) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quasiturbine | 17:02 |
| fenn | .wik quasiturbine | 17:02 |
| yoleaux | "The Quasiturbine or Qurbine engine is a proposed pistonless rotary engine using a rhomboidal rotor whose sides are hinged at the vertices." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quasiturbine | 17:02 |
| kanzure | this question seems like a thing genehacker would know things about | 17:02 |
| kanzure | he is good at knowing obscure things | 17:03 |
| kanzure | gah where is he. "away"? wtf. | 17:03 |
| delinquentme_ | kanzure, no thanks | 17:03 |
| fenn | actually i designed something like this and forgot about it | 17:04 |
| delinquentme_ | I like the efficiency of constant inverting piston velocity | 17:04 |
| delinquentme_ | fenn im headed to tech shop for a meetup in a bit | 17:04 |
| delinquentme_ | if you wanna go! | 17:05 |
| delinquentme_ | afterwards back to the top secret workshop | 17:05 |
| -!- ebowden_ [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 17:08 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 17:08 | |
| fenn | i don't think i'm going to make it, but keep me in the loop | 17:08 |
| kanzure | scroll expander looks close but i don't see any papers- makes me a bit suspicious but will look closer | 17:08 |
| kanzure | i was trying to remember various rocket engines but i never classified those into two or three dimensional or many-part. i remember lots of large cones to guide exhaust.... but that's not surprising or interesting here.. | 17:09 |
| fenn | linear aerospike | 17:09 |
| kanzure | masers? | 17:09 |
| fenn | nasa has some microthruster array stuff | 17:09 |
| kanzure | ah true... but not helpful here methinks. | 17:09 |
| fenn | apparently the efficiency of a rocket is not tied to its size | 17:09 |
| * kanzure drafts 2d-spaceships.pdf | 17:10 | |
| kanzure | (not really.) | 17:10 |
| fenn | such an awesome image http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Twin_Linear_Aerospike_XRS-2200_Engine_PLW_edit.jpg | 17:11 |
| kanzure | vertical air tunnel? | 17:11 |
| fenn | it's a rocket engine | 17:12 |
| fenn | it's inside out | 17:12 |
| -!- ebowden_ [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 17:12 | |
| kanzure | http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/79/Aerospikeprinciplediagram.svg/1280px-Aerospikeprinciplediagram.svg.png | 17:13 |
| kanzure | ah... | 17:13 |
| kanzure | scroll compressor animation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsabYhhOko0&t=50s | 17:15 |
| kanzure | (at 50s) | 17:15 |
| kanzure | that is quite clever. | 17:16 |
| kanzure | i wonder how that happened | 17:16 |
| kanzure | "Creux invented the compressor as a rotary steam engine concept, but the metal casting technology of the period was not sufficiently advanced to construct a working prototype, since a scroll compressor demands very tight tolerances to function effectively. The first practical scroll compressors did not appear on the market until after World War II, when higher-precision machine tools enabled their construction. They were not commercially ... | 17:18 |
| kanzure | ... produced for air conditioning until the early 1980s.[2]" | 17:18 |
| kanzure | "A scroll compressor uses two interleaving scrolls to pump, compress or pressurize fluids such as liquids and gases. The vane geometry may be involute, Archimedean spiral, or hybrid curves.[3][4][5][6][7] Often, one of the scrolls is fixed, while the other orbits eccentrically without rotating, thereby trapping and pumping or compressing pockets of fluid between the scrolls. Another method for producing the compression motion is ... | 17:18 |
| kanzure | ... co-rotating the scrolls, in synchronous motion, but with offset centers of rotation. The relative motion is the same as if one were orbiting." | 17:18 |
| kanzure | asciilifeform recommends tesla turbine | 17:22 |
| jrayhawk | Also common in superchargers, nowadays. | 17:24 |
| jrayhawk | huh, I guess actually that's not really the case anymore. | 17:25 |
| jrayhawk | A friend of mine had to rebuild G60; it was neat lookin'. | 17:26 |
| kanzure | .wik fluidyne engine | 17:26 |
| yoleaux | "A Fluidyne engine is an alpha or gamma type Stirling engine with one or more liquid pistons. It contains a working gas (often air), and either two liquid pistons or one liquid piston and a displacer." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluidyne_engine | 17:26 |
| -!- p_h_m4_2 [~zzz@94.118.128.7] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 17:30 | |
| kanzure | asciilifeform recommends a magnetohydrodynamics actuator | 17:34 |
| kanzure | .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13JW-Ifg4wA | 17:37 |
| yoleaux | High-thrust spiral motor : DigInfo - YouTube | 17:37 |
| kanzure | 17:41 <+asciilifeform> kanzure: you should be able to fabricate a linear mhd actuator using ordinary etched copper pcb. | 17:41 |
| kanzure | 17:41 <+asciilifeform> or, alternatively, a liquid-pistol stirling engine using two sheets of glass and a garden-variety co2 laser engraver | 17:41 |
| kanzure | muscle wire.... should have thought of muscle wire. | 17:49 |
| kanzure | pre-compressed air or liquid would also work i suppose | 17:50 |
| -!- Burnin8 is now known as Burninate | 18:02 | |
| kanzure | where is cpopell and why is he not here to tell me things about magnetohydrodynamics | 18:18 |
| -!- nmz787_i [~nmccorkx@134.134.139.74] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] | 18:19 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:29 | |
| ParahSailin | oh fuck, android emulator is jacking shit from virtualbox | 18:34 |
| ParahSailin | VT-x/AMD-V whatever the fuck that is | 18:34 |
| catern | huh | 18:37 |
| catern | is that CPU feature only available to one hypervisor at a time | 18:37 |
| catern | that would make sense | 18:37 |
| ParahSailin | yeah, having a hard time locating whatever zombie process android emulator has | 18:38 |
| kanzure | your first mistake is using virtualbox | 18:41 |
| catern | yeah I'm gonna have to agree, that is a mistake | 18:43 |
| ParahSailin | oh fuck | 18:43 |
| kanzure | android kvm things are superfast | 18:48 |
| kanzure | qemu-kvm etc | 18:48 |
| -!- Merovoth [~Merovoth@gateway/tor-sasl/merovoth] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] | 18:52 | |
| -!- Merovoth [~Merovoth@gateway/tor-sasl/merovoth] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:53 | |
| -!- phryk [~phryk@ip-109-91-122-252.hsi12.unitymediagroup.de] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:55 | |
| kanzure | pgp source code http://www.symantec.com/connect/downloads/symantec-pgp-desktop-peer-review-source-code | 19:14 |
| catern | that comment | 19:18 |
| kanzure | ? | 19:22 |
| catern | someone asking for support for the API for this library which they presumably just compiled from the source release "not for reuse" | 19:25 |
| -!- genehacker [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 19:26 | |
| genehacker | So kanzure what do you want with a planar engine? | 19:26 |
| yoleaux | 26 Jan 2015 03:19Z <kanzure> genehacker: "Achieving motion in a plane orthogonal to the substrate" (in mems) http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/~pister/245/project/DungaSatyanarayana.pdf | 19:26 |
| yoleaux | 26 Jan 2015 03:20Z <kanzure> genehacker: "Method for attaching fluidic interconnects using resistively heated gold" http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/~pister/245/project/Edd.pdf | 19:26 |
| yoleaux | 26 Jan 2015 03:26Z <kanzure> genehacker: "An electrostatically-actuated rotational micromirror" http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/~pister/245/project/JaasmaSanchez.pdf | 19:26 |
| yoleaux | 26 Jan 2015 03:27Z <kanzure> genehacker: air bubble array http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/~pister/245/project/JonesYu.pdf | 19:26 |
| yoleaux | 26 Jan 2015 03:43Z <kanzure> genehacker: cmos micromirror method http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/~pister/245/project/NgOo.pdf | 19:26 |
| kanzure | genehacker: something easy to manufacture. one manufacturing process tops. no assembly or only one assembly operation. | 19:27 |
| kanzure | someone was recommending a magnetohydrodynamic pump... | 19:27 |
| genehacker | What for? | 19:27 |
| kanzure | someone else suggested a fluidyne actuator, another memory muscle, tesla turbine, spiral compressor or spiral expander | 19:27 |
| kanzure | just generic meso-scale motion, i guess | 19:28 |
| genehacker | Why not just a turbine? | 19:28 |
| kanzure | enough to lift stuff during manufacturing, drilling, etc | 19:28 |
| genehacker | So you want a tiny rotary actuator | 19:28 |
| kanzure | ideally something that can be made through photolithography - again with no assembly or only one assembly step | 19:29 |
| kanzure | actually it doesn't have to be tiny, just flat really | 19:29 |
| genehacker | MEMs scale? | 19:29 |
| kanzure | nah | 19:29 |
| kanzure | not necessarily | 19:29 |
| kanzure | but mems techniques are okay | 19:29 |
| kanzure | fenn says a large-scale comb drive wont work | 19:29 |
| genehacker | How much torque/size | 19:30 |
| kanzure | i don't have any numbers... i don't know, conventional cnc? car engine moving around a few thousand kg? | 19:30 |
| kanzure | a few hundred foot pounds | 19:31 |
| kanzure | between 10 and 500 foot pounds | 19:31 |
| kanzure | stuff like that | 19:31 |
| genehacker | Why not use piezoelectric pancake motors | 19:31 |
| kanzure | looking | 19:31 |
| genehacker | Continuous or controlled rotation? | 19:32 |
| kanzure | no preference | 19:32 |
| kanzure | these pancake motors look pretty small. still looking. | 19:32 |
| genehacker | It seems like getting that much torque would be hard | 19:34 |
| genehacker | Maybe wobble motors would do the trick or an air bladder driven harmonic drive | 19:35 |
| kanzure | looking | 19:35 |
| genehacker | Wobble motor = ring gear moves around rotor gear | 19:37 |
| kanzure | .wik harmonic drive | 19:37 |
| yoleaux | "Harmonic Drive is a strain wave gear that can improve certain characteristics compared to traditional gearing systems. Harmonic Drive is trademarked by the Harmonic Drive company." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonic_drive | 19:37 |
| kanzure | " The key to the design of the strain wave gear is that there are fewer teeth (for example two fewer) on the flexspline than there are on the circular spline. This means that for every full rotation of the wave generator, the flexspline would be required to rotate a slight amount (two teeth, for example) backward relative to the circular spline. Thus the rotation action of the wave generator results in a much slower rotation of the ... | 19:39 |
| kanzure | ... flexspline in the opposite direction." | 19:39 |
| genehacker | There's also pancake PCB motors | 19:39 |
| genehacker | You have a disk with curved radial | 19:40 |
| kanzure | .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrsoE-j0DXo | 19:40 |
| yoleaux | Electric Motor Pancake - YouTube | 19:40 |
| genehacker | Traces and you apply current from the middle out and use magnets | 19:40 |
| kanzure | ah interesting | 19:41 |
| genehacker | http://newt.phys.unsw.edu.au/hsc/hsc/electric_motors5.html | 19:41 |
| genehacker | I doubt it has much force | 19:42 |
| genehacker | Err torque | 19:42 |
| genehacker | But again why? | 19:43 |
| genehacker | Why do you need a flat cheap motor? | 19:43 |
| kanzure | hard to explain | 19:44 |
| genehacker | Is it flat so it is cheap? | 19:44 |
| kanzure | flat so it's easier to make | 19:44 |
| kanzure | less manufacturing steps | 19:44 |
| kanzure | we can do vlsi for microelectronics and microfluidics and it would be nice to have vlsi (very large scale integration) for actuators that can move things around | 19:45 |
| genehacker | Someone's trying to do that | 19:45 |
| kanzure | i want spatial light modulation to make high torque actuators basically | 19:45 |
| kanzure | or motors/engines/whatever | 19:45 |
| genehacker | Guy at UT | 19:46 |
| genehacker | High torque is the hard part | 19:46 |
| genehacker | The idea he had was to mass produce smart actuators | 19:47 |
| kanzure | smart=? | 19:47 |
| genehacker | With standard interfaces | 19:47 |
| genehacker | Smart as in able to control force, torque, position, acceleration, etc | 19:48 |
| kanzure | cool | 19:48 |
| genehacker | And you have actuators specialized for high acceleration, high torque, high speed or whatever | 19:49 |
| genehacker | This way you could put together a robot, exoskeleton, car with all wheels powered and steered and have it just work | 19:51 |
| genehacker | And because your actuators are standardized all you have to do is mass produce them to make them cheap | 19:52 |
| genehacker | Delbert Tesar, the guy who did robotics really pushed this | 19:53 |
| genehacker | Even wanted to do the whole VLSI thing for mechanical systems | 19:54 |
| kanzure | "Rabindran and Tesar (2009) introduced a dual-input/single-output actuator based | 19:54 |
| kanzure | on an epicy- clic gear train, which can realize the force/velocity control" | 19:55 |
| kanzure | cool | 19:55 |
| genehacker | Supposedly he's in talks with some Korean company to make this stuff | 19:55 |
| kanzure | can't find anything about his vlsi work on google scholar | 19:56 |
| genehacker | And he has a way to make torque dense electric actuators | 19:56 |
| kanzure | ah "intelligent electromechanical actuators" | 19:57 |
| genehacker | https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&q=delbert%20tesar%20vlsi&ei=ejvUVJbtJo-rogS-pYLADg&url=http://wikileaks.org/gifiles/attach/35/35859_CIRV%2520prop%2520doc0020511.pdf&ved=0CCoQFjAF&usg=AFQjCNEjcFu7TlLFJ3E9uKSN4Sbi0nDEeg&sig2=iaUXNvDAbt3OSnPW7VFd9A | 19:58 |
| genehacker | He isn't very internet inclined | 19:59 |
| kanzure | haha | 19:59 |
| genehacker | That has details, I can't believe it's on wikileaks | 19:59 |
| kanzure | i see a thesis of his doctoral student, measuring performance of soldiers in the army | 20:00 |
| kanzure | wikileaks delivers | 20:00 |
| genehacker | I can't seem to find his crazy proposal for a vehicle with all wheels powered and steered with active suspension, torque sensing | 20:05 |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 20:05 | |
| genehacker | A camera looking ahead of each tire to see what the tire's going to hit, a camera behind the tire to measure terrain deflection, a tire deflection sensor, and ground penetrating radar | 20:07 |
| kanzure | page 25 of that link maybe | 20:07 |
| genehacker | On every tire | 20:07 |
| genehacker | With something that has like 8 | 20:08 |
| kanzure | (labeled as page 22 in the doc) | 20:08 |
| kanzure | (his student's thesis) bayesian soldier performance model http://repositories.lib.utexas.edu/bitstream/handle/2152/ETD-UT-2011-05-3201/MCFARLAND-THESIS.pdf?sequence=1 | 20:09 |
| genehacker | https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&ei=Uj7UVKKfD5broASd8IF4&url=http://www.sae.org/events/dod/presentations/2008delberttesar.pdf&ved=0CC4QFjAF&usg=AFQjCNGQceX-gOfHFih-pbYW6v-lymUBxQ&sig2=zI3uI2lkigu8go81OsSCIA | 20:10 |
| genehacker | Check this out | 20:10 |
| kanzure | "The Development of a Full Architecture For High Performance Actuators For Navy Applications" http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA381029 | 20:10 |
| genehacker | 5th slide gives a pretty good idea of what VLSI in mechanical systems looks like | 20:11 |
| kanzure | ultra caps | 20:11 |
| genehacker | I just wish he'd hurry up and commercialize this stuff | 20:13 |
| genehacker | Because the actuators we have now suck | 20:14 |
| genehacker | Computing and sensing have advanced by leaps and bounds but our actuators have not | 20:14 |
| genehacker | Hobby servos suck | 20:15 |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:16 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has quit [Excess Flood] | 20:18 | |
| -!- DumpsterD1ver [~loki@vpn166.sdf.org] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 20:18 | |
| -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qejrvstydzlmpqje] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] | 20:18 | |
| -!- genehacker [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 20:18 | |
| -!- genehacker [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:19 | |
| -!- DumpsterD1ver [~loki@vpn166.sdf.org] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:31 | |
| -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jzisxofffthbabhv] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:37 | |
| -!- AmbulatoryC0rtex [~Ambulator@173-31-9-188.client.mchsi.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:41 | |
| -!- AmbulatoryCortex [~Ambulator@173-31-9-188.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 20:43 | |
| -!- ebowden_ [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 21:46 | |
| -!- ebowden [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 21:46 | |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] | 21:59 | |
| -!- AmbulatoryC0rtex [~Ambulator@173-31-9-188.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 22:04 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:06 | |
| -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:07 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 22:14 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:18 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has quit [Excess Flood] | 22:19 | |
| -!- AndChat|336756 [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:25 | |
| -!- genehacker [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 22:25 | |
| -!- genehacker [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:27 | |
| -!- AndChat|336756 [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 22:27 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:28 | |
| -!- genehacker [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 22:28 | |
| -!- AndChat|336756 [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:28 | |
| -!- genehacker [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:28 | |
| -!- AndChat|336756 [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 22:28 | |
| -!- genehacker [~AndChat33@c-98-232-239-159.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 22:31 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 22:34 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:35 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] | 22:45 | |
| -!- dustinm [~dustinm@192.241.142.243] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:47 | |
| -!- ebowden_ [~ebowden@147.69.161.105] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 23:37 | |
| -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jzisxofffthbabhv] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] | 23:58 | |
| --- Log closed Fri Feb 06 00:00:46 2015 | ||
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.0.dev0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!
