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| kanzure | .g site:youtube.com robots getting blowed up | 05:07 |
|---|---|---|
| yoleaux | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3cI3l0F25Y | 05:07 |
| kanzure | .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDO09EVFSmg | 05:26 |
| yoleaux | Nick Szabo speaks at Bitcoin Investor (Las Vegas) 2015-10-29 - YouTube | 05:26 |
| kanzure | he is real | 05:26 |
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| kanzure | eudoxia: sup | 05:50 |
| eudoxia | nothing of note really | 05:51 |
| kanzure | do you have magical list of awesome molecular machines that should be made at day one of having working nanofactory? | 05:53 |
| eudoxia | unfortunately no | 05:53 |
| mosasaur | item 1: "make a copy". The end. | 05:56 |
| kanzure | congrats you just grey gooed the whole galaxy | 05:56 |
| mosasaur | I knew there should be an if clause there somewhere | 05:59 |
| kanzure | "You know Myra, some people might think you're cute. But me, I think you're one very large baked potato." | 06:13 |
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| chris_99 | http://www.dolomite-microfluidics.com/webshop/fluidic_factory looks kind of interesting | 06:54 |
| JayDugger | kanzure, didn't you meet Szabo in Montreal? I thought he spoke there too. | 07:19 |
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| kanzure | nope | 07:23 |
| JayDugger | No to both, right? | 07:33 |
| kanzure | yes | 07:35 |
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| JayDugger | Hm...I'll guess Szabo was the special guest speaker at Bitcoin Investor. | 07:37 |
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| JayDugger | Yup. I take three hours off to do housework and I miss all this. Three cheers for scroll bar! | 07:40 |
| kanzure | some sort of "30 years of this crap?" event at media lab http://www.media.mit.edu/events/medialabtalk/ | 07:41 |
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| maaku | <kanzure> do you have magical list of awesome molecular machines that should be made at day one of having working nanofactory?" <-- a computer | 08:14 |
| maaku | specifically, a trillion-core reversible classical computer, and a thousands-of-qubits NV-diamond quantum computer | 08:14 |
| maaku | then we can really do some brute-force engineering of whatever else you want | 08:17 |
| kanzure | i mean simpler molecular machines :-) | 08:21 |
| kanzure | like "here's a series of small parts that would be very useful" | 08:21 |
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| kanzure | ISO IEC JTC 1 SC 22 WG 14 ISO IEC 9899:1999, Programming languages -- C http://croco.freeonsciencelibraryguide.com/view.php?id=506751 | 08:24 |
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| maaku | kanzure: my interest in building an 'artificial engineer' is specifically to enable immediate production of complex but repetative designs like such as logic gates for a computer, as soon as basic positional synthesis is available | 08:53 |
| maaku | or to hasten the availability of that tech if possible | 08:53 |
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| kanzure | looks like singinst raised at least $500k in donations https://intelligence.org/2015/07/17/miris-2015-summer-fundraiser/ | 09:59 |
| kanzure | mostly linking to that for the snoops on whatsups | 10:00 |
| nmz787_i1 | .title http://mymochii.com/ | 10:00 |
| yoleaux | Mochii Product Site | 10:00 |
| nmz787_i1 | 'Meet mochii, the world’s smallest production electron microscope.' | 10:00 |
| chris_99 | ooh | 10:03 |
| chris_99 | how much is it | 10:03 |
| nmz787_i1 | they don't say, and I can't remember what the guy said at the conference | 10:07 |
| nmz787_i1 | but they only had a mockup at the conference, with a 'virtual demo' | 10:07 |
| chris_99 | ah | 10:07 |
| nmz787_i1 | so who knows, maybe they're faking | 10:07 |
| chris_99 | heh | 10:08 |
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| kanzure | 10:38 <+jcowan> kanzure: I wrote a small text editor called "plokta", the advantage of which was that almost any plausible sequence of keys woud get you out of it. | 11:01 |
| kanzure | 10:38 <+jcowan> It was an acronym for "press lots of keys to abort" | 11:01 |
| kanzure | 11:01 <+kanzure> jcowan: should just be wrapper around any other text editor, really | 11:01 |
| kanzure | 10:38 <+jcowan> lost it though | 11:01 |
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| kanzure | i should have mentioned this earlier, but human-usable computer is not a good first molecular nanotechnology project. far more projects are going to be possible long before human-usable molecular nanotechnology assembled computer is constructed and working. | 11:30 |
| kanzure | however, such a project might be useful in the sense that set your goals high and then iterate and do feedback, which usually gets more results than doing nothing at all | 11:30 |
| kanzure | shorter-term molecular nanotechnology projects that i would expect would be things such as: better atomic force microscopy tips (single-atom tips), linear actuators, mechanical chambers for yoctoliter chemical reactions, pre-programmed patterned superhydrophobic surfaces, ... i don't actually think "low-mass carbon-only replicas of most hardware store items" is a good initial goal, because i doubt that large-scale lego brick assembly is ... | 11:37 |
| kanzure | ... going to be first thing to work after you get positional assembly of small collections of atoms. | 11:37 |
| kanzure | and i would consider "low-mass carbon-only replicas of most hardware store items" to be much more easily achieved than most atomically-precise human-usable computers. although small chips could be easier in some circumstances. | 11:37 |
| fenn | i think this is obvious | 11:38 |
| kanzure | well, yes, but the question was "list of molecular machines to make on day one", and i keep struggling on that one | 11:39 |
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| fenn | not hardware store items but electronics | 11:39 |
| kanzure | i mean sure we can look at the merkle differential gear all we want | 11:39 |
| kanzure | yeah there are lots of electronics things that could be proposed... radio transceivers, actuators, sound, various phased array stuff. | 11:40 |
| fenn | smart dust | 11:40 |
| fenn | handwavium | 11:40 |
| kanzure | smart dust != utility fog? | 11:40 |
| fenn | utility fog is more of a mechanical actuator system, whereas smart dust just sticks to things and floats around on the breeze | 11:40 |
| delinquentme | do ADCs typically cost 10x what a DAC costs? | 11:41 |
| kanzure | i don't even know how i know about "utility fog". i don't remember where i picked that up. in my original timeline, i remember "utility fog" as the concept of a (mostly invisible) fog that surrounds you, and you send commands to the fog and it manufactures things in front of you out of ambient background resources. | 11:41 |
| delinquentme | analog to digital converter and digital to analog converter | 11:41 |
| delinquentme | kanzure, my understanding of it was that its used as ladders , stepping stools , mechanical force actuators ( exoskeleton ) and also protection from being hit by cars | 11:42 |
| kanzure | iirc "smart dust" was something about better-than-rfid thing tracking and utilization | 11:42 |
| fenn | i don't think maaku meant "an entire laptop" when he said "a trillion core computer" | 11:42 |
| kanzure | and to think i have enough trouble with gpu pipelining... hm. | 11:42 |
| fenn | also your concept of utility fog is inaccurate, it doesn't typically manufacture anything | 11:43 |
| fenn | it just rearranges its shape | 11:44 |
| maaku | kanzure: oh, 'extrusion' of carbon nanotube fiber. because space elevators | 11:44 |
| fenn | bah | 11:45 |
| kanzure | fenn: well my inaccuracy there is probably because i have no clue where i picked up the idea. maybe i just heard the phrase once and just assumed a bunch of stuff. | 11:45 |
| maaku | and yeah, i meant basically just being able to put logic gates together | 11:45 |
| kanzure | "better electronics" is a good answer | 11:45 |
| maaku | imho the NV-diamon quantum computer *should* be the first goal however, because it is trivially easy (might even be doable with present AFM technology), and quantum computers get us better simulations of quantum systems | 11:47 |
| kanzure | reason why i was looking for list of machine ideas was because i have been apprehensive about how everyone jumps immediately to large-scale products and robotics | 11:48 |
| kanzure | we have ribosomes cranking out proteins but that doesn't mean we can make large-scale structures at the moment | 11:49 |
| fenn | yeah especially the assumption that self replicating robots will be easy | 11:49 |
| maaku | kanzure: yeah but i still read your question as 'what's the highest impact thing you can make right out of the gate?' | 11:50 |
| fenn | water :P | 11:50 |
| * fenn puts on carl sagan voice | 11:50 | |
| kanzure | "high impact" is backwards.. better to look at what can be made, then filter as second step. | 11:51 |
| fenn | billions and billions of gallons of fresh clean water | 11:51 |
| kanzure | filtration could work | 11:51 |
| maaku | to which I think logic gates, NV-diamond quantum computers, and macro-scale braided carbon nanotube fibers are reasonable answers :) | 11:51 |
| nmz787_i | delinquentme: ADCs and DACs do not generally have a 10X cost relationship | 11:51 |
| delinquentme | nmz787_i, hmm one of the newbs in ##electronics sez yeh | 11:52 |
| delinquentme | but who knows | 11:52 |
| fenn | delinquentme: this is a "how much does a rope cost" sort of question | 11:54 |
| delinquentme | fenn, I dont need rope | 11:54 |
| delinquentme | jk jk lolol | 11:54 |
| fenn | but considering that a very good ADC costs about $1 i'm not sure why it matters | 11:54 |
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| nmz787_i | delinquentme: you get both a DAC and a ADC on an arduino, so they cost the same | 11:55 |
| fenn | unless you are doing software defined radio the cost will be negligible | 11:55 |
| nmz787_i | delinquentme: that is a newb answer for ya | 11:55 |
| nmz787_i | fenn: well 'good' is relative to the application | 11:55 |
| * delinquentme grumbles | 11:55 | |
| fenn | exactly | 11:55 |
| * delinquentme sips more kale protein slurry abomination | 11:56 | |
| kanzure | data storage, cameras would be easy. | 11:57 |
| kanzure | oh that counts as electronics. meh. | 11:57 |
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| fenn | something that can fix carbon with either light or electricity | 12:00 |
| maaku | Josh|NH4H has no-nanotech-required ideas regarding that | 12:00 |
| fenn | it should be reasonably efficient (>30%) and not require water or cleaning | 12:01 |
| Josh|NH4H | I believe I've been summoned? | 12:01 |
| fenn | hello | 12:01 |
| maaku | <fenn> something that can fix carbon with either light or electricity | 12:01 |
| fenn | we are rambling about easy things to make with nanofactories | 12:02 |
| kanzure | and by nanofactory we mean... more like a few months after positional placement of atoms starts working if ever. | 12:03 |
| fenn | actually since carbon fixation would need to be such a large scale process to be useful, it's not relevant for early nanofactory stuff because they would have limited output capacity | 12:04 |
| fenn | how about x-ray mirrors, made from nanometer thick layers of elements of increasing mass each layer | 12:06 |
| kanzure | for x-ray micromirror array things ? | 12:06 |
| fenn | for lots of stuff | 12:07 |
| fenn | x-ray lithography, x-ray lasers, x-ray holography, maybe some stimulated gamma emission experiments | 12:08 |
| Darius | drexler seems to think APM will evolve kind of gradually out of things like DNA origami, so we'd see early applications built out of polymers, with the unit size etc. more continuously getting better | 12:08 |
| kanzure | yeah probably lots of "metamaterial" options are available... like a glue paste that doubles as heat sink for buildings and airplanes and engines, shoot out energy wherever we want maybe. | 12:08 |
| kanzure | various molecular cages | 12:09 |
| kanzure | sensors with local logs | 12:11 |
| kanzure | eh nevermind, you'd probably just use the nanotech to improve electronics-based sensors anyway. | 12:11 |
| maaku | Darius: DNA origami should be sufficient for building little reaction chambers with protein catalysts for the reactions needed to charge tooltips | 12:13 |
| kanzure | dna origami structures are not "solids" | 12:13 |
| delinquentme | position specific placement of atoms havs already been achieved w diamond mechanosynthesis | 12:13 |
| maaku | delinquentme: not in any interesting way | 12:14 |
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| kanzure | s/interesting/useful | 12:14 |
| Darius | the idea is to use weak floppy hard-to-design things to build slightly stiffer easier-to-design things that can iterate the process | 12:14 |
| Darius | and make ever more useful products along the way | 12:14 |
| kanzure | has anyone demonstrated controlled chemical reactions inside of dna origami chambers? | 12:15 |
| delinquentme | Oyabu et al : http://journals.aps.org/prl/abstract/10.1103/PhysRevLett.90.176102 | 12:15 |
| maaku | Darius: i don't think that will work, but you could use the chemistry done with synthetic bio + dna origami with the positional silicon 3d printed structures zyvex is working on | 12:15 |
| delinquentme | kanzure, we've demonstrated controller dna assembly -- why doesnt that count / | 12:15 |
| kanzure | "controller dna assembly" what? | 12:15 |
| maaku | that would provide precision enough for unstressed diamondoid structures, i believe | 12:16 |
| kanzure | we can assemble some dna origami structures, sure | 12:16 |
| delinquentme | controlled * dna assembly | 12:16 |
| delinquentme | thats not the chemistry you're looking for? | 12:17 |
| maaku | delinquentme: i don't think anyone is looking to use DNA alone, no | 12:19 |
| kanzure | i think for dna origami reaction chambers you would need to synthesize the oligo with biotin at some point, or some other way to select a molecule to get inside of the chamber before the folding is complete. then you would combine with another dna origami structure that has the second reaction component. | 12:20 |
| delinquentme | that is definitely one thing I didnt write into the provisional | 12:20 |
| kanzure | dna origami predictability is only slightly better than protein folding predictability | 12:20 |
| delinquentme | using DNA origami to position the strands. Could be quite useful | 12:20 |
| kanzure | dna synthsis costs are also somewhat high | 12:20 |
| delinquentme | cause we dont yet have mecanoligation | 12:20 |
| * delinquentme nods | 12:20 | |
| kanzure | dna origami precise positioning isn't quite precise.... don't know what you are thinking about. | 12:20 |
| delinquentme | someone really should work on that | 12:21 |
| kanzure | huh? | 12:21 |
| delinquentme | mechanical ligation | 12:21 |
| fenn | how about YOU | 12:21 |
| maaku | kanzure: i meant just using DNA as structure for building tubes and valves and things at that scale | 12:21 |
| kanzure | dna origami is not going to do mechanical ligation of dna molecules | 12:21 |
| maaku | not doing single-particle reaction chambers | 12:21 |
| fenn | eh there's precedent with RNA "ribozyme" polymerases | 12:22 |
| kanzure | maaku: i think that it would be hard to make dna serve as hard building blocks like that | 12:22 |
| kanzure | yes, i'm aware of dnazymes | 12:22 |
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| kanzure | .wik deoxyribozyme | 12:22 |
| yoleaux | "Deoxyribozymes, also called DNA enzymes, DNAzymes, or catalytic DNA, are DNA oligonucleotides that are capable of catalyzing specific chemical reactions, similar to the action of other biological enzymes, such as proteins or ribozymes (enzymes composed of RNA)." — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deoxyribozyme | 12:22 |
| fenn | and self-splicing introns | 12:23 |
| fenn | anyway | 12:23 |
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| kanzure | not sure how to think of dna origami in terms of material characteristics. it's not just a polymer, it selectively binds to random stuff and twists and turns and it's not really a solid surface even if it is dna origami. | 12:25 |
| fenn | dna origami could be used as a scaffold to mount precise nanocrystals/nanoclusters that provide the precision necessary for charging tooltips or whatever, in the same way that one makes a precise structure out of ball bearings in order to achieve a better precision than is available using bulk manufacturing processes | 12:25 |
| kanzure | whereas proteins i am slightly more familiar with | 12:25 |
| kanzure | and then blocks of carbon are just graphene, graphite, diamond and easy to play around with in my head | 12:26 |
| fenn | think of dna origami like self-folding duct tape | 12:27 |
| kanzure | yeah probably first few molecular nanotech things should be for easier control of molecular precision, like ratcheting and actuators and positioning things. | 12:27 |
| kanzure | duct tape except sometimes it's not a film :-/ | 12:27 |
| kanzure | and it has weird dimensionality and twisting | 12:27 |
| fenn | duct string | 12:28 |
| fenn | well my point was that we can make identical copies of nanocrystals and nanoclusters so that provides a precise unit of measurement | 12:29 |
| kanzure | dna origami ticker tape with nanocrystals every n position length, then shimmy it on the tooltip a few nm away from the tip, move band over to get next nanocrystal reaction catalyst | 12:30 |
| kanzure | how did i get to this again? something about filters and machine tools. why am i thinking about this? | 12:31 |
| fenn | more like, design the dna origami so that it folds and pushes all the crystals together in the configuration you want to line up the substrate | 12:31 |
| Darius | drexler again, use weak positional constraints to make self-assembly more powerful | 12:32 |
| kanzure | that's too handwavy, i can't turn that into something real | 12:34 |
| fenn | "use TRIZ to apply inventive principles!" | 12:35 |
| kanzure | i am not entirely convinced about self-assembly directions, actually. amorphous computing either. i mean they are nice ideas and they look interesting but at some time i dunno how to make that many surfaces that bind selectively to other surfaces. like having 100k parts that find other proteins and assemble together at specific surface interfaces, that sort of binding selectivity is still hard to generate at the moment. and expensive. | 12:36 |
| kanzure | i like idea of biotin on oligo molecule. can stretch out oligo molecule and react to other surfaces, suddenly you have nm-resolution spacing of whatever you attached the biotin against. | 12:37 |
| fenn | that's not precise enough though | 12:37 |
| kanzure | what was the requirement? | 12:38 |
| fenn | not sure but i would guess under the length of a carbon bond | 12:38 |
| fenn | .wa length of a carbon bond | 12:38 |
| yoleaux | Carbon bonds: bond length: (data not available) | 12:38 |
| fenn | lol why do i bother | 12:38 |
| kanzure | maaku: are you around to meet a formal verification coq person? | 12:39 |
| kanzure | maybe explain your goals a bit. he's somewhat familiar with miri happenings. | 12:39 |
| fenn | 0.1 nm | 12:39 |
| kanzure | maaku: he can be on irc at 1:30pm pdt if you want to pick his brain. i highly recommend this. | 12:41 |
| kanzure | (50 minutes from now) | 12:41 |
| maaku | I'm on a 1-2pm conference call but free after | 12:42 |
| kanzure | ok so how about 2pm | 12:42 |
| maaku | sounds good to me | 12:42 |
| kanzure | ok done | 12:43 |
| fenn | kanzure handshake protocol completed, negotiating baud rate... | 12:43 |
| kanzure | no kidding | 12:43 |
| kanzure | it's like herding cats | 12:43 |
| maaku | is he employable? | 12:43 |
| kanzure | he has a relevant employer, but has buy-out clause | 12:43 |
| kanzure | kung fury soundtrack https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sw9uicEGjGw | 12:49 |
| kanzure | maaku: for context that conversation will be more along lines of cpu/vm (micro)architecture, coq stuff, correctness, formal verification, compiler design/theory/practicalities. | 12:56 |
| kanzure | unrelated but i think i had somewhat productive rant in #lesswrong earlier where i was able to convince at least some of them that computational complexity classes are real and that they apply to more than just "software", such as for general engineering reasons and systems refactoring or modifications. | 12:57 |
| delinquentme | lost me at #lesswrong | 12:58 |
| maaku | kanzure: how are you able to keep up with #lesswrong and stay productive? | 12:58 |
| maaku | but thanks for fighting the good fight | 12:58 |
| kanzure | maaku: i am immune to noise (not really, i just want to sound like evil luke from the new star wars trailer) | 12:58 |
| kanzure | context switching required to keep up in lesswrong is absolutely nothing compared to adhd | 12:59 |
| kanzure | also, i seem to have higher productivity on days where i am yelling at more people, according to some evidence i've been collecting | 13:00 |
| kanzure | (today has been good day for zeromq/tornado adventures) | 13:00 |
| maaku | well your most productive visible activity seems to be herding said cats, so that makes sense | 13:02 |
| kanzure | yeah i sorta regret that my software activity is non-visible | 13:02 |
| kanzure | but w/e who am i convincing anyway | 13:02 |
| delinquentme | engagement is always a good thing | 13:04 |
| delinquentme | yelling / bitching can help that sometimes | 13:04 |
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| kanzure | https://botbot.me/freenode/bitcoin-core-dev/2015-10-30/?msg=53142950&page=4 | 15:16 |
| kanzure | https://github.com/moyix/panda | 15:16 |
| kanzure | http://rr-project.org/ | 15:17 |
| kanzure | http://velvetpulse.com/2012/11/27/scribe-the-deterministic-transparent-record-replay-engine/ | 15:17 |
| kanzure | deterministic debugging/replay stuff | 15:17 |
| kanzure | http://www.crowdsupply.com/kosagi/novena-open-laptop | 15:50 |
| kanzure | http://spectrum.ieee.org/consumer-electronics/portable-devices/novena-a-laptop-with-no-secrets | 15:50 |
| kanzure | 19:00 < nmz787_i1> well this is pretty nice http://hackaday.com/2014/05/09/bunnies-laptop-gets-a-900mhz-scope-addon/ | 15:50 |
| kanzure | 19:01 < nmz787_i1> some PDFs of the probe schematics http://bunniefoo.com/novena/novescope/ | 15:50 |
| fenn | .title https://www.google.com/patents/US8067758 | 15:52 |
| yoleaux | Patent US8067758 - Nano-structured nuclear radiation shielding - Google Patents | 15:52 |
| kanzure | .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKjMLqkOdgM | 15:53 |
| yoleaux | 01. David Hasselhoff – True Survivor ( Kung Fury - Original Soundtrack ) - YouTube | 15:53 |
| fenn | did you just discover the 1980's? | 15:53 |
| kanzure | well i have been looking for reliable source of 80s for a while now | 15:54 |
| kanzure | newretrowave isn't quite on target for me | 15:55 |
| fenn | i feel like i will be judged unfairly for any specific 80's music i recommend | 16:05 |
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| kanzure | hah well most of what i listened to as a kid was my dad's stuff which was just top charts so i'm not one to judge here :-/ | 16:06 |
| fenn | some tangerine dream http://fennetic.net/irc/risky_business_love_on_a_real_train.mp3 | 16:11 |
| fenn | i guess i don't actually have very much 80's music | 16:12 |
| kanzure | womp womp | 16:12 |
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| kanzure | why do i keep confusing phil collins and philip glass | 16:18 |
| fenn | this is phil collins: http://fennetic.net/irc/risky_business_in_the_air_tonight.mp3 | 16:20 |
| fenn | philip glass is just synthesized piano arpeggios repeated until your mind melts | 16:21 |
| fenn | no i actually like philip glass https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Stu7h7Qup8 | 16:24 |
| fenn | this was what we had to substitute for techno music back in the days before internet | 16:29 |
| kanzure | make up your mind | 16:30 |
| kanzure | philip glass confusion is probably because koyaanisqatsi and truman show | 16:31 |
| fenn | i can like something even if it's not as good as modern things | 16:31 |
| kanzure | er nevermind, that doesn't explain the mixup | 16:32 |
| kanzure | 10:24 < nmz787_i1> http://mymochii.com/ --- 'Meet mochii, the world’s smallest production electron microscope.' | 16:35 |
| kanzure | "2015 Aug - Mochii makes its debut at Microscopy and Microanalysis 2015 in Portland, OR." | 16:36 |
| nmz787_i | yeah except they didn't actually show the microscope, they had a case and a tablet with a mock demo | 16:46 |
| fenn | boo hiss | 16:46 |
| fenn | ipad go home | 16:47 |
| kanzure | https://github.com/cliffordwolf/picorv32 | 17:03 |
| kanzure | http://nommu.org/jcore/ | 17:04 |
| kanzure | .title http://0pf.org/ | 17:04 |
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| yoleaux | Open Processor Foundation | Accelerating the development with open core processors | 17:04 |
| maaku | along similar lines | 17:05 |
| maaku | .title http://riscv.org/ | 17:05 |
| yoleaux | RISC-V | 17:05 |
| maaku | what a boring title | 17:05 |
| kanzure | that "video-only" open-source cad group will be discussing this presentation next: http://academy.cba.mit.edu/classes/old/cad_cam_cae/Bowyer.pdf (adrian boywer stuff from 2009) | 17:08 |
| kanzure | hmm i should probably send email to adrian bowyer about verbnurbs and solvespace, dunno if he has seen that yet | 17:08 |
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| fenn | video-only? | 17:10 |
| fenn | they don't know how to type or speak? | 17:10 |
| kanzure | google hangouts video face2face chat | 17:10 |
| kanzure | "look at each other's faces" group | 17:10 |
| fenn | such motivation | 17:11 |
| kanzure | "your chin is very motivating" | 17:11 |
| fenn | huh there actually is a philip glass techno remix album | 17:12 |
| kanzure | "techno" is too vague these days. could mean anythng. | 17:12 |
| fenn | nosaj thing, amon tobin, pantha du prince | 17:12 |
| fenn | pantha du prince is literally "minimal techno" that's the name of the sub-genre | 17:13 |
| fenn | ok i read the Bowyer.pdf and find it hard to believe anyone has anything worth contributing in video hangout form | 17:32 |
| fenn | it's basically "here's a b-rep. here's an f-rep. b-reps got here first, that's why we use them today. the end." | 17:33 |
| kanzure | code-review of verbnurbs or solvespace might be more productive | 17:37 |
| kanzure | but that's basically just "okay let's find where the resolution parameter is passed in, done" | 17:37 |
| kanzure | and maybe "glance at pdf in repository for whatever paper he is working from" | 17:37 |
| kanzure | http://ariel.chronotext.org/dd/defigueiredo93adaptive.pdf | 17:38 |
| kanzure | ("Adaptive sampling of parametric curves") | 17:38 |
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| kanzure | http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/ https://github.com/cliffordwolf/icestorm | 19:23 |
| kanzure | "Project IceStorm aims at documenting the bitstream format of Lattice iCE40 FPGAs and providing simple tools for analyzing and creating bitstream files. At the moment the focus of the project is on the HX1K-TQ144 and HX8K-CT256 devices, but most of the information is device-independent." | 19:23 |
| kanzure | "We have enough bits mapped that we can create a functional Verilog model for almost all bitstreams generated by Lattice iCEcube2 for the iCE40 HX1K-TQ144 and the iCE40 HX8K-CT256." | 19:23 |
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| kanzure | 19:28 < kanzure> wasn't this a giant missing piece of the puzzle and everyone had to use xilinx for the longest time | 19:35 |
| kanzure | 19:31 < TD-Linux> yes it was. and still is - the lattice chips are too small for some things | 19:35 |
| fenn | but better than nothing | 19:36 |
| kanzure | right, right. asked how small these things are, haven't looked. | 19:36 |
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| kanzure | i wonder if you could do ivf cycles while in an induced coma | 19:39 |
| kanzure | to get past the shittyness | 19:40 |
| fenn | yes | 19:40 |
| kanzure | although maybe i am overestimating shittyness | 19:40 |
| fenn | i don't think people are complaining about it that much | 19:40 |
| kanzure | ah. well okay then. | 19:40 |
| kanzure | 19:42 < TD-Linux> largest one is 8k LUTs / 64k dram. just large enough for a very small CPU, for example. | 19:42 |
| kanzure | 19:44 < TD-Linux> you can get a 1k LUT one on a USB stick with programmer for $20, and run a tiny CPU: http://www.excamera.com/sphinx/article-j1a-swapforth.html | 19:44 |
| kanzure | the future is pretty cool | 19:45 |
| fenn | so it's nice to be able to run a cpu in a fpga, but i'd rather just have a cpu and fpga combo | 19:46 |
| kanzure | oh some soc monstrosity? | 19:46 |
| fenn | the only use case i can think of is processor desginers/students or crypto people who can't trust that their processor is what it claims to be and nothing else | 19:47 |
| fenn | for a soft core | 19:47 |
| kanzure | sdr stuff? | 19:47 |
| fenn | otherwise an "asic" cpu is superior in every way | 19:47 |
| fenn | don't need a soft cpu for sdr | 19:48 |
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| nmz787_i | zynq | 20:31 |
| nmz787_i | me and chris_99 talked about this a few days ago | 20:31 |
| nmz787_i | we traded links back and forth a bunch | 20:31 |
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| kanzure | wasn't impressed by earlier list of molecular machines, actual answer might be "eh we only know what to do with large chunks of matter placed together" and/or "so electronics" | 21:20 |
| kanzure | electronics is broad enough to be useful tho, so i'll be okay with that | 21:21 |
| kanzure | fenn: carbon-bond positional placement was not the requirement for nanocrystal positioning. afm and/or stage can do positioning. nanocrystal just had to deliver chemical reagents for tooltip delivery. and then spacing between nanocrystals large enough that you wont accidentally hit the wrong one. | 21:24 |
| kanzure | *carbon-bond-resolution positional placement | 21:25 |
| kanzure | have two moving parts, one is the afm tip (or stage) second moving part is dna origami tape with nanocrystals attached at defined intervals. need to provide delivery of tooltip modification reagents that doesn't geometircally intersect with growing workpiece unless necessary for tooltip modification at specific time and place. | 21:26 |
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| JayDugger | fenn, what title has that Philip Glass remix album you mentioned? | 23:10 |
| --- Log closed Sat Oct 31 00:00:12 2015 | ||
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