* [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box
@ 2015-09-01 0:26 hurricanewarn1
2015-09-01 1:04 ` Milly Bitcoin
` (2 more replies)
0 siblings, 3 replies; 10+ messages in thread
From: hurricanewarn1 @ 2015-09-01 0:26 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: bitcoin-dev
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I have been struggling to get port 8333 open all year, I gave up and was using blockchain for months despite a strong desire to stay on Bitcoin Core, but now the issue has reached critical mass since I'm using the python Bitcoin server module. I have literally spent my entire day trying to open 8333, I thoroughly made sure it was open on the router and computer and it's still closed. Strangely enough I got it open for 30 seconds once today but something closed it immediately.
After hours of phone calls and messaging AT&T finally told me the truth of what was going on, and only because I noticed it myself and demanded an answer. The internet is being routed through a DVR/cable box, and they confirmed the DVR also has a firewall. To make this even more absurd they refused to turn the firewall off because it is their equipment. So effectively they can firewall any port they want even if the customer asks them not to, in the unlikely event the customer figures it out.
Perhaps this is the driving force behind the inexplicable and massive decline in Bitcoin nodes. Bitcoin is being censored by the ISPs themselves, and they won't even tell you that. I had to get in touch with headquarters and threaten to rip it out of the wall to get a proper answer.
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread* Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box 2015-09-01 0:26 [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box hurricanewarn1 @ 2015-09-01 1:04 ` Milly Bitcoin 2015-09-01 1:16 ` James Hilliard 2015-09-01 7:16 ` odinn 2 siblings, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Milly Bitcoin @ 2015-09-01 1:04 UTC (permalink / raw) To: bitcoin-dev > I have been struggling to get port 8333 open all year, > > After hours of phone calls and messaging AT&T finally told me the truth > of what was going on, I went through this Comcast involving another port. When they blocked the port I asked them the reason (I referenced their privacy policy that they are supposed to disclose my account info to me). they told me it didn't matter what their privacy policy said, they weren't going to tell me. I then showed up in federal court and testified as to what they were doing. It was a class action lawsuit against them for people who tried to get refunds over bandwidth throttling and I was one of members of the class. In any event the solution for me was to get a business account rather than a residential account. You get a gateway that you can configure yourself and you can turn off the firewall. As far as I can tell no ports are blocked like residential accounts. The cost was an extra $10/month (unless you get other options like fixed IP and/or increased bandwidth). maybe you can get the data from bitnodes.io to see if any ISP is blocking nodes. Maybe stats could be posted based on ISP. I have been running a node through that account for awhile now https://getaddr.bitnodes.io/nodes/70.90.2.18-8333/ Russ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box 2015-09-01 0:26 [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box hurricanewarn1 2015-09-01 1:04 ` Milly Bitcoin @ 2015-09-01 1:16 ` James Hilliard 2015-09-01 7:16 ` odinn 2 siblings, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: James Hilliard @ 2015-09-01 1:16 UTC (permalink / raw) To: hurricanewarn1; +Cc: bitcoin-dev You should tell AT&T that you want the DVR/cable box put into what is usually referred to as "bridge mode" or sometimes "true bridge mode" depending on your ISP and then use your own router, look under "Bridged Mode" at the bottom of this page for AT&T http://www.att.com/gen/general?pid=23697 . You want your own router to have the external IP, if it does not it is not configured correctly. In general one should never use a router provided by their ISP for anything other than modem functionality since it is typically only the ISP that can change the firmware on it, it also makes troubleshooting problems like this more difficult. On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 7:26 PM, Zach G via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote: > I have been struggling to get port 8333 open all year, I gave up and was > using blockchain for months despite a strong desire to stay on Bitcoin Core, > but now the issue has reached critical mass since I'm using the python > Bitcoin server module. I have literally spent my entire day trying to open > 8333, I thoroughly made sure it was open on the router and computer and it's > still closed. Strangely enough I got it open for 30 seconds once today but > something closed it immediately. > > After hours of phone calls and messaging AT&T finally told me the truth of > what was going on, and only because I noticed it myself and demanded an > answer. The internet is being routed through a DVR/cable box, and they > confirmed the DVR also has a firewall. To make this even more absurd they > refused to turn the firewall off because it is their equipment. So > effectively they can firewall any port they want even if the customer asks > them not to, in the unlikely event the customer figures it out. > > Perhaps this is the driving force behind the inexplicable and massive > decline in Bitcoin nodes. Bitcoin is being censored by the ISPs themselves, > and they won't even tell you that. I had to get in touch with headquarters > and threaten to rip it out of the wall to get a proper answer. > > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box 2015-09-01 0:26 [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box hurricanewarn1 2015-09-01 1:04 ` Milly Bitcoin 2015-09-01 1:16 ` James Hilliard @ 2015-09-01 7:16 ` odinn 2015-09-01 14:44 ` Dan Bryant 2015-09-02 7:20 ` [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets hurricanewarn1 2 siblings, 2 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: odinn @ 2015-09-01 7:16 UTC (permalink / raw) To: hurricanewarn1, bitcoin-dev -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 Another note on this subject to add to the stuff people have already mentioned... If you have the AT&T landline but don't use AT&T's standard internet / tv (what they call Uverse) offering - that is, if you prefer to use some local internet provider - you are probably better off (in terms of avoiding not only this sort of blockage/censorship but as well, potentially getting a better privacy policy that isn't going to be like AT&T's long-term data retention). You can check directly with the various local small ISPs to see what their policies are specifically on ports and whatnot. Ideally your ISP should let you: port forward to SOMEPORTNUMBER for tcp and udp (above may or may not be helpful for some if you are using decentralized markets) have port 8333 open (above is for bitcoin of course) Supposing you have FTTN because you are paying a local ISP for internet service, and that local ISP has contracted with AT&T to be able to provide service in an area where old-style DSL has been phased out, thus your local ISP is essentially providing you AT&T FTTN. (FTTN is Fiber to the Node, FTTN-BP is FTTN Bonded Pair). Even if a local ISP has its own privacy policy posted which is different from AT&T, everything is subject to AT&T data retention because the FTTN. So get yourself a VPN (or set up your own) for your connection. Tor will run through the VPN. General observations - TWC stores your IP and other stuffs for 6 months or longer. Same for Comcast. Verizon retains your stuffs for 18 month minimum, probably longer though. Qwest/Century, 1 year. Cox, 6 months. AT&T retains for longer than a year. This is just what they are telling you, the reality is it's probably longer due to stuff like this: https://www.lawfareblog.com/odni-and-doj-release-last-section-215-collec tion-order Zach G via bitcoin-dev: > I have been struggling to get port 8333 open all year, I gave up > and was using blockchain for months despite a strong desire to stay > on Bitcoin Core, but now the issue has reached critical mass since > I'm using the python Bitcoin server module. I have literally spent > my entire day trying to open 8333, I thoroughly made sure it was > open on the router and computer and it's still closed. Strangely > enough I got it open for 30 seconds once today but something closed > it immediately. > > After hours of phone calls and messaging AT&T finally told me the > truth of what was going on, and only because I noticed it myself > and demanded an answer. The internet is being routed through a > DVR/cable box, and they confirmed the DVR also has a firewall. To > make this even more absurd they refused to turn the firewall off > because it is their equipment. So effectively they can firewall any > port they want even if the customer asks them not to, in the > unlikely event the customer figures it out. > > Perhaps this is the driving force behind the inexplicable and > massive decline in Bitcoin nodes. Bitcoin is being censored by the > ISPs themselves, and they won't even tell you that. I had to get in > touch with headquarters and threaten to rip it out of the wall to > get a proper answer. > > > > _______________________________________________ bitcoin-dev mailing > list bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > - -- http://abis.io ~ "a protocol concept to enable decentralization and expansion of a giving economy, and a new social good" https://keybase.io/odinn -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJV5VDeAAoJEGxwq/inSG8CvkIH/jy4Vo+My3xeBdvFQmxkJWyQ U5mv2zWEvBYw71Xy1EDzQY1AhEBmatUU1eu2AbOqXdUR4511FxCNzFmTxy6roEiz EehBkvXNbBCbEzLRisjxuQw34OKM+xfieCqE1mzJok2uSdLMMQLcbWL1/k3/OmS5 9O9z/wMXqU1Jc19MTK+vF1Lz5ilnRn3hEbTaCN3ivYnYFa0DpBH9r0Y07UcoJ6Wr ui/x0sSSuupAGzOkZ75HQ8yeQXckeAu6TB3/jE8QEqNUmAJkmR8eK4ofXZWFrIjy mOKeQL4c+jRQnTR8pt+y89g2QIpzFoHaV5T+WvQuC1t8xNOrxLgYFXWgl0dhoYE= =UCLC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box 2015-09-01 7:16 ` odinn @ 2015-09-01 14:44 ` Dan Bryant 2015-09-02 7:20 ` [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets hurricanewarn1 1 sibling, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Dan Bryant @ 2015-09-01 14:44 UTC (permalink / raw) To: odinn; +Cc: bitcoin-dev Keep in mind... Legal or Not, many ISPs (Comcast for example) prohibit offering up network services (which a full node would supply) from your residence. I checked AT&T's TOS and they have a carve-out on equipment that is scary http://www.att.com/legal/terms.internetAttTermsOfService.html >Regardless of whether the equipment used to access your Service (modem, gateway, etc.) is owned by you or AT&T, AT&T reserves the right to manage such equipment for the duration of your Service, and retains exclusive rights to data generated by the equipment. Neither you nor a third party may change, interfere with, or block access to equipment data or settings. AT&T seams to imply they implicitly have Admin rights to all "equipment" that connects to their network. Clearly an overreach that needs to be clarified, but there it is. As for Comcast, they simply forbid network "services" that serve anyone off-premise. http://www.xfinity.com/Corporate/Customers/Policies/HighSpeedInternetAUP.html > [MAY NOT] use or run dedicated, stand-alone equipment or servers from the Premises that provide network content or any other services to anyone outside of your Premises local area network (“Premises LAN”), also commonly referred to as public services or servers. Examples of prohibited equipment and servers include, but are not limited to, email, web hosting, file sharing, and proxy services and servers Technically, P2P is prohibited in the Comcast TOS, or at least by my reading. I realize that Comcast with deny this tooth and nail, but if they ever want to exercise the prohibition, it is clearly spelled out in their TOS My recommendation is to file a complaint with the FCC to bring up your issue as well as any overreach they spell out in the AUP or TOS. As for me... I simply subscribed to a VPN. That gives me both privacy (to a degree) and flexibility to open or close whatever ports I want. On Tue, Sep 1, 2015 at 2:16 AM, odinn via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA512 > > Another note on this subject to add to the stuff people have already > mentioned... > > If you have the AT&T landline but don't use AT&T's standard internet / > tv (what they call Uverse) offering - that is, if you prefer to use > some local internet provider - you are probably better off (in terms > of avoiding not only this sort of blockage/censorship but as well, > potentially getting a better privacy policy that isn't going to be > like AT&T's long-term data retention). You can check directly with > the various local small ISPs to see what their policies are > specifically on ports and whatnot. > > Ideally your ISP should let you: > > port forward to SOMEPORTNUMBER for tcp and udp > > (above may or may not be helpful for some if you are using > decentralized markets) > > have port 8333 open > > (above is for bitcoin of course) > > Supposing you have FTTN because you are paying a local ISP for > internet service, and that local ISP has contracted with AT&T to be > able to provide service in an area where old-style DSL has been phased > out, thus your local ISP is essentially providing you AT&T FTTN. > (FTTN is Fiber to the Node, FTTN-BP is FTTN Bonded Pair). Even if a > local ISP has its own privacy policy posted which is different from > AT&T, everything is subject to AT&T data retention because the FTTN. > So get yourself a VPN (or set up your own) for your connection. Tor > will run through the VPN. > > General observations - TWC stores your IP and other stuffs for 6 > months or longer. Same for Comcast. Verizon retains your stuffs for > 18 month minimum, probably longer though. Qwest/Century, 1 year. > Cox, 6 months. AT&T retains for longer than a year. This is just > what they are telling you, the reality is it's probably longer due to > stuff like this: > https://www.lawfareblog.com/odni-and-doj-release-last-section-215-collec > tion-order > > > > > > > > > > Zach G via bitcoin-dev: >> I have been struggling to get port 8333 open all year, I gave up >> and was using blockchain for months despite a strong desire to stay >> on Bitcoin Core, but now the issue has reached critical mass since >> I'm using the python Bitcoin server module. I have literally spent >> my entire day trying to open 8333, I thoroughly made sure it was >> open on the router and computer and it's still closed. Strangely >> enough I got it open for 30 seconds once today but something closed >> it immediately. >> >> After hours of phone calls and messaging AT&T finally told me the >> truth of what was going on, and only because I noticed it myself >> and demanded an answer. The internet is being routed through a >> DVR/cable box, and they confirmed the DVR also has a firewall. To >> make this even more absurd they refused to turn the firewall off >> because it is their equipment. So effectively they can firewall any >> port they want even if the customer asks them not to, in the >> unlikely event the customer figures it out. >> >> Perhaps this is the driving force behind the inexplicable and >> massive decline in Bitcoin nodes. Bitcoin is being censored by the >> ISPs themselves, and they won't even tell you that. I had to get in >> touch with headquarters and threaten to rip it out of the wall to >> get a proper answer. >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ bitcoin-dev mailing >> list bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org >> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev >> > > - -- > http://abis.io ~ > "a protocol concept to enable decentralization > and expansion of a giving economy, and a new social good" > https://keybase.io/odinn > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > > iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJV5VDeAAoJEGxwq/inSG8CvkIH/jy4Vo+My3xeBdvFQmxkJWyQ > U5mv2zWEvBYw71Xy1EDzQY1AhEBmatUU1eu2AbOqXdUR4511FxCNzFmTxy6roEiz > EehBkvXNbBCbEzLRisjxuQw34OKM+xfieCqE1mzJok2uSdLMMQLcbWL1/k3/OmS5 > 9O9z/wMXqU1Jc19MTK+vF1Lz5ilnRn3hEbTaCN3ivYnYFa0DpBH9r0Y07UcoJ6Wr > ui/x0sSSuupAGzOkZ75HQ8yeQXckeAu6TB3/jE8QEqNUmAJkmR8eK4ofXZWFrIjy > mOKeQL4c+jRQnTR8pt+y89g2QIpzFoHaV5T+WvQuC1t8xNOrxLgYFXWgl0dhoYE= > =UCLC > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing list > bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. 2015-09-01 7:16 ` odinn 2015-09-01 14:44 ` Dan Bryant @ 2015-09-02 7:20 ` hurricanewarn1 1 sibling, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: hurricanewarn1 @ 2015-09-02 7:20 UTC (permalink / raw) To: bitcoin-dev [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 9341 bytes --] I was about to buy a VPS for Bitcoin, but I really do need Bitcoin Core for business reasons so I didn't give up. I once again thoroughly went through my computer and made sure there was nothing blocking 8333, a couple useful tools are CurrPorts and TCPView. I went through the router to make sure there was no block of port 8333. I researched everything thoroughly and was sure these were the right settings, but Bitcoin was still getting throttled every second and stuck in sys_sent, and python kept saying the target was rejecting the connection. I finally stumbled upon subnet settings, and saw that I had a private subnet, one of the few IPs that are private on earth ( https://www.arin.net/knowledge/address_filters.html ). Uverse put all their customers on a private subnet by default. This made my computer not only hidden but unroutable for any computer on the Bitcoin network. That alone is enough to totally stop Bitcoin connections on any port, but they made it even crazier by generating a dynamic IP that changes all the time, so public IP was meaningless for my computer. I switched over to a public subnet, and right there was a checkbox to allow incoming connections. My static IP showed for a minute then became dynamic/hidden again without me even touching anything. The final roadblock was AT&T charges $15-30/month for a public static IP, which is obviously insane and actually one could argue that violates their own terms of service. So the router was still ignoring my public IP settings simply because I wasn't paying for a public IP, and intentionally changing the settings back. I asked for a free public IP and there was no response for awhile. I found this article on cryptocoinnews while working out: https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/isps-intentionally-blocking-bitcoin/ It's based on the first email I sent, and was displayed prominently on their front page. I posted a tweet publicly about it which referenced AT&T ( https://twitter.com/turtlehurricane/status/638930065980551168 ) and believe it or not I had a static public IP and port 8333 was open about 1 minute later. I don't know if it was a coincidence cause I already messaged them to please do that an hour before, or if that article and tweet spurred them to action. The timing was so ridiculous I think it's the latter. Without twitter I probably wouldn't have succeeded, the technicians on twitter actually answered all my questions 24/7 unlike phone technicians which were clueless and trying to sell me a subscription for connection services help. And shout out to cryptocoinnews for making this public. So to clarify, it appears AT&T has not blocked port 8333 itself, but rather effectively blocked all ports via the private subnet, which makes the computer hidden and unroutable for incoming peers. Although this severely limits functionality and cripples the ability to run a full node and many other programs it is understandable, since it just about 100% prevents hackers from getting in, since they can't even see your computer. What isn't understandable is that AT&T technicians did not inform me about this until I changed the settings myself, despite the fact it is a very obvious cause of ports being blocked. It's probably just ignorance since AT&T has so many complex network settings it's hard to keep track of, although I have a suspicion that someone in their command chain is withholding information in an attempt to make them buy a $15/month connection service, and once they buy that another $15-30/month is needed to get the static IP. As far as I know there is no easy to find info on the internet about private subnets crippling the ability to use Bitcoin. I believe this needs to be explicitly said in instructions for running a full node, maybe it wasn't a problem in 2009 but now it is a major issue. On default settings Bitcoin is 100% blocked, and most people do not have the time or motivation to fix this. I talked to at least 10 AT&T technicians and worked on it 2-3 days straight, did not receive the right answer until I found it myself, although they certainly gave me some useful clues about how the network works. I am very happy that AT&T fixed it, since other ISPs like Comcast appeared even worse. I openly talked with them about Bitcoin and they showed no prejudice, might've actually made them more willing to help me cause otherwise they would think I'm a hacker. tl;dr The good news is anyone with AT&T can be a full node by getting a public static IP, the bad news is almost no one will figure this out unless we as a community make it well known. I guarantee node numbers will improve if this information is spread to everyone. Database size and computing expenditures is simply not the reason people don't run full nodes, it's because their ISP has made it just about impossible without shelling out nearly 100% more money per month. If you don't pay the fee AT&T would never tell you about the private subnet, at least based on my experience. -----Original Message----- From: odinn <odinn.cyberguerrilla@riseup•net> To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol•com>; bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> Sent: Tue, Sep 1, 2015 3:16 am Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 Another note on this subject to add to the stuff people have already mentioned... If you have the AT&T landline but don't use AT&T's standard internet / tv (what they call Uverse) offering - that is, if you prefer to use some local internet provider - you are probably better off (in terms of avoiding not only this sort of blockage/censorship but as well, potentially getting a better privacy policy that isn't going to be like AT&T's long-term data retention). You can check directly with the various local small ISPs to see what their policies are specifically on ports and whatnot. Ideally your ISP should let you: port forward to SOMEPORTNUMBER for tcp and udp (above may or may not be helpful for some if you are using decentralized markets) have port 8333 open (above is for bitcoin of course) Supposing you have FTTN because you are paying a local ISP for internet service, and that local ISP has contracted with AT&T to be able to provide service in an area where old-style DSL has been phased out, thus your local ISP is essentially providing you AT&T FTTN. (FTTN is Fiber to the Node, FTTN-BP is FTTN Bonded Pair). Even if a local ISP has its own privacy policy posted which is different from AT&T, everything is subject to AT&T data retention because the FTTN. So get yourself a VPN (or set up your own) for your connection. Tor will run through the VPN. General observations - TWC stores your IP and other stuffs for 6 months or longer. Same for Comcast. Verizon retains your stuffs for 18 month minimum, probably longer though. Qwest/Century, 1 year. Cox, 6 months. AT&T retains for longer than a year. This is just what they are telling you, the reality is it's probably longer due to stuff like this: https://www.lawfareblog.com/odni-and-doj-release-last-section-215-collec tion-order Zach G via bitcoin-dev: > I have been struggling to get port 8333 open all year, I gave up > and was using blockchain for months despite a strong desire to stay > on Bitcoin Core, but now the issue has reached critical mass since > I'm using the python Bitcoin server module. I have literally spent > my entire day trying to open 8333, I thoroughly made sure it was > open on the router and computer and it's still closed. Strangely > enough I got it open for 30 seconds once today but something closed > it immediately. > > After hours of phone calls and messaging AT&T finally told me the > truth of what was going on, and only because I noticed it myself > and demanded an answer. The internet is being routed through a > DVR/cable box, and they confirmed the DVR also has a firewall. To > make this even more absurd they refused to turn the firewall off > because it is their equipment. So effectively they can firewall any > port they want even if the customer asks them not to, in the > unlikely event the customer figures it out. > > Perhaps this is the driving force behind the inexplicable and > massive decline in Bitcoin nodes. Bitcoin is being censored by the > ISPs themselves, and they won't even tell you that. I had to get in > touch with headquarters and threaten to rip it out of the wall to > get a proper answer. > > > > _______________________________________________ bitcoin-dev mailing > list bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > - -- http://abis.io ~ "a protocol concept to enable decentralization and expansion of a giving economy, and a new social good" https://keybase.io/odinn -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJV5VDeAAoJEGxwq/inSG8CvkIH/jy4Vo+My3xeBdvFQmxkJWyQ U5mv2zWEvBYw71Xy1EDzQY1AhEBmatUU1eu2AbOqXdUR4511FxCNzFmTxy6roEiz EehBkvXNbBCbEzLRisjxuQw34OKM+xfieCqE1mzJok2uSdLMMQLcbWL1/k3/OmS5 9O9z/wMXqU1Jc19MTK+vF1Lz5ilnRn3hEbTaCN3ivYnYFa0DpBH9r0Y07UcoJ6Wr ui/x0sSSuupAGzOkZ75HQ8yeQXckeAu6TB3/jE8QEqNUmAJkmR8eK4ofXZWFrIjy mOKeQL4c+jRQnTR8pt+y89g2QIpzFoHaV5T+WvQuC1t8xNOrxLgYFXWgl0dhoYE= =UCLC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 10435 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
[parent not found: <2156992.EaWDNESINK@crushinator>]
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. [not found] <2156992.EaWDNESINK@crushinator> @ 2015-09-02 9:20 ` hurricanewarn1 0 siblings, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: hurricanewarn1 @ 2015-09-02 9:20 UTC (permalink / raw) To: bitcoin-dev [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 12397 bytes --] First off I couldn't synch the wallet, it said no block source available and there was zero connections. Bitcoin was literally getting thottled every second. It would not even allow the connection to get block source. EVERY port was blocked, making exceptions in the router firewall did nothing. I was forced to use Blockchain.info which is a major security risk. Secondly, I am developing a program using Bitcoin Python modules, so I login to my computer like it's a server and it was flat out rejecting the connection. I could not run any code until this got fixed, and of course needed the block source to even do anything. If Bitcoin Core worked but 8333 was blocked I would not be emailing the list. Bitcoin Core was crippled and unusable due to the AT&T settings, and they tried hard to get me to buy monthly subscriptions to get the answer. This makes it likely that Bitcoin Core is unusable for most AT&T customers and other ISPs, hence the massive node decline. I'm sure this disrupts alot of other people besides Bitcoiners too, hence the monthly subscriptions geared towards people who can't figure out their connection situation. AT&T literally blocked access to static IP if you don't buy one, so it wasn't a normal network setup. Unfortunately the same security used to stop hackers and viruses stops Bitcoin too, so this is probably the settings for almost every router in the country. Nodes are in fact declining worldwide, down 15% in the past year alone. Community needs to speak up and also educate before this gets completely out of control. https://getaddr.bitnodes.io/dashboard/?days=365 6,000 nodes is pathetic as it is and it's constantly declining. -----Original Message----- From: Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock•name> To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol•com> Sent: Wed, Sep 2, 2015 4:32 am Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. Respectfully, what the heck are you talking about? Practically every home LAN runs on a private subnet. My own desktop computer has the IP address 192.168.1.34, which is in a private subnet. This doesn't prevent my Bitcoin Core node from making outbound connections to other nodes. Moreover, almost all home Internet connections in the world run on dynamically assigned IP addresses. Again, this does not cause any problems for connecting outbound to other Bitcoin nodes. It's true that your node can't accept incoming connections unless you forward port 8333 on your router to your computer, but you don't need to be able to accept incoming connections to participate in the Bitcoin network. On Wednesday, 2 September 2015, at 3:20 am, Zach G via bitcoin-dev wrote: > > I was about to buy a VPS for Bitcoin, but I really do need Bitcoin Core for business reasons so I didn't give up. I once again thoroughly went through my computer and made sure there was nothing blocking 8333, a couple useful tools are CurrPorts and TCPView. I went through the router to make sure there was no block of port 8333. I researched everything thoroughly and was sure these were the right settings, but Bitcoin was still getting throttled every second and stuck in sys_sent, and python kept saying the target was rejecting the connection. > > I finally stumbled upon subnet settings, and saw that I had a private subnet, one of the few IPs that are private on earth ( https://www.arin.net/knowledge/address_filters.html ). Uverse put all their customers on a private subnet by default. This made my computer not only hidden but unroutable for any computer on the Bitcoin network. That alone is enough to totally stop Bitcoin connections on any port, but they made it even crazier by generating a dynamic IP that changes all the time, so public IP was meaningless for my computer. > > I switched over to a public subnet, and right there was a checkbox to allow incoming connections. My static IP showed for a minute then became dynamic/hidden again without me even touching anything. The final roadblock was AT&T charges $15-30/month for a public static IP, which is obviously insane and actually one could argue that violates their own terms of service. So the router was still ignoring my public IP settings simply because I wasn't paying for a public IP, and intentionally changing the settings back. I asked for a free public IP and there was no response for awhile. > > I found this article on cryptocoinnews while working out: https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/isps-intentionally-blocking-bitcoin/ It's based on the first email I sent, and was displayed prominently on their front page. I posted a tweet publicly about it which referenced AT&T ( https://twitter.com/turtlehurricane/status/638930065980551168 ) and believe it or not I had a static public IP and port 8333 was open about 1 minute later. I don't know if it was a coincidence cause I already messaged them to please do that an hour before, or if that article and tweet spurred them to action. The timing was so ridiculous I think it's the latter. Without twitter I probably wouldn't have succeeded, the technicians on twitter actually answered all my questions 24/7 unlike phone technicians which were clueless and trying to sell me a subscription for connection services help. And shout out to cryptocoinnews for making this public. > > So to clarify, it appears AT&T has not blocked port 8333 itself, but rather effectively blocked all ports via the private subnet, which makes the computer hidden and unroutable for incoming peers. Although this severely limits functionality and cripples the ability to run a full node and many other programs it is understandable, since it just about 100% prevents hackers from getting in, since they can't even see your computer. What isn't understandable is that AT&T technicians did not inform me about this until I changed the settings myself, despite the fact it is a very obvious cause of ports being blocked. It's probably just ignorance since AT&T has so many complex network settings it's hard to keep track of, although I have a suspicion that someone in their command chain is withholding information in an attempt to make them buy a $15/month connection service, and once they buy that another $15-30/month is needed to get the static IP. > > As far as I know there is no easy to find info on the internet about private subnets crippling the ability to use Bitcoin. I believe this needs to be explicitly said in instructions for running a full node, maybe it wasn't a problem in 2009 but now it is a major issue. On default settings Bitcoin is 100% blocked, and most people do not have the time or motivation to fix this. I talked to at least 10 AT&T technicians and worked on it 2-3 days straight, did not receive the right answer until I found it myself, although they certainly gave me some useful clues about how the network works. > > I am very happy that AT&T fixed it, since other ISPs like Comcast appeared even worse. I openly talked with them about Bitcoin and they showed no prejudice, might've actually made them more willing to help me cause otherwise they would think I'm a hacker. > > tl;dr The good news is anyone with AT&T can be a full node by getting a public static IP, the bad news is almost no one will figure this out unless we as a community make it well known. I guarantee node numbers will improve if this information is spread to everyone. Database size and computing expenditures is simply not the reason people don't run full nodes, it's because their ISP has made it just about impossible without shelling out nearly 100% more money per month. If you don't pay the fee AT&T would never tell you about the private subnet, at least based on my experience. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: odinn <odinn.cyberguerrilla@riseup•net> > To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol•com>; bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> > Sent: Tue, Sep 1, 2015 3:16 am > Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA512 > > Another note on this subject > to add to the stuff people have already > mentioned... > > If you have the AT&T > landline but don't use AT&T's standard internet / > tv (what they call Uverse) > offering - that is, if you prefer to use > some local internet provider - you are > probably better off (in terms > of avoiding not only this sort of > blockage/censorship but as well, > potentially getting a better privacy policy > that isn't going to be > like AT&T's long-term data retention). You can check > directly with > the various local small ISPs to see what their policies > are > specifically on ports and whatnot. > > Ideally your ISP should let > you: > > port forward to SOMEPORTNUMBER for tcp and udp > > (above may or may not > be helpful for some if you are using > decentralized markets) > > have port 8333 > open > > (above is for bitcoin of course) > > Supposing you have FTTN because you > are paying a local ISP for > internet service, and that local ISP has contracted > with AT&T to be > able to provide service in an area where old-style DSL has been > phased > out, thus your local ISP is essentially providing you AT&T FTTN. > (FTTN > is Fiber to the Node, FTTN-BP is FTTN Bonded Pair). Even if a > local ISP has > its own privacy policy posted which is different from > AT&T, everything is > subject to AT&T data retention because the FTTN. > So get yourself a VPN (or set > up your own) for your connection. Tor > will run through the VPN. > > General > observations - TWC stores your IP and other stuffs for 6 > months or longer. > Same for Comcast. Verizon retains your stuffs for > 18 month minimum, probably > longer though. Qwest/Century, 1 year. > Cox, 6 months. AT&T retains for longer > than a year. This is just > what they are telling you, the reality is it's > probably longer due to > stuff like > this: > https://www.lawfareblog.com/odni-and-doj-release-last-section-215-collec > tion-order > > > > > > > > > > Zach > G via bitcoin-dev: > > I have been struggling to get port 8333 open all year, I > gave up > > and was using blockchain for months despite a strong desire to > stay > > on Bitcoin Core, but now the issue has reached critical mass since > > > I'm using the python Bitcoin server module. I have literally spent > > my entire > day trying to open 8333, I thoroughly made sure it was > > open on the router and > computer and it's still closed. Strangely > > enough I got it open for 30 seconds > once today but something closed > > it immediately. > > > > After hours of phone > calls and messaging AT&T finally told me the > > truth of what was going on, and > only because I noticed it myself > > and demanded an answer. The internet is > being routed through a > > DVR/cable box, and they confirmed the DVR also has a > firewall. To > > make this even more absurd they refused to turn the firewall > off > > because it is their equipment. So effectively they can firewall any > > > port they want even if the customer asks them not to, in the > > unlikely event > the customer figures it out. > > > > Perhaps this is the driving force behind the > inexplicable and > > massive decline in Bitcoin nodes. Bitcoin is being censored > by the > > ISPs themselves, and they won't even tell you that. I had to get in > > > touch with headquarters and threaten to rip it out of the wall to > > get a > proper answer. > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > bitcoin-dev mailing > > list bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org > > > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > > > > - -- > > http://abis.io ~ > "a protocol concept to enable decentralization > and > expansion of a giving economy, and a new social > good" > https://keybase.io/odinn > -----BEGIN PGP > SIGNATURE----- > > iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJV5VDeAAoJEGxwq/inSG8CvkIH/jy4Vo+My3xeBdvFQmxkJWyQ > U5mv2zWEvBYw71Xy1EDzQY1AhEBmatUU1eu2AbOqXdUR4511FxCNzFmTxy6roEiz > EehBkvXNbBCbEzLRisjxuQw34OKM+xfieCqE1mzJok2uSdLMMQLcbWL1/k3/OmS5 > 9O9z/wMXqU1Jc19MTK+vF1Lz5ilnRn3hEbTaCN3ivYnYFa0DpBH9r0Y07UcoJ6Wr > ui/x0sSSuupAGzOkZ75HQ8yeQXckeAu6TB3/jE8QEqNUmAJkmR8eK4ofXZWFrIjy > mOKeQL4c+jRQnTR8pt+y89g2QIpzFoHaV5T+WvQuC1t8xNOrxLgYFXWgl0dhoYE= > =UCLC > -----END > PGP SIGNATURE----- > > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 15022 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
[parent not found: <1954364.4gG0cHmrlB@crushinator>]
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. [not found] <1954364.4gG0cHmrlB@crushinator> @ 2015-09-02 13:44 ` hurricanewarn1 2015-09-02 19:21 ` Matt Whitlock 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: hurricanewarn1 @ 2015-09-02 13:44 UTC (permalink / raw) To: bitcoin-dev [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 14520 bytes --] 42 in the whole world, and I'm one of them. Clearly that is a problem, do you even know about AT&T or are you in another country? Cause that statement is utterly ridiculous given the fact there are hundreds of millions of people using AT&T. I was simply sharing my knowledge on this issue since it poses a threat to the health of the bitcoin network, no need for personal attacks. None of my accusations were false, there is a firewall in the DVR that is uncontrolled and all ports are blocked via private subnets and no fixed public IP allowed unless you pay. I confirmed every one of these details with AT&T technicians or I wouldn't be saying them. -----Original Message----- From: Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock•name> To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol•com> Sent: Wed, Sep 2, 2015 5:34 am Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. According to BitNodes, 42 Bitcoin nodes are running on AT&T's network: https://getaddr.bitnodes.io/nodes/?q=AT%26T So I'm thinking there's nothing wrong with AT&T's default network configuration. Frankly, the things you've been writing strongly suggest that you aren't very knowledgeable about computer networking. Instead of jumping right into making wild accusations about AT&T, you probably should find someone knowledgeable to verify your claims. On Wednesday, 2 September 2015, at 5:20 am, Zach G via bitcoin-dev wrote: > First off I couldn't synch the wallet, it said no block source available and there was zero connections. Bitcoin was literally getting thottled every second. It would not even allow the connection to get block source. EVERY port was blocked, making exceptions in the router firewall did nothing. I was forced to use Blockchain.info which is a major security risk. > > Secondly, I am developing a program using Bitcoin Python modules, so I login to my computer like it's a server and it was flat out rejecting the connection. I could not run any code until this got fixed, and of course needed the block source to even do anything. > > If Bitcoin Core worked but 8333 was blocked I would not be emailing the list. Bitcoin Core was crippled and unusable due to the AT&T settings, and they tried hard to get me to buy monthly subscriptions to get the answer. This makes it likely that Bitcoin Core is unusable for most AT&T customers and other ISPs, hence the massive node decline. I'm sure this disrupts alot of other people besides Bitcoiners too, hence the monthly subscriptions geared towards people who can't figure out their connection situation. > > AT&T literally blocked access to static IP if you don't buy one, so it wasn't a normal network setup. Unfortunately the same security used to stop hackers and viruses stops Bitcoin too, so this is probably the settings for almost every router in the country. Nodes are in fact declining worldwide, down 15% in the past year alone. Community needs to speak up and also educate before this gets completely out of control. https://getaddr.bitnodes.io/dashboard/?days=365 6,000 nodes is pathetic as it is and it's constantly declining. > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock•name> > To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol•com> > Sent: Wed, Sep 2, 2015 4:32 am > Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. > > > Respectfully, what the heck are you talking about? Practically every home LAN > runs on a private subnet. My own desktop computer has the IP address > 192.168.1.34, which is in a private subnet. This doesn't prevent my Bitcoin Core > node from making outbound connections to other nodes. Moreover, almost all home > Internet connections in the world run on dynamically assigned IP addresses. > Again, this does not cause any problems for connecting outbound to other Bitcoin > nodes. It's true that your node can't accept incoming connections unless you > forward port 8333 on your router to your computer, but you don't need to be able > to accept incoming connections to participate in the Bitcoin network. > > > On > Wednesday, 2 September 2015, at 3:20 am, Zach G via bitcoin-dev wrote: > > > > I > was about to buy a VPS for Bitcoin, but I really do need Bitcoin Core for > business reasons so I didn't give up. I once again thoroughly went through my > computer and made sure there was nothing blocking 8333, a couple useful tools > are CurrPorts and TCPView. I went through the router to make sure there was no > block of port 8333. I researched everything thoroughly and was sure these were > the right settings, but Bitcoin was still getting throttled every second and > stuck in sys_sent, and python kept saying the target was rejecting the > connection. > > > > I finally stumbled upon subnet settings, and saw that I had a > private subnet, one of the few IPs that are private on earth ( > https://www.arin.net/knowledge/address_filters.html ). Uverse put all their > customers on a private subnet by default. This made my computer not only hidden > but unroutable for any computer on the Bitcoin network. That alone is enough to > totally stop Bitcoin connections on any port, but they made it even crazier by > generating a dynamic IP that changes all the time, so public IP was meaningless > for my computer. > > > > I switched over to a public subnet, and right there was > a checkbox to allow incoming connections. My static IP showed for a minute then > became dynamic/hidden again without me even touching anything. The final > roadblock was AT&T charges $15-30/month for a public static IP, which is > obviously insane and actually one could argue that violates their own terms of > service. So the router was still ignoring my public IP settings simply because I > wasn't paying for a public IP, and intentionally changing the settings back. I > asked for a free public IP and there was no response for awhile. > > > > I found > this article on cryptocoinnews while working out: > https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/isps-intentionally-blocking-bitcoin/ It's based > on the first email I sent, and was displayed prominently on their front page. I > posted a tweet publicly about it which referenced AT&T ( > https://twitter.com/turtlehurricane/status/638930065980551168 ) and believe it > or not I had a static public IP and port 8333 was open about 1 minute later. I > don't know if it was a coincidence cause I already messaged them to please do > that an hour before, or if that article and tweet spurred them to action. The > timing was so ridiculous I think it's the latter. Without twitter I probably > wouldn't have succeeded, the technicians on twitter actually answered all my > questions 24/7 unlike phone technicians which were clueless and trying to sell > me a subscription for connection services help. And shout out to cryptocoinnews > for making this public. > > > > So to clarify, it appears AT&T has not blocked > port 8333 itself, but rather effectively blocked all ports via the private > subnet, which makes the computer hidden and unroutable for incoming peers. > Although this severely limits functionality and cripples the ability to run a > full node and many other programs it is understandable, since it just about 100% > prevents hackers from getting in, since they can't even see your computer. What > isn't understandable is that AT&T technicians did not inform me about this until > I changed the settings myself, despite the fact it is a very obvious cause of > ports being blocked. It's probably just ignorance since AT&T has so many complex > network settings it's hard to keep track of, although I have a suspicion that > someone in their command chain is withholding information in an attempt to make > them buy a $15/month connection service, and once they buy that another > $15-30/month is needed to get the static IP. > > > > As far as I know there is no > easy to find info on the internet about private subnets crippling the ability to > use Bitcoin. I believe this needs to be explicitly said in instructions for > running a full node, maybe it wasn't a problem in 2009 but now it is a major > issue. On default settings Bitcoin is 100% blocked, and most people do not have > the time or motivation to fix this. I talked to at least 10 AT&T technicians and > worked on it 2-3 days straight, did not receive the right answer until I found > it myself, although they certainly gave me some useful clues about how the > network works. > > > > I am very happy that AT&T fixed it, since other ISPs like > Comcast appeared even worse. I openly talked with them about Bitcoin and they > showed no prejudice, might've actually made them more willing to help me cause > otherwise they would think I'm a hacker. > > > > tl;dr The good news is anyone > with AT&T can be a full node by getting a public static IP, the bad news is > almost no one will figure this out unless we as a community make it well known. > I guarantee node numbers will improve if this information is spread to everyone. > Database size and computing expenditures is simply not the reason people don't > run full nodes, it's because their ISP has made it just about impossible without > shelling out nearly 100% more money per month. If you don't pay the fee AT&T > would never tell you about the private subnet, at least based on my > experience. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: odinn > <odinn.cyberguerrilla@riseup•net> > > To: hurricanewarn1 > <hurricanewarn1@aol•com>; bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> > > > Sent: Tue, Sep 1, 2015 3:16 am > > Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has > effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in > the cable box > > > > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > Hash: SHA512 > > > > > Another note on this subject > > to add to the stuff people have already > > > mentioned... > > > > If you have the AT&T > > landline but don't use AT&T's > standard internet / > > tv (what they call Uverse) > > offering - that is, if you > prefer to use > > some local internet provider - you are > > probably better off > (in terms > > of avoiding not only this sort of > > blockage/censorship but as > well, > > potentially getting a better privacy policy > > that isn't going to > be > > like AT&T's long-term data retention). You can check > > directly with > > > the various local small ISPs to see what their policies > > are > > specifically > on ports and whatnot. > > > > Ideally your ISP should let > > you: > > > > port > forward to SOMEPORTNUMBER for tcp and udp > > > > (above may or may not > > be > helpful for some if you are using > > decentralized markets) > > > > have port > 8333 > > open > > > > (above is for bitcoin of course) > > > > Supposing you have > FTTN because you > > are paying a local ISP for > > internet service, and that > local ISP has contracted > > with AT&T to be > > able to provide service in an > area where old-style DSL has been > > phased > > out, thus your local ISP is > essentially providing you AT&T FTTN. > > (FTTN > > is Fiber to the Node, FTTN-BP > is FTTN Bonded Pair). Even if a > > local ISP has > > its own privacy policy > posted which is different from > > AT&T, everything is > > subject to AT&T data > retention because the FTTN. > > So get yourself a VPN (or set > > up your own) for > your connection. Tor > > will run through the VPN. > > > > General > > observations > - TWC stores your IP and other stuffs for 6 > > months or longer. > > Same for > Comcast. Verizon retains your stuffs for > > 18 month minimum, probably > > > longer though. Qwest/Century, 1 year. > > Cox, 6 months. AT&T retains for > longer > > than a year. This is just > > what they are telling you, the reality > is it's > > probably longer due to > > stuff like > > this: > > > https://www.lawfareblog.com/odni-and-doj-release-last-section-215-collec > > > tion-order > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Zach > > G via bitcoin-dev: > > > > I have been struggling to get port 8333 open all year, I > > gave up > > > and > was using blockchain for months despite a strong desire to > > stay > > > on > Bitcoin Core, but now the issue has reached critical mass since > > > > > I'm > using the python Bitcoin server module. I have literally spent > > > my entire > > > day trying to open 8333, I thoroughly made sure it was > > > open on the router > and > > computer and it's still closed. Strangely > > > enough I got it open for > 30 seconds > > once today but something closed > > > it immediately. > > > > > > > After hours of phone > > calls and messaging AT&T finally told me the > > > truth > of what was going on, and > > only because I noticed it myself > > > and demanded > an answer. The internet is > > being routed through a > > > DVR/cable box, and > they confirmed the DVR also has a > > firewall. To > > > make this even more > absurd they refused to turn the firewall > > off > > > because it is their > equipment. So effectively they can firewall any > > > > > port they want even if > the customer asks them not to, in the > > > unlikely event > > the customer > figures it out. > > > > > > Perhaps this is the driving force behind the > > > inexplicable and > > > massive decline in Bitcoin nodes. Bitcoin is being > censored > > by the > > > ISPs themselves, and they won't even tell you that. I > had to get in > > > > > touch with headquarters and threaten to rip it out of the > wall to > > > get a > > proper answer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > bitcoin-dev mailing > > > list > bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org > > > > > > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev > > > > > > > - > -- > > > > http://abis.io ~ > > "a protocol concept to enable decentralization > > > and > > expansion of a giving economy, and a new social > > good" > > > https://keybase.io/odinn > > -----BEGIN PGP > > SIGNATURE----- > > > > > iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJV5VDeAAoJEGxwq/inSG8CvkIH/jy4Vo+My3xeBdvFQmxkJWyQ > > > U5mv2zWEvBYw71Xy1EDzQY1AhEBmatUU1eu2AbOqXdUR4511FxCNzFmTxy6roEiz > > > EehBkvXNbBCbEzLRisjxuQw34OKM+xfieCqE1mzJok2uSdLMMQLcbWL1/k3/OmS5 > > > 9O9z/wMXqU1Jc19MTK+vF1Lz5ilnRn3hEbTaCN3ivYnYFa0DpBH9r0Y07UcoJ6Wr > > > ui/x0sSSuupAGzOkZ75HQ8yeQXckeAu6TB3/jE8QEqNUmAJkmR8eK4ofXZWFrIjy > > > mOKeQL4c+jRQnTR8pt+y89g2QIpzFoHaV5T+WvQuC1t8xNOrxLgYFXWgl0dhoYE= > > =UCLC > > > -----END > > PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > > > > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 18653 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. 2015-09-02 13:44 ` hurricanewarn1 @ 2015-09-02 19:21 ` Matt Whitlock 2015-09-02 20:31 ` hurricanewarn1 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Matt Whitlock @ 2015-09-02 19:21 UTC (permalink / raw) To: hurricanewarn1; +Cc: bitcoin-dev I've been trying to keep our discussion off-list because it is off-topic, but you keep adding the list back on in your replies. http://steamforge.net/wiki/images/2/29/Settings-Firewall-Advanced.png Settings > Firewall > Advanced Configuration > Outbound Protocol Control > All Other Protocols That's all you had to do. On Wednesday, 2 September 2015, at 9:44 am, Zach G via bitcoin-dev wrote: > 42 in the whole world, and I'm one of them. Clearly that is a problem, do you even know about AT&T or are you in another country? Cause that statement is utterly ridiculous given the fact there are hundreds of millions of people using AT&T. I was simply sharing my knowledge on this issue since it poses a threat to the health of the bitcoin network, no need for personal attacks. > > None of my accusations were false, there is a firewall in the DVR that is uncontrolled and all ports are blocked via private subnets and no fixed public IP allowed unless you pay. I confirmed every one of these details with AT&T technicians or I wouldn't be saying them. > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock•name> > To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol•com> > Sent: Wed, Sep 2, 2015 5:34 am > Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. > > > According to BitNodes, 42 Bitcoin nodes are running on AT&T's > network: > > https://getaddr.bitnodes.io/nodes/?q=AT%26T > > So I'm thinking > there's nothing wrong with AT&T's default network configuration. > > Frankly, the > things you've been writing strongly suggest that you aren't very knowledgeable > about computer networking. Instead of jumping right into making wild accusations > about AT&T, you probably should find someone knowledgeable to verify your > claims. > > > On Wednesday, 2 September 2015, at 5:20 am, Zach G via bitcoin-dev > wrote: > > First off I couldn't synch the wallet, it said no block source > available and there was zero connections. Bitcoin was literally getting thottled > every second. It would not even allow the connection to get block source. EVERY > port was blocked, making exceptions in the router firewall did nothing. I was > forced to use Blockchain.info which is a major security risk. > > > > Secondly, I > am developing a program using Bitcoin Python modules, so I login to my computer > like it's a server and it was flat out rejecting the connection. I could not run > any code until this got fixed, and of course needed the block source to even do > anything. > > > > If Bitcoin Core worked but 8333 was blocked I would not be > emailing the list. Bitcoin Core was crippled and unusable due to the AT&T > settings, and they tried hard to get me to buy monthly subscriptions to get the > answer. This makes it likely that Bitcoin Core is unusable for most AT&T > customers and other ISPs, hence the massive node decline. I'm sure this disrupts > alot of other people besides Bitcoiners too, hence the monthly subscriptions > geared towards people who can't figure out their connection situation. > > > > > AT&T literally blocked access to static IP if you don't buy one, so it wasn't a > normal network setup. Unfortunately the same security used to stop hackers and > viruses stops Bitcoin too, so this is probably the settings for almost every > router in the country. Nodes are in fact declining worldwide, down 15% in the > past year alone. Community needs to speak up and also educate before this gets > completely out of control. https://getaddr.bitnodes.io/dashboard/?days=365 6,000 > nodes is pathetic as it is and it's constantly declining. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. 2015-09-02 19:21 ` Matt Whitlock @ 2015-09-02 20:31 ` hurricanewarn1 0 siblings, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: hurricanewarn1 @ 2015-09-02 20:31 UTC (permalink / raw) To: bitcoin-dev [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4718 bytes --] When you assume you make an ass out of you and me. That page doesn't even exist in my router, I don't have 2wire. The router I have is the one everyone is getting from uverse. Literally everything you said is incorrect. It is completely on topic as it pertains to Bitcoin Core functionality, 42 connections is nothing, and that's not how you fix it. If you're gonna call me out for being wrong at least be correct! I spent a lot of time fixing this and the info is useful cause this problem happens to a lot of people, so why obfuscate it with this nonsense. AT&T u-verse as it is now is near impossible for bitcoin nodes, 42 in the world is absolutely pathetic considering they are among the top 2 ISPs in the USA. Thanks for proving my point. -----Original Message----- From: Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock•name> To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol•com> Cc: bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> Sent: Wed, Sep 2, 2015 3:21 pm Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. I've been trying to keep our discussion off-list because it is off-topic, but you keep adding the list back on in your replies. http://steamforge.net/wiki/images/2/29/Settings-Firewall-Advanced.png Settings > Firewall > Advanced Configuration > Outbound Protocol Control > All Other Protocols That's all you had to do. On Wednesday, 2 September 2015, at 9:44 am, Zach G via bitcoin-dev wrote: > 42 in the whole world, and I'm one of them. Clearly that is a problem, do you even know about AT&T or are you in another country? Cause that statement is utterly ridiculous given the fact there are hundreds of millions of people using AT&T. I was simply sharing my knowledge on this issue since it poses a threat to the health of the bitcoin network, no need for personal attacks. > > None of my accusations were false, there is a firewall in the DVR that is uncontrolled and all ports are blocked via private subnets and no fixed public IP allowed unless you pay. I confirmed every one of these details with AT&T technicians or I wouldn't be saying them. > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Matt Whitlock <bip@mattwhitlock•name> > To: hurricanewarn1 <hurricanewarn1@aol•com> > Sent: Wed, Sep 2, 2015 5:34 am > Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets. > > > According to BitNodes, 42 Bitcoin nodes are running on AT&T's > network: > > https://getaddr.bitnodes.io/nodes/?q=AT%26T > > So I'm thinking > there's nothing wrong with AT&T's default network configuration. > > Frankly, the > things you've been writing strongly suggest that you aren't very knowledgeable > about computer networking. Instead of jumping right into making wild accusations > about AT&T, you probably should find someone knowledgeable to verify your > claims. > > > On Wednesday, 2 September 2015, at 5:20 am, Zach G via bitcoin-dev > wrote: > > First off I couldn't synch the wallet, it said no block source > available and there was zero connections. Bitcoin was literally getting thottled > every second. It would not even allow the connection to get block source. EVERY > port was blocked, making exceptions in the router firewall did nothing. I was > forced to use Blockchain.info which is a major security risk. > > > > Secondly, I > am developing a program using Bitcoin Python modules, so I login to my computer > like it's a server and it was flat out rejecting the connection. I could not run > any code until this got fixed, and of course needed the block source to even do > anything. > > > > If Bitcoin Core worked but 8333 was blocked I would not be > emailing the list. Bitcoin Core was crippled and unusable due to the AT&T > settings, and they tried hard to get me to buy monthly subscriptions to get the > answer. This makes it likely that Bitcoin Core is unusable for most AT&T > customers and other ISPs, hence the massive node decline. I'm sure this disrupts > alot of other people besides Bitcoiners too, hence the monthly subscriptions > geared towards people who can't figure out their connection situation. > > > > > AT&T literally blocked access to static IP if you don't buy one, so it wasn't a > normal network setup. Unfortunately the same security used to stop hackers and > viruses stops Bitcoin too, so this is probably the settings for almost every > router in the country. Nodes are in fact declining worldwide, down 15% in the > past year alone. Community needs to speak up and also educate before this gets > completely out of control. https://getaddr.bitnodes.io/dashboard/?days=365 6,000 > nodes is pathetic as it is and it's constantly declining. [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 5898 bytes --] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
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2015-09-01 0:26 [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes by closing port 8333 via a hidden firewall in the cable box hurricanewarn1
2015-09-01 1:04 ` Milly Bitcoin
2015-09-01 1:16 ` James Hilliard
2015-09-01 7:16 ` odinn
2015-09-01 14:44 ` Dan Bryant
2015-09-02 7:20 ` [bitcoin-dev] AT&T has effectively banned Bitcoin nodes via utilizing private subnets hurricanewarn1
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2015-09-02 9:20 ` hurricanewarn1
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2015-09-02 13:44 ` hurricanewarn1
2015-09-02 19:21 ` Matt Whitlock
2015-09-02 20:31 ` hurricanewarn1
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