From: Thomas Voegtlin <thomasv1@gmx•de>
To: bitcoin-development@lists•sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] BIP0039: Final call
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2014 17:47:21 +0100 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <52E29919.7030404@gmx.de> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20140124090532.GB15398@savin>
Le 24/01/2014 10:05, Peter Todd a écrit :
> On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 01:00:43AM +0100, Thomas Voegtlin wrote:
>> Hi slush,
>>
>> Thank you for your new proposal; it seems to be a compromise.
>>
>> @Christophe Biocca:
>> If the wordlist becomes part of the standard, then we will run into
>> problems of collisions once users ask for wordlists in every language.
>>
>> IMO the right approach is to implement checksums that do not depend
>> on the wordlist (eg the 'brute force' method, Hash(mnemonic||1) mod
>> 2^k == 0 )
>> this would also allow us to implement sipa's variable stretching proposal.
>>
>> I understand this is not possible because of the computational
>> requirements of devices such as trezor.
> Is it? Surely the trezor can bruteforce, say, 8 bits == 0. How many
> SHA256/sec can the trezor hardware do? Generating your seed is a
> one-time thing after all - that taking 10-30s doesn't seem like a big
> deal to me.
>
> Even a 1/256th "checksum" will really cut down on the number of mistakes
> made and money lost.
slush, correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that's the only reason:
They want to generate a seed by combining entropy from the trezor device
and from the user's computer;
In addition, they want the computer to be able to check that the seed
actually was derived from the entropy it provided, using only a master
public key (the computer does not have access to the seed)
This is why they designed bip39 that way.
I think the new bip39 proposal could be used in Electrum as an option
for trezor, but I am reluctant to make it default, because it imposes
its own dictionary.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2014-01-24 16:47 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 17+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2014-01-20 17:42 slush
2014-01-20 19:55 ` Mike Hearn
2014-01-20 20:02 ` Luke-Jr
2014-01-20 21:47 ` slush
2014-01-20 22:01 ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-01-20 22:05 ` Brooks Boyd
2014-01-20 22:35 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-20 23:06 ` Christophe Biocca
2014-01-20 23:18 ` slush
2014-01-21 0:00 ` Thomas Voegtlin
2014-01-24 9:05 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-24 16:47 ` Thomas Voegtlin [this message]
2014-01-20 23:14 ` Adam Back
2014-01-20 23:18 ` Mark Friedenbach
[not found] <mailman.423274.1390277261.21953.bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
2014-01-21 5:43 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-01-21 10:01 ` Gary Rowe
2014-01-21 10:11 ` Mike Hearn
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