* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 0:30 [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC Luke Dashjr
@ 2019-04-01 1:04 ` Ricardo Filipe
2019-04-01 2:57 ` Thomas France
2019-04-01 3:04 ` Dave Scotese
2019-04-01 1:11 ` Peter Todd
` (2 subsequent siblings)
3 siblings, 2 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Ricardo Filipe @ 2019-04-01 1:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
one year seems too long. i think with the BIP-148 experience you have
we could easily get there in 6 months at most.
Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>
escreveu no dia segunda, 1/04/2019 à(s) 01:33:
>
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
> low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
> that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
> signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
> minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
>
> The BIPs are here, as well as included at the bottom of this email for
> convenience:
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-usdprice.mediawiki
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-softfork-50k-price.mediawiki
>
> A reference implementation is here:
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:softfork_50k
>
> Please review ASAP so we can get these deployed in Bitcoin Core v0.18.
>
> Luke
>
>
> <pre>
> BIP: ?
> Layer: Applications
> Title: Signed USD Price Indicator
> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> Status: Draft
> Type: Standards Track
> Created: 2019-04-01
> License: BSD-2-Clause
> </pre>
>
> ==Abstract==
>
> This BIP proposes a method to explicitly specify and sign the USD/BTC price
> for transactions.
>
> ==Copyright==
>
> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>
> ==Motivation==
>
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably low
> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the price
> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that, and
> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> This problem can be fixed by setting a global minimum price for bitcoins.
> Unfortunately, today, the consensus protocol is completely oblivious to the
> price bitcoins are traded at. Therefore, we must first add a field to Bitcoin
> transactions to indicate their price.
>
> ==Specification==
>
> ===New field and legal implication===
>
> A new field is added to Bitcoin transactions. This field, if present, must
> represent the honest and true USD/BTC rate used for the transaction. By
> signing the transaction, the sender legally affirms this is the valuation of
> bitcoins used for the transaction.
>
> For the avoidance of doubt: when the transaction is valued in a currency other
> than USD, any reasonable exchange rate may be used to come up with the USD
> valuation.
>
> ===Serialisation===
>
> When serialising the transaction for any purpose, including signing, weight
> calculation, and so on, the output count must be incremented by one. Prior to
> the first real output, the following bytes must be inserted:
>
> * Constant: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> * Constant: 6a 04 55 53 44 24
> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> * The USD/BTC rate used for the transaction, in standard signed integer
> serialisation, with all leading zeros removed (except as necessary to
> preserve the sign bit).
>
> ==Backwards compatibility==
>
> ===Consensus===
>
> The new price field is serialised as a dummy output, with a value of zero, and
> a scriptPubKey that begins with OP_RETURN (6a). Existing nodes will ignore
> this dummy output, and the leading OP_RETURN in the scriptPubKey ensures it
> is never considered spendable.
>
> Therefore, current nodes will ignore the new field entirely, and accept
> transactions using it.
>
> ===Wallets===
>
> Existing wallets do not typically generate price indicators as specified.
> Under this BIP, this absence of the field is perfectly acceptable.
>
> ==Reference implementation==
>
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:usd_price_tx_field
>
> <pre>
> BIP: ?
> Layer: Consensus (soft fork)
> Title: $50k USD/BTC Minimum Price
> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> Status: Draft
> Type: Standards Track
> Created: 2019-04-01
> License: BSD-2-Clause
> Requires: usdprice
> </pre>
>
> ==Abstract==
>
> This BIP defines a minimum price of $50k USD/BTC for Bitcoin transactions.
>
> ==Copyright==
>
> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>
> ==Motivation==
>
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably low
> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the price
> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that, and
> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> bip-usdprice defines a new field to indicate the price of transactions. Using
> this, we can softfork to require a minimum transaction price.
>
> ==Specification==
>
> Beginning with block height 622370 (expected approximately 2020 April 1), a
> block is reject as invalid unless all transactions it contains both declare a
> USD/BTC price (as defined in bip-usdprice) and specify a price that is at a
> minimum $50k USD/BTC.
>
> ==Backwards compatibility==
>
> As a soft fork, older nodes will continue to accept the blockchain without
> modification. Non-upgraded nodes, however, will not validate the minimum
> price requirement, and may accept invalid blocks if miners choose to make
> them. Since transactions not declaring a price are at this time still
> common-place, the softfork activation has been set a full year into the
> future to ensure time to upgrade both nodes and wallet software.
>
> ==Reference implementation==
>
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bitcoin/compare/usd_price_tx_field...softfork_50k
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 1:04 ` Ricardo Filipe
@ 2019-04-01 2:57 ` Thomas France
2019-04-01 3:04 ` Dave Scotese
1 sibling, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Thomas France @ 2019-04-01 2:57 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Ricardo Filipe, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 7240 bytes --]
Once again, Core shows how conservative they are. I am in favor of 2X with
a 100kUSD minimum price, all Bitcoin businesses are with me !
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 7:48 PM Ricardo Filipe via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> one year seems too long. i think with the BIP-148 experience you have
> we could easily get there in 6 months at most.
>
> Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>
> escreveu no dia segunda, 1/04/2019 à(s) 01:33:
> >
> > Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
> unreasonably
> > low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven
> the
> > price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
> > that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
> >
> > In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
> > signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
> > minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
> >
> > The BIPs are here, as well as included at the bottom of this email for
> > convenience:
> >
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-usdprice.mediawiki
> >
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-softfork-50k-price.mediawiki
> >
> > A reference implementation is here:
> >
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:softfork_50k
> >
> > Please review ASAP so we can get these deployed in Bitcoin Core v0.18.
> >
> > Luke
> >
> >
> > <pre>
> > BIP: ?
> > Layer: Applications
> > Title: Signed USD Price Indicator
> > Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> > Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> > Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> > Status: Draft
> > Type: Standards Track
> > Created: 2019-04-01
> > License: BSD-2-Clause
> > </pre>
> >
> > ==Abstract==
> >
> > This BIP proposes a method to explicitly specify and sign the USD/BTC
> price
> > for transactions.
> >
> > ==Copyright==
> >
> > This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
> >
> > ==Motivation==
> >
> > Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
> unreasonably low
> > prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price
> > down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that,
> and
> > there is widespread support for higher prices.
> >
> > This problem can be fixed by setting a global minimum price for bitcoins.
> > Unfortunately, today, the consensus protocol is completely oblivious to
> the
> > price bitcoins are traded at. Therefore, we must first add a field to
> Bitcoin
> > transactions to indicate their price.
> >
> > ==Specification==
> >
> > ===New field and legal implication===
> >
> > A new field is added to Bitcoin transactions. This field, if present,
> must
> > represent the honest and true USD/BTC rate used for the transaction. By
> > signing the transaction, the sender legally affirms this is the
> valuation of
> > bitcoins used for the transaction.
> >
> > For the avoidance of doubt: when the transaction is valued in a currency
> other
> > than USD, any reasonable exchange rate may be used to come up with the
> USD
> > valuation.
> >
> > ===Serialisation===
> >
> > When serialising the transaction for any purpose, including signing,
> weight
> > calculation, and so on, the output count must be incremented by one.
> Prior to
> > the first real output, the following bytes must be inserted:
> >
> > * Constant: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
> > * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> > * Constant: 6a 04 55 53 44 24
> > * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> > * The USD/BTC rate used for the transaction, in standard signed integer
> > serialisation, with all leading zeros removed (except as necessary to
> > preserve the sign bit).
> >
> > ==Backwards compatibility==
> >
> > ===Consensus===
> >
> > The new price field is serialised as a dummy output, with a value of
> zero, and
> > a scriptPubKey that begins with OP_RETURN (6a). Existing nodes will
> ignore
> > this dummy output, and the leading OP_RETURN in the scriptPubKey ensures
> it
> > is never considered spendable.
> >
> > Therefore, current nodes will ignore the new field entirely, and accept
> > transactions using it.
> >
> > ===Wallets===
> >
> > Existing wallets do not typically generate price indicators as specified.
> > Under this BIP, this absence of the field is perfectly acceptable.
> >
> > ==Reference implementation==
> >
> >
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:usd_price_tx_field
> >
> > <pre>
> > BIP: ?
> > Layer: Consensus (soft fork)
> > Title: $50k USD/BTC Minimum Price
> > Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> > Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> > Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> > Status: Draft
> > Type: Standards Track
> > Created: 2019-04-01
> > License: BSD-2-Clause
> > Requires: usdprice
> > </pre>
> >
> > ==Abstract==
> >
> > This BIP defines a minimum price of $50k USD/BTC for Bitcoin
> transactions.
> >
> > ==Copyright==
> >
> > This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
> >
> > ==Motivation==
> >
> > Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
> unreasonably low
> > prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price
> > down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that,
> and
> > there is widespread support for higher prices.
> >
> > bip-usdprice defines a new field to indicate the price of transactions.
> Using
> > this, we can softfork to require a minimum transaction price.
> >
> > ==Specification==
> >
> > Beginning with block height 622370 (expected approximately 2020 April
> 1), a
> > block is reject as invalid unless all transactions it contains both
> declare a
> > USD/BTC price (as defined in bip-usdprice) and specify a price that is
> at a
> > minimum $50k USD/BTC.
> >
> > ==Backwards compatibility==
> >
> > As a soft fork, older nodes will continue to accept the blockchain
> without
> > modification. Non-upgraded nodes, however, will not validate the minimum
> > price requirement, and may accept invalid blocks if miners choose to make
> > them. Since transactions not declaring a price are at this time still
> > common-place, the softfork activation has been set a full year into the
> > future to ensure time to upgrade both nodes and wallet software.
> >
> > ==Reference implementation==
> >
> >
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bitcoin/compare/usd_price_tx_field...softfork_50k
> > _______________________________________________
> > bitcoin-dev mailing list
> > bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 1:04 ` Ricardo Filipe
2019-04-01 2:57 ` Thomas France
@ 2019-04-01 3:04 ` Dave Scotese
1 sibling, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Dave Scotese @ 2019-04-01 3:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Ricardo Filipe, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 7683 bytes --]
I think EXACTLY ONE YEAR is the perfect time. Well, a year and a day for
me because I'm on the wrong side of the date line, apparently.
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 6:04 PM Ricardo Filipe via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> one year seems too long. i think with the BIP-148 experience you have
> we could easily get there in 6 months at most.
>
> Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>
> escreveu no dia segunda, 1/04/2019 à(s) 01:33:
> >
> > Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
> unreasonably
> > low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven
> the
> > price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
> > that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
> >
> > In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
> > signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
> > minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
> >
> > The BIPs are here, as well as included at the bottom of this email for
> > convenience:
> >
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-usdprice.mediawiki
> >
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-softfork-50k-price.mediawiki
> >
> > A reference implementation is here:
> >
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:softfork_50k
> >
> > Please review ASAP so we can get these deployed in Bitcoin Core v0.18.
> >
> > Luke
> >
> >
> > <pre>
> > BIP: ?
> > Layer: Applications
> > Title: Signed USD Price Indicator
> > Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> > Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> > Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> > Status: Draft
> > Type: Standards Track
> > Created: 2019-04-01
> > License: BSD-2-Clause
> > </pre>
> >
> > ==Abstract==
> >
> > This BIP proposes a method to explicitly specify and sign the USD/BTC
> price
> > for transactions.
> >
> > ==Copyright==
> >
> > This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
> >
> > ==Motivation==
> >
> > Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
> unreasonably low
> > prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price
> > down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that,
> and
> > there is widespread support for higher prices.
> >
> > This problem can be fixed by setting a global minimum price for bitcoins.
> > Unfortunately, today, the consensus protocol is completely oblivious to
> the
> > price bitcoins are traded at. Therefore, we must first add a field to
> Bitcoin
> > transactions to indicate their price.
> >
> > ==Specification==
> >
> > ===New field and legal implication===
> >
> > A new field is added to Bitcoin transactions. This field, if present,
> must
> > represent the honest and true USD/BTC rate used for the transaction. By
> > signing the transaction, the sender legally affirms this is the
> valuation of
> > bitcoins used for the transaction.
> >
> > For the avoidance of doubt: when the transaction is valued in a currency
> other
> > than USD, any reasonable exchange rate may be used to come up with the
> USD
> > valuation.
> >
> > ===Serialisation===
> >
> > When serialising the transaction for any purpose, including signing,
> weight
> > calculation, and so on, the output count must be incremented by one.
> Prior to
> > the first real output, the following bytes must be inserted:
> >
> > * Constant: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
> > * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> > * Constant: 6a 04 55 53 44 24
> > * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> > * The USD/BTC rate used for the transaction, in standard signed integer
> > serialisation, with all leading zeros removed (except as necessary to
> > preserve the sign bit).
> >
> > ==Backwards compatibility==
> >
> > ===Consensus===
> >
> > The new price field is serialised as a dummy output, with a value of
> zero, and
> > a scriptPubKey that begins with OP_RETURN (6a). Existing nodes will
> ignore
> > this dummy output, and the leading OP_RETURN in the scriptPubKey ensures
> it
> > is never considered spendable.
> >
> > Therefore, current nodes will ignore the new field entirely, and accept
> > transactions using it.
> >
> > ===Wallets===
> >
> > Existing wallets do not typically generate price indicators as specified.
> > Under this BIP, this absence of the field is perfectly acceptable.
> >
> > ==Reference implementation==
> >
> >
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:usd_price_tx_field
> >
> > <pre>
> > BIP: ?
> > Layer: Consensus (soft fork)
> > Title: $50k USD/BTC Minimum Price
> > Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> > Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> > Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> > Status: Draft
> > Type: Standards Track
> > Created: 2019-04-01
> > License: BSD-2-Clause
> > Requires: usdprice
> > </pre>
> >
> > ==Abstract==
> >
> > This BIP defines a minimum price of $50k USD/BTC for Bitcoin
> transactions.
> >
> > ==Copyright==
> >
> > This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
> >
> > ==Motivation==
> >
> > Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
> unreasonably low
> > prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price
> > down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that,
> and
> > there is widespread support for higher prices.
> >
> > bip-usdprice defines a new field to indicate the price of transactions.
> Using
> > this, we can softfork to require a minimum transaction price.
> >
> > ==Specification==
> >
> > Beginning with block height 622370 (expected approximately 2020 April
> 1), a
> > block is reject as invalid unless all transactions it contains both
> declare a
> > USD/BTC price (as defined in bip-usdprice) and specify a price that is
> at a
> > minimum $50k USD/BTC.
> >
> > ==Backwards compatibility==
> >
> > As a soft fork, older nodes will continue to accept the blockchain
> without
> > modification. Non-upgraded nodes, however, will not validate the minimum
> > price requirement, and may accept invalid blocks if miners choose to make
> > them. Since transactions not declaring a price are at this time still
> > common-place, the softfork activation has been set a full year into the
> > future to ensure time to upgrade both nodes and wallet software.
> >
> > ==Reference implementation==
> >
> >
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bitcoin/compare/usd_price_tx_field...softfork_50k
> > _______________________________________________
> > bitcoin-dev mailing list
> > bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> > https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
--
I like to provide some work at no charge to prove my value. Do you need a
techie?
I own Litmocracy <http://www.litmocracy.com> and Meme Racing
<http://www.memeracing.net> (in alpha).
I'm the webmaster for The Voluntaryist <http://www.voluntaryist.com> which
now accepts Bitcoin.
I also code for The Dollar Vigilante <http://dollarvigilante.com/>.
"He ought to find it more profitable to play by the rules" - Satoshi
Nakamoto
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 0:30 [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC Luke Dashjr
2019-04-01 1:04 ` Ricardo Filipe
@ 2019-04-01 1:11 ` Peter Todd
2019-04-01 2:55 ` Omar Shibli
` (2 more replies)
2019-04-01 2:54 ` Omar Shibli
2019-04-01 11:22 ` Melvin Carvalho
3 siblings, 3 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Peter Todd @ 2019-04-01 1:11 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Luke Dashjr, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
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On Mon, Apr 01, 2019 at 12:30:34AM +0000, Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev wrote:
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
> low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
> that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
> signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
> minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
I believe I've found a serious vulnerability in your proposal: there's no limit
on the maximum supply of USD.
--
https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 1:11 ` Peter Todd
@ 2019-04-01 2:55 ` Omar Shibli
2019-04-01 3:02 ` ZmnSCPxj
2019-04-01 3:07 ` Satoshin
2 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Omar Shibli @ 2019-04-01 2:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Peter Todd, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1151 bytes --]
Shit, so we are vulnerable today? is this zero day vulnerability? so we
could be f***** big?
On Mon, Apr 1, 2019 at 5:47 AM Peter Todd via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> On Mon, Apr 01, 2019 at 12:30:34AM +0000, Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev
> wrote:
> > Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
> unreasonably
> > low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven
> the
> > price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
> > that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
> >
> > In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
> > signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
> > minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
>
> I believe I've found a serious vulnerability in your proposal: there's no
> limit
> on the maximum supply of USD.
>
> --
> https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 1:11 ` Peter Todd
2019-04-01 2:55 ` Omar Shibli
@ 2019-04-01 3:02 ` ZmnSCPxj
2019-04-01 3:07 ` Satoshin
2 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: ZmnSCPxj @ 2019-04-01 3:02 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Peter Todd, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
Hard NAK.
A minimum 50000 USD : 1 BTC exchange rate implies that the value of 1 USD = 0.00002 BTC at maximum.
However, such a USD value in BTC value maximum makes no sense since the true value of 1 USD = 0.00000000 BTC.
(on Lightning, 1 USD = 0.00000000000 BTC)
In particular, the encoding proposed in the BIP does not support a representation of infinity USD per BTC, such that it is impossible to express the true value of USD under this BIP.
> * The USD/BTC rate used for the transaction, in standard signed integer serialisation, with all leading zeros removed (except as necessary to preserve the sign bit).
Regards,
ZmnSCPxj
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 1:11 ` Peter Todd
2019-04-01 2:55 ` Omar Shibli
2019-04-01 3:02 ` ZmnSCPxj
@ 2019-04-01 3:07 ` Satoshin
2019-04-01 8:55 ` LORD HIS EXCELLENCY JAMES HRMH
2 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Satoshin @ 2019-04-01 3:07 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Peter Todd, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
Hi Everyone,
First portion of your First BIP is excellent- with this field the protocol can actually attain HFT- by pinning of value at time of trade for later unblock scaling as a mark to market tool which is used in HFT.
The Second BIP of a minimum price would never allow Bitcoin to pass the SEC test of a viable asset. - I hope that portion was actually a Joke since it makes no sense economically.
If one has ever seen a stock drop 90% in one day then you would understand the volatile nature of future valuation.
Prices have to be able to go higher and lower based on market demand and not tethering to perceived norms. If the US dollar was crashed and it went down to Venezuelan currency levels [hypothetically then where would your 50k limit lead the currency} Never say never-
Best Regards
XX
> On Mar 31, 2019, at 9:11 PM, Peter Todd via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
> On Mon, Apr 01, 2019 at 12:30:34AM +0000, Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev wrote:
>> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
>> low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
>> price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
>> that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
>>
>> In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
>> signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
>> minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
>
> I believe I've found a serious vulnerability in your proposal: there's no limit
> on the maximum supply of USD.
>
> --
> https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 3:07 ` Satoshin
@ 2019-04-01 8:55 ` LORD HIS EXCELLENCY JAMES HRMH
0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: LORD HIS EXCELLENCY JAMES HRMH @ 2019-04-01 8:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Peter Todd, Satoshin, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion,
Bitcoin Protocol Discussion, Luke Dashjr
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2673 bytes --]
It is April 1st. Nonetheless, I am agreed that the first part to track the exchange rate in USD (why not use Gold $/oz?) has merit if properly implemented. Voluntary data is notoriously difficult to enforce for accuracy.
Regards,
________________________________
From: bitcoin-dev-bounces@lists•linuxfoundation.org <bitcoin-dev-bounces@lists•linuxfoundation.org> on behalf of Satoshin via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>
Sent: Monday, 1 April 2019 2:07 PM
To: Peter Todd; Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
Hi Everyone,
First portion of your First BIP is excellent- with this field the protocol can actually attain HFT- by pinning of value at time of trade for later unblock scaling as a mark to market tool which is used in HFT.
The Second BIP of a minimum price would never allow Bitcoin to pass the SEC test of a viable asset. - I hope that portion was actually a Joke since it makes no sense economically.
If one has ever seen a stock drop 90% in one day then you would understand the volatile nature of future valuation.
Prices have to be able to go higher and lower based on market demand and not tethering to perceived norms. If the US dollar was crashed and it went down to Venezuelan currency levels [hypothetically then where would your 50k limit lead the currency} Never say never-
Best Regards
XX
> On Mar 31, 2019, at 9:11 PM, Peter Todd via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
> On Mon, Apr 01, 2019 at 12:30:34AM +0000, Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev wrote:
>> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
>> low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
>> price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
>> that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
>>
>> In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
>> signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
>> minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
>
> I believe I've found a serious vulnerability in your proposal: there's no limit
> on the maximum supply of USD.
>
> --
> https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
_______________________________________________
bitcoin-dev mailing list
bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 0:30 [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC Luke Dashjr
2019-04-01 1:04 ` Ricardo Filipe
2019-04-01 1:11 ` Peter Todd
@ 2019-04-01 2:54 ` Omar Shibli
2019-04-01 11:22 ` Melvin Carvalho
3 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Omar Shibli @ 2019-04-01 2:54 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Luke Dashjr, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 6382 bytes --]
Reasonable, I think also first timer should be forbidden form transacting
for at least 3 years from the first purchase, after going in '3 years' into
the rabbit hole, you can consider selling bitcoins. that's fair for low
time hard money folks, imho.
On Mon, Apr 1, 2019 at 3:33 AM Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
> low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
> that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
> signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
> minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
>
> The BIPs are here, as well as included at the bottom of this email for
> convenience:
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-usdprice.mediawiki
>
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-softfork-50k-price.mediawiki
>
> A reference implementation is here:
>
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:softfork_50k
>
> Please review ASAP so we can get these deployed in Bitcoin Core v0.18.
>
> Luke
>
>
> <pre>
> BIP: ?
> Layer: Applications
> Title: Signed USD Price Indicator
> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> Status: Draft
> Type: Standards Track
> Created: 2019-04-01
> License: BSD-2-Clause
> </pre>
>
> ==Abstract==
>
> This BIP proposes a method to explicitly specify and sign the USD/BTC
> price
> for transactions.
>
> ==Copyright==
>
> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>
> ==Motivation==
>
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
> low
> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price
> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that,
> and
> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> This problem can be fixed by setting a global minimum price for bitcoins.
> Unfortunately, today, the consensus protocol is completely oblivious to
> the
> price bitcoins are traded at. Therefore, we must first add a field to
> Bitcoin
> transactions to indicate their price.
>
> ==Specification==
>
> ===New field and legal implication===
>
> A new field is added to Bitcoin transactions. This field, if present, must
> represent the honest and true USD/BTC rate used for the transaction. By
> signing the transaction, the sender legally affirms this is the valuation
> of
> bitcoins used for the transaction.
>
> For the avoidance of doubt: when the transaction is valued in a currency
> other
> than USD, any reasonable exchange rate may be used to come up with the USD
> valuation.
>
> ===Serialisation===
>
> When serialising the transaction for any purpose, including signing,
> weight
> calculation, and so on, the output count must be incremented by one. Prior
> to
> the first real output, the following bytes must be inserted:
>
> * Constant: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> * Constant: 6a 04 55 53 44 24
> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> * The USD/BTC rate used for the transaction, in standard signed integer
> serialisation, with all leading zeros removed (except as necessary to
> preserve the sign bit).
>
> ==Backwards compatibility==
>
> ===Consensus===
>
> The new price field is serialised as a dummy output, with a value of zero,
> and
> a scriptPubKey that begins with OP_RETURN (6a). Existing nodes will ignore
> this dummy output, and the leading OP_RETURN in the scriptPubKey ensures
> it
> is never considered spendable.
>
> Therefore, current nodes will ignore the new field entirely, and accept
> transactions using it.
>
> ===Wallets===
>
> Existing wallets do not typically generate price indicators as specified.
> Under this BIP, this absence of the field is perfectly acceptable.
>
> ==Reference implementation==
>
>
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:usd_price_tx_field
>
> <pre>
> BIP: ?
> Layer: Consensus (soft fork)
> Title: $50k USD/BTC Minimum Price
> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> Status: Draft
> Type: Standards Track
> Created: 2019-04-01
> License: BSD-2-Clause
> Requires: usdprice
> </pre>
>
> ==Abstract==
>
> This BIP defines a minimum price of $50k USD/BTC for Bitcoin transactions.
>
> ==Copyright==
>
> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>
> ==Motivation==
>
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
> low
> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price
> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that,
> and
> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> bip-usdprice defines a new field to indicate the price of transactions.
> Using
> this, we can softfork to require a minimum transaction price.
>
> ==Specification==
>
> Beginning with block height 622370 (expected approximately 2020 April 1),
> a
> block is reject as invalid unless all transactions it contains both
> declare a
> USD/BTC price (as defined in bip-usdprice) and specify a price that is at
> a
> minimum $50k USD/BTC.
>
> ==Backwards compatibility==
>
> As a soft fork, older nodes will continue to accept the blockchain without
> modification. Non-upgraded nodes, however, will not validate the minimum
> price requirement, and may accept invalid blocks if miners choose to make
> them. Since transactions not declaring a price are at this time still
> common-place, the softfork activation has been set a full year into the
> future to ensure time to upgrade both nodes and wallet software.
>
> ==Reference implementation==
>
>
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bitcoin/compare/usd_price_tx_field...softfork_50k
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 0:30 [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC Luke Dashjr
` (2 preceding siblings ...)
2019-04-01 2:54 ` Omar Shibli
@ 2019-04-01 11:22 ` Melvin Carvalho
2019-04-01 11:50 ` Dana L. Coe
3 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Melvin Carvalho @ 2019-04-01 11:22 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Luke Dashjr, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 6567 bytes --]
On Mon, 1 Apr 2019 at 02:32, Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev <
bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
> low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
> that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
> signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
> minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
>
> The BIPs are here, as well as included at the bottom of this email for
> convenience:
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-usdprice.mediawiki
>
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-softfork-50k-price.mediawiki
>
> A reference implementation is here:
>
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:softfork_50k
>
> Please review ASAP so we can get these deployed in Bitcoin Core v0.18.
>
This seems a little arbitrary. Ask yourself, "Why the USD?". Yes, it is
the dominant currency now, but in 2, 6, 10, 14 years? Who knows.
You could make equally an argument to denominate in euros. Or a basket of
currencies, or even the Bancor.
However the wider question is why even denominate in fiat at all?
I suggest denominating the minimum value in satoshsis themselves, which
would be a negligable upgrade to the network.
>
> Luke
>
>
> <pre>
> BIP: ?
> Layer: Applications
> Title: Signed USD Price Indicator
> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> Status: Draft
> Type: Standards Track
> Created: 2019-04-01
> License: BSD-2-Clause
> </pre>
>
> ==Abstract==
>
> This BIP proposes a method to explicitly specify and sign the USD/BTC
> price
> for transactions.
>
> ==Copyright==
>
> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>
> ==Motivation==
>
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
> low
> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price
> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that,
> and
> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> This problem can be fixed by setting a global minimum price for bitcoins.
> Unfortunately, today, the consensus protocol is completely oblivious to
> the
> price bitcoins are traded at. Therefore, we must first add a field to
> Bitcoin
> transactions to indicate their price.
>
> ==Specification==
>
> ===New field and legal implication===
>
> A new field is added to Bitcoin transactions. This field, if present, must
> represent the honest and true USD/BTC rate used for the transaction. By
> signing the transaction, the sender legally affirms this is the valuation
> of
> bitcoins used for the transaction.
>
> For the avoidance of doubt: when the transaction is valued in a currency
> other
> than USD, any reasonable exchange rate may be used to come up with the USD
> valuation.
>
> ===Serialisation===
>
> When serialising the transaction for any purpose, including signing,
> weight
> calculation, and so on, the output count must be incremented by one. Prior
> to
> the first real output, the following bytes must be inserted:
>
> * Constant: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> * Constant: 6a 04 55 53 44 24
> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> * The USD/BTC rate used for the transaction, in standard signed integer
> serialisation, with all leading zeros removed (except as necessary to
> preserve the sign bit).
>
> ==Backwards compatibility==
>
> ===Consensus===
>
> The new price field is serialised as a dummy output, with a value of zero,
> and
> a scriptPubKey that begins with OP_RETURN (6a). Existing nodes will ignore
> this dummy output, and the leading OP_RETURN in the scriptPubKey ensures
> it
> is never considered spendable.
>
> Therefore, current nodes will ignore the new field entirely, and accept
> transactions using it.
>
> ===Wallets===
>
> Existing wallets do not typically generate price indicators as specified.
> Under this BIP, this absence of the field is perfectly acceptable.
>
> ==Reference implementation==
>
>
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:usd_price_tx_field
>
> <pre>
> BIP: ?
> Layer: Consensus (soft fork)
> Title: $50k USD/BTC Minimum Price
> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org>
> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
> Status: Draft
> Type: Standards Track
> Created: 2019-04-01
> License: BSD-2-Clause
> Requires: usdprice
> </pre>
>
> ==Abstract==
>
> This BIP defines a minimum price of $50k USD/BTC for Bitcoin transactions.
>
> ==Copyright==
>
> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>
> ==Motivation==
>
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
> low
> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price
> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that,
> and
> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> bip-usdprice defines a new field to indicate the price of transactions.
> Using
> this, we can softfork to require a minimum transaction price.
>
> ==Specification==
>
> Beginning with block height 622370 (expected approximately 2020 April 1),
> a
> block is reject as invalid unless all transactions it contains both
> declare a
> USD/BTC price (as defined in bip-usdprice) and specify a price that is at
> a
> minimum $50k USD/BTC.
>
> ==Backwards compatibility==
>
> As a soft fork, older nodes will continue to accept the blockchain without
> modification. Non-upgraded nodes, however, will not validate the minimum
> price requirement, and may accept invalid blocks if miners choose to make
> them. Since transactions not declaring a price are at this time still
> common-place, the softfork activation has been set a full year into the
> future to ensure time to upgrade both nodes and wallet software.
>
> ==Reference implementation==
>
>
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bitcoin/compare/usd_price_tx_field...softfork_50k
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 8858 bytes --]
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 11:22 ` Melvin Carvalho
@ 2019-04-01 11:50 ` Dana L. Coe
2019-04-02 16:48 ` Aymeric Vitte
0 siblings, 1 reply; 13+ messages in thread
From: Dana L. Coe @ 2019-04-01 11:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Melvin Carvalho, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 8013 bytes --]
I suggest in the spirit of the times that we not use USD as the reference, but USDT.
Everyone knows Tethers are much more flexible in tracking the true value of the US dollar.
Dana
> On Apr 1, 2019, at 7:22 PM, Melvin Carvalho via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> On Mon, 1 Apr 2019 at 02:32, Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>> wrote:
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably
> low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the
> price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
> that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to add a
> signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to softfork a
> minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
>
> The BIPs are here, as well as included at the bottom of this email for
> convenience:
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-usdprice.mediawiki <https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-usdprice.mediawiki>
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-softfork-50k-price.mediawiki <https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-softfork-50k-price.mediawiki>
>
> A reference implementation is here:
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:softfork_50k <https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:softfork_50k>
>
> Please review ASAP so we can get these deployed in Bitcoin Core v0.18.
>
> This seems a little arbitrary. Ask yourself, "Why the USD?". Yes, it is the dominant currency now, but in 2, 6, 10, 14 years? Who knows.
>
> You could make equally an argument to denominate in euros. Or a basket of currencies, or even the Bancor.
>
> However the wider question is why even denominate in fiat at all?
>
> I suggest denominating the minimum value in satoshsis themselves, which would be a negligable upgrade to the network.
>
>
> Luke
>
>
> <pre>
> BIP: ?
> Layer: Applications
> Title: Signed USD Price Indicator
> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org <mailto:luke%2Bbip@dashjr•org>>
> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-?? <https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-??>??
> Status: Draft
> Type: Standards Track
> Created: 2019-04-01
> License: BSD-2-Clause
> </pre>
>
> ==Abstract==
>
> This BIP proposes a method to explicitly specify and sign the USD/BTC price
> for transactions.
>
> ==Copyright==
>
> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>
> ==Motivation==
>
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably low
> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the price
> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that, and
> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> This problem can be fixed by setting a global minimum price for bitcoins.
> Unfortunately, today, the consensus protocol is completely oblivious to the
> price bitcoins are traded at. Therefore, we must first add a field to Bitcoin
> transactions to indicate their price.
>
> ==Specification==
>
> ===New field and legal implication===
>
> A new field is added to Bitcoin transactions. This field, if present, must
> represent the honest and true USD/BTC rate used for the transaction. By
> signing the transaction, the sender legally affirms this is the valuation of
> bitcoins used for the transaction.
>
> For the avoidance of doubt: when the transaction is valued in a currency other
> than USD, any reasonable exchange rate may be used to come up with the USD
> valuation.
>
> ===Serialisation===
>
> When serialising the transaction for any purpose, including signing, weight
> calculation, and so on, the output count must be incremented by one. Prior to
> the first real output, the following bytes must be inserted:
>
> * Constant: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> * Constant: 6a 04 55 53 44 24
> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the inserted data
> * The USD/BTC rate used for the transaction, in standard signed integer
> serialisation, with all leading zeros removed (except as necessary to
> preserve the sign bit).
>
> ==Backwards compatibility==
>
> ===Consensus===
>
> The new price field is serialised as a dummy output, with a value of zero, and
> a scriptPubKey that begins with OP_RETURN (6a). Existing nodes will ignore
> this dummy output, and the leading OP_RETURN in the scriptPubKey ensures it
> is never considered spendable.
>
> Therefore, current nodes will ignore the new field entirely, and accept
> transactions using it.
>
> ===Wallets===
>
> Existing wallets do not typically generate price indicators as specified.
> Under this BIP, this absence of the field is perfectly acceptable.
>
> ==Reference implementation==
>
> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:usd_price_tx_field <https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:usd_price_tx_field>
>
> <pre>
> BIP: ?
> Layer: Consensus (soft fork)
> Title: $50k USD/BTC Minimum Price
> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org <mailto:luke%2Bbip@dashjr•org>>
> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
> Comments-URI: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-?? <https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-??>??
> Status: Draft
> Type: Standards Track
> Created: 2019-04-01
> License: BSD-2-Clause
> Requires: usdprice
> </pre>
>
> ==Abstract==
>
> This BIP defines a minimum price of $50k USD/BTC for Bitcoin transactions.
>
> ==Copyright==
>
> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>
> ==Motivation==
>
> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for unreasonably low
> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even driven the price
> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than that, and
> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>
> bip-usdprice defines a new field to indicate the price of transactions. Using
> this, we can softfork to require a minimum transaction price.
>
> ==Specification==
>
> Beginning with block height 622370 (expected approximately 2020 April 1), a
> block is reject as invalid unless all transactions it contains both declare a
> USD/BTC price (as defined in bip-usdprice) and specify a price that is at a
> minimum $50k USD/BTC.
>
> ==Backwards compatibility==
>
> As a soft fork, older nodes will continue to accept the blockchain without
> modification. Non-upgraded nodes, however, will not validate the minimum
> price requirement, and may accept invalid blocks if miners choose to make
> them. Since transactions not declaring a price are at this time still
> common-place, the softfork activation has been set a full year into the
> future to ensure time to upgrade both nodes and wallet software.
>
> ==Reference implementation==
>
> https://github.com/luke-jr/bitcoin/compare/usd_price_tx_field...softfork_50k <https://github.com/luke-jr/bitcoin/compare/usd_price_tx_field...softfork_50k>
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev <https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev>
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread
* Re: [bitcoin-dev] Softfork proposal for minimum price of $50k USD/BTC
2019-04-01 11:50 ` Dana L. Coe
@ 2019-04-02 16:48 ` Aymeric Vitte
0 siblings, 0 replies; 13+ messages in thread
From: Aymeric Vitte @ 2019-04-02 16:48 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Dana L. Coe, Bitcoin Protocol Discussion, Melvin Carvalho
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Right and everybody knows that Tether is the most clever sidechain ever
invented far more sophisticated than lightning, which makes me think
that a punishment should be added in the proposal for the cheater
advertising a price < 50 k (or 100) and/or selling before 1-3 years
(tbd) so all his coins go to the Bitcoin Mediator, a new notion here to
sustain the community (I modestly apply for the position)
Le 01/04/2019 à 13:50, Dana L. Coe via bitcoin-dev a écrit :
> I suggest in the spirit of the times that we not use USD as the
> reference, but USDT.
>
> Everyone knows Tethers are much more flexible in tracking the true
> value of the US dollar.
>
> Dana
>
>> On Apr 1, 2019, at 7:22 PM, Melvin Carvalho via bitcoin-dev
>> <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
>> <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, 1 Apr 2019 at 02:32, Luke Dashjr via bitcoin-dev
>> <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
>> <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>> wrote:
>>
>> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
>> unreasonably
>> low prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even
>> driven the
>> price down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much
>> more than
>> that, and there is widespread support for higher prices.
>>
>> In light of this, I have written and implemented two BIPs: one to
>> add a
>> signed price field to Bitcoin transactions, and the other to
>> softfork a
>> minimum price of $50k USD/BTC a year from today.
>>
>> The BIPs are here, as well as included at the bottom of this
>> email for
>> convenience:
>> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-usdprice.mediawiki
>> https://github.com/luke-jr/bips/blob/softfork_50k/bip-softfork-50k-price.mediawiki
>>
>> A reference implementation is here:
>> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:softfork_50k
>>
>> Please review ASAP so we can get these deployed in Bitcoin Core
>> v0.18.
>>
>>
>> This seems a little arbitrary. Ask yourself, "Why the USD?". Yes,
>> it is the dominant currency now, but in 2, 6, 10, 14 years? Who knows.
>>
>> You could make equally an argument to denominate in euros. Or a
>> basket of currencies, or even the Bancor.
>>
>> However the wider question is why even denominate in fiat at all?
>>
>> I suggest denominating the minimum value in satoshsis themselves,
>> which would be a negligable upgrade to the network.
>>
>>
>> Luke
>>
>>
>> <pre>
>> BIP: ?
>> Layer: Applications
>> Title: Signed USD Price Indicator
>> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org
>> <mailto:luke%2Bbip@dashjr•org>>
>> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
>> Comments-URI:
>> https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
>> Status: Draft
>> Type: Standards Track
>> Created: 2019-04-01
>> License: BSD-2-Clause
>> </pre>
>>
>> ==Abstract==
>>
>> This BIP proposes a method to explicitly specify and sign the
>> USD/BTC price
>> for transactions.
>>
>> ==Copyright==
>>
>> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>>
>> ==Motivation==
>>
>> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
>> unreasonably low
>> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even
>> driven the price
>> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
>> that, and
>> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>>
>> This problem can be fixed by setting a global minimum price for
>> bitcoins.
>> Unfortunately, today, the consensus protocol is completely
>> oblivious to the
>> price bitcoins are traded at. Therefore, we must first add a
>> field to Bitcoin
>> transactions to indicate their price.
>>
>> ==Specification==
>>
>> ===New field and legal implication===
>>
>> A new field is added to Bitcoin transactions. This field, if
>> present, must
>> represent the honest and true USD/BTC rate used for the
>> transaction. By
>> signing the transaction, the sender legally affirms this is the
>> valuation of
>> bitcoins used for the transaction.
>>
>> For the avoidance of doubt: when the transaction is valued in a
>> currency other
>> than USD, any reasonable exchange rate may be used to come up
>> with the USD
>> valuation.
>>
>> ===Serialisation===
>>
>> When serialising the transaction for any purpose, including
>> signing, weight
>> calculation, and so on, the output count must be incremented by
>> one. Prior to
>> the first real output, the following bytes must be inserted:
>>
>> * Constant: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
>> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the
>> inserted data
>> * Constant: 6a 04 55 53 44 24
>> * A single byte, the size in bytes of the remainder of the
>> inserted data
>> * The USD/BTC rate used for the transaction, in standard signed
>> integer
>> serialisation, with all leading zeros removed (except as
>> necessary to
>> preserve the sign bit).
>>
>> ==Backwards compatibility==
>>
>> ===Consensus===
>>
>> The new price field is serialised as a dummy output, with a value
>> of zero, and
>> a scriptPubKey that begins with OP_RETURN (6a). Existing nodes
>> will ignore
>> this dummy output, and the leading OP_RETURN in the scriptPubKey
>> ensures it
>> is never considered spendable.
>>
>> Therefore, current nodes will ignore the new field entirely, and
>> accept
>> transactions using it.
>>
>> ===Wallets===
>>
>> Existing wallets do not typically generate price indicators as
>> specified.
>> Under this BIP, this absence of the field is perfectly acceptable.
>>
>> ==Reference implementation==
>>
>> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/v0.17.1...luke-jr:usd_price_tx_field
>>
>> <pre>
>> BIP: ?
>> Layer: Consensus (soft fork)
>> Title: $50k USD/BTC Minimum Price
>> Author: Luke Dashjr <luke+bip@dashjr•org
>> <mailto:luke%2Bbip@dashjr•org>>
>> Comments-Summary: No comments yet.
>> Comments-URI:
>> https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/wiki/Comments:BIP-????
>> Status: Draft
>> Type: Standards Track
>> Created: 2019-04-01
>> License: BSD-2-Clause
>> Requires: usdprice
>> </pre>
>>
>> ==Abstract==
>>
>> This BIP defines a minimum price of $50k USD/BTC for Bitcoin
>> transactions.
>>
>> ==Copyright==
>>
>> This BIP is licensed under the BSD 2-clause license.
>>
>> ==Motivation==
>>
>> Certain parts of the community have been selling bitcoins for
>> unreasonably low
>> prices. This has halted Bitcoin's valuation at $20k and even
>> driven the price
>> down below $15k! However, clearly Bitcoin is worth much more than
>> that, and
>> there is widespread support for higher prices.
>>
>> bip-usdprice defines a new field to indicate the price of
>> transactions. Using
>> this, we can softfork to require a minimum transaction price.
>>
>> ==Specification==
>>
>> Beginning with block height 622370 (expected approximately 2020
>> April 1), a
>> block is reject as invalid unless all transactions it contains
>> both declare a
>> USD/BTC price (as defined in bip-usdprice) and specify a price
>> that is at a
>> minimum $50k USD/BTC.
>>
>> ==Backwards compatibility==
>>
>> As a soft fork, older nodes will continue to accept the
>> blockchain without
>> modification. Non-upgraded nodes, however, will not validate the
>> minimum
>> price requirement, and may accept invalid blocks if miners choose
>> to make
>> them. Since transactions not declaring a price are at this time
>> still
>> common-place, the softfork activation has been set a full year
>> into the
>> future to ensure time to upgrade both nodes and wallet software.
>>
>> ==Reference implementation==
>>
>> https://github.com/luke-jr/bitcoin/compare/usd_price_tx_field...softfork_50k
>> _______________________________________________
>> bitcoin-dev mailing list
>> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
>> <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>
>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> bitcoin-dev mailing list
>> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
>> <mailto:bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>
>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 13+ messages in thread