From: Mike Hearn <mike@plan99•net>
To: Andreas Schildbach <andreas@schildbach•de>
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists•sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] moving the default display to mbtc
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2014 16:32:55 +0100 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CANEZrP2AtfkiNG4--8rF8C73N=Hf_UR+9DzPAWESSfu95KCwiw@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <lfv5ml$vl8$1@ger.gmane.org>
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 5883 bytes --]
The issue here is that most people are producing prices in BTC by just
multiplying through the spot rate with full precision. Obviously if you
converted dollar prices to Euro prices with the same technique, you'd also
end up with lots of numbers after the decimal point, but in the real world
nobody actually does this. They always "prettify" the price.
This practice often annoys people because they feel like they get short
changed. The most notorious example is Apple which likes (liked?) to charge
99 cents per iTunes song in the USA, and 99 pennies per song in the UK,
despite that the British pound is worth a lot more than the dollar. It
should be more like 60 pence.
Nothing stops BitPay rounding the mBTC price to look more natural, but
right now it's not common practice.
On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 4:02 PM, Andreas Schildbach
<andreas@schildbach•de>wrote:
> By that definition 3.56 is a price. Maybe I misunderstood you and you're
> lobbying for mBTC?
>
>
> On 03/14/2014 03:57 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:
> > you miss the point Andreas. It is not about the magnitude but about
> > the form of a price.
> >
> > A number with no decimals or with two decimals is percieved as a
> > price in some currency.
> >
> > A number with more than two decimals is just not percieved as a price
> > but as a geeky something that you rather convert to local currency.
> >
> > Tamas Blummer
> > Bits of Proof
> >
> > On 14.03.2014, at 15:49, Andreas Schildbach <andreas@schildbach•de
> > <mailto:andreas@schildbach•de>> wrote:
> >
> >> How much do you pay for an Espresso in your local currency?
> >>
> >> At least for the Euro and the Dollar, mBTC 3.56 is very close to what
> >> people would expect. Certainly more familiar than µBTC 3558 or BTC
> >> 0.003578.
> >>
> >> Anyway, I was just sharing real-world experience: nobody is confused.
> >>
> >>
> >> On 03/14/2014 03:14 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:
> >>> You give them a hard to interpret thing like mBTC and then wonder
> >>> why they rather look at local currency. Because the choices you
> >>> gave them are bad.
> >>>
> >>> I think Bitcoin would have a better chance to be percieved as a
> >>> currency of its own if it had prices and fractions like currencies
> >>> do.
> >>>
> >>> 3.558 mBTC or 0.003578 BTC will never be as accepted as 3558 bits
> >>> would be.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Tamas Blummer Bits of Proof
> >>>
> >>> On 14.03.2014, at 15:05, Andreas Schildbach <andreas@schildbach•de
> >>> <mailto:andreas@schildbach•de>>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> btw. None of Bitcoin Wallet's users complained about confusion
> >>>> because of the mBTC switch. In contrast, I get many mails and
> >>>> questions if exchange rates happen to differ by >10%.
> >>>>
> >>>> I suspect nobody looks at the Bitcoin price. It's the amount in
> >>>> local currency that matters to the users.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On 03/13/2014 02:40 PM, Andreas Schildbach wrote:
> >>>>> Indeed. And users were crying for mBTC. Nobody was asking for
> >>>>> µBTC.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I must admit I was not aware if this thread. I just watched
> >>>>> other wallets and at some point decided its time to switch to
> >>>>> mBTC.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 03/13/2014 02:31 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:
> >>>>>> The standard has become mBTC and that's what was adopted.
> >>>>>> It's too late to try and sway this on a mailing list thread
> >>>>>> now.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Gary Rowe
> >>>>>> <g.rowe@froot•co.uk <mailto:g.rowe@froot•co.uk>
> >>>>>> <mailto:g.rowe@froot•co.uk>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> The MultiBit HD view is that this is a locale-sensitive
> >>>>>> presentation issue. As a result we offer a simple
> >>>>>> configuration panel giving pretty much every possible
> >>>>>> combination: icon, m+icon, μ+icon, BTC, mBTC, μBTC, XBT,
> >>>>>> mXBT, μXBT, sat along with settings for leading/trailing
> >>>>>> symbol, commas, spaces and points. This allows anyone to
> >>>>>> customise to meet their own needs beyond the offered default.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> We apply the NIST guidelines for representation of SI unit
> >>>>>> symbols (i.e no conversion to native language, no RTL giving
> >>>>>> icon+m etc).
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Right now MultiBit HD is configured to use m+icon taken from
> >>>>>> the Font Awesome icon set. However reading earlier posts it
> >>>>>> seems that μ+icon is more sensible.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Let us know what you'd like.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Links: m+icon screenshot: http://imgur.com/a/WCDoG Font
> >>>>>> Awesome icon:
> >>>>>> http://fortawesome.github.io/Font-Awesome/icon/btc/ NIST SI
> >>>>>> guidelines: http://physics.nist.gov/Pubs/SP811/sec07.html
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On 13 March 2014 12:56, Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@bitpay•com
> >>>>>> <mailto:jgarzik@bitpay•com>
> >>>>>> <mailto:jgarzik@bitpay•com>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Resurrecting this topic. Bitcoin Wallet moved to mBTC
> >>>>>> several weeks ago, which was disappointing -- it sounded like
> >>>>>> the consensus was uBTC, and moving to uBTC later --which will
> >>>>>> happen-- may result in additional user confusion, thanks to
> >>>>>> yet another decimal place transition.
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
> "Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and their
> applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the field,
> this first edition is now available. Download your free book today!
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development@lists•sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>
[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 8851 bytes --]
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2014-03-14 15:33 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 112+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2013-11-14 11:45 Melvin Carvalho
2013-11-14 18:18 ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-17 3:22 ` Jacob Lyles
2013-11-14 20:01 ` Alan Reiner
2013-11-14 21:15 ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-14 21:55 ` Allen Piscitello
2013-11-14 22:00 ` Alan Reiner
2013-11-14 22:07 ` Allen Piscitello
2013-11-14 23:01 ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-14 23:11 ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-14 23:13 ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-14 23:22 ` Jeff Garzik
2013-11-15 0:15 ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-15 0:18 ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-16 0:41 ` Drak
2013-11-16 0:48 ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-16 1:10 ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-16 1:19 ` Jean-Paul Kogelman
2013-11-16 1:19 ` Drak
2013-11-16 1:31 ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-15 8:55 ` Eugen Leitl
2013-11-14 22:21 ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-14 22:32 ` Drak
2013-11-14 22:37 ` Drak
2014-05-02 19:17 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-05-03 0:54 ` Ben Davenport
2014-05-03 1:13 ` Alan Reiner
2014-05-03 1:50 ` Aaron Voisine
2014-05-03 2:10 ` Matias Alejo Garcia
2014-05-03 2:38 ` Luke Dashjr
2014-05-03 2:41 ` Ben Davenport
2014-05-03 2:43 ` Peter Todd
2014-05-03 3:35 ` Un Ix
2014-05-03 12:32 ` Roy Badami
2014-05-03 4:23 ` Tamas Blummer
2013-11-14 22:03 ` Jeff Garzik
2013-11-14 22:31 ` Mark Friedenbach
2013-11-14 22:53 ` Alan Reiner
2013-11-14 23:01 ` Jeff Garzik
2013-11-14 23:10 ` Luke-Jr
2013-11-15 9:23 ` Eugen Leitl
2013-11-15 9:37 ` Alex Kravets
2013-11-15 9:59 ` Adam Back
2013-11-15 10:39 ` Eugen Leitl
2013-11-15 7:18 ` Wladimir
2013-11-18 2:28 ` Wendell
2014-03-13 12:56 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 13:29 ` Gary Rowe
2014-03-13 13:31 ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 13:40 ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 14:05 ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 14:14 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-14 14:49 ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 14:57 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-14 15:02 ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 15:12 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-14 15:30 ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 15:32 ` Mike Hearn [this message]
2014-03-14 15:56 ` Andreas Schildbach
2014-03-14 16:01 ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-03-14 16:15 ` Alex Morcos
2014-03-14 16:51 ` Ricardo Filipe
2014-03-14 16:58 ` Allen Piscitello
2014-03-14 15:10 ` Tyler
2014-03-14 14:18 ` Roy Badami
2014-03-13 19:38 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 13:34 ` Wladimir
2014-03-13 13:45 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 13:53 ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 14:32 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 15:50 ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 16:17 ` Troy Benjegerdes
2014-03-13 16:39 ` Melvin Carvalho
2014-03-13 16:55 ` Allen Piscitello
2014-03-13 17:13 ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 17:23 ` Allen Piscitello
2014-03-13 16:14 ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-13 16:23 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-13 16:29 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 17:18 ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-03-13 17:21 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-03-13 17:24 ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 17:36 ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-13 17:43 ` Wladimir
2014-03-13 17:51 ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 17:58 ` Alan Reiner
2014-03-13 19:26 ` Drak
2014-03-13 16:08 ` Troy Benjegerdes
2014-03-13 16:30 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-13 16:37 ` slush
2014-03-13 17:48 ` Luke-Jr
2014-03-13 18:23 ` Jorge Timón
2014-03-13 18:29 ` Mike Hearn
2014-03-13 18:51 ` Ben Davenport
2014-03-14 0:34 ` Jorge Timón
2014-03-14 17:14 ` vv01f
2014-03-14 20:13 ` Natanael
2014-03-14 1:26 ` Un Ix
2014-03-14 21:56 ` Odinn Cyberguerrilla
2013-11-15 10:45 ` Wladimir
2013-11-15 10:57 ` Eugen Leitl
2013-11-14 22:27 ` Drak
2013-11-15 0:05 ` Jeff Garzik
2013-11-15 0:37 ` Daniel F
2013-11-15 0:46 ` Melvin Carvalho
2013-11-15 0:57 ` Alan Reiner
2014-05-02 14:29 ` Melvin Carvalho
2013-11-15 5:21 Tamas Blummer
[not found] <mailman.271337.1390426426.2210.bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net>
2014-03-13 15:17 ` Tamas Blummer
2014-03-13 15:37 ` Chris Pacia
2014-03-14 16:25 Andrew Smith
[not found] <536537E2.1060200@stud.uni-saarland.de>
2014-05-03 18:46 ` Jannis Froese
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to='CANEZrP2AtfkiNG4--8rF8C73N=Hf_UR+9DzPAWESSfu95KCwiw@mail.gmail.com' \
--to=mike@plan99$(echo .)net \
--cc=andreas@schildbach$(echo .)de \
--cc=bitcoin-development@lists$(echo .)sourceforge.net \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox