From: gabe appleton <gappleto97@gmail•com>
To: Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@bitpay•com>
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists•sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Proposed additional options for pruned nodes
Date: Tue, 12 May 2015 16:41:10 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CANJO25+yXnkQm8ATq694PurDKGBPTkCcJzD4fJaPS4Jy9HmbTg@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAJHLa0O3fgmg4AFAM9+4RRkhSo8ekATs2Ks+Ry7ooQafjQ-4qw@mail.gmail.com>
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I suppose this begs two questions:
1) why not have a partial archive store the most recent X% of the
blockchain by default?
2) why not include some sort of torrent in QT, to mitigate this risk? I
don't think this is necessarily a good idea, but I'd like to hear the
reasoning.
On May 12, 2015 4:11 PM, "Jeff Garzik" <jgarzik@bitpay•com> wrote:
> True. Part of the issue rests on the block sync horizon/cliff. There is
> a value X which is the average number of blocks the 90th percentile of
> nodes need in order to sync. It is sufficient for the [semi-]pruned nodes
> to keep X blocks, after which nodes must fall back to archive nodes for
> older data.
>
> There is simply far, far more demand for recent blocks, and the demand for
> old blocks very rapidly falls off.
>
> There was even a more radical suggestion years ago - refuse to sync if too
> old (>2 weeks?), and force the user to download ancient data via torrent.
>
>
>
> On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 1:02 PM, Gregory Maxwell <gmaxwell@gmail•com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 7:38 PM, Jeff Garzik <jgarzik@bitpay•com> wrote:
>> > One general problem is that security is weakened when an attacker can
>> DoS a
>> > small part of the chain by DoS'ing a small number of nodes - yet the
>> impact
>> > is a network-wide DoS because nobody can complete a sync.
>>
>> It might be more interesting to think of that attack as a bandwidth
>> exhaustion DOS attack on the archive nodes... if you can't get a copy
>> without them, thats where you'll go.
>>
>> So the question arises: does the option make some nodes that would
>> have been archive not be? Probably some-- but would it do so much that
>> it would offset the gain of additional copies of the data when those
>> attacks are not going no. I suspect not.
>>
>> It's also useful to give people incremental ways to participate even
>> when they can't swollow the whole pill; or choose to provide the
>> resource thats cheap for them to provide. In particular, if there is
>> only two kinds of full nodes-- archive and pruned; then the archive
>> nodes take both a huge disk and bandwidth cost; where as if there are
>> fractional then archives take low(er) bandwidth unless the fractionals
>> get DOS attacked.
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Jeff Garzik
> Bitcoin core developer and open source evangelist
> BitPay, Inc. https://bitpay.com/
>
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next prev parent reply other threads:[~2015-05-12 20:41 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 19+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <CANJO25J1WRHtfQLVXUB2s_sjj39pTPWmixAcXNJ3t-5os8RPmQ@mail.gmail.com>
2015-05-12 15:26 ` gabe appleton
2015-05-12 16:05 ` Jeff Garzik
2015-05-12 16:56 ` gabe appleton
2015-05-12 17:16 ` Peter Todd
2015-05-12 18:23 ` Tier Nolan
2015-05-12 19:03 ` Gregory Maxwell
2015-05-12 19:24 ` gabe appleton
2015-05-12 19:38 ` Jeff Garzik
2015-05-12 19:43 ` gabe appleton
2015-05-12 21:30 ` [Bitcoin-development] [Bulk] " gb
2015-05-12 20:02 ` [Bitcoin-development] " Gregory Maxwell
2015-05-12 20:10 ` Jeff Garzik
2015-05-12 20:41 ` gabe appleton [this message]
2015-05-12 20:47 ` Gregory Maxwell
[not found] ` <CAFVoEQTdmCSRAy3u26q5oHdfvFEytZDBfQb_fs_qttK15fiRmg@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <CAJHLa0OxxxiVd3JOp8SDvbF8dHj6KHdUNGb9L_GvTe93z3Z8mg@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <CAJHLa0MYSpVBD4VE65LVbADb2daOvE=N83G8F_zDSHy3AQ5DAQ@mail.gmail.com>
2015-05-12 21:17 ` [Bitcoin-development] Fwd: " Adam Weiss
2015-05-12 22:00 ` [Bitcoin-development] " Tier Nolan
2015-05-12 22:09 ` gabe appleton
2015-05-13 5:19 ` Daniel Kraft
2015-05-13 9:34 ` Tier Nolan
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