From: Christophe Biocca <christophe.biocca@gmail•com>
To: Troy Benjegerdes <hozer@hozed•org>
Cc: "bitcoin-development@lists•sourceforge.net"
<bitcoin-development@lists•sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] unlinakble static address? & spv-privacy (Re: Stealth Addresses)
Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2014 15:25:36 -0500 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CANOOu=9t7UxBQWHXS4hVziWqaaDx-D6POK23RNhL5CM8m_JQqg@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20140118174452.GG3180@nl.grid.coop>
Like any other mechanism that puts extra data in the blockchain, the
sender pays the fees.
This mechanism is to improve privacy for static addresses (donation
links on websites and so on). I personally don't think it will be used
nearly as much as BIP0032 or the payment protocol (both of which don't
need on-blockchain data), precisely because it increases the fees
required to send funds, but this doesn't externalize costs anymore
than any other use of the blockchain does.
People who don't care about privacy and want smallest cost and maximum
convenience already use SPV nodes. Their resource usage will not be
affected in the least.
On Sat, Jan 18, 2014 at 12:44 PM, Troy Benjegerdes <hozer@hozed•org> wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 15, 2014 at 05:32:31PM -0800, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
>> On Wed, Jan 15, 2014 at 5:02 PM, Jeremy Spilman <jeremy@taplink•co> wrote:
>> > Choosing how many bits to put in the prefix may be difficult, particularly
>> > if transaction load changes dramatically over time. 0 or 1 bits may be
>> > just fine for a single user running their own node, whereas a central
>> > service might want 4 or 5 bits to keep their computation costs scalable.
>>
>> Ignoring prefixes the cost for each reusable address is only a small
>> percentage of the full node cost (rational: each transaction has one
>> or more ECDSA signatures, and the derivation is no more expensive), so
>> I would only expect computation to be an issue for large centralized
>> services. (non-full nodes suffer more from just the bandwidth impact).
>
> I have not seen anyone address my high-level question to (somewhat) complicated
> mechanisms to keep coin flows private.
>
> Who pays for it? From what I see it's going to double the amount of data
> needed per address, further centralizing 'full' nodes. I'm fine if the NSA
> is paying for privacy (I actually trust them more than banks and advertisers),
> but let's just be honest, okay?
>
> If socializing the cost of privacy is Bitcoin's goal, and giving the benefits
> to a few that understand it and/or have the resources to determine privacy
> providers that won't scam them, then say so, so I can get on with launching
> a 'transparencycoin' with a modified code that explicitly ALWAYS re-uses
> addresses, and has miners and pools that charge more for addresses they have
> never seen before. I bet it will be more distributed and have about half the
> average transaction cost of Bitcoin, because most people *just don't care*
> about privacy if they get cheap and/or free services.
>
>
> -- Troy, transparency advocate who is quite transparent that if you buy me
> farmland, I'll shut up about transparency, because I'll be too busy growing
> food and giving part of it away.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> CenturyLink Cloud: The Leader in Enterprise Cloud Services.
> Learn Why More Businesses Are Choosing CenturyLink Cloud For
> Critical Workloads, Development Environments & Everything In Between.
> Get a Quote or Start a Free Trial Today.
> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=119420431&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development@lists•sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2014-01-18 20:25 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 87+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2014-01-06 12:03 [Bitcoin-development] Stealth Addresses Peter Todd
2014-01-08 10:20 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-10 10:20 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-10 11:28 ` Drak
2014-01-10 12:00 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-12 10:33 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-12 12:51 ` Mike Hearn
2014-01-12 18:20 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-12 18:26 ` Mike Hearn
2014-01-13 9:13 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-14 14:15 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-14 17:54 ` Odinn Cyberguerrilla
2014-01-12 21:18 ` Gavin Andresen
2014-01-13 9:52 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-01-13 10:39 ` Mike Hearn
2014-01-13 13:37 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-13 15:58 ` Mike Hearn
2014-01-13 20:11 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-14 22:53 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-15 0:19 ` Drak
2014-01-15 20:22 ` Ben Davenport
2014-01-15 20:38 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-01-15 20:44 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-01-15 22:38 ` [Bitcoin-development] Static addresses on chains encouraging address *RE* use Troy Benjegerdes
2014-01-15 23:01 ` [Bitcoin-development] Stealth Addresses Mike Hearn
2014-01-15 23:04 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-15 23:07 ` Jeff Garzik
2014-01-15 23:17 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-15 23:19 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-15 23:09 ` [Bitcoin-development] unlinakble static address? & spv-privacy (Re: Stealth Addresses) Adam Back
2014-01-16 1:02 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-16 1:32 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-01-18 17:44 ` Troy Benjegerdes
2014-01-18 20:25 ` Christophe Biocca [this message]
2014-01-20 11:11 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-21 4:00 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-24 9:17 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-16 11:42 ` Adam Back
2014-01-16 18:19 ` Troy Benjegerdes
2014-01-16 0:05 ` [Bitcoin-development] Stealth Addresses Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-16 0:10 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-01-16 0:24 ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-01-16 0:44 ` Eric Martindale
2014-01-16 6:26 ` Gary Rowe
2014-01-16 9:48 ` Wladimir
2014-01-16 1:16 ` Odinn Cyberguerrilla
2014-01-16 10:14 ` Drak
2014-01-16 10:19 ` Mike Hearn
2014-01-16 11:12 ` [Bitcoin-development] reusable address privacy problems & fuzzy bait limitations (Re: Stealth Addresses) Adam Back
2014-01-16 21:28 ` [Bitcoin-development] Stealth Addresses Peter Todd
2014-01-17 2:30 ` Johnathan Corgan
2014-01-17 3:13 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-17 7:49 ` Drak
2014-01-17 9:15 ` Mike Hearn
2014-01-17 9:19 ` Mark Friedenbach
2014-01-17 9:23 ` Natanael
2014-01-17 9:59 ` Drak
2014-01-17 20:16 ` Cameron Garnham
2014-01-17 14:46 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-17 19:21 ` Ben Davenport
2014-01-18 4:55 ` Alan Reiner
2014-01-18 5:09 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-01-18 23:12 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-18 23:50 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-01-20 11:08 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-13 19:53 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-13 19:57 ` Mike Hearn
2014-01-13 20:01 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-13 19:40 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-13 19:44 ` Drak
2014-01-13 19:59 ` Alan Reiner
2014-01-13 20:10 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-01-13 20:15 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-13 22:02 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-14 14:19 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-14 19:12 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-14 20:48 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-14 21:51 ` Adam Back
2014-01-14 22:34 ` Jeremy Spilman
2014-01-13 20:14 ` Peter Todd
2014-01-13 20:41 ` Alan Reiner
2014-01-13 20:47 ` Gregory Maxwell
2014-01-13 21:02 ` Roy Badami
2014-01-13 21:15 ` Alan Reiner
2014-01-13 21:27 ` Peter Todd
[not found] ` <op.w9ne31oqyldrnw@laptop-air.hsd1.ca.comcast.net>
2014-01-14 12:10 ` Peter Todd
2014-03-06 12:23 ` Dan Carter
Reply instructions:
You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:
* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
and reply-to-all from there: mbox
Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style
* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
switches of git-send-email(1):
git send-email \
--in-reply-to='CANOOu=9t7UxBQWHXS4hVziWqaaDx-D6POK23RNhL5CM8m_JQqg@mail.gmail.com' \
--to=christophe.biocca@gmail$(echo .)com \
--cc=bitcoin-development@lists$(echo .)sourceforge.net \
--cc=hozer@hozed$(echo .)org \
/path/to/YOUR_REPLY
https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line
before the message body.
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox