From: Pieter Wuille <pieter.wuille@gmail•com>
To: Mike Hearn <mike@plan99•net>
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists•sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] comments on BIP 100
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 12:24:45 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAPg+sBgc0i-XsN=g0V4Y0bko-Xb1AT5x=UWDa+opL3eFbBmJfA@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CANEZrP0Z_EOmVgbvVmYDvegm6jfd1cKB52acXHocjRuM-qGEog@mail.gmail.com>
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On Mon, Jun 15, 2015 at 11:27 AM, Mike Hearn <mike@plan99•net> wrote:
> I persevered for several months to add a very small "API" I needed for my
> app to Bitcoin Core, and it was in the end a waste of time. There are no
> actionable items left for the getutxo patch, regardless, I had to fork
> Bitcoin to get it out there. It would have been *much* easier to just
> say, fuck it, I'll use blockchain.info and in fact some in this community
> told me to do exactly that. But, the approach I chose has been working fine
> for months now.
>
Since you keep bringing this up, I'll try to clarify this once again.
Since your patch was to enable querying spentness of particular outputs,
which is fundamentally unprovable data in Bitcoin as is (even your proposed
protocol that verifies scripts with amounts under sighash only proves
correctness of the txout data, not its spentness), I indeed don't see why
you would want anything else than querying such a service. I wish it were
different, but the choice is between querying a central service, or
trusting something a random peer on the internet tells you. At least with
the central service you can use an authenticated protocol with known keys
to detect MITM, and have someone to point to when they lie.
Not decentralized you say? Absolutely. But why do we want decentralization
in the first place? To remove central points of failure, and to reduce
trust. Bitcoin gets away with decentralization because it can validate (to
more or lesser extent) the data it received from its identityless peers. If
you can't do that, and are just aiming for removing central points of
failure, run a bunch of servers yourself, and let others run their own.
That sounds remarkably close to what you actually did, actually...
Do you want actually trustless querying of spentness in the future? Help
working on one of the several TXO commitment ideas to get them implemented.
--
Pieter
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next prev parent reply other threads:[~2015-06-15 10:24 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 36+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2015-06-14 21:23 Adam Back
2015-06-14 22:23 ` Mike Hearn
2015-06-14 23:58 ` Adam Back
2015-06-15 0:53 ` Eric Lombrozo
2015-06-15 0:55 ` Eric Lombrozo
2015-06-15 4:11 ` Peter Todd
2015-06-15 4:43 ` Eric Lombrozo
2015-06-15 9:27 ` Mike Hearn
2015-06-15 9:39 ` Eric Lombrozo
2015-06-15 10:24 ` Pieter Wuille [this message]
2015-06-15 10:36 ` Mike Hearn
2015-06-15 10:40 ` Pieter Wuille
2015-06-15 10:50 ` Mike Hearn
2015-06-15 11:16 ` Rebroad (sourceforge)
2015-06-15 17:53 ` Raystonn .
2015-06-15 18:14 ` Adam Back
2015-06-15 18:57 ` [Bitcoin-development] The Bitcoin Node Market Raystonn .
2015-06-15 19:18 ` sickpig
2015-06-15 19:36 ` Raystonn .
2015-06-15 20:12 ` sickpig
2015-06-16 3:30 ` Kevin Greene
2015-06-16 3:41 ` Luke Dashjr
2015-06-16 3:49 ` Kevin Greene
2015-06-16 4:05 ` Kevin Greene
2015-06-16 4:12 ` Aaron Voisine
2015-06-16 5:28 ` justusranvier
2015-06-16 5:30 ` Potter QQ
2015-06-16 7:55 ` Aaron Voisine
2015-06-16 13:32 ` justusranvier
2015-06-16 17:04 ` Aaron Voisine
2015-06-16 17:22 ` Aaron Voisine
2015-06-16 15:52 ` devrandom
2015-06-15 4:43 ` [Bitcoin-development] comments on BIP 100 Peter Todd
2015-06-15 9:06 ` Mike Hearn
2015-06-15 2:28 ` Jeff Garzik
2015-06-15 2:44 ` Jeff Garzik
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