From: Kalle Rosenbaum <kalle@rosenbaum•se>
To: Tom Harding <tomh@thinlink•com>
Cc: Bitcoin Dev <bitcoin-development@lists•sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Bitcoin-development] Proof of Payment
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2015 14:41:51 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CAPswA9w=DMDokS8BrDPTtWa_qpdORbK+V4aNS4DoAKE_F1iVoA@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAPswA9xUfr1D6New3hm+1Z1OqSfkAZ8L+VnbFZayG+uJecgaeA@mail.gmail.com>
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"Or a really high lock_time, but it would not make it invalid, just
delayed."
Ok, this was a bad idea, since nodes would have to keep it in memory.
Please disregard that idea...
Kalle
Den 27 apr 2015 14:35 skrev "Kalle Rosenbaum" <kalle@rosenbaum•se>:
>
> >
> > Some more use cases might be:
> > Waiting in comfort:
> > - Send a payment ahead of time, then wander over and collect the goods
> > after X confirmations.
> >
> > Authorized pickup :
> > - Hot wallet software used by related people could facilitate the use
> > of 1 of N multisig funds. Any one of the N wallets could collect goods
> > and services purchased by any of the others.
>
> I like this one, because it shows the power of reusing the transaction
data structure.
>
> >
> > Non-monetary gifts:
> > - Sender exports spent keys to a beneficiary, enabling PoP to work as a
> > gift claim
> >
> > Contingent services:
> > - Without Bob's permission, a 3rd party conditions action on a payment
> > made from Alice to Bob. For example, if you donated at least .02 BTC to
> > Dorian, you (or combining scenarios, any of your N authorized family
> > members), can come to my dinner party.
>
> This is an interesting one.
>
> >
> > I tried out your demo wallet and service and it worked as advertised.
> >
> > Could the same standard also be used to prove that a transaction COULD
> > BE created? To generalize the concept beyond actual payments, you could
> > call it something like proof of payment potential.
>
> I guess it's possible, but we'd have to remove the txid from the output,
since there is none. This is a way of saying "I'm in control of these
addresses". The other party/parties can then verify the funds on the
blockchain and watch those addresses for changes. Maybe there are some
interesting use cases here. Ideas?
>
> >
> > Why not make these proofs permanently INVALID transactions, to remove
> > any possibility of their being mined and spending everything to fees
> > when used in this way, and also in cases involving reorganizations?
>
> Yes. Initially I thought it would be enough that the funds are already
spent, but I think you're right here. Reorgs could be a problem. Worse, you
also might want to prove 0-confirmation transactions, in which case it's a
huge security problem. Someone might intercept the PoP and publish it on
the bitcoin network, spending all the funds. But I still would like wallets
to be able to build/verify PoPs with little or no modifications. Could we
possibly change the version number on the PoP to something other than 1?
Maybe 2^4-1? Or a really high lock_time, but it would not make it invalid,
just delayed. Any suggestions here?
>
> >
> > I agree that PoP seems complementary to BIP70.
> >
> >
>
> Thank you very much for your comments!
>
> /Kalle
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next prev parent reply other threads:[~2015-04-27 12:41 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 15+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2015-03-13 19:29 Kalle Rosenbaum
2015-03-13 20:30 ` Natanael
2015-03-13 21:31 ` Mike Hearn
2015-03-13 21:47 ` Kalle Rosenbaum
2015-03-13 22:03 ` Mike Hearn
[not found] ` <CAPswA9y5bDs1urRCmh8Oxeho4As8pBt2rRVP6fjhjJA0cZrvfA@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <CANEZrP35_h_-2c=A-1+M8umSpAC70DJ7sYhPPo_62dm2QKHCEg@mail.gmail.com>
2015-03-14 9:28 ` Kalle Rosenbaum
[not found] ` <A2849710-1069-45A1-89C0-9D8E40C4A8D6@newcastle.ac.uk>
2015-03-14 18:16 ` Kalle Rosenbaum
2015-04-22 20:03 ` Kalle Rosenbaum
[not found] ` <55384AC9.80501@datamagi.no>
2015-04-23 14:39 ` Kalle Rosenbaum
2015-04-27 0:50 ` Tom Harding
2015-04-27 12:35 ` Kalle Rosenbaum
2015-04-27 12:41 ` Kalle Rosenbaum [this message]
2015-04-28 7:23 ` Jorge Timón
2015-04-28 12:41 ` Kalle Rosenbaum
2015-04-28 12:53 ` Jorge Timón
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