Re: [bitcoin-dev] PayJoin adoption

From: dev_f <dev@fitti•io>
To: Chris Belcher <belcher@riseup•net>,
	Bitcoin Protocol Discussion
	<bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] PayJoin adoption
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2021 02:52:34 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <MRPJ51OJKiOHFfMaz1Y0XC-BWAyJqQFRQttP5sApf8_gtlVk3k-jziFACTwFZ3QPK3jFZ9yaVmFXf9BuN-dbo3J1JrWjLTkk3wKw1LfocKk=@fitti.io> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <2b8ba39f-8fe9-8800-b8e6-47ca263774d5@riseup.net>

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Hey Chris,

I assume that a major reason for the lack of adoption is the lack of visibility.
I personally first found out about PayJoin when using BTCPayServer for a donation
and being told by the site that PayJoin was available (https://hrf.org/donate-bitcoin/payjoin/).
The wiki page you created is a good starting point. Bringing up the issue of implementing
PayJoin directly with the companies / in the respective software repos seems like it would
be a strong first step for greater adoption. Gets more eyes on it in general.
(Directly contributing to the software by writing an implementation is obviously the
most helpful, though clearly harder.)

As a second option, pushing merchants towards accepting Bitcoin specifically via
software like BTCPayServer, which already supports PayJoin, might be immensely
helpful when Bitcoin adoption itself rises.

Fitti

Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.

‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐

On Saturday, January 16th, 2021 at 1:07 AM, Chris Belcher via bitcoin-dev <bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org> wrote:

> PayJoin is an exciting bitcoin privacy technology which has the
> 

> potential to damage the ability of blockchain surveillance to spy on
> 

> bitcoin users and destroy bitcoin's fungibility. A protocol standard has
> 

> already been defined and implemented by a couple of projects such as
> 

> BTCPayServer, Wasabi Wallet, JoinMarket and BlueWallet.
> 

> I've made a wiki page tracking adoption:
> 

> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/PayJoin_adoption
> 

> It is similar to the Bech32 adoption page.
> 

> Recently a UK bitcoin exchange shut down due to new regulations, with
> 

> the owner writing a very interesting and relevant blog post that I'll
> 

> quote here:
> 

> > you’re considered suspicious if you used a marketplace and not an
> 

> exchange. Coinjoin counts as high risk. Gambling is high risk. As you
> 

> use entities that are paranoid about keeping their coins clean and
> 

> adhering to all the regulations, your risk scores will continue to
> 

> increase and without you even knowing why, your deposits will become
> 

> rejected, you may be asked to supply documents or lose the coins, your
> 

> account may become suspended without you having any clue what you did
> 

> wrong. And quite possibly you didn’t do anything wrong. But that won’t
> 

> matter.
> 

> > The goal post, the risk score threshold will keep moving along this
> 

> trend until the point where you will be afraid of using your personal
> 

> wallet, donating to someone online, receiving bitcoins from anywhere
> 

> except for regulated exchanges. At that point, crypto will be akin to a
> 

> regular bank account. You won’t have a bitcoin wallet, you will have
> 

> accounts to websites.
> 

> https://blog.bitbargain.com/post/638504004285054976/goodbye
> 

> If we want bitcoin to fulfill its dream of a permissionless money for
> 

> the internet then we'll have to work on this. What can we do to increase
> 

> adoption of PayJoin?
> 

> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> 

> bitcoin-dev@lists•linuxfoundation.org
> 

> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev

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