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* [bitcoindev] OP_Expire mempool behavior
@ 2024-03-13  3:32 Peter Todd
  2024-03-16 18:21 ` [bitcoindev] " Antoine Riard
  2024-03-19 15:04 ` Peter Todd
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 4+ messages in thread
From: Peter Todd @ 2024-03-13  3:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: bitcoindev

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I got a question re: the following comment on delvingbitcoin with regard to
OP_Expire:

> > nodes should require higher minimum relay fees for transactions close to
> > their expiration height to ensure we don’t waste bandwidth on transactions
> > that have no potential to be mined
>
> This seems insufficient to solve the problem, unless the premium is so high
> that it virtually guarantees that the transaction will be mined before it
> expires. However, if the feerate were that high, wouldn’t OP_EXPIRE simply
> waste blockspace? If however the feerate of the transaction is merely
> competitive, the presence of OP_EXPIRE creates a bandwidth-wasting vector: an
> attacker would submit e.g. OP_EXPIRE transactions at the bottom of the top
> block and push them out of the top block with further OP_EXPIRE transactions.
> This way the attacker could issue a constant stream of transactions, but
> never pay for more than a couple barely sliding in at the bottom of the
> block.
-https://delvingbitcoin.org/t/op-checkmaxtimeverify/581/8

This "bandwidth-wasting vector" requires the attacker to create actual
fee-paying transactions, with a fee-rate sufficiently high to get mined in the
next block or so. This of course is very expensive by itself.

If you already have a need to make such transactions, you can argue that the
marginal cost to also use up that bandwidth is low. But that's already the case
with RBF: we allow any transaction to be replaced with RBF for a (by default)
1sat/vB additional cost to "pay for" the bandwidth of that replacement.
OP_EXPIRE does not change this situation: you're still paying for an additional
1sat/vB cost over the replaced transaction, as eventually one of your
replacements will get mined.

-- 
https://petertodd.org 'peter'[:-1]@petertodd.org

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 4+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2024-06-20 23:58 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 4+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
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2024-03-13  3:32 [bitcoindev] OP_Expire mempool behavior Peter Todd
2024-03-16 18:21 ` [bitcoindev] " Antoine Riard
2024-03-19 15:04 ` Peter Todd
2024-06-20 23:09   ` Antoine Riard

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