--- Day changed Mon Dec 16 2019 01:04 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 01:26 -!- jonatack [~jon@2a01:e0a:53c:a200:bb54:3be5:c3d0:9ce5] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:37 -!- b10c [~Thunderbi@mue-88-130-54-196.dsl.tropolys.de] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 01:54 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 01:58 < nickler> ZmnSCPxj: I didn't mean to say that you could just use lightning implementations as they exist today. I was essentially thinking of a less powerful version of nodelets (which I only read about last week). 01:58 < ZmnSCPxj> Ah, I see. 01:59 < ZmnSCPxj> So...... `R` is somehow coordinated between the implementations? 01:59 < ZmnSCPxj> a la nodelets, effectively 02:00 < ZmnSCPxj> hmmmm.... what can nodelets do that your proposal cannot, and what is the advantage? 02:04 < nickler> There's no advantage of my ad-hoc idea. I was only thinking of "single-party nodelets" for security, i.e. mitigating hot wallet risks. 02:05 -!- aj___ [aj@cerulean.erisian.com.au] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:05 -!- jkczyz [~jkczyz@135.84.132.250] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:05 -!- tecnovert [~user@mail.tecnovert.net] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:05 -!- willcl_ark [~quassel@cpc123762-trow7-2-0-cust7.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:05 -!- soju_ [~kwon@206.189.94.44] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:05 -!- yaslama [~yaslama@bzq-218-78-150.red.bezeqint.net] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:07 -!- maaku [~quassel@ec2-54-186-10-232.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:08 -!- luke-jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:09 -!- jonatack [~jon@213.152.161.85] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:17 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 02:23 -!- aj___ is now known as aj 02:27 -!- jonatack [~jon@213.152.161.85] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:29 -!- mryandao [~mryandao@gateway/tor-sasl/mryandao] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:15 -!- Murch [murch@sf1.hashbang.sh] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.6] 03:37 < ZmnSCPxj> seems similar to idea by devrandom? 05:07 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:07 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 05:32 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:46 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 06:36 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:37 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 06:38 -!- afk11 [~afk11@gateway/tor-sasl/afk11] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:39 -!- afk11 [~afk11@gateway/tor-sasl/afk11] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 07:04 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:04 -!- orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 07:47 -!- andytoshi [~apoelstra@wpsoftware.net] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 07:47 -!- andytoshi [~apoelstra@wpsoftware.net] has quit [Changing host] 07:47 -!- andytoshi [~apoelstra@unaffiliated/andytoshi] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 07:48 -!- orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:50 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 08:02 -!- _andrewtoth_ [~andrewtot@gateway/tor-sasl/andrewtoth] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 08:03 -!- andrewtoth_ [~andrewtot@gateway/tor-sasl/andrewtoth] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:10 -!- _andrewtoth_ [~andrewtot@gateway/tor-sasl/andrewtoth] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:14 -!- mol [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:20 -!- jonatack [~jon@2a01:e0a:53c:a200:bb54:3be5:c3d0:9ce5] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 08:44 -!- _andrewtoth_ [~andrewtot@gateway/tor-sasl/andrewtoth] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 10:08 -!- b10c [~Thunderbi@mue-88-130-54-196.dsl.tropolys.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:16 -!- mol [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 10:23 -!- meshcollider [meshcollid@quantumznc.com] has quit [Quit: ZNC - https://znc.in] 10:43 < devrandom> ( https://gitlab.com/ksedgwic/liposig/-/wikis/Lightning-Policy-Signing-PoC ) 11:46 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:46 -!- orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 11:49 -!- b10c [~Thunderbi@mue-88-130-54-196.dsl.tropolys.de] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 12:04 < aj> devrandom: if you're forwarding other people's HTLCs, there's a bunch of edge cases that are hard to deal with i think -- you want to not sign the outgoing channel update until you have the incoming channel update; but you also want to know the incoming channel hasn't been fully closed in a previous state too. i think if you compromise the node and open a channel to the node, you can steal large 12:04 < aj> chunks of money that way even without having direct access to the secrets (now i think about it, could conceivably use UTXO commitments to prove the channel hasn't been closed) 12:04 -!- orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:05 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 12:29 < devrandom> aj: agreed. already captured these in https://gitlab.com/ksedgwic/liposig/blob/master/docs/policy-controls.md (e.g. "HTLC receive channel validity") 12:30 < devrandom> and mentioned the need to have a set of oracles that commit to the UTXO set in https://medium.com/@devrandom/securing-lightning-nodes-39410747734b 12:31 < devrandom> would love a thorough review to see if we missed anything 12:47 -!- pinheadmz [~matthewzi@pool-100-33-69-78.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: pinheadmz] 12:48 -!- pinheadmz [~matthewzi@pool-100-33-69-78.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 14:10 -!- dr-orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:10 -!- orlovsky [~dr-orlovs@194.230.155.171] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 14:23 -!- afk11 [~afk11@gateway/tor-sasl/afk11] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:25 -!- afk11 [~afk11@gateway/tor-sasl/afk11] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 14:43 -!- b10c [~Thunderbi@mue-88-130-54-196.dsl.tropolys.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 18:59 -!- ZmnSCPxj [~ZmnSCPxj@180.190.49.93] has quit [Quit: ZmnSCPxj] 20:07 -!- achow101 [~achow101@unaffiliated/achow101] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:14 -!- achow101 [~achow101@unaffiliated/achow101] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 20:31 -!- achow101 [~achow101@unaffiliated/achow101] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 20:50 -!- achow101 [~achow101@unaffiliated/achow101] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 22:18 -!- pinheadmz [~matthewzi@pool-100-33-69-78.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: pinheadmz] 23:32 -!- ZmnSCPxj [~ZmnSCPxj@180.190.49.93] has joined ##taproot-bip-review 23:32 -!- ZmnSCPxj [~ZmnSCPxj@180.190.49.93] has quit [Client Quit] 23:58 -!- aj [aj@cerulean.erisian.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:59 -!- aj [aj@cerulean.erisian.com.au] has joined ##taproot-bip-review