--- Day changed Fri Jun 12 2009
00:10 -!- DrTread [n=chatzill@cpe-70-112-223-97.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
00:40 -!- DrTread [n=chatzill@cpe-70-112-223-97.austin.res.rr.com] has left #hplusroadmap ["Around the house"]
01:49 -!- any71938629 [n=someone@99.194.249.149] has joined #hplusroadmap
02:06 -!- katsmeow-afk [n=someone@99.194.253.130] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
03:47 -!- elias` [n=c@host217-42-207-213.range217-42.btcentralplus.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
05:52 -!- Utopiah_ [n=libre@rps7452.ovh.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
06:03 -!- Utopiah [n=libre@rps7452.ovh.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
06:15 -!- Utopiah_ is now known as Utopiah
06:22 -!- any71938629 is now known as katsmeow-afk
08:02 < kanzure> forgot to cd in to the right dir to run the nightly svn zip file thingy on adl.serveftp.org :(
08:02 < kanzure> (fixed)
08:12 -!- elias` [n=c@unaffiliated/elias/x-342423] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
08:16 -!- elias` [n=c@host86-159-170-69.range86-159.btcentralplus.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
09:57 -!- samrose [n=samrose@h134-215-226-37.lnngmi.dedicated.static.tds.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
10:13 < kanzure> various scripts from ADL that I've written: http://adl.serveftp.org/dokuwiki/scripts
10:16 < kanzure> apparently Henry Gates, Sr. is currently having his genome sequenced (Bill's father)
10:23 < kanzure> fenn: since you're reading about brains, do you remember my brain builder app? before I started working on it, what I was trying to do was figure out a way to organize the information on [[Sustained_attention]] on the mediawiki installation. 
10:23 < kanzure> the problem that I kept running into was that there were too many different regions of the brain and not enough .. er, organization of information
10:23 < kanzure> so I couldn't just immediately map some research to some region of the brain because I didn't have a good data structure
10:23 < kanzure> one way to do it might be to use a coordinate system for the brain (there are a few mentioned in the literature, one is the most popular standard but I don't recall it)
10:24 < kanzure> "mapping the brain with GIS"
10:24 < kanzure> what most people do is just get a brain scan via MRI or fMRI and then call it quits and use that for local coordinate crap
10:25 < kanzure> but that doesn't really help with trying to do standard coordinates for different regions
10:25 < kanzure> personally I'm not convinced that all brain atlas cartographers or anatomists really know what regions of the brain they are looking at.
10:25 < kanzure> "that's clearly the such and such region!"
10:32 -!- ybit [n=ybit@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap
10:32 < ybit> hmm, thinking about making rubber with a dandelion today, that XOR sharpie microfluidics
10:35 -!- kardan| [n=kardan@p54BE396E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
10:52 -!- cis-action [n=cis-acti@146-115-127-170.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
10:54 -!- cis-action [n=cis-acti@146-115-127-170.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Client Quit]
10:58 < kanzure> ybit: XOR? what?
10:58 < kanzure> rubber with a dandelion would be a good project for the day, ybit
11:06 < kanzure> oh, didn't see "sharpie"
11:07 < kanzure> anyway, if you can make a rubber microfluidics device from dandelion latex, you win teh internets
11:42 < ybit> not quite as scientific, seems we are making jelly and wine with dandelions and muskedimes
11:42 < ybit> as well as rubber... 
11:42 < ybit> a rubber microfluidics device? :)
11:58 -!- genehacker [n=chatzill@wireless-128-62-153-20.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap
12:18 -!- genehacker_ [n=chatzill@wireless-128-62-85-176.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap
12:23 -!- genehacker [n=chatzill@wireless-128-62-153-20.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
12:24 -!- genehacker_ is now known as genehacker
12:43 < kanzure> who is making jelly?
12:43 < kanzure> I must not be understanding your context, ybit
12:43 < kanzure> also, whistling seems to damage my neuroreceptors
12:47 -!- xp_prg [n=xp_prg3@99.2.31.217] has joined #hplusroadmap
12:50 -!- genehacker [n=chatzill@wireless-128-62-85-176.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
14:04 < ybit> we = my dad and myself, but i'll probably be making the jelly myself, but we will both partake in the creation of wine from muskedimes which it seems come in july
14:09 -!- samrose [n=samrose@h134-215-226-37.lnngmi.dedicated.static.tds.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
14:20 < ybit> has anyone actually tried making a rubber band from dandelions yet? it's difficult to extract much sap
14:20 < ybit> i've got a whole bunch dandelions and am having difficulty getting any sap from them
14:20 < ybit> very little has come out
14:26 < kanzure> aren't you supposed to centrifuge it or something?
14:26 < kanzure> are you reading the email that I sent to diybio?
14:27 < ybit> kanzure: yeah
14:28 < ybit> i'm reading the email but it doesn't mention centrifuge
14:28 < kanzure> okay
14:28 < kanzure> it probably doesn't because I'm confusing that with another memory
14:29 < kanzure> you should read the links I mention in it, which is from where I found the dandelion/latex stuff
14:29 < kanzure> STUFF!
14:29 < kanzure> SCIENCE!
14:30 < ybit> https://kb.osu.edu/dspace/bitstream/1811/35948/1/OS_ENG_v26_i05_020.pdf
14:30 < ybit> Agriculture's Rubber, from Ohio State University
14:31 < ybit> there's only one link and it mentions ohio state getting a large grant to make rubber from a russian dandelion
14:31 < ybit> you can apparently make rubber from soybeans
14:32 < ybit>                               However, the plant
14:32 < ybit> produces an appreciable amount of rubber only
14:32 < ybit> when there is an approximately equal wet and dry
14:32 < ybit> season, and the wet season cannot be very wet
14:32 < ybit>                               However, the plant
14:32 < ybit> produces an appreciable amount of rubber only
14:32 < ybit> when there is an approximately equal wet and dry
14:32 < ybit> season, and the wet season cannot be very wet
14:32 < ybit> whoops
14:33 < ybit> From accumulating evidence it is believed that
14:33 < ybit> guayule stores rubber under its bark only through
14:33 < ybit> a rainless season. Nevertheless, it requires mois-
14:33 < ybit> ture for growth, and locations suitable for its cul-
14:33 < ybit> ture are few.
14:35 < ybit> note, guayule != dandelion
14:36 < ybit> and the it seems the russian dandelion, wait for it.. native to russia
14:36 < ybit> so i'm guessing not just any dandelion will do
14:36 < ybit> on a positive note:   The alkale deserts of six western states hold
14:36 < ybit> 500,000,000 pounds of natural rubber—sufficient
14:36 < ybit> to last the United States for five months—avail-
14:36 < ybit> able for immediate harvesting, according to Uni-
14:36 < ybit> versity of California scientists.
14:37 < ybit> ""
14:42 < ybit> so, scratch that idea for today
14:43 < ybit> i'll try a few other diybio ideas floating around just as soon as i get time this afternoon
14:54 < kanzure> 7-up as protoslow might be sufficiently easy if you have a microscope nearby
14:54 < kanzure> or if you want to construct a microscope with a water drop and some glass slides and some wood frame thingy (or maybe made out of cardboard if you have some of that laying around)
15:00 < ybit> thinking i might do something like the water droplet microscope and plan on making a thermocycler this weekend
15:01 < ybit> or at least start construction tomorrow
15:01 < ybit> or tonight, depends on how much time i have and how long it takes to decide on a plan
15:01 < ybit> looking at the heybryan.org/~bbishop/docs.thermocycler.pdf doc right now
15:02 < ybit> /docs/ **
15:05 < kanzure> oh really? I thought hte server was down.
15:05 < kanzure> in fact, I know it is.
15:18 < kanzure> hm. I need the definitions of f-circuit and f-cutset that I pasted in here a while back.
15:18  * kanzure goes to dig through logs
15:21 < ybit> i have mirroring heybryan.org
15:22 < ybit> have been*
15:28 < kanzure> hrm. maybe you're the one who has been causing me troubles. 
15:28 < kanzure> have you been doing it daily recently?
15:34 -!- samrose [n=samrose@h134-215-226-37.lnngmi.dedicated.static.tds.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
15:38 < ybit> nope, it was a weekly thing around sunday
15:38 < ybit> but my computer want by shooting for your server this weekend, it's f'd 
15:39 < ybit> and all it does now is check to see if anything has changed, it's grabbed mostly everything there
15:39 < kanzure> eh well I had to turn it off because I was only getting 5 KB/sec outgoing at home
15:39 < ybit> sunday @ 1am i believe
15:39 < kanzure> "turn it off" as in, not connect it to port 8
15:39 < ybit> yikes
15:39 < kanzure> 80
15:39 < fenn> http://www.logarithmic.net/pfh/blog/01194868073   web of science (for realz)
15:41  * ybit is off to compare workbenches at lowe's and home depot to the ones i've already found
16:00 -!- samrose [n=samrose@h134-215-226-37.lnngmi.dedicated.static.tds.net] has quit ["Ex-Chat"]
16:02 -!- ybit [n=ybit@unaffiliated/ybit] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)]
16:05 -!- genehacker [n=chatzill@cpe-67-9-157-136.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
16:08 -!- genehacker [n=chatzill@cpe-67-9-157-136.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
16:19 -!- kardan| [n=kardan@p54BE396E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)]
16:27 -!- anthonyl [n=duzt@dsl093-216-054.aus1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
17:02 -!- ybit [n=ybit@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap
17:11 < ybit> the $25 thermocycler isn't a bad option
17:11 < fenn> indeed
17:12 < ybit> even thought it's roughly $100
17:12 < fenn> but it needs a fan and possibly a valve to let the air out
17:12 < ybit> though*
17:13 < kanzure> fenn and his ninja magic
17:13 < kanzure> he just got here and hasn't typed anything
17:13 < kanzure> and yet I see things from him
17:20 -!- kardan| [n=kardan@p54BE5E1E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
17:44 < ybit> irc on cell phone perhaps?
17:45  * ybit is considering purchasing http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000HDG0AO/ref=ord_cart_shr?%5Fencoding=UTF8&m=AKJ57Q9VZBBO8&v=glance
17:46 < ybit> Aoyue 968 SMD Digital Hot Air Rework Station
17:46 < ybit> not the best, but it's the only decent soldering station i can find with a hot air gun and still relatively cheap
17:58 -!- kardan| [n=kardan@p54BE5E1E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
18:09 -!- any73341293 [n=someone@75-120-217-181.dyn.centurytel.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
18:17 -!- kardan| [n=kardan@p54BE5E1E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
18:21 -!- any72720259 [n=someone@99.194.250.28] has joined #hplusroadmap
18:21 -!- katsmeow-afk [n=someone@99.194.249.149] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
18:21 -!- any72720259 is now known as katsmeow-afk
18:23 < fenn> http://www.theonion.com/content/video/experts_agree_giant_razor_clawed?utm_source=a-section
18:23 < fenn> Experts Agree Giant, Razor-Clawed Bioengineered Crabs Pose No Threat
18:25 -!- any29798921 [n=someone@75-120-32-145.dyn.centurytel.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
18:25 < kanzure> when I bring my giant razor-clawed bioengineered crabs to them, we'll see who's who.
18:29 < fenn> who's who in mad science?
18:30 -!- any35269274 [n=someone@75-120-37-187.dyn.centurytel.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
18:30 -!- katsmeow-afk [n=someone@99.194.250.28] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
18:30 -!- any35269274 is now known as katsmeow-afk
18:31 < ybit> the urinomics projects/spectrophotometer, i like it
18:31 < ybit> i have an extra arduino lying around
18:31 < kanzure> http://science.slashdot.org/story/09/06/12/0352217/Teen-Diagnoses-Her-Own-Disease-In-Science-Class?art_pos=20
18:31 < kanzure> teen diagnoses herself, doesn't die
18:31 < fenn> why? it barely works. are they even getting quantitiative data from it?
18:32 < ybit> i don't think they have produced anything yet
18:32 < fenn> it's just some LED's stuck to an arduino
18:38 -!- any73341293 [n=someone@75-120-217-181.dyn.centurytel.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
18:44 < kanzure> blink blink blink
18:44 < kanzure> look, science!
18:44 -!- any29798921 [n=someone@75-120-32-145.dyn.centurytel.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
18:46 -!- elias`_ [n=c@host86-159-170-69.range86-159.btcentralplus.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
19:01 -!- elias` [n=c@unaffiliated/elias/x-342423] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
19:01 -!- elias`_ is now known as elias`
19:05 < ybit> making the microscope right now
19:11 < ybit> wow, i need my glasses to see through that tiny hole
19:11 < ybit> you know your hand can magnify as well, right?
19:11 < kanzure> with water on it
19:11 < ybit> you = anyone
19:13 < ybit> no water required
19:14 < ybit> having a tough time finding a link
19:14 < ybit> may just have to take a pic of my hand formation
19:15 < ybit> all you do is curl your fingers into a fist and use the hole as the magnifying glass, may take a little practice, but it does magnify about 1.5x
19:15 < kanzure> http://code.google.com/p/python-graph/
19:16 < kanzure> I've done that before. doesn't seem to work much though.
19:16 < ybit> alright, time to go test out the paperclip microscopes :)
19:29 < ybit> it works
19:29 < ybit> a pita to use though :P
19:30 < ybit> i'm about to be blown away by the storm here
19:34 < ybit> anyone have the pdfs linked to from http://groups.google.com/group/diybio/browse_thread/thread/bf7f21047d4499e7/489c2e38afd56d82?lnk=raot&pli=1
19:35 < ybit> "microscopes out of water"
20:06 < ybit> i'd also like http://heybryan.org/books/papers/Capillary%20flow%20control%20using%20hydrophobic%20patterns.pdf
20:07 < ybit> nm, on the serverftp.org site
20:11 < ybit> not the water microscope papers though
20:13 -!- duzt [n=duzt@dsl093-216-054.aus1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
20:23 -!- anthonyl [n=duzt@dsl093-216-054.aus1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
20:33 -!- any24458891 [n=someone@75-120-10-52.dyn.centurytel.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
20:34 -!- any56543388 [n=someone@75-120-40-62.dyn.centurytel.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
20:34 -!- katsmeow-afk [n=someone@75-120-37-187.dyn.centurytel.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
20:34 -!- any56543388 is now known as katsmeow-afk
20:38 -!- any65798386 [n=someone@99.194.251.74] has joined #hplusroadmap
20:40 -!- any24458891 [n=someone@75-120-10-52.dyn.centurytel.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)]
20:42 -!- any64265182 [n=someone@75-120-3-231.dyn.centurytel.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
20:42 -!- katsmeow-afk [n=someone@75-120-40-62.dyn.centurytel.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
20:42 -!- any64265182 is now known as katsmeow-afk
20:43 -!- xp_prg [n=xp_prg3@99.2.31.217] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"]
20:45 -!- any70767341 [n=someone@75-120-42-36.dyn.centurytel.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
20:59 -!- any65798386 [n=someone@99.194.251.74] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
21:02 -!- katsmeow-afk [n=someone@75-120-3-231.dyn.centurytel.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
21:03 < ybit> probably behind, but wow: http://citsci.blogspot.com/2009/05/for-diybio-lab.html
21:03 < ybit> that's a lot interesting ideas for a la
21:04 -!- anthonyl [n=duzt@dsl093-216-054.aus1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
21:06 < ybit> it gave me an idea, when i get the neorunner in october, maybe it can be my oscillope
21:14 -!- duzt [n=duzt@dsl093-216-054.aus1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
21:18 < kanzure> - count the number of incoming edges for each node. O(n+e)
21:18 < kanzure> - put each node with 0 incoming edges in a set S. O(n)
21:18 < kanzure> - while S has nodes:
21:18 < kanzure> - take a node n from S.
21:18 < kanzure> - delete n and update the number of incoming edges of the nodes connected to n. if any of those nodes now have 0 incoming edges, put them in S.
21:18 < kanzure> - endwhile O(n+e)
21:18 < kanzure> - if S is empty put there are still nodes left, you have cycle.
21:21 < drazak_> can someone explain me the difference between weight and mass, and why this difference is important?
21:27 < kanzure> weight is a force that results from the action of gravity on a mass
21:31 < drazak_> hmph
21:31 < drazak_> I mean
21:31 < drazak_> I knew that
21:31 -!- any70767341 is now known as katsmeow
21:32 < drazak_> in absense of gravity, how does one measure mass?
21:33 < kanzure> probably by accelerating it to the speed of light or something
21:34 < kanzure> maybe mass isn't the right idea in the first place?
21:34 < kanzure> gravity is one of those sketchy thingies
21:35 < drazak_> so in absense of gravity, I can't measure reactions for chemistry?
21:35 < kanzure> what?
21:35 < drazak_> er
21:36 < drazak_> reactants, for a chemical reaction
21:36 < kanzure> mass spec?
21:36 < drazak_> that seems way too complicated
21:37 < ybit> kanzure: can you link me to the papers linked from https://mail.google.com/mail/?shva=1#inbox/12024144c38c1dd6
21:37 < kanzure> what the fuck is that link
21:38 < ybit> it's your 'microscopes out of water' diybio post
21:39 < ybit> looking for the papers mentioned @ the bottom
21:39 < ybit> Water-drop projector
21:39 < ybit> http://heybryan.org/books/papers/Water-drop%20projector.pdf
21:39 < ybit> Water droplet lens microscope and microphotographs
21:39 < ybit> http://heybryan.org/books/papers/Water%20droplet%20lens%20microscope%...
21:39 < ybit> Fast focusing using a pinned-contact oscillating liquid lens
21:39 < kanzure> yeah that should be on http://adl.serveftp.org/papers/
21:39 < ybit> hmmm
21:39 < kanzure> or not
21:39 < ybit> :)
21:40 < ybit> yeah, already looked
21:40 < kanzure> well it's in the .tar file in there
21:42 < ybit> ah, okay.. then i wasn't looking in the correct place on me puter
21:50 < ybit> Capillary flow control using hydrophobic patterns.pdf
21:50 < ybit> ack
21:50 < ybit> not finding Water-drop-projector.pdf
21:51 < ybit> maybe i chroot into the machine and use locate
21:52 < ybit> nope, that didn't show anything
21:54 < kanzure> did you look in the tar file?
21:55 < kanzure> anyway it's a drop of water on the bottom of a syringe
21:55 < kanzure> and a laser attached to it
21:55 < kanzure> so it's a shadow-based projector of whatever the hell is in the water drop
21:58 < ybit> yeah, i had extracted the files to a particular location previously
21:58 < ybit> anywho
22:17 < ybit> btw, bryan, i went ahead and removed the mirror heybyran.org cron task 
23:13 < fenn> drazak_: resonance frequency depends on mass and is easily measured
23:14 -!- genehacker [n=chatzill@cpe-67-9-157-136.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
23:14 < fenn> it's how quadrupole mass spec's work actually
23:15 < fenn> but you'd probably be doing something with springs (super fancy quartz springs no doubt)
23:15 < genehacker> hmmmm....
23:15 < fenn> don't get too excited now
23:19 < genehacker> now where can I get thin film polyethylene sandwiching a layer of metal...
23:19 < fenn> they dont make polyethylene with enough purity for high voltage insulation since the 60's
23:19 < fenn> sorry dude
23:20 < fenn> get a better dielectric. barium titanate might be up to it
23:21 < genehacker> is barium titanate flexible?
23:21 < fenn> no
23:21 < genehacker> errr... just metal coated polyethylene
23:21 < fenn> well.. everything is rather flexible if you make it thin enough
23:21 < genehacker> guess
23:21 < genehacker> so
23:22 < genehacker> this one company makes flexible diamond sheets
23:26 < genehacker> really really thin films
23:33 < genehacker> I wonder if you can make flexible barium titanate films
23:33 < genehacker> on plastic or metal
23:34 < fenn> what do people do for fun on the weekends?
23:34 < fenn> in austin, in summer
23:35 < genehacker> I'm not sure
23:35 < fenn> surely someone must know
23:39 < genehacker> i'm trying translate a patent into a useful algorithm for generating gear profiles
23:39 < genehacker> http://www.google.com/patents?id=VzkhAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4&source=gbs_summary_r&cad=0_0#PPA19,M1
23:42 -!- katsmeow is now known as katsmeow-afk