--- Log opened Mon Oct 20 00:00:20 2014
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00:25 < archels> hmm, what was that short story again where human lifetimes are limitless, and we follow this one couple trying to make contact with a population at the centre of the Milky Way as their last big thing?
01:13 < ebowden> paperbot: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24858680
01:13 < paperbot> http://libgen.org/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1016%2Fj.jbiotec.2014.05.005
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01:24 < bkero> paperbot will get any paper off pubmed?
01:24 < bkero> Fuck yeah!
01:25 < bkero> kanzure: is that like Maddox's gambit? (the infecting 4 of yours)
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03:39 < FourFire> Has anyone in here seen anything about 3D printed (bipedal) exoskeletons ?
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04:29 < ebowden> paperbot: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22954616
04:29 < paperbot> http://libgen.org/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1177%2F0269881112458728
04:33 < ebowden> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19741506
04:33 < paperbot> http://libgen.org/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1097%2FFBP.0b013e328331ba1b
04:35 < ebowden> paperbot: http://journals.lww.com/behaviouralpharm/pages/articleviewer.aspx?year=2009&issue=10000&article=00014&type=abstract
04:35 < paperbot> http://libgen.org/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1097%2FFBP.0b013e328331ba1b
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06:49 < JayDugger> archels, been done in Vinge's Marooned in Realtime.
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07:16 < kanzure> what
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08:21 < JayDugger> archels asked "hmm, what was that short story again where human lifetimes are limitless, and we follow this one couple trying to make contact with a population at the centre of the Milky Way as their last big thing?"
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08:24 < kanzure> i don't know what i was whating
08:25 < drethelin> clearly you should sleep
08:29 < JayDugger> Sure. First, do you know anyone who wants to work at SpaceX? We've a headhunter sniffing among my co-workers for someone who doesn't mind working 80+ hour weeks on avionics and electronics.
08:30 < JayDugger> Only ex-military need apply. For some reason--probably as a filter for an inability to do arithmetic necessary to figure hours per week from the salary range and hourly wage the headhunter provides.
08:31 < kanzure> rough
08:32 < drethelin> maybe they want people who can keep opsec
08:33 < kanzure> military ain't got a great track record there
08:33 < JayDugger> Perhaps, but I prefer my theory about poor arithmetic skills better.
08:33 < drethelin> depends what you compare it to, presumably
08:33 < drethelin> plenty of military tech has been unknown for years before it gets declassified
08:33 < JayDugger> Nobody has a good track record on that point. You don't hear about the ones that do.
08:34 < kanzure> is this your way of bragging
08:34 < JayDugger> (Yes, yes, biased sample vs. absence of evidence != evidence of absence.)
08:34 < JayDugger> No.
08:34 < kanzure> he means yes :)
08:35 < JayDugger> I'd like to do something nice for the headhunter in case I need them.
08:35 < kanzure> nobody comes to mind
08:35 < JayDugger> Ouch.
08:35 < kanzure> ex-military doesn't tend to intersect these parts
08:35 < kanzure> not much, anyway
08:35 < JayDugger> Both fair points.
08:36 < drethelin> I know a guy in the air force
08:36 < drethelin> but I doubt he's up for hire any time soon
08:38 < JayDugger> Orion International's the headhunting firm. They've been around since 1975, so they might well be around for some time yet.
08:39 < JayDugger> When your acquaintance separates from the service, he or she could do worse than to work with them.
08:48 < fenn> if they want people with hands-on experience with space hardware who aren't from NASA or ULA, that leaves precious little besides ex-military
08:50 < fenn> russians mostly
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08:57 < fenn> i bet this is where the star wars "pod racer" idea came from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scaled_Composites_Pond_Racer
09:06 < fenn> (front side view) http://www.aafo.com/gallery/07-23-01.htm
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09:11 < fenn> pond racer documentary (in german) http://youtube.com/watch?v=66q4awWPArM
09:12 < fenn> hard to believe the damn thing flies
09:13 < archels> what. fuck you
09:13 < archels> that's Dutch, not German
09:13 < fenn> ha sorry
09:14 < fenn> i don't know either
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09:28 < kanzure> .title https://coderwall.com/p/_s_xda
09:28 < yoleaux> Mike Bloy : Fix SSH agent in reattached tmux session shells
09:28 < kanzure> .title https://gist.github.com/martijnvermaat/8070533
09:28 < yoleaux> SSH agent forwarding and screen
09:28 < DonnchaC_> kanzure: Just reading some scrollback, have you seen IPFS?
09:29 < DonnchaC_> http://static.benet.ai/t/ipfs.pdf
09:32 < kanzure> there seems to be no mention of speed of light constraints here
09:32 < kanzure> this smells a little bit like dalrymple/davidad
09:33 < kanzure> argh what's the point of writing any of this up if there are no statements made about how it solves interplanetary problems
09:34 < DonnchaC_> He's really not focusing on the real problems, moving data faster than the speed of light:P
09:35 < kanzure> i'm not claiming that you have to move it faster than that
09:35 < kanzure> but your system does have to be designed to not assume an instantly synchronous network across large time/light delays
09:42 < fenn> delay tolerant networking has plenty of uses here on earth
09:43 < kanzure> sure
09:43 < kanzure> DonnchaC_: so what's the incentive in ipfs to store anything at all?
09:43 < fenn> i dont get why this paper is called "interplanetary"
09:44 < kanzure> it looks like the optimal strategy is to just serve requests by asking another peer first, and then returning the data to whoever asked you
09:45 < kanzure> (instead of storing data locally)
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09:47 < kanzure> haha davidad jumped ship "He works for Twitter as an engineer as of May, 2014."
09:47 < fenn> :(
09:47 < kanzure> so much for nemaload
09:48 < kanzure> http://blog.davidad.net/post/70566989179/cryptotransactions
09:48 < fenn> a worm's gotta eat
09:53 < archels> hmm sounds interesting https://gist.githubusercontent.com/anonymous/7e9afeed38314e8de99a/raw/29270821c743db4a452599d35b36dcdabc90b959/gistfile1.txt
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09:57 < fenn> i'm betting it looks like a dinosaur
09:57 < fenn> rawr
09:57 < fenn> (the brain's feature priorities in visual search)
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10:04 < kanzure> fenn, i bought a stenography machine (elan cybra)
10:04 < kanzure> turns out their usb protocol is proprietary
10:04 < kanzure> "buy our $5000 software license to proceed"
10:04 < kanzure> i was going to reverse engineer their usb protocol and dump it into plover
10:04 < kanzure> instead i got sidetracked trying to reverse engineer their license serial code stuff
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10:05 < fenn> protocol would be better anyway
10:05 < fenn> arent those things ridiculously expensive though
10:07 < drethelin> how different is a stenography machine than a regular keyboard?
10:07 < drethelin> and/or how does it compare to a twiddler
10:07 < kanzure> http://stenoknight.com/twotripods.jpg
10:07 < fenn> it's more ergonomic than a twiddler and has less keys than a keyboard
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10:08 < drethelin> that thing looks like a sinister torture device
10:08 < chris_99> anyone ever used a digital pen on a sort of related topic
10:08 < kanzure> keys are backed by mechanical levers basically
10:08 < fenn> what is a digital pen
10:08 < drethelin> what sort of typing speed are you looking to get out of it?
10:08 < chris_99> sec
10:08 < kanzure> you know, the toy from leapfrog that reads the word you highlight in your ebook
10:08 < drethelin> 150+?
10:08 < chris_99> http://www.wacom.com/en/gb/creative/inkling
10:08 < kanzure> drethelin: well i type 196 wpm on qwerty so i need something like 250-300 wpm to make this worth my time
10:09 < drethelin> oof
10:09 < drethelin> 196 is pretty impressive
10:09 < kanzure> yes well i'm on lots of drugs
10:09 < drethelin> I average around 100 on a laptop
10:09 < drethelin> hehe
10:09 < drethelin> fair enough
10:09 < kanzure> http://www.seanwrona.com/typeracer/profile.php?username=kanzure
10:10 < drethelin> impressive
10:10 < fenn> chris_99: apparently they can lose sync slightly and not pick up lots of small cross hatches
10:10 < chris_99> hmm, i only want it for writing
10:10 < fenn> well you're probably fine then
10:10 < drethelin> http://www.seanwrona.com/typeracer/profile.php?username=drethelin
10:10 < kanzure> drethelin: http://typeracer.com/
10:10 < drethelin> oh I have to import
10:12 < drethelin> 105 just now
10:12 < drethelin> drinking coffee but didn't sleep
10:12 < drethelin> maybe I should take some modafinil and see the effect
10:14 < fenn> piracetam goes better with caffeine fwiw
10:14 < drethelin> yeah but I don't have that on hand
10:15 < drethelin> i might have it somewhere but I'm not sure where
10:15 < fenn> maybe we should research glial cell activation supplements
10:15 < drethelin> I don't regularly use nootropics because I'm an unproductive slob
10:15 < fenn> that doesn't make any sense
10:15 < drethelin> sure it does
10:15 < drethelin> if I'm gonna be spending the day lounging around and internetting what do I need nootropics for?
10:16 < kanzure> uh...
10:17 < fenn> so you're skipping sleep to do a half-assed job of internetting?
10:17 < kanzure> besides the regular things wrong with that statement, what's wrong with using the internet plus nootropis?
10:17 < kanzure> *nootropics
10:17 < drethelin> no I'm skipping sleep because I'm a piece of shit
10:17 < fenn> maybe you think you're a piece of shit because you skip sleep
10:17 < drethelin> kanzure nothing, just the increased benefits are not necesarrily worth the effort involved
10:17 < drethelin> I like internetting on modafinl
10:18 < drethelin> when I was using piracetam I didn't subjectively notice much difference
10:19 < fenn> it primarily affects word recall and reduces caffeine-induced error
10:21 < fenn> most people don't notice any subjective difference, especially without knowing what to look for
10:21 < kanzure> well this is neat https://github.com/hashicorp/terraform/tree/master/examples/consul
10:21 < drethelin> that's fair
10:22 < fenn> anyway i suggest reevaluating your logic
10:22 < drethelin> what part do you see the error in?
10:23 < fenn> "no point in trying to improve myself because i'm unproductive"
10:24 < drethelin> insofar as I'm doing things with no measurable output, I can only improve in terms of subjective experience
10:24 < drethelin> so if piracetam has no noticeable difference but makes me make like
10:24 < drethelin> 10 percent fewer typos
10:24 < drethelin> it doesn't seem worth the effort to take the pills
10:25 < fenn> measure something different then
10:26 < drethelin> why?
10:26 < kanzure> are you depressed?
10:26 < drethelin> I don't think so
10:26 < drethelin> just unambitious
10:28 < fenn> i'm not saying piracetam is the answer to all your problems. it sounds like you have low self esteem and motivation and are stuck in an unstimulating environment
10:28 < drethelin> nah I'm pretty great
10:28 < drethelin> I do have pretty low motivation
10:28 < drethelin> but when I say unproductive I'm not using it in an entirely derogatory manner
10:28 < drethelin> eg I view reading fiction books as unproductive
10:29 < drethelin> but I wouldn't call it unstimulating
10:29 < fenn> here's a differential diagnosis technique; drink a can of diet soda (with nutrasweet/aspartame) on an empty stomach and see if you feel more excited about stuff in general
10:29 < drethelin> if I reframe it as living a life of leisure maybe it will be more clear to you
10:29 < drethelin> hmm
10:29 < drethelin> I just had a whole butter  coffee
10:30 < drethelin> does sucralose work?
10:30 < drethelin> I have a can of whipcream next to me with sucralose
10:30 < fenn> no. aspartame is converted to dopamine, and other stuff
10:30 < fenn> sucralose is just imitation sugar
10:31 < drethelin> huh, didn't know that
10:32 < fenn> it should take about an hour
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10:33 < drethelin> I might do it later
10:33 < drethelin> I don't want another soda's worth of caffeine right this second
10:33 < fenn> if you are low on sleep it may just make you extremely irritable
10:33 < nmz787_i> kanzure: so I was grepping the logs for freecad, but didn't check the surrounding lines... but it seems you have been using it. Does that mean you were working on the backend (I saw you said you didn't want to support opencascade)
10:34 < nmz787_i> kanzure: what have you been working on for the nurbs intersection stuff?
10:35 < drethelin> I'm definitely low on sleep
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10:39 < fenn> join us next time on IRC MD
10:39 < nmz787_i> kanzure: seen this? .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=suv90ahXa5s&feature=plcp
10:39 < nmz787_i> .title
10:39 < yoleaux> Transitioning from NURBS to T-Splines - YouTube
10:45 < archels> T-splines stuff is all closed source/proprietary afaik
10:47 < kanzure> nmz787_i: http://verbnurbs.com/
10:47 < kanzure> i also have a python implementation called lolcad that i haven't git pushed in a long, long time, but at the moment verbnurbs is more featureful
10:48 < kanzure> if you really /must/ use freecad then the only way worth using is https://github.com/dcowden/cadquery
10:48 < archels> can that do anything that OpenNURBS cannot?
10:49 < kanzure> yes, it has tests
10:49 < archels> or is that just Atwood's law in action
10:49 < archels> what sort of test--intersections?
10:49 < kanzure> every feature is correctly tested
10:49 < kanzure> opennurbs does not distribute tests
10:49 < kanzure> so it makes it rather hard to maintain
10:50 < nmz787_i> is opennurbs in opencascade?
10:50 < kanzure> no
10:50 < kanzure> opennurbs is from the rhino cad people
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10:51 < kanzure> brlcad uses opennurbs
10:52 < kanzure> but python-brlcad can't expose opennurbs because opennurbs is c++, whereas python-brlcad is only a ctypes-based wrapper (for c parts)...
10:53 < archels> nurbs++ has a subdirectory called 'tests'
10:53 < archels> never really checked it out though
10:53 < nmz787_i> hrmm
10:53 < nmz787_i> so verb doesn't have an interactive curve editor GUI does it?
10:53 < kanzure> no
10:54 < kanzure> that guy is using it on a proprietary cad site he's been working on
10:54 < kanzure> i don't remember the name of his web cad app thingy
10:54 < nmz787_i> I'd want an editor GUI, then I'd need some way to slice the model and convert slices into a beam raster format
10:55 < nmz787_i> python isn't necessary I guess, but that is likely what I would use to convert a slice to a beam raster file
10:56 < kanzure> your gui requirement already radically increases development time and requirements
10:56 < kanzure> you might as well just use freecad and save every 5 seconds (because it crashes a bunch)
10:57 < nmz787_i> kanzure: do any of these do NURBs to surface tesselation? like if you don't give many control points, some kind of iterative/recursive smoothing?
10:57 < kanzure> without your gui requirement i would say the whole thing would be 10-30x easier
10:57 < kanzure> all of them do tessellation for nurbs rendering
10:57 < nmz787_i> but then I'd be left to develop my own GUI
10:58 < nmz787_i> well I guess I want to know if the chunky/blocky examples on verbnurbs.com could be smoothed with something already existing in the NURBS definition/implementation
10:58 < nmz787_i> 'calculateMoreSmoothness'
10:58 < nmz787_i> or something
11:00 < nmz787_i> kanzure: also without the GUI, wouldn't I have to tweak some NURBS values, display, tweak then display, tweak then display... so isn't that basically a GUI?
11:03 < kanzure> who knows, i'm not prepared to guess what your expectations are
11:04 < nmz787_i> what would you propose for non-gui model development?
11:08 < kanzure> cadquery is pretty nice, but it fails when you use numbers between 0.47 and 0.5
11:09 < kjskjskjs> fenn: nice gears!
11:09 < kjskjskjs> jrayhawk_: sorry I missed you
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11:40 < kanzure> blah https://github.com/hashicorp/terraform/issues/451
11:41 < kanzure> "Valid point and is needed at times, i.e. for organisations that need to have completely separated accounts for Ops live/staging."
11:41 < kanzure> in other words, people are running production and staging and other environments using the same credentials?
11:45 < drethelin> assuming you don't get injured, is it better to lift a heavier weight fewer times or the other way around?
11:45 < drethelin> I can't remember
11:45 < drethelin> but my phone just reminded me to exercise
11:45 < kanzure> steroids.
11:45 < kanzure> less risk of physical injury
11:46 < drethelin> don't those still require exercise?
11:46 < kanzure> no
11:46 < drethelin> plus they have emotional side effects
11:46 < kanzure> yawn
11:46 < drethelin> those seem obnoxious
11:46 < kanzure> there's a lot of disinformation about steroids
11:46 < drethelin> then again that could just be a stereotype
11:46 < drethelin> yeah
11:46 < drethelin> like cocaine myths compared to reasonable use
11:47 < drethelin> and marijuana propaganda
11:47 < drethelin> anyway
11:47 < drethelin> I don't have steroids here right now
11:47 < drethelin> but I do have weighs
11:47 < Viper168> dunno, I have seen roid rage a the least
11:48 < Viper168> dude beat up his girlfriend, as well as choked out another friend
11:48 < kanzure> what's the difference between roid rage and normal rage
11:48 < drethelin> I think it's a little hard to anecdotally distinguish roid rage from strong hypermasculinity
11:48 < Viper168> normally wasn't that kind of person
11:48 < Viper168> kanzure, normal rage is caused by incidents that tend to call for it more
11:48 < Viper168> roid rage it's stupid bullshit a lot of the time, and escalates quickly
11:49 < kanzure> those damn dirty drug users
11:49 < kanzure> someone should declare a war against drugs or something
11:49 < Viper168> *is
11:49 < Viper168> irritability increases
11:49 < Viper168> and self control can't keep up
11:50 < kanzure> that also sounds like bullshit
11:50 < kanzure> why can't i have roid rage and perfect self control?
11:50 < drethelin> you probably can if you mix your drugs right
11:50 < kanzure> huh?
11:50 < Viper168> maybe if you are already equipped with ridiculous self control
11:50 < Viper168> but most people aren't
11:50 < kanzure> no i mean, if i am choking you, maybe it's because i want to be choking you
11:50 < kanzure> that's self-control
11:50 < Viper168> kanzure, maybe it's because your hormones and shit are whacked out
11:51 < kanzure> so what?
11:51 < Viper168> caused by steroids
11:51 < Viper168> this guy I know would have never resorted to violence so quickly
11:51 < Viper168> it turned him inot a piece of shit
11:51 < Viper168> *into
11:51 < Viper168> I don't talk to him anymore because of it
11:51 < Viper168> no one in our group does
11:51 < kanzure> so it's completely impossible for this person to have changed his opinions about violence
11:52 < kanzure> maybe you're just a bad friend?
11:52 < Viper168> or it's the fact that he's on roids, and it started when he started them
11:52 < kanzure> your reasoning is flawless
11:52 < Viper168> pretty clear connection to the behavior
11:52 < Viper168> he stopped for a while and we started having him around for a while
11:52 < kanzure> i would be pretty enraged if i was subjected to this bullshit line of reasoning
11:53 < Viper168> but then all of a sudden he starts acting like a prick again and sure enough we find out he's back on them
11:54 < Viper168> right, it's bullshit to assume the one new thing he started doing is responsible for the drastic change in personality, especially when they are known for causing it
11:54 < drethelin> I think kanzure is just trollin you
11:54 < drethelin> or maybe he's roid raging at you
11:55 < kanzure> no, i am not trolling Viper168
11:55 < Viper168> yeah might as well be
11:55 < Viper168> both shitty behavior
11:55 < kanzure> yeah fuck rage, and anyone who experiences it
11:55 < kanzure> bunch of idiots huh
11:55 < Viper168> I've dealt with plenty of rage, natural rage
11:55 < Viper168> this was a distinct change in personality
11:56 < kanzure> so what?
11:56 < Viper168> not just getting pissed off
11:56 < Viper168> it ruined him as a person
11:56 < drethelin> kanzure, are you trying to argue that being somewhat angrier is a fine trade-off, or that it's a mythical symptom that doesn't actually exist
11:56 < Viper168> is what
11:56 < Viper168> I lost a friend because of it is what
11:56 < Viper168> because we couldn;t afford to be around him anymore, aside from the dickishness
11:57 < kanzure> drethelin: i think that Viper168 is full of shit, and he would have dropped his friend regardless of steroids or not
11:57 < Viper168> starts choking people out because of a stupid disagreement
11:57 < Viper168> something he never would have done before
11:57 < kanzure> drethelin: there's nothing wrong with dropping a friend, everyone does it eventually
11:57 < Viper168> kanzure, if he started acting like a violent douchebag without roids, then yes I would
11:57 < drethelin> kanzure: ignoring this specific example, do you think roid rage is a thing
11:58 < Viper168> but he didn't turn into one without, it was once he started them that he changed
11:58 < kanzure> well, i definitely believe that roid rage is a term that people know about
11:58 < kanzure> i also believe that steroids can impact behavior, but i don't think this is important
11:58 < Viper168> plus that little window hwere he was off them and was ok
11:58 < Viper168> until he started getting smaller and decided to go back to them
11:59 < Viper168> kanzure, well form the kind of attitudes I've seen form you that doesn;t surprise me
11:59 < Viper168> *from
11:59 < kanzure> why would it matter whether it was steroids or alcohol or whatever. who cares?
12:00 < drethelin> me?
12:00 < drethelin> I care?
12:00 < Viper168> I have a friend becoming a dick from drinking his ass off constantly too, and a similar response on my part is coming if he doesn;t shape up
12:00 < Viper168> both are bad
12:00 < drethelin> like I don't give a shit why some random guy gets angry
12:00 < drethelin> but if I take steroids and get really angry
12:00 < drethelin> that will be bad
12:00 < drethelin> so it's important to know whether that'[s a real thing
12:01 < kanzure> also, isn't the real problem violence, and not anger
12:01 < drethelin> to an extent yes
12:02 < drethelin> but subjectively, feeling angry is usually unpleasant
12:02 < drethelin> whether or not I'm violent
12:02 < Viper168> kanzure, when that violence is caused by uncontrollable anger from steroid use, then no you can;t divorce them
12:03 < kanzure> cpopell2: are any of the anabolic steroids addictive?
12:12 < drethelin> I guess we'll never know
12:12 < drethelin> anyway I did some squats with a kettlebell
12:13 < nmz787_i> kanzure did at one point seem to ask a question more like "do 'roids reduce self-control"
12:13 < nmz787_i> which it seems that most likely they do have some impact on
12:14 < kanzure> self-control is underspecified anyway
12:14 < drethelin> do people on steroids eat the marshmallow or do they wait for two marshmallows
12:16 < kanzure> screw that, go out and buy some
12:16 < nmz787_i> there's also likely some social taboo/ herd mentality crap going on too though, where the public concept of 'roids being bad impacts the users' self-image in a negative way... leading to impact in a negative way on the emotional state
12:16 < drethelin> yeah social context is super important
12:16 < drethelin> people in different countries react differently to alcohol based on how they are expected to
12:17 < drethelin> and I imagein the same could apply to steroids
12:17 < nmz787_i> so that society is says 'roids are bad makes the user more sensitive to negative comments on their behavior, making them pissed as a result
12:17 < drethelin> that too
12:17 < drethelin> kanzure if I could grab them from the corner store I probably would
12:17 < drethelin> but I'm fairly lazy
12:17 < drethelin> I would have to look for an online retailer
12:17 < nmz787_i> marshmallows and/or 'roids?
12:18 < drethelin> hmm I guess I'm not sure what kanzure meant by go out and by some
12:18 < kanzure> marshmallows
12:18 < drethelin> I assumed he was encouraging me to engage in a relatively low risk experiment
12:18 < drethelin> instead of relying on hearsay about steroids
12:19 < nmz787_i> this is the kind of bio experiment outsourcing bitcoin needs to enable
12:20 < kanzure> marshmallows should be easy to access
12:20 < kanzure> i'm just saying, if you're being put through some experiment about one or two or something, it's easier to just go buy your own
12:20 < nmz787_i> find two ppl in countries where they have marshmallows and steroids, but in which only one country finds it socially acceptable (or lacks the concept of finding them unacceptable)
12:21 < drethelin> I was just referencing the classic self control experiment
12:21 < kanzure> and i was citing a snarky way to corrupt the experiment's results
12:22 < nmz787_i> this looks like it is the code defining the verbnurbs.com background model http://verbnurbs.com/js/verb-index.js
12:23 < nmz787_i> but not what actually get's the model to the screen
12:25 < nmz787_i> kanzure: the verbnurbs guy is with AutoDesk
12:25 < nmz787_i> https://www.linkedin.com/in/ptrbyr
12:26 < kanzure> "on screen" well that's webgl and canvases
12:27 < kanzure> anyway i wouldn't recommend modifying control points by hand
12:27 < kanzure> instead just define some primitives, like a half-circle based on known control points and knobs or w/e
12:27 < kanzure> and then build shapes from those primitives
12:28 < nmz787_i> is this his project using verb that you mentioned? http://floodeditor.com/
12:28 < kanzure> iirc verbnurbs does not have surface-surface intersection yet but this might have changed recently
12:28 < kanzure> yes
12:29 < kanzure> he added curve-surface but no surface-surface yet https://github.com/pboyer/verb
12:29 < nmz787_i> oh, this is on github too https://github.com/pboyer/flood
12:29 < kanzure> here's a recent change.... https://github.com/pboyer/verb/commit/d642d08c3ae7162c111008cd3ccafad08f42d17d
12:29 < nmz787_i> so i guess it is separate from autodesk somehow
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12:31 < kanzure> well it's a wildly different implementation
12:37 < nmz787_i> i'd assume such a company would want any IP generated by employees that is similar in any way to their core IP
12:38 < kanzure> autodesk did not write their own cad kernel, actually
12:39 < kanzure> they licensed the acis kernel
12:42 < fenn> kjskjskjs: lcamtuf has an incredibly well done guide to resin casting of gears and robot parts, if you haven't seen it: http://lcamtuf.coredump.cx/rstory/ http://lcamtuf.coredump.cx/gcnc/ and also some cycloid gear stuff http://lcamtuf.coredump.cx/cycloid/
12:43 < fenn> .title
12:43 < yoleaux> cycloidal transmission
12:44 < fenn> hm
12:44 < fenn> "Guerrilla guide to CNC machining, mold making, and resin casting"
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12:51 < kanzure> evidence that aliens are real https://github.com/whatupdave/blockway/blob/master/tf/main.tf
12:51 < kanzure> terraform is pretty neat
13:07 < kjskjskjs> fenn: yes, I like it a lot
13:07 < kjskjskjs> although it looks like he has added new stuff to it
13:13 < kjskjskjs> so thank you very much :)
13:15 < jrayhawk_> the opportunity might arise again
13:17 < kanzure> nmz787_i: let me know if flood works at all or wut
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13:21 < nmz787_i> kanzure: might try later this week... idk how long setup will take since I've not worked with node.js before
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13:38 < kanzure> .wik weevil
13:38 < yoleaux> "A weevil is a type of beetle from the Curculionoidea superfamily. They are usually small, less than 6 millimetres (0.24 in), and herbivorous. There are over 60,000 species in several families, mostly in the family Curculionidae (the true weevils)." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weevil
13:38 < kanzure> just for the name
13:50 < kjskjskjs> my weevil strategy is freezers and PET bottles
13:53 < superkuh> paperbot: http://scitation.aip.org/content/aip/journal/rsi/84/10/10.1063/1.4827079
13:53 < paperbot> http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/Note%3A%20Repetitive%20operation%20of%20the%20capacitor%20bank%20of%20the%20low-voltage%20miniature%20plasma%20focus%20at%2050%20Hz.txt
13:54 < superkuh> paperbot: http://scitation.aip.org/deliver/fulltext/aip/journal/rsi/84/10/1.4827079.pdf
13:55 < paperbot> http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/Delivery%20Error.txt
14:00 < nmz787_i> superkuh: i emailed the cap company, have you done the same? any response?
14:00 < superkuh> I didn't.
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14:08 < kanzure> he was so disappointed that he /quit
14:18 < superkuh> The caps in question were almost certainly from a custom batch. There is no way I could afford a custom batch. The author of the journal articles saying they were $10 was probably disingenuous in some way. I can hardly trust someone who calls all capacitors "electrolytic capacitors".
14:20 < kjskjskjs> jrayhawk_: did you get any answers about memristors?
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14:21 < kjskjskjs> superkuh: have you asked the author?
14:21 < superkuh> Yes.
14:21 < kjskjskjs> it would be an easy mistake to make that any capacitor in a big round metal can is an electrolytic capacitor
14:21 < superkuh> Yeah. The blue fooled me for a while.
14:22 < superkuh> But you don't use electrolytics in that type of circuit.
14:22 < kjskjskjs> Because it needs to be AC?
14:22 < kjskjskjs> I haven't read the paper actually
14:23 < jrayhawk_> I didn't really have any questions.
14:23 < kjskjskjs> so feel free to tell me RTFOP
14:23 < kjskjskjs> jrayhawk_: aw. that's too bad. some people posted some in here.
14:23 < superkuh> High voltage reversal during the ringing down of the the pulse discharge.
14:24 < superkuh> So, yeah, AC.
14:24 < kjskjskjs> Right.
14:24 < jrayhawk_> I saw fenn being snarky, but that didn't seem worth passing on
14:27 < fenn> i expect the PI didn't build the machine and has a low opinion of people who know how to build things
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14:33 < kanzure> jrayhawk_: do you have any ideas for a situation where there's a bunch of git submodules, but you might have those repos otherwise checked out on your system, and you would like symlinks while still letting the git-repo-with-the-submodules control checkouts correctly?
14:34 < kanzure> oh, you can symlink into the submodules, rather than from the submodule's folder/path
14:35 < kanzure> which will preserve the parent repo's ability to control checkouts/working directories/whatever
14:35 < jrayhawk_> local clone operations link by default, but that's not quite optimal
14:35 < jrayhawk_> /usr/share/doc/git/contrib/workdir/git-new-workdir
14:36 < kanzure> but git operations in the symlinked one wont work because there's no .git in there. hmm. i'm not sure if this is bad though.
14:36 < jrayhawk_> git-new-workdir symlinks stuff within .git to do the maximally efficient thing
14:36 < jrayhawk_> while still allowing e.g. independent merge operations
14:37 < kanzure> huh.
14:37 < kanzure> that looks close. at least topical.
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15:02 < nmz787_i> this site won't stop pausing/freezing in the middle of a song
15:02 < nmz787_i> https://bleep.com/release/53848-aphex-twin-syro
15:03 < kanzure> these guys have been stalking me http://www.decentralbank.com/whitepaper
15:03 < kanzure> (i can stalk back, yo)
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15:07 < drethelin> why are they stalking you
15:09 < nmz787_i> luckily their URL naming scheme is incremental
15:10 < kanzure> drethelin: linkedin, so i assume because they want a programmer
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15:37 < nmz787_i> chris_99: idk if you might ever use wxPython, but I modified some code to display an opencv video stream in wxPython, and added some nifty ROI cropping stuff (shades areas outside the area to-be-cropped as you click-drag with mouse) http://stackoverflow.com/a/26457671/253127
15:37 < chris_99> cool, i was looking at opencv recently and their face recognition stuff
15:39 < nmz787_i> chris_99: I remember you posting that receipt scanner when I happened upon it myself a few weeks ago
15:39 < nmz787_i> i'll be playing with integrating this into the GUI this week https://github.com/Itseez/opencv/blob/master/samples/python2/find_obj.py
15:40 < chris_99> cool
15:42 < chris_99> i found this recently https://github.com/apresta/tagger
15:42 < chris_99> which works pretty well, at tagging docs
15:43 < kanzure> hm.
15:43 < kanzure> run it against this channel's logs
15:44 < chris_99> heh good idea
15:45 < chris_99> i'm working on making something that logs my computer usage (keypresses, websites visited etc) and infers stuff from them hopefully, so i wanted to use that with parts of it
15:45 < dingo> hey i'll use that tagger module
15:46 < ParahSailin_> PHP implements its arbitrary size arithmetic in C. However, it doesn’t have a BigInt data type, so its arbitrary size numerical functions take and return strings.
15:46 < dingo> my bbs messaing system uses tagging, i'll use it on that, thanks chris_99
15:46 < chris_99> cool
15:46 < kanzure> for bookmark tagging https://github.com/davidlazar/jotmuch
15:47 < chris_99> intriguing
15:53 < kanzure> $ ./jot count
15:53 < kanzure> 1659
15:54 < nmz787_i> $ ls /
15:54 < kanzure> bin
15:54 < nmz787_i> oh
15:55 < nmz787_i> but it wasn't a bot that replied
15:55 < fenn> Read error: device not found
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16:10 < kanzure> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_SoJUWoaYI
16:10 < yoleaux> Kajis - 60 Million Years (Original Mix) - YouTube
16:15 < kanzure> haha,
16:15 < kanzure> .title http://motherboard.vice.com/read/i-waited-five-months-for-my-soylent-and-now-i-cant-get-rid-of-it?trk_source=popular
16:15 < yoleaux> The secondary market for Soylent on Craigslist and Ebay | Motherboard
16:22 < kjskjskjs> ParahSailin_: sweet.  we should do that in shell
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16:29 < nmz787_i> http://www.amazon.com/SystemSure-Plus-Luminometer/dp/B004BXG10A#
16:29 < nmz787_i> 'Perfect tool for rapid assessment of ATP levels with ATP hygiene monitoring system'
16:29 < nmz787_i> $1300
16:30 < kanzure> hygiene?
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16:34 < kanzure> any guesses to whether or not scp to a remote server with a non-root user would be able to place a file in a regular /etc somewhere
16:35 < kanzure> ugh looks like my provision-stuff will have to copy them from an intermediate location
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16:35 < kjskjskjs> : user@debian:~; find /etc -type d -perm -002 -ls 2>/dev/null
16:35 < kjskjskjs> : user@debian:~;
16:35 < fenn> cannot touch ‘/etc/foo’: Permission denied
16:35 < kjskjskjs> no
16:36 < kanzure> is it roomy in there inside that head you two?
16:36 < fenn> i am feeling very confused today
16:36 < fenn> reading postmodernist structuralist discourse theory isnt helping
16:36 < kanzure> computational aether is just compensating for heat dissipation issues
16:37 < kjskjskjs> fenn: who, Foucault?
16:37 < kjskjskjs> I guess he's post-structuralist
16:37 < fenn> please, don't
16:37 < kanzure> hah
16:38 < kanzure> airbnb for fenn's headspace
16:38 < kanzure> banned by the state of new york, at least twice
16:39 < kanzure> banned by the state and city of new york, at least twice
16:39 < fenn> redundant redundancy for everyone everyone
16:39 < fenn> shack up in someone else's head for a day, take a load off
16:40 < kanzure> funny thing is kjskjskjs was trying to start a feminism discussion with me earlier
16:40 < kjskjskjs> actually I think you started it
16:40 < kanzure> (and i escaped)
16:40 < kanzure> no way
16:40 < kjskjskjs> I was just trying to answer your question
16:40 < kanzure> well that wasn't my intention
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17:33 < kanzure> http://venturebeat.com/2014/10/20/ranked-all-32-billion-dollar-mobile-internet-start-ups-report/
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18:05 < pasky> so twitter is still a startup? until when?
18:05 < kanzure> until they stop growing
18:07 < drethelin> startup is such an odd category
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19:24 < kjskjskjs> Twitter is still a startup?
19:25 < kjskjskjs> no they're not
19:25 < kjskjskjs> I could maybe see calling them a startup until they're profitable
19:25 < kjskjskjs> but that happened six months ago
19:26 < kanzure> startups can be profitable
19:26 < kjskjskjs> yes, but they stop being startups
19:26 < kanzure> i use this definition often http://www.paulgraham.com/growth.html
19:27 < kjskjskjs> Twitter also isn't growing at 3% or 5% per week!
19:27 < kanzure> "if you were once growing at that rate for more than a year then you are a startup and will probably continue to be called a startup"
19:28 < kjskjskjs> that's nonsense
19:28 < kanzure> probably
19:28 < kjskjskjs> the page doesn't even say that
19:30 < kanzure> oh, i didn't mean to imply that, sorry
19:30 < kanzure> but yes usually when i quote some text after dropping a link, i mean it came from the link
19:30 < kanzure> so you're not wrong to think it should have
19:30 < kjskjskjs> :)
19:30 < kjskjskjs> I was like "I don't remember Paul saying that"
19:30 < kjskjskjs> and ^F and nope!
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20:02 < kanzure> "The IRS says the costs of developing computer so closely resembles research and experimental expenses that it warrants similar accounting treatment. As a result, a taxpayer may use any of the following three methods for costs paid or incurred in developing software for a particular project, either for the taxpayer’s own use, or to be held by the taxpayer for sale or lease to others: (1) The costs may be consistently treated as current ...
20:02 < kanzure> ... expenses and deducted in full. (2) The costs may be consistently treated as capital expenses that are amortized ratably over 60 months from the date of completion of the software development. (3) The costs may be consistently treated as capital expenses and amortized ratably over 36 months from the date the software is placed in service. Under this method, the cost may also be eligible for a bonus first-year depreciation allowance."
20:02 < kjskjskjs> "developing computer"?
20:02 < kjskjskjs> should that be "developing computer software"?
20:02 < kanzure> i think so, but i don't know if the quote was verbatim
20:03 < kjskjskjs> I understand that certain antibiotics can help if you develop computer after initial exposure
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20:03 < kjskjskjs> those sound like reasonable approaches except for the "from the date of completion" idea
20:04 < kjskjskjs> presumably they don't let you use option #2 if the software was already placed in service?
20:05 < kanzure> backdating is often allowed for various things
20:06 < kjskjskjs> right, but that only helps you if you want to lower your book value
20:06 < kjskjskjs> which you can do more effectively by taking door #1
20:07 < kanzure> i feel like there's a tax monster behind all of these doors and there's no great option
20:07 < kjskjskjs> if instead you want to raise your book value (say, because you would like to avoid turning your net positive cash flow this year into a taxable profit) then #2 would seem to allow you to do so indefinitely
20:07 < kanzure> it's too bad that the irs has been taking a negative view on open source software lately as a charitable enterprise
20:07 < kanzure> although i wouldn't mind taking a tax break on all this software i write
20:08 < kjskjskjs> yeah
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22:15 < kanzure> .to sheena http://imgur.com/a/8DfqE
22:15 < yoleaux> kanzure: I'll pass your message to sheena.
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22:33 < nmz787> .to sheena why not just use a small plate?
22:33 < yoleaux> nmz787: I'll pass your message to sheena.
22:34 < nmz787> .to chris_99 http://www.reddit.com/r/opencv/ has some good links, been reading through SIFT and a few others on here http://aishack.in/category/computer-vision/
22:34 < yoleaux> nmz787: I'll pass your message to chris_99.
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23:54 < nmz787> paperbot: ttp://www.nature.com/nrd/journal/v12/n11/full/nrd4068.html
23:55 < nmz787> paperbot: http://www.nature.com/nrd/journal/v12/n11/full/nrd4068.html
23:55 < paperbot> ConnectionError: HTTPConnectionPool(host='libgen.org', port=80): Max retries exceeded with url: /scimag/librarian/form.php (Caused by <class 'socket.gaierror'>: [Errno -2] Name or service not known) (file "/usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/requests/adapters.py", line 375, in send)
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--- Log closed Tue Oct 21 00:00:22 2014