##hplusroadmap

--- Log opened Sun Jan 30 00:00:10 2011
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kanzure'Boy, Captain America over here! "Best of the best of the best, sir!" "With honors." Yeah, he's just really excited and he has no clue why we're here.'01:11
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Lukas___Good morning03:06
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fennis there a word for using a webcam to detect facial expression and sending only compressed version of the expression as a cartoon sort of thing? (webcam avatar sorta kinda works)04:55
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fennman, all the kinect avatars look like bobbleheads04:58
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Lukas__Good morning05:08
kanzurefenn: at least recommended because the book recommendations match what you've recently been reading,05:26
kanzurehttp://ynotds.com/05:26
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fennis this tony's book?05:26
fennhe's like the australian greg egan~05:27
JayDuggerYou know Greg Egan's an Australian, right?05:29
kanzurefenn: no i think he's just reaching retirement and wants a commemorative wall of text05:30
fennJayDugger: hence the snark mark05:32
JayDuggerSorry. I missed that.05:32
kanzure##hplusroadmap: an official sponsor of the snarkmark~05:32
JayDuggerI didn't know Egan was an Australian until the day after I left his hometown.05:32
JayDuggerSome people can't read faces. I have to guess at emoticons.05:32
JayDuggerFailing that, I need elevator shoes to help me catch what goes over my head.05:33
fennyou should try reading minds, works much better05:33
JayDuggerNo, thank you. Why would I want to go skinny-dipping in blood-warm sewage, fenn?05:34
JayDuggerI'll stick inside my own skull.05:34
fennmeh, suit yourself05:34
kanzurebest of the best of the best, of the best of the best http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXRi28W-ENY05:47
Lukas__xD05:53
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Lukas__What is your opinion on the proposed Internet kill switch?06:28
fennplease be more specific06:29
Lukas__http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-20029282-281.html06:30
Lukas__http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/01/kill-switch-legislation/06:31
fennoh, if it's in wired i'm not worried about it06:34
fennwtf seriously there is no realtime spectrogram visualization for linux?06:35
fennthis is like a 10 line program with fftw06:35
Lukas__What do you mean?06:37
Lukas__"if it's in wired i'm not worried about it"06:37
fenni want http://ecee.colorado.edu/~mathys/ecen1200/hwcl09/gram2.png but without all the windows legacy cruft06:38
kanzureLukas__: wired.com is full of shit these days, wired.com/threatlevel (which you linked to) even more so (you might recalled he trolled DIY transhumanism)06:39
kanzure*recall06:39
Lukas__ah06:39
Lukas__It still worries me though, especially with what is happening in Egypt06:40
kanzurei don't think that's true06:40
kanzureif you were actually worried you'd set up a mesh network06:40
fennegypt's economy isn't tied to the net06:40
fenneven if they for some reason turned off the net for a day, it'd never last a week06:41
fenni'd like to think we can survive without the internet for a day06:41
fennand yes, we really do need mesh networks as a fallback06:42
fennindymedia in carnegie mellon was doing this in like 200306:43
delinquentme... a day w/o internet06:44
fennalso there's APRS over shortwave06:44
delinquentmei donno man06:44
fenni would guess the airwaves would get clogged rather quickly tho06:45
fennlukas you might like the book "little brother" if you're paranoid about these things06:46
fennwow, google decided to stop censoring search results in china06:48
fennhttp://googleblog.blogspot.com/2010/01/new-approach-to-china.html06:48
Lukas__I'm not paranoid about stuff like this, usually I let it go06:48
Lukas__but a whole internet kill switch scares me06:48
Lukas__anything less and I wouldn't care06:49
Lukas__but this is a bit unnerving06:49
ThomasEgibuild your own backbone infrastructure. problem avoided.06:49
Lukas__Funding?06:50
ThomasEginone.06:50
ThomasEgiyou simply conenct to the neighbours.06:50
fennlukas did you actually read the article?06:50
ThomasEgiwlan, physical wire, and my favorite: free space optical.06:50
Utopiahhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wireless_community_networks_by_region06:51
fennThomasEgi: optical sucks (on earth at least)06:51
ThomasEgifenn, it doesnt06:51
fennor anything more than 20 feet that doesn't involve towers or tall buildings06:51
ThomasEgi2km with 10mbit is not bad at all06:51
ThomasEgiwith homebrew hardware.06:52
fenni'm sure it could be improved a lot if someone actually did some serious development06:52
ThomasEgiit can.06:52
ThomasEgii'm always keeping an eye on it.06:52
ThomasEgithe 10mbit are baseband transmission.06:52
ThomasEgiusing dsp's and real modulation you could get a lot higher bandwith.06:52
ThomasEgibut still. 10mbit is quite fast if you use it to build a meshed grid06:53
ThomasEgieven a lot less would be useful for communication. if you dont have to deal with youtube and the likes you can have an awful lot of people communicating together.06:53
fennyeah06:54
ThomasEgihttp://ronja.twibright.com/ <- for the 10mbit homebrew06:54
ThomasEgii'm thinking about building a smaller, lot simpler and cheaper usb versiom.06:54
fenni knew about ronja even before i heard about wifi mesh networks06:54
ThomasEgiwith just one to 3 mbit06:54
ThomasEgilowering costs and difficulties. aswell as boosting range.06:56
fennyou can already get usb wifi transmitters though..06:57
ThomasEgijeah but.. a government can easily disturb wifi city-wide06:58
fennis that true?06:58
ThomasEgisignal-noise ratio..06:58
fennthere's already a zillion things pumping out non-wifi 2.4GHz06:58
ThomasEgijeah. wifi is totaly at it's limit already.06:59
ThomasEgii mean.. wifi sends in the milliwatt range.. a microwave oven easily does 300 to 1000.07:00
ThomasEgishutting down wifi is quite easy07:00
kanzureso all those non-profit orgs for civil rights and other bullshit07:02
kanzureshould be supplying enough ronjas or mesh nodes to cover the surface of egypt07:02
kanzurequick, do the math! how much would that be and at what cost?07:02
ThomasEgironja is comparebly expensive.07:02
kanzuredoesn't matter, civil rights groups are loaded with bullshit dollars07:02
ThomasEgisomewhere between 100 and 250 $ per link i guess.07:03
ThomasEgifor slightly reduced speed, like the 3mbit usb version i am experimenting around.. you could cut the costs down by 80%. if you order in volume, even more07:04
kanzurei don't care.. set it as a variable07:04
ThomasEgiwell. setting it up, aiming the devices etc is propably what takes most time.07:05
ThomasEgia single link is established quite fast, but a whole mesh takes time. so you better set it up before your government decides to go down the drain.07:05
kanzurei don't think you read what i wrote07:06
ThomasEgi*sigh* it's unpraticable :P07:08
ThomasEgito mesh up cairo with one node every 200meters (which is really dense) it may be around 1 to 2 mio €07:12
kanzure2 million euros? is cheap for these NPOs07:12
ThomasEgiso.. if you break down the gosts. it's less than 50¢ per person living in cairo. you'd have to bridge to the people's homes using regular cables or (as long as the government doesnt shut you down) wifi07:13
ThomasEgiit could be a lot cheaper tho.07:13
ThomasEgiwhen i look at pictures , it appears cairo's roofs are clustered with satelite dishes. a few small optical heads would go almost unnoticed.07:15
ThomasEgioh , one big advantage of optical links. they dont distrub each other, so you can have as many as you like.07:17
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kanzurehaha john smart is cited on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_2.008:18
kanzureLukas__ if you ever get bored you can rewrite the diybio wikipedia article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:DIYbio08:19
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kanzureinternational biomolecular design competition http://biomod.net/08:59
kanzurewait, you don't have to make your molecule?09:00
kanzureDMD bullshit here we come09:00
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Lukas__Did I miss anything vital?09:52
kanzurehttp://gnusha.org/logs/2011-01-30.log09:53
Lukas__Wow, the logs are fairly short09:54

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