11-Dec-18 10:45 PM The dirty hands and excessively clean pieces place! \o/ Milling, turning, filing, cutting and joining. Show all the weird and wonderful techniques you didn't read in a book, or picked up from some obscure place. Pic-flood encouraged. 11-Dec-18 10:45 PM Pinned a message. 12-Dec-18 12:29 AM ok cool 12-Dec-18 01:26 PM Tools you might not know. 12-Dec-18 01:26 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181212_221526-AD6B2.jpg 12-Dec-18 01:26 PM I found the small version of the extensible T's after a lot of digging. 12-Dec-18 01:27 PM for measuring inside diameters? 12-Dec-18 01:27 PM Yeah, pretty useful. 12-Dec-18 01:27 PM Especially the small ones, they go as low as 3mm 12-Dec-18 01:27 PM oh, nice 12-Dec-18 01:28 PM And another one, the chernobyl brother of the calliper: 12-Dec-18 01:28 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181212_221558-F47A9.jpg 12-Dec-18 01:28 PM Didn't know that thing existed (the bottom one) but popped up while looking for digital protractors like the one on top. 12-Dec-18 01:30 PM I can't even imagine what it's used for 12-Dec-18 01:30 PM It's an angle calliper, just like a normal one. 12-Dec-18 01:30 PM Amazing, right? 18-Dec-18 12:34 PM ahhh, those inside measurement thingys... i once had the opportunity to get literally a few kilos of those (unsorted, just a pallet full of measuring stuff), but didn't have the money on hand :-( 18-Dec-18 12:34 PM well, at least i took something like 30 or 40 micrometer clock gauges 18-Dec-18 01:23 PM in case of missing money to buy cheap af nice equip, call your local nerd to help you out under the number of: +49....! 18-Dec-18 01:25 PM well, i want to sort through the gauges first (and well, they need thorough cleaning and some lubrication, it's a sticky mess...) 18-Dec-18 01:25 PM but hey, if somebody really needs one, contact me 18-Dec-18 01:27 PM @Pan Da 18-Dec-18 01:36 PM ...yeah, uh. :-D 18-Dec-18 01:36 PM *contact me after january 2019 - i'll be far away from my stuff until then ^^ 18-Dec-18 01:55 PM Rofl 18-Dec-18 01:55 PM Just for fun, post a photo of them someday. 18-Dec-18 01:56 PM +1 18-Dec-18 01:57 PM ...remind me of that when i'm back :-D 18-Dec-18 01:57 PM you're still here 18-Dec-18 01:59 PM physically yes, mentally far away. and i won't unpack all of them from their nice cardboard box where they are safe from parents and stuff 18-Dec-18 01:59 PM Btw, I am going to have a metric ton of fun seeing how pure aluminium reacts to a carbide endmill. 18-Dec-18 01:59 PM Would freezing it help? 18-Dec-18 01:59 PM (with super shallow passes) 18-Dec-18 01:59 PM I gave one away to @AdamMcCombs . It had this funny name company "TheClock", but was in some odd and outdated measuring units. 18-Dec-18 02:03 PM My shop is almost all metric so I agree with you 18-Dec-18 02:08 PM i love the jokes Nik and Richard at bad obsession motorsports make about the imperial system... very british jokes. 18-Dec-18 02:13 PM yes, you, little richie 18-Dec-18 02:13 PM noooo, the other one 18-Dec-18 02:15 PM the less cool one? 18-Dec-18 02:15 PM the very british one. 18-Dec-18 02:16 PM :< 18-Dec-18 10:22 PM Put an example 18-Dec-18 10:22 PM Btw, I was thinking on pinning a message with the best shops to buy cheap cutters, inserts and tools (there are not that many, actually, and will be used often, hence why a pinned message here, instead of a lost message in resources) Opinions? 18-Dec-18 10:29 PM Go for it 18-Dec-18 11:45 PM Tooling, inserts and general utility shops: https://www.ebay.com/str/carbidechiu (good carbide tooling, tested) https://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/ (UK based shop, carries some unconventional items) https://littlemachineshop.com/ (UK based shop) https://www.rdgtools.co.uk/ (UK based shop) https://www.chronos.ltd.uk/ (UK based shop) https://es.aliexpress.com/store/1950213 (China supplier of quartz and alumina goods, tested) https://es.aliexpress.com/store/4428140 (China supplier of inserts and other machining tools, tested) DM me with any other shops you would like to see added. 18-Dec-18 11:45 PM Pinned a message. 22-Dec-18 12:08 PM Helping my son to get his birthday present wired up. Seems to be working, just need to attach the X DRO scale. Index is not as well known as Bridgeport, but the company is still in business. This one is from the 50's, but has been rebuilt recently. 22-Dec-18 12:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181222_150123298-41B7C.jpg 22-Dec-18 12:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181222_150411685-3CF4B.jpg 22-Dec-18 02:55 PM Omg... 22-Dec-18 09:11 PM You know it's a keeper when it has a power feeder 24-Dec-18 07:53 AM Rofl. 24-Dec-18 07:53 AM So my lathe motor decided it was time for a cleaning/brush replacement. 24-Dec-18 07:53 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181224_161827-4024A.jpg 24-Dec-18 07:53 AM Nothing some scotchbrite can't fix. Brushes look ok. (Mark in the center is from years ago, when a brush catastrophically failed). 24-Dec-18 07:53 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181224_162136-1A8BB.jpg 24-Dec-18 07:53 AM Breaking in. 20" @ 500rpm, zero load. (Motor not connected to lathe spindle) 20" @ 1200rpm, zero load. 24-Dec-18 07:53 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_8ga736-5CB0E.jpg 24-Dec-18 08:31 AM Had to share: 24-Dec-18 08:31 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kiXXTdybMPw 26-Dec-18 12:04 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYOgmhpBUJs 26-Dec-18 01:44 PM Just saw it. Made me think about fusing two to make a glassworking lathe. (But they are not that cheap, so I'll just make my own with other hardware) 26-Dec-18 01:47 PM hmm, you'd have to use stepper motors to sync the rotation, right? 26-Dec-18 02:01 PM or a long toothed rod or something. that's how they did it in The Olden Times 26-Dec-18 02:01 PM (tm) 26-Dec-18 02:06 PM Couldn't you "just" sync them by a shaft on the side? 26-Dec-18 02:07 PM @Leona that's what i meant. it's late, i sometimes don't find the english words... 26-Dec-18 02:07 PM Ah. Somehow didn't read your comment 26-Dec-18 02:08 PM at least one chuck has to be moveable along the slide 26-Dec-18 02:08 PM how well does that work with a "long gear"? 26-Dec-18 02:08 PM I have no idea about that stuff... 26-Dec-18 02:09 PM Bahahaha 26-Dec-18 02:09 PM Yes, you can synchro them with a splined shaft. 26-Dec-18 02:09 PM However, I have a plan of just using two big stepper motors. If big enough, loosing steps is unlikely, and there is not that much counter-torque to be aplied AT THE SAME TIME that you require synchronization to be good. 26-Dec-18 02:13 PM HA! 26-Dec-18 02:18 PM There is the issue that you would want as big a throat as possible in the chucks, so instead of direct drive, it would be more like a toothed belt drive to allow for a 50/80mm ID of the shaft, wich would allow for smaller motors. (i don't plan to do giant pieces anyways) 26-Dec-18 02:18 PM *yet 26-Dec-18 02:19 PM Hah. 26-Dec-18 02:19 PM there are some tubes I'd pay for you to make them 26-Dec-18 02:19 PM but on the other hand they should not be made from glass... 26-Dec-18 02:20 PM Bahahaha 26-Dec-18 02:20 PM You will end being my first customer of vacuum parts. 26-Dec-18 02:22 PM I'm fine with that 26-Dec-18 02:23 PM What tubes, btw? 26-Dec-18 02:23 PM high powered thyratrons, stuff like that 26-Dec-18 02:23 PM I'm still dreaming of switching my caps any other way than a simple spark gap 26-Dec-18 02:25 PM But...aren't there any avaliable on ebay or something? 26-Dec-18 02:26 PM only with like... an order of magnitude too little current 26-Dec-18 02:26 PM ????? 26-Dec-18 02:26 PM Not sure I'll be able to do what you'd need. 26-Dec-18 02:27 PM me neither 26-Dec-18 02:27 PM I'm just playing with some thoughts 26-Dec-18 02:28 PM But why are there not avaliable in higher power? 26-Dec-18 02:29 PM I guess they're just not needed 26-Dec-18 02:29 PM I'm sure you can get them at those kinds of powers, just not for cheap on ebay 26-Dec-18 02:29 PM Bahahaha. 26-Dec-18 02:29 PM Spark gap it is, then. 26-Dec-18 02:30 PM ah well 26-Dec-18 02:35 PM Hm...their working principle is quite interesting. Filled with hydrogen. We should try building one at some point, even if to only see it explode. 26-Dec-18 02:37 PM count me in 26-Dec-18 02:37 PM oh and maybe an ignitron, just for fun! 26-Dec-18 02:41 PM stoechiometric H2/O2 mix for a better plasma! 26-Dec-18 10:40 PM Hmm...went to sleep thinking about it being something of a glorified spark gap, and there are "controlled" spark gaps. I wonder, what if you made a glass bottle with two tungsten electrodes, rarified gas and an external dc ionizing source, so you could form the plasma inside? Wouldn't that work as a switch? Edit: Wich, I just realized, is a xenon flash lamp... 26-Dec-18 10:48 PM http://www.angelfire.com/80s/sixmhz/trigatron.html 26-Dec-18 10:48 PM The writing is priceless. Wish I had done it myself. 26-Dec-18 10:57 PM Are you sure you need me to build something? It seems perfectly doable by yourself. (Might be just that you want it made of glass? ) 27-Dec-18 01:42 AM let's make it a challenge 27-Dec-18 01:42 AM everyone produces their own triggering device, they all get testet with our capacitor(s), and the best one gets an award? 27-Dec-18 01:42 AM "best" as in "most shots per money" 27-Dec-18 02:28 AM best as in fastest, lowest impedance 27-Dec-18 02:28 AM But what kv? 27-Dec-18 02:36 AM 40 max 27-Dec-18 05:13 AM Bahahah 27-Dec-18 05:13 AM Competition for this time next year. 27-Dec-18 05:14 AM hehe 27-Dec-18 05:14 AM winner gets a cap 27-Dec-18 08:27 AM Organizing my bolts https://twitter.com/robamacl/status/1078324809736564736?s=09 27-Dec-18 01:26 PM I would steal the fastener box of mistery from you. XD 27-Dec-18 01:26 PM I will totally enter the competition. How do we name it? "Sparkatron"? "The day capacitors stood still"? BlowUpTron? Spark'n'hide? 27-Dec-18 01:59 PM Sparking the fire 27-Dec-18 02:19 PM Firestarter! 27-Dec-18 03:24 PM The firestarter project 27-Dec-18 03:24 PM has a nice ring to it 27-Dec-18 05:46 PM Darn, missed coversation yesterday on spark gap switching, that's one of my big areas of study! @GigaSquirrel spark gaps for your caps are definitely the best way to go. I wouldn't dismiss them at all - there are some really insane state of the art spark gaps that make tubes look like a joke. 27-Dec-18 05:54 PM All types too, from your standard gas gaps, to liquid gaps, and solid dielectric gaps. Depending on the parameters you required to switch the gap can be tailored to the need. Gaps can cover anything from multi kHz rep rates, to megavolts, mega amps, subnanosecond jitter, subnanosecond switching and rise times, ultra low impedance, you name it 27-Dec-18 05:54 PM Even triggering can get quite sophisticated depending on the gap geometry, dielectric used, and synchronization/jitter requirements - anywhere from standard field triggering, to pressure, to laser 27-Dec-18 06:07 PM To be honest, the super simple basic gaps you see people making for stuff like tesla coils, basic Marx generators, and other high voltage projects don't even scratch the surface of the variety of gaps available. Granted spark gaps still have limits and tradeoffs (you can't get all parameters simultaneously, like for any switch), but there is a huge selection of self breaking and triggered gaps that are available to explore, especially for high peak power cap banks 27-Dec-18 11:53 PM Someone might be a bit excited about that, I pressume. XDDDD 27-Dec-18 11:53 PM What would be the difference between a sealed with gas triggered spark gap, and that semiconductor reverse-whatnot-diode-plasmosis we talked a while ago? 27-Dec-18 11:53 PM (not physical, I mean in performance) 28-Dec-18 03:28 AM TBH I have No idea about spark gaps, I was just looking into tubes because they're somewhat available 28-Dec-18 03:28 AM I always saw them as unreliable and inefficient, due to the ones I saw in all those TCs ^^ 28-Dec-18 05:08 AM @Applied_Ion Do you have any keywords for me to know what to look into? 28-Dec-18 05:46 AM "spark" "gap" 28-Dec-18 05:46 AM Sorry, but not sorry. 28-Dec-18 07:59 AM @Nixie their are a lot of differences between the DSRD and a triggered gas gap. DSRDs cover the kind of odd range of switching in between the parameters of tubes and gaps. They can handle ns pulsewidths, subnanosecond rise times, and subnanosecond pulses, which tubes can't but gaps can. Also have subnanosecond jitter which is tougher to get in tubes and gaps. However, similar to tubes, you can control the pulse width directly from the drive circuitry, and can handle far higher rep rates than gaps. They can handle very high voltages and medium currents, and can be stacked easily, making them unique to gaps and tubes. Many kv at low to moderate currents, such as several kA pulsed. Stacked I have seen them in the 100kv range. However, they can't handle the insane voltages and currents that gaps can, like up to MV and MA levels. The main downside of gaps is rep rate. As switching voltage and/current increases, it becomes much harder to quench the gap. Generally they operate at a few hz, with some special considerations they can go to 10s of hz, and some state of the art high pressure ultrafast gaps for subnanosecond switching can hit 1 khz. Basically DSRDs are best for the nanosecond/subnanosecond range of pulsing where you need very high rep rates at high voltages and low to medium current levels. Spark gaps are ideal for the highest voltages and currents anywhere from microsecond to subnanosecond where rep rate isn't critical 28-Dec-18 07:59 AM Of course, there are some other specialized switches that can handle very high voltages and currents if you need precise trigger synchronization, such a as photoconductive semiconductor switches. Unlike DSRDs, these are commercially available, but very costly, and are triggered via laser pulses. They are advantageous when precision triggering of multiple banks are needed with ns intense pulses, like for induction linacs or dielectric wall linacs. However, they are rated for lower rep rates, but can handle many kA of current with very low jitter. 28-Dec-18 08:11 AM @GigaSquirrel do you know what switching parameters you require? Voltage, current, pulsewidth, rise time, rep rate, load, etc? The biggest consideration for gaps is rep rate - if your rep rates are very low, it makes them much easier. I'm assuming you are looking to switch your big caps? Something on the order in the 100 kA range at 10s of kV? Chances are your rep rate will be much less than 1hz, making gap design much easier. But again, the gap design all goes back to what you are trying to accomplish. I'd say work out the pulse parameters needed first, then move to gap design. J.C. Martin, the father of pulsed power, pioneered spark gaps, and did a tremendous amount of work with gas, liquid, and solid dielectric switching and breakdown phenomenon, and is a great place to start looking for info. 28-Dec-18 08:13 AM thanks for all the information! 28-Dec-18 08:16 AM You are also right about the TC gaps. Those are as simple as you can get, and while they work for their purposes, don't really show what gaps are capable of. Sorry if I can't give specifics exactly what to search, there is just a huge range, and depends on the gap and application. Like for ultrafast subnanosecond stuff, the Russians pioneered some incredible high speed high pressure nanosecond converter gaps. For high rep rates, high pressure flowing gas or oil gaps are the way to go. Also magnetic and blown gas quenching for low-range rep rates. General low rep rate or single shot, triggered stuff is covered a lot by J.C. Martin. 28-Dec-18 08:18 AM Caps are specd for 150 kA max, at 40 kV max, but we're gonna drive them at 30, for longer life; current might be higher, since we can parallel them. Rep rate will be <1 per minute, once every 30s at maximum, we are limited by my power supply here. I have no specific load in mind right now, I was thinking more along the lines of making an universal switch for them so I could switch whatever load I'd want to. Quenching will not be needed 28-Dec-18 08:19 AM How many uF are the caps rated for? 28-Dec-18 08:19 AM I'd be happy with <µs switching, we really don't need anything special, just something that can handle the current 28-Dec-18 08:19 AM one sec 28-Dec-18 08:19 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Caps_of_doom-432CB.jpg 28-Dec-18 08:23 AM A general triggered gap would definitely serve as a great multipurpose switch covering most loads. For caps like that, you are definitely looking at microsecond-long discharges at very low rep rates. Spark gaps will give you high rate of rise definitely below uS, but to get shorter pulses that the capacitor discharge you would need to look into secondary pulse compression stages. If you are going for pinch stuff, you don't really need nanosecond pulses, which are generally more reserved for beam stuff. 28-Dec-18 08:23 AM Is your bank just paralleled caps charged to 30kV? Or are you stacking for higher voltages? 28-Dec-18 08:23 AM Also do you want a triggered gap or self breaking? 28-Dec-18 08:25 AM I'm sorry, wrong wording, I'm looking for sub µs risetimes, not pulse length 28-Dec-18 08:25 AM we'll stay with parallel for now 28-Dec-18 08:25 AM Ok yeah that's fine then, much easier to deal with 28-Dec-18 08:25 AM J.C. Martin would be a great resource then, since a lot of their pulsers covered this level of switching 28-Dec-18 08:26 AM Thanks 28-Dec-18 08:26 AM gotta keep my eyes open for that, hopefully there's a chance to get it for <300€ 28-Dec-18 08:32 AM No problem. For fast rise times, for a gas gap, pressurized gaps would be the way to go. Multichannel breakdown gaps also can help in that regard, but not as critical as at MA levels. 30kv is super easy to deal with - a lot of triggering alone is much higher than that. I think the pdf version is of the book free and floating around. 28-Dec-18 08:32 AM I may have a copy of the pdf, I'll have to dig around my files 28-Dec-18 08:32 AM I happened across the book version for free by chance 28-Dec-18 08:35 AM it's just all very new to me 28-Dec-18 08:35 AM I've played around with ~50 kV from a DST when I was younger, but never at any kind of current 28-Dec-18 08:35 AM and the biggest cap bank I've had was barely 1 kJ at ~400V ^^ 28-Dec-18 08:35 AM all the switching I've done so far at those kinds of powers was by touching wires together 28-Dec-18 08:35 AM does it say anything about electrode materials in the book? Or is it just geometry etc? 28-Dec-18 08:43 AM Yeah I think there is reference to electrode material. For low rep rate stuff, material is much less critical. Copper or brass is more than fine 28-Dec-18 08:43 AM Actually that's pretty much all they used for gas gaps 28-Dec-18 08:44 AM oh, ok, I was expecting something like W or WCu 28-Dec-18 08:44 AM No way lol, not at all. You only see that for maybe the super high rep rate stuff 28-Dec-18 08:44 AM For everything else, copper and brass dominate 28-Dec-18 08:45 AM that's gonna make the whole thing a lot cheaper 28-Dec-18 08:46 AM Oh yeah, spark gaps are still dirt cheap 28-Dec-18 08:46 AM At our lab, we built a 3d printed pressurized gap with optional triggering insert 28-Dec-18 08:46 AM Couple of 1/2" brass bars for electrodes 28-Dec-18 08:46 AM Solid single piece 3d printed housing construction, went up to 80 psi countless times, never gave issues 28-Dec-18 08:46 AM I still use it occasionally now 28-Dec-18 08:46 AM Cost us literally almost nothing to make. Though for your currents, you may want something a bit more robust with larger electrodes 28-Dec-18 08:50 AM that's very promising, I might throw something together this weekend 28-Dec-18 08:50 AM for my small can crusher project 28-Dec-18 08:50 AM looking for TSGs I found primarily 2 designs, with the triggering electrode in the axis of the main electrodes, or with the trigger off axis, how does that impact on performance? 28-Dec-18 09:03 AM How do you define performance lol 28-Dec-18 09:04 AM fair question 28-Dec-18 09:04 AM is there a simple way to say what it changes? 28-Dec-18 09:19 AM I don't think there is a massive difference in performance. I think for the high peak power stuff you generally see preference for the off axis field distortion gap rather than on axis trigatron gaps. The biggest concern with the latter is erosion. I'd say go with the field distortion. Generally easier to build, more adjustable, better flexibility. I have only used the field distortion off axis gaps myself as well 28-Dec-18 09:19 AM I will be covering spark gaps extensively for my system build, and will be using several different types 28-Dec-18 09:19 AM Started the pulsed power driver design last week, wrapping up the major parameters now. I have some interesting tricks I could play to manipulate it to get where I want for cheap, it's just a matter of balancing cost and performance. My bank only stores about 130 joules, so I gotta play some real pulsed power games to get to the results I need, and there are a lot of ways to go about it. 28-Dec-18 09:26 AM good luck with that! 28-Dec-18 09:26 AM what results are you looking for? 28-Dec-18 09:38 AM Without giving too much away, ideally want to achieve 300kV or more at several tens of kA delivered to a matched load. From 10-30ns, peak power of several tens of GW. Gotta convert the really low capacity of my bank to high peak power on a budget of a couple hundred dollars. I've got most of the details figured out, just a matter of solidifying the final topology of my driver. 28-Dec-18 09:38 AM My caps are only 28kv, .02uF, storing maybe 7 joules each, and can only deliver 600A per cap, so I've got to really pull out the big guns on this one, really no overhead to work with puts me at a big disadvantage and really forces me to build a true optimized pulsed power driver. 28-Dec-18 09:45 AM Wooo 28-Dec-18 09:45 AM Can you crush the plasma arc physically? (With a dielectric flap of sorts that gets in the middle of the electrodes) 28-Dec-18 09:47 AM What do you mean exactly by crushing the arc? 28-Dec-18 09:47 AM Like reducing distance, radially pinching it, etc? 28-Dec-18 09:53 AM Like, once the spark is on, on an air gap, putting something in the middle of the electrodes. (I realize it would be whoefully slow and unpractical, just wondering of there are other less obvious limitations other than slow response and dielectric strenght. 28-Dec-18 09:54 AM What would be the purpose? Not quite following lol 28-Dec-18 09:54 AM There is a whole class of single shot solid dielectric spark gaps that use plastic instead of air, usually for MA level currents with very high rise times and low jitter 28-Dec-18 09:55 AM Imagine an infinitely big capacitor bank (don't wet yourself) and ypu want to abruptly terminate the discharge, for example. 28-Dec-18 09:55 AM But separating the electrodes until the arc extinguishes, sounds even slower than putting something in between. 28-Dec-18 09:56 AM Oh yeah, that's easy, you use a nanosecond/subnanosecond converter spark gap 28-Dec-18 09:56 AM What the fluf is that? 28-Dec-18 09:57 AM The converter shortens the pulse by cutting it abrubtly. Mainly used for GW class subnanosecond pulse power generators 28-Dec-18 09:57 AM The Russians really pioneered that technology 28-Dec-18 09:57 AM Ohhh 28-Dec-18 09:57 AM Can you pint me any links to learn about that? 28-Dec-18 09:58 AM It essentially uses a second radial gap around the primary gap to short the pulse to ground abruptly 28-Dec-18 09:58 AM These gaps are what get into state of the art stuff 28-Dec-18 09:58 AM Very high pressure gaps, with everything impedance matched to reduce inductance 28-Dec-18 09:58 AM These gaps are actually what got me hooked on spark gap technology lol 28-Dec-18 10:06 AM so much new stuff to learn 28-Dec-18 10:06 AM I love it 28-Dec-18 10:10 AM Yeah, this is the stuff you gotta spend a long time digging to find. Nothing anyone will introduce in any classes or even most labs. The coolest stuff is the super specialized tech, buried away just waiting to be found. Taken me a few years of digging and research on my own to really pry into this area, and still lots more to learn 28-Dec-18 10:10 AM @Nixie you bet I got papers and resources on this stuff lol, gotta dig through them 28-Dec-18 10:10 AM This is why I am so excited about EXEDA, it's nothing new or revolutionary, but rather revives super old niche technology and brings the possibility of this level of physics to the maker world. It can be done very cheap too, just gotta know where to look. Best part is, the principles can be scaled - you don't need insane physics equipment or a budget of millions to accomplish it, and can still achieve pretty crazy results. 28-Dec-18 10:17 AM google gives nothing useful for "exeda", what's that? 28-Dec-18 10:20 AM That's my accelerator lol, you won't find anything on it yet. Depending on the configuration, it can be used for a huge array of high power beam physics that haven't been touched yet by makers. 28-Dec-18 10:20 AM ahh, ok 28-Dec-18 10:24 AM I could possibly have first low-power (relatively speaking) beam as early as Feb or March depending if everything goes without issue for the vacuum and pulsed power driver. 28-Dec-18 10:24 AM That's also contingent upon getting instrumentation such as rogowski coils and capacitive voltage dividers built with a decently high speed scope on loan 28-Dec-18 10:25 AM what are you accelerating and to what energy? 28-Dec-18 10:29 AM Let's just say depending on the mode, it's very versatile. Two main modes really - high peak power, and high energy. Both will be higher than anything built by a maker by orders of magnitude. One mode utilizes a very niche and practically forgotten type of accelerator that died decades ago that I would like to see revived and explored. 28-Dec-18 10:30 AM looking forward to superheavy nuclei at TeV! 28-Dec-18 10:30 AM forgotten accelerator could be a betatron... 28-Dec-18 10:30 AM just out of curiosity: why the secrecy? 28-Dec-18 10:45 AM I will release full details in time, but I gotta get beam first. I know it sounds petty, but there are lots of people out there that could beat me to the punch who have a lot more resources than me. My budget is garbage now, and makes it tough, though this project is largely the result of trying to figure out how to do this level of physics for little money. This project is the culmination of years of digging, research, and experience, and is something that hasn't been done at this level before. I want to say that I have been the first to do it, and really lead the development of this area of physics in the maker world. It's a system I have become very passionate about, and in some sense is the ultimate test of my ability as an engineer. It will definitely be open source, so there will be a ton of info on it to come. Lol no TeV stuff, but if you want MeV I'd stick around. At least as far as I am aware, no fully independent home built from scratch system has reached this level. This is only one mode though, which the EXEDA-MEVI configuration will cover. The other modes will cover some other exciting devices at lower energy. Betatron is far too mainstream, this goes much deeper, at least for the MEVI system. The technology used in the primary driver EXEDA is still pretty niche, though still used around the world today 28-Dec-18 10:47 AM Bragging rights are always a great argument 28-Dec-18 10:47 AM but yeah, sounds very cool, good luck! 28-Dec-18 10:47 AM reaching MeV would be awesome, I'd love to see an 511 keV peak made by something a hobbyist built! 28-Dec-18 10:49 AM That would be very easy to hit with MEVI lol 28-Dec-18 10:49 AM In theory for the input I am putting in, absolute ideal energies for the best system configuration built are on the order of 6 MeV, though I am just aiming for 1 MeV for now for MEVI. 511 kev could be reached with a smaller device - the effect scales down. I am actually looking to explore smaller scaled systems with my 2.75" conflat chamber, want to see how far I can push it in a small area. What exactly is the significance of this energy peak? 28-Dec-18 10:58 AM A 511 keV photon is created when a positron annihilates, by peak I meant "peak in a gamma spectrum", I just thing it would be awesome if someone created antimatter at home 28-Dec-18 10:59 AM Oh lol, I thought you meant as in particle energy. No antimatter still at this level unfortunately. 28-Dec-18 11:02 AM Pair production is possible above 1022 keV, the rest mass of 2 electrons, at least with photons it is actually noticeable at 5+ MeV 28-Dec-18 11:02 AM you should at least get some light at those kinds of energies with your accelerator? 28-Dec-18 11:03 AM Pair production from ion or electron bombardment? 28-Dec-18 11:03 AM Sorry, not too familiar on the nuclear side, mainly the accelerator side lol 28-Dec-18 11:05 AM not sure what energy you'd need to produce it directly by electron interaction, but you will get some bremsstrahlung at 1+ MeV 28-Dec-18 11:08 AM What about ion bombardment? I know at those level spallation neutrons start being produced, as well as activation 28-Dec-18 11:09 AM hmm 28-Dec-18 11:09 AM bremsstrahlung would not be an issue due to the high charge carries mass 28-Dec-18 11:09 AM also for spallation / activation you need beam energies higher than the binding energy of the nuclides 28-Dec-18 11:09 AM https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/53/Binding_energy_curve_-_common_isotopes.svg 28-Dec-18 11:11 AM Well, no antimatter with this setup. It could maybe be done at home, but for a lot more money and a much larger system than I could do now 28-Dec-18 11:13 AM antimatter if you use a heavy metal target and electron beam, due to pair production via high energy bremsstrahlung 28-Dec-18 11:13 AM just no spallation 28-Dec-18 11:13 AM no messing around in the nucleus 28-Dec-18 11:15 AM So based on the graph, a lithium target with 6 MeV protons would produce spallation correct? 28-Dec-18 11:16 AM yep 28-Dec-18 11:17 AM That means a deuterated target could create spallation neutrons at only a little more than 1 MeV 28-Dec-18 11:18 AM I don't know about the effective cross section, but it is possible 28-Dec-18 11:18 AM using a deuterium beam on a deuterated target would be way more efficient, but I'm sure I don't need to tell you that 28-Dec-18 11:22 AM Oh yeah for sure. Based on what I have seen, for a deuterated target on axis with deuterium, we are talking on the order of up to 10^13 neutrons per pulse. 28-Dec-18 11:23 AM oof 28-Dec-18 11:24 AM But neutron production isn't my goal anyway. Spallation neutrons is much more intriguing though since it verifies min energy threshold, and no need for deuterium. Also don't think any maker has created verified spallation neutrons, only fusion neutrons which is much, much easier 28-Dec-18 11:25 AM yep 28-Dec-18 11:25 AM but for a meaningful spallation source you need at least twice the energy 28-Dec-18 11:25 AM http://www.rpe.org.in/articles/2012/35/3/images/RadiatProtEnviron_2012_35_3_145_117672_f9.jpg 28-Dec-18 11:25 AM of course different nuclei have different cross sections, but you get the idea 28-Dec-18 11:29 AM Spallation would be cool, but not the goal either and still quite a stretch. First and foremost is peak energy for this setup, other things can come after 28-Dec-18 11:29 AM 1MeV min is the defining point for success for MEVI, after that others with more money can improve on it lol 28-Dec-18 11:31 AM is this something one could do at home? eg no special machining etc needed? 28-Dec-18 11:45 AM I have no machining at home. Basic tooling like a lathe is all thats needed. The basic setup is extraordinary simple, but requires optimization. For the first iteration, it won't really be reproducible exactly at home since I have a special component that can't be built at home, but after I verify with that I will show how the standard component in the field is designed and built with very cheap and common materials, and do it myself. I'm just using the custom component at first to save money and effort for the first proof of concept, and since I got it for free. For the accelerator itself, if you have like a lathe and mill/cnc router, you could reasonably build it for a couple hundred or less in very common materials, and house it in a standard 6" or larger conflat chamber, though a lower power system could certainly use a smaller chamber. The challenge is the driver and interface, not the accelerator itself. The whole goal is to show that it can be done at home for dirt cheap. Certainly way cheaper and easier than the cyclotron builder crowd with way higher energy, power, and current output with minimal input. Believe me, when I actually release what the accelerator looks like, you will probably be shocked at its simplicity. 28-Dec-18 11:48 AM sounds exiting, I can't wait for more details! 28-Dec-18 11:59 AM Can't garauntee I'll succeed, but maybe I can atleast lay the groundwork for someone else in the community if I fail. But I think I can get positive results regardless lol. EXEDA will be easy. EXEDA-MEVI will be more trial and error. It's really a shame though that the type of accelerator MEVI is based off of died and there isn't any interest in it now. Granted there are a bunch of drawbacks, but for maker based physics I'd take the downsides for the upsides any day. 28-Dec-18 12:02 PM too bad I don't know anything about accelerators, otherwise I would be trying to guess what you're building 28-Dec-18 12:02 PM but the only old types I know are DC and AC linear accelerators 28-Dec-18 12:05 PM Even talking to people in the accelerator field now, no one has heard of the type MEVI is based off of. EXEDA is a more common system, but a rather specialized subset that isn't covered much. Even in lectures from like CERN, it's not really specifically mentioned or described 28-Dec-18 12:05 PM huh 28-Dec-18 12:05 PM so how do you even know that type 28-Dec-18 12:07 PM Oh, lots and lots of desperate research into the darkest areas of accelerators lol. Having little funding and no machining has forced me to dig way outside the box outside of convention 28-Dec-18 12:07 PM I spend lots of time reading papers lol 28-Dec-18 12:08 PM I guess that's how one finds the best stuff 28-Dec-18 02:53 PM @Applied_Ion We are going to throw you a party when you present it. 28-Dec-18 02:53 PM Would you consider making a livestream presentation (AFTER the official release, of course) for a few chosen ones (that you feel comfortable with) in here? 28-Dec-18 02:53 PM It doesn't have to be like profesional, more of an off the cuff explanation about it, your feelings etc, etc... 28-Dec-18 03:27 PM Sure, I could definitely do kind of a live stream lecture on it. At that point, no reason to restrict access, anyone could listen in on it. I think that could be a good idea to introduce the background, principles, etc. It would be difficult to present everything in just a barrage of tweets lol 28-Dec-18 03:40 PM BTW @Nixie you wanted to see the high speed converter spark gap. Take a look at this beauty. 200kV pulses with FWHM at 500 picoseconds, though they can be configured to fire in less than half that time, generally adjustable from 150-300kV. Steady rep rates at several hundred hz, with second-long burst capabilities at several kHz. 28-Dec-18 03:40 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/RADAN_Pulser-56FAA.jpg 28-Dec-18 03:40 PM this is what got me obsessed with spark gap switching lol 28-Dec-18 03:43 PM Will look at it tomorrow, my eyes cant remain opened for much more zzzzzzzzzzz 28-Dec-18 03:43 PM Thanks! 28-Dec-18 03:55 PM Note that is just the fast converter spark gap and load part, only half of the full unit. The other half is the pulse power supply, consisting of a fast tesla transformer pulse charged coaxial line directly built on top of each other that directly feeds into the gap. Really elegant design for maximizing speed: 28-Dec-18 03:55 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/RADAN_Pulse_Power_Supply-DC28F.jpg 28-Dec-18 04:04 PM gaps are pressurized with either nitrogen for standard operation, or high pressure hydrogen for khz bursts due to the faster recovery of hydrogen. Standard pressure maybe around 500-600 psi, though I have seen then referenced up to 3000 psi hydrogen for fast burst stuff 28-Dec-18 06:03 PM thats the stuff that makes me horny 29-Dec-18 01:40 AM OMG, I would love to see a slow motion CGI video about how it does it's thing. 29-Dec-18 02:46 AM it sparks 29-Dec-18 02:46 AM then it sparks somewhere else 29-Dec-18 02:46 AM then it stops sparking 29-Dec-18 02:46 AM I mean 29-Dec-18 02:46 AM looking at this with no prior knowledge I'd say a pulse comes in from the left, breaks down the peaking gap, current flows through the coax and into the load, but since the chopping gap is so small it breaks down in a few ps after the peaking gap, shorting the load to ground? 29-Dec-18 04:04 AM oh, and the high pressure is for shorter gaps, resulting in faster switching, I think 29-Dec-18 08:14 AM nice 29-Dec-18 01:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181229_220626-B3E8B.jpg 29-Dec-18 01:08 PM Had to go in this channel, I know. 29-Dec-18 01:31 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181229_222001-1BF2B.jpg 29-Dec-18 01:31 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181229_221938-C1295.jpg 29-Dec-18 01:31 PM I hope this counts as machining 29-Dec-18 01:53 PM well it comes from a machine, right? :D 29-Dec-18 01:54 PM @GigaSquirrel looking forward to the results! 29-Dec-18 01:54 PM what voltage and how many joules for the cap? 29-Dec-18 01:56 PM 6 kV max, but I'm aiming for 5, in order not to kill the cap instantly. At 30 µ nominal that results in 540 / 375 J 29-Dec-18 02:13 PM Nice. In terms of triggering, there are a few tricks for improving performance such as jitter, variation, rise-time, etc. For example, it's common to trigger a gap with a voltage at least twice as high as the main voltage to reduce jitter and trigger consistency if possible. However, for very high voltage systems that run on unreasonably high voltages, the trigger electrode can be offset closer to one side for reduced voltage triggering. Obviously pressure helps reduce inductance, and not much pressure is really needed to be effective. Other methods such as UV irradiation or pre-ionization from an auxiliary pin can help. For your big cap bank, if you are getting into the range of multi-hundred kAs, a larger pressurized rail gap or multi-channel breakdown gap would be a strong way to go. Pressure with large area low-inductance gaps and over-volted triggering will help greatly reduce you rise time. Since the big caps are only going to 30kV, it would be very easy to make a 60kV trigger pulse for them. If doing single-shot stuff on the fly, you can also use a pneumatic valve to rapidly decrease pressure for pressure-triggering of the gap, though its definitely not as good as field distortion triggering. 29-Dec-18 02:13 PM btw, do you have any instrumentation to take current pulse measurements for your can crusher? 29-Dec-18 02:17 PM guess we should first come up with an idea what to do with the caps and design the gap accordingly 29-Dec-18 02:17 PM nothing so far, I was thinking of winding a rogowsky for it, just out of curiosity 29-Dec-18 02:18 PM yeah, that's the way I would go. I will need to build several rogowski coils for my system 29-Dec-18 02:20 PM I guess non-coax shunts are a no go? 29-Dec-18 02:22 PM for which part? 29-Dec-18 02:24 PM the can crusher, eg. using the straight piece inbetween the coil and cap as a shunt 29-Dec-18 02:24 PM the tubing has pretty much exactly 1mOhm per meter 29-Dec-18 02:28 PM Well it's looking like I'm going to have to break these out soon 29-Dec-18 02:28 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181229_142307-FCC54.jpg 29-Dec-18 02:29 PM its fine for slow discharge stuff like large capacity caps/banks. In terms of inductance, there are plenty of ways of making very low inductance and non-coax high power shunts 29-Dec-18 02:29 PM @AdamMcCombs nice! What are those ones rated for? 29-Dec-18 02:30 PM 15kv 1mfd 29-Dec-18 02:31 PM seems like everyone's caps are better than mine! 29-Dec-18 02:31 PM They really just fell into my lap 29-Dec-18 02:31 PM I was helping someone unload a bunch of test equipment and he mentioned he was going to have to get rid of this discharge rig and I very quickly informed him I could take them off his hands. 29-Dec-18 02:33 PM I think when people see what can really be done with caps for an optimized system, more will be scrambling to break out their caps and build the fun stuff, far beyond just sparks, arcs, and bangs... 29-Dec-18 02:33 PM So backed the truck up to his and it was mine 29-Dec-18 02:33 PM free caps are the best caps! (usually) 29-Dec-18 02:34 PM yep, they are 29-Dec-18 04:23 PM I assume the spark duration is too short to actually melt the pla if the repetition rate is very low, rigjt? 29-Dec-18 04:30 PM yeah 29-Dec-18 04:30 PM and the electrodes have a high thermal mass 29-Dec-18 04:54 PM (btw, the movie was great, argument is symplistic, but visuals are pretty good. Very entertaining, nice worldbuilding. Also, spotted a diffusion pump in one particular scene, wich is a plus. ) 29-Dec-18 04:56 PM sorry, I must have missed that completly, what movie are you talking about? 29-Dec-18 05:08 PM Mortal engines, posted a pic like 4h ago. 29-Dec-18 05:08 PM ah, I saw that 29-Dec-18 05:08 PM just did not realise you were watching it ^^ 29-Dec-18 05:19 PM Did you crush the can already or what? 29-Dec-18 05:20 PM nope, currently working on the ignition system 29-Dec-18 05:20 PM tomorrow I'll think of something for charging the cap 29-Dec-18 05:20 PM Daaamn 29-Dec-18 05:20 PM Will you be able to shrink coins? 29-Dec-18 05:21 PM not even close 29-Dec-18 05:21 PM I'll wait. 29-Dec-18 05:21 PM with the big ones definatly, but applied ion dosen't allow that 29-Dec-18 05:22 PM Wait, what? 29-Dec-18 05:22 PM I want a crushed coin 29-Dec-18 05:22 PM I disapprove of that disapproval 29-Dec-18 05:25 PM hmm, I might sell some shrunken coins and donate the income to the poor who don't have huge pulsecaps xD 29-Dec-18 05:31 PM Bahahaha 29-Dec-18 05:31 PM Robin spakrhood, terror of the coin-holders. 29-Dec-18 05:33 PM ...ouch 29-Dec-18 05:44 PM video of the trigger is up on twitter, I'm gonna go sleep now 29-Dec-18 05:44 PM good night 29-Dec-18 09:09 PM lol @GigaSquirrel you can shrink as many coins as you like, but it would be a great waste and disservice to those devices to only use them on more trivial applications. Capacitors like that puts you into the power class realm of national labs. Caps like these are now quite available on the surplus market, and have been used by makers for years. 29-Dec-18 09:09 PM Over the years, countless hobbyists and makers have made long arcs, loud bangs, shrunk coins and cans, blown up fruits, fired rail guns - you name it. But no serious effort has gone into using these incredible historic systems and versatile resources for their original purpose - high power vacuum physics. No attempts at driving true high power beam or plasma systems at this level, perhaps with exception of the DPF. Remember, pulsed power was originally developed for vacuum system based experiments - pulsed power and vacuum go hand in hand. All that other stuff is easy - driving a plasma or beam is the real test of engineering. 29-Dec-18 09:09 PM Sure, there are tons of hobbyist built fusors and cute little beam on target systems, small ebeams, even cyclotrons (though at abysmally low energies for the cost and effort) - microamps at most, tens to maybe 150kev for the really well funded. Maybe mid 10^6 neutrons per second for the best efforts. Great toys and learning tools, but nothing at the high level that we all read about and dream of seeing at these big labs. Imagine though that this level of physics all the big boys with endlessly deep pockets play with being available to makers! kA level beams, many 100s of keV and higher, peak powers at the 100s of MW to GW range, +100 MW RF sources, high brightness high energy x-rays, intense laser systems, and neutron yields many orders of magnitude higher than even the best ever amateur neutron sources ever achieve! And doing this all from the power available from your outlet. 29-Dec-18 09:09 PM I would like to see and lead a revival of the real old-school pulsed power stuff at the maker level. With what is available on the surplus market today, and the vast variety of resources on the internet, it is achievable. I'd say it's well about time the maker crowd has access to true high power physics that really is at the core of accelerators and plasma labs today. All these big places - Sandia, SLAC, CERN, Los Alamos, share a common origin from the early pioneers of the field, who built incredible machines with what is available to us today as makers. Now, there is no way we could reach the truly insane levels of these national labs. But the very earliest machines that started the field - that is within our grasp. 29-Dec-18 09:09 PM Looking at all of the tantalizing possibilities available, making just long arcs or popping watermelons just can't compare (though I am biased in this opinion, but perhaps not alone.) Sorry for the long rant, I promise my massive wall of text is done now lol, but it's too exciting what can be done with resources available now. 30-Dec-18 12:22 AM Can't say anything without sounding dumb, but yeah! It is not my field of study/experimentation, but will gladly follow all.your advances and toast to your achievements 30-Dec-18 02:38 AM I totally get your point, I just don't have the space to use them properly 30-Dec-18 02:38 AM yet 30-Dec-18 02:38 AM It will properbly be years until we do something with them 30-Dec-18 02:38 AM in that time I can learn a lot about pulsed power stuff, as right now I would not even know what to do with them 30-Dec-18 05:52 AM well, that was... unimpressing 30-Dec-18 05:52 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181230_145027-99065.jpg 30-Dec-18 06:10 AM If that's your crush, it means love is in the can? 30-Dec-18 06:10 AM the results were crushing 30-Dec-18 06:14 AM Any videos? Btw, if you put a smartphone with the hall sensor app, at some distance, does it show anything after the bang? 30-Dec-18 06:14 AM video is up on twitter, but you don't see much 30-Dec-18 06:14 AM I like the hall sensor Idea, the phone might be a bit too slow, but it's worth a shot 30-Dec-18 06:14 AM but hey, the spark gap works perfectly! 30-Dec-18 06:19 AM Will you name it sparky and add googly eyes? (If they where ferrimagnetic they would move with the pulse and make it hilarious.) 30-Dec-18 06:20 AM xD 30-Dec-18 06:43 AM hm, I might put a 7.5 kV 35µ cap parallel, but I don't know anything about it's pulse rating 30-Dec-18 07:13 AM find out! 30-Dec-18 07:22 AM nah, it's pandas and I don't want to ruin it 30-Dec-18 03:59 PM https://twitter.com/_JohnnyJones/status/992827002058047488 30-Dec-18 04:05 PM https://i.imgur.com/oOAu8D4.jpg 30-Dec-18 04:08 PM match made in heaven. 31-Dec-18 04:46 AM I should really get a boring bar, but surprisingly the end mill on the lathe toolpost worked quite well. 31-Dec-18 04:46 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181231_074410870-AC645.jpg 31-Dec-18 04:46 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20181231_073402661-B1FDB.jpg 31-Dec-18 05:16 AM lets move to general 31-Dec-18 05:16 AM True. 31-Dec-18 05:16 AM Let me delete this 02-Jan-19 08:26 AM This chip from drilling copper is cool. It has one mirror shiny surface and one dull. https://photos.app.goo.gl/pDoLENzGjnSmV9ZAA 02-Jan-19 08:45 AM 02-Jan-19 08:45 AM What are you up to? 02-Jan-19 02:27 PM I made a spot welder. https://twitter.com/robamacl/status/1080587345722781697?s=09 02-Jan-19 02:30 PM Woah!! Looks great. What do you use it for that "requires" the pneumatics? (Could be because you could too, I take that into account) 02-Jan-19 02:35 PM Well pneumatic is pretty common on industrial spot welders. My son like the "C" geometry rather than the pincer design, and once I got the big cylinder I had to make a bracket strong enough for the ~900 lb max force, even tho the electrodes won't stand that much, but never know when you might want to squash something a bit. Especially if your sheet is a bit rippled, which happens when you cut with hand shears, then it takes a bunch of force to get the two sheets in good contact. 02-Jan-19 02:35 PM The hack here is using the cylinder as a linear guide, when cylinders are not really supposed to be used with side load. But the two ended cylinder has bronze bushings at both ends, not relying on the piston seal for the side load. 02-Jan-19 02:35 PM The frame is steel angle from an old bed frame. Mostly stuff a had on hand except for the cylinder, pneumatic valve, and hardware like the bolts and threaded rod. 02-Jan-19 02:46 PM Excellent! 02-Jan-19 02:46 PM Hownhave you isolated one of the terminals? (My guess is the piston end) 02-Jan-19 04:55 PM Yes. I didn't have ability to turn threads on the ID of the upper electrode holder, was going for a slip fit, figuring I would shim it with paper or something, but of course it ended oversized, so I decided to make a virtue of that, and press a sheet of inner tube rubber in between the piston shaft and holder. This seems to work, so far. Voltage is only 3V, so only issue would be if the rubber punches thru mechanically. 02-Jan-19 11:54 PM 05-Jan-19 08:10 AM I laid out the control panel for spot welder. It's .062" (1.6 mm) aluminum. I cut outline on the bandsaw and now it's all drilling. 05-Jan-19 08:10 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_110750449-018F9.jpg 05-Jan-19 08:25 AM I've drilled the mounting holes for circuit board and box, and also predrilled all the large holes using one of those sizes. 05-Jan-19 08:25 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_112306739-B44F3.jpg 05-Jan-19 10:46 AM Go, go, go! 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM I use the step drill to make the .375 holes, since it makes clean holes in sheet. At my lowest speed on the drill press, 500 rpm. Step drill tends to move work sideways, so clamp everything down well, tighten lock screws. 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_113229090-A72B6.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_113410482-DDADC.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM I don't have the right size step drill for the other holes, so I am using twist drill. First drill a larger pilot hole, and clamp well because the drill may grab in the thin soft sheet. 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_114546601-721F6.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_114719390-C3192.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM A look at the hole from the twist drill (first) and the step drill, on reverse side. A lot of chatter with the twist drill gave a rough not very round hole, with some burrs. 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_115041427-41A04.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_115055595-0B2A0.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM I made this hole with another large twist drill, but this time at 500 rpm, not 1500. There was much less chatter, and a pretty clean result. The advantage for the step drill is bigger with the commercially pure aluminium often used in electronics enclosures, which is particularly soft and gummy. This is 6061 which machines pretty well. 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_120537411-BE89F.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Deburring large holes with deburring tool, and small holes with 90 degree countersink on hand drill. Use low speed and firm pressure with countersink, only requires one or two revolutions. You can just turn the countersink with your fingers too. 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_115413049-0F90B.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_115621433-54645.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM I can't find that potentiometer, time to put some stuff away. 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_121642413-49245.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM The missing pot didn't turn up, but I have another. Now I find I really should have drilled holes for the anti rotation key. I'm used to using metal pots where you can torque it down until it doesn't turn, but that isn't working. I'm going to try double sided tape. 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_122720903-EF8FE.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM The other pot did show up eventually. Anyway, this is how it goes together. I am only using the back of the box. An air pressure sensor with display is at top left. 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_155143167-4553A.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_160651769-B4CC8.jpg 05-Jan-19 01:12 PM Now to do the actual wiring and coding... 05-Jan-19 03:10 PM Excellent work! For the twist drill/sheet metal debacle, I use a piece of wood (thicker than the drill's diameter) on top, after centering the hole. 05-Jan-19 04:27 PM Ok, this is the plan for the electronics. 05-Jan-19 04:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_185801730-0B03A.jpg 05-Jan-19 04:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190105_185746049-9FA33.jpg 06-Jan-19 09:56 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHoHNt1NOZs 06-Jan-19 12:02 PM Omg 06-Jan-19 12:03 PM And I can't watch it right now. 06-Jan-19 12:03 PM Gods be damned 08-Jan-19 07:03 AM Spot welder controller circuit is coming along. Wires are pigtails at this point, will solder to regulator and pots on front panel. Aside from teensy and ULN2003A there are just some input protection/divider networks. 08-Jan-19 07:03 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190108_095939347-604D0.jpg 08-Jan-19 07:03 AM Board front 08-Jan-19 07:03 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190108_100403125_BURST000_COVER_TOP-5FA6E.jpg 08-Jan-19 07:03 AM I have all the controller board components soldered in, just need external wiring to air valve and the welder power breadboard. 08-Jan-19 07:03 AM The box was almost too small. Still haven't learned my lesson from the first time I tried to put a project in a box back around 1975. 08-Jan-19 07:03 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190108_101021111_HDR-E9C4F.jpg 08-Jan-19 07:03 AM Height was the main issue, only a couple mm clearance at top and bottom. Tantalum chip is touching pot. 12-Jan-19 04:26 AM I just saw this and thought it would be interesting to share. Never heard of this technique before: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2m1ryCQhnM&t=0s 12-Jan-19 04:26 AM (see @GigaSquirrel , even a motorcycle channel can give you insights into machining, hence why I recommended him. XDDD) 12-Jan-19 04:43 AM cracked conrods? it is very common since the 90s 12-Jan-19 04:43 AM the machine that cracks them can be pretty simple or very involved, usually you just machine a stress riser from the side and force the rod over a cone with a hydraulic cylinder 12-Jan-19 04:43 AM some modern systems use a laser to induce a crack while the rod is already stressed on the cone 12-Jan-19 04:54 AM Never heard of the technique, in any case. Found it fascinating. ^^ 12-Jan-19 05:04 AM it's pretty neat, yeah 12-Jan-19 12:28 PM Spot welder with controller is all assembled and wired up. Now for the firmware. Going to try to keep that simple because it's a bit too much like the day job. 12-Jan-19 12:28 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190112_152500779-DBDB5.jpg 12-Jan-19 12:28 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190112_152107428_HDR-BCE27.jpg 12-Jan-19 12:28 PM Display on front is the air pressure gauge for down force. A smart gauge I got for $20 on eBay, NOS. Knobs are pots, analog input to controller, will be pulse time and pressure. Switch is manual up/down. 12-Jan-19 01:09 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FA46h7Db1BY 12-Jan-19 02:49 PM Just saw it, if it wasn't for the fact that it costs 300€ I would dismantle one to try wirebonding. 12-Jan-19 02:52 PM oh wow, more than expected 20-Jan-19 09:55 AM The spot welder is now working with adjustable pulse time and sequencing of the pneumatic cylinder. https://photos.app.goo.gl/tK5YLX9Jk9B5nWia8 20-Jan-19 10:03 AM When you first press the pedal the cylinder goes down, stopping when the pressure setpoint is reached. Then when you release the pedal the lamp comes on and the welder is armed. Next pedal press does the weld, and after a short hold time the cylinder comes up. If you let up the pedal during the down cycle the cylinder stops, allowing you to reposition work. Press down again and the cycle continues. If the down cycle completes and you are not happy with position then you can do manual up. The weld cycle disarms after 2s timeout, and you are back to the top of the down cycle, ready to try again. 20-Jan-19 10:03 AM Industrial machines use a two-step pedal, first notch does pressure, the next does weld. But I only had an ordinary pedal switch. 20-Jan-19 10:56 AM Awesome! Can we see a video of it working?...for reasons... XD 20-Jan-19 11:33 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMDsX38_rxY 20-Jan-19 12:11 PM shame 20-Jan-19 12:12 PM is the spot welder driven by capacitive discharge 20-Jan-19 03:45 PM No, this is a microwave transformer AC welder. The google photos link above is a video clip. 20-Jan-19 06:48 PM ah 21-Jan-19 02:37 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190121_113703-F49F8.jpg 21-Jan-19 02:37 AM thank you @Nixie <3 21-Jan-19 04:16 AM bows My pleasure, now go find how much better the alum inserts work. 21-Jan-19 08:52 AM is stainless (304 & 316) the better common materials to build chambers out of? like, you wouldnt want to make something out of aluminum, would you? 21-Jan-19 10:00 AM it's perfectly acceptable to make a chamber out of aluminium 21-Jan-19 10:00 AM the issues start when you need CF flanges 21-Jan-19 10:38 AM Yep. 21-Jan-19 10:39 AM Aluminum has extremely low outgassing properties which are comparable to SS, and can be baked as well. For seals, it depends on what level of vacuum you are trying to reach. Like sync said, issues cam arise if you need cf. However, viton is perfectly acceptable to quite high vacuum levels, 10^-8 before permeation at room temp becomes the limiting factor. 21-Jan-19 10:39 AM For my chamber, I actually use an aluminum plate to cf adapter with a flat viton cf gasket crushed between the stainless conflat knife edge seal and the flat aluminum surface 21-Jan-19 10:39 AM here is a standard seal interference for the flat viton for conflat to conflat: 21-Jan-19 10:39 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Conflat_Knife_Edge_Mating_Profile_with_Vit-F6375.jpg 21-Jan-19 10:39 AM here is what I will be using, with a flat surface at the bottom, and increasing the compression ratio to almost 50% (30% for viton is standard): 21-Jan-19 10:39 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Conflat_Knife_Edge_with_Flat_Surface_Matin-BCC81.jpg 21-Jan-19 10:39 AM this second cross section is with the aluminum plate surface on the bottom, with the 6" conflat seal on the top 21-Jan-19 10:43 AM oh really? that suprises me, haven't any resources but my intuition would think aluminum would ad/absorb more water on its surface than SS 21-Jan-19 10:43 AM but I should better find some resources... 21-Jan-19 10:44 AM no, if you look at the numbers for SS and aluminum for prepped surface, they are pretty much the same 21-Jan-19 10:44 AM unbaked however SS performs better, but not super drastically 21-Jan-19 10:44 AM I am actually writing up a new blog post exactly on the plate sealing surface design as we speak 21-Jan-19 10:54 AM What is the prepped surface in aluminium? 21-Jan-19 10:54 AM Like, for homemade stuff is it easier to use ss because doesn't need much else? 21-Jan-19 10:55 AM either pumping for long periods of time, or baking/pumping 21-Jan-19 10:55 AM both will have some outgassing unbaked, but you won't observe the effects until you start trying to hit UHV levels 21-Jan-19 10:55 AM its not really that much of an issue for most practical applications 21-Jan-19 10:55 AM let me get some average numbers I have used for Molflow simulation of aluminum and SS 21-Jan-19 10:55 AM Some very general average numbers - For Aluminum: Unbaked/Pumped 1hr - 1.066 x 10^-6 mbar x l/s/cm^2 Unbaked/Pumped >24hr - 1.333 x 10^-10 mbar x l/s/cm^2 Baked/Pumped >24hr - 6.665 x 10^-13 mbar x l/s/cm^2 For Stainless Steel: Unbaked/Pumped 1hr - 6.665 x 10^-8 mbar x l/s/cm^2 Unbaked/Pumped >24hr - 1.333 x 10^-10 mbar x l/s/cm^2 Baked/Pumped >24hr - 3.999 x 10^-13 mbar x l/s/cm^2 21-Jan-19 11:23 AM Welding aluminum is a differeant beast than [stainless] steel.. a drawback I would think 21-Jan-19 11:25 AM are you looking to custom weld your own chamber from scratch as opposed to using surplus parts? 21-Jan-19 11:25 AM I am questioning it 21-Jan-19 11:25 AM any reason in particular? What will the chamber be used for? 21-Jan-19 11:27 AM the two projects on my list are SEM and Mass Spec.. the only reason would possibly to have something tailor made that you amde yourself.. and I like machining (I'm at a watchmaking school) 21-Jan-19 11:27 AM just got dimensions for a jig borer I am interested in, from a suprlus place, and it will fit through my front doors 21-Jan-19 11:28 AM it would probably be significantly easier and cheaper in the long run to use surplus vacuum parts and machine only the critical parts you need yourself, especially if you are looking to achieve deeper vacuum levels 21-Jan-19 11:29 AM more of the question if the right surplus part crosses my path or not 21-Jan-19 11:32 AM that's something that if you are on a tight budget, takes a lot of patience and searching. It's been a year since I first started designing my system and I'm only just now starting to assemble it. 21-Jan-19 11:33 AM and, due to being new here, what is your system trying to achieve? 21-Jan-19 11:37 AM Multipurpose depending on the chamber. I have 3 main chambers, which all fit onto a modular high vacuum test stand. The test stand has the cooling system, roughing pump, and high vacuum pump assembly integrated so all I need to do is swap out chambers on the top. The chambers themselves are built around 6" conflat hardware. My two main focuses are micro propulsion for small satellites, and my big system I have been talking about here and on twitter a lot, EXEDA, which is an industrial class high power accelerator. As far as I am aware, it will be the highest power amateur accelerator ever built if it works, reaching peak beam powers of several hundred MW. 21-Jan-19 11:37 AM Everything is open source, and I include cad, simulations, cost analysis, build pictures, specifications, write-ups, etc 21-Jan-19 11:46 AM That sounds very interesting! Do you have a link to your writeups etc? 21-Jan-19 11:47 AM I am working on a website currently. I don't have info for the accelerator posted yet, but I am rapidly working towards finalizing the design. The other preliminary stuff for various chambers and simulations are up, and I am trying to constantly add more stuff 21-Jan-19 11:47 AM @heye the website is here: http://appliedionsystems.com/ 21-Jan-19 11:47 AM most of the updates get posted immediately to twitter first since it's easier, then I write up and add stuff to the site as I go along 21-Jan-19 11:47 AM I also add writeups for non vacuum projects such as electrospinning, atmospheric plasma treatment, etc. I will be starting a series on DIY pulsed power soon as well 21-Jan-19 11:59 AM That's a nice website also, you have a new twitter follower ^^ 21-Jan-19 11:59 AM thanks! 21-Jan-19 12:01 PM I'm a fan of the small satellite propulsion testing, was thinking about something similar, but it's much more complicated than the sputter I'm working on right now ^^ 21-Jan-19 12:05 PM yeah, it takes quite a bit more planning, especially on the vacuum side. My propulsion testing chamber is very simple, made from x2 6" conflat tees: 21-Jan-19 12:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Micro_Propulsion_Test_Chamber-EADD7.jpg 21-Jan-19 12:05 PM 6 inputs on the left for the engine, 9 inputs on the right for diagnostics, and 6" conflat viewport for direct engine viewing 21-Jan-19 12:05 PM for what I am looking to do, mainly pulsed plasma thrusters, I only need a vacuum of around 10^-6 torr base, and operating pressure of 10^-5 torr. Hall thrusters require more stringent vacuum levels, but other thrusters can generally be run at lower levels 21-Jan-19 12:05 PM the specs for this system are here so far: http://appliedionsystems.com/portfolio/micro-propulsion-testing-chamber/ 21-Jan-19 12:10 PM Shouldn't it be possible to run something like a HET in 10^-5? I remember reading a paper that said you didn't need to compensate measurements for small thrusters and only larger thrusters had significantly different measurements compared to 10^-8 or so 21-Jan-19 12:10 PM and nice 'simple' construction by the way ^^ 21-Jan-19 12:14 PM they should be able to be run at those levels, though from what I have seen the recommended levels are usually higher than 10^-6. However, you are probably right about small engines, since most thrusters tested for HET are on the larger size, not really the small-scale size I am looking at. I will definitely try exploring them regardless, shouldn't hurt! Though the main issue is gas feed, which my system currently does not have. PPTs have an advantage that it makes it cheaper and simpler to run, not having to worry about gas handling for the engine since the fuel is teflon. 21-Jan-19 12:16 PM Yeah the missing gas feed was another question I had I mean in a real small satellite you have everything on board, gas-tank etc. If you planned to test the complete thing you didn't need a gas feed ^^ 21-Jan-19 12:19 PM true lol, though I don't plan on making full satellites, just exploring open source development and providing resources for the thrusters and modules. I have looked around a lot, and I don't believe I have seen much, if any, work on thrusters in the open source small satellite community, but my focus on this research has been much less than the accelerator development for now. 21-Jan-19 12:25 PM Yeah there is not a lot open source propulsion going on... Hopefully that will change eventually ^^ And the accelerator seems like a nice ambitious project, not my thing, but I hope you will get it working 21-Jan-19 12:34 PM Thanks! The accelerator is definitely a massively challenging build, but I expect to get at least some results, even if not ideal at the beginning. However if its successful, the system would allow for a new door to high power beam -based physics at the amateur level not really tapped into before. My hope is also that the propulsion system work will help lower the barrier of entry into the field, and provide resources for very simple low cost modules small groups can build and implement on their own. For some of these thrusters, like PPTs, the cost is still exorbitantly high, and I think some of these can be made much cheaper and explored at the maker level. There is already a lot of work on open source cubesat stuff - just gotta bring propulsion into the mix now! 22-Jan-19 02:11 AM i'm using Al for UHV too, downside is only the lower max temp compared to SS 22-Jan-19 03:22 AM (slight machining off-topic: plastic extrusion: https://twitter.com/Saturnax1/status/1087426608720429056 ) 22-Jan-19 03:22 AM #machining-that-is-sometime-offtopic-which-is-sometimes-on-topic 22-Jan-19 03:22 AM oh wow, I never new the scale of these things 22-Jan-19 04:24 AM was about to change the name of the channel, but decided to wait until april fools also, Adam might not laugh 22-Jan-19 04:34 AM wow 23-Jan-19 03:50 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/1548287425591958776055-929CE.jpg 23-Jan-19 05:10 PM I dont see any that were cut/physically altered 23-Jan-19 05:10 PM we worked on our lapelle pins more today, I started to frost mine (btw, it is of the state of Ohio in the US) 23-Jan-19 05:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0018-4F21A.jpg 23-Jan-19 05:10 PM that is 60-90 grit SiC 23-Jan-19 05:10 PM the main exercise was making a rivet, which you can see the different brass alloy.. I ended up priming this to paint in a day or two because I am from the capitol of Ohio, and the rivet was not located where it's at (it is slightly off) and would drive me crazy if I looked at it long enough.. so going to paint it to RAL 6011, raseda green 23-Jan-19 05:10 PM lathed the nut, filed a square on it.. also counterbored some stuff on another project 04-Feb-19 08:43 AM Lovely! 04-Feb-19 08:43 AM Drilling a 0.125mm hole in a lathe: 04-Feb-19 08:43 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzVDk5bUOiM 08-Feb-19 05:02 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/photo_2019-02-08_14-02-08-9AB47.jpg 08-Feb-19 05:05 AM The painnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn 08-Feb-19 05:05 AM 08-Feb-19 05:05 AM https://giphy.com/gifs/YwOFosmTM0Vag 08-Feb-19 05:06 AM https://tenor.com/view/seriously-sideeye-confused-gif-8776030 08-Feb-19 05:11 AM There are hells for people like that. 08-Feb-19 05:27 AM what, welders? 08-Feb-19 05:35 AM everyone that uses a micrometer like that. 08-Feb-19 05:35 AM (I don't have one, XDDDD) 08-Feb-19 06:50 AM pfft, if it is out of calibration might as well use it as a c clamp 08-Feb-19 06:56 AM Yeah I know, but without a context, it hurts to see. 08-Feb-19 10:59 AM yeaaa uhg... even if its out of cal... it should still be linear, so you can use it to measure differences... see how much material you've taken off... etc... 08-Feb-19 10:59 AM unless its completely borked 08-Feb-19 11:26 AM Lol my only micrometer is a 9,90eur china special from a local autoparts store 08-Feb-19 11:26 AM Good enough for my current use 08-Feb-19 11:26 AM It was chosen among the units availabe by checking which had the least roughness in travel. 08-Feb-19 12:36 PM Behold my new part project! 08-Feb-19 12:36 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190208_213712-84B59.jpg 08-Feb-19 12:36 PM KF25. I will weld-grow the lugs for the passthroughs and machine them aftwerwards. 08-Feb-19 12:40 PM why the 90° turn in the plates instead of a straight capacitor design? 08-Feb-19 12:43 PM To be able to adjust and reorient them. A straight wire would mean a very difficult time, if possible, to do it. With that angle, I can sort of separate or join the plates and make them turn around an axis to have a proper 90° between x and y stages. 08-Feb-19 12:43 PM (also its more like 45°) 08-Feb-19 12:51 PM Now I need the KF25 piece, but I only have found them in the US 08-Feb-19 12:51 PM Neat! Though I've heard welds are REALLLYYY hard to get to a point of not having microcracks/holes in them that cause vacuum leak... But I think your welding skills are far above most of us :) 08-Feb-19 12:52 PM or maybe they get slathered in some funky epoxy 08-Feb-19 12:52 PM Looking at that makes me want to make my own CRT tube someday. 08-Feb-19 12:52 PM I have some KF/NW25 stuff... But not an extreme amount of it 08-Feb-19 12:52 PM Naaaa, my weld skills suck, but if instead of joining a tube, I grow the metal then machine it, i think it pretty much guarantees a leak proof part. 08-Feb-19 12:53 PM I think the short section of KF25 I have currently is for coming off my Turbo since it has to come out a bit otherwise you run into interference problems 08-Feb-19 12:53 PM I have found one on ebay for 14$, but shipping to me.would be too expensive 08-Feb-19 12:53 PM I'll keep an eye out for you, or if you find something you like in the states let me know and I can add it to your box 08-Feb-19 12:53 PM You are too busy 08-Feb-19 12:53 PM remember I still owe you a box :P 08-Feb-19 12:53 PM I'm not too busy to receive a part 08-Feb-19 12:53 PM I'm at home every day 08-Feb-19 12:53 PM I can ship your stuff any day to be honest now that I'm on more of a morning schedule 08-Feb-19 12:54 PM XD 08-Feb-19 12:54 PM its just more of... I kinda figured you'd end up wanting more parts from the states and like... yea... 08-Feb-19 12:54 PM Bahahahaj 08-Feb-19 12:54 PM lets order that part tonight and I'll add it to your pile :P 08-Feb-19 12:54 PM Okay, okay 08-Feb-19 12:54 PM shipping to you won't cost any extra lol 08-Feb-19 12:54 PM Okay, let me.find it 08-Feb-19 12:55 PM or if it does it'll be peanuts 08-Feb-19 01:07 PM XD, link sent 08-Feb-19 01:54 PM whoever was saying that watchmakers lathes are a dime a dozen at german swap meets.. will pay big bucks for a complete (and I do mean complete) Favorite lathe.. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Favorite-lathe-8mm-watchmaker-tool-for-Bergeon-Schaublin/223368942296 08-Feb-19 01:54 PM doublew tee eff is a swear word? 08-Feb-19 01:54 PM ok 08-Feb-19 02:15 PM cr4p is too 08-Feb-19 02:19 PM wow beautiful 08-Feb-19 02:59 PM fabulous 08-Feb-19 02:59 PM just schmeared the rip in the roof with a whole tube of silicone 08-Feb-19 02:59 PM prob half an inch came down on me as I did it 08-Feb-19 02:59 PM of snow 08-Feb-19 03:00 PM This is the vacuum discord, we use JB weld to fix leaks here 08-Feb-19 03:01 PM FlexSeal 08-Feb-19 03:01 PM this was a building brand thing 08-Feb-19 03:01 PM that makes weather barriers 08-Feb-19 03:01 PM I got their whole product line, basically 08-Feb-19 03:01 PM and on-hand 08-Feb-19 03:01 PM uniquely prepared 09-Feb-19 07:40 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ds6qZ7Ss2fA 09-Feb-19 10:14 AM 09-Feb-19 10:14 AM Love This Old Tony <3 09-Feb-19 10:45 AM hah, too bad there isnt much info out there on cycloidal gears, which I have to work with 09-Feb-19 10:45 AM really only one main supplier anymore 09-Feb-19 10:45 AM but, at least that 09-Feb-19 11:39 AM only one suplier? how come so? 09-Feb-19 12:27 PM because there isnt a big demand 09-Feb-19 12:29 PM ah. Can it be asked what do you do to need those? 09-Feb-19 12:29 PM (I thought they where widely used in huge hydraulic motors) 09-Feb-19 12:30 PM I dont think they use cutters in that situation, they use like an end mill 09-Feb-19 12:30 PM watches use cycloidal primarily because involute tooth form doesnt work well for below 8 or so teeth 09-Feb-19 12:30 PM and some pinions are only 6 teeth 09-Feb-19 12:30 PM so, your standard "gear" has two, the wheel and hte pinion 09-Feb-19 12:30 PM typically wheels drive pinions 09-Feb-19 08:13 PM I thought I was told/read that Shapeways had basically rackmounted 3d printers.. I watched a few of their vids on their 'factory'(s) and most of those machines(appliances) were as big as a rack, maybe setup similar distance to how datacenters are configured, but not really... anyways, I've thought about rackmounted machining equipment before, either for modulatirty or space savings.. anyone know of any company/product that does that? 09-Feb-19 08:13 PM Machining as a Service 09-Feb-19 11:18 PM Machining as a service? Yeah, there are some. With a service similar to shapeways, you upload the model and they dirextly quote a machining price. 09-Feb-19 11:18 PM I don't have names on my phone right now 09-Feb-19 11:52 PM However, rackmounting machining equipment doesn't seem much feasible. I haven't heard of anyone making a company based on the "Pocket NC" and any other machine is simply too big to be practical to have in more than one level. 10-Feb-19 02:22 AM In case not everyone knows him already, this guy just came to my mind for some reason. https://www.youtube.com/user/dgelbart/videos Much stuff applicable to our kind of work 10-Feb-19 02:32 AM He is the one with the granite/1micron lathe? 10-Feb-19 02:36 AM exactly that guy 10-Feb-19 04:28 AM Heh puts medal on 10-Feb-19 06:30 AM Pr0n: 10-Feb-19 06:30 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-60DAB.png 10-Feb-19 06:30 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-C41EB.png 10-Feb-19 06:30 AM I have to build this. 10-Feb-19 06:30 AM I need to do it. 10-Feb-19 06:31 AM uh damn 10-Feb-19 06:31 AM u really want it, huh? 10-Feb-19 06:31 AM go for it 10-Feb-19 06:31 AM 8mm thick walls. 90mm windows. 10-Feb-19 06:31 AM (100mm glass discs) 10-Feb-19 06:31 AM (no money right now) 10-Feb-19 06:32 AM you want to start from 12 stainless steel pieces? 10-Feb-19 06:32 AM Yes, that thing is HUGE at 200mm tall (flat to flat) 10-Feb-19 06:32 AM I mean, 200mm doesn't seem that much, I know...but I think it's going to look bigger than it seems 10-Feb-19 06:32 AM at 90mm holes, I can fit my hand in there easily. 10-Feb-19 06:52 AM drewl 10-Feb-19 06:52 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-D9A75.png 10-Feb-19 06:52 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-21446.png 10-Feb-19 06:52 AM got this beauty recently, roughly 300mm dia and 20-30kg of stainless 10-Feb-19 06:54 AM omg when did you take this photo? 10-Feb-19 06:54 AM oh ok 10-Feb-19 07:06 AM WOAH 10-Feb-19 07:06 AM lovely!!!!! 10-Feb-19 07:06 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-DAA58.png 10-Feb-19 07:06 AM (last photo with o-rings and glass) 10-Feb-19 07:39 AM oh myyy 10-Feb-19 07:39 AM you have to build a fusor in a chamber like that! 10-Feb-19 07:57 AM I have to build a chamber like that. 10-Feb-19 07:57 AM We can talki about what to use it for afterwards. 10-Feb-19 07:57 AM Besides, you'll be giving me money for one like that. 10-Feb-19 08:07 AM ...damn 10-Feb-19 08:10 AM so you don't need the chamber part from me anymore? 10-Feb-19 08:11 AM if you get me the one from nixie for the same price as yours 10-Feb-19 08:13 AM https://tenor.com/view/well-welp-oh-dear-awkward-gif-9309318 10-Feb-19 08:20 AM It is going to take me a looooooooooooooooooooooong while to make that chamber. 10-Feb-19 08:20 AM what chamber part? 10-Feb-19 08:22 AM sorry, haven't got a pic of that 10-Feb-19 08:22 AM it's a CF tee (somewhere in the neighbourhood of 100-160) with lots of smaller ports placed everywhere 10-Feb-19 08:25 AM this shape 10-Feb-19 08:25 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190130_203535__01-A9548.jpg 10-Feb-19 08:27 AM Ah, that should be cheaper, I guess. 10-Feb-19 08:27 AM actual cost is... getting it from dirac to me 10-Feb-19 08:29 AM Yeah, well at least I'll have your envy. 10-Feb-19 02:05 PM Making a mister for my little CNC mill 10-Feb-19 02:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_1313-C1187.JPG 10-Feb-19 02:05 PM ...using microfluidic tubing... 10-Feb-19 10:57 PM If it works, it works. 10-Feb-19 10:57 PM I am super dissapointed with mine. 10-Feb-19 10:57 PM (commercial, chinese, not the best) 11-Feb-19 06:54 AM Okay, I don't usually follow clickspring, but this was impressive: 11-Feb-19 06:54 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtjvWU0Ij-c 11-Feb-19 09:46 AM Okay, after calculating glass strenght in some online calculators, I could not use 4mm thick glass. So I had to switch to 10mm thick, but had a different diameter (109mm). So redesigned the whole thing again: 11-Feb-19 09:46 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Final_version_10mm_thick_glass-D18BE.jpg 11-Feb-19 09:46 AM 8mm thick stainless. 98mm holes. 220mm internal diameter. 11-Feb-19 09:46 AM Coolnes factor 1.000.000±1% 11-Feb-19 09:46 AM Fusion says 7.5 Kg (stainless core, borosilicate glass, nylon retainer and nitrile rubber. 11-Feb-19 11:06 AM thats light weight for such a big chamber 11-Feb-19 11:15 AM It's not that big actually. 11-Feb-19 11:15 AM I mean, 220mm of internal diameter is huge compared to my tiny 1L chamber 11-Feb-19 11:15 AM but it's not that much, or efficient. 11-Feb-19 11:16 AM hm 220mm is really not that much, somehow looked like more :d 11-Feb-19 11:17 AM Yeah, I know 11-Feb-19 11:17 AM but it's based on two things: 11-Feb-19 11:17 AM Maximum diameter I can turn on my lathe. (those pieces are around 160mm already, max is 200ish. 11-Feb-19 11:17 AM and a cheap source of 10x109mm borosilicate round viewports. 11-Feb-19 11:17 AM (10€ a piece) 11-Feb-19 03:41 PM Btw, I am very proud of this fixture: 11-Feb-19 03:41 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190212_004212-21A88.jpg 11-Feb-19 03:41 PM 3*M7 screws attach this plate to the lathe, whereas the four 8mm holes will attach it to the rotary table. 11-Feb-19 03:41 PM The small fingers on the outside get bent with a beveled screw (each) clamping the pentagonal piece by the inside. The lip will hold the piece against cuttting forces. Using the M7 screws from the front can help holding the pentagonal plate for machining from the underside. 12-Feb-19 08:33 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190212_173122-C16A3.jpg 12-Feb-19 08:33 AM Yeah, size is spot on. Hand goes in comfortably. Now to print 2 or 3 more to get a feel of the size and welding hand positions. 13-Feb-19 05:14 AM Mockup model says it will be fairly easy to weld inside the chamber: 13-Feb-19 05:14 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DzScQBJWwAECIV_-50C50.png 13-Feb-19 05:14 AM A flexible neck in the torch helps with the angle, and I can always use a shorter electrode/electrode cap. 13-Feb-19 05:14 AM And on top of my current turbo: 13-Feb-19 05:14 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DzScSRgW0AIEM9--E49AB.png 13-Feb-19 05:14 AM I'll need a turbo with a flange diameter of 110mm when this project is a go, so I can directly couple it to the chamber. 13-Feb-19 05:14 AM @GigaSquirrel do you know if there is one with such size? 13-Feb-19 05:22 AM check the usual ISO sizes, you should find at least one pump for each size 13-Feb-19 05:25 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-414D6.png 13-Feb-19 05:25 AM ISO 80, seems to be. 13-Feb-19 05:25 AM Do you think it will be viable to find? 13-Feb-19 08:39 PM Sharpening hand gravers for a practice machining exam, tomorrow 13-Feb-19 08:39 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0079-11005.jpg 14-Feb-19 12:53 AM OMFG...The Crimes of Grindelmachining! 14-Feb-19 12:53 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m28xx9j0_Cc 14-Feb-19 07:32 PM oh my god @Nixie you're really building it aren't you 14-Feb-19 07:32 PM clearly i've been missing out on some excitement o.O 14-Feb-19 10:29 PM @qualia yes. It will take some months, as I am still jobless, but that dodecagonal simplified version is perfectly doable in my workshop. 14-Feb-19 10:53 PM Seriously? noone is going to check why I posted that video? 14-Feb-19 10:53 PM Dammit, people, I do things for a reason! 14-Feb-19 11:41 PM okay okay it's actually pretty cool >.> 15-Feb-19 12:36 AM good luck @Noxz ! 15-Feb-19 12:36 AM @Nixie ISO80 will be hard, never seen those. but ISO63 and ISO100 should be doable. otherwise make an adapter? 15-Feb-19 01:06 AM Yeah, counted on that, but a direct coupling would be nice, wouldn't it? 15-Feb-19 02:50 AM defintily, maybe you can just machine your own fitting body like @george did 15-Feb-19 03:03 AM Maybe, or machine down the existing body to fit. Well, that should not worry me in a long time. 15-Feb-19 05:06 AM Wow: 15-Feb-19 05:06 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvM1zE7Zfh0 15-Feb-19 05:14 AM Metal 3D printing at home might be different than I though. 15-Feb-19 06:17 AM the practice exam was relaitvely easy.. make a winding stem, 3x the size, in brass 15-Feb-19 06:17 AM only tricky part was a 3mm divet thing (for the setting lever post) which I got to dimension by taking some 3mm round steel stock and made a temporary hand graver out of it (filed two flats on it, no heat treating because.. brass) 15-Feb-19 06:17 AM others actually modified cutters and so forth, I think my method was fastest 15-Feb-19 12:40 PM btw, I passed.. like 5/7.. the finishing I failed, and one critical dimension I measured wrong, and thus failed 15-Feb-19 12:40 PM I had beveling on the stem 15-Feb-19 12:40 PM square part 15-Feb-19 12:40 PM meh 15-Feb-19 12:40 PM Monday is a holiday here, so I will have a nice long weekend to hack on some high pressure stuffs 15-Feb-19 01:05 PM Well, next time you'll do better! (will we get pics sometime? for...huh...science? 15-Feb-19 02:33 PM oh, I was returned the part, but I did not even look at it, I mean, I made it the day before, so meh 15-Feb-19 02:33 PM the grading was explained on a 1:1 15-Feb-19 02:33 PM 1:1 = face to face with instructor 15-Feb-19 02:33 PM "one on one" is typically how I say that 15-Feb-19 02:33 PM buuut.. I just got a watch delivered from england.. about to open it up.. pics coming up.. in another channel 16-Feb-19 12:08 AM Good, good. 17-Feb-19 01:38 PM https://imgur.com/a/38SqmmU 19-Feb-19 09:45 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qR_HueJoVHk 19-Feb-19 09:45 AM Heh, they don't show how the ball actuator seal is made. 20-Feb-19 05:24 PM handmade 6497 Yoke 20-Feb-19 05:24 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0122-8CABC.jpg 20-Feb-19 10:26 PM Lovely! 20-Feb-19 10:35 PM I have been working on a mechanical latch for the phone holder. Yesterday got into double lever latching, and it works beautifully. 20-Feb-19 10:35 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190221_073358-C86A4.jpg 20-Feb-19 10:35 PM For the less mechanically inclined: The clasp opening vector gets diverted to the frame via the secondary lever/actuator, so the small ball latch between the two actually doesn't see any force, and allows for a very good clamping mechanism. 20-Feb-19 10:35 PM https://twitter.com/nixie_guy/status/1098353534322593792?s=19 20-Feb-19 10:35 PM (very satisfying clasping sound) 20-Feb-19 11:36 PM awesome 21-Feb-19 02:16 AM Heh...went wild with the lever. Also, probabaly final color scheme: 21-Feb-19 02:16 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-58F99.png 21-Feb-19 06:00 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYzQNgIwqgo 21-Feb-19 06:00 AM A bit of everything. It's a bit pedantic, but fun to watch. Especially certain "precision" details. 21-Feb-19 06:00 AM Also, we should look into metal spinning to make our own diffusion pumps. 22-Feb-19 12:59 AM yeah, that's nice 23-Feb-19 02:23 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTG1TTR1CJk 23-Feb-19 04:27 PM @Nixie The latch idea is neat.. I recently thought of a place in a watch that could be useful to have such a thing.. basically combining some components into a single - since there is no adjustment between them, and the latch would close upon the component it acts on is inserted/installed, keeping it in place.. so no screwing it down.. then to remove you would push a lever to release it, instead of unscrewing 23-Feb-19 04:27 PM I love the concept of 'self' assembly 23-Feb-19 04:27 PM and monocoque designs 23-Feb-19 04:27 PM I am currently 'battling' the idea of some thrust 'bearing' (not really, just a wall since it rarely gets rotated, only during winding) 23-Feb-19 04:51 PM "clasp" is a good word for the latch.. great example (as pointed out in a video I just watched) is the buckle for backpacks or similar 23-Feb-19 11:09 PM 23-Feb-19 11:17 PM I am pretty proud of it too. PLA is not the best plastic for those two pieces, though. I should really think about making them in abs or nylon (shapeways maybe? My cetus can't do ABS). I have a little obsession with clamping, clasping, latching and buckling mechanisms. (enough to dream yesterday about writing a small booklet about the concepts (no maths, no much history) on them. Shame I'm not an expert enough, so actual clamping historians would just LMAO at it. 23-Feb-19 11:40 PM @Nixie I'm a fan of [distrubted] compliant mechanisms.. I am sur ehaving the 3d printer allows you to test ideas fairly quick 23-Feb-19 11:48 PM Yeah. I tend to print in the highest settings, wich take a long time, but I get the piece that can't be easily machined, so it's okay. 23-Feb-19 11:48 PM Yeah 23-Feb-19 11:48 PM You might consider buying one, one like mine is fairly cheap. (Cetus 3D) 23-Feb-19 11:48 PM A friend didnt recognize a line from a song 23-Feb-19 11:49 PM Aaand...you posted it in #machining 23-Feb-19 11:50 PM I thought I had the DM window open in discord 23-Feb-19 11:50 PM Ah! 23-Feb-19 11:50 PM Too much non looped pneumatic connections, I guess. 23-Feb-19 11:50 PM rofl 23-Feb-19 11:51 PM among other things 23-Feb-19 11:52 PM @Noxz BUT should you want to test first, I can print and send pieces for you. 23-Feb-19 11:52 PM (in PLA) 23-Feb-19 11:53 PM I am sure I can find people with printers around.. or I can make things out of metal and just machine them to spec 23-Feb-19 11:53 PM which is going to be the end goal anyways 24-Feb-19 12:01 AM I love the idea of fast prototyping, even if neded to be 5x the size due to minimum resolution able to print 24-Feb-19 12:12 AM 24-Feb-19 12:12 AM Yeah about machining, I just have happened to start designing things that would be difficult to machine in a 5 axis center. 24-Feb-19 12:12 AM (and that they allow to be made in plastic) Altough I have started to do more and more hybid designs (incorporating metal parts) 24-Feb-19 12:12 AM (btw, I meant if you wanted tests with the particular printer model, there are so many types, chances of testing the same one, are small. ) 24-Feb-19 03:34 AM Bahahaa, the ToT video is excellent. "Weekly Machinists anonymous" 27-Feb-19 06:12 AM pretty sure I am going to buy that swiss jig borer.. 27-Feb-19 07:07 AM Niiiiiiiiiice 27-Feb-19 07:07 AM How was the exammmmmmm (second query, btw) 27-Feb-19 06:07 PM Lorch Junior 27-Feb-19 06:07 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0133-C7517.jpg 27-Feb-19 06:07 PM my lil watchmaker lathe arrived 27-Feb-19 06:07 PM it's so cute 27-Feb-19 06:07 PM more attachments, btw 27-Feb-19 06:07 PM I rewired it for 120v, and also replaced some corroded wires 27-Feb-19 07:06 PM I half wish that I had a shot of all the accesories with it.. maybe tomorrow, we do have a machining project but it should not take too much time 27-Feb-19 10:30 PM Omg, so lovely!! 28-Feb-19 08:02 AM such a lathe would be perfect for my phone restoration projects... polishing screws and axles and turning new ones if necessary... but the small ones are usually veeery expensive :-( 04-Mar-19 05:20 PM I have to redo this part because it drilled off center! still getting the hang of this lil girl 04-Mar-19 05:20 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0138-67EB2.jpg 04-Mar-19 05:24 PM its just so cute lol 04-Mar-19 05:24 PM having one of those would actually be pretty handy for simple small bits I guess 04-Mar-19 05:24 PM but do you just machine the parts by hand basically? 04-Mar-19 05:24 PM I suppose I don't fully understand the skill to use a watchmakers lathe 04-Mar-19 05:26 PM there is some hand graving 04-Mar-19 05:26 PM but we use the cross slide quite a bit 04-Mar-19 05:27 PM ah ok I suppose thats just a removable piece? 04-Mar-19 05:29 PM I was making an adapter for the "horia tool" whihc is used to set jewels and such 04-Mar-19 05:29 PM depth them 04-Mar-19 05:29 PM those are normally 4mm diameter, but Rolex has their own toos which are 3mm, so we made an adapter 04-Mar-19 05:29 PM and a set screw 04-Mar-19 05:30 PM cool 04-Mar-19 05:30 PM I plan on redoing my set screw and using an old Rolex crown I was given 04-Mar-19 05:30 PM its wonderful to have a tool which you can use to make adapters for other tools or itself :) 04-Mar-19 05:30 PM I really really need a lathe lol 04-Mar-19 05:30 PM if it weren't for my grandfather's house being 4-5 hours away by car I'd be on his lathe/milling machine heh 04-Mar-19 05:31 PM I am pretty sure I am going to get the jig borer I am looking at, too, but I need various other things to verify the condition, such as length standards 04-Mar-19 05:31 PM to check the acuracy throughout the lead screw 04-Mar-19 05:31 PM anwho, dogwalk time! 04-Mar-19 05:31 PM lemme post one diff pic in showandtell 05-Mar-19 04:54 PM for those that work with lathes.. when should a screw feed tailstock be used and when should a lever be used? lever typically for feel and quick removal of material.. but screw has much greater mechanical advantage to cut into 06-Mar-19 02:11 PM https://youtu.be/gDQLIEV3IpA 08-Mar-19 10:30 AM Interesting heatsking shaping: 08-Mar-19 10:30 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghrjJ1OL6jM 09-Mar-19 11:48 AM w00t, just got the report frommy buddy about the swiss jig borer.. apparently the readouts are in inches though!... overall I think I should go for it (and of course change the digits) base don his findings.. some work needed, yes, but this puppy wont show up again 09-Mar-19 12:23 PM niiiiiice 10-Mar-19 11:32 AM ha. i machined something! 10-Mar-19 11:32 AM there's something satisfying about drilling 13mm holes with a sharp drill into 4mm alu... 10-Mar-19 01:40 PM nice! 10-Mar-19 01:40 PM What for? 10-Mar-19 01:42 PM to mount my tool wall on my worktable 10-Mar-19 01:42 PM the tabletop is held onto the steel frame with M12 bolts 10-Mar-19 01:43 PM No photos? 10-Mar-19 01:43 PM bad 10-Mar-19 01:43 PM i machined a alu fence to screw down with those so the wooden tool wall panel can't slip off the table 10-Mar-19 01:43 PM photos when it's finished. 2 holes 1m apart in a piece of 60x100 angle ir...alu are pretty boring. :-D 10-Mar-19 01:45 PM not if you did them with a boring head 10-Mar-19 01:45 PM XDDDDDDDDD 10-Mar-19 01:46 PM no, but it was a big drill doing it. 10-Mar-19 01:46 PM You love your big drills. 10-Mar-19 01:46 PM XDDD 11-Mar-19 07:50 PM got a counter offer for the jig borer.. will likely accept it.. kinda done messing around gambling if someone else will snag it 12-Mar-19 01:13 AM hey 12-Mar-19 01:13 AM if i want to make such watch-maker-tiny stuff, it's handy to use a small lathe, right? 12-Mar-19 01:13 AM or should i mount a SteMi on my large lathe to keep my face at a safe distance? :3 12-Mar-19 01:13 AM are there any good books about the secret sauce of watch making? 12-Mar-19 02:04 AM Maybe change the lathe chuck for a collet chuck. 12-Mar-19 02:24 AM yeah that provided 12-Mar-19 02:24 AM but ... small lathes are kinda cute 12-Mar-19 02:49 AM totally 12-Mar-19 09:19 AM hehe 13-Mar-19 07:45 AM Plasma time! 13-Mar-19 07:45 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-C865F.png 13-Mar-19 07:45 AM This is the top plate for the electron beam experiment thingy. 13-Mar-19 07:45 AM Oh boy, this is going to take a whiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiile... 13-Mar-19 07:45 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/D1icJsEWkAAsu7v-8F465.png 13-Mar-19 09:43 AM My offer for the swiss jig borer was accepted, hopefully it is delivered during the break of winter/spring quarter of school 13-Mar-19 10:56 AM Nice! 13-Mar-19 10:56 AM I expect tons of photos 13-Mar-19 10:56 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/D1jlSB-XgAIExZP-77ECC.png 13-Mar-19 10:56 AM (I managed to give myself cuts in three fingers. Superglue shower time!) 13-Mar-19 12:16 PM You call yourself a machinist, I call you a masochist :P 13-Mar-19 12:20 PM Lord Masochinist for you. 13-Mar-19 12:20 PM Btw, I'm using a sacrificial peg that I face everytime, then apply good 3M thin doublesided tape to hold the disc. 13-Mar-19 01:28 PM oh... thats only being held onto the chuck with 3M tape basically? XD 13-Mar-19 01:28 PM that sounds... dangerous... 13-Mar-19 01:28 PM is that aluminum or SS304? 13-Mar-19 02:40 PM Sometimes only emery paper is used for friction ifa tailstock is used.. Joe piecynzsky did a video about it recene 13-Mar-19 02:40 PM I thought itwas w/re to a trepanning tool 13-Mar-19 02:40 PM Making a disc from a sheet 13-Mar-19 03:08 PM oh wow neat 13-Mar-19 03:08 PM totally can tell how much I've used a lathe 14-Mar-19 01:26 AM 304SS, yes. The trick, if there is one, is that the DCGT inserts I use are extremely sharp, wich reduces cutting pressure a huge amount. Supposedly, they are only good for aluminium, however, this is carbide after all, so that is only true for real production environments, where insert life and cumulative cost is also important. To me, only results matter, so I can get away with that. 14-Mar-19 01:26 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DCGT-11T302-ALU-AK10-CARBIDE-INSERT-TURNIN-793B9.png 14-Mar-19 01:26 AM DCGT on top, DCMT on bottom, see how different the cutting edges are? 14-Mar-19 01:26 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/32420-Inserts_MG_7096_1-36B56.png 14-Mar-19 01:26 AM The double sided tape I'm using is a high temp 200micron good quality (NOT non-descript chinese something) tape. Even then, turning that without the tailstock IS dangerous, so my facing cuts are extremely shallow when doing that. 14-Mar-19 01:26 AM (Before anyone says I can use a superglue chuck, I don't like them). In any case, I keep checking the temperature of the stock, and when it's warm to the touch, I stop machining until it totally cools down. (keeping pressure with the tailstock when cooling down) 14-Mar-19 01:40 AM @Conmega , that's what this sub-section is for, to show weird things we machine, so others can learn. (and I am by no means even a decent machinist, believe me) 14-Mar-19 02:08 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190314_100757-94E27.jpg 14-Mar-19 02:08 AM Faced! 14-Mar-19 02:08 AM Holder: 14-Mar-19 02:08 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190314_100803-19E59.jpg 14-Mar-19 02:47 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190314_104734-42E12.jpg 14-Mar-19 02:47 AM O-ring holder recess. (1.5mm*106,5mm) 14-Mar-19 04:10 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-27C79.png 14-Mar-19 04:10 AM The SS stock was limited in size, hence the difference in diameters. Screws will be M3 and come from the bottom piece, because the ring is aluminium and I prefer not to put pressure in the aluminium. 14-Mar-19 04:34 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-E2C89.png 14-Mar-19 04:34 AM And modeled with KF25 and KF16 ports. I might shorten the KF16 one (the hornet gauge goes in there) depending on my mood. XDDD 14-Mar-19 04:45 AM do you have those ports or do you need some? 14-Mar-19 04:46 AM Have, have. 14-Mar-19 04:46 AM (that's the last pieces I ordered a month ago, when I still had money XD) 14-Mar-19 04:46 AM (well, not exactly, the KF16 is from when I started with HV, but you get the idea) 14-Mar-19 04:46 AM Thanks, btw. 14-Mar-19 04:46 AM It is going to be interesting to see how do I couple the plate and ring to the rotary table (it's a small 100mm table) 14-Mar-19 06:03 AM And because I'm insane... 14-Mar-19 06:03 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-E3468.png 14-Mar-19 06:03 AM Should this require high precision, I would make that holder out of aluminium, but since this is only aproximate, I'm going to 3D print that, to hold it down in the rotary table. 14-Mar-19 06:03 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-A698E.png 14-Mar-19 07:34 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/D1oEJJzWsAALwxl-BF175.png 14-Mar-19 11:50 AM Okay, the thing worked and didn't. Plates got centered well, but base was too flimsy. Printing a thicker one now. 14-Mar-19 11:50 AM Also 99% infill instead of 85% 14-Mar-19 11:50 AM And less holes on the outside. 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM TL;DR -> finished the holes succesfully. 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190315_141641-BB115.jpg 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Printed a massive support with 0.6mm nozzle. It has always given me not perfect results, and the piece was slightly flimsy. I put some superglue in the body to reinforce and after drying for a few hours, centered it in the rotary table, measuring the outside of the aluminium ring. (Could not get it better than within 0,12mm runout but that should be good enough) 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM I suspect the ring wasn't all that concentric anyways. 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM In any case, the setup wasn't rigid enough to drill (kinda knew that) but allowed me to do spot drills in both rings, concentrically. (First in the aluminium ring, then in the stainless plate) 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190315_123136-B60C0.jpg 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM With that I went to the drill press and made 2.5mm all around, then 4mm in the aluminium and 2.7mm for the M3 tap, I know the correct drill is 2.5, but I didn't want to risk breaking a tap, as I don't have spares for anything. 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190315_140908-38E95.jpg 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Everything aligns properly (huge margins in the whole setup, so nothing to be proud of) 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190315_140715-CF118.jpg 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM In position: 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190315_141611-9C7B4.jpg 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Side view: 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190315_141604-D5F50.jpg 15-Mar-19 06:19 AM Next week, port holes and welding. 15-Mar-19 08:15 AM ohhh very nice!! 15-Mar-19 08:15 AM Can't wait to see how your welds go and ultimately how your vacuum does 15-Mar-19 09:15 AM Next week I should be doing the hole-ing and welding. Hopefully I'll get the hornet soon so I can test end vacuum. 15-Mar-19 10:01 AM Yes I hope you do, I sent you the one I could find... Not sure if it was the better conditioned one... 15-Mar-19 10:01 AM I seriously completely freaking lost my other one... YAY 15-Mar-19 10:01 AM I might order like 2 more since they are so cheap lol 15-Mar-19 10:01 AM But yea sadly no tracking for overseas packages, so hopefully you'll get it sooner than later 15-Mar-19 10:01 AM they got the address exact minus the degree symbol in the apartment number? Since they didn't have it on the keyboard and I don't just remember the alt key combo stuff for that 15-Mar-19 10:01 AM I did mark it as return to sender if it can't find its way, so its not like they should just seize it if its lost... 15-Mar-19 10:21 AM Well, let's hope for the best. XDDD 18-Mar-19 02:13 AM Can you TIG 304 stainless onto 316 stainless? 18-Mar-19 02:18 AM It seems so, but with caveats, and special wires: 18-Mar-19 02:18 AM https://app.aws.org/forum/topic_show.pl?tid=5254 18-Mar-19 07:56 AM i have some fancy MIG wire somewhere, some special stainless alloy to weld dissimilar stainless parts... if anybody needs a few meters that stuff, i can see if i can find it 18-Mar-19 08:06 AM 18-Mar-19 08:55 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97t7Xj_iBv0 18-Mar-19 09:01 AM for a vacuum chamber or a pressure vessel that runs at regular temperatures I'd just weld them together 18-Mar-19 12:45 PM Saw it the other day on twitter. The damn book of the professor costs 120+€ 18-Mar-19 12:45 PM https://twitter.com/scanlime/status/1107540244163788801 19-Mar-19 01:59 AM I couldn't find pulsed power for under 300€ XD 19-Mar-19 03:57 AM XDDD 19-Mar-19 03:57 AM At least all my semiconductor books where cheap, EXCEPT the one "History of semiconductor engineering" wich is again 100€+ (no, I don't have it) 20-Mar-19 05:16 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190320_131157-2AF9B.jpg 20-Mar-19 05:16 AM most important tool in everyones Workshop! 20-Mar-19 06:05 AM disagrees 20-Mar-19 05:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0158-2C30A.jpg 20-Mar-19 05:08 PM Starrett standards.. 1-24" in inch increments 20-Mar-19 05:08 PM sucks it's in inches, but easy conversion 20-Mar-19 05:08 PM okay price on it too.. cost less than 3 of the large ones individually 20-Mar-19 05:08 PM maybe less than two of them, who knows 21-Mar-19 12:19 AM XDDDDD, at least it's a standard, I have none. ^^U 21-Mar-19 01:44 AM OMG, those first TIG welds... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_6e71BJOzM 21-Mar-19 02:23 AM A grinder and paint make you the welder you aint! 21-Mar-19 02:36 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoPPwGxgWEY 21-Mar-19 02:49 AM yup! Saw marco's yestarday. 21-Mar-19 02:52 AM finally he shows signs of life again 21-Mar-19 06:13 AM not sure I got anything from that video 21-Mar-19 06:13 AM also, I have started watching nearly all machining vids on YT at atleast 1.5x 21-Mar-19 06:42 AM well, the video is more for people who don't have any idea about machining / machines 21-Mar-19 07:07 AM also, unless it's something like a jig borer, you should not rely on position based on screw/nut rotation posiiton.. you should use a scale (DRO) 21-Mar-19 07:07 AM especially if you use it for milling 21-Mar-19 07:07 AM as it will destroy the accuracy rather quickly wiht sideload, the angular contact bearings will not help this 21-Mar-19 07:07 AM k, school time! 22-Mar-19 05:23 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNRnrn5DE58 22-Mar-19 07:36 PM I think I've seen it 22-Mar-19 07:36 PM btw, I might be looking at an Emco Maximat Super 11 lathe+milling attachment (available through local craigslist - contacted the seller already)... Stefan Gotteswinter just posted a video that he got one! 22-Mar-19 11:15 PM Oh 22-Mar-19 11:15 PM Will check it 23-Mar-19 09:55 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGsFdudG7Ho 24-Mar-19 11:11 AM I shall learn how to do this: 24-Mar-19 11:11 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NRN2IXjwsY 25-Mar-19 02:40 PM OMFG. (The phrase is missing the word "CLAMPS" just before) 25-Mar-19 02:40 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190325_223910-0D8F8.jpg 25-Mar-19 02:40 PM I know that if they are damaged, they cant be used for much more, but DAMN! 25-Mar-19 02:43 PM hahaha 25-Mar-19 06:18 PM hahahaha 25-Mar-19 06:18 PM There’s a whole meme of this 25-Mar-19 06:18 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-1612A.jpg 25-Mar-19 10:00 PM @Nixie I take it you're in Spain? I guess you'd not be available to machine custom flange adapters, for U.S. shipping? 25-Mar-19 10:00 PM @Nixie in that case, could you recommend a good guide or website for machine tools? Like, I just typed "lathe" into my local craigslist since it seems those, along with a drill press (or is it a mill), are what get you most of the way to having these flange adapters 26-Mar-19 12:53 AM @Nixie man all your work featured on the hackaday compendium is awesome! It's amazing to see how you pretty much built everything but the SSRs, transformers, and basic raw materials (aside from the commonly available shop tools). How long have you been practicing macro fab/machining? 26-Mar-19 09:19 AM Sorry for the late reply! 26-Mar-19 09:19 AM Yes, I am in southern spain, wich does not exclude automatically custom works, but shipping is somewhat expensive (2Kg package costed 35€ from US to EU). What kind of flange do you need? (I don't do CF flanges, in any case, as those require extreme precision I don't have tools for yet (custom cutter for the knife edge, mainly). 26-Mar-19 09:19 AM A guide or web for machine tools in US? probably @AdamMcCombs or @Conmega can guide you better in that regard (they have the knowledge and live in US soil) 26-Mar-19 09:19 AM Actually, a Lathe and a TIG welder is what you would be after. A milling machine will help if you need to actually do some kind of ring hole pattern or something (always talking about custom flanges), but that can be done with a drill press and being careful with the center punch (having access to a 3D printer also helps into making drill guides). 26-Mar-19 09:19 AM Also, depending on what flanges do you need, they can be found pre-made and they just require some welding in between them (wich might be very cheap to do locally, for example) 26-Mar-19 09:19 AM Thanks for the appreciation! Hum...I think I had my lathe and mill about...11 years, but I haven't done much in the first 7, just small pieces and such. I got heavily into it after a breakup (as I had a huge amount of free time after that. XD) 26-Mar-19 09:34 AM you can get conflat flanges for welding pretty easily on eBay in all sizes, but welding them requires some skill, if you care about pulling a high vacuum anyway :) 26-Mar-19 09:34 AM The hard part probably then becomes getting the exact fit SS304 tube... that will probably be a bit expensive 26-Mar-19 09:34 AM I don't know about machine tools specific to stuff like conflat knife edges... I dunno where you'd get those special lathe bits 26-Mar-19 09:34 AM but I'm sure there is some company that makes them 26-Mar-19 09:39 AM I bet there is some way to get EDM machined HSS bits with the Knife edge profile. 26-Mar-19 09:39 AM oh neat I'd love to see those 26-Mar-19 09:39 AM that would make conflat making 1000% easier :) 26-Mar-19 09:39 AM other than the whole... stainless steel being somewhat expensive thing hah 26-Mar-19 09:40 AM Not at all, sadly 26-Mar-19 09:40 AM oh really? 26-Mar-19 09:40 AM I thought the knife edge was the difficult part 26-Mar-19 09:40 AM flat cutting tools do not leave superb finishes, so it might require polishing afterwards. 26-Mar-19 09:40 AM (this is assuming your making a solid part like a 6 way block or something) other than the drilled and tapped holes for the bolting 26-Mar-19 09:40 AM I meant that it would not ease it 1000% 26-Mar-19 09:41 AM Vs using standard cutting tools I meant 26-Mar-19 09:41 AM using standard cutting tools with CNC is the best way 26-Mar-19 09:41 AM as they can be extremely sharp 26-Mar-19 09:41 AM BUT, not having those, a profile cut HSS tool might work. 26-Mar-19 09:42 AM I kinda doubt that they machine conflat edges on a CNC... a lathe really seems like the correct tool 26-Mar-19 09:42 AM but what do I know I guess 26-Mar-19 09:42 AM there are CNC lathes too. 26-Mar-19 09:42 AM O_o 26-Mar-19 09:43 AM of-course, I meant CNC mill durr 26-Mar-19 09:43 AM I know, I just didn't thought I had to specify it was a CNC lathe. 26-Mar-19 09:43 AM which is generally what i think of off the bat when someone says CNC 26-Mar-19 09:43 AM honestly I think you'd have a bad time trying to CNC conflat on a lathe even unless you have sensors with the ruby edge finding bits and such to ensure accuracy 26-Mar-19 09:43 AM otherwise knowing your lathe and its slack and how to ensure you take it out with micrometers and such, probably give you the best result at home over an older simple lathe CNC 26-Mar-19 09:43 AM especially since lathe CNCing, like most CNC work, requires quite a lot of learning curve 26-Mar-19 09:43 AM I think a lot of people today think 3D printing or laser cutting correlates exactly to how CNC machining is like... and uh... no... 26-Mar-19 09:43 AM way way more complex, different bits, different feed rates, measuring your bit lengths to ensure the machine knows how long it is, etc etc etc 26-Mar-19 09:43 AM way way way more work 26-Mar-19 09:46 AM I am no expert in CNC lathes, so I can't say. 26-Mar-19 09:46 AM especially for someone at home machining... one or two of something 26-Mar-19 09:46 AM if you want to make 100 26-Mar-19 09:46 AM sure 26-Mar-19 09:46 AM makes sense to spend months figuring that out 26-Mar-19 09:47 AM Hm...you don't need ruby edge finders to know the tool position. You take a cut, measure as precisely as you can, and you can zero the insert edge to that. 26-Mar-19 09:47 AM Also, insert the diameter of the piece gives you a 0,0 coordinate 26-Mar-19 09:49 AM right, but still, your either working on a new CNC lathe that probably just has the edge finders, or an older one that may be worn out... it may have slack in movement and uhm yea... 26-Mar-19 09:49 AM dealing with that in your CNC prodecures, if the machine isn't smart enough for that, is uh... uhg 26-Mar-19 09:49 AM Sure that you require a really thin and sharp tool for cutting the conflat edge, but apart from that, I don't see the extreme difficulty you mention. 26-Mar-19 09:49 AM Any older CNC lathe that has slack, can have it's halfnuts tightened to reduce that. 26-Mar-19 09:49 AM newer lathes have ballscrews. 26-Mar-19 09:50 AM I just.. .don't recommend a CNC lathe for the home CNC mills are simpler and you can build one for not all too much if you have a welder and such 26-Mar-19 09:50 AM Sure! 26-Mar-19 09:50 AM I would not have a CNC lathe before a CNC mill 26-Mar-19 09:50 AM but most CNC lathes I see for sale are small old dinky things 26-Mar-19 09:50 AM do not want 26-Mar-19 09:50 AM XD 26-Mar-19 09:50 AM me neither 26-Mar-19 09:50 AM I would probably just try to CNC mine 26-Mar-19 09:50 AM I remember having a bet of some sort with @AdamMcCombs about me making a good CF flange at home. 26-Mar-19 09:51 AM CNC milling they at-least have some decent software for nowadays to easily do that kinda stuff 26-Mar-19 09:51 AM but CNC lathing... uhg... uncharted territory for the most part 26-Mar-19 09:51 AM so it would be... not fun heh... 26-Mar-19 09:51 AM That software also works for lathes, as far as I know. 26-Mar-19 09:51 AM (Fusion 360 does, if I recall correctly) 26-Mar-19 09:53 AM I have yet to play with fusion 360 much 26-Mar-19 09:53 AM I will probably start doing so once I get enough bits for my main chamber 26-Mar-19 09:53 AM (really need some darn feedthroughs for eletrical bits) 26-Mar-19 09:54 AM I love it 26-Mar-19 09:54 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9mMJdJWONo 26-Mar-19 09:54 AM (never tried that CAM section, as I don't have a CNC lathe, but at least Fusion has it. 26-Mar-19 10:02 AM ah cool 26-Mar-19 12:08 PM neat, thanks for the explanations 26-Mar-19 12:08 PM even having not done much on your lathe for 7 years... that's a good amount of time to get accustomed to small operational procedures so they become second nature by the time a hard project comes around 26-Mar-19 12:08 PM I have only played with a lathe once, I think I made a mini baseball bat or something... and that was probably 20 years ago, in the same Tech Ed class that I got introduced to (and swept away by) robotics 26-Mar-19 01:55 PM They are fun little machines to have around, especially when plastic 3D printed parts are not to par with robotics requirements (thinking on your profile) 26-Mar-19 01:55 PM So, what was your required flange? 26-Mar-19 02:09 PM I still haven't got that far 26-Mar-19 02:16 PM ah. Well, we can talk about that when the time comes, then! 27-Mar-19 06:07 PM that emco I'm looking at is still available 27-Mar-19 06:07 PM lathe 27-Mar-19 06:07 PM dude didnt get back to me after a few days with more photos so I was asked if he sold it alread 27-Mar-19 06:29 PM Oh God that's not one of those cnc lathes is it? 27-Mar-19 06:29 PM no 27-Mar-19 06:29 PM Those little tiny things that generally have an IBM PC XT sitting next to it? 27-Mar-19 06:30 PM Emco Maximat Super 11 27-Mar-19 06:30 PM Oh OK. I thought that brand was EMCO 27-Mar-19 06:30 PM well, they have stuff like that iirc 27-Mar-19 06:30 PM Oh those look cool 27-Mar-19 06:31 PM the one available has the milling attachment, though not sure how good it really is 27-Mar-19 06:31 PM the price is decent enough 27-Mar-19 06:31 PM and it's newer.. and not 100% chinese 27-Mar-19 06:31 PM (I dont know how much is actually made in austria, maybe jsut assemled?) 28-Mar-19 03:29 AM Not Emco that makes those high voltage modules? 28-Mar-19 09:07 AM no 28-Mar-19 09:07 AM I think the emco maximats were still made in austria 28-Mar-19 09:07 AM they are ok machines 28-Mar-19 09:07 AM @Conmega making conflats on a cnc lathe is very easy, I have both done it on a manual one and on a cnc one, it's a simple part in general 28-Mar-19 09:09 AM did you ask @GigaSquirrel about Emco? :-D 28-Mar-19 09:10 AM oh, that emco is good 28-Mar-19 09:10 AM the lathe one. 28-Mar-19 09:10 AM thothe lathy f*ckerth 28-Mar-19 09:11 AM very lathey, such boring? 28-Mar-19 09:44 AM @sync cool! I was wondering how it would be so hard, but everyone I've talked to about it implies its super duper precise, like as if calipers and dial indicators don't exist? 28-Mar-19 09:46 AM no idea, maybe they have no machining experience 28-Mar-19 09:52 AM @AdamMcCombs said he would be impressed if I made a conflat in my lathe. But I'm not a professional machinist. 28-Mar-19 09:52 AM So I can't argue about it. 28-Mar-19 07:14 PM I got a few pics of that Emco.. arranging with a friend to view it on.. Saturday? 28-Mar-19 07:14 PM and possibly buy it then 28-Mar-19 07:48 PM I may simply end up selling the milling attachment as I am told it is a semi-joke but also it will bring in good money for those 'collectors' out there 28-Mar-19 07:48 PM steady & follower rest are going for over 1k USD on ebay 29-Mar-19 09:25 AM Wow 29-Mar-19 09:25 AM good luck! 30-Mar-19 12:46 PM was supposed to pick it up (err, looka t :P) today but apparently the guy who was going to help me hasnt been legally driving since 2010... but his wife will help us out with the rental tomorrow (I do not have a drivers license myself - so I am unable to rent a pickup) 31-Mar-19 11:20 PM w00t, I got a lathe! 31-Mar-19 11:27 PM !!! 31-Mar-19 11:27 PM Congratulations! 31-Mar-19 11:39 PM anyone have any opinions on grizzly mini lathe, or grizzly combo lathe+mill ? 01-Apr-19 12:48 AM Nice! 01-Apr-19 12:48 AM but post photos! 01-Apr-19 01:11 AM Just bought this vest for my new job: 01-Apr-19 01:11 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/HTB1CwF9pfiSBuNkSnhJq6zDcpXaY-43FD7.png 01-Apr-19 01:11 AM I found myself carrying lots of tools in my pockets in the second and third day, and I have to move between trucks, so I'd rather be visible. XD 01-Apr-19 01:11 AM I want to make an aluminium carrying case / heat protector for a TS100, as I need to be able to solder anywhere around a really big truck, repairing camera cables, led floodlight cameras and such. 01-Apr-19 01:11 AM But I want to be able to store it away and not worry about burning anything while it cools down (and the trucks are dirty as hell, so I don't want to leave it anywhere else either ) 01-Apr-19 01:15 AM I think I need that jacket 01-Apr-19 01:16 AM because it's orange? 01-Apr-19 01:16 AM iXDD 01-Apr-19 01:16 AM It's a cheapo 15$ aliexpress (but dug through a bunch of models and prices, I'll post the link in resources) 01-Apr-19 01:52 AM so apparently 'mini metal lathes' are a thing (from china) 01-Apr-19 01:52 AM basically it seems like they work pretty well, but just need a good amount of practice and fiddling/adjustment (or even cleanup/modification after receiving a new one) 01-Apr-19 01:52 AM reportedly the Harbor Freight ones are hard to get parts for 01-Apr-19 02:02 AM @Noxz what did you pay for the Emco lathe+mill? 01-Apr-19 02:02 AM I am seeing some similar (at pic level) stuff around here new for ~$2700 new https://www.amazon.com/Grizzly-G9729-Combo-Lathe-Mill/dp/B0000DD0O4/ 01-Apr-19 02:02 AM but reviews say the mill isn't too useful 01-Apr-19 02:02 AM at least not easily, or without some modification to lock it square with the bed 01-Apr-19 02:02 AM too light/twisty 01-Apr-19 05:56 AM I did pay more than that.. but it's also not an import clone - but [mostly] made in Austria.. which I would gladly pay a premium for.. like if someone saw a watchmaker working on a Grizzly they would essentially be laughed at for not continuing some heritage of tool makers and such.. I've been explained it by other students: would you want your car mechanic to have Snap-On or some Husky branded (home depot house brand?) tools? does one make one better? well, one is certainly tried and true, and has a reputation 01-Apr-19 05:56 AM also, there are certainly differences in import clones.. Stefan Gotteswinter mentions a few of them 01-Apr-19 05:56 AM also, I have a stand with a brake 01-Apr-19 05:56 AM oh, wow, no automatic gears on that thing you linked 01-Apr-19 05:56 AM manually changing the belt on pulleys? heh 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM I was linked a grizzly from someone else that was a near clone, but yeah, that one isnt really inthe same user experience class 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM my issue is they have like 50+ lathes on their website to weed through, waaaay too many options 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM maybe more like this one? https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-12-x-24-Gear-Head-Cam-Lock-Spindle-Gap-Bed-Lathe/G4002 in which case I paid less than that + the stated freight shipping 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM plus I got a stand and milling attachment 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM I suppose I do have to factor in the truck rental which is a huge PITA 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM appparnetly you are not supposed to try to rent a truck on the last day of a month, in the spring time 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM oh, actually, it appears to be much more similar to this.. in fact, this looks like a clone at first glance: https://www.grizzly.com/products/South-Bend-Heavy-10-trade-10-x-30-Gearhead-Lathe/SB1007 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM so, certainly paid less than half 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM I do still need a 5C collet chuck and collets though, but there is a fancy emco quick collet chuck thing that I wish to get, but is likely a little pricey.. maybe I can make one.. 01-Apr-19 06:12 AM anwyho, almost time for dog walk then back to school - spring break is over! 01-Apr-19 06:54 AM https://youtu.be/KX6FpLBDOFs 01-Apr-19 06:54 AM Especially for you, @AdamMcCombs 01-Apr-19 08:24 AM @Noxz are you in Seattle area? I saw a an Emco Super 11 in Snohomish and now the listing is gone 01-Apr-19 08:24 AM thanks for the explanation, definitely makes sense... I basically used a lathe 20ish years ago in middle school and I think it was on some stupid wood project that I can barely remember (or maybe I skipped the lathe work and just played with the robotics stuff we had, I can't even really recall) 01-Apr-19 08:24 AM the biggest takeaway I got from some youtubing on cheapo lathes last night was that the combo slide angle adjustment is a pain to adjust on the cheap ones... having to move the combo slide all the way back to expose some bolts, which you then can loosen and turn the whole thing 01-Apr-19 09:38 AM @@nmz787 yes, that's the one I got 01-Apr-19 09:38 AM It was in decent shape, was under power so I was able to run it, and was pretty elegant, really 01-Apr-19 09:38 AM Better than our Wabeco D6000 at school.. But I do need a DRO and such now, maybe I can work towards the DIY Magnescale 01-Apr-19 01:15 PM hmm, all these names are new to me 01-Apr-19 01:15 PM sounds like you've been lathing for a while, or did you just dig into videos and forums for a few weeks nonstop? 01-Apr-19 01:23 PM I'm seeing a few of these pretty cheap, seems like they might work to make some vacuum adapters https://www.harborfreight.com/7-inch-x-10-inch-precision-mini-lathe-93212.html 01-Apr-19 01:23 PM at least I'd learn some stuff on it if I needed to go somewhere and work quickly on a good lathe 01-Apr-19 01:24 PM well KF is quite easy to turn if you have a top slide to do the 15° 01-Apr-19 01:24 PM I did one in copper some time ago 01-Apr-19 01:24 PM yeah it has a top slide with a protractor 01-Apr-19 01:25 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190401_222441-D2074.jpg 01-Apr-19 01:25 PM I'd love to show more details, but I'm not gonna vent the chamber for that 01-Apr-19 01:28 PM seems like the runout could be an issue, but I'm not sure if that's something that could be upgraded or mitigated somehow 01-Apr-19 01:29 PM KF is quite tolerant 01-Apr-19 01:29 PM like get into +/- 1mm and you're fine 01-Apr-19 01:29 PM oh, hmm 01-Apr-19 01:29 PM well it seems my rough pump probably has a KF fitting 01-Apr-19 01:29 PM the spec sheet says NW25 01-Apr-19 01:30 PM NW is KF, yes 01-Apr-19 01:30 PM but I'm seeing KF=QF==NW 01-Apr-19 01:30 PM Aye 01-Apr-19 01:35 PM hrmm, a KF25 flange to barb adapter is only $16 with free shipping... 01-Apr-19 01:35 PM my wife was definitely like "collecting more stuff" this morning when I mentioned interest in getting a lathe 01-Apr-19 02:21 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lvwq7YqDJiw 01-Apr-19 02:34 PM https://youtu.be/Lvwq7YqDJiw 01-Apr-19 02:35 PM @Nixie ... did you look before you post? :P 01-Apr-19 02:36 PM I purposefully posted those two. 01-Apr-19 02:36 PM Yes 01-Apr-19 02:36 PM It's april fools, dang. 01-Apr-19 02:37 PM @nmz787 I am attending a Watchmaking program, first year.. Hardly operated a lathe beforehand and simply knew basics 01-Apr-19 02:37 PM Also, TOT has a video on that minilathe, semi joke.. Replaced the plastic gears with metal ones 01-Apr-19 02:37 PM I didn't start watching precision machining videos until taking an Engine Turning class (geometric engraving, almost like a spirograph) where I learned about dovetail scrapped linear slides over linear ball bearings commonly used on CNCs 01-Apr-19 02:53 PM @Noxz ah, right, now I remember from #homecmos 01-Apr-19 02:53 PM ah, I actually watched the overview mini lathe video he has last night 01-Apr-19 05:00 PM @nmz787 yup, same dude, I think you ay have been the one that linked to this chat 02-Apr-19 09:20 AM ehehe 02-Apr-19 09:20 AM i want to be a watchmaker :(( 02-Apr-19 09:20 AM like in those movies 02-Apr-19 10:03 AM what watchmaker movies are out there 02-Apr-19 10:03 AM Watchmaker I, II, III, and IV. 02-Apr-19 10:03 AM superehero watchmaker. 02-Apr-19 10:04 AM He is given 72 hours to finish the job or he will be forced to retire, each time. 02-Apr-19 10:04 AM well f me there is a movie called watchmaker 02-Apr-19 10:04 AM Summaries Three people. One whose time is rolling back. One whose time is stagnant, one whose time doesn't exist. The three meet and have a talk and finally play a deadly game. Only one can exist of the three. The film is based on a state between dream and vision. 02-Apr-19 10:04 AM XDDDDDDDDD 02-Apr-19 10:04 AM NOT gona watch that. 02-Apr-19 10:05 AM https://www.imdb.com/title/tt8785050/ 02-Apr-19 10:20 AM OMG 02-Apr-19 10:20 AM https://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Measurement/Calipers/Left-Hand-Digital-Calipers-Not-just-for-Lefties 02-Apr-19 10:21 AM Finally! 02-Apr-19 10:21 AM An end to the oppression 02-Apr-19 10:31 AM XDDDDD 02-Apr-19 10:31 AM I would love to have a left hand big display one: 02-Apr-19 10:31 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/2b68ed68-2bbb-40f9-9633-a77600abf4c7_600x5-E95F0.png 02-Apr-19 11:02 AM lol 03-Apr-19 06:31 PM tried my hand at a lil touchup on the lathe stand, since I had the RAL6011 on hand.. I do think there is a slight difference but it's close enough.. not like I really know how to paint well, and not like rattlecan spray can make any good result, but meh, an attempt 03-Apr-19 06:31 PM more so want to seal & stop rust from forming, since the stand is configured for coolant 03-Apr-19 11:27 PM I picked up that Harbor Freight mini lathe! $250... not too bad for learning at least, and I might even be able to make something useful 03-Apr-19 11:27 PM though I feel like now I need to pick up a TIG welder 04-Apr-19 09:26 AM Tig welding rules 04-Apr-19 09:26 AM XD 04-Apr-19 04:27 PM just put a 21kVA danfoss VFD on the lathe, now I can properly load the spindle down without the drive tripping 04-Apr-19 09:55 PM Scheiße.. broke one part on the lathe thus far.. was cleaning the lead screw and more or less the carriage ran to the end and busted the bracket that hold it and the power feed onto the lathe bed near the tail stock.. reading up there appears it should have had an aluminum shear pin and "under no circumstances should this be replaced with anythign stronger".. I think that is a reason why.. I t hink the person before (or before him) replaced it with steel .. will likely pickup some JB Weld at the hardware store tomorrow and simply work on machining a new bracket out of something stronger than cast iron.. and also locate where that shear pin is and put an aluminum one in there 04-Apr-19 09:55 PM cleaned up the lead screw pretty good though.. just a tad bit of surface rust near the tail stock, but did a general cleaning all over it.. 04-Apr-19 09:55 PM I would have much rather broken an aluminum shear pin (whcih are super easy to make, obviously) than the bracket 04-Apr-19 11:04 PM was the lathe running when that happened? 05-Apr-19 05:51 AM yeah, I was feeding to the back - actually, not power feeding, but screw cutting, I suppose left hand in that case, to do final clear offs of the lead screw.. had done it once before that direction and stopped it within about 5cm till the end before, but I was slower this time.. there should absolutely be stops setup as well, not sure why the carriage wanted to continue 05-Apr-19 05:51 AM I removed the bracket and took out the leadscrew and power feed bar.. lathe still runs, as does the screw cutting gear box (output connectors) 05-Apr-19 05:51 AM it is 100% my fault.. but I would have wanted safe gaurds in place as well 05-Apr-19 05:51 AM it's a relatively easy part to make 05-Apr-19 05:51 AM and instead of these sleve bearings and such I may upgrade it to ball bearings for easy of replacement and no spot oil lubrication 05-Apr-19 05:51 AM I suppose I should examine the half nuts too, but I suspect they are okay 05-Apr-19 05:51 AM everything needs a good cleaning anyways 05-Apr-19 05:51 AM not that it was filthy, but it wasnt in a preciscion lab 05-Apr-19 11:20 AM hmm, I thought the power drive was used for screw cutting... guess I need to look into this more 05-Apr-19 12:08 PM there's two different bars, one for screw cutting (lead screw), then a hexagonal bar for the power feed (and power cross slide, selectable at the apron) 05-Apr-19 01:43 PM Hey all! I've got somequestions about potting my own pass throughs for a low vacuum (100-500 mTorr) 05-Apr-19 01:44 PM Oh,nice! 05-Apr-19 01:45 PM I was looking at drilling and tapping a hole in the acrylic base plate of the bell jar, then getting matching pipe, ptfe taping the outside, and filling the inside around my wires with [some kind of acrylic or epoxy] 05-Apr-19 01:45 PM diy vacuum passthroughs don't seem to be easy to google 05-Apr-19 01:45 PM what with most "vacuum acrylic" hits being about vacuum degassing chambers for making acrylic 05-Apr-19 01:46 PM what current / voltage are we talking about? 05-Apr-19 01:47 PM 12V dc at a tenth amp max, some real low power RF SMA connectors, and maybe a USB passthrough for a webcam 05-Apr-19 01:48 PM well for low power stuff spark plugs and feedthrough caps are great 05-Apr-19 01:48 PM what frequency for the sma? 05-Apr-19 01:49 PM ~1GHz 05-Apr-19 01:49 PM you'll want to avoid wires as they break easily and there's always some slit inbetween the copper and insulator 05-Apr-19 01:49 PM Interesting 05-Apr-19 01:49 PM Oh, these? 05-Apr-19 01:49 PM https://www.omega.com/pptst/MFT_FEEDTHROUGH.html 05-Apr-19 01:51 PM these look great, just might be a bit expensive 05-Apr-19 01:51 PM man these are so cheap. I kept finding SMA and USB feedthroughs for like, hundreds or thousands of dollars 05-Apr-19 01:51 PM I mean as long as it costs me less that ~$300, I'm home free, $500 tops ish 05-Apr-19 01:52 PM ah, that opens a lot of options 05-Apr-19 01:52 PM lol 05-Apr-19 01:52 PM I just really did not find anything in the $30 range before, this is awesome 05-Apr-19 01:53 PM just picked up some jb weld (JB Kwik, generic epoxy from them, quick setting), PB Blaster, and some hydraulic fluid.. going to be a fun weekend 05-Apr-19 01:57 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/273781530536 05-Apr-19 01:59 PM @GigaSquirrel so for the purposes of running a vacuum system for only a few hours, and only down to a tenth of a torr, do you have any epoxy recommendations for potting these things? We've got more SMA wires than you can shake a stick at, and I was thinking of building a panel to mount each end to to avoid flexing. 05-Apr-19 01:59 PM And if it turns out to be unpumpable I'll throw cash at the problem 05-Apr-19 01:59 PM Maybe @AdamMcCombs knows a good vacuum feed through potting blend 05-Apr-19 02:00 PM generally any 2 component epoxy should do 05-Apr-19 02:00 PM Oh neat 05-Apr-19 02:01 PM I've gotten my chamber with a lot of epoxy in it down to 1e-8 05-Apr-19 02:01 PM it was uhu endfest 300, but I think that's very.... local 05-Apr-19 02:01 PM as in not very available outside of germany 05-Apr-19 02:02 PM Well it's $13 on amazon, so that's an affordable first shot 05-Apr-19 02:02 PM oh 05-Apr-19 02:02 PM oh 05-Apr-19 02:02 PM nice 05-Apr-19 02:02 PM well go for it 05-Apr-19 02:02 PM lol 05-Apr-19 02:02 PM awesome! 05-Apr-19 02:04 PM hah, that msds looks near identical to what I just nabbed.. teh amine is slightly different, but yeah 05-Apr-19 02:08 PM You guys should be-able to nab feedthroughs for way cheap. All the ones I got in show-and-tell I got for like 100-200 bucks for ALL OF THEM, so yea... Keep an eye out, things come up for good deals, its just a hunt. 05-Apr-19 02:08 PM If your that concerned about the A) right piece and B) a low price, anyway... If you need something ASAP, then yet there are some reasonable deals like @GigaSquirrel posted 05-Apr-19 02:19 PM Yeah, I'd like to hunt, but I've been told, "diy it, and then buy it off the shelf if it doesn't work" 05-Apr-19 02:19 PM On a research team and just trying to help a grad student get good data on his thing by getting some oxygen away from his stuff 05-Apr-19 02:40 PM Lol fischer 05-Apr-19 02:40 PM sort of crappy datasheets, No easy way to know what connectors fit what. 05-Apr-19 02:40 PM Designed a super simple adapter board for one research project work was contracting. 05-Apr-19 02:40 PM Hmm, I should attempt to convince my boss to scrap some old electornics, because those have hermetic DB25 pass thrus 05-Apr-19 06:43 PM w00t, fixed the lathe's power feed.. the bracket seems to be holding for simply running the carriage back and forth, haven't tried cutting anything just yet, but first thing I guess I need to make is a better replacement bracket 05-Apr-19 06:43 PM also, replaced the screw cutting with a steel pin, to temporarily test..will make sure everything is tip top before throwing production at it 06-Apr-19 02:55 PM friend will help me lift/move the lathe back onto the bed (cleaned it up well) - got the dolly it is currently on, on jack stands, and a couple wood bar handle things to make lifting it to height just that much easier.. I'll have t he headstock end, of course 06-Apr-19 02:55 PM hopefully will have a small show-and-tell by tomorrow 06-Apr-19 07:06 PM got it on it's stand, a lil struggle just because, but it's on there and bolted down 06-Apr-19 07:06 PM taking cuts like nobody's business 06-Apr-19 07:06 PM well, maybe if I had better single point cutters on and it would 07-Apr-19 12:55 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNBg_1GPuH0 07-Apr-19 02:36 PM yeah shrinky-dinks aren't really gonna be too useful practically 07-Apr-19 02:36 PM (I've been researching microfluidics for about a decade, as a hobby anyway) 07-Apr-19 09:01 PM gross, the gearbox (lead and screw cutting) oil was syrupy - caramel color 07-Apr-19 10:21 PM lol, that JB weld just broke 08-Apr-19 03:47 AM JB Weld broke? Wow 08-Apr-19 05:52 AM I might give it one more go, also it was JB Kwik 08-Apr-19 05:52 AM so, the 6 minute setting one 08-Apr-19 05:52 AM does that mean it is less strong? no, I wouldnt say that specciofically, but it may be 08-Apr-19 05:52 AM but yeah, I may give it one more try, I need to machne a new piece 08-Apr-19 03:03 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HC4KiulYs68 08-Apr-19 03:03 PM tldr; stainless steel bolts can seize due to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galling 08-Apr-19 03:03 PM so use anti-seize lube if you need to use stainless bolts 08-Apr-19 03:03 PM I guess maybe for us, vacuum grease might be suitable, not sure 08-Apr-19 03:26 PM uhm yes most vacuum shops sell antiseize in a chapstick style form for this exact reason :P 08-Apr-19 03:26 PM Most of us in vacuum are well aware of gauling because most all the bolts are stainless :) (unless you buy steel stuff at lowes because your too cheap to buy new stainless hardware heh) 08-Apr-19 03:36 PM duniway sells silver-plated stainless steel bolts that hold up quite nicely over time to galling, but they're obv. kinda pricey 08-Apr-19 03:36 PM one time the sales rep at duniway kinda surreptitiously leaned over to me and she kinda whispers 'you know you can just slick up any 'ol bolt with a bit of DC150 and they work just as well in most cases' :D 08-Apr-19 03:36 PM my understanding is galling becomes a bigger issue if you have to do bakeouts or otherwise do lots of temperature cycling, too 08-Apr-19 04:05 PM also, unrelated: i've had a longstanding issue with my vacuum system where all i know how to do with this entire massive assembly of 304SS is, just.. set it on a table. this isn't very good at all for being able to get access to various pieces to disconnect them 08-Apr-19 04:05 PM it's large and unwieldy enough that trying to move the entire assembled thing is a two-person job. i feel like 80/20 is the way to go with this -- i know @Applied_Ion has been successfully working with it for a while now, but I have no idea how/where to start with that whole system 08-Apr-19 04:09 PM I think I am going to build a frame with wood/metal and any parts that clamp... or touch the chamber I'll cover with like thick weather stripping for an isolation dampening? 08-Apr-19 04:09 PM @qualia yeah, 8020 is expensive but well worth it. My rig has definitely gotten heavy, and it's allowed me to mount things and expand pretty easily 08-Apr-19 04:10 PM oh god yea 8020 is awesome but uhgg expensive 08-Apr-19 04:10 PM Also cad with 8020 is convenient lol 08-Apr-19 04:10 PM even the chinese ePay stuff is pretty spensive 08-Apr-19 04:10 PM Never buy full price 08-Apr-19 04:10 PM I got everything 1/2 on ebay 08-Apr-19 04:10 PM oh sure, even 8020 themselves has an ePay 08-Apr-19 04:10 PM but still... even the chinese stuff with dings and dents and not 100% perfect is... pricey for anything fairly large lol 08-Apr-19 04:11 PM If you are looking for the nuts, bolts, and brackets, use T Nutz ebay store, fully compatible and much cheaper 08-Apr-19 04:11 PM Also for the 8020 stock I only buy discount lots from 8020, usually they sell it pretty discounted 08-Apr-19 04:11 PM Again, still not cheap at all, but it has advantages 08-Apr-19 04:14 PM @Applied_Ion Even like the chinese KF flange vendors? 08-Apr-19 04:17 PM https://www.ebay.com/str/TNUTZ-T-Slotted-Aluminum-Hardware 08-Apr-19 04:17 PM nice 08-Apr-19 04:18 PM for vibration dampening i've seriously considered making a discrete 'pumping station' and then having a short chunky KF50 hose or smth that i can stick on any arbitrary chamber and pump it down to HV 08-Apr-19 04:18 PM also has the nice benefit of letting me shield my turbopump from extraordinary magnetic fields 08-Apr-19 04:21 PM @rfs I mean 1/2 for 8020 stock lol 08-Apr-19 04:21 PM I have like 2 3ft KF40 hoses... 08-Apr-19 04:21 PM and I NOW HAVE an ISO 63 to KF 40 adapter... 08-Apr-19 04:21 PM I could make a pumping station.... 08-Apr-19 04:21 PM and then run that up to my tiny chamber from the turbo... 08-Apr-19 04:21 PM there are also KF40 throttle valves regularly available 08-Apr-19 04:21 PM but I have my eyes on an ISO100 throttle valve at the moment which would be more appropriate and I have an iso 100-63 adapter I got recently 08-Apr-19 04:21 PM I have lots of options heh... just need to figure out what I want to do 08-Apr-19 04:21 PM I seriously think I have more high vacuum equipment than any one person should need at the moment... but it also feels like its not enough... 08-Apr-19 04:25 PM @Applied_Ion Ok, was not 100% clear so had to ask. Oh well, I should still cee if any accpet slightly lower offers. 08-Apr-19 04:29 PM Yeah, never hurts to look around and make offers for lower prices 08-Apr-19 04:29 PM yea I know a guy who like waits patiently for a thing he wants to show up cheap on eBay... 08-Apr-19 04:29 PM it may take him a year or two to find it... 08-Apr-19 04:29 PM but he's the guy that will get something that is normally 500 bucks for like... 25.... 08-Apr-19 04:29 PM because weird searches, and just hunting... 08-Apr-19 04:29 PM like you can get anything for free, I promise you, its just how hard you try... you either spend time, or money, getting something :P 08-Apr-19 04:29 PM I ussually go the both route :P 08-Apr-19 04:35 PM i got a 6" CF pneumatic gate valve for like $60 by searching for 'gate valve 4' (the ID is ~4" 08-Apr-19 04:35 PM and then proceeded to break it/knock something loose the first time i tried to actuate it under vacuum >.> now i have another pneumatic valve from @Applied_Ion to have a path to rough the main chamber through, but i haven't gotten around to demounting anything bc i have several new things to install at once 08-Apr-19 04:35 PM ... but, yeah, anyways, i think i need to trawl for some 80/20 lot sales and try'n CAD out a frame stable enough to hold everything 08-Apr-19 04:35 PM hopefully won't have to have any weird exotic mounting hardware machined for it 08-Apr-19 04:49 PM oh :( that sucks, the 6" valve isn't repairable? 08-Apr-19 04:49 PM I have an 8" conflat gate valve I got for like... 100 bucks... lol 08-Apr-19 04:49 PM I was going to use that as a door on my big chamber lmao 08-Apr-19 04:49 PM but yea the problem with most of the larger valves is they are pneumatic, and as such, on or off... 08-Apr-19 04:49 PM not adjustable, my 8" is a hand crank so you could use it as a throttle, and I may do on my large turbo if I ever get an adapter for it... 08-Apr-19 04:49 PM but ideally having a gate valve for a load lock is just... wonderful 08-Apr-19 04:51 PM i have a 6" throttle too that was mumble mumble kinda expensive, but lets me do.. not totally continuous variable flow control, but something like a 600 L/s to 10 L/s conductance range with pneumatic bi-state all-open/closed-to-that-point control 08-Apr-19 04:52 PM niceee, hey I've payed way too much for some stuff too, I think we all do from time to time 08-Apr-19 04:52 PM but we aren't buying everything at new price hahaha thats how we can afford any of this stuff :P 08-Apr-19 04:53 PM i am not sure what happened to the 6" gate valve. it may not even be totally broken, but .. what happened was, i tried to open it while there was a large pressure difference on either side of the door, and the mechanism that used to smoothly open and close the door now stalls for a moment at the closed point, then goes THONK and slams shut 08-Apr-19 04:53 PM I always tell my coworkers I'm the "Reuse" in "Reduce Reuse Recycle" since I'm always pilfering the trash at work and people see me carrying stuff and are like "dumpster diving again? lol" 08-Apr-19 04:53 PM @qualia uhm... I think thats normal 08-Apr-19 04:54 PM the exploded diagram for the thing is literally a dense fog of screws and washers and i'm terrified of trying to really open it up and really breaking it 08-Apr-19 04:54 PM the gate valve I have is brand new... and it does that thunk 08-Apr-19 04:54 PM hrm 08-Apr-19 04:54 PM mine didn't initially.. 08-Apr-19 04:54 PM its camming 08-Apr-19 04:54 PM it basically does a cam action to PUSH down on the oring 08-Apr-19 04:54 PM yeah,t he camming used to be smooth and silent 08-Apr-19 04:54 PM you MAY have sucked the oring out of place... and now your trying to seal on metal... 08-Apr-19 04:55 PM i have videos on twitter somewhere 08-Apr-19 04:55 PM oh maybe 08-Apr-19 04:55 PM yea... make sure you have the oring in the right place :) 08-Apr-19 04:55 PM but I doubt you would have broken it doing that 08-Apr-19 04:55 PM most of these valves are made so heavy duty 08-Apr-19 04:55 PM its like holy moly 08-Apr-19 04:55 PM if you break that I'd not want to arm wrestle you hahaha 08-Apr-19 04:55 PM probably just something simple :) 08-Apr-19 04:59 PM ah, before i goofed it up it worked like this: https://twitter.com/profanegeometry/status/1033101200357392384 08-Apr-19 04:59 PM beautifully smooth 08-Apr-19 04:59 PM maybe gate valves just Do That when people like me get a hold of them 08-Apr-19 04:59 PM https://twitter.com/profanegeometry/status/1011926315358797824 and from the manual.. >.> 08-Apr-19 05:17 PM Ohhh it's pneumatic neat. 08-Apr-19 05:17 PM Hrm yea most of that looks like bushings and things lol. But I see a cam there... Hrm what pressure are your you feeding it before vs now... You may not have had enough pressure to cause it to cam over... 08-Apr-19 05:17 PM I'd be interested in a video of it now 08-Apr-19 05:20 PM i think like 20 psi? idr, will have to check 08-Apr-19 05:20 PM https://twitter.com/profanegeometry/status/1046219043781267456 ok here's what it's like now 08-Apr-19 05:20 PM (also this totally isn't about machining oops) 08-Apr-19 05:28 PM I mean it sounds like it's camming but also maybe a sticky oring. I'd get to the other side of that and ensure your oring is still seated... Opening it a a pressure differential could have definitely sucked or pushed it out of place. 08-Apr-19 05:29 PM now that you mention it i think it actually did get popped out 08-Apr-19 05:29 PM I'd expect these valves to require about 70psi at minimum btw... 08-Apr-19 05:29 PM pr'aps needs to be reseated 08-Apr-19 05:29 PM The tiny like 2 inch valves in my SEM need 70PSI 08-Apr-19 05:29 PM there's a sticker on it that said what psi to use and it wasn't super high 08-Apr-19 05:29 PM Oh hrm... Interesting 08-Apr-19 05:29 PM but will verify with The Manual 08-Apr-19 05:31 PM I'm gona be working on my HV stuff here in a second if you want to do a DM voice chat or something. I can show what I'm working on 08-Apr-19 09:28 PM made and put in the proper aluminum shear pin into the lathe 08-Apr-19 09:28 PM still need to remake the bracket 08-Apr-19 09:28 PM JB Welded it again (2nd time) 11-Apr-19 02:59 PM https://forum.millerwelds.com/forum/welding-discussions/21413-uhv-ultra-high-vacuum-welding 11-Apr-19 02:59 PM "The welds were done by my mentor who used a syncrowave 200 and did all the welds manually. He didn't use any pulse option as his syncrowave didn't have this option. In addition, he still uses a passive helmet!" 11-Apr-19 02:59 PM "All welding was done manually on a table with back purging using argon but my mentor did them all without a motorized turntable. He started the welds and then stopped when he needed to roll the cylinder. Started again until he was done." 15-Apr-19 05:16 PM Got to love somebody who is actually good at welding... I’m terrible 16-Apr-19 05:17 PM Alright, so arts and crafts 2 part epoxy from amazon, NPT 3/4" brass nipples, and gasket-in-a-can worked! Thanks @GigaSquirrel for dispelling my notion that I had to get ultra-specific vacuum feedthough epoxy resin 16-Apr-19 10:54 PM glad it worked! 17-Apr-19 01:48 AM I’m impressed that cheap epoxy worked. What vacuum level? 17-Apr-19 03:52 AM if you look in the nasa material compatibility charts there are lots of non specialized resin systems that work 17-Apr-19 07:44 AM I am still a big fan of silver solder brazing. It’s got a much higher chance to be leak free the first time. Hard to re work though. Then again I am only concerned with getting to the -7 range for evacuating tubes. 17-Apr-19 07:44 AM Most of our evacuation stations were either just plain copper plumbing or cannibalized Veeco leak detectors. I will post some photos some time. I kept one of each style when the business closed and use them at home for hobby type stuff. 19-Apr-19 05:30 PM detailed view of dude's shop.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-Sf7Nvkwzg 20-Apr-19 12:35 PM New bandsaw blade is sweet. On first try I got too long blade, tried shortening and silver solder, but I didn't have a fixture to maintain alignment, so it didn't come out exactly straight. I used it for a while, then the braze broke, I redid and it was differently misaligned so the joint was too thick and would make a huge slam on each revolution whenever you sawed something that was hard enough to put up resistance. So I figured out the right size and got a pre-welded blade. 20-Apr-19 12:35 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190420_152646384-76E64.jpg 20-Apr-19 04:10 PM @a_quiet_scientist Not high vacuum. Our dinky gauge just says -25 inHg, and that's good enough for the science we need to do 20-Apr-19 08:23 PM Invest in a cheap battery powered thermocouple or piezo gauge from eBay. Even a cheap one is literally two orders of magnitude better than a mechanical gauge. 22-Apr-19 04:59 PM brand new albrecht chuck delivered 22-Apr-19 05:11 PM hah, their packaging is intersting 22-Apr-19 05:11 PM oh my, that is a nice chuck 22-Apr-19 05:11 PM that should last me a while.. now what other tools do I need?!? 22-Apr-19 05:11 PM ER25 collets for the milling attachment.. oh, parting off tool+blades (I have a holder) 22-Apr-19 05:11 PM etc etc etc etc 07-May-19 07:48 AM What's a good method of connecting an NW25 hose to a chamber? 07-May-19 07:48 AM For purposes of evacuation 07-May-19 07:48 AM Is this a port kind of thing or a flange or a butt or a stub? 07-May-19 07:51 AM there are many flanges on ebay with a NPT-something thread on one end 07-May-19 07:51 AM That feedthrough I janked together weeks ago was such a help that we're going whole hog into fancy equipment 07-May-19 07:51 AM I guess I'm looking for NW25 to conflating flange? And I'll bolt and gasket that onto a hole in the acrylic wall 07-May-19 07:53 AM KF25 to conflat? 07-May-19 07:53 AM conflat is for high and ultrahigh vacuum stuff 07-May-19 08:14 AM I thought conflat just meant a flat thing 07-May-19 08:14 AM Figured that was fancy vacuum talk for a flange 07-May-19 08:14 AM Or a nipple 07-May-19 08:15 AM https://sc02.alicdn.com/kf/HTB12jllHFXXXXcqXpXXq6xXFXXXG/223538225/HTB12jllHFXXXXcqXpXXq6xXFXXXG.jpg 07-May-19 08:15 AM that is conflat 07-May-19 08:16 AM I see 07-May-19 08:16 AM Looks like NW but with more bolts 07-May-19 08:17 AM nope, there is a knife edge and a copper ring that gets cut into by those knife edges to make a metal on metal seal 07-May-19 08:17 AM which is for UHV applications 07-May-19 08:18 AM Neat 07-May-19 08:18 AM So I might be looking for something that doesn't exist. I'm thought it would be possible to have an NW25 bit just bolted on to the side of my chamber, but I don't see the shape I expected. What's the typical name for the connection point between a hose and a chamber? 07-May-19 08:18 AM It's gotta be a vocabulary issue that's impacting my search 07-May-19 08:21 AM are you looking for a weld on flange? 07-May-19 08:23 AM The chamber is acrylic, so I was hoping I could bolt onto some instagasket 07-May-19 08:23 AM The new goal is 1mTorr 07-May-19 08:23 AM And we've got an acrylic bell jar on top of an acrylic base 07-May-19 08:24 AM something like this? 07-May-19 08:24 AM http://www.vacom-shop.de/epages/VacomShop.sf/en_GB/?ViewObjectID=1088405 07-May-19 08:26 AM Is NW25 to a threaded, NPT kinda jazz a solid way to go at mTorr? 07-May-19 08:26 AM Because we've done NPT holes already, and can do them again 07-May-19 08:27 AM I got my chamber down to e-8 with lots of NPT in it 07-May-19 08:27 AM Alright! 07-May-19 08:27 AM Found a tungsten filament vacc gauge that just clips onto an NW25 port just now, so I think if NPT gets us into chamber then my shopping is dang near done 07-May-19 08:27 AM And I managed to find everything at LDS Vacuum 07-May-19 08:27 AM These fancy metal accordion hoses. Should I go ahead and use those wherever I can? Instead of metal ends hoseclamped onto hosing? 07-May-19 08:33 AM yep 07-May-19 08:33 AM metal is always better than plastic when it comes to vacuum 07-May-19 08:37 AM What about thin/medium/thick wall? 07-May-19 08:37 AM I assume they correlate to different pressures, but isn't an atmosphere an atmosphere when it comes to crushing vacuum stuff? 07-May-19 08:38 AM it's got to withstand 1 bar of pressure difference 07-May-19 08:38 AM thinner tubing would diffuse more, but that's only an issue below e-6 where you'd want to avoid long tubes anyway 07-May-19 08:39 AM Oh okay. For e-3 and 18 inch lengths it sounds like thin wall will suffice 07-May-19 08:39 AM yep 07-May-19 08:45 AM Well I tell you hwat, a plumbing list of $1090 is a lot more than it took to fix my bathroom sink 07-May-19 08:46 AM but you could pump your sink down to e-3 07-May-19 08:46 AM got a clog? Just vacuum-boil it away! 07-May-19 08:47 AM I like the way you think 07-May-19 12:36 PM I now see that most of this discussion should have gone in #off-topic-thats-sometimes-on-topic . I didn't realize just how on topic that channel was 07-May-19 12:47 PM well it was not grossly off topic 08-May-19 08:55 AM It depends how high a vacuum you want 08-May-19 08:55 AM You could get a NWxx half nipple and weld it, if it’s a SS chamber and you have the hardware and skill 08-May-19 08:55 AM Rubber hose with heavy wall and worm clamps are ok for low vacuum - really depends what your vacuum definition is 08-May-19 08:55 AM You could probably JB-Weld a NW16 or NW25 half nipple into an acrylic chamber and get it to millitorr 08-May-19 09:48 AM Single digit mTorr is the goal 08-May-19 09:48 AM And I found an NPT to NW25 adapter in a box in my office, so we're starting there 09-May-19 01:33 PM Machined a 8" CF to 4.5" CF zero length reducer today from a 8" CF blank 09-May-19 01:33 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/zero_length_reducer-C1286.jpg 09-May-19 01:33 PM The seal is achieved with a Viton gasket for 4.5" CF flanges, compressed into the shallow groove. I really hope it will seal okay 09-May-19 01:33 PM Tried to do most of the operations on a lathe, but a rotary table is so much better for anything related to flanges because it only requires one set-up 09-May-19 02:49 PM ah, no knife edge then? 09-May-19 02:49 PM either way that's gorgeous 09-May-19 08:11 PM It is quite hard to turn the knife edge on a lathe since I don't have the correct tooling 10-May-19 05:30 AM I turned some last week for the luls, the only hard thing is that you need a boring bar that clears the 20° ramp 10-May-19 07:19 AM Unfortunately I don't have that at the student machine shop. I think at the very least I will need to grind my own bit to make it work 10-May-19 07:19 AM Hopefully the leak rate won't be too bad with this solution 10-May-19 08:23 AM Very nice 10-May-19 09:14 AM I think I used a SVQB type boring bar tilted a few ° to clear the ramp angle, the chinese ones are cheap 10-May-19 09:14 AM and you probably want to use a cnc lathe as the corner radius is important 10-May-19 10:09 AM Thanks for the advice! I will keep that in mind if I ever need to go to higher vacuum on my whole set-up. 10-May-19 01:18 PM How do i tell what sort of fitting is on the end of my nitrogen pressure regulator? Will i get enough info by just measuring with calipers? 10-May-19 01:18 PM What sort of line should I prefer to use between that fitting and the input to my FIB, which has both a 6mm or 1/4 inch swagelok fittings? 11-May-19 03:20 AM 1/4” is a common standard for gas handling, whether it’s stainless steel line and Swagelok or John Guest fittings with nylon line 11-May-19 03:20 AM Take a photo of the fitting and post it for strange nerds on the Internet, that’ll fix it 14-May-19 12:56 AM hmm, I guess I can try meshing the threads of the regulator with the 1/4" swagelok on my FIB inlet to see if they match 15-May-19 02:21 AM ID is 0.25 inch, OD is 0.43 (I guess 7/16) inch.. thread pitch seems like 0.05 inch (20 TPI)... I am guessing at this point this is a "4AN" fitting... but I have no idea as I'm not seeing any adapters that convert from this to a compression fitting (for plastic tubing) 15-May-19 02:21 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/8MXqzWK4y3lk71_A3xOWlJjGcikv3_NHVjUHjBeWaq-C1104.png 15-May-19 02:21 AM ID is 0.25 inch, OD is 0.53 (I guess 1/2) inch... thread pitch seems to be 0.05 (20 TPI)... my guess is this is a NPT fitting 15-May-19 02:21 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/AtbYxarMLL2wS6JcqExwsaIkjKUV15drjTNGQ6lhJC-9A7C0.png 15-May-19 02:21 AM maybe this one, but I don't know why it mentions the word "swivel" https://www.amazon.com/EVIL-ENERGY-Straight-Fitting-Aluminum/dp/B07FQPRQ4L/ 15-May-19 02:38 AM maybe one of these for the other side?? https://www.amazon.com/LTWFITTING-Female-Compression-Connector-Fitting/dp/B00CHHZS06/ 15-May-19 07:21 AM Regulator looks like npt, what I'm guessing is the instrument looks like swagelock from here. 15-May-19 09:04 AM Manual does say swagelok 15-May-19 09:04 AM What's a good intermediary between the two? 15-May-19 09:04 AM I'm thinking tubing connected via a compression fitting 15-May-19 09:08 AM Yeah exactly 15-May-19 09:08 AM PTC tubing from McMaster works well 15-May-19 09:14 AM This is such a horrible task... 15-May-19 09:14 AM I was reading about fittings for at least two or three hours last night already 15-May-19 09:14 AM Why can't these manufactures inscribe specific connection codes on each fitting to make this easier 15-May-19 09:27 AM You get better at making fitting work with time, but it never quite stops sucking until you get to the point where you just don't care about the price and grab everything from your Swagelok guy in town and are glad when it just works 15-May-19 10:22 AM I'm about ready to find my local swagelok guy.... 15-May-19 10:22 AM I wonder how well just shoving tubing over those fittings and pipe clamping would hold up 15-May-19 10:22 AM This sucks 15-May-19 10:26 AM https://www.mcmaster.com/swagelok-compatible-tube-fittings 15-May-19 10:27 AM Swagelok themselves seem to have 3 or 4 thread styles 15-May-19 10:28 AM https://www.mcmaster.com/push-to-connect-pipe-to-tube-fittings 15-May-19 10:28 AM The first link should have what you need for the instrument side and the second one what you need for the regulator. 15-May-19 10:29 AM But don't i want to connect to plastic tube? 15-May-19 10:29 AM That link doesn't mention mating with plastic 15-May-19 10:30 AM https://www.mcmaster.com/pneumatic-tubing 15-May-19 10:30 AM I think that Moisture-Resistant Acetal Opaque Tubing is what you are looking for 15-May-19 10:30 AM Its compatible with swage lok and compresion 15-May-19 10:35 AM How much for you to come figure this out, hehe 15-May-19 10:35 AM I am still lost 15-May-19 10:35 AM For example, i don't know if the 1/4" ID on the machine is going to translate to ID or OD on the tubing 15-May-19 10:35 AM And that swagelok page seems to only mention metal tubing, does plastic still work with those fittings? 15-May-19 10:39 AM Give me a sec I will send you a cart that will work 15-May-19 10:39 AM Can you go to voice chat? 15-May-19 10:46 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-BED07.png 15-May-19 10:46 AM This should be what you want 15-May-19 10:46 AM all push to connect and swagelok is sold as on od measurement, so i set it up to use all 1/4 tubing 15-May-19 10:46 AM The nut and sleeve are to connect the tubing to the scope. 15-May-19 10:46 AM Correction this is what you want 15-May-19 10:46 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-6C906.png 15-May-19 10:48 AM Awesome, sorry was taking my kid to the bathroom 15-May-19 10:48 AM I forgot the tube support 15-May-19 10:48 AM The tube support goes in the center of the swagelok 15-May-19 10:48 AM Then the push to connect air hose adapter gets you to 3/8 npt, and the 3/8 to 1/2 get you to the 1/2 on your regulator 15-May-19 10:48 AM If you dm me an email I can send you the cart 15-May-19 10:48 AM I would check over all this ofcourse but Im pretty sure that this will get you connected up. 15-May-19 10:51 AM Why two air hoses? 15-May-19 10:51 AM 10ft 15-May-19 10:51 AM I dont see a tube to tube mater 15-May-19 10:51 AM Oh, they'll send it as one tube? 15-May-19 10:51 AM Though it would be more coinvent 15-May-19 10:51 AM Yeah 15-May-19 10:51 AM Oh yeah, that's good 15-May-19 12:09 PM Sewagelok changed the compression nut threading at some point. I have systems with both on it. The Yor Lok is compatible with the new stuff but not with the old. 16-May-19 12:40 AM any idea on what year that was? this machine is circa 2005 16-May-19 07:26 AM @ jjwas @@jis u you are in the new stuff at that point. I am talking about stuff from the 40’s and 50’s 16-May-19 07:26 AM The pitch on the clamp nuts was changed to give more control of the clamping force I believe. Also the wedge shape and size was changed slightly. 22-May-19 02:06 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=po9wapoDRas 23-May-19 01:19 AM :3 23-May-19 01:19 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190523_100826-8AC7B.jpg 23-May-19 06:32 AM lol 23-May-19 01:27 PM Should get the AvE "chipping ain't easy" short some dya when it's available 23-May-19 05:29 PM I hate the fact that McMaster won’t serve international customers 23-May-19 05:37 PM Have you tried misumi? 23-May-19 05:45 PM I do love that McMaster is like two day shipping because I live a day's drive from their warehouse 23-May-19 05:45 PM 2 day? 23-May-19 05:45 PM I'm normally getting next day am 23-May-19 05:45 PM Even ordering at 6pm... 23-May-19 05:58 PM You pay for that? 23-May-19 05:58 PM And I'm a night owl for McMaster orders 23-May-19 07:02 PM Nope just regular shipping 23-May-19 08:05 PM Yeah I get 2 day as well, live 1 state over from one of their distribution centers 11-Jul-19 01:26 PM awfully quiet here 11-Jul-19 01:26 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190711_210321-1E5B4.jpg 11-Jul-19 01:26 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190711_214542-0377F.jpg 11-Jul-19 01:26 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190711_215217-5AB78.jpg 11-Jul-19 01:26 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190711_221245-8E24A.jpg 11-Jul-19 02:37 PM nice :D 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM I was wondering when someone was going to post something new in here.. 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM my 2nd certification exam is monday, so we've been building tons of hairsprings + balance wheels 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM but, machining related.. I purchased a universal tool & cutter grinder - having it freighted out 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM rather large, going to be fun to get it in the house 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM I will use it as a surface grinder as well - large enough for it 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM and D bit grinder, etc 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM one interesting thing though, will be making cycloidal gear cutters 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM since there's basically only one dude in the UK who makes them anymore (nto that his prices are bad, but if I learn to fish...) 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM @GigaSquirrel what kind of tap is that, here we would probably do NPT (national pipe thread) if a good seal was the end goal.. it is a large taper to make a strong interferance 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM oh, also, finally got a 5C collet chuck for the lathe, clamping kit and er25 collets for the milling head... finally working towards tooling up 11-Jul-19 04:48 PM cleaning and relubing a small watchmaker's 3 jaw chuck tonight, maybe playing around with making eccentrics on the emco as well.. will see 11-Jul-19 08:06 PM watchmakers 3 jaw chuck, gunk 11-Jul-19 08:06 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0436-060DD.jpg 11-Jul-19 11:57 PM hii 12-Jul-19 04:24 PM installed and did a prelim test of the new 5c collet chuck (D1-4) on the emco 13-Jul-19 11:24 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0449-338EF.jpg 13-Jul-19 11:24 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0451-8A55D.jpg 13-Jul-19 11:24 AM will be an adjuster nut, need to make one more, but still getting used to my tooling and such 13-Jul-19 11:24 AM basically, there will be a post (threaded) that goes through that adjuster (which is held onto the circle with a bridge) that has an arm which goes out ot he center which holds a work piece 13-Jul-19 03:54 PM just went into school to do a test run on building a hairspring for the certification exam on Monday.. I completed that part in about 2 hrs (and pretty good this time around, too!).. the other two parts take about 1 hr, putting how long it takes me to about 4 hrs, and we have 8 to do it, so no owrries 14-Jul-19 01:29 PM did it again, in 2 hrs, should be good for tomorrow! 14-Jul-19 02:56 PM also, got a gallon of cutting fluid and 3x 250ml and 3x 500ml squueze bottles with spouts for various oils 14-Jul-19 06:13 PM a second adjuster 14-Jul-19 06:13 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0454-5BC2C.jpg 14-Jul-19 06:13 PM also installed the brake back up (doest turn off the power.. havent figured that out just yet) 19-Jul-19 01:21 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=so4O_yxUfCE 20-Jul-19 08:33 PM I actually saw that yesterday, pretty good overall, even if a failure 18-Aug-19 06:21 PM nice to be able to go down a few blocks to the local small hardware store and pickup a 4mm tap (that I had broken chasing threads) 19-Aug-19 10:11 AM @Noxz, you should check out McLendon Hardware if you're near one. Their fastener selection is awesome. Like 10 aisles full of fasteners. 19-Aug-19 10:12 AM hrm, never heard of them before 20-Aug-19 11:45 PM took basically 4 solid days of cleaning/scrubbing the moveable parts of the vintage swiss grinding dresser machine, to get it somewhat going again.. I need to make new handles though (2 broke in transit) and I am pretty sure I am going to paint it.. chips and such are character.. but not MY character 20-Aug-19 11:46 PM Paint it white! No dull colors! 20-Aug-19 11:46 PM planning on white base with red/green/blue components 20-Aug-19 11:46 PM Though it might go dull after actual use 20-Aug-19 11:46 PM yes! 20-Aug-19 11:46 PM brite! 20-Aug-19 11:46 PM bright? 20-Aug-19 11:46 PM I wanted to get a white lathe 20-Aug-19 11:46 PM But the red and grey one was better and $50 cheaper 20-Aug-19 11:46 PM I am SO over this RAL6011 paint scheme on much of my equipment... 20-Aug-19 11:47 PM RAL6011 should be banned 20-Aug-19 11:47 PM heh 20-Aug-19 11:47 PM if you look at some hobby workshops, like TACrafted.. he painted EVERYTHING that.. I know he is german, but damn 20-Aug-19 11:47 PM how do you know what machine you are on! 20-Aug-19 11:48 PM By feel 20-Aug-19 11:48 PM Braille verniers 20-Aug-19 11:48 PM >_> 20-Aug-19 11:48 PM RAL 9003 is where it's at 20-Aug-19 11:48 PM I'll have to scope out the main colors I am interested in 20-Aug-19 11:48 PM find something super solvent/cutting fluid safe 20-Aug-19 11:49 PM you can get pretty much any ral color in solvent safe 20-Aug-19 11:49 PM just have to pick the right actual paint 20-Aug-19 11:49 PM there are very few makers of RAL paint in the states.. I got a can of 6011 and 6009 - of which I plan to paint the house that colour 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM Or just make your own out of industrial epoxy and TiO2 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM will need a few gallons 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM TiO2 is cheap and is white as all white 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM brb, gotta take out the trash 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM I actually had to do a few mods tot he machine already.. there was excess play in a few of the leadscrews.. had to shorten a should on the shaft 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM oh, and I hate flathead screws.. I want to change all of those (except ofr the small ones ofr the gibs) to hex 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM actually, the small ones on the gibs could be hex as well.. I re-tapped every single thread, both internal and external 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM this rebuild is likely going to take me a while, but will look stellar in the end 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM will also be my first real rebuild 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM requiring some scrapping 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM much of the original scrapping is still active/vissible 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM but some other parts.. not so much 20-Aug-19 11:50 PM anywho, time for a movie then sleepy time 21-Aug-19 10:18 AM Why HEX instead of Torx? 21-Aug-19 10:25 AM hrm.. somewhat good point, but would likely come down to hex is more ubiquitos.. but you can torque down more with torx.. so I'll take that into consideration 21-Aug-19 10:25 AM also, I dont think my local hardware store stocks torx as much as regular hex 21-Aug-19 12:55 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/kupferfail1-0D80A.jpg 21-Aug-19 12:55 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/kupferfail2-E7C30.jpg 21-Aug-19 12:55 PM copper after brazing (with a torch since in vacuum it dindt work out yet) is reeeeeeally soft.... 21-Aug-19 12:55 PM tool dug in and that was it, more than an entire day of work turned into art 21-Aug-19 02:35 PM been there before.. what sort of cutter were you using? 22-Aug-19 03:06 AM it was no cutter issue, i did the disk andrings with the same one having perfect finish despite copper, als you can see on the first pic i already did a bit of machining even after the brazing with no issue. I suspect the loads from machining slowly worked the part loose until it just grabbed the tool 22-Aug-19 03:06 AM if i had put a dowel inside first nothing would have happened but well... 22-Aug-19 03:06 AM sadly i dindt run out of bad luck yesterday 22-Aug-19 03:06 AM wanna spare you the crappy storry but i decidedto do a small simple teflon part for having some success in theday and then dropped the stepper right on the sealing surface 22-Aug-19 03:06 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-A77A2.png 22-Aug-19 03:06 AM gonna do thatagain now... 22-Aug-19 03:25 AM Better luck today 22-Aug-19 08:44 AM would Delrin give you the same desired properties as teflon? I am told it machines muuuch better 22-Aug-19 08:44 AM I havent tried it myself 22-Aug-19 08:44 AM did make some hand-cut teflon head gaskets for my chemistry vacuum pumps after DMF got sucked through and ate all the rubber ones 22-Aug-19 08:44 AM the diaphragms themselves are still some rubber + kevlar based stuff, would love to make them entirely resistant 22-Aug-19 08:44 AM I thought I had some photos of it.. did find one corner of the cut off teflon in a diff chem image though.. 22-Aug-19 08:44 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1486-8D6F9.jpg 22-Aug-19 08:44 AM that is Mg turnings in, what I believe to be, some iPrOH and some catalyst, which was not enough to get the reaction going 22-Aug-19 08:44 AM works without a catalyst with MeOH 22-Aug-19 08:50 AM oh, the machining actually went beautifully, i expected much worse 22-Aug-19 08:50 AM just use very sharp tools and its a dream to machine 22-Aug-19 08:51 AM at school (watchmaking) we commonly superglue or shellac parts to a brass 'wax chuck' 22-Aug-19 08:51 AM and yeah, sometimes it isnt solidly on there and will fall off and get damaged while machining 22-Aug-19 08:51 AM though i did the second one from some unknown plasic i had laying around wich has nice slidy properties as well but is harder then teflon 22-Aug-19 08:51 AM jup, i do that a lot 22-Aug-19 08:51 AM the copper preforms were done that way, just chucked a piele auf Al and superglued the copper to it 22-Aug-19 08:51 AM its really useful for disk shaped stuff because using the tailstock with a center point you can center the workpiece on any punshmark or drilled hole 22-Aug-19 08:51 AM basically a lazy mans 4 jaw 22-Aug-19 08:57 AM Teflon head gasket for chemistry vacuum pump, cut by hand 22-Aug-19 08:57 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0852-56D8B.jpg 22-Aug-19 08:57 AM made two of them, as I have two in series, gets me down to about 50 torr 22-Aug-19 08:57 AM k, dog walk time 22-Aug-19 08:59 AM luckily my chemistry pump is fine, just somewhat dirty with unknown stuff 22-Aug-19 09:01 AM my big universal tool & cutter grinder is due to arrive today, going to be fun getting that in the house, possibly with the help of Adam.. gotta tire out the dog first, off we go! 22-Aug-19 09:03 AM hf 24-Aug-19 07:25 PM scrapped v way of the tool & cutter grinder... belongs over on this channel 24-Aug-19 07:25 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0551-600D8.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0557-4418F.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0558-CCCE0.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0559-39050.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0561-7F676.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0560-ED43C.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0562-41F61.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0563-804C1.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0567-7EF1E.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0570-8B056.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0571-F57F7.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0573-8D3AB.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0572-D44A6.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0574-25FEC.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0575-60E70.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0576-ACE5B.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0577-3072D.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0578-EC9EE.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0579-0C880.jpg 28-Aug-19 05:05 PM made an extractor for the grinder pulley 29-Aug-19 12:45 AM So I didn't have the right size boring bar for this job 29-Aug-19 12:45 AM Prepare yourselves for some machining gore 29-Aug-19 12:45 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/d6ab4ec3-849f-4fd2-a0e1-d2548cc966c0-27553.png 29-Aug-19 12:45 AM It's mild gore, but still 29-Aug-19 07:12 AM Totally legit! Hahahah. Just take little light cuts. Have done that in desperation many many times. 29-Aug-19 10:24 AM I don't have a boring bar yet, nor a parting off tool - but I do have a holder for one... I need more holders 29-Aug-19 10:24 AM once the grinder is going I can make my own 29-Aug-19 10:24 AM also, I don't get why you didnt put the screws down and then just raise the tool holder? 29-Aug-19 10:24 AM do you not have that capability 29-Aug-19 10:24 AM I want a ID threading bar, too.. which is kinda why I used the tap (and it was a standard size, so it was on hand) 29-Aug-19 11:09 AM I'd have to make shims for the tool holder too 29-Aug-19 11:09 AM https://i.spirit.re/Fmhok.jpg 29-Aug-19 11:09 AM Part 1 down, two more to go 29-Aug-19 11:09 AM Now, some of you may call me cheap for making my own KF16 hose adapters 29-Aug-19 11:09 AM And to those I say: yeah you're right 29-Aug-19 12:26 PM if you have the material, then it's faster than ordering 29-Aug-19 01:38 PM And cheaper depending 29-Aug-19 01:42 PM they're $15 each at the retailers I was looking at 29-Aug-19 01:42 PM and I figured since I needed 3, spending $45 for bits of tube was unreasonable 29-Aug-19 01:54 PM yea 29-Aug-19 02:07 PM if I am looking to stick a VFD on a 1.5kw motor.. should I look for more than a 1.5kw VFD, such as 2.2kw? 29-Aug-19 02:19 PM best to go with 2.2 29-Aug-19 03:33 PM just spent the last 1.5hrs scrapping 50 year old grime off that motor.. 29-Aug-19 03:35 PM an easier solution is to soak it in a dilute alcohol solution 29-Aug-19 03:35 PM for a day or two 29-Aug-19 03:35 PM ... then find a friend with a very big oven 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM I have the 'aircraft' version of SimpleGreen (not green in this version) on hand 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM but, it is better to give it a good go at scrubbing/scrapping first 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM it was so bad the fan fins were rubbing gaainst grime 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM making noise 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM the inside cavity of where it was housed wasn't much better, but atleast slightly more regular shaped 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM I will try to plumb a filtered air duct to it (and maybe an exhaust duct) for preventative maintenance 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM it likely has never been cleaned before, no idea when it was last used nor how much it was used 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM used enough to buildup.. and saw hacks of getting around the grime 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM I will be using this for production type work.. so I can't exactly have downtime if it is my only machine for the job 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM might as well do it right 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM will look into plumbing all the machines for clean(er) air 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM atleast in the future shop 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM I need to run a new wire[s] from the electrical panel to the junction (or fix the one I cut.. but meh..) .. most suppliers of multi-conductor wires seemed rather expensive.. but I can easily get a 4 conductor 'extension cord' that will suit my needs for how I am rewiring it (Delta, vs Wye) 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM there is a ton of work ahead for this puppy.. 29-Aug-19 03:36 PM honeslty though, getting a VFD and a simple cord will allow me to see if the motor runs 29-Aug-19 06:37 PM ok... after the PB Blaster smell disappated.. my entry room (with the new/old grinder) has a funky smell to it.. I thought the machine initially smelled like mouse poo.. but the room doesnt.. opened the window to help air it out, but it wont do much good till it gets a thourough cleaning 29-Aug-19 06:37 PM also, re mouse poo... there was no poo 29-Aug-19 06:37 PM maybe just varnished old collant/oil 29-Aug-19 06:37 PM before synthetic really came along 29-Aug-19 06:53 PM Old machines just have a smell. 29-Aug-19 08:34 PM it took a minute for the lathe to air out.. but it was also grungy.. after cleaning it then just cutting fluid that I was using was the smell in the room 31-Aug-19 03:27 PM VFD and cabling arrived.. it is smaller than expected.. at least in comparison to the large cables (10 AWG) that I got 31-Aug-19 03:27 PM I wired up the 50ft extension cord for the 220v 50A plug.. will hookup the 4 conductor wire for the motor in delta, program the VFD, and connect the motor.. hopefully she spins 31-Aug-19 03:27 PM will rework a bit of the internal electronics to feed into the VFD.. most of the transformers inside for the low voltage appear to be selectable of 220 or 380 V.. just gotta rig, and test the conductivity as the water/rust may mean that I need to replace a lot of stuff 31-Aug-19 03:27 PM but first test is just if the motor works.. will do that after dog walk, otherwise I'll be so deep into it I will forget 31-Aug-19 03:27 PM also got some new dispossable gloves to clean the machine 31-Aug-19 07:16 PM w00t! motor works off the VFD~ 31-Aug-19 07:16 PM first time using, and setting up (hardly) a VFD 31-Aug-19 07:16 PM without any real programming, it worked perfectly 31-Aug-19 07:16 PM so now, I just need to rewire the cabinet for opposing phase 220v, and then feed what would be the motor input into the VFD, then into the motor.. I also got the 2m extension cable for the little remote control interface thing.. will figure out a place to mount it 31-Aug-19 07:16 PM beyond cleaning the machine (and motor a bit more).. I need to feed through this new 4 conductor wire I got for it 01-Sep-19 04:03 PM cleaned it up a bit.. and was able to (after lots of struggling) get the old motor feed line (to the panel wher eyou select Wye or Delta) out.. next up will be getting the new feed line in.. 06-Sep-19 03:02 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/ManSon-hobbyist-watch-4-jaw-chuck-lathe-Small-Machines-Inc-Los-Angeles-CA/173996461205 06-Sep-19 03:02 PM D'Aww 06-Sep-19 03:02 PM It's like a nano-colchester! 06-Sep-19 11:26 PM anyone have a recommendation for a minilathe? I'm willing to spend $1200 at most and I don't have the space / transportation options to get a real lathe 06-Sep-19 11:26 PM I was thinking about getting https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-8-x-16-Variable-Speed-Bencthop-Lathe/G0768 06-Sep-19 11:26 PM but idk what the most skookum ones are 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM @taktoa yes, something like that is a great choice 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM don't get anything smaller than 7x14 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM or the metric equivalent 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM I have this little guy: 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/jet_bd_7vs_nastolnyy_tokarnyy_stanok_po_me-EEC05.png 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM which is basically a 7x14ish lathe, except in metric, and the edges aren't filleted :P 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM they're basically all the same lathe, more or less, so buy what you can in terms of size 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM my only negative impression: screw the gears, just no, I hate them 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM threading anything custom or changing the autofeed speed is HELL and you'll want to build an electronic leadscrew(stepper driven with encoder) about an hour in 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM a pro tip: get a carbide insert tool kit 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM these lathes take 10mm tools, so get something like this: 06-Sep-19 11:42 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/7pc-Set-Of-10mm-Lathe-Turning-Tool-Holder-Boring-Bar-w-DCMT-CCMT-Carbide-Insert/323531168196 07-Sep-19 04:59 PM looking at DIY way covers.. just looked at the original and seems easy enough to try to replicate, also looked at a few DIY threads 07-Sep-19 04:59 PM may go tot he plastic store tomorrow 08-Sep-19 04:13 PM finally got the hydraulic cylinder (for the table) off 08-Sep-19 04:13 PM had to drill out some little set screws for some knobs 08-Sep-19 08:36 PM why are there so many lathes in connecticut on ebay 08-Sep-19 09:26 PM Metal lathes? Uh oh. More American manufacturing closing down? 10-Sep-19 12:13 AM mh, can u use the "lathe index" for stock speculations then? 10-Sep-19 12:30 AM Lol 11-Sep-19 02:25 PM got the table linear roller bearings setup to be much more functional (basically have them half on/off when inserting the table into the base/rails) 11-Sep-19 07:58 PM Hmmmm... I like this lathe to productivity index for American manufacturing. 12-Sep-19 12:03 AM I ordered the 8 x 16 grizzly 12-Sep-19 12:03 AM fingers crossed 12-Sep-19 12:17 AM order the tools now! @taktoa 12-Sep-19 12:17 AM you'll hate to wait... 12-Sep-19 07:07 AM Shop Tools and Machinery at Grizzly.com https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-8-x-16-Variable-Speed-Benchtop-Lathe/G0768 12-Sep-19 07:07 AM This one? Nice looking little lathe 12-Sep-19 07:07 AM I had a similar one. Couple things. If you can get a quick change tool post do it. Totally worth it. No shimming of tools required. Just set the height stops once and leave them forever. If you plan on doing any steel cooling is pretty much a must both for heat, and lubrication. The small machines chatter like crazy. Always use the tail when cutting anything longer than about an inch and a half from the face of the chuck. Get a stout spotting or step drill to get your divot for the point of the tail. Regular drill bits walk too much. Too many other things to mention but try to find a relatively short length chuck and shank combo for that tail stock. 12-Sep-19 07:07 AM It improves accuracy and does not chew up so much of your bed length. Also make sure you get all of the cosmoline out of the tailstock hole. It’s no fun chasing the taper shank around in circles because of a left over dab of that stuff in there. 15-Sep-19 03:45 PM Got the workhead back onto the base.. was a bit harder than anticipated due to it sliding forward, creating an interface between the leadscrew (which was discovered when we reinstalled the workhead on during the forklift move) 15-Sep-19 03:45 PM next up is electrical.. weaving the new cord through, and reinstalling the motor (easy) 15-Sep-19 03:45 PM the cord will likely be a piece of junk to work with 16-Sep-19 06:56 AM Anybody have experience laser cutting ceramic? Thin substrate. I have had some .030 parts cut, but have a 100 watt laser cutter and was curious if that was good enough to try it with or is that the sort of material that requires crazy super lasers to do anything real with? 16-Sep-19 09:01 AM @piGuy maybe? 16-Sep-19 10:48 AM IIRC we used to get laser cut alumina parts from some UK supplier at work 16-Sep-19 10:48 AM No idea about the supplier tho 16-Sep-19 10:48 AM eggshell thin things. 16-Sep-19 11:35 AM That’s the kind of thickness I am looking at. I may just eBay some pieces and give it a try 16-Sep-19 08:51 PM 100W is ok 16-Sep-19 08:51 PM for Alumina if it's a CO_2 lasor 16-Sep-19 08:51 PM for .03" thick stuff 16-Sep-19 08:51 PM and one trick is submerging the part in water 16-Sep-19 08:51 PM but what's best depends on the cut you're trying to make 16-Sep-19 08:51 PM I only need straight cuts ^^ 16-Sep-19 09:14 PM a...and sealing air of course 16-Sep-19 09:14 PM since there comes hot dusty steam out of the kerf 16-Sep-19 09:14 PM kinda violently 16-Sep-19 09:38 PM pretty sure you can cut alumina with almost any powerful laser 16-Sep-19 10:11 PM he asked about 100W CO_2 I guess 16-Sep-19 10:11 PM and it works because alumina absorbs 10micrometer-ish radiation pretty well 16-Sep-19 10:11 PM below 20W it becomes tricky 16-Sep-19 10:11 PM + using water is a good idea for better kerf quality using the temperature gradient for kinda ripping effect 16-Sep-19 10:11 PM + cavitation style cleaning included 16-Sep-19 10:11 PM what prevents welding sht into the cut surfaces 17-Sep-19 06:07 AM looking at magnetic chucks for the grinder as it is nearly operational 17-Sep-19 06:07 AM need to tool up 17-Sep-19 08:15 AM I need a small surface grinder but they are exceedingly hard to find. I was given a 612 but it was beyond help. It had been dropped. It was a shame because it was a good model. There are some very small types out there for small tool and die making but people tend to never let those go. 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM hobby size surface grinders are expensive because of the hobby market 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM if you have space for something large, like the 612, then try to nab it.. but make sure it's in good ocndition.. you dont want a surface grinder to fix a surface grinder.. 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM Sanford is the only make (of the US) that makes a small surface grinder, bench scale 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM http://www.lathes.co.uk/sanford/ 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM last one on ebay sold within a day, for like 1500 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM you could always get a brand new Tormach one.. 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM ~$6-8k 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM not sure on reviews of it though 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM anywho, I think I need to start on this new gland for the motor electrical cord -> electric box interface.. 17-Sep-19 08:16 AM shouldn't take too long, but at least I have a little more finger room to get the thing in there.. 17-Sep-19 08:59 AM I bought a Sanford SG48 last year, overhauled by a retired aerospace machinist, for $1000 17-Sep-19 09:12 AM nice! 17-Sep-19 09:12 AM I decided I did not need to remachine a gland screw coupling thing.. enough threads on it to be useful.. but the rubber gromet inbetween did snap, so I just siliconed the cord into the screw thing.. should be dry enough to screw on the female end by noon 17-Sep-19 09:12 AM then I'll have the joy of attempting to weave the other end up through the column to attach to the motor 17-Sep-19 09:29 AM the hard part will be the metal clamp.. I should try to completely remove that and just zip tie it... but no zip ties on hand.. maybe grocery store will have some 17-Sep-19 09:29 AM raining.. 18-Sep-19 04:30 PM got the cord + motor in.. need some new crimps for the bigger cable, but awaiting on a delivery.. after that hooking up the VFD and it should work 18-Sep-19 07:41 PM IT WORKS! 19-Sep-19 08:39 AM Many old vacuum systems I have gone through used old cable gland fittings as vacuum couplers to glass exhaust tubes on the tubes. I have several boxes of them in the garage, all new, all from the 50’s and a bag of new rubber rings for them. 19-Sep-19 07:53 PM ah, interesting 19-Sep-19 07:53 PM nearing the end of putting things on.. still another day or two.. plus I need to recreate at least the column bellow 19-Sep-19 07:53 PM out of polypropylene film 19-Sep-19 09:23 PM Had to look up what a cable gland was :O 19-Sep-19 09:31 PM most Chinese manufacturers don't bother 19-Sep-19 09:31 PM :P 19-Sep-19 10:15 PM they just use gromets 19-Sep-19 10:15 PM if that 19-Sep-19 10:15 PM high end automative racing companies/teams have interfaces between any kind of firewall, so there is no chance of a wire shorting out (plug + receptacle on their own side, connect in the middle) 19-Sep-19 10:15 PM they also have a decent amount of service loop at each end of the connector, so if you need to tap onto or whatever, there is plenty of wire to do so 19-Sep-19 10:15 PM https://www.rbracing-rsr.com/wiring_ecu.html 20-Sep-19 08:30 AM This was a practice racing teams got from the aerospace industry. It's actually quite hard to do it right when you have a 40+ pin connector 20-Sep-19 08:30 AM A modular wiring harness is also nice in a race car because you can disconnect all sensors and electronics in the engine bay from the engine control unit and directly measure power and signal going to the sensors. Helps troubleshooting massively 20-Sep-19 11:13 AM Racing grew up in el seguendo where aerospace grew up. I have observed many racing documentaries being made and many of the individuals had experience both in racing and aerospace. 21-Sep-19 02:50 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20190921_144902-8D3D0.jpg 21-Sep-19 02:50 PM went to an estate sale of a guy with a big machine shop and picked up some brass, aluminum, and stainless 21-Sep-19 02:50 PM and delrin 21-Sep-19 02:50 PM $220 for all that (it was $2.5/lb for aluminum and steel and delrin, $3.5/lb for brass) 21-Sep-19 02:50 PM there's a guy farther away (like 1.5 hr train ride) who is shutting down a machine shop and selling 1/2" steel rod stock for $0.25/lb, and he claims to have hundreds of pounds, so I think I'll visit him tomorrow 21-Sep-19 03:04 PM the estate sale was a bit overpriced but brass is pretty expensive / hard to come by around here 21-Sep-19 03:23 PM $220? 21-Sep-19 03:23 PM just how much did you buy 21-Sep-19 03:23 PM that doesn't look like 100 lbs 21-Sep-19 03:29 PM I think it's 80 lbs and we got $20 of other stuff 21-Sep-19 03:29 PM it's heavier than it looks 21-Sep-19 07:34 PM That delrin is expensive and brass round stock is becoming shockingly expensive. Everything is going crazy theese days 21-Sep-19 09:06 PM H-hmmm 21-Sep-19 09:06 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-C9512.png 21-Sep-19 09:08 PM because a pulsed laser can't precisely or easily ablate plastic 21-Sep-19 09:08 PM easier to put a spindle on it 21-Sep-19 09:19 PM Yeah I think their particular requirements are niche 21-Sep-19 09:19 PM I was reading the rest of the thread 21-Sep-19 09:20 PM this is done with metal 21-Sep-19 09:20 PM DMLM - direct metal laser melting + milling, where a powder jet is melted onto a part, then the head switches and it mills it to dimension 21-Sep-19 09:20 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3CkzQQFZXs 22-Sep-19 02:14 PM Ablating thermoplastic would take a pretty serious laser. Like an ultrafast laser or excimer or something. Maybe a TEA laser. 22-Sep-19 02:32 PM starting to seriously look at some "automatic" (cam operated) swiss-type lathes 22-Sep-19 03:45 PM @Noxz that sounds heavy 22-Sep-19 03:45 PM 1900lbs is the stated weight... 22-Sep-19 03:45 PM and ther eis also the cam-cutter on ebays as well... but that one is in Cincy, so I asked the seller if I can just pick it up when I return to OH 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM I'm not sure how many more times your rose can be dug up 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM same company/brand for 'em.. so I am looking at them as the best combo thus far 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM it is actually on the rebound! 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM but yeah.... 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM I dont have room for both machines.. maybe one more 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM but that would be more so moving lab stuff upstairs and freeing up space in the frog room, simply as storage 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM a better idea would be to get a storage space, and have it delviered/work on it there 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM because it will all need cleaning, etc 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM but... I dont have many options when it comes to anti-CNC 22-Sep-19 03:46 PM I mean, I could make my own.. it's pantograph style on cams.. 22-Sep-19 03:49 PM swiss style lathes are incredibly rigid 22-Sep-19 03:49 PM good luck making one yourself for less than a used one costs 22-Sep-19 03:49 PM the biggst issue with an old machine is that the number of tools is limitted, whereas I could make more like a CNC style tool changer and use many tools on my own 22-Sep-19 03:49 PM Spirit, it would be less about the cost.. 22-Sep-19 03:49 PM more about being able to make it modular 22-Sep-19 03:49 PM and maybe weight 22-Sep-19 03:49 PM rigid always means heavy 22-Sep-19 03:49 PM my own design, not being stuck to something 22-Sep-19 03:50 PM as for modularity... just... get a CNC turret lathe 22-Sep-19 03:50 PM nope... cant do it 22-Sep-19 03:50 PM at that point you're not very far off 22-Sep-19 03:50 PM no CNC allowed 22-Sep-19 03:50 PM traditional or not 22-Sep-19 03:50 PM what's the point of making a universal tool changer lathe 22-Sep-19 03:50 PM you arent limitted by the number of tool holders 22-Sep-19 03:50 PM the one I am looking at has 5 radial tools 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM it's not like you're going to get anything other than the same result 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM what if I need nore cuitters 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM cam driven lathes are still programmed 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM I mean, they used to be made this way, and that is prob plenty 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM "programmed" 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM but not with computers 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM you can 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM a boring distinction 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM design them etc 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM that I'm going to assume nobody will care about 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM so there goes your novelty 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM I think some will 22-Sep-19 03:51 PM it shows more craftsmanship of "traditional" methods 22-Sep-19 03:52 PM "traditional" methods is crunched down behind a watchmaker's lathe 22-Sep-19 03:52 PM there is pre-traditional stuff, where people use files to cut gear teeth by hand, but I am not going that far 22-Sep-19 03:52 PM swiss style lathes are made for mass production 22-Sep-19 03:52 PM on massive scales 22-Sep-19 03:52 PM yeah 22-Sep-19 03:52 PM it can take weeks to set up a job 22-Sep-19 03:52 PM that's okay... 22-Sep-19 03:52 PM make 1k parts.. 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM and at that point you're just getting the same part as a CNC lathe would make you 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM and then proceede to the next setup 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM the "craftsmanship" is gone 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM right, but CNC doesnt take a craftsman 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM sure does 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM we have different terms for the same word 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM defintions 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM it takes just as much effort in setting up the tool paths and proper code to make a good part on a lathe 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM I completely understand why I should get a CNC... 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM you don't just hit "go" and pray the carbide takes it 22-Sep-19 03:53 PM cam lathes are the exact same thing, just more tedious 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM but it's more of an 'ode to the past and whatnot 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM they also "never" fail 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM one motor 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM they fail 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM so much 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM I dont ever want to replace a stepper 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM a stepper will never fail 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM iunno man.. 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM swiss style lathes break a lot when running new parts 22-Sep-19 03:54 PM if it's been cranking out the same part for 10 years, it probably has a "do not touch!" label somewhere 22-Sep-19 03:55 PM heh 22-Sep-19 03:55 PM there's hundreds of moving parts and probably even more wearable surfaces 22-Sep-19 03:55 PM honestly, if I dont want to go CNC, and I want to make a moderate amount, automated, cam style is the only way I can figure 22-Sep-19 03:55 PM nope 22-Sep-19 03:55 PM regular setups on a lathe are fairly automated 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM turret 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM do it the real old way :P 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM not turret, no 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM round robin parts 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM rechucking is a big no-no 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM do operation 1 on a hundred parts, next setup 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM do operation 2 on a hundred parts 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM that's how it was done :P 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM arbors, jigs 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM that's real craftsmanship 22-Sep-19 03:56 PM not setting up cam distances 22-Sep-19 03:57 PM I suppose what you could do is have a removable chuck, so you have you put the chuck on/off, and never change the 'jaws'/clamping on the part 22-Sep-19 03:57 PM no, it was all chucked and clamped 22-Sep-19 03:57 PM multiple setups 22-Sep-19 03:57 PM I am giving examples on how to defeat it though 22-Sep-19 03:57 PM because the goal is accuracy, and a medium-ish production output 22-Sep-19 03:57 PM vs micro output 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM you're dropping craftsmanship for tedium 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM not old school-ness 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM it's almost the same as just buying a CNC lathe 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM it doesnt take a craftsman to repeat the same thing, it takes a monkey, or a robot 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM or a cam 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM it takes a monkey to iterate through cam settings until you get something to work 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM it's nearly the same as buying a CNC lathe... but there is a difference.. 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM I dont need to convince you 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM I need to convince the market I sell to 22-Sep-19 03:58 PM I just think you won't convince anyone else that it's a novelty thing 22-Sep-19 03:59 PM why 22-Sep-19 03:59 PM because to the untrained eye it's pretty much CNC 22-Sep-19 03:59 PM it's doing the same job, over and over again, automatically, without operator input 22-Sep-19 04:00 PM still trying to do it more traditional than modern 22-Sep-19 04:00 PM almost as a challenge to myself 22-Sep-19 04:00 PM then learn the art of multiple setup runs 22-Sep-19 04:00 PM without cheating 22-Sep-19 04:00 PM that isnt a valid alternative 22-Sep-19 04:00 PM you can also shove your face into every shot in that case 22-Sep-19 04:00 PM to what is available, and what was used 22-Sep-19 04:00 PM cam lathes is what were used, eventually 22-Sep-19 04:00 PM and stayed in use until CNC took over 22-Sep-19 04:01 PM what was used was manual work, multiple setups, swiss lathes, then swiss lathes were retrofitted with motors 22-Sep-19 04:01 PM sure 22-Sep-19 04:01 PM and then everyone ditched swiss as soon as proper cnc was available 22-Sep-19 04:01 PM swiss-type lathes are still in use 22-Sep-19 04:01 PM w/ CNC 22-Sep-19 04:01 PM well, yeah, just properly made and with cnc in mind 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM sure.. Citizen is a decent maker of them nowadays 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM tornos too 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM Tornos made cam operated ones back in the day 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM real swiss :P 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM they still sell spare parts for their oldest cam operated lathes 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM Citizen makes watches though.. I believe they are the citizen watch co 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM anywho... 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM I am not trying to change peoples minds 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM and not even trying to charge them more.. because I know CNC woudl produce cheaper parts (time wise) in the end 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM but I will have a very limitted number of setups (watch calibers).. which is why I dont need to have the ability to program it instantly 22-Sep-19 04:02 PM I, myself, have a hard time taking people seriously who make watch parts on CNC 22-Sep-19 04:05 PM don't see why 22-Sep-19 04:05 PM it's still a very complicated process that takes a lot of effort to program 22-Sep-19 04:05 PM does the machine do the same thing in the end? sure 22-Sep-19 04:05 PM I'd simply like to avoid it, as I feel it does show more craftsmanship to do it more traditional 22-Sep-19 04:05 PM it's not like I am even trying to charge a boatload 22-Sep-19 04:05 PM the goal is to keep all costs down 22-Sep-19 04:06 PM CNC is definitely the way to go then 22-Sep-19 04:07 PM well.. hold up.. the goal is to make ~100 watches a year 22-Sep-19 04:07 PM using traditional methods 22-Sep-19 04:07 PM at that point you can just do regular multi setups 22-Sep-19 04:07 PM a swiss lathe will take you two weeks to set up for a single part 22-Sep-19 04:07 PM then it'll make a hundred parts in an hour 22-Sep-19 04:07 PM if you say so... 22-Sep-19 04:07 PM (and you will end up with a bucket of scraps from testing) 22-Sep-19 04:07 PM scrap isnt big deal, imo 22-Sep-19 04:08 PM swiss lathes take a lot of effort to set up, almost none to run 22-Sep-19 04:08 PM feed bar into hole 22-Sep-19 04:09 PM I hear you.. but I dont know if you know the market 22-Sep-19 04:09 PM you have your own opinion which is valid 22-Sep-19 04:09 PM and I have mine which I feel is very valid as well 22-Sep-19 04:09 PM does it matter to me if the person I sell to know I used traditional methods? stayed away from CNC, etc? 22-Sep-19 04:09 PM does it matter to them? 22-Sep-19 04:10 PM yes, but I think they wouldn't see swiss as really traditional 22-Sep-19 04:10 PM I think the crowd it is for would like to know and that it matters 22-Sep-19 04:11 PM maybe if you emphasize how complicated the prep work and setup is for a swiss 22-Sep-19 04:11 PM maaaaybe they'll see it that way 22-Sep-19 04:11 PM the plan is to also show near every step in YT vids 22-Sep-19 04:11 PM maybe not re-show every single thing.. ie, if I have to turn 2 different staffs (for different wheels) then jus tshow the process for one 22-Sep-19 04:11 PM there is a decent sentence in one of the watchmaking books about the use of a press to stamp out certain parts.. from probably the most traditional guy there is, who states that most independant watchmakers arent really able to have such a machine (cost, space, etc) nor make the proper tooling for it 22-Sep-19 04:11 PM I just dont want to be the guy who tries to handmake an entire watch on a single lathe.. acting like I know what I am doing 22-Sep-19 04:11 PM sighs 22-Sep-19 04:11 PM hard to put a lot of the feelings into words 22-Sep-19 04:15 PM if you end up making an entire watch on a lathe, you can be pretty sure you'll know what you're doing by the end of it 22-Sep-19 04:15 PM knowing what you are doing and doing 'wrong' work is two different htings 22-Sep-19 04:15 PM most of the methods in that idea are inaccurate and so forth 22-Sep-19 04:15 PM but, most watchmakers cant afford to make jigs for every step 22-Sep-19 04:15 PM or dont have the tools for it 22-Sep-19 04:15 PM or if they are only doing one-off/unique pieces on commision.. then there is no need 22-Sep-19 04:15 PM I want to prove accuracy 22-Sep-19 04:15 PM I guess I would (want to) fit in between the hand-made and the cnc-made 22-Sep-19 04:31 PM and merely for the ability to do accurate work, a modest amount, and semi quick.. I do see these machines as a very applicable method.. each method has it's own problems 22-Sep-19 04:31 PM shrugs 29-Sep-19 01:31 AM So, basically clickspring but better, right? 29-Sep-19 01:31 AM also, morning! 29-Sep-19 01:31 AM There goes Stephan again: 29-Sep-19 01:31 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxvVUvUBqag 29-Sep-19 01:31 AM 0.05mm per pass, but still damn. 01-Oct-19 10:49 AM nothing new, there was a discussion on a german forum if that is possible and he just made a video about it 01-Oct-19 10:49 AM you can also use diamond 01-Oct-19 12:03 PM Well, I didn't expect it, just that. 23-Oct-19 08:37 PM Started designing a tiny 3-phase servo motor controller for CNC 23-Oct-19 08:37 PM https://i.spirit.re/aH2cl.png 23-Oct-19 08:37 PM This is the NEMA17 footprint, designed to bolt directly onto a motor 23-Oct-19 08:37 PM double-sided load, 4 layer board... this is going to be affordable, but not stupid cheap :( 23-Oct-19 08:37 PM The magnetic encoder sits directly on the back, where the motor's shaft goes 23-Oct-19 08:37 PM https://i.spirit.re/OY65e.png 24-Oct-19 01:35 AM @Deleted User there might not be enough space for the magnetic encoder on the backside 24-Oct-19 01:35 AM But that is a valid way to do it, as I have seen similar magnetic encoder retrofits myself. 24-Oct-19 02:20 AM Nice! 24-Oct-19 10:07 AM @rfs the little chip in the middle of the cross is the encoder 24-Oct-19 10:09 AM Just that it is on the back side of the board, and I'm unsure if the motor axle will smash it in some cases 24-Oct-19 10:09 AM also, aren't those current shunts right above it? 24-Oct-19 10:36 AM I've since realized I don't need per-phase shunts for FOC when I have an encoder 24-Oct-19 10:36 AM https://i.spirit.re/BM3NE.png 24-Oct-19 10:36 AM and yeah, it's on the back - those holes are NEMA17 and are suitable for just adding small spacers 24-Oct-19 10:38 AM I'd recommend two shunts 24-Oct-19 10:38 AM and then calculate the last one 24-Oct-19 10:38 AM again, that's not necessary 24-Oct-19 10:43 AM Are you designing it to be used with any particular motors or just any nema17? 24-Oct-19 10:44 AM any motor you want, DC servo included 24-Oct-19 10:44 AM (using 4 of the 6 fets) 24-Oct-19 10:51 AM Nice 24-Oct-19 10:51 AM What is the estimated cost of components so far? 24-Oct-19 11:02 AM in one-off quantity using the best components, around $35, including the board 24-Oct-19 11:02 AM mass-produced, probably less than $25 total, including assembly 24-Oct-19 11:07 AM That isnt bad at all 24-Oct-19 11:10 AM cheaper than the cheapest servos on ebay, and some stepper drivers! 24-Oct-19 11:14 AM But this is a combination stepper with encoder? which will ensure you don't loose steps but won't give you the speed and torque of a DC motor? which is generally the point of going DC motor/encoder I thought? still nice to have a stepper driver integrated like that 24-Oct-19 11:42 AM It's not a stepper, it's a 3-phase ac servo 24-Oct-19 11:42 AM it will have stepper functionality(step/dir signal input), but it's a full 3 phase servo motor 24-Oct-19 11:42 AM slightly less torque than a stepper at stall, but you get MUCH higher powers and they're MUCH faster 24-Oct-19 11:42 AM which means you can use a reducer/belt 24-Oct-19 11:45 AM oh awesome, didn't know they made 3 phase servos in nema packaging, very cool!! 24-Oct-19 11:45 AM that's the only packaging high end machines use 24-Oct-19 11:45 AM just not this tiny 24-Oct-19 11:45 AM NEMA17 and NEMA23 are often steppers 24-Oct-19 11:45 AM NEMA34 are more often than not servos 24-Oct-19 11:45 AM and anything above costs too much money to keep in your head 24-Oct-19 11:45 AM there's also NEMA8... which I think I could make work... 24-Oct-19 11:46 AM but yea I do remember reading up on people playing with 3 phase motors as servos but I think there is some issue with using them like repeatability or something... or at-least I think people trying to use stupid hobby motors for like quadcopters 24-Oct-19 11:46 AM nothing like that 24-Oct-19 11:46 AM and people do that, yeah - the odrive project does this for 2 motors 24-Oct-19 11:46 AM however, the ordrive is $150-200 alone 24-Oct-19 11:47 AM yea... 24-Oct-19 11:47 AM I am just glad I found a DAC board for my big xyz gantry which needs -10 to +10 inputs 24-Oct-19 11:47 AM you don't need a special dac for that 24-Oct-19 11:48 AM got a PCI dac board with free linux/windows/mac drivers/api, 32 DACs 16-bits each, each with remote sense lines, some digital I/O on the board too along with like a motorola based microprocessor on the board for programming to setup control stuff for more real-time applications disconnected from the host OS 24-Oct-19 11:48 AM I actually have two of them 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM now that sounds like overkill 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM the best kind of kill 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM they were in the trash 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM aka 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM free 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM so I am working with what is cheapest :P 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM just so happens there is docs for linux cnc for them 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM though I don't know if I will use linux cnc? 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM I would 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM or if I will just poke at the API or whatever 24-Oct-19 11:49 AM it's the standard now 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM well if I do PnP stuff I'd be using openPnP talking to linuxCNC or just write my own library to talk straight to the card's API 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM isn't openpnp based on linuxcnc? 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM maybe it is, I never got that far into the docs 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM if it is then great 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM linuxcnc is a bit of a modular package 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM emc2 is the regular gcode dingus 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM with the mill-like ui 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM mhm I definitely plan to poke at it 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM I just need to get the specially connector and make up a cable for the card then I can install it in the picmg chassis in the system and play with it 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM I also need to get all the stuff thats to go out out of the way in the basement, like loading up the trailer with scrap... 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM so I can move that machine to a more usable space 24-Oct-19 11:50 AM its kinda burried atm 24-Oct-19 11:52 AM just dig a second basement out 24-Oct-19 11:52 AM lol I'll be at some point in the next few years be getting an insulated steel building outside... 24-Oct-19 11:52 AM but that will be like a 50K investment... 24-Oct-19 11:52 AM would like to try and have the car payed off before that lol 24-Oct-19 07:11 PM there we go, final-ish version 24-Oct-19 07:11 PM https://i.spirit.re/woaQR.jpg 24-Oct-19 07:11 PM https://i.spirit.re/BPS53.png 24-Oct-19 07:22 PM Those are some beefy looking traces 24-Oct-19 07:59 PM probably not beefy enough 24-Oct-19 07:59 PM that's why they're bare 24-Oct-19 08:01 PM Damn, how many amps does a 3 phase nema17 motor take? 24-Oct-19 08:01 PM the smallest nema17 motor I'm looking at is 1.9A 24-Oct-19 08:01 PM the largest is ~7-12A 24-Oct-19 08:01 PM though there's non-nema motors(cylindrical with only 1 nema17 flange) that go up to 280W 24-Oct-19 08:01 PM they're all stupid cheap though 24-Oct-19 08:01 PM a 24V 6.4A 105W motor is $37.54 24-Oct-19 08:02 PM Hmm, what kind of holding torque can you get out of the most powerful types? 24-Oct-19 08:03 PM the non-flanged 14A ones output around 0.6Nm static 24-Oct-19 08:03 PM that's what they're saying anyway 24-Oct-19 08:04 PM I've got a worm drive for a digital indexing head on the mill, it's quite overkill though... 24-Oct-19 08:04 PM 60:1 reduction and it's also pre-tensioned, takes a nema motor, probably nema17 24-Oct-19 08:11 PM ordered a motor from China and parts for 2 boards, as well as 3 actual boards 24-Oct-19 08:11 PM here's how it stacks up so far: https://i.spirit.re/1qYh4.png 24-Oct-19 08:11 PM almost $5 can be shaved off if you don't want RS485(and can do with 3.3V serial instead) 24-Oct-19 08:11 PM another $5-6 is optional for the DC-DC converter if you want to run above 45V, otherwise just jumpered over 24-Oct-19 08:11 PM the only really expensive bits are the STSPIN32F0A, the AS5600 encoder, and 6 fets 03-Nov-19 02:24 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dcgTIrSpXg that actually made me jump a bit... 03-Nov-19 07:32 AM quick question 03-Nov-19 07:32 AM my chamber is a ISO 100 cross and I want to weld some more ports onto it 03-Nov-19 07:32 AM it has no flat surface, so I was wondering how to get the holes in 03-Nov-19 07:32 AM I only have a drill press, no mill etc 03-Nov-19 07:32 AM a friend of mine recommended a step drill, does anyone have experience with them in stainless tubes? 03-Nov-19 07:57 AM just use a hochwertige Lochsäge 03-Nov-19 08:28 AM i do not think that a step drill is the answer in tubing...but maybe it would work 03-Nov-19 08:28 AM the hole saw idea sounds better to me 03-Nov-19 08:28 AM just make sure everything is very well clamped on your drill press table 03-Nov-19 08:28 AM and go slow! 03-Nov-19 08:51 AM I've made the experience that hole saws aren't very precise 03-Nov-19 08:51 AM but it might just have been a price thing 03-Nov-19 08:55 AM yeah the thing with hole saws though is you get pretty balanced cutting forces 03-Nov-19 08:55 AM with a step drill you are cutting mostly in just one place (on the ones i have anyway) 03-Nov-19 08:56 AM that's a good point 03-Nov-19 08:56 AM I guess I'll got the hole saw route 03-Nov-19 08:57 AM whatever you try...just make sure everything is really well clamped 03-Nov-19 08:57 AM that's a given ^^ 03-Nov-19 08:57 AM and I'll practice before on some scraps 03-Nov-19 08:57 AM because damn, ISO 100 ain't cheap 03-Nov-19 08:59 AM you could try to find someone with a milling machine if you run into trouble but i am sure that is sort of your last resort option 03-Nov-19 09:05 AM that would be cheating :P 03-Nov-19 09:05 AM I just like to do as much at home as I can 03-Nov-19 11:03 AM maybe look into how handmade bicycle tubes are notched? iirc they just use a jig and hole saws 03-Nov-19 11:03 AM any sort of 'space frame' would be similarly made 03-Nov-19 11:03 AM well, manually, as there are CNC plasma cutters that do it slightly different 03-Nov-19 11:06 AM I'm not talking about notching, but just putting holes in tubes 03-Nov-19 11:07 AM yeah, well, same concept, isn't it? 03-Nov-19 11:07 AM the difference is the diameter of the 'notch' 03-Nov-19 11:07 AM great or less than tube diameter 03-Nov-19 11:08 AM fair enough 03-Nov-19 11:08 AM are you going perpendicular? 03-Nov-19 11:08 AM yep 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM oh, easy then, use some V blocks and yeah, hole saws, should be okay 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM some angle would be fun, but I'm not ready for that yet 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM requires more jigs 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM but yeah, I'd just look at V-blocks, if you have them, otherwise just a vice should be decent enough 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM well, I will end up with some weird angle, but only when I try to drill perpendicular 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM vice with maybe two parallels 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM to support/level 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM the last time I used a hole saw was when I drilled my espresso machine portafilter to be bottomless/naked 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM and I used my morttiser machine, as I dont have another drill press, well, I didnt 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM I havent used my milling attachment for anything other than drilling, yet 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM but yeah, I'd say f you dont have V-blocks, but y ou have a vice big enough, then maybe use two parallels to support it off the bottom, if possible, otherwise, just support it and all should be good enough 03-Nov-19 11:09 AM how accurate do you really need the resulting hole? 03-Nov-19 11:12 AM not at all 03-Nov-19 11:12 AM I can compensate a lot while welding 03-Nov-19 11:12 AM sometimes having a brass/sacrificial inner block/round to support the downard forces may be a good idea 03-Nov-19 11:12 AM oh wow V blocks can be expensive... 03-Nov-19 11:12 AM yeah, kinda sucks 03-Nov-19 11:12 AM good Idea 03-Nov-19 11:13 AM for just a 90/45 deg 03-Nov-19 11:13 AM do you have parrelels for your vice at all? 03-Nov-19 11:13 AM and, is your vice big enough for said tube/chamber 03-Nov-19 11:13 AM not even close 03-Nov-19 11:14 AM hrmm... do you have C/G clamps? 03-Nov-19 11:14 AM the chamber is big enough so I can literally put my only good vice inside 03-Nov-19 11:14 AM hah.. I have one crummy vice.. I need to make some toolmakers vices, once I get the grinder all covered 03-Nov-19 11:14 AM do you have G clamps? 03-Nov-19 11:14 AM that are big enough for tube 03-Nov-19 11:18 AM just cut some pieces of wood on a bandsaw to support the cross 03-Nov-19 11:18 AM strap clamps over the tube through the wood 03-Nov-19 11:18 AM bolts into the drill press table 03-Nov-19 11:18 AM my opinion anyway 03-Nov-19 11:19 AM technically I have no clamp at all that would fit it 03-Nov-19 11:19 AM was thinking of building some holding jig out of wood 03-Nov-19 11:21 AM LRM's idea of putting wood inside that you clamp onto would likely work well 03-Nov-19 11:21 AM most vices are clamped at the base to the T-slots 03-Nov-19 11:21 AM what you don't want is rolling 03-Nov-19 11:21 AM heck, if the tube can rest inside of a T-slot, that may work (do you have T slots?) 03-Nov-19 11:23 AM yeah i was thinking wood inside and under as support 03-Nov-19 11:23 AM then using the piece underneath to just bolt things to the table 03-Nov-19 11:23 AM most drill presses do not have T slots, just slots, in my experience anyway 03-Nov-19 11:24 AM no t-slots either 03-Nov-19 11:24 AM but workholding will be the least of my problems 03-Nov-19 11:24 AM the welding will not be fun...but my tig skills are a bad joke 03-Nov-19 11:24 AM hope yours are better 03-Nov-19 11:25 AM how to get the holes in there and how to weld them shut again is (with a straight-ish flange inside) 03-Nov-19 11:25 AM tbh I think my tig skills are ok 03-Nov-19 11:26 AM how many holes are you adding? guess i thought you just meant one 03-Nov-19 11:27 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191022_195241-74834.jpg 03-Nov-19 11:27 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191022_194455-85E91.jpg 03-Nov-19 11:27 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191103_174959-2CA51.jpg 03-Nov-19 11:27 AM not sure about that yet, as many as possible 03-Nov-19 11:27 AM 5, maybe 10 03-Nov-19 11:27 AM pics are some of my tig adventures so far, I think they look just fine, considering I never held a tig torch in my hand until a month ago 03-Nov-19 11:27 AM I'm not happy with the looks of my Al welds, but so far they didn't leak 03-Nov-19 11:30 AM I sitll need to try out welding 03-Nov-19 11:31 AM all i have ever tried to tig was aluminum and i would be too embarrassed to show photos of it haha 03-Nov-19 11:31 AM i am pretty decent at stick welding w/ steel so im not sure what exactly the issue was but i am guessing surface prep in retrospect 03-Nov-19 11:31 AM are you able to get inside the ID of the cross to do the welding? 03-Nov-19 11:33 AM aye, should be 102 mm 03-Nov-19 11:33 AM thereabouts 03-Nov-19 11:34 AM what is the wall thickness? 03-Nov-19 11:38 AM 3, maybe 4 mm? 03-Nov-19 11:39 AM 316 stainless? 03-Nov-19 11:39 AM this has nothing to do with holding, not really, just generally curious 03-Nov-19 11:42 AM unknown stainless 03-Nov-19 11:42 AM 316, 304, hastelloy-n, I really have no Idea 03-Nov-19 11:42 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191101_222319-2BA18.jpg 03-Nov-19 11:42 AM looks like this 03-Nov-19 11:42 AM and there you can already see my issue, three ports already have a purpose (pump, viewport, HV feedthrough) so there is only one left for diagnostics and whatever I want to put inside the chamber 03-Nov-19 11:42 AM which is why I want many smaller ports all around it, just so I can de-clutter that one top flange 03-Nov-19 11:42 AM and 03-Nov-19 11:42 AM well 03-Nov-19 11:42 AM because welding stainless is so much fun 07-Nov-19 09:22 AM thanks @Pan Da for the lochsäge recommendation 07-Nov-19 09:22 AM while I did not go for a good quality one I still got one that chews through stainless like nothing 07-Nov-19 09:22 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191107_175615-89CB8.jpg 07-Nov-19 11:26 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191107_200354-C1751.jpg 07-Nov-19 11:26 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191107_201932-E2FC4.jpg 07-Nov-19 11:39 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191107_203837-6474C.jpg 07-Nov-19 11:39 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191107_204055-F8572.jpg 07-Nov-19 11:47 AM abstract high vacuum art 07-Nov-19 11:50 AM have I ever mentioned how much fun welding stainless is 07-Nov-19 11:52 AM you're not going to fun me into buying a tig welder 07-Nov-19 12:06 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191107_205452-F80FD.jpg 07-Nov-19 12:06 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191107_210539-BB47B.jpg 07-Nov-19 03:15 PM are those just test holes? or will they be used for something? 07-Nov-19 03:18 PM oh, totally forgot to take a picture of the other side xD 07-Nov-19 03:18 PM I just welded in two KF16 flanges 08-Nov-19 01:15 AM @GigaSquirrel you need scotch brite wheels to polish that. I bought a set of three grains in aliepress (those with velcro) and could not be happier. 08-Nov-19 01:15 AM what's wrong with electropolishing? 08-Nov-19 01:15 AM no danger if scratching up the sealing surface 08-Nov-19 01:17 AM Ah, thought yiu had only pickled it. 08-Nov-19 01:17 AM Sorry. 08-Nov-19 01:18 AM ah, no, I'm using phosphoric and sulfiric acid as an eleytrolyte, combined with a carbon brush and many many amps ^^ 08-Nov-19 01:18 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20191103_175455-E83BC.jpg 08-Nov-19 01:18 AM left ia original part, right is welded and electropolished 08-Nov-19 01:20 AM Try the hardware approach, gives a really good polish, especially in parts like that that can be chucked into the lathe 08-Nov-19 01:21 AM maybe I'm missing something, but... why? ^^ 08-Nov-19 01:21 AM the electro stuff is absolutely no effort for me 08-Nov-19 01:21 AM Because fashion victim 08-Nov-19 01:21 AM get the brush, plug it in, brush the part, rinse in water 08-Nov-19 01:22 AM I mean, you can totally see the weld in the right piece. 08-Nov-19 01:22 AM With scotch brite, you can't tell at all. 08-Nov-19 01:23 AM I will put a camera in my chamber only to Livestream the weld 24/7 for you :P 08-Nov-19 01:23 AM XD 08-Nov-19 01:23 AM Would watch. 08-Nov-19 01:23 AM World Wide Weld? 08-Nov-19 01:23 AM XD 08-Nov-19 01:24 AM ehehe 08-Nov-19 01:24 AM But seriously, I'll send you a disc of each grain and try it. 08-Nov-19 01:25 AM but I don't want to xD 08-Nov-19 01:25 AM I'm happy as is, it's a workflow that works for me 08-Nov-19 01:25 AM Learn to properly finish what you weld, kid! 08-Nov-19 01:25 AM /hover slap hand/ 08-Nov-19 01:26 AM I tend to screw up things involving "manual" work, as in not guided by rails (like the lathe) 08-Nov-19 01:27 AM Nah, chuck the piece, spin, apply gentle pressure with decreasing grains, marvel at mirror finish. 08-Nov-19 01:27 AM It's so easy even you can't frick it up. 08-Nov-19 01:27 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/raw-B1397.png 08-Nov-19 01:29 AM I have the high lathe, boy. cuts anakinsquirrel arms and legs 08-Nov-19 01:30 AM 'this but a scratch! 08-Nov-19 01:30 AM What are you going to do, spit?! 08-Nov-19 01:31 AM yeah, spit acid and electropolish my stuff with it 08-Nov-19 01:31 AM Just do it, resistance is futile. 08-Nov-19 01:31 AM I know, the voltage is high enough 08-Nov-19 01:33 AM /John Wick's king of hobos voice/ SOMEONE, PLEAAAAAAASE, GIVE THIS MAN A SCOTCH BRITE POLISH PAD 08-Nov-19 01:35 AM huehuehue 08-Nov-19 08:07 AM man I may need to setup a nice big electro-polishing setup for large pieces 08-Nov-19 08:41 AM highly recommended 08-Nov-19 08:56 AM Gonna be honest whenever I heard of electro-polishing I assumed it to be a much more complex process hehe 08-Nov-19 08:56 AM Lol not really 08-Nov-19 08:56 AM I've been tempted to build a set up as well 08-Nov-19 09:56 AM the issue with a bath is that it gets quite big 08-Nov-19 09:56 AM and I'm not sure I want multiple liters of concentrated acids standing around 08-Nov-19 11:08 AM Make a sane setup for draining it when not in use? 12-Nov-19 06:19 PM new bellows for the column of the tool & cutter grinder finally arrived! (I finally ordered them, arrived in like 3 days) 12-Nov-19 06:19 PM after I slice the existing seam, , wrap around the column, and re-solvent weld (neoprene), I should be good to go with the machine.. of course I sitll need to purchase an electromagnetic chuck (thinking import because half as much as anything else, and new) for various stuffs, but I could potentially be tool grinding very soon 12-Nov-19 07:19 PM slicing the bellow is actually going quick enough, about half way through 12-Nov-19 07:49 PM and done.. let's see if it fits, or an expensive mistake! 12-Nov-19 07:56 PM as far as I can tell, it's a perfect fit! .. just to need solvent weld (apparently rubber cement works on neoprene? but dont have any, so likely will run out to the grocer to get some real quick) the seam, and clamp it in there 12-Nov-19 09:56 PM hrm, first attempt at rubber cement and doesnt appear to be working as fast as I want it to.. may result to some straigh toluene to solvent weld it, or similar.. 13-Nov-19 02:45 AM Photos! 14-Nov-19 08:20 PM once it is setup!.. 14-Nov-19 08:20 PM looks like silicone sealant (construction grade) is actually working the best.. mild heat gunning to help speed it up, will do it in sections, as it is hard to glue all the accordion folds at once, and cant fold them onto each other untill dry 14-Nov-19 11:56 PM Those accordion folds aren't regarding vacuum I guess? 15-Nov-19 05:58 AM no, rubber bellows for a grinding machine's column (sliding surface, protects against hardened tool steel dust) 15-Nov-19 05:58 AM maybe eventually it will make vacuum parts! 16-Nov-19 02:59 PM started to glue the bellow to the retaining ring, since it was a cuff style initially, it makes clamping difficult due to deforming.. but it should hold well.. just a few more sections (doing 1/6th at a time) before I can screw the top section all together, then onto the bottom.. hopefully it will be all setup by the end of the weekend 16-Nov-19 02:59 PM I think I need to go to the small hardware store for 3 screws.. dropped one, and likely the replacement wont be a perfect match, so might as well just replace all of them.. plus they would be better as hex than flat head 16-Nov-19 02:59 PM doh, about to rain.. hrmmm 17-Nov-19 10:55 AM bellows finally installed! ..will post pics once I clean up the dozens of paper towels and nitrile gloves.. I currently have it sitting in the most stretched position, to allow for the silicone along the seam to cure in that non-contact w/ accordion folds position, as it is still a little tacky, and needs another coat or two, still 17-Nov-19 11:02 AM congrats! sounds like that has been a huge project 17-Nov-19 11:03 AM the bellows took a few days of actual work, mostly due to drying time of the silicone and such, but yeah, my entire summer break was cleaning the machine 17-Nov-19 11:03 AM beyond the de-facto 1-2-3 blocks, and machinist vices.. I do plane on making some simple blades, sort of like for a hand-planer, but for pegwood, as my first 'production' project on it 17-Nov-19 11:03 AM looking at a form-grinding (dressing) attachment, for the gear profiles that I am really aiming for 17-Nov-19 11:03 AM also need to figure out how to rig spiral grinding onto it.. which I think will be easier with master plates/spirals that a finger then traces 17-Nov-19 11:03 AM but I'll keep y'all posted.. 17-Nov-19 11:03 AM the next thing I really need for it is an magnetic chuck.. thinking import simply because half the cost of used ones, and new 17-Nov-19 11:22 AM how big of one do you need? 17-Nov-19 11:22 AM the surface grinder size pop up on craigslist fairly often at decent prices 17-Nov-19 11:22 AM those might be a little big for your machine though? 17-Nov-19 11:23 AM I am likely looking at 18" long, and maybe better than 6" deep (sorry for imperial measurements here) 17-Nov-19 11:23 AM the machine is actually quite big, not hobby size 17-Nov-19 11:23 AM oh yeah just watch craigslist then 17-Nov-19 11:23 AM I have about a meter of travel on the table 17-Nov-19 11:23 AM yeah, good idea, lemme check 17-Nov-19 11:23 AM those show up fairly often in my area (southern california) 17-Nov-19 11:23 AM I cant watch though, if it's there, then good, toherwise I just need ot pull the trigger and buy a new one 17-Nov-19 11:24 AM look for surface grinder listings with one and email about just buying that too 17-Nov-19 11:24 AM might free up some $ for those attachments 17-Nov-19 11:24 AM closest one is a bit further away, yeah, I'll just look at a new import 17-Nov-19 11:24 AM it will be ground in place, so there isn't a fear of how terrible it may be 17-Nov-19 11:24 AM I'll figure out the perfect size soon enough 17-Nov-19 11:24 AM going to keep it mounted to the far right, and likely keep the tool holding head on the left 17-Nov-19 11:24 AM I have plans to use the swivel of the table to the fullest extends to create large radii where needed 17-Nov-19 11:27 AM damn...if only i had enough space to justify this... https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv/tls/d/granada-hills-surface-grinder-machine/7015841324.html 17-Nov-19 11:27 AM $250 for a surface grinder w/ magnetic vise 17-Nov-19 11:27 AM crazy stuff 17-Nov-19 11:27 AM I paid $900 for the base machine.. plus shipping 17-Nov-19 11:27 AM and forklift rental.. 17-Nov-19 11:27 AM and pizza for Adam 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM isnt your machine a really nice one though and not just your average surface grinder? 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM yeah.. 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM universal tool and cutter grinder than can actually do surface, ID, and OD with specific attachments and such 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM so, no need for a sep surface grinder 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM I'll snag some shots of current ocndition in a few hours.. still chilling out/waking up 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM half looking at this one.. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Hishiko-18-x-8-Magnetic-Chuck-No-707-Super-Strong-Hold-20-OAL-NICE/264373000120?hash=item3d8ddbd7b8:g:1hAAAOSw-O9dDt3N 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM but yeah, double the price of any 6x18 new import 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM import: https://www.ebay.com/itm/10-x-20-Fine-Pole-Magnetic-Chuck-N45-Magnet-Material-Processing-Neodymium/202755119798 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM lol, same product, by diff seller, is like $75 less 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM I'll double check some measurements and whatnot, but that islikely the way I will go 17-Nov-19 11:28 AM I dont want to be picky about such a non critical type of thi g that will be ground in place anyways 17-Nov-19 11:38 AM do you have a T slot right in the middle of your table? 17-Nov-19 11:38 AM I have three, and hte middle one is at an angle 17-Nov-19 11:38 AM most tool & cutter grinders only have a single T 17-Nov-19 11:39 AM would that complicate clamping on the 10x20? was just thinking about that 17-Nov-19 11:39 AM I may have to make special clamps, but it would be worth it 17-Nov-19 11:39 AM yeah i have seen them with the center one most often, few oddballs that had two though 17-Nov-19 11:39 AM the need to clamp in the middle may not be needed 17-Nov-19 11:39 AM three is a new one on me heh 17-Nov-19 11:39 AM any idea why the center is at an angle? 17-Nov-19 11:40 AM some of these chucks have a clamp like t hing that can go anywhere on the end, vs a hole cutout for a T nut/bolt 17-Nov-19 11:40 AM the workholding headstock + tailstock are formed for the angle too.. 17-Nov-19 11:40 AM maybe works bettter for certain type of OD grinding where you have a bit more force in that direction 17-Nov-19 11:40 AM I'll try to show some pics soon enough, watching a presentation on mechanical singing birds now 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0690-DB030.jpg 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0691-4D2D0.jpg 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0692-4D82C.jpg 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0693-E033E.jpg 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0694-AC75B.jpg 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0695-F366A.jpg 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0696-8953A.jpg 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0697-51C38.jpg 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM angled T-slot 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0689-98ED8.jpg 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM yeah, it's a mess, but it'll do! 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM it's also not operating, so no need to keep tools off of it, yet 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM the bellows/way covers for the saddle there are basically fine.. the metal ones that attached to it, telescopic, suffered a little damage and I have to remake one part, but the crusty old black accordion style bellows dont have any holes in them, and will be fine to simply put on 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM the one on the column had basically been torn off 17-Nov-19 02:10 PM so, that bellow is 8" ID x 10" OD x 12" long.. so like 200mm x 250mm x 300mm.. not exactly an easy size to find 17-Nov-19 02:24 PM that angled T slot is super interesting 17-Nov-19 02:31 PM the mating part is the base for the tool holder thing.. I simply have it disassembled for cleaning 17-Nov-19 02:31 PM but yeah, I have other T slots I can use beyond that one, or "simply" make angled clamps 17-Nov-19 02:31 PM for the future magnetic chuck 19-Nov-19 05:51 PM How easy would it be to machine a piece of sheet metal 150 microns think? Basically just cutting the border off which surrounds some nano features, that are about 1 inch by 1 inch. The border is about 1/8 of an inch and ideally would be trimmed off to within say 100 microns give or take 100 microns 19-Nov-19 05:51 PM I went to an EDM shop today and they quoted roughly $1,000 including some tooling like a jig to hold the work piece, so the nano features weren't being clamped on 19-Nov-19 05:51 PM $500 of that was just making the jig, then a bunch to align optically the workpiece in the jig (which would clamp the piece around the outer edge) 19-Nov-19 05:51 PM And around an hour to do the actual cutting 19-Nov-19 05:51 PM Plus time to do that a few times to dial in the settings on some test pieces 19-Nov-19 05:51 PM I'm thinking that clamping the workpiece between two pieces of rubber and shoving that into a high speed mill with a really nice stage might work just fine... But I'm not sure if the burr on the edge would be too tall or if it would warp the workpiece 19-Nov-19 06:33 PM @nmz787 ship it over, I have a friend with an idle WEDM machine 19-Nov-19 06:33 PM 150um isn't that hard though - a high speed(think NSK or Westwind) spindle, a rigid machine, and precise/fast feed rates 19-Nov-19 07:23 PM @Deleted User sounds good, but I think we've been shipping this project around too much already 19-Nov-19 07:23 PM heh 19-Nov-19 07:23 PM Yeah, try a high speed spindle and rigidity 19-Nov-19 08:36 PM Would a dremel be high enough speed? 19-Nov-19 09:28 PM dremels have waaaaay too much runout to be useful for that 19-Nov-19 09:28 PM what kind of metal is it that you want cut? 19-Nov-19 09:28 PM and you just want to trim the border off? could you use a shear of some kind? 19-Nov-19 09:32 PM dremels are hand tools and should stay that way 19-Nov-19 09:33 PM if it is something like copper, brass, aluminum, maybe nickel you could probably use some of those razor pliers 19-Nov-19 09:33 PM the most sane option is probably this 19-Nov-19 09:33 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/Water-cooled-CNC-Spindle-Motor-800W-ER11-220V-400Hz-24000rpm-Engraving-Mill-CE/163323436687? 19-Nov-19 09:33 PM for spindles anyway 19-Nov-19 09:33 PM cutting metal with scissors always leaves a nasty burr 19-Nov-19 09:33 PM and given that he went to an EDM place, I'm assuming this needs to be near perfect 19-Nov-19 09:34 PM i have a nice nsk air spindle but i have not had the guts to use it on anything yet...or bought any tools for it. i couldnt say no at the price heh 19-Nov-19 09:35 PM this is closer to the standard for high precision machining 19-Nov-19 09:35 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/Precise-Fischer-SC-52-High-Frequency-Spindle-Motor-60000-rpm/183885326259 19-Nov-19 09:35 PM and i dont think scissors are a great idea at all but something like these: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Craftool-Razor-Cutting-Pliers-by-Tandy-FREE-SHIPPING-in-USA-/283254452535 19-Nov-19 09:35 PM those might work 19-Nov-19 09:35 PM unlikely 19-Nov-19 09:35 PM Making me want a CNC 19-Nov-19 09:35 PM they still leave a small burr 19-Nov-19 09:35 PM I need less projects not more 19-Nov-19 09:35 PM even though that thing I have downstairs would make one heck of a CNC platform 19-Nov-19 09:37 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/Nakanishi-HTS-1501S-Air-Spindle-150-000-RPM-M2040F-Coolant-Nozzle-Collet-Lock/183744354076 <- this is what i have 19-Nov-19 09:37 PM air spindles are nice and all, but they have roughly between zero and nil torque 19-Nov-19 09:37 PM yeah i plan to use it for engraving mostly 19-Nov-19 09:38 PM not to mention screaming like murder 19-Nov-19 09:38 PM i was surprised how not that bad it is actually 19-Nov-19 09:38 PM the guy will take less than $100 if you get a dialog going with him heh 19-Nov-19 09:39 PM this is super nice 19-Nov-19 09:39 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/Nakanishi-NSK-NR40-5100-ATC-Spindle-50-000-RPM-CNC-Router-Carbon-Fiber/182128755223 19-Nov-19 09:39 PM but needs an actual motor to spin it up 19-Nov-19 09:40 PM yeah the gearbox thing and then motors are all insane prices mostly 19-Nov-19 09:40 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/NSK-Nakanishi-NRA-5080-High-Speed-Spindle-EM805-Motor-80-000-min-1/183946798625 19-Nov-19 09:40 PM it's not too bad 19-Nov-19 09:40 PM very comparable to super high power spindles 19-Nov-19 09:42 PM anyway...for the trimming question...i think the answers probably vary a lot depending what material he needs to cut 19-Nov-19 10:43 PM Well just spent 290 bucks on Mesa cards 19-Nov-19 10:43 PM ya'll got me thinkin about it and I just got paid recently so yea going to get that thing in the basement more usable 19-Nov-19 10:43 PM Got a 6I24-16, 7I33TA, and a 7I90HD 19-Nov-19 10:45 PM LinuxCNC? 19-Nov-19 10:45 PM yea, figured its a good place to start and start learning with it 19-Nov-19 10:45 PM the gantry itself is beautiful, has good servo amps 19-Nov-19 10:45 PM just need a controller, so something basically plug and play other than initial setup will allow me to get acquainted with the software 19-Nov-19 10:46 PM I have aerotech motor drives for my CNC mill but the firewire interface is really flaky. Thinking of switching to LinuxCNC with mesa cards. 19-Nov-19 10:47 PM this is the thing I have to retrofit 19-Nov-19 10:47 PM https://i.imgur.com/97eh07Q.jpg 19-Nov-19 10:47 PM I would ideally like to end up using it for PnP which some people have gotten openPnP playing with and some people have gotten their own PnP stuff going under LinuxCNC 19-Nov-19 10:47 PM but yea 19-Nov-19 10:47 PM https://i.imgur.com/ZQqd0Ip.jpg 19-Nov-19 10:47 PM the ballscrews in that thing are crazy 19-Nov-19 10:47 PM https://i.imgur.com/RFtaLT6.jpg 19-Nov-19 10:47 PM and the linear rails are wonderful, its just crazy over-built and was used in a clean room enviroment so yea... 19-Nov-19 10:47 PM it was used for putting the encapsulation glue around dies 19-Nov-19 11:06 PM https://i.imgur.com/Gv8wl8C.jpg 19-Nov-19 11:06 PM Ah there is a good photo 19-Nov-19 11:06 PM https://i.imgur.com/dHLDSWl.jpg 19-Nov-19 11:06 PM https://i.imgur.com/hnBOPLW.jpg 19-Nov-19 11:06 PM old PICMG chassis top is going out 19-Nov-19 11:06 PM it was flakey anyway unfortunately 20-Nov-19 12:02 AM Brushed servos! 20-Nov-19 12:02 AM And hot damn those ballscrews, that pitch!!! 20-Nov-19 12:30 AM yea it's fast!! 20-Nov-19 12:30 AM supposed to be darn precise too though hehe 20-Nov-19 12:30 AM got some nice encoders on there 20-Nov-19 12:30 AM I have some linear stepper motors that could compete with it 20-Nov-19 12:30 AM They're scary and open-loop though 20-Nov-19 12:30 AM I still need to build a PNP machine out of them 20-Nov-19 12:30 AM Or a stupidly fast 3D printer, or a stupidly fast PCB engraver 20-Nov-19 12:33 AM its not like you have to pick just one. why not do all 3 things 1/3rd as well? hah 20-Nov-19 12:36 AM That's what I would do 20-Nov-19 03:15 AM Woah 20-Nov-19 11:32 AM @LRM it's nickel 20-Nov-19 11:32 AM Unfortunately I need this done asap 20-Nov-19 11:32 AM Burr is not as much of an issue as warping, I think 20-Nov-19 11:32 AM Seems like run-out of a dremel means I just need a slower feedrate 20-Nov-19 11:32 AM Gonna contact an EDM shop across the country who apparently can do optically guided EDM 20-Nov-19 11:32 AM Need the border of a holographic "shim" trimmed to as close to the nano features as possible... So I can use it to stamp replicas as close as possible 20-Nov-19 11:32 AM Ideally there'd just be like 3 inches of unpatterned nickel around the nano features, but someone cut it with shears to get it into their small vacuum chamber for imaging 20-Nov-19 11:32 AM (since the unpatterned nickel wouldn't scratch or affect nearby stamps, after the UV casting resin hardened) 20-Nov-19 11:36 AM do you have extras to test with? i think the razor pliers might work if it is thin nickel and would not warp things much because of the flat support underneath 20-Nov-19 11:36 AM Yeah 20-Nov-19 11:36 AM 150 microns thick 20-Nov-19 11:37 AM i would give those a try before shelling out money for EDM 20-Nov-19 11:40 AM Thing is, I don't think I can manually get things cut within say 100 microns 20-Nov-19 11:40 AM Unless the nickel was fixed well on a stage, and the tool was fixed well relative to the stage 20-Nov-19 11:41 AM all depends on how precise it needs to be 20-Nov-19 11:41 AM Actually 250 microns would be OK 20-Nov-19 11:41 AM It could be wavy 20-Nov-19 11:41 AM But needs to be less than or equal to about 250 microns 20-Nov-19 11:41 AM Mayyybe I could do it by hand under an inspection scope 20-Nov-19 11:41 AM But, if I mess up, it'd be a pretty big loss 20-Nov-19 11:43 AM 0.1mm-0.25mm/0.004"-0.009" isnt impossible to do even just by hand with some good magnification for those pliers but dont slip hah 20-Nov-19 11:43 AM something similar to that with a nice work surface would be good but im not sure what you would even look for to buy that 21-Nov-19 12:32 PM The servo driver is coming along! Here's the almost final-ish design: https://i.spirit.re/oAn4J.png 21-Nov-19 12:32 PM And here it is in the flesh(revision 1, already worse than the design): 21-Nov-19 12:32 PM https://i.spirit.re/Y9488.jpg 21-Nov-19 06:01 PM Looks pretty good 21-Nov-19 06:01 PM DC or brushless? Good for turbos? 21-Nov-19 06:01 PM The 6 fet looking chips make me hopeful that it's 3 phase 21-Nov-19 06:20 PM 3 phase, but not good for powerful turbos 21-Nov-19 06:20 PM only ~45V max supply voltage 21-Nov-19 06:20 PM I'll probably make a turbo driver based on this later, this is for servos only 21-Nov-19 07:08 PM Will you open source it? 21-Nov-19 07:08 PM Kicad and github 21-Nov-19 10:46 PM Yes, yes, and yes 21-Nov-19 11:44 PM Btw, I just found this exists: 21-Nov-19 11:44 PM https://es.aliexpress.com/item/32876196374.html?spm=a2g0s.8937460.0.0.2f2b2e0eTU3a7N 21-Nov-19 11:44 PM Build quality is not going to be the best from aliexpress, but just bought one for fun. 22-Nov-19 09:40 AM Quick update on the servo drive: Holy hell math I may not be able to write all the firmware myself. Learning about space vector modulation and Park transforms is like scraping my brain against turbopump blades 22-Nov-19 09:40 AM But the board started up on the first try! Everything works! Except RS485, because I put the right part on the board, but ordered the wrong version of the chip. Whoops. 22-Nov-19 10:12 AM sounds awesome 22-Nov-19 10:13 AM Turns out servos are very complicated 22-Nov-19 10:13 AM https://i.spirit.re/tY2mm.webm 22-Nov-19 10:13 AM Here's a "360 degree" sweep on an 8 pole motor 22-Nov-19 11:42 AM @Conmega who was that we were talking to about server drives in voice chat a long time ago? 22-Nov-19 12:58 PM servo drives? Hrm I can't remember, I think I was talking about designing my own servo controller and they were telling me that was stupid of me to try and do. Which was fair advice but rude. 22-Nov-19 12:59 PM I guess I wasn't there for that part. I just remembered them pointing to some good recorces 22-Nov-19 12:59 PM I personally think if I had the focus I could have gotten something going but I only realize my tension span is too short heh... 22-Nov-19 12:59 PM I think they brought up a lot of topics that I'd have difficulty with, but I don't remember resources... I'd hope they would be in the resources channel if they were brought up. 22-Nov-19 01:00 PM @Conmega that advice is very very sound 22-Nov-19 01:00 PM I thought it would be simpler 22-Nov-19 01:00 PM dear god it isn't 22-Nov-19 01:00 PM "ok, I have three phase control and encoder feedback, now what?" person on the other end dumps 3000 pages of advanced math on me 22-Nov-19 01:01 PM Yea I mean like you seem to have more patience and skill than I do :P 22-Nov-19 01:02 PM in hardware design, maybe 22-Nov-19 01:02 PM I suck at software 22-Nov-19 01:02 PM I'm OK with C but not the advance mathz 22-Nov-19 01:02 PM And like I've been doing a lot of microcontroller C and have most of the basic dos and don'ts for performance understood at this point and how to work with prephrials and speed through a datasheet. 22-Nov-19 01:03 PM see, that's the part I already got down 22-Nov-19 01:03 PM Though I have yet to get into ST's parts I think. I have been using TI chips mostly and am playing with an AVR recently for a christmas gift project 22-Nov-19 01:03 PM I've got the blinkenlights, the fets do the fet thing, and the encoder spits out data 22-Nov-19 01:03 PM But space vector modulation, park, inverse park, and clarke transforms, electric degrees, anti-cogging, stage decision, and all that, is currently boiling my brain 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM the 3 phase control and timing on that will be fun 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM Turns our servos are not driven with sine waves in the slightest 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM Or trapezoids 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM but I wouldn't worry about all the features right now, you can add those as you go on 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM Yeah, those aren't features 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM Just worry about spinning it right now, no feedback 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM Those are the basics 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM take it in steps 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM That's spinning it 22-Nov-19 01:04 PM Actual control theory is bolted on top of that 22-Nov-19 01:05 PM Ah 22-Nov-19 01:05 PM I know there are lots of 3 phase drivers that are open-source, you may be-able to find something to look at and start with! 22-Nov-19 01:05 PM I'm learning a little 22-Nov-19 01:05 PM I personally was going to do a DC servo drive, so I'd only need a +10-10 output and encoder input 22-Nov-19 01:05 PM so my controller wouldn't have been too bad if I just kept with it heh... 22-Nov-19 01:06 PM DC servos are marginally easier 22-Nov-19 01:06 PM had gotten a TI C2000 board to play with for it 22-Nov-19 01:06 PM But there's a ton of control theory in those too 22-Nov-19 01:06 PM yea I know 22-Nov-19 01:06 PM or I found out :P 22-Nov-19 01:06 PM The opensource drivers that work with stationary motor control(as in, position) and do it properly are very very complicated 22-Nov-19 01:06 PM This should be able to control a DC motor as well, just a bit of logic reconfiguration 22-Nov-19 01:07 PM Well you mostly just need direction and speed control then a PID loop with the encoders for a very basic thing right? 22-Nov-19 01:07 PM At the basic level for DC motors, yeah 22-Nov-19 01:07 PM so if you can find code that you can modify from some open-source project into your thing that gives you basic control like a quad-coper would have for its blades... 22-Nov-19 01:07 PM Might be-able to work off that? 22-Nov-19 01:08 PM Those are worthless for this 22-Nov-19 01:08 PM Since they rely on inertia 22-Nov-19 01:08 PM mmm right 22-Nov-19 01:08 PM If I twiddle the motor fast enough, it spins 22-Nov-19 01:08 PM yea... 3phase motors are generally not used for axis drives for a reason aren't they... 22-Nov-19 01:08 PM eugh 22-Nov-19 01:08 PM They are used for literally every industrial machine ever 22-Nov-19 01:08 PM It's just that their drives are $$$ 22-Nov-19 01:09 PM I do remember one hackaday article on someone who used off the shelf like quadcopter servos for gantry 22-Nov-19 01:09 PM Big CNC mills, lathes, etc - they're all servos 22-Nov-19 01:09 PM And you're talking about ODrive 22-Nov-19 01:09 PM It also has a ton of code 22-Nov-19 01:09 PM other projects are STMBL, VESC 22-Nov-19 01:10 PM hmm ok, and I suppose I forgot those large machines use them where price is little to be concerned about, I was more talking anything sub 10K I guess heh... 22-Nov-19 01:11 PM sub 10k is easy 22-Nov-19 01:11 PM sub 1k is also easy 22-Nov-19 01:11 PM sub 100 is not 22-Nov-19 01:11 PM although the gantry I have was a 250K machine and that is just DC motor with encoder system 22-Nov-19 01:11 PM but its probably from... mid 2000s? 22-Nov-19 01:11 PM older ones did use DC, since the brains were dumber back then 22-Nov-19 01:11 PM its a really nice gantry though 22-Nov-19 01:11 PM yea this had an MEI ISA board in it 22-Nov-19 01:11 PM had some DSPs on it for the control loops 22-Nov-19 01:12 PM nowadays all those DSPs are replaced by software 22-Nov-19 01:12 PM software written by bearded nude wizards in industrial control companies' basements 22-Nov-19 01:16 PM heh pmuch 22-Nov-19 04:40 PM do you need a CNC kit? 22-Nov-19 04:40 PM https://www.motioncontrolproducts.co.uk/products/15/170/cnc-3-axis-estun-pronet-servo-kit---400w/ 22-Nov-19 04:40 PM These kits are really good 22-Nov-19 04:40 PM they can do higher power too :> 22-Nov-19 04:40 PM (just mail them) 22-Nov-19 04:40 PM I'm gonna use them (3 axis of 1kW) for my Bridgeport retrofit 22-Nov-19 04:48 PM wish I had a bridgeport to retrofit heh 22-Nov-19 06:40 PM Motioncontrolproducts sell these nice kits yeah 22-Nov-19 06:40 PM They were in Marco Reps' video 22-Nov-19 06:40 PM (sponsored?) 22-Nov-19 06:40 PM Progress! https://i.spirit.re/SuwsC.webm 22-Nov-19 06:48 PM nice! 23-Nov-19 07:52 AM Yeah, sponsored, but they are good, and the price is pretty great compared to other systems on the market 23-Nov-19 07:52 AM and your servo drive seems neat 23-Nov-19 04:10 PM I learned of a new way for micro movements.. called the "poisson pusher" named for the Poisson ratio of materials, which is basically that if you push a rod at both ends, it grows in diameter in the middle, conversely, if you squeeze it in the middle, it grows longer at the ends.. so high pressure hydraulics around one can make it lengthen 23-Nov-19 04:10 PM I am imagining making a base for the upcoming magnetic chuck for the grinder, to raise (like a jack) the chuck microns, if not lower 23-Nov-19 04:10 PM the divisions of t he column (Z) travel is in 5 microns, so I would love to attempt to chase single, or even sub.. without needing to lap 23-Nov-19 04:10 PM I would name the system... The Poisson Frog 23-Nov-19 04:10 PM high pressure sensor, and some stepper/servo on a ballscrew/whatever to add more pressure into the pusher system, as well as an [expensive] displacement sensor to have some sort of feedback, more than just pressure, and could be dependant on the weight of the part loaded 23-Nov-19 04:10 PM super neat idea though.. I didn't come up with it.. I think I really only "invented" one thing 23-Nov-19 04:10 PM ever 23-Nov-19 04:46 PM hmm interesting 23-Nov-19 04:46 PM suuuper interesting 23-Nov-19 04:46 PM I'd suggest looking towards flexure design 23-Nov-19 04:46 PM in the papaer that spoke about it, they could do 100um 23-Nov-19 04:46 PM I know a bit about "flexures" as most of everyone calls them 23-Nov-19 04:46 PM I call it "compliance" 23-Nov-19 04:47 PM distributed compliance, at that 23-Nov-19 04:47 PM if you can dsitribute it 23-Nov-19 04:47 PM vs localized 23-Nov-19 04:47 PM this concept is basically flexure, at it's core 23-Nov-19 04:47 PM just, not really bending, but it is deformation 23-Nov-19 04:47 PM controlled deformation 25-Nov-19 02:25 AM Wow LinuxCNC's learning curve is just... non linear and like they really try to make documentation as scattered, outdated, and inconsistent as possible. It basically seems you either ask to learn stuff from other's who already know stuff, or you follow other's scattered tutorials made over the last 15 years... 25-Nov-19 02:25 AM Like I get it, open-source and all but man 25-Nov-19 02:25 AM Its weird too because there is SO MUCH documentation but its just... BAD 25-Nov-19 02:25 AM Either too high level or too low level with no high level context and its just like if it was written consistently and to the point it could get the complete point across in half the amount of documentation. 25-Nov-19 02:25 AM I also love how on the forums people come asking, how do get this config going??? and people are like well a default config for that exact config doesn't exist, you'll have to make your own HAL/INI files... 25-Nov-19 02:25 AM OK, fine, I'll go look at the docs, goes over high level what these files do... nothing about specificly how to write them... Well cool ok so what am I to do exactly? Look at the source? Is that the documentation? 25-Nov-19 02:25 AM Either way Just jeez this is bad. Currently trying to get Xilinx Design Suite 14.5 installed so I can generate my own bitfile for the Mesa card since seemingly this place sells hundreds of them but its a "new" card (aka only 2 years old instead of 20) so people don't have any close to related bitfiles out there. 25-Nov-19 02:38 AM do you know marco reps? 25-Nov-19 02:38 AM he does lots of stuff with Linux cnc and his mesa card 25-Nov-19 02:38 AM maybe he can help you 25-Nov-19 02:38 AM https://youtu.be/1dy8Dgzcgq4 25-Nov-19 02:47 AM I've also been recommended linuxcnc in the past, never dod use it, GRBL has been enough in the little stage movement I've done so far 25-Nov-19 02:47 AM Need to install xilinx ISE myself, got my new FPGA with Sdram a few days ago 25-Nov-19 02:48 AM I have seen his videos, he uses the xi25 series which is super used and documented very well, I am using the xi24 series, which is a LOT less so 25-Nov-19 02:48 AM I am just trying to not be that person yelling into the IRC omg help me not be dumb... I am going to spend at-least a week or so trying to work my way through online stuff first before asking too many questions 25-Nov-19 02:54 AM Sometimss asking those kinda questions is surprisingly and refreshingly fruitful 25-Nov-19 02:54 AM At least in places like #regex 25-Nov-19 02:56 AM oh god I already cut my teeth on regex 25-Nov-19 02:56 AM I can read that stuff upside down and backwards 25-Nov-19 02:56 AM thanks to $dayjob and lots of perl 25-Nov-19 02:57 AM I still learn new regex tidbits every year or so 25-Nov-19 02:57 AM Forward and reverse look ahead/behind is something that doesn't stick for me 25-Nov-19 07:45 AM Xilinx ISE RIP 25-Nov-19 07:45 AM I'm so glad they have Vivado now 25-Nov-19 10:33 AM Not for the Spartan 6 25-Nov-19 10:36 AM Ah yeah. 25-Nov-19 10:36 AM I have some older LED Driver boards with that and 32mb SDRAM and 2x GBE, almost all other GPIO is buffered so that it can run at 5V and drive the drivers. 25-Nov-19 10:36 AM But I'm currently more in the Altera land, and I'd rather be somewhat competent in that tool first. 25-Nov-19 10:36 AM As you are quite married to your tool and As we use Altera at work, It's what I'm aiming at. 29-Nov-19 12:01 PM I am starting to look into CNC swiss-type lathes.. but maybe to make vs buy, because the ones on the market are a bit too universal for my needs 29-Nov-19 12:23 PM I knew you'd eventually fall to this conclusion 29-Nov-19 12:23 PM :P 29-Nov-19 12:23 PM building one doesn't make sense, you'll end up with the same build 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM the issue is that the old autos are not exactly horologically significant.. and dont say anything for craftsmanship 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM neither does doing it manually, either with cross sldie or manual hand turning with a graver.. it just means you mess up more parts 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM and nobody really cares 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM cost is not a concern (of why build vs buy) 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM it's more of that I want to build a sequential boring line.. essentially drill presse sganged up that always drill at 0,0.. due to not having a moveable table, but that the part mounts onto a jig.. so very repeatable without any kind of wear (only on the Z) 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM no need for XY on every machine, only one to make the jigs 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM and that is sort of the mentality I was trying to approach the lathe idea.. but can't be done the same way 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM mostly, the reason that I would want to build one myself, is to showcase the how/why.. which I feel has never been discussed in a more public format (youtube videos) 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM like, I dont t hink I have ever really seen a video on metrology frames on a machining ... machine 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM and "everybody" that builds their own CNC really has no idea about them 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM but yeah, I am trying to not think of it as the dark side.. but simply there isnt anything horologically significant that needs to be preserved/demonstrated 29-Nov-19 01:20 PM also, messaged a seller in the UK about why his shipping prices to the US for some gauge blocks is so fregin expensive 29-Nov-19 02:06 PM well, fully automated swiss lathes have been used since the 1800s 29-Nov-19 02:06 PM Tornos literally still supplies parts for machines that have been made around 1890-1920 29-Nov-19 02:06 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/5078_1-85372.png 29-Nov-19 02:57 PM them and petermann were the main brands I was looking at (+bechler) if I was going with the auto-cam route... it's not the idea that it works.. but the felxibility isnt there, especially if prototyping or a relatively low number of parts 29-Nov-19 02:57 PM I somewhat stated versatility is not what I am after, but I dont want to waste time trying to grind cams 29-Nov-19 02:57 PM also parts availability is a concern 29-Nov-19 02:57 PM would be nicer to simply order for a modern machine, if need be 29-Nov-19 03:38 PM so buy a CNC swiss 29-Nov-19 03:38 PM digital cams 29-Nov-19 05:56 PM yeah, likely a citizen cincom 29-Nov-19 06:53 PM the bar loader is the biggest piece of it all, heh 29-Nov-19 07:00 PM all that I've seen use LNS feeders 29-Nov-19 08:02 PM https://youtu.be/-CRflaPPR5c this video claims this machine was used at tektronix. Makes sense with all the shafts and adaptors in old scopes 29-Nov-19 09:02 PM If price "doesn't matter", look at a modern Tornos @Noxz 29-Nov-19 09:02 PM Look at the Grimsmo Knives videos, they recently bought a modern one and it's so nifty 29-Nov-19 09:02 PM I love their channel in general, they do lots of cool machining in-depth 29-Nov-19 09:02 PM (don't love their knife prices though) 29-Nov-19 11:58 PM I've looked at a few brands, the issue is the "I dont need one right this second" so if the 'right one' comes along I wouldnt jump on it 30-Nov-19 12:57 PM did a first sealing/patching of the Y direction bellows of the grinder with FlexSeal.. would have gone with a 'standard' silicone spray but the local hardware store didnt have any on hand, so might as well put something on there to start with 30-Nov-19 03:36 PM Send a photo if it to old Phil. Maybe it will be on a commercial! 03-Dec-19 07:40 PM So I discovered something absolutely amazing 03-Dec-19 07:40 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSHxNEiHve0 03-Dec-19 07:40 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjTQ5uHKruQ 03-Dec-19 07:40 PM Turns out, linear shaft servos are SIMPLE AS HELL 03-Dec-19 07:40 PM I think I'm going to build a few once my servo drive is done. 03-Dec-19 07:40 PM I'll ping @Mason_Yu and @Noxz because this is something you could be interested too 03-Dec-19 07:47 PM I didn't realize how much force these things can put out 03-Dec-19 07:47 PM Hundreds of newtons, apparently! 03-Dec-19 07:47 PM with the really big ones 03-Dec-19 07:47 PM Ooo at lockpicking meetup, will check it out when I get home 03-Dec-19 07:49 PM I really love how elegant that dual arm actuator is 03-Dec-19 07:49 PM Two moving parts! 03-Dec-19 07:50 PM Has built-in reduction ratio like a delta style 3D printer 03-Dec-19 07:50 PM Perfect for a 3D printer design or pick&place 03-Dec-19 07:54 PM This could replace hydraulics for a compact and fast robotic arm 03-Dec-19 07:58 PM mhm 03-Dec-19 08:00 PM that's really cool, wonder what different sizes they are made in and what they cost heh 03-Dec-19 08:01 PM I've been told that they're ridiculously overpriced 03-Dec-19 08:01 PM but sizes of over 2kN in power 03-Dec-19 08:01 PM 2kN!!!! 03-Dec-19 08:01 PM as for physical size, you can get them tiny or huge 03-Dec-19 08:01 PM jeez that's impressive 03-Dec-19 08:01 PM they look pretty simple to build in theory? opensource linear servos? 03-Dec-19 08:01 PM I mean controllers aside... 03-Dec-19 08:02 PM you're thinking what I'm thinking 03-Dec-19 08:02 PM https://magnetics.de/images/Showroom/ElectricMotors/LinearShaftMotorDesign/LinearShaftMotor.pdf 03-Dec-19 08:02 PM someone in another server showed a video where they've built one 03-Dec-19 08:02 PM literally three coils over a PVC tube with magnets butted together pole to pole 03-Dec-19 08:02 PM 1N/A @ 16V 03-Dec-19 08:03 PM hollow tube to be filled with magnets end to end, then some windings that can be made onto 3D printed coil holders 03-Dec-19 08:03 PM yep! 03-Dec-19 08:03 PM I don't think they can deliver continuous 2kN holding force though, more like a quick 30 second pulse 03-Dec-19 08:03 PM probably, yeah 03-Dec-19 08:03 PM but high end pick and place machines have linear servos, the non-tubular kind, that deliver around 80N static 03-Dec-19 08:03 PM if you don't care about longevity you could even use the 3D printed tube as the sliding surface, but you could also design it to take industry standard bushings in the ends 03-Dec-19 08:03 PM most PnPs I have seen just use ballscrews 03-Dec-19 08:04 PM hence high end 03-Dec-19 08:04 PM what my thought was - using stainless tube the perfect size for regular linear bearings 03-Dec-19 08:04 PM pack the tube with magnets, put the bearings in the forcer 03-Dec-19 08:04 PM that's essentially what the LinX motors are 03-Dec-19 08:04 PM looks like the ideal design is to have two sets of 3 coils each, with the length of each set being that of one magnet 03-Dec-19 08:04 PM start with one set of coils, test the design out 03-Dec-19 08:09 PM I'm a little worried about induced currents on the metal shaft and effect of induced field on the coil 03-Dec-19 08:09 PM well then, external supports and a CF tube 03-Dec-19 08:09 PM or plastic, but I'd probably do CF for rigidity 03-Dec-19 08:10 PM CF tubes are so cheap nowadays 03-Dec-19 08:10 PM I happen to have a good source and quite a lot of them lying around... 03-Dec-19 08:10 PM ID not large enough to take neodymium magnets though. 03-Dec-19 08:10 PM you can get small magnets 03-Dec-19 08:10 PM you'd probably want big ones though 03-Dec-19 08:10 PM something around 10x30mm for good force 03-Dec-19 08:10 PM looks like the only proper way to build them is to have each coil be 1/3 the length of each magnet 03-Dec-19 08:12 PM The tubes I have are meant for pushrods on our school's FSAE race car, so the ID is like 1/4". I can get some thin walled ones that are meant for quadcoptors for this application though 03-Dec-19 08:12 PM 6mm magnets are common and cheap 03-Dec-19 08:12 PM but usually short, around 6x10 03-Dec-19 08:13 PM I wonder how they get the resolution with large magnets like that? I assume the coils aren't exactly the lengths of the magnets and instead some slightly smaller or larger size to create interference where you can use different strength induced currents in each of the coils to precisely position along the rod... 03-Dec-19 08:13 PM it's a lot simpler than that 03-Dec-19 08:13 PM linear encoders and closed loop feedback 03-Dec-19 08:13 PM but the magnet length doesn't scale linearly I think, hence the double-set design 03-Dec-19 08:13 PM where there's effectively two forcers acting in tandem on two magnets 03-Dec-19 08:13 PM shorter magnets = higher electrical and physical resolution = less force? 03-Dec-19 08:13 PM this is also one big benefit, you can have as many independent forcers on a shaft as you want 03-Dec-19 08:15 PM the doc you sent they have 6 coils and 3 coils equal the length of a magnet allowing them to use different forces on each to get to different points between magnets? 03-Dec-19 08:15 PM like I described? 03-Dec-19 08:16 PM mhm 03-Dec-19 08:16 PM I understand the whole having a feedback loop as-well would allow for more precision with an encoder and such 03-Dec-19 08:16 PM which makes sense as-well 03-Dec-19 08:16 PM the second set is just for force, I can't think of any other reason 03-Dec-19 08:16 PM since one set would do exactly the same action, just 360 electrical degrees apart 03-Dec-19 08:17 PM well its kinda like a stepper motor 03-Dec-19 08:17 PM but it's a bit counter-intuitive, these perfect dimensions, since you have three coils and three fields within a single magnet's field 03-Dec-19 08:17 PM and you have similar poles stacked 03-Dec-19 08:17 PM north to north, south to south 03-Dec-19 08:18 PM heh getting all those magnets in that tube must be a fun time 03-Dec-19 08:18 PM especially if you don't close that thing well 03-Dec-19 08:18 PM I've been told that if you don't cap it off, they tend to escape at rapid velocities 03-Dec-19 08:18 PM yea... I'd imagine 03-Dec-19 08:19 PM I'd fill that thing with epoxy 03-Dec-19 08:19 PM I suppose you can only make end caps long enough that if you were to weld them you can cool just below the weld point so you don't screw up the magnets 03-Dec-19 08:19 PM why weld? 03-Dec-19 08:19 PM So the magnets don't move 03-Dec-19 08:19 PM just screw them in :P 03-Dec-19 08:19 PM just use 3D printed plastic to hold back all those magnets, surely it'll be fine 03-Dec-19 08:20 PM oh, actually... you know, these could be used in vacuum! 03-Dec-19 08:20 PM surely you won't end up with plastic shrapnel all over the room 03-Dec-19 08:20 PM weld the stator shut, pot the coils 03-Dec-19 08:20 PM bam, instant SEM actuator 03-Dec-19 08:20 PM yes, these could have applications in vacuum, no real need for grease either with the right materials 03-Dec-19 08:20 PM no passthroughs and such 03-Dec-19 08:20 PM some of those fancy igus plastics 03-Dec-19 08:21 PM speaking of actuators and SEMs I really need to rebuild my SEM stage :( 03-Dec-19 08:21 PM its in really bad shape 03-Dec-19 08:21 PM Mine is not much better... 03-Dec-19 08:21 PM some of the axis are seized almost completely and others have so much backlash 03-Dec-19 10:52 PM So you really cant use large magnetic fields in the stage of a SEM... Because you know the electron beam. 03-Dec-19 11:17 PM if you can deal with the vibrations while actively moving, and the ring-down, you could use piezos in contact with linear rod ends to excite the proper modes and induce surface waves in one direction or the other 03-Dec-19 11:17 PM no ferrostuff that way and can achieve very small movement and keep cheap and scalable 03-Dec-19 11:22 PM that's closer to fiction than reality 03-Dec-19 11:22 PM eh, I could link you like 5 papers easy 03-Dec-19 11:23 PM and zero real world implementations 03-Dec-19 11:23 PM closest that exists is less-than-zero tolerance piezo motors with fingers 03-Dec-19 11:23 PM don't think that's true as it's basically just stick-slip with the roles reversed 03-Dec-19 11:23 PM the linear motors would probably need a sin/cos feedback sensor setup regardless 03-Dec-19 11:24 PM https://www.researchgate.net/publication/231070052_Piezoelectric_Ultrasonic_Motors_Overview 03-Dec-19 11:24 PM this highlights several arrangements of doing exactly what I said 03-Dec-19 11:24 PM yeah, these are regular piezo motors 03-Dec-19 11:24 PM they have nothing to do with linear servos 03-Dec-19 11:24 PM sigh, read 03-Dec-19 11:24 PM https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Kenji_Uchino/publication/318034017/figure/fig30/AS:613924869263398@1523382503702/Linear-motor-using-a-beam-bending-vibration.png 03-Dec-19 11:24 PM for example.... 03-Dec-19 11:24 PM I've never seen this used 03-Dec-19 11:25 PM not going to argue with you about how practical it is (it is), I was just adding to the discussion something that may help another person trying to achieve a goal 03-Dec-19 11:25 PM I've seen piezo motors, both rotary and linear, they're used pretty widely 03-Dec-19 11:25 PM have you seen piezo walkers? 03-Dec-19 11:25 PM they've turned those into mini linear actuators 03-Dec-19 11:25 PM they literally lift their legs up and move them on in front of another doing a shuffle 03-Dec-19 11:26 PM https://piezomotor.com/produkt/ll06/ 03-Dec-19 11:26 PM yours for the low low price of 800-something euro for this one 03-Dec-19 11:26 PM as for inducing surface waves from another wave type, that is also widely done 03-Dec-19 11:26 PM they use the walkers but in a sandwich configuration 03-Dec-19 11:26 PM one on the top, one on the bottom 03-Dec-19 11:27 PM from the earth during quakes, to surface plasmons on optic fibers induced by brouillion scattering from the photon, to vibrations through the atomic lattice 03-Dec-19 11:27 PM very cool, but mind-numbingly expensive and not many practical applications 03-Dec-19 11:27 PM very practical when you need nanometer or sub-nanometer resolution 03-Dec-19 11:27 PM yep 03-Dec-19 11:27 PM when you need nanometer resolution you generally don't care about the price 03-Dec-19 11:28 PM they aren't terribly expensive, especially second hand 03-Dec-19 11:28 PM a few thousand for a good actuator with a nice range 03-Dec-19 11:28 PM you're just making stuff up, lol 03-Dec-19 11:28 PM I literally have stacks of piezo actuators I bought for $15-150 each on ebay 03-Dec-19 11:29 PM what motion range? 03-Dec-19 11:29 PM for the walkers? infinite 03-Dec-19 11:30 PM for the ones you bought for $15-150 03-Dec-19 11:30 PM the walkers are in that group 03-Dec-19 11:30 PM well, from what I've seen, they're either very expensive or short range/low actuation force/open loop 03-Dec-19 11:30 PM walkers, SAW interdigitated electrodes, inch-worm/stick-slip, piezo stacks in flexure amplifiers 03-Dec-19 11:31 PM I wonder if they're vacuum compatible 03-Dec-19 11:32 PM so long as you don't get them hot enough at low enough pressure... 03-Dec-19 11:32 PM there are high speed gas valves made from stainless piezo buzzers specifically for gas flow modulation in molecular beam epitaxy 03-Dec-19 11:34 PM there are high speed valves for piezo jetting too! 03-Dec-19 11:34 PM I've been pining over a Nordson EFD pico jetting system for a while 03-Dec-19 11:34 PM indeed 03-Dec-19 11:34 PM those are just cool 03-Dec-19 11:34 PM you can get very far with just a piezo buzzer and proper waveform 03-Dec-19 11:34 PM I doubt I could get as far as "jetting microliters of heavy solder paste 30mm away into perfect droplets" 03-Dec-19 11:34 PM not with my equipment anyway 03-Dec-19 11:34 PM that's mostly what I'd use it for, probably 03-Dec-19 11:36 PM IMO you're better off using the piezo to generate a standing wave at the tip of your needle and inducing droplet formation that way, then modulate your flow rate separately 03-Dec-19 11:36 PM heavy solder paste is not going to jet unless you've got a bigass orifice 03-Dec-19 11:36 PM "acoustophoretic printing" 03-Dec-19 11:36 PM use high pressure to push your ink of high viscosity to the tip of the needle then use your piezo to pinch it off 03-Dec-19 11:37 PM there's this kind https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gj5kmURJUjU 03-Dec-19 11:37 PM this is slower 03-Dec-19 11:37 PM and then there's this kind 03-Dec-19 11:37 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3QOJt43OKE 03-Dec-19 11:38 PM that sounds like it's using pneumatics 03-Dec-19 11:38 PM both are piezo, the first uses backpressure 03-Dec-19 11:38 PM I believe the second does too 03-Dec-19 11:38 PM just moving the bulk fluid quickly, creating a jet is fundamentally different but who uses the term correctly these days anyway 03-Dec-19 11:38 PM they use piezo valves with backpressure 03-Dec-19 11:39 PM I don't imagine there's any backpressure coming from the hose going into the end of that syringe 03-Dec-19 11:39 PM pretty sure that would just be pressure making it extrude hehe 03-Dec-19 11:39 PM it wouldn't flow otherwise 03-Dec-19 11:39 PM it's the valve that makes the nice droplets, but it needs pretty high pressure to force stuff through it 03-Dec-19 11:39 PM at least that's what I think it is 03-Dec-19 11:40 PM agreed, though IMO a better solution is acoustophoresis 03-Dec-19 11:40 PM that way you can also guide the droplet straight down, or upside down, whatever 03-Dec-19 11:41 PM would it work with these non-uniform liquids and very high viscosity? 03-Dec-19 11:41 PM you can flip the jetting system in any direction, one of their applications puts it on a multi-axis system 03-Dec-19 11:41 PM it shoots liquid 03-Dec-19 11:41 PM I don't imagine the nordson stuff could put that droplet a few MM above its opening in an upside down configuration 03-Dec-19 11:42 PM not to worry, I'll just replace the syringe with a steel one and bolt it to a high pressure air bottle :D 03-Dec-19 11:42 PM jetting from a meter away 03-Dec-19 11:42 PM I've done nearly that distance with my DIY piezo disc 03-Dec-19 11:43 PM I've had a droplet generator project on my todo list for a while, though it's not for machining or surface treatment, it's for high speed video 03-Dec-19 11:43 PM the real indicator of "jetting" though, is whether you can make a droplet smaller in diameter than the orifice it came from 03-Dec-19 11:44 PM that could be possible if you push it to the extremes, maybe 03-Dec-19 11:44 PM it's routinely done in every real "inkjet" 03-Dec-19 11:44 PM I mean with the high viscosity stuff 03-Dec-19 11:44 PM ultra short needle path right next to the valve, with a bit of residue left after the last ejection 03-Dec-19 11:44 PM sort of like a real inkjet 03-Dec-19 11:45 PM you could do it with enough energy, it's all about the dwell time between pulses making subsequent pulses constructively interfere 03-Dec-19 11:46 PM I'd just use it to be lazy and dispense paste for my projects 04-Dec-19 10:34 AM man I really want one of those first ones for dispensing solder paste... 04-Dec-19 10:34 AM would love to throw that on the PnP and just have that do the solder too 04-Dec-19 10:34 AM that would be perfect for everything I am doing 04-Dec-19 10:58 AM I know a guy that consults for scienion, I'll ask him about thick viscous dispensing 04-Dec-19 10:58 AM "sometimes. It works well for mixing things in polymers." 04-Dec-19 11:29 AM The problem with solder paste is its not just thick and viscous, it also has lots itty solder balls which is just... different than say a thick flux or something... 04-Dec-19 11:29 AM not sure of the complications with that, obviously the valve design would have to be special to prevent from getting jammed 04-Dec-19 11:35 AM somehow "peristaltic pump" comes to mind when i hear that 04-Dec-19 11:46 AM well remember the paste comes in tubes you can supply air to the rear of that for back pressure, you just need a valve to control letting the flow happen or not I guess 04-Dec-19 11:46 AM so you pressure regulate the back pressure so you know exactly how much will be dispensed in X amount of time, then you have a quick acting valve to open/close in that time 04-Dec-19 11:46 AM or you can valve the pressure itself but that can end up with control problems with how much gets dispensed 04-Dec-19 12:22 PM The paste acts like a liquid for all intents and purposes 04-Dec-19 12:22 PM No jamming will happen 04-Dec-19 12:22 PM Also you can get either the first or the second, they both work for paste! 04-Dec-19 07:46 PM I need that paste setter for moleten shellac 04-Dec-19 07:46 PM looking into the linear drives now.. got caught up in other stuff 04-Dec-19 07:46 PM also, I have like 8 or so AGLS25 piezo stages, plus the... 6??? channel driver 04-Dec-19 07:46 PM the piezo driven solder paste is interesting.. basically just a big print head in hte end 05-Dec-19 09:53 AM https://i.gyazo.com/85ba333245dfb9f149496cc024ee75b2.png 05-Dec-19 09:53 AM this turned out pretty well for how little effort i put in heh 05-Dec-19 09:53 AM Still need to drill the bolt holes for mounting it 05-Dec-19 10:24 AM looks nice! 05-Dec-19 11:43 AM Is it for a turbo? 05-Dec-19 11:47 AM No, just to hook up a gauge and close off a port on my diffusion pump system that i am not using 05-Dec-19 11:47 AM Well not using for the original purpose 05-Dec-19 11:47 AM nice 06-Dec-19 02:10 PM @Mason_Yu someone just tried to sell me a used 20W raycus for $3500 06-Dec-19 02:10 PM I think I can buy a brand new IPG laser for that much 06-Dec-19 02:10 PM On that note... are you really sure they're selling 20W raycus lasers for $700? 06-Dec-19 02:10 PM The prices really don't add up 06-Dec-19 02:13 PM I'd be surprised if an IPG is that cheap brand new 06-Dec-19 02:14 PM the lowest end 20W could be around that much 06-Dec-19 02:14 PM I suppose fiber laser prices have been falling for years, maybe I need to take another look 06-Dec-19 02:14 PM but the cheapest raycus I can find on aliexpress/alibaba is $1600-1700ish 06-Dec-19 02:14 PM so I'm a bit skeptical about what Mason said about that HK supplier selling them for $700 each 06-Dec-19 02:14 PM half the ali price? 06-Dec-19 02:15 PM I've seen them for like $1100 06-Dec-19 02:16 PM some of the major patents for all-fiber designs are expiring these days, so you'll be seeing prices drop way down 06-Dec-19 02:16 PM I'd say even the high end price is pretty dang cheap for what you can do with it 06-Dec-19 02:16 PM Chinese manufacturers don't really care about patents ever 06-Dec-19 02:17 PM I'm waiting for the chinese to make a dirt cheap ultrafast laser 06-Dec-19 02:17 PM I disagree with regard to the generalization, but yes you're likely to find them not abiding 06-Dec-19 02:17 PM You shouldn't really be shopping based on wattage btw, unless you're just after removal rate period 06-Dec-19 02:19 PM sure, but 20w is a nice average 06-Dec-19 02:19 PM I'd take a milliwatt average power 300fs pulse over a 20w avg 500ms pulse 06-Dec-19 02:19 PM the ideal laser for my application is femtosecond, but that's never going to happen 06-Dec-19 02:20 PM I disagree, that's one of my active development areas 06-Dec-19 02:20 PM @Deleted User what is the application? 06-Dec-19 02:20 PM a super secret possibly commercial application 06-Dec-19 02:20 PM micromachining 06-Dec-19 02:21 PM I have a spectra physics hippo-17 that is fairly decent at micromachining. 06-Dec-19 02:21 PM But I don't have one and you won't sell it to me for a reasonable price 06-Dec-19 02:21 PM the hippo is pretty average in terms of specs though 06-Dec-19 02:21 PM aside from the fact that it weighs three times as much 06-Dec-19 02:22 PM compared to a fiber laser? 06-Dec-19 02:22 PM pulse length is much shorter 06-Dec-19 02:22 PM yes 06-Dec-19 02:23 PM and if you're resourceful enough, you can get harmonic generators for it to generated 532nm, 355nm or 266nm 06-Dec-19 02:23 PM The spectra physics is definitely shorter 06-Dec-19 02:23 PM Spirit are you looking specifically for two-photon absorption or just want the material versatility? 06-Dec-19 02:24 PM Material versatility and ablation with as small of a heat affected zone as possible 06-Dec-19 02:24 PM the latter can be omitted for the prototype 06-Dec-19 02:24 PM fiber laser pulse length will be like machining with a bone saw at the micro scale 06-Dec-19 02:24 PM since I can sell the idea to some manufacturer and let them deal with that pain 06-Dec-19 02:24 PM just not very quickly 06-Dec-19 02:25 PM fiber lasers have a huge range of pulse lengths 06-Dec-19 02:25 PM no, you can do pretty good micromachining with a fiber laser @piGuy 06-Dec-19 02:25 PM yeah 06-Dec-19 02:25 PM discord is laggy 06-Dec-19 02:25 PM well if we're talking cheap chinese fiber lasers, we're probably talking like 100-200ns 06-Dec-19 02:25 PM 80 to 200 is the usual range 06-Dec-19 02:26 PM I suppose it comes down to material removal rate for you spirit 06-Dec-19 02:26 PM and the material 06-Dec-19 02:26 PM material doesn't matter if going with the femtosecond two-photon absorption angle 06-Dec-19 02:27 PM femtosecond would be awesome but unobtainable 06-Dec-19 02:27 PM gimme like 6 months and I'll have one on offer for relatively reasonable specifically for micro-machining 06-Dec-19 02:28 PM reasonable as in "$4000 and it fell off the back of a truck" or "$599 and it's yours"? 06-Dec-19 02:28 PM :P 06-Dec-19 02:28 PM laserresale.com has some SPI MOPA fiber lasers for $3500 new, but the M2 is like 2 06-Dec-19 02:28 PM still ridiculously unobtainable for me 06-Dec-19 02:28 PM I'm hoping less than $2,000 06-Dec-19 02:29 PM yup :( 06-Dec-19 02:29 PM if it was everything I was going to invest into, I could probably sell some things and get $2000, but it's not something I can afford otherwise 06-Dec-19 02:29 PM even if I can see a big ROI, it's not investor money 06-Dec-19 02:29 PM it won't be suitable for photopolymerization as it'll be 1.5um fundamental but it will work for micromachining 06-Dec-19 02:30 PM as long as I can point it at an object and have that object slowly turn into dust 06-Dec-19 02:30 PM with some collimation 06-Dec-19 02:30 PM Call up a laser manufacturer, tell them you're looking to buy a laser, visit their applications lab and have them do the work for you for free. 06-Dec-19 02:30 PM I've done it. 06-Dec-19 02:30 PM I want to build a quite complicated system, so no going to a showroom 06-Dec-19 02:30 PM removal rate will be comparatively slow.. still milliwatt average power 06-Dec-19 02:31 PM That might not be enough for me 06-Dec-19 02:31 PM even 10-20W is slow for my application 06-Dec-19 02:31 PM again, average power isn't that great of a metric 06-Dec-19 02:31 PM at mW ranges I'll be spending weeks machining things 06-Dec-19 02:31 PM what size features do you need? 06-Dec-19 02:31 PM you can only put so much into the actual pulses, physics still apply 06-Dec-19 02:31 PM I don't know about feature sizes yet, it's a concept in my head at best 06-Dec-19 02:32 PM You can put gigawatts into a fs pulse 06-Dec-19 02:32 PM but I'm thinking sub-mm scale 06-Dec-19 02:32 PM sure, gigawatts but at what repetition rate? 06-Dec-19 02:32 PM you're still removing nanoliters of volume per pulse 06-Dec-19 02:32 PM 10's of mhz 06-Dec-19 02:32 PM it depends on what you're trying to do.. if you want to mill pockets, sure.. you'll need high average power 06-Dec-19 02:32 PM that's one of the applications 06-Dec-19 02:32 PM it's not surface treatment or nanoscale 06-Dec-19 02:33 PM but if you want to cut something in two, you don't have to remove lots of material 06-Dec-19 02:33 PM What about traditional micromachining? 06-Dec-19 02:33 PM for that you need traditional investments of many millions for R&D :P 06-Dec-19 02:33 PM I would also look in to a DIY EDM setup 06-Dec-19 02:33 PM not something I want to do 06-Dec-19 02:33 PM I have a friend with EDM if I need one-off parts 06-Dec-19 02:34 PM as for the gigawatt pulses, again bad metrics IMO 06-Dec-19 02:34 PM I bet you could throw together a cheap micromachining system with like a used NSK air spindle and a precision stage 06-Dec-19 02:34 PM wattage is energy over time, useless measurement for laser machining 06-Dec-19 02:34 PM what you want to know is pulse energy and rep rate 06-Dec-19 02:34 PM well, pulse, rep, and spot size 06-Dec-19 02:35 PM I disagree, the REAL metric is energy flux! 06-Dec-19 02:35 PM J/cm^2 06-Dec-19 02:35 PM Oh yeah you said spot size 06-Dec-19 02:35 PM which is derived from pulse and spot 06-Dec-19 02:35 PM hehe, yea I should have included it in the first statement 06-Dec-19 02:35 PM j/cm^2 still doesn't tell you what material you can do though 06-Dec-19 02:35 PM well I take that back, if we're measuring per pulse then yes 06-Dec-19 02:37 PM @piGuy "cheap" means "harmonic drives, chilled granite base(regardless of how small), $1200-2500 NSK spindle" in this case 06-Dec-19 02:37 PM you forgot wavelength too. @Deleted User can't afford ultrafast so wavelength is important 06-Dec-19 02:37 PM again, traditional micromachining is doable IF you have the money 06-Dec-19 02:37 PM I do not 06-Dec-19 02:37 PM wavelength will translate into ev and joules 06-Dec-19 02:38 PM a good DIY 5-axis micromill is maybe $5-10k 06-Dec-19 02:38 PM yea if you're dealing with single photon then you'll need to factor in material absorption for whatever spectrum 06-Dec-19 02:38 PM only :) 06-Dec-19 02:38 PM hey, it's "only" that if you "only" need a few cm^3 of machining volume 06-Dec-19 02:38 PM But it's a small price to pay for your billion dollar idea! 06-Dec-19 02:38 PM my billion dollar idea is no billion dollar idea if it's a conventional mill! 06-Dec-19 02:38 PM :P 06-Dec-19 02:38 PM but yeah, I need a mix of power and pulse length 06-Dec-19 02:38 PM the cheapest available is either getting lucky on ebay(none so far) or finding an affordable pulsed fiber laser 06-Dec-19 02:39 PM I still think your best bet is EDM unless you have compound curves/angles 06-Dec-19 02:39 PM I don't want to reinvent an EDM system 06-Dec-19 02:39 PM they exist and they're useful in their own right 06-Dec-19 02:39 PM I want to experiment with a possibly stupid, but possibly brilliant idea that I have 06-Dec-19 02:40 PM Do you have a local university with the fabrication tools? Sometimes you can pay an industry rate to use them... 06-Dec-19 02:40 PM lol no 06-Dec-19 02:40 PM so you want to invent your method of micromachining to make your product?? 06-Dec-19 02:40 PM I have no product to make 06-Dec-19 02:40 PM I want to tinker with the actual manufacturing methods 06-Dec-19 02:40 PM your .. idea 06-Dec-19 02:40 PM gotcha 06-Dec-19 02:40 PM I was under the impression that there was some object that you wanted to make in quantity or similar 06-Dec-19 02:41 PM I can think of a few products to make with the idea, sure, but that's assuming the idea works, and I don't know that yet 06-Dec-19 02:42 PM can you divulge more details? material? 06-Dec-19 02:42 PM metals, probably 06-Dec-19 02:42 PM small volumes, material removal 06-Dec-19 02:42 PM found an interesting laser 06-Dec-19 02:42 PM https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32794482226.html 06-Dec-19 02:42 PM 3W, 5 nanosecond pulses! 06-Dec-19 02:42 PM wonder how they accomplish that 06-Dec-19 02:42 PM looks like there's an active-ish head? 06-Dec-19 02:42 PM they even have green lasers 06-Dec-19 02:46 PM how about lithography with chemical etching? 06-Dec-19 02:46 PM I want to play with lasers 06-Dec-19 02:47 PM I've seen some papers that suggest MRR can be higher with longer pulses. Longer pulse melts the material and it gets pushed out while boiling. Takes less energy than vaporizing everything. 06-Dec-19 02:49 PM boiling things is generally not a good idea 06-Dec-19 02:49 PM the heat affected zone becomes pretty big 06-Dec-19 02:50 PM If you just need sub-mm features, it would be acceptable 06-Dec-19 02:50 PM How do you plan on positioning the laser spot? That might be more expensive than the laser itself 06-Dec-19 02:50 PM well, either way, I haven't found any lasers I can afford yet 06-Dec-19 02:50 PM positioning is a bit easier, more used options 06-Dec-19 02:51 PM galvo scanhead? 06-Dec-19 02:51 PM yes, narrow scanhead with a narrow f-theta lens 06-Dec-19 02:52 PM how critical is dimensional accuracy? I had a scanlab scancube but no means to calibrate it to correct distortion 06-Dec-19 02:52 PM calibration is done afterwards 06-Dec-19 02:52 PM and I think I have a clever idea on how to make it cheap 06-Dec-19 02:53 PM Need more details before I can steal your idea 06-Dec-19 02:54 PM very expensive idea!!! 06-Dec-19 02:54 PM I will trade it for one(1) scancube 06-Dec-19 02:54 PM it's just marking a reference grid, measuring it(hint-hint, scanner!), and doing some math in post to calculate a correction 2D LUT 06-Dec-19 02:54 PM that way you calibrate out both the scanhead's error and the lens inaccuracies 06-Dec-19 02:55 PM yeah, I tried doing that with the software I was using (beamconstruct), but program kept crashing 06-Dec-19 02:56 PM I'd probably be writing my own software for the system I'll eventually build 06-Dec-19 04:53 PM well that's interesting 06-Dec-19 04:53 PM @Mason_Yu I think I found your laser supplier :P 06-Dec-19 04:53 PM https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33002903485.html 06-Dec-19 04:53 PM it's the same picture as you sent 06-Dec-19 04:53 PM except $220 more expensive 07-Dec-19 12:34 AM @Deleted User were there links in here for the pulsed lasers you referred to for micromachining something like my 150 micron nickel sheet? 07-Dec-19 12:34 AM see right above 07-Dec-19 12:34 AM focus that, put that on an X/Y table(you don't really need galvos), and just do a couple squares 07-Dec-19 02:19 AM Oh, I didn't realize they are on Aliexpress as well. But yeah it looks like that's the same company. A 35% markup is quite typical for export sales on Aliexpress 07-Dec-19 10:21 AM BCXLaser it is! 07-Dec-19 10:21 AM They replied $950 for raycus, $850 for maxlaser, "super" for $750 07-Dec-19 10:21 AM Check if your supplier has maxlaser or "super" units? @Mason_Yu 07-Dec-19 10:21 AM Seems like you could get them for $600 instead of $700, for the same 20W 07-Dec-19 10:43 AM We've already paid the EDM shop for the current job we need cut, but if these sort of jobs happen more frequently it could be useful to get one of those. Do you need special high strength optics to deal with the high energy of the pulses? 07-Dec-19 10:47 AM Just good ones, they're cheap though 07-Dec-19 12:28 PM Does anyone in here have a system with one of those lasers already? A friend has a part he had machined with cutting tools and wants the tooling marks cleaned up, or if cheap enough, totally machined with a laser (or better than cutting tools technique). 07-Dec-19 12:39 PM I'll grab one for a donation ;) 07-Dec-19 12:39 PM it should be possible to machine entirely with a laser 07-Dec-19 12:45 PM the lasers I am looking at are for interferrometry measurements 07-Dec-19 12:45 PM you can do interferometry using a temperature stabilized hene 07-Dec-19 12:46 PM but, that's another level that I haven't really looked into much, only breifly 07-Dec-19 12:46 PM I've been looking more so at some "glass" scales, on Zerodur 07-Dec-19 12:46 PM https://www.heidenhain.de/de_EN/products/linear-encoders/exposed-linear-encoders/selection-guide-for-lip/lip-382/ 07-Dec-19 12:47 PM more than enough for machining really 07-Dec-19 12:47 PM that's all relative 07-Dec-19 12:48 PM more than enough for anything you can do at a reasonable price 07-Dec-19 12:50 PM yeah.. actually, let me get a graphic that relates to that statement.. 07-Dec-19 12:50 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/cost_v_performance-312FA.jpg 07-Dec-19 12:50 PM basically, you can refine existing tech to be pretty optimal, but past a point it becomes very cost restrictive to keep working with it, and although some new tech may have an initial higher cost, it will eventually outperform for less money 07-Dec-19 12:50 PM yeah.. actually, let me get a graphic that relates to that statement.. 07-Dec-19 12:50 PM not sure why that last thing didnt go through 07-Dec-19 01:03 PM discord has been having issues today 07-Dec-19 01:03 PM noted 07-Dec-19 02:48 PM @Deleted User I'll contact them tomorrow evening and get more prices. I found they sell quite high power CW fiber lasers as well and I'm looking at a 100W unit for SLM 07-Dec-19 02:48 PM That 100W laser is apparently only $1000 07-Dec-19 02:50 PM You can buy 100W nLight lasers on eBay for less 07-Dec-19 02:50 PM But I'm really interested in whether they sell even cheaper 20W pulsed lasers that aren't raycus 07-Dec-19 02:50 PM SLM... selective laser melting? 07-Dec-19 02:52 PM Yes 07-Dec-19 02:52 PM you'll definitely want one of the eBay ones with the shorter wavelength 07-Dec-19 02:52 PM nLight Pearl is your search term 07-Dec-19 02:52 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/nLIGHT-Pearl-P4-110-0886-5-2-A-R02-Mfg-2017-2013-Fiber-coupled-Laser-Tested-120W/254421382143 07-Dec-19 02:52 PM such as this 07-Dec-19 02:52 PM P4-110um fiber-886.5nm 07-Dec-19 02:52 PM IIRC that's what the part number means 07-Dec-19 02:52 PM though for SLM you generally don't need a very powerful laser, only if you're doing metal sintering 07-Dec-19 02:55 PM Man, internet on the train sucks. Will look when I get home 07-Dec-19 02:55 PM you heat up the whole vat to just below the melting/fusion temperature, then the laser kicks it over 07-Dec-19 02:55 PM just a note on eBay lasers: make sure the laser you're buying either has the power supply pins shorted, or is a guaranteed refundable item 07-Dec-19 02:55 PM it's VERY easy to kill laser diode arrays even with a bit of carpet running 08-Dec-19 12:45 AM https://www.anycubic.com/collections/3d-printers/products/anycubic-photon-3d-printer?variant=29545804529724 08-Dec-19 12:45 AM Pretty tempting 08-Dec-19 09:41 AM I've heard good things about that printer, though I've also heard that LCDs don't last very long when exposed to UV light in SLA applications 08-Dec-19 09:41 AM Heck that printer is about the same price as a lier of resin for my formlabs printer 08-Dec-19 09:50 AM regarding printers.. link to the hackable inkjet we were talking about? 08-Dec-19 09:56 AM https://reprap.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_Xaar_128 08-Dec-19 09:56 AM The operations guide linked at the bottom is the critical document since Xaar won't give it to you. 08-Dec-19 09:56 AM Probably should move that to #resources or something 08-Dec-19 11:10 AM I had no idea about that channel, lol 08-Dec-19 12:56 PM I've looked into that xaar print head before 08-Dec-19 12:56 PM https://www.allprintheads.com/products/xaar-xj128-40w 08-Dec-19 12:57 PM The only downside is that you can literally not find them used 08-Dec-19 12:57 PM They're either brand new and ready to be used, or directly discarded 08-Dec-19 12:57 PM I've only seen ONE used xaar 128 printhead on eBay in like 6 years 08-Dec-19 12:57 PM there's a few right now that are brand new for $200-250 08-Dec-19 12:57 PM pretty easy to drive though, you just need some piezo voltages and that's it 08-Dec-19 12:59 PM I moved past because they were too slow and too few print nozzles 08-Dec-19 12:59 PM the head itself is two 64-bit shift registers stacked together 08-Dec-19 12:59 PM Onto the Kyocera's 08-Dec-19 12:59 PM have you been able to get one and get it to work? 08-Dec-19 01:00 PM Nah I was helping others ideate, didn't particularly want to go the printer route for the project 08-Dec-19 01:00 PM I know some polyjet and binderjet printers use high end kyocera heads 08-Dec-19 01:00 PM The kind that have a few thousand nozzles and are a good 10cm wide 08-Dec-19 01:00 PM polyjet is pretty much the ideal hobbyist 3D printer technology 08-Dec-19 01:00 PM you get all the benefits of SLA and FDM with none of the mess 08-Dec-19 01:03 PM My research was regarding some picoliter dosed chemical reactions 08-Dec-19 01:03 PM Massive amounts of parallel reactions across a matrix 08-Dec-19 01:04 PM you could use them for that, but most print heads are quite sensitive to the actual compound 08-Dec-19 01:04 PM a lot of compounds are very aggressive to them 08-Dec-19 01:05 PM Yeah it was all water based stuff, proteins and salts mostly i recall 08-Dec-19 01:08 PM @Deleted User I understood from piGuy that the piezo driving circuitry is built into the head, thus making it super simple to 'drive'.. just binary/whatever commands to get it to print, that it has everything else it needs onboard 08-Dec-19 01:08 PM yeah, pretty much all modern piezo heads are like that 08-Dec-19 01:08 PM ah 08-Dec-19 01:08 PM but the interfaces for high end heads are often VERY complex 08-Dec-19 01:08 PM think high speed LVDS at some hundreds of MHz with dozens of clocking modes 08-Dec-19 01:08 PM the xaar 128 is just a shift register 08-Dec-19 01:15 PM I need some ideas for how to build the crucibles and introduction piping for the molecular vapor deposition system I'm building. So far I've only got two chemicals to introduce, fdts and water vapor. Thinking a single pipe into the vacuum chamber with a Y splitter, a valve on each side of the Y, then pipe going to the crucible (each side has one). Polyimide film heater maybe, taped to the outside of a copper pipe with a kf flange brazed on to load fresh reagent. Then I can heat each end to a given temperature using PID controller, actuate the vacuum/gas valves as needed to prevent cross contamination. 08-Dec-19 02:32 PM downside with that xaar is you're pretty much limited to solvent ink of low viscosity 08-Dec-19 02:32 PM upside as you already know is the massively parallel orifice 08-Dec-19 02:32 PM and yea, as Noxz mentions you can't drive it with a bespoke waveform or anything 08-Dec-19 02:49 PM @nmz787 btw when I was looking at mbe ideas I liked the idea of laser evap instead of a crucible and wound up coming across this paper https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/0953-4075/49/3/035301 "Simple and compact nozzle design for laser vaporization sources" 08-Dec-19 02:50 PM Sadly even with how xaar's documents were leaked, the others haven't even had their briefs leaked 08-Dec-19 02:50 PM The print head industry is weirdly closed 08-Dec-19 02:50 PM And the prices are unobtainable unless you sign an NDA 08-Dec-19 02:54 PM yea it's pretty niche and winds up intrinsically self-contained just due to the highly specialized characteristics of each printhead 08-Dec-19 02:54 PM even regular high viscosity print heads are just unobtainium 08-Dec-19 02:54 PM you wind up needing the printhead mfg to then design your ink because it can't print the stuff you wanted to 08-Dec-19 02:54 PM yea it's a messy world there 08-Dec-19 02:54 PM IMHO the only real flexible option is single nozzle sort of stuff 08-Dec-19 02:54 PM plus acoustophoresis at the nozzle tip hehe 08-Dec-19 02:54 PM even the single-nozzle world is pretty ridiculous as the only self-contained solution needs to include a droplet imaging setup and a competent operator to tune the pulses to avoid satellite drops and whatnot 08-Dec-19 02:54 PM with the acousto stuff though you at least get to skip the waveform fidgeting and separate the droplet initiation from droplet volume 08-Dec-19 02:54 PM but you still need imaging for trajectory and dropsize consistency verfication 08-Dec-19 02:58 PM https://www.xaar.com/en/news/2019/xaar-announces-ultra-high-viscosity-jetting-capability-at-inprint-2019/ 08-Dec-19 02:58 PM oh look 08-Dec-19 02:58 PM and it's not even that expensive to get into that range 08-Dec-19 02:58 PM https://www.sigmaaldrich.com/catalog/product/aldrich/900149?lang=en®ion=BY 08-Dec-19 02:58 PM only 600 eur per kilo from sigma 08-Dec-19 02:58 PM if it's "cheap" from sigma, there should be much more affordable options 08-Dec-19 03:00 PM yea 100cp is nowhere near high viscosity 08-Dec-19 03:00 PM that's barely any change from 10 08-Dec-19 03:01 PM well, you're not going to jet SLA resins 08-Dec-19 03:01 PM that's closer to what the nordson systems do, dispensing honey 08-Dec-19 03:01 PM honey is in the 10,000cp range 08-Dec-19 03:01 PM SLA resins are 3-10k 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM and acoustophoresis can handle that as well 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM buuuuuuut... single spot picoliters? 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM yes 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM that'll take days to print a calibration cube 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM if not weeks 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM the volume and drop formation are totally separate processes 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM one alternative that can be looked into is the UV curing glues 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM you pump out your volume, then crank up the ultrasound increasing the pinch at the top of the droplet 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM until it separates 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM and essentially build an FDM liquid printer 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM which is boring and not very useful 08-Dec-19 03:02 PM the whole advantage of polyjet is that you print a whole layer in seconds 08-Dec-19 03:03 PM I think it would be neat to have a very high resolution phased array where you can reliably transport the drop in 3d hehe 08-Dec-19 03:03 PM yea that is where those highly parallel orifice printheads totally dominate, for sure 08-Dec-19 03:03 PM and if that's what the goal is, then problem solved. but I think we're talking about what happens once you deviate even a little bit from the prescribed setup of those printheads 08-Dec-19 03:07 PM the lowest viscosity resin I can find cheap is around 500 cps 08-Dec-19 03:07 PM there's UV curing glue though... 08-Dec-19 03:07 PM that's near 10 cps 08-Dec-19 03:07 PM I wonder why UV glue is so cheap while UV resins are so expensive 08-Dec-19 03:07 PM you can buy a 4 kilo drum of UV glue for like $200 08-Dec-19 03:09 PM not sure, good question though 08-Dec-19 03:09 PM a xaar can totally jet UV glue 08-Dec-19 03:09 PM and it seems like the fluids are quite low UV sensitivity, which means they won't cure on the nozzles and you need some powerful UV LEDs to cure it 08-Dec-19 03:11 PM you can get good mileage out of warming your resin also btw 08-Dec-19 03:11 PM even at room temperature these are under 10 cps 08-Dec-19 03:12 PM resin, ink, whatever 08-Dec-19 03:12 PM 100ml of the cheap generic stuff is only $10-15 08-Dec-19 03:12 PM ... but if you buy them in 50ml bottles, it's $6 08-Dec-19 03:12 PM lol 08-Dec-19 03:13 PM you can usually also add in a surfactant to help, like Triton X-100 08-Dec-19 03:14 PM if only the xaar 128 heads didn't cost $300 a piece 08-Dec-19 03:15 PM not that bad for what they can do when they're operating in their designed environment 08-Dec-19 03:15 PM which is in printers with 6 of them :P 08-Dec-19 03:15 PM or just 1, plenty of throughput compared to any other method of producing green structures 08-Dec-19 03:16 PM well yeah, they're just used in color setups in actual boring printers 08-Dec-19 03:16 PM ah yea, those people are weird 08-Dec-19 03:16 PM who wants to jet a pattern on the back of a laptop lid from 2 inches when you could be printing piezoelectric structures and sintering them in a muffle furnace 08-Dec-19 03:17 PM I wonder if epson print heads are hackable at all 08-Dec-19 03:17 PM they're true piezo and pretty cheap 08-Dec-19 03:17 PM the hp.. 85 or something 08-Dec-19 03:17 PM lemme find it, it's well documented 08-Dec-19 03:18 PM pretty sure those are resistive 08-Dec-19 03:18 PM nope not this one 08-Dec-19 03:18 PM it's truly piezo, no instant vapor from resistive heater sort of thing 08-Dec-19 03:18 PM it's the HP45 https://ytec3d.com/hp45-inkjet-printhead/ 08-Dec-19 03:19 PM it's the ultra low viscosity one though 08-Dec-19 03:19 PM and that article literally shows that it's a resistive head 08-Dec-19 03:21 PM yea hang on I think there's another one 08-Dec-19 03:21 PM you're right though, sry for the curse btw 08-Dec-19 03:21 PM xaar are by far the cheapest high viscosity ones afaik 08-Dec-19 03:21 PM there's Fuji Dimatix, Konica, and Seiko 08-Dec-19 03:21 PM all are around $500-1200 08-Dec-19 03:23 PM It may be the CN642A, not sure 08-Dec-19 03:28 PM https://youtu.be/FN9Btu7DHhw 08-Dec-19 03:28 PM there was this talk 08-Dec-19 03:28 PM epson print heads 08-Dec-19 03:33 PM btw, part of why I was interested in the print heads was for dispensing watch gear oil.. looking at the tech sheet for a common one it appears to be ~150 cSt @ 20 C (dens of ~0.9 @ 20 C.. so there for =~ 135 cP) 08-Dec-19 03:34 PM look at 34:36 on that video 08-Dec-19 03:34 PM he prints LIQUID WAX! 08-Dec-19 03:34 PM (at 70C) 08-Dec-19 03:34 PM which means the print head can easily survive a slightly hotter oil 08-Dec-19 03:34 PM but for watches I'd probably go the picojetting route 08-Dec-19 03:35 PM yeah, I came across these a few days ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rd04kt7VBpE 08-Dec-19 03:35 PM earlier version PicoDot valves are available in several different configurations to handle fluids ranging from 50 to 500,000 cps. The LV configuration is designed for use with low viscosity fluids from 50 - 1,000 cps; the MV configuration covers a wide range of viscosities from 50 - 200,000 cps; and the HV configuration is specifically designed for fluids with high viscosities of 1,000 - 500,000 cps. Nozzles are available with 150µm, 200µm, 300µm and 400µm orifice diameters to accommodate a wide range of dot sizes. 08-Dec-19 03:35 PM a thicker oil we use is ~1200 cSt @ 20 C 08-Dec-19 03:44 PM stokes are not poise 08-Dec-19 03:44 PM I know, I showed some basic conversion on th e other one.. 08-Dec-19 03:44 PM similar density of ~0.9g/ml .. so ~1080 cP 08-Dec-19 03:44 PM the greases we use dont have any such numbers 08-Dec-19 03:47 PM I think xaar 128 is the cheapest way to get into piezo jetting except for maybe a consumer epson printer 08-Dec-19 03:47 PM consumer epsons are far cheaper and quite hackable 08-Dec-19 03:47 PM but there are no opensource projects 08-Dec-19 03:47 PM $250 for a pico dot head and about another $250 for a driver 08-Dec-19 03:48 PM that CCC talk is the only thing he published 08-Dec-19 03:48 PM no info, no source code, no pcbs 08-Dec-19 03:48 PM There are some .. forget the name ... single nozzle jetter on Ebay, lemme find 08-Dec-19 03:48 PM for my application, one 'dot', no need to "print", plus some thicker stuffs 08-Dec-19 03:48 PM metanoic, would be interesting.. 08-Dec-19 03:49 PM Microfab Technologies 08-Dec-19 03:49 PM unst, not for $20k 08-Dec-19 03:50 PM https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F162484082389 08-Dec-19 03:50 PM ohhhhh... 08-Dec-19 03:51 PM I have the heated version, pulse shape isn't too hard to figure out but IMO a piezo buzzer setup works better with more power capable 08-Dec-19 03:51 PM Steminc has a buzzer bender that is good for 150v and displaces well and fast 08-Dec-19 03:51 PM https://youtu.be/oj_BfAOKjBc 08-Dec-19 03:51 PM This is me testing the buzzer displacement for... 08-Dec-19 03:52 PM one thou 08-Dec-19 03:53 PM https://www.steminc.com/PZT/en/piezo-round-bimorph-actuator-for-pumps-27x05mm 08-Dec-19 03:54 PM so just a DC voltage? 08-Dec-19 03:54 PM And here is that buzzer in a cheapo head I slapped together in a matter of hours 08-Dec-19 03:54 PM https://youtu.be/T6PSBG1SOqQ 08-Dec-19 03:55 PM oh dude, yeah, that's what I want 08-Dec-19 03:55 PM kinda, maybe more handheld, but yeah 08-Dec-19 03:55 PM I think I was running it like -30 through 110 or so 08-Dec-19 03:55 PM But it was partly due to just avoiding sucking in air as I was just doing a ramp waveform 08-Dec-19 03:55 PM ducking? 08-Dec-19 03:56 PM *sucking 08-Dec-19 03:56 PM roger 08-Dec-19 03:56 PM Sry on my phone in the shop atm 08-Dec-19 03:56 PM no worries dude, that's some good info for what I am interested in it for 08-Dec-19 03:57 PM With the ramp signal I was able to find a ~800hz resonance with good drop formation without satellites, but you get way more mileage by tailoring a two pulse wave that constructively interferes to do actual jetting 08-Dec-19 03:57 PM I can link to several papers on the excitation waveform optimization when I get back to the computer 08-Dec-19 03:58 PM I watched the xaar video and how they make the wave with two opoosing xtals 08-Dec-19 03:58 PM I'd think it is somewhat similar 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM Yes the idea is universal 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM the piezo signal they have is pretty much what you'd think 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM you first suck up some, expand the volume 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM then you slam it to make the droplet 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM nice, alright.. just thuinking about two piezos 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM ah 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM Not quite actually the opposite 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM Positive displacement followed by recoil timed for the recoil wave to interfere 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM Then tailored ringdown compensation to stabilize for the next pulse 08-Dec-19 03:59 PM You can use the excitation to self measure if your piezo has 3 contacts 08-Dec-19 04:01 PM I wouldn't need to go fast, just a single droplet (or more to get right quantitiy) 08-Dec-19 04:01 PM Well, more easily anyway 08-Dec-19 04:01 PM Can still prove your chamber's resonance with a single transducer with two contacts 08-Dec-19 04:01 PM *probe 08-Dec-19 04:02 PM from what I've seen the epson waveforms are first positive/negative ramps, then a slam in the other direction 08-Dec-19 04:04 PM microfab: Fluid viscosity < 20 cPs 08-Dec-19 04:05 PM build your own 08-Dec-19 04:05 PM seems like it's pretty easy 08-Dec-19 04:05 PM yeah, I made a few sketches upon looking at that pico pulse product 08-Dec-19 04:05 PM their cleaning insutrction/kit thing showed every component, nearly 08-Dec-19 04:05 PM where a piezo drives a poppet/push rod 08-Dec-19 04:05 PM looks like the microfab uses a glass liner/tube that gets squeezed 08-Dec-19 04:07 PM Aside from the waveform there are two other key considerations, nozzle aperture being very uniform and chamber design to not trap air 08-Dec-19 04:07 PM Any air and you won't get jetting or even drops at all, and without a very well shaped nozzle you'll get drops sticking or trajectory off axis or unavoidable satellites 08-Dec-19 04:08 PM also, the pico pulse had a spring on the poppet.. 08-Dec-19 04:08 PM we have an "automatic oiler" but it's pretty lame (all mechanical) 08-Dec-19 04:08 PM and the fine tip breaks often, and $40 for a replacement sucks 08-Dec-19 04:09 PM On my assembly I chose to use a luer lock fitting to try out different orifice sizes since ai don't have glass working equipment to taper a capillary 08-Dec-19 04:09 PM I basically scored the needle and broke it off, leaving enough distance to file and polish it past any bends induced during snapping 08-Dec-19 04:10 PM heh, I am t hinking of a mechnical jetting version.. only in my head, I doubt it will end up on paper 08-Dec-19 04:10 PM almost like a center punch 08-Dec-19 04:11 PM If you want good throughput then I think you'll have to avoid moving the whole assembly, but depends on your needs of course 08-Dec-19 04:12 PM define: good throughput 08-Dec-19 04:12 PM assembling 2 watches a day is decent 08-Dec-19 04:13 PM At least hundreds of drops per second? A resonant jetting method gets you in the thousands 08-Dec-19 04:13 PM yeah, not sure that would be posible with my application.. and some of those oils are thick 08-Dec-19 04:13 PM And if you want droplets smaller than the orifice diameter I'm not sure how a mechanical sort of thing would go 08-Dec-19 04:13 PM With strong enough pulses you can literally atomize about anything 08-Dec-19 04:15 PM the current method is to dip/drag an oiler (very small paddle) into a tiny bowl of oil, look at how much you picked up, and if on both sides, then very carefully transfer it to the inner bowl of a ruby jewel, being careful not to get it on the 'flat' of the jewel.. sometimes less than 0.5mm diameter clearance 08-Dec-19 04:15 PM by hand 08-Dec-19 04:16 PM Can you hold your workpiece upside down without falling apart? If so there is another design that excites a pool of liquid to produce a static "tongue" that can be dragged around 08-Dec-19 04:16 PM this seems like a job for a mini CNC table 08-Dec-19 04:16 PM the watchh stays together, yes, heh 08-Dec-19 04:16 PM I like the idea of Jigs more than XY travel 08-Dec-19 04:17 PM you place the watch into a jig, it oils all the spots automatically 08-Dec-19 04:17 PM ie, if a single probe like thing can come down through a tube and be perfectly aimed at the jewel it needs to dispnse to, then dispense 08-Dec-19 04:17 PM then onto next station to do next jewel 08-Dec-19 04:17 PM that way you dont have wear on precision X/Y tavel 08-Dec-19 04:17 PM which is more of a manufacturing ... philosophy?.. .that I am gearing towards 08-Dec-19 04:17 PM like any "second op" lathe setup 08-Dec-19 04:17 PM just does one thing, and onto the next 08-Dec-19 04:19 PM this seems like a job for those DIY linear servos :P 08-Dec-19 04:19 PM but yeah, I am all for trying to produce more stuffs 08-Dec-19 04:19 PM no wear, direct positioning 08-Dec-19 04:19 PM So do you need DROPLETS or just very precise metering pump? 08-Dec-19 04:19 PM i wonder if you could use one of the syringe pusher designs out there already and connect that up to some stainless capillary tube 08-Dec-19 04:19 PM not sure if droplets would be beneficial or not, we never really do that 08-Dec-19 04:20 PM Cause you can also do a pico/nano liter pump with a buzzer 08-Dec-19 04:20 PM sometimes we have to aim for the side of t he bowl in the jewel, because there is a staff sticking out and it owuld look bad if oil got ontop of the flat 08-Dec-19 04:20 PM I do like the idea of a buzzer.. just want something relatively small at first, like handheld as I manually position it and try it out 08-Dec-19 04:20 PM I wonder if I can measure how much oil I normally transfer/dispense 08-Dec-19 04:21 PM https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10033-017-0151-z 08-Dec-19 04:21 PM we dont have great measuring equipment at school.. no microscopes with that capability 08-Dec-19 04:21 PM neat paper 08-Dec-19 04:22 PM You could 3d print a picoliter pump and use a cheapo buzzer and square waveform. What viscosity liquid do you need to handle? 08-Dec-19 04:22 PM inlet/outlet have oppoisng shapes 08-Dec-19 04:22 PM fine oil : ~135 cP, thicker oil: ~1100 cP .. and there are two greases (one mainly for the setting mechanism, and ht eother specifically for the escapement) 08-Dec-19 04:24 PM The printhead in my video is quite small btw, easily handheld 08-Dec-19 04:24 PM I also want to try to dispense hot/melted shellac 08-Dec-19 04:25 PM I think you can handle those with a buzzer pump, may need active valves rather than diffusion style 08-Dec-19 04:25 PM @Metanoic Ithe issue I would have is the amount of starting oil.. this stuff is pretty expensive and a small vial should last several months 08-Dec-19 04:25 PM Okay, another way is to do surface acoustic waves on the tubing itself 08-Dec-19 04:26 PM hrmmm 08-Dec-19 04:26 PM I remember EEV Blogs video on acoustic delays 08-Dec-19 04:26 PM That way no reservoir and you can use smallest diameter tubing your liquid will flow through 08-Dec-19 04:26 PM It's easy these days they have interdigitated piezo elements 08-Dec-19 04:26 PM this is all really good stuff.. winter break starts on Wednesday, will give me stuff to play around with 08-Dec-19 04:28 PM There's also P waves and Love waves and whatnot 08-Dec-19 04:28 PM You should be able to get by with something that can just squeeze the tube quickly 08-Dec-19 04:30 PM likely.. 08-Dec-19 04:30 PM a total resevoir of 1ml is likely too much, just as a reference of size 08-Dec-19 04:30 PM for the handheld version.. maybe once I am making thousands of watches a day, then we'll revisit it 08-Dec-19 04:31 PM oil costs $100k per liter 08-Dec-19 04:32 PM btw, decent graphic of glass tube + PZT .. http://www.microfab.com/a-basic-ink-jet-microdispensing-setup 08-Dec-19 04:35 PM Electrophoresis may be an option too 08-Dec-19 04:35 PM Actually probably not, no high fields near watches 08-Dec-19 04:38 PM heh, I bet I could either use an existing jewel, or simply grind my own oriffice out of blank jewels we have, just like a water jet nozzle (or just get a brand new one of those) 08-Dec-19 04:39 PM waterjet nozzles are very huge orifices 08-Dec-19 04:39 PM comparatively 08-Dec-19 04:40 PM http://www.okcc.com/PDF/SapphireOrifice.pdf .. as small as 0.03 mm 08-Dec-19 04:40 PM that may not be specifically for waterjet 08-Dec-19 04:40 PM With as small of volumes you're starting with, I'd just actuate a syringe 08-Dec-19 04:46 PM I'd think a syringe has too much stick-slip 08-Dec-19 04:46 PM if you mean use a syrnge needle as the orrifice, that's different 08-Dec-19 04:46 PM oh, I actually have some cappilary tubes on hand, for a melting point tester thing 08-Dec-19 04:46 PM MelTemp 08-Dec-19 04:46 PM or something.. it's with all of my chemistry anaylitcal consumables 08-Dec-19 04:46 PM but yeah, I should see if I can squeeze them 08-Dec-19 04:46 PM and how easy/hard it may be to coat a piezo onto it 08-Dec-19 04:52 PM hydrophobic coating of the capillary or syringe internal would likely help 08-Dec-19 04:55 PM help with the liquid or piezo? 08-Dec-19 04:55 PM will help with the liquid moving through the body of whatever it's moving through 08-Dec-19 04:55 PM we use an oleophobic coating (PTFE based) that has screwed me over recently, but finally found out the cause (the solvent attacking the shellac from dipping it too deep) 08-Dec-19 04:56 PM yea that's always a concern with a coating, if your fluid is sensitive then no-go 08-Dec-19 04:56 PM what are you using now, again? I would at least get a cheap pipette or something. 08-Dec-19 04:56 PM also looking at backscroll, for interferometry I would go with a telecom sub-band DFB laser and make it all-fiber 08-Dec-19 04:56 PM use a piezoelectric tube with one leg's fiber wrapped around it and as you energize it you'll be increasing the true path length for that leg of the interferometer 08-Dec-19 04:56 PM a DFB laser is usually in a butterfly package where you can modulate temperature via TEC and they also use a fiber bragg grating which is basically an in-fiber band pass filter 08-Dec-19 05:04 PM I am using an "oiler" that is basically a small paddle 08-Dec-19 05:05 PM and telecom frequency in silica is zero dispersion territory so you'll not get any atmosphere induced dispersion 08-Dec-19 05:05 PM and I pickup some from a tiny bowl, and deposit it into a ruby jewel 08-Dec-19 05:05 PM See if you can find a video about this process, I recall it being quite weird @Noxz 08-Dec-19 05:05 PM ah yea 08-Dec-19 05:05 PM what I'm describing would be considered an "all-fiber fourier transform interferometer" 08-Dec-19 05:05 PM not sure if anything really shows it indepth, but nearly anything from the Watchmaking Repair Channel is a good place to start 08-Dec-19 05:05 PM https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-iic0hc/images/stencil/1280x1280/products/42433/66614/7013Nphoto3__15391.1477080079.jpg 08-Dec-19 05:07 PM You know, I have an idea of what you could use! 08-Dec-19 05:07 PM Biological micropipettes 08-Dec-19 05:07 PM tainless Steel needle tip is precisely finished to a tip diameter of 0.18mm (Black), 0.18mm (Red), 0.24mm (Blue), 0.32mm (Green) & 0.45mm (Yellow) 08-Dec-19 05:07 PM The ones with a handle and button you push 08-Dec-19 05:07 PM yeah, even then though... 08-Dec-19 05:07 PM yep, they'll get you in the 10ul range 08-Dec-19 05:07 PM hrmm.. 08-Dec-19 05:07 PM again, I really wonder what quantity we use 08-Dec-19 05:07 PM I need to try to measure it 08-Dec-19 05:08 PM if you can see a single droplet clearly, microliters 08-Dec-19 05:08 PM I understand what you're going for though, you don't really even want a specific amount of fluid on each transfer, you want the surface tension induced amount for whatever surface you're wetting 08-Dec-19 05:09 PM standard oiler profile: https://d1v6dnm22vfd7d.cloudfront.net/monthly_2018_07/oil9.thumb.jpg.bd10c06f222488729ca2238334cb491d.jpg 08-Dec-19 05:09 PM "ergonomic" : https://d1v6dnm22vfd7d.cloudfront.net/monthly_2018_07/oil8.thumb.jpg.64b6fb40eb0dbecb232ce9d62e8a1573.jpg 08-Dec-19 05:09 PM the amount on the standard one is way too much 08-Dec-19 05:09 PM half that is likely what you are after 08-Dec-19 05:09 PM but yeah, you just kinda pick some up, and wick it away 08-Dec-19 05:10 PM does it have an actual wick in it or anything? some of my machine tools use "wick oilers" which are gravity fed capillary transfer like what you're doing 08-Dec-19 05:10 PM but they have a reservoir of fluid and won't leak out unless you alleviate the capillary volume 08-Dec-19 05:11 PM if we pretend the "diameter" makes a perfect sphere, split in half (I guess htat's a hemisphere).. then the "black" one would give .. 0.024 mm^3 08-Dec-19 05:11 PM oh, divided by two 08-Dec-19 05:11 PM so, on the low end, like 0.01 uL 08-Dec-19 05:11 PM high side.. maybe 0.15 uL 08-Dec-19 05:11 PM wow... tiny 08-Dec-19 05:14 PM You can get down to 1uL fairly easily with a bio pipette 08-Dec-19 05:14 PM and that's a rough estimation based on numbers found on interwebs 08-Dec-19 05:14 PM yeah, I guess we're talking about 1/10th a uL though 08-Dec-19 05:15 PM can easily get down there 08-Dec-19 05:15 PM How about a syringe dispenser? I have 32 gauge tips that are only about 100um diameter 08-Dec-19 05:17 PM not sure that is small enough 08-Dec-19 05:17 PM https://www.esslinger.com/bergeon-7718-1a-automatic-watch-and-clock-oiler/ 08-Dec-19 05:17 PM yeah, we have that one 08-Dec-19 05:17 PM !@# 08-Dec-19 05:17 PM I dont use it much because the tips break and are expensive 08-Dec-19 05:17 PM 34 gauge needles are only 50um ID. I use a loctite syringe dispenser with adjustable pressure and pulse length 08-Dec-19 05:18 PM oh, 50um should be decent enough, I suppose 08-Dec-19 05:18 PM I use this when I'm slicing glass https://www.amazon.com/Titan-Tools-15200-Precision-Oiler/dp/B002LYQALQ 08-Dec-19 05:18 PM https://ecatalog.corning.com/life-sciences/b2c/US/en/Equipment/Liquid-Handling-Equipment/Pipettors/Corning%C2%AE-Lambda%E2%84%A2-Plus-Single--and-Multi-channel-Pipettors/p/4070-ALT 08-Dec-19 05:18 PM that's all ginormous to me 08-Dec-19 05:18 PM 0.2uL is not ginormous 08-Dec-19 05:18 PM that's the full actuation range 08-Dec-19 05:19 PM the item itself 08-Dec-19 05:19 PM I dindt even read the range, sorry 08-Dec-19 05:19 PM but, yeah, actually.. from those rough calcs I did, 0.2uL may be a bit much 08-Dec-19 05:19 PM just mount it on something 08-Dec-19 05:19 PM 0-0.2uL is a tiny actuation amount 08-Dec-19 05:20 PM relative size of the pyhysical oiler to a hand: https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-iic0hc/images/stencil/1280x1280/products/40336/73155/metal_dip_oiler_42.248photo4__22112.1478725874.jpg?c=2&imbypass=on 08-Dec-19 05:20 PM Link was 0.2-20uL range 08-Dec-19 05:20 PM You mean 0.2-2 08-Dec-19 05:20 PM That's 1.8uL range 08-Dec-19 05:21 PM that should be the setting, right? 08-Dec-19 05:21 PM so you should be able to go from 0.2 to 2 08-Dec-19 05:21 PM Yeah 08-Dec-19 05:21 PM I have a 0.2-2uL pipette. Kind of a pain in the butt to use. 08-Dec-19 05:21 PM could still go with jetting 08-Dec-19 05:22 PM Resolution depends on thread per inch or whatever and how long the travel is 08-Dec-19 05:22 PM Pneumatic syringe dispenser is my pick 08-Dec-19 05:22 PM again, I think a "syringe" will have a stick-slip 08-Dec-19 05:22 PM and unable to actually get the tiny amounts 08-Dec-19 05:22 PM Autopipettes exist 08-Dec-19 05:23 PM take the plunger out of the syringe and you should be able to just rely on capillary action 08-Dec-19 05:23 PM Opentrons for CNC pipetting 08-Dec-19 05:23 PM the only issue I see with jetting is positioning 08-Dec-19 05:23 PM sure, you can get a 5pL droplet 08-Dec-19 05:23 PM toss a ptfe sticker on the opening or something to prevent spill 08-Dec-19 05:23 PM but where will it end up? 08-Dec-19 05:23 PM well, if it jets through, say, a syrnge needle, then it should be easy 08-Dec-19 05:23 PM to locate 08-Dec-19 05:24 PM are the parts you have to oil all in different Z-heights? 08-Dec-19 05:24 PM Pipetting oil in small volumes could be tricky because the oil will wet the outside of the tip and drip down. 08-Dec-19 05:24 PM yes, different Z heights 08-Dec-19 05:24 PM maybe upwards of 0.5um apart 08-Dec-19 05:24 PM sorry 08-Dec-19 05:24 PM 500um 08-Dec-19 05:24 PM @piGuy that's why jetting may be the only real answer 08-Dec-19 05:25 PM polypropylene tips are hydrophobic so they'll stay dry on the outside after you pull them out of the solution you're sucking up. Oil won't do that. 08-Dec-19 05:26 PM hydrophobic does not mean oleophobic 08-Dec-19 05:27 PM What's the stick-slip concern with syringe dispensing? 08-Dec-19 05:27 PM to move the plunger .. it wont happen.. wont happen, then all of a sudden slip and you have 100x the amount you wanted 08-Dec-19 05:27 PM Doesn't use a plunger. 08-Dec-19 05:28 PM Hear me out... would a wick with no liquid work? 08-Dec-19 05:28 PM Solenoid actuated with pressure regulator 08-Dec-19 05:28 PM Touch the wick, you leave a wisp of residue 08-Dec-19 05:28 PM Sounds like a wisp is all you want 08-Dec-19 05:28 PM This is what I have: https://www.all-spec.com/Catalog/Adhesives-Sealants-Tapes/Dispensing-Equipment/Metered-Dispensers/883976-30769?gclid=EAIaIQobChMInprigbWn5gIVh6DsCh2YWgb9EAQYASABEgJ1TfD_BwE 08-Dec-19 05:28 PM like a glass fiber wick with capillary action 08-Dec-19 05:28 PM 2-3 micron fibers bundled into a tiiiiiiiiiiny brush 08-Dec-19 05:28 PM with a few hundred uL of capillary action fill 08-Dec-19 05:29 PM hrm, that's one idea 08-Dec-19 05:44 PM also, Barium Titanate is the only piezo I know I can get as powder to maybe form /coat into my own shapes 08-Dec-19 05:52 PM piezoelectric materials need to be solid 08-Dec-19 05:53 PM they get sintered from powder 08-Dec-19 05:53 PM well, if doing that way 08-Dec-19 05:53 PM nnnnnot at home 08-Dec-19 05:53 PM otherwise crystal 08-Dec-19 05:53 PM totally at home using a powder bed printer and a furnace that you can flood with noble 08-Dec-19 05:54 PM not pressure? 08-Dec-19 05:54 PM nope just need no oxidation I believe 08-Dec-19 05:55 PM then it should be doable 08-Dec-19 05:55 PM https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1757-899X/455/1/012046 08-Dec-19 05:55 PM the polling is probably the most difficult part I'd think 08-Dec-19 05:55 PM @Noxz 08-Dec-19 05:55 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20191208_195635-56348.jpg 08-Dec-19 05:55 PM that's my print head, for scale 08-Dec-19 05:57 PM with some machining I reckon that can be made much smaller 08-Dec-19 05:57 PM very much so 08-Dec-19 05:57 PM it's slapped together using a kf16 flange and some npt adapters down to a luer lock fitting and needle 08-Dec-19 05:58 PM oh, doh, that's a kf16 flange 08-Dec-19 05:58 PM and it's a horribly placed inlet, too, as it allows for bubbles of air to become trapped above it and it takes forever to prime it again lol 08-Dec-19 05:58 PM it was literally put together in one hour of amazon shopping and one our of assembly 08-Dec-19 05:59 PM it will evolve when I get back to that project, but for now working on some fiber processing stuffs 08-Dec-19 08:55 PM I think I found some metrology equipment I may want.. basically an optical dividing tilting head + more 08-Dec-19 09:28 PM just remember that while they may be accurate, they don't provide backlash removal 08-Dec-19 11:10 PM it's more for inspection/calibration of index plates I would make, but does state it can be used for actual machining 08-Dec-19 11:10 PM also, most of these have a LOCK.. so yes, it completely removes backlash 08-Dec-19 11:10 PM not designed to make an arc, but to go to a position/rotation and stay there 08-Dec-19 11:14 PM it doesn't remove backlash 08-Dec-19 11:14 PM if you go forward, then go back - you won't end up in the same place 08-Dec-19 11:18 PM it's an optical read head, it's not based on the lead screw 08-Dec-19 11:18 PM yes, the lead screw will rotate the spindle, but the reading is done from a glass disc mounted on the spindle, not the lead screw/worm 08-Dec-19 11:18 PM anywho, bed time, school tomorrow, will test if perflourohexane is eating my shellac or not 10-Dec-19 02:08 AM hmm, $2k but if I can get the ebay credit for 2 years, it would be 0% and only like $83/month payment https://www.everlastgenerators.com/product/tig-stick/powertig-255ext 10-Dec-19 02:08 AM the one nixie mentioned seems to not ship outside of EU 10-Dec-19 02:08 AM the eastwood digital AC/DC doesn't have as low starting amperage, which seems useful for thin stuff 10-Dec-19 02:08 AM (https://www.eastwood.com/tig-200-digital.html) 11-Dec-19 11:51 AM Looking for a temporary adhesive to mount optics for dicing. So far I've found Crystalbond 509. Anyone have any other suggestions? 11-Dec-19 12:00 PM That opticians wax thing? 11-Dec-19 12:00 PM The one they use for lens grinding, the purply-blackish tar-like thing 11-Dec-19 12:13 PM yeah 11-Dec-19 12:18 PM That's my suggestion 11-Dec-19 12:18 PM I guess crystalbond is pretty much that 11-Dec-19 12:58 PM any of y'all know about optical rotary tables/dividing heads.. vs, say, rotary encoders? 11-Dec-19 12:58 PM the goal is precision, inspection first, but machining fixtures second 11-Dec-19 12:58 PM optical ones read down to about 1 arc second 11-Dec-19 12:58 PM harmonic reducer + 24 bit optical rotary encoder on the output 11-Dec-19 12:58 PM and an index notch 11-Dec-19 12:59 PM 24bit, what resolution is that.. 11-Dec-19 12:59 PM 2^24 = 16777216 11-Dec-19 12:59 PM or rather, ^23, yeah? 8388608 11-Dec-19 12:59 PM 129600 arc seconds in 1 rev 11-Dec-19 12:59 PM so, that is potentially 64 times more resolution 11-Dec-19 12:59 PM link to said encoder? 11-Dec-19 12:59 PM the best I found on mouser had 80k pulses (not cycles?) 11-Dec-19 12:59 PM digikey had none better 11-Dec-19 01:02 PM they're not cheap 11-Dec-19 01:02 PM (very not cheap) 11-Dec-19 01:02 PM look for used ones 11-Dec-19 01:03 PM I'd post a number of about what I would want to spend on encoder + rotary table, but that's semi meaningless 11-Dec-19 01:04 PM https://www.rls.si/en/products/aksim-2-off-axis-rotary-absolute-encoder 11-Dec-19 01:04 PM select the 080 ring to get the 20 bit resolution 11-Dec-19 01:04 PM not quite 24 11-Dec-19 01:04 PM 240-250 eur for a compatible set 11-Dec-19 01:05 PM yeah I can swing that 11-Dec-19 01:05 PM also, beyond electronics/DRO needed.. any real reason to go with an oldie optical one over new age rotary encoder? (sort of the reason why I am looking at the new ones is I have my eye on a nice oldie) 11-Dec-19 01:06 PM optical encoders are very expensive for high resolution 11-Dec-19 01:06 PM like, who needs better than 1 arc second for work that is likely not more than 200mm 11-Dec-19 01:06 PM and quite fragile 11-Dec-19 01:06 PM optical = glass slide + microscope stuff 11-Dec-19 01:06 PM sorry if we are mixing up terms 11-Dec-19 01:06 PM when I say optical, I mean old stuff... "rotary encoder" is new stuff 11-Dec-19 01:07 PM rotary encoders are much nicer 11-Dec-19 01:08 PM in wh at sense? that I dont need to look through a viewport? 11-Dec-19 01:08 PM I have to think with added resolution you gain preciscion, but this old stuff was the best metrology things, just below laser interferometry and optical polygons 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM well, you also get a huge resolution and a direct digital readout 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM the weak link becomes how tight you can position the measuring implement 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM I still need to pair the sensor with a nice mechanical unit 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM used harmonic drive 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM I suppos eyou did state harmonic drive 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM yeah, hrmm 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM there's more to it than just that 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM not really 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM that rotates a shaft, sure 11-Dec-19 01:10 PM there is bearings and whatnot to consider 11-Dec-19 01:11 PM most are weight bearing 11-Dec-19 01:11 PM example of the one I am looking at.. 11-Dec-19 01:11 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/optical_dividing-ADC1B.jpg 11-Dec-19 01:11 PM 5 is the glass 'encoder' 11-Dec-19 01:11 PM 13 is the viewport, also reads at 180 deg opposite, for the dual output sort of thing 11-Dec-19 01:11 PM within the same viewport 11-Dec-19 01:12 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/1PC-Harmonic-Drive-CSF-27-50-2UH-100-1-50-1-2-phase-60-step-motor-XH/273566333668 11-Dec-19 01:12 PM load bearing example 11-Dec-19 01:12 PM half thinking about getting that unit(as it also has tilt) and then rigging up a better encoder + motor drive (which it can do) 11-Dec-19 01:13 PM I'd DIY it completely 11-Dec-19 01:13 PM with a granite epoxy frame just for the fun overkill of it 11-Dec-19 01:13 PM I dont want to waste that time.. I suppose I have the equipment, but meh 11-Dec-19 01:13 PM I sort of want something that simply works.. and has already been calibrated 11-Dec-19 01:14 PM well, you can just bolt two harmonic drives together with an L bracket if that's all you really want 11-Dec-19 01:14 PM and no calibration needed since you'd put the encoder on the output, not input 11-Dec-19 01:16 PM so, there's still roundness of the faceplate and so forth 11-Dec-19 01:16 PM I'd think I want some sort of morse taper in the center.. 11-Dec-19 01:16 PM well, whatever works 11-Dec-19 01:16 PM but HDs+high res encoders on the output is the way to go 11-Dec-19 01:17 PM lemme think on that a bit more, but yeah, will look up other encoders 11-Dec-19 01:17 PM having a 200+lbs dividing head in already good wokring order is likely worth the money 11-Dec-19 01:17 PM my currant capabilities wouldn't really be able to handle that so well.. no problem making a staff and bearings.. but housings are another story 11-Dec-19 01:22 PM wonder if you could use an industrial robot's wrist 11-Dec-19 01:22 PM with an extra encoder on each axis 11-Dec-19 01:22 PM hrmm.. 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/12778-STAUBLI-ROBOT-WRIST-W-HEIDENHAIN-MTR-EQI-1128-16-59S15-R8-D24288906/113747094988 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM staubli's wrists are the most precise afaik 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM they use custom made and custom designed gearboxes 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM interesting 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM oil-filled! 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM nice! serviceable 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM not at all lol 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM oh? 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM all the parts are custom 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM 100% of them 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM it doesnt mean not serviceable 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM just means you may be able to clean them 11-Dec-19 01:24 PM ie, Rolexes are serviceable, but it's hard as hell to get a parts account 11-Dec-19 01:25 PM but yeah, that wrist might be what you want 11-Dec-19 01:25 PM two axis dividing head 11-Dec-19 01:25 PM yeah, I may have to think on this more.. 11-Dec-19 05:04 PM many high end rotary encoders I have looked at have an accuracy of way .. more?.. less.. than an arc second.. some in several degrees.. simply has a bit of resolution but not veery accurate.. some had a repeatability of like 0.2deg (12 mins) 11-Dec-19 05:04 PM still going through a bit though 11-Dec-19 05:04 PM one... problem?... is many are self contained units, so whatever bearings and general preciscion assembly is what you are 'stuck' with... plus you then need to figure out how to attach the shaft 11-Dec-19 05:04 PM so far, this had made me lean more towards the oldie optical 11-Dec-19 05:04 PM many places wont even publish such numbers 11-Dec-19 05:23 PM also, most of the "24 bit" I found wer emul;titurn, where half that resolution went to the total turn, but single turn was only 12-14 11-Dec-19 05:23 PM even 2^14 * 4 (quad) yeilds something that is still about 2 arc seconds.. yet with porer quality control( total accuracy) 11-Dec-19 05:26 PM I did link you to the kind you want 11-Dec-19 05:27 PM encoder accuracy: +/- 0.05 deg 11-Dec-19 05:27 PM like hell no 11-Dec-19 05:27 PM typically +/- 0.025 it says, but nope 11-Dec-19 05:27 PM that's 1.5 arc minutes 11-Dec-19 05:27 PM MINUTES 11-Dec-19 05:27 PM if Iget a good one maybe it will be down tot he seconds, but that's what I am talking about.. about what is metrology grade 11-Dec-19 05:27 PM frog feeding time.. but yeah, that's kinda my point, is the published data for these things are either not available, or simply terrible 11-Dec-19 05:36 PM Again, use that magnetic one 11-Dec-19 05:36 PM Not the cheap crappy chinese ones 11-Dec-19 05:40 PM this is what I just looked up: https://www.rls.si/eng/products/aksim-2-off-axis-rotary-absolute-encoder 11-Dec-19 05:40 PM which is what you linked 11-Dec-19 05:40 PM resolution does not gaurantee accuracy 11-Dec-19 05:40 PM it increases preciscion, yes 11-Dec-19 05:40 PM (I think I got that right, I mix up terms often enough) 11-Dec-19 05:47 PM well, you're still never going to get ridiculous sub-arcsecond precision on a large mechanical system 11-Dec-19 05:47 PM what if it is primarily inspection? 11-Dec-19 05:47 PM what use is a tool that you dont want to/cant use 11-Dec-19 05:47 PM if you dont trust it 11-Dec-19 05:47 PM I'd almost like to get an oldie, and compare it to the reading of a new encoder 11-Dec-19 05:57 PM there exist high resolution glass scale encoders 11-Dec-19 05:57 PM but they're hard to get and they're expensive 11-Dec-19 11:36 PM @Noxz look what I found on aliexpress: 11-Dec-19 11:36 PM https://es.aliexpress.com/item/32850680537.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.163e3335VKioee&algo_pvid=a243d70d-cbac-4f46-8db3-66b6fd3c21a4&algo_expid=a243d70d-cbac-4f46-8db3-66b6fd3c21a4-12&btsid=c91e5457-a1d6-4f88-9f2c-38fa5d0c3894&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_2,searchweb201603_55 11-Dec-19 11:37 PM lol, no 11-Dec-19 11:37 PM lolyes 11-Dec-19 11:37 PM XDDDDDD 11-Dec-19 11:37 PM loook at it!! 11-Dec-19 11:37 PM XDDDDDDDDD 11-Dec-19 11:39 PM this is basically waht I am looking at https://www.ebay.com/itm/Leitz-Optical-Tilting-Deviding-Table/113768914819?hash=item1a7d27df83:g:iWsAAOSw-A9c8pRY 11-Dec-19 11:39 PM innards 11-Dec-19 11:39 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/optical_dividing-3EEEC.jpg 11-Dec-19 11:39 PM optics 11-Dec-19 11:39 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/optics-04D6C.jpg 11-Dec-19 11:39 PM apparently the wheel is graduated in 20 arc minutes, and adjusting 27/28, it tilts 30, which through the range can offset the measurement up to the 20mins, but read down to 2 arc second dashes 11-Dec-19 11:39 PM sort of like an adjustable autocolimator/whatever inside the table 12-Dec-19 08:19 PM just ordered a bit of metal for a relatively simple project.. basically a hand planer, but not 12-Dec-19 08:19 PM will make 2 dozen of them, hand them out to students (charge them $20) 12-Dec-19 08:47 PM https://www.datron.com/products/cnc-milling-machines/c5/ 12-Dec-19 08:47 PM Hot. Want. Now. 12-Dec-19 10:27 PM hobby 12-Dec-19 11:26 PM ohh, any blueprints on that hand planer? 13-Dec-19 09:35 AM I mean, I can show you pictures of the actual item 13-Dec-19 09:35 AM it's a peg wood sharpener 13-Dec-19 09:35 AM peg wood looks like skewers 13-Dec-19 09:35 AM is used to hold down and poke watch stuff 13-Dec-19 09:35 AM during assembly/dissasembly 13-Dec-19 09:35 AM and the makers of the oen I got dont make them anymore, and one dude in class was hype on it and mad at me for finding it 13-Dec-19 09:35 AM etc.. so I'm just going to make brass versions for everyone (with a small charge) and give him the original 13-Dec-19 09:39 AM oh btw @Noxz you were the clockmaking student, right? how good are you at very small scale lathe stuff? and would you be willing to manufacture a set of axles or whatever they are called in this case for a clockwork i've got? XD 13-Dec-19 09:40 AM so, I have yet to really do more than one, but I'd love to try to make more! 13-Dec-19 09:40 AM I have a medium/arge hobby sized lathe, and a small watchmakers lathe 13-Dec-19 09:40 AM if the pivot is broken, it can either be drilled out and a new pivot put in, or the entire pinion - which includes the low number teeth gear - has to be remade 13-Dec-19 09:40 AM sometimes on clocks those are separate, but more often than not it's asingle piece 13-Dec-19 09:40 AM the bigger gear, which we call the Wheel, is rivetted onto the staff 13-Dec-19 09:40 AM I do have some clock gear cutters, but I also plan on making all the pinions ones when I need 13-Dec-19 09:40 AM I'd likely need some measurements of everything 13-Dec-19 09:40 AM also, about to go on morning dog walk, so, bbl! 13-Dec-19 09:45 AM my problem in this case is as follows: it's a synchronous motor clock with 3 concentric shafts for minutes, hours and seconds... and somebody gave it a whack, so all three were bent and stuck in each other. 13-Dec-19 09:45 AM unst 13-Dec-19 09:45 AM if they didnt break, you can sometimes straighten the pivots by annealing the steel slightly 13-Dec-19 09:47 AM i managed to disassemble everything and have drawings somewhere, but sadly they are bent in a way I can't straighten them out enough so they could fit as they should 13-Dec-19 09:47 AM yeah, maybe just needs to be remade 13-Dec-19 09:47 AM or drilled out and new pivots loctite'd in place 13-Dec-19 09:47 AM is it a fancy/expensive clock at all? I know some old aircraft clocks are kinda rare and whatnot 13-Dec-19 09:47 AM k, my shoes are on, time for dog walk 13-Dec-19 09:50 AM not fancy, dunno if rare, but my only one of that kind 13-Dec-19 09:50 AM probably not rare at all 13-Dec-19 09:50 AM also not worth repairing. it's just for fun and to prove it's possible ^^ 15-Dec-19 04:57 PM w00t, gauge block set arrived 15-Dec-19 11:47 PM Photos? 16-Dec-19 07:53 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0724-C7507.jpg 16-Dec-19 07:53 AM 1.001 - 1.009 [0.001], 1.01-1.49[0.01], 0.5-10[0.5], 20-100[10] 16-Dec-19 07:53 AM old german brand 16-Dec-19 08:07 AM I am now deciding if a Suburban Tool (made in america brand) magnetic chuck is worth the ~x6 price 16-Dec-19 08:07 AM what sort of measurement things are used when detecting thicknesses of different films/layers when doing IC mfgr? 16-Dec-19 08:39 AM Pretty! 16-Dec-19 09:23 AM @Noxz Think this might be what you are looking for https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJodcGa0ef4 16-Dec-19 09:24 AM fairly certain that sticks you with during-deposition measurement, so depends on what you're looking for Noxz 16-Dec-19 09:28 AM generally for deposition you use exactly what LRM posted, a crystal thickness monitor 16-Dec-19 09:28 AM some people here have experimented with doing their own by cutting open canned crystals, but if you can find a conflat crystal holder the older controllers are cheap and readily available 16-Dec-19 09:28 AM the crystal holders are always posted for way too much though, I got lucky and nabbed a NOS one for like 100 bucks or something 16-Dec-19 09:52 AM @LRM there's that, but also for spin coating is what I was referring to.. so to poke throuhg a semi plastic material? or similar? 16-Dec-19 09:52 AM basiccally looking at sub micron resolution 16-Dec-19 09:52 AM anywho, working a bit on the house (planting hedges) today 16-Dec-19 09:52 AM I will be looking at capacitive/inductive displacement sensors, but the actual probe of poking through stuff is of question as well 16-Dec-19 09:52 AM that's kinda what I wanted to know about 16-Dec-19 09:52 AM so if I know I am 0.25um away from a final dimension, maybe I can spin coat it to raise it up that much and just take another grind 16-Dec-19 09:52 AM but, beyond tables of dilutes of various photoresists, I would like to measure/verify it 16-Dec-19 09:52 AM k, house work time 16-Dec-19 09:58 AM thats not something i can help with...but definitely share whatever info you find 16-Dec-19 09:59 AM I know there is also plastic/thin film shim stock available 16-Dec-19 10:50 AM trying to measure photoresist thickness right? 16-Dec-19 10:50 AM I’d say some sort of optical profilemetry 16-Dec-19 10:50 AM optical profiler* based on interferometry 16-Dec-19 11:27 AM There's some thickness gauges on Amazon.com that use eddy currents or something, for metals only though https://www.amazon.com/Digital-Thickness-CM-205FN-Automatic-Non-Ferrous/dp/B07VBF1BN3/ 16-Dec-19 11:27 AM Yeah otherwise profilometry, or just cutting a section and using a (electron or ion) microscope to look at the edge 16-Dec-19 11:27 AM Some stuff you can just use the color of the layer, since the bilayer interference, if the layer is transparent 16-Dec-19 11:27 AM You can also use interferometry 16-Dec-19 11:27 AM Again if it's transparent 16-Dec-19 11:27 AM DIC optics will produce contrast as soon as there's any difference in path length (i e any layer thickness)... But you'll likely need some standards to calibrate against 16-Dec-19 02:43 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/223668417882 16-Dec-19 02:43 PM Are these surface plates any good? 16-Dec-19 02:44 PM not likely 16-Dec-19 02:44 PM mine is 3" thick, and that is the minimum I would say 16-Dec-19 02:44 PM that just looks like a tile, honestly 16-Dec-19 02:44 PM look for either black or pink granite 16-Dec-19 02:44 PM and always check for one that has a calibration sticker 16-Dec-19 02:45 PM Yeah, I have a pretty big height gauge to measure pretty big parts, with a 3" slab it would be ridiculously heavy 16-Dec-19 02:45 PM big parts need a thicker slab to support 16-Dec-19 02:45 PM to prevent distortion of the granite 16-Dec-19 02:45 PM as you place parts on 16-Dec-19 02:46 PM https://www.grizzly.com/search?q=(granite) 16-Dec-19 02:46 PM Grizzly seems to be the cheapest source 16-Dec-19 02:46 PM yeah, likely.. and I could trust them at the basic level 16-Dec-19 02:46 PM not for anything super precision though 16-Dec-19 02:46 PM the issue is how you mount it 16-Dec-19 02:46 PM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airy_points 16-Dec-19 02:47 PM Shipping is an arm and a leg. I'm not asking super precise stuff, just to have a standard now I have set of gauge blocks and a tenth indicator 16-Dec-19 02:47 PM and how the plate was calibrated (on those points) 16-Dec-19 02:47 PM I got my plate "locally", with a stand he made for it 16-Dec-19 02:48 PM I might sit and wait for some machine shop nearby to toss out their metrology stuff 16-Dec-19 02:48 PM I honestly have yet to do anything with it though, as I am still acquiring tools and things to use on it 16-Dec-19 02:48 PM if you are near surplus places, I see granite plates pop up all the time 16-Dec-19 02:48 PM like at HGR 16-Dec-19 02:48 PM https://hgrinc.com/?all=1&view&aisle&from&to&markdowns&newarrivals&sort&kw=granite&per_page=24&min_price&max_price&pn=1 16-Dec-19 02:48 PM but yeah, find a local-ish place, otherwise shipping will be a bit, and you want to make sure it arrives in one piece 16-Dec-19 02:48 PM I would always look for a calibration sticker.. but the date may not matter, just the fact it was mated to a stand is all that really counts 16-Dec-19 02:48 PM mine was last calibrated the year I was born, but the tool & die maker it came from had a few others and rarely used it, so it didnt get much use 16-Dec-19 02:48 PM k, back to a movie.. resting for the rest of the day as I got the privacy hedge all planted 16-Dec-19 03:41 PM those surface plates are good for gluing down sandpaper to...or if you want to make some mounted tool base but they are not really suitable for precise measuring 16-Dec-19 03:41 PM the thin ones linked before 16-Dec-19 03:42 PM Hmm, could use it as a lapping surface 16-Dec-19 03:42 PM For optical fibers and so on 16-Dec-19 03:42 PM Surface to stick lapping paper on I mean 16-Dec-19 03:44 PM yeah that sort of thing is all i would consider it for, something you can shamelessly get abrasive on without feeling bad 16-Dec-19 04:26 PM I have one of the 3" B grade grizzly plates and it was worth the price IMO. For lapping and small machine tool bases I use one of their small 2" plates (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000DD0KE) 16-Dec-19 04:26 PM low grade is better than no grade, but you're absolutely right on the shipping/freight aspect. Plan a stop next time you're traveling would be my advice 16-Dec-19 04:26 PM and if you can manage it, try mounting the plate in a pull out drawer/platform so you don't just stack stuff on it.. flat surface and all.. Just make sure you go all out on the drawer slides so you're not afraid to have you toes under it lol 17-Dec-19 10:45 AM brass arrived for a project, sitll waiting on the Aluminum and O1 tool steel 18-Dec-19 11:47 AM https://www.ebay.com/itm//333057027076 18-Dec-19 11:47 AM oooo 18-Dec-19 11:47 AM this could be useful 20-Dec-19 01:46 PM As a cheap dodgy poor man’s surface plate I often use a sheet of glass or a piece of manufactured granite-spam counter top 20-Dec-19 01:46 PM “Engineered quartz” or whatever they call it, the stuff they fit kitchens with 20-Dec-19 01:56 PM just dont tell anyone you do that 20-Dec-19 01:56 PM also, just ordered a bunch of import tooling (again, not proud, but something to start with is better than going into debt) 20-Dec-19 02:13 PM I have been considering a surplus grave stone for that. They sometimes mess up engravings and have "promotional units". A tad morbid but would be massive and good for vibration sensitive stuff. 20-Dec-19 02:30 PM "promotional units" 20-Dec-19 02:30 PM buy one gravestone, get one free :v 20-Dec-19 02:30 PM family pack :v 20-Dec-19 02:30 PM Black Friday Discount :V 20-Dec-19 02:32 PM Nothing wrong with import tooling or machines IMO. I take the perspective of Gotteswinter in that I see the machines as a kit where they provide the basics and you finish it. 20-Dec-19 02:34 PM so long as you have decent machinery to finish it 20-Dec-19 02:34 PM some of it is just super simple stuff 20-Dec-19 02:34 PM I am looking to spend the extra $ on a decent magnetic chuck for the grinder 20-Dec-19 02:54 PM Well, if promotional can give you three grave stones, you can make them really flat with the correct grinding process. 20-Dec-19 03:23 PM so, yeah, starting to sketch an espresso machine 20-Dec-19 03:39 PM ... kf and conflat flanges... ?? 20-Dec-19 03:49 PM distillers use crappy discount KF flanges for their projects 21-Dec-19 12:14 AM You mean Tri-clamps? 21-Dec-19 12:15 AM Discount KF, tellin' ya. 21-Dec-19 12:28 AM And annoying enough it's based on imperial measurements 21-Dec-19 12:29 AM Now all we need is discount CF 21-Dec-19 12:43 AM XDDD 21-Dec-19 12:43 AM I think a discount CF might work against what we want from CF... 21-Dec-19 12:43 AM With that, I have to confess I did buy some triclamp pieces for the water vapor generator for the semiconductor oven. 21-Dec-19 12:44 AM They sure are a lot cheaper than KF 21-Dec-19 12:48 AM Totally. and for a simple water cup that could resist 200ºC, was enough. 21-Dec-19 07:44 PM I gave this espresso machine more though.. and sort of want to machine a torchoid geroter for it 21-Dec-19 07:44 PM more of a geroler, which appears to be a brand name/expired patent to Eaton 21-Dec-19 07:44 PM just makes forming the internal hypocycloidal easier by using hardened steel pins 21-Dec-19 08:23 PM .. are vacuum fittings good for pressure? I mean, it's basically a pressure differential any way you look at it, right? just one has internal vs external force 21-Dec-19 08:23 PM would be cute to do it all in 10mm conflat (or KF) 21-Dec-19 08:23 PM most people DIYing espresso machines use Swagelok stuff 21-Dec-19 08:37 PM Not espresso machine pressures 21-Dec-19 08:37 PM Maybe 1-2 bar tops 21-Dec-19 08:42 PM espresso needs 10 bar 21-Dec-19 08:43 PM Yeah, you'll want swagelok for that kind of overkill 21-Dec-19 08:43 PM shucks.. 21-Dec-19 09:02 PM i think if you go for sanitary fittings you might be able to get away with it 21-Dec-19 09:02 PM but threaded fittings are probably safer long term 21-Dec-19 09:11 PM HP lines on the diesel use ferrules with retaining screws 21-Dec-19 09:11 PM and in the service manual, states to replace them anytime you untighten them (one time use) 21-Dec-19 09:27 PM I think replacing the bolts has something to do with them lengthening, and thus the torque spec will be different if you wanted to reuse them 21-Dec-19 09:27 PM I seem to recall something like that for another automotive thing, maybe head bolts? 21-Dec-19 09:33 PM head bolts had a similar one-time-use spec, and torque setting was like 45 Nm + 30 degrees 22-Dec-19 10:40 AM Torque to yield bolts are not reusable for a different reason as deforming ferrules 22-Dec-19 10:40 AM The bolt in the sealing ferrules on the line is not going to be lengthened to a significant extent, but to reuse them you'd have to use a new ferrule so it bite into and seals against the line 22-Dec-19 10:40 AM Kinda like swagelok ferrules 22-Dec-19 12:14 PM that's what I was thinking.. like, can you reuse conflat knife edges at all? or very limitted? 22-Dec-19 12:14 PM probably not between different flanges, only the mated pair? 22-Dec-19 12:14 PM Reuse? 22-Dec-19 12:14 PM I pretend like I am a vacuum hacker 22-Dec-19 12:14 PM yeah, are the copper knife edges reusable? 22-Dec-19 12:15 PM They're not copper 22-Dec-19 12:15 PM umm.. I thought.. 22-Dec-19 12:15 PM The knife edges are stainless, the gasket is copper 22-Dec-19 12:15 PM hrmm 22-Dec-19 12:15 PM ohh 22-Dec-19 12:15 PM yeah, the gasket is what I mean 22-Dec-19 12:15 PM You can 22-Dec-19 12:15 PM If you align them well and apply more torque that is 22-Dec-19 12:15 PM But definetely not recommended 22-Dec-19 12:16 PM thats what I thought 22-Dec-19 12:16 PM i have been wondering, would annealing them also help? 22-Dec-19 12:16 PM Yes 22-Dec-19 12:16 PM It's recommended to anneal if you re-use 22-Dec-19 12:17 PM pretty simple to do that with just a propane torch 22-Dec-19 12:17 PM unless you are talking some giant gasket size 22-Dec-19 12:17 PM You can just go around slowly applying heat 22-Dec-19 12:17 PM Or pop it in the oven 22-Dec-19 12:18 PM if you have a heat treat oven, yeah 22-Dec-19 12:20 PM A regular toaster oven could work 22-Dec-19 12:21 PM you need like 750F/400C to anneal copper afaik 22-Dec-19 12:21 PM A toaster oven shoooooould get to 250-300ish if you don't plan on eating in it again 22-Dec-19 12:21 PM And then you kick it over with a torch 22-Dec-19 12:23 PM nichrome heating can easily get over 400 C 22-Dec-19 12:23 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0305-AF311.jpg 22-Dec-19 12:23 PM that was a test tube furnace thing I made 22-Dec-19 12:23 PM I'm actually thinking about making a mini kiln (I have a dozen kiln/refactory bricks) for heat treating.. but some of the hardening temps rival what nichrome can get up to 22-Dec-19 12:23 PM kanthal is relaly no better 22-Dec-19 12:23 PM stainless can also be used as a heating element.. has a bit higher melting point 22-Dec-19 12:23 PM but dunno about lifespan 22-Dec-19 12:23 PM my mother is a stained glass artist - I was at an expo one time talking to a bunch of kiln manufacturers and non of them varried voltage/current.. just ON/OFF (with a PID) - would be nice to smooth out temp variations more 22-Dec-19 12:23 PM oh, also, I'd need to quench... which sort of brings me to the idea of just sending out the tools to have heat treated in a proper inert/vacuum furnace with proper quenching, etc 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM But you do want to make all your tools and stuff yourself 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM heh 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM sighs... 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM yeah 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0306-E3386.jpg 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM btw, the front of that dohookie 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM basically bolted the wire to.. bolts.. and fed them through the brick, and to a DC PSU 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM since I dont have a contact welder netiher 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM that PSU and wires were actually underpowered.. but I still got over 700 C 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM melted glass, too 22-Dec-19 12:33 PM borosilcate 22-Dec-19 12:36 PM Building a bigger oven isn't too hard 22-Dec-19 12:36 PM nope, I have plenty of bricks, too 22-Dec-19 12:36 PM also, how large do I need 22-Dec-19 12:40 PM depends on what you want to do 22-Dec-19 12:40 PM for gaskets you can probably just get away with a stove 22-Dec-19 12:40 PM and a brick or two 22-Dec-19 12:41 PM such as, if my mag chuck for grinder is 150x450.. and I have a max of 300mm of height, well, that sort of gives me a good footprint to aim for 22-Dec-19 12:41 PM tool steel stuff 22-Dec-19 12:41 PM jigs, etc 22-Dec-19 12:43 PM that's a good size to aim for 22-Dec-19 12:43 PM yeah, if it's my max working envelope on the grinder 22-Dec-19 12:43 PM oh, I guess it is a universal grinder, so I could do long shafts 22-Dec-19 12:43 PM up to about a meter 22-Dec-19 12:44 PM There are practical limits to overkill 22-Dec-19 12:44 PM when do I transition from home shop to a setup up 22-Dec-19 12:44 PM also, isnt a SEM at home overkill? 22-Dec-19 12:44 PM It's perfectly acceptable overkill 22-Dec-19 12:44 PM a 1000x300x150 oven does seem like overkill 22-Dec-19 12:45 PM yeah, I dont think I would need a long shaft for anything.. just buy prehardeneed and do hard turning/grinding that I need 22-Dec-19 12:45 PM 450x150x300 seems decent enough 22-Dec-19 12:48 PM if you can afford the power to heat it 22-Dec-19 12:48 PM hah, yeah, I hear that 22-Dec-19 12:50 PM heating is cheap if you invest in the insulation 22-Dec-19 12:50 PM I could double layer the refactory bricks, not overlapping seams, etc 22-Dec-19 12:50 PM theoretically should only cost the specific energy capacity of the thing you're heating 22-Dec-19 12:50 PM vacuum chamber it for only IR losses :3 22-Dec-19 12:51 PM what pressure do "most"/common vacuum furnaces operate at? 22-Dec-19 12:51 PM standard roughing pump? 22-Dec-19 12:51 PM yes 22-Dec-19 01:22 PM there's no real true pressure difference between a roughing pump vacuum and absolute vacuum. 22-Dec-19 01:22 PM it's just a huge amount of effort & pain getting those last molecules out. 22-Dec-19 01:23 PM bloody molecules 22-Dec-19 03:17 PM kanthal (~1400C) is a lot better than nichrome (~1100)... 22-Dec-19 03:17 PM can get a furnace hot enough to heat treat tool steels with kanthal where nichrome would melt 22-Dec-19 03:31 PM hmmm# 22-Dec-19 03:31 PM need to do an induciton furnace 22-Dec-19 03:31 PM on graphite crucible :d 22-Dec-19 03:37 PM ohh, I hadnt looke dup the numbers from kanthal in a while 22-Dec-19 03:37 PM I knew it was slightly better, wasnt sure how much better 22-Dec-19 03:37 PM yeah, so either kanthal or a stainless would likely be fine for most purposes 22-Dec-19 03:37 PM also, no need to really [oil] quench if I only deal with A2 - which has been a thought to stay clear 22-Dec-19 03:37 PM or simply to make the process slightly easier.. anywho 22-Dec-19 03:37 PM did a little bit of maths on boiling water (for espresso) again 22-Dec-19 03:37 PM looking at some other tools steels (always sidetracked) apears no more th an 1200 C is needed 22-Dec-19 03:47 PM what crucible do they use for silicon and a lot of crystals? 22-Dec-19 03:47 PM platinum or iridium 22-Dec-19 03:49 PM wait 22-Dec-19 03:49 PM really 22-Dec-19 03:49 PM o.o 22-Dec-19 03:49 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/cz-growth-large-2E1AB.png 22-Dec-19 03:49 PM Iridium.. ouch $47k per kilo 22-Dec-19 03:53 PM the crucibles are usually very thin 22-Dec-19 03:53 PM maybe a few mm tops 22-Dec-19 03:54 PM for a lot of it you can get away with carbon though 22-Dec-19 03:55 PM i think there are also ceramic crucibles that get used fairly often for silicon but theyre generally single use 22-Dec-19 03:55 PM not sure what the exact material is though 22-Dec-19 03:56 PM yeah, silicon sticks 22-Dec-19 03:56 PM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crucible#/media/File:Czochralski_method_used_crucible_1.jpg 22-Dec-19 03:56 PM DIY ruby rod? 22-Dec-19 03:56 PM has anyone ever tried to DIY Czochralski's pulling process,? 22-Dec-19 03:59 PM im sure many people have thought about it but i have not seen anyone do it besides for very small amounts. growing your own laser rod would be a great project to dedicate 5-10 yrs on 22-Dec-19 03:59 PM if you can fund it haha 22-Dec-19 04:00 PM xD 22-Dec-19 04:05 PM look.... I do not need to make my own rubies... I do not need to make my own rubies.. I do not need to make my own rubies 22-Dec-19 04:05 PM and if I did... I would use a microwave 22-Dec-19 04:07 PM How can you make a single ruby crystal in a microwave? 22-Dec-19 04:08 PM magic 22-Dec-19 04:08 PM but I wonder if polycrystaline would work in the end 22-Dec-19 04:08 PM oh, a seed crystal would likely help 22-Dec-19 04:12 PM What? I don't think ruby crystal growth is as simple as just "heating it up and let it cool" 22-Dec-19 04:12 PM Unless what you are referring to is a ruby microwave maser? 22-Dec-19 04:12 PM Even then you can't make the crystal in a microwave 22-Dec-19 04:17 PM @Mason_Yu Challenge accepted. Using Microwave as part of furnace casing. 22-Dec-19 04:18 PM I have a lab microwave and looked a bit into sintering/whatever crystals.. there was a good one I read on I believe MgF optical quality ones 22-Dec-19 04:18 PM mayeb this ? I forget,, https://www.scirp.org/pdf/JMMCE20040200006_43173773.pdf 22-Dec-19 04:18 PM In order to obtain a fine microstructure while achieving full densification, an additional densification method, such as hot pressing, needs to be added 22-Dec-19 04:22 PM Oh sintered laser rods? That won't work as a lasing medium if there is no uniform lattice structure to speak of 22-Dec-19 04:22 PM You need very specialized ceramic sintering process for laser gain medium, usually a specific crystal structure is required 22-Dec-19 04:23 PM I forget why I looked into MgF.. 22-Dec-19 04:23 PM They call it Co-sintering I believe? 22-Dec-19 04:23 PM I have a feeling I wanted to use a thin coating for a photodiode 22-Dec-19 04:23 PM maybe LiF was on the list too 22-Dec-19 04:23 PM one of those, or maybe something else, I forget, had the lowest work function (ability/ease of an electron to leave the material and enter the vacuum).. for the electron gun 22-Dec-19 04:23 PM it's been a while since i looked into it though, and not sure where that notebook is 22-Dec-19 04:26 PM Making LiF atomically using Florine gas through a fine lithium powder 22-Dec-19 04:26 PM :3 22-Dec-19 04:27 PM no no no.. Lithium isoproxide (or whatever alkoxide) + dilute HF 22-Dec-19 04:27 PM oh? 22-Dec-19 04:27 PM muuuch easier 22-Dec-19 04:27 PM sooo 22-Dec-19 04:27 PM safer? 22-Dec-19 04:27 PM ... lamer. 22-Dec-19 04:27 PM yeah 22-Dec-19 04:27 PM lol 22-Dec-19 04:27 PM "I stare danger in the face.. and spit in it's eyes" 22-Dec-19 04:29 PM uses an RTG to boil water for coffee 22-Dec-19 04:29 PM somone said I should use Pu in another server 22-Dec-19 04:29 PM imagine if radiation didn't harm humans 22-Dec-19 04:29 PM w...what. 22-Dec-19 04:29 PM language block, really? 22-Dec-19 04:30 PM turned on by admins 22-Dec-19 04:30 PM >.> Why? 22-Dec-19 04:30 PM heh 22-Dec-19 04:30 PM work vs nsfw? 22-Dec-19 04:31 PM what company cares about language? :V 22-Dec-19 04:31 PM jeebus, we swear at work all the time. 22-Dec-19 04:31 PM It's not a company its a student group that also uses this 22-Dec-19 04:32 PM 12 year olds? :V 22-Dec-19 04:32 PM hey, some people here cant even drink 22-Dec-19 04:32 PM which country tho? :V 22-Dec-19 04:32 PM censorship! first amendment rights! REEE! 22-Dec-19 04:37 PM LiF has a work function of ~3.8eV, MgF of ~3.5eV - both in the UVA wavelength 22-Dec-19 04:37 PM I think that was initially what I was looking into 22-Dec-19 04:37 PM also, this talk could likely migrate elsewhere.. but yeah.. 22-Dec-19 04:37 PM the concept was something like a photodiode that has a LiF/MgF coated cathode/whatever at a voltage difference in a vacuum.. and yeah, shine UV at photodiode, get electrons to jump off 22-Dec-19 04:37 PM that will likely be my first real vacuum project.. is the photoelectric effect based electron gun 22-Dec-19 04:41 PM that's one hell of a project to make your first 22-Dec-19 04:42 PM oh, yeah, but it has a bit of chemistry -- which I like 22-Dec-19 04:42 PM I'd start by making a regular electron gun 22-Dec-19 04:42 PM also, I really dislike the idea of tungsten based thermionic electron gun 22-Dec-19 04:43 PM start with tungsten, progress to LaB6 22-Dec-19 04:44 PM meh... 22-Dec-19 05:27 PM finally got my machining stuff 22-Dec-19 05:27 PM slitting saw arbor, parallels, small machinist vise, end mill, centering bits, countersinks... 22-Dec-19 05:27 PM the vise actually isnt all too terrible, even if I need to refinish it myself (which may not be the case) .. not even a logo on it 22-Dec-19 06:29 PM yay, espresso machine fixed 22-Dec-19 07:28 PM https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1260359869/swissmak-the-mill-turn-center-for-your-machine-sho/description 22-Dec-19 07:28 PM Opinions on this "hobbyist" mill-turn machine? 22-Dec-19 07:28 PM I cannot find myself buying into the aluminum frame for rigidity and vibration, and the spindle just does not look beefy enough to take any heavy cuts 22-Dec-19 07:31 PM It was quite obviously designed by a designer, not an engineer. 22-Dec-19 07:32 PM He does claim it can cut steel, but I really think it will be a chattering nightmare unless it's a super light cut 22-Dec-19 07:33 PM I can cut steel on my 3040 linear rod router 22-Dec-19 07:33 PM (it's a chattering nightmare) 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM He's ditching ball screws for leadscrews, ditching traditional linear rails for boxways, and I think the price is still going to be ~6k all said and done 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM For that? Probably. 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM Impressive idea though 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM It's a subpar machine 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM For $6k you can buy a banged up Japanese full-size 5-axis milling center 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM (3+2 trunnion) 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM If the machine was built out of steel, I'd say it was worth having 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM But not out of soft aluminium with cantilevers such as these 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/b43474e731d9a9e907d72146de009a43_original-D12C3.png 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM All your load sits on that little circle 22-Dec-19 07:35 PM A lever load I should add 22-Dec-19 07:38 PM I don't think they've shipped a single machine yet and they're currently relocating their entire manufacturing operation to Taiwan 22-Dec-19 07:38 PM "we've had some unforeseen difficulties" 22-Dec-19 07:38 PM Trump's tariff lol 22-Dec-19 07:38 PM it's mostly metal 22-Dec-19 07:38 PM can't be much of a tariff 22-Dec-19 07:39 PM https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1260359869/swissmak-the-mill-turn-center-for-your-machine-sho/posts/2632350 22-Dec-19 07:39 PM They claim that was the main obstacle to buying material and components 22-Dec-19 07:40 PM ... which they already bought 22-Dec-19 07:40 PM (????) 22-Dec-19 07:40 PM on that note 22-Dec-19 07:40 PM https://www.robotdigg.com/product/1707/Pocket-or-desktop-5-axis-CNC-engraver 22-Dec-19 07:41 PM Yeah that's even more of a scam 22-Dec-19 07:41 PM RobotDigg made a better PocketNC for less money 22-Dec-19 07:41 PM lol 22-Dec-19 07:41 PM That's so tiny! 22-Dec-19 07:42 PM yup 22-Dec-19 07:42 PM would be great for making DIY turbos 22-Dec-19 07:42 PM Well I didn't see the price, but it's reasonable as a toy 22-Dec-19 07:42 PM just a cheaper PocketNC 22-Dec-19 07:42 PM Wait no 22-Dec-19 07:42 PM I saw the wrong price 22-Dec-19 07:43 PM but what do you expect, everything is cheaper in China 22-Dec-19 07:43 PM It's still not worth it 22-Dec-19 07:43 PM it's worth it if you're doing dental or something 22-Dec-19 07:43 PM Maybe, when the alternative is a million dollar metal 3D printer 22-Dec-19 07:43 PM And you're not a machinist 22-Dec-19 07:43 PM the alternative is a $200k 5-axis dental cnc machine 22-Dec-19 07:43 PM https://www.datron.com/products/cnc-milling-machines/c5/ 22-Dec-19 07:43 PM there's a dental version of this 22-Dec-19 07:43 PM but also, hot, want. 22-Dec-19 07:45 PM I feel that everytime I see a DMG-Mori promo vid lol 22-Dec-19 07:45 PM well, it's the name you go to when you have money and need a machine 22-Dec-19 07:45 PM DMG Mori for most stuff 22-Dec-19 07:45 PM Tornos for swiss 22-Dec-19 07:45 PM Kern for micromachining with hair thin endmills 22-Dec-19 07:45 PM Datron when you need a CNC router that can also hog out steel 22-Dec-19 07:50 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hF9Cq-jJ3xE 22-Dec-19 07:50 PM Damn, do they know how to make videos 22-Dec-19 07:51 PM Someone is paid very well to make them :P 22-Dec-19 07:51 PM Though this is something I could make in a few days 22-Dec-19 07:51 PM (a few days of work time, not a few working days) 22-Dec-19 08:11 PM dang that looks nice 22-Dec-19 10:27 PM I recall this swissmak thing, and yeah, built for a price point and not really engineered 22-Dec-19 10:29 PM I think he did put some quite serious consideration into the spindle design and layout of the machine, but I also think he over-estimated the rigidity of the framework and precision he can achieve 22-Dec-19 10:29 PM Not to mention how much of a pain 5-axis CAM can be, and programming on a mill-turn can take years of experience to do effectively 22-Dec-19 10:30 PM There is/was some talk about it (from the designer) on the ODrive forum as that's what he is/was(?) planning to use for his motion control and spindle motor drivers. 22-Dec-19 10:31 PM looking at the bit of land I am interested in to build out a shop (and house) upon graduating 22-Dec-19 10:31 PM I believe he also participates in the machining channel on the ODrive discord 22-Dec-19 10:32 PM would be super nice to build out a shop from the ground up 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM Indeed. I almost bought a "barndominium" that had a huge garage. Thinking it was on the order of 40x40ft. They wanted a bit too much for it and couldn't come to an agreement. Would've been nice though. 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM a few days ago they lowered the price of the lot again 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM looking to sell it, apparently 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM may ask my dad/brother to checkout the lot during xmas call or whatever 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM (this is across the country from where I currently am) 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM what kinda sucks is I looke dup school district stuff aorund there. and it''s city schools, and basically failing students, lol 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM good thing I dont have kids? 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM if I did, they would be sent elsewhere 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM private/charter/whatever 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM I have an art studio in downtown there, but I am fairly sure I dont want to comei nto the situation of running out fo space 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM would rather start from the ground up 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM or somethign that clearly wont be low on space 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM the studios that may be available to me as shop use are just about 1k sq ft 22-Dec-19 10:34 PM not enough 23-Dec-19 02:37 PM lol.... import tooling 23-Dec-19 02:37 PM the retaining nut with post on the lil toolmakers vise I just got... broke in half on the first tighten 23-Dec-19 02:37 PM I have some 12L14 on hand that I can turn a new one, but damn 23-Dec-19 02:37 PM minus one star, maybe two 23-Dec-19 02:37 PM I also need to make specific clamps for it, as my straps are a bit too large (or rather, the vise is too long) for my lil combo lathe/mill cross slide 23-Dec-19 02:37 PM but, did some first tests of milling, and seems to work 23-Dec-19 04:58 PM broken vise nut 23-Dec-19 04:58 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0770-1CB61.jpg 23-Dec-19 04:58 PM does not look like actual steel.. more like cast /sintered 23-Dec-19 04:58 PM will make a new one in a bit.. 23-Dec-19 05:01 PM probably cast chinesium steel that gets a quick machine finishing 23-Dec-19 05:01 PM thats some nasty grain structure in there 23-Dec-19 05:07 PM there is no structure 23-Dec-19 05:07 PM it looks like a ferrite inductor core that broke 23-Dec-19 11:28 PM I made the thing.. 23-Dec-19 11:28 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0782-C8E6E.jpg 23-Dec-19 11:28 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0783-51460.jpg 23-Dec-19 11:28 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0784-9F2FC.jpg 23-Dec-19 11:28 PM this was sketch.. 23-Dec-19 11:28 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0775-656D4.jpg 23-Dec-19 11:28 PM universal tool holder from the grinder mounted on the combo mill/lathe cross slide.. but it worked! 23-Dec-19 11:28 PM straped it down best I could as it has a nonstandard clamping thing (specifically for the grinder) 24-Dec-19 07:44 PM The yokes in those toolmakers vices are garbage. Ever since I got my first angle lock (Kurt style) vice the toolmakers vices just get used as clamping aids. 25-Dec-19 09:34 AM I have a grinder that it will be used on extensively, I feel 25-Dec-19 09:34 AM but yeah, just sintered something or other 26-Dec-19 09:45 AM i switched to HSS from carbide inserts for aluminum on my mini lathe and zomg my life has changed 26-Dec-19 09:49 AM just keep the edge honed nicely and HSS will eat aluminum 26-Dec-19 09:49 AM if you start seeing any sort of build up instead of nice cutting action its time for a hit with the stone 26-Dec-19 10:00 AM build up of what? i recently got this and have zero idea what i'm doing in general other than reading stuff online 26-Dec-19 10:02 AM on the work piece if you start getting a raised area where the aluminum is getting pushed instead of cut, thats what to watch for 26-Dec-19 10:02 AM same thing if it starts to just mush onto the tool instead of being cut 26-Dec-19 10:02 AM ahh 26-Dec-19 10:02 AM though that would suggest tool geometry issues 26-Dec-19 10:02 AM main thing i was trying to communicate is just to keep a nice sharp honed edge on your tool 26-Dec-19 10:02 AM thats the key to HSS cutting well 26-Dec-19 10:03 AM ahh, thanks 26-Dec-19 11:50 AM I learned the HSS bits I got were eaten by the 4142 (work hardened it after not too long).. I should have had/used carbide for that 26-Dec-19 11:50 AM still working on tooling up 26-Dec-19 11:50 AM also, I question if it is wise to tighten a ER25 collet/holder while in the mill 26-Dec-19 01:22 PM i have used HSS on 4140 before and it is a painful process involving a lot of trips to the grinder 26-Dec-19 01:22 PM gotta do what you gotta do sometimes tho heh 27-Dec-19 12:20 AM @samy I would suggest you try the DCGT, specific aluminium inserts (wich work for many other things too, I use them for stainless, for example) to reduce cutting pressure even more. For parting tools MGGN tools work wonderfully (both have very high rake angles) Of course they are less resilient than HSS tooling, and expensiver to some extent (I buy them in aliexpress, can't complain) BUT they give superb finish, repeatability, and no need to resharpen anything, wich is a nuisance for me. @GigaSquirrel can confirm this. 27-Dec-19 12:20 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-F3146.png 27-Dec-19 12:20 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-44015.png 27-Dec-19 12:20 AM MGGN: 27-Dec-19 12:20 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-F0BEA.png 27-Dec-19 01:04 AM confirms this 27-Dec-19 01:04 AM confirms his confirmation 27-Dec-19 01:18 AM I need to buy some inserts 27-Dec-19 01:18 AM Are there any alu inserts that consistently break chips? 27-Dec-19 01:18 AM Most of mine tend to make nice long cheese unless I get into the CNC ranges of feedrates, taking off a few mm per side on my poor benchtop lathe(which can handle it) 27-Dec-19 01:19 AM every insert is made to break chips at a certain feed and speed 27-Dec-19 01:19 AM But my heart can't take it 27-Dec-19 01:19 AM I need more machinist-friendly inserts 27-Dec-19 01:19 AM Rather than CNC-friendly 27-Dec-19 02:21 AM Of all the inserts I have used, I think I have never achieved true chip breaking. 27-Dec-19 02:21 AM As you say, because my heart can't take it. 27-Dec-19 02:21 AM I am not sure there is a particular insert that will do that for you at hobby speeds and feeds. 27-Dec-19 02:21 AM Without putting extreme cutting pressure, that is. 27-Dec-19 03:44 AM ahh cool 27-Dec-19 09:56 AM chip breaking is one of the reasons i like HSS for aluminum instead of carbide inserts 27-Dec-19 09:56 AM ive had issues with the inserts in the past where if you get any aluminum build up on them it will take some carbide with it and leave a nice chunk missing 27-Dec-19 09:56 AM but that doesnt happen super often 27-Dec-19 02:02 PM anyone played with neutral rakes for aluminum? 27-Dec-19 02:29 PM they work alright but you will run into more issues with aluminum building up on the carbide than the positive inserts 27-Dec-19 02:29 PM then it rips off chunks of the insert 27-Dec-19 02:29 PM good for finishing if you have a nice radius on the insert and a crisp edge 27-Dec-19 02:36 PM right now 6061 is what is chucked up in the vise, did my first cuts with standard HSS stuff the past few days, learning what works and what doesnt 27-Dec-19 02:36 PM first time ever cutting aluminum on a mill 27-Dec-19 03:45 PM current combo lathe/mill setup 27-Dec-19 03:45 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0788-D96D4.jpg 27-Dec-19 03:45 PM just a lil 50mm vise on there with a practice piece of 20x10mm 6061 27-Dec-19 03:45 PM I really want to get the makers stand plumbed up to a 5gal paint bucket (from my chemistry days is what I used) and load up the cutting fluid in there with a pump.. but I still need the backsplash (I need to have it made) 27-Dec-19 04:08 PM for milling you will want to stick with 2 flute endmills for most everything in aluminum and 4+ in steels 27-Dec-19 04:09 PM I havent really spec'd out cutters much, yet.. primarily because I have the tool & cutter grinder so the idea will be to make my own 27-Dec-19 04:09 PM if you are running it manually HSS endmills may be the best option as they handle inconsistent loading way better than carbide 27-Dec-19 04:09 PM but it's not yet in operational order 27-Dec-19 04:09 PM yeah, that's a manual machine, but I do have powerfeed in both directions if I want 27-Dec-19 04:09 PM actually interested in finding a clear cutting fluid.. the one I am currently using has a yellow tinge 27-Dec-19 04:09 PM and oil based, not water 27-Dec-19 04:12 PM i use mist on my mill a lot (never enough to obscure visibility) or just a well placed air stream to clear the chips without cutting fluid at all 27-Dec-19 04:12 PM where is your air compressor? I'd prefer to not have that noise near me 27-Dec-19 04:13 PM its in the front of my garage which my neighbors thankfully never complain about 27-Dec-19 04:13 PM its not super loud though 27-Dec-19 04:13 PM and does not cycle much 27-Dec-19 04:14 PM I think I'll stick with relatively low flow cutting oil 27-Dec-19 04:14 PM if the thing was entirely enclosed I would opt for high pressure 27-Dec-19 04:14 PM but I am fine flooding 27-Dec-19 04:14 PM flood just gets everywhere 27-Dec-19 04:14 PM frees up a hand + time of manually squiriting 27-Dec-19 04:16 PM you seem like you enjoy making your own stuff so you might do what i did and throw one of these together: https://fogbuster.com/Machining-Sprayer-Products.html 27-Dec-19 04:17 PM I've seen fogbusters on YT a bit 27-Dec-19 04:17 PM and yeah, my goal will be to make stuff 27-Dec-19 04:17 PM ive got that sort of setup as well as just a very fine 20-40psi air spray nozzle that i set up 27-Dec-19 04:17 PM more than just machining, but more so jigs for production 27-Dec-19 04:17 PM I have a few misting setups.. for my frogs 27-Dec-19 04:18 PM dont remember how thick the tube is but the air consumption is shockingly low for the chip clearing it gives 27-Dec-19 04:18 PM one was built from a KNF mini pump and a DC power supply 27-Dec-19 04:18 PM well the machining stuff takes the exact opposite approach than those 27-Dec-19 04:18 PM those are foggers (afaik?) 27-Dec-19 04:18 PM well, misters.. 27-Dec-19 04:19 PM you do not want to aerosolize your coolant, just make a spray of it that is a "mist" 27-Dec-19 04:19 PM I actually jsut had to replace a leaky connector 27-Dec-19 04:19 PM yeah, that's what this is 27-Dec-19 04:19 PM https://www.mistking.com/ 27-Dec-19 04:19 PM it nearly fogs, but it's still very directional 27-Dec-19 04:19 PM and I woudl suspect oil would coallesce more 27-Dec-19 04:19 PM but still.. I think flood coolant would be better in a home shop over misting due to aerosolizing 27-Dec-19 04:31 PM I realy need to contact a local sheet metal bender and have them make my backsplash for me 27-Dec-19 04:34 PM the idea of the fogbuster style stuff is that it is small droplets carried by the air but not so small that they aerosolize and get into your air, it takes a bit of tuning with the air pressure/tube size but i do not have any issues with coolant getting into the air thankfully 27-Dec-19 05:10 PM When making a TIG weld on stainless steel vacuum component, is it possible to “gap fill” a mm or two ? Like a 19mm OD tube into a 21mm ID hole. It would really be better to have tight tolerances right 27-Dec-19 05:38 PM With filler it's possible 27-Dec-19 11:29 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtVz2GH8w_A 28-Dec-19 02:25 AM @Noxz !!! Will you be able to make small carbide cutters with a particular taper profile? 28-Dec-19 02:25 AM If so, we have to talk. 28-Dec-19 02:25 AM I will eventually graduate to carbide 28-Dec-19 02:25 AM And taper in what sense, like drills and taps (that have a smaller diameter towards the shank to allow for easier non chattering follow) 28-Dec-19 02:28 AM No, a 2/3° taper towards the front, to mill a tapered hole with a particular diameter, single flute. 28-Dec-19 02:28 AM I want to make an ink pen for my gf, and I want to use a particular ink feeder wich is tapered. 28-Dec-19 02:28 AM On a titanium body. 28-Dec-19 02:29 AM Ohh, i see what you are saying 28-Dec-19 02:29 AM Heheheh 28-Dec-19 02:29 AM Goood 28-Dec-19 02:29 AM Like a ferrule connection 28-Dec-19 02:29 AM Tapered 28-Dec-19 02:29 AM Yeah. 28-Dec-19 02:29 AM The angle is small. 28-Dec-19 02:30 AM And ypu want that anglw in thw cutyer vs uaing a compound slide to set the angle 28-Dec-19 02:30 AM Exactly. 28-Dec-19 02:31 AM switching to computer to type better.. I was 5ft away 28-Dec-19 02:31 AM and you want to mill, not use a lathe? 28-Dec-19 02:31 AM So I can make the hole with the drilling head, instead of moving the rest. 28-Dec-19 02:31 AM Nono, that's for the lathe. 28-Dec-19 02:31 AM And the cutter is more like a reamer 28-Dec-19 02:31 AM just without setting the angle on a compound, okay 28-Dec-19 02:31 AM right 28-Dec-19 02:32 AM I will predrill it, then use that to get the finished angle 28-Dec-19 02:32 AM yeah, that ctually wouldn't be too difficult 28-Dec-19 02:32 AM How expnsive do you think it could get? 28-Dec-19 02:32 AM In very broad terms 28-Dec-19 02:32 AM but you cant hold me to any timeline 28-Dec-19 02:32 AM umm... 28-Dec-19 02:32 AM Oh, NEVER 28-Dec-19 02:33 AM what is the rough large diameter? 28-Dec-19 02:33 AM The max diameter is...6mm or so. 28-Dec-19 02:33 AM oh.. the carbide blank for it would be relatively cheap - if it is brazed onto a steel shank 28-Dec-19 02:33 AM ie, boring bar 28-Dec-19 02:34 AM Lets just make it full carbide. 28-Dec-19 02:34 AM or if you use certain inserts, maybe foring it to work on those 28-Dec-19 02:34 AM (I'm looking at carbide prices) 28-Dec-19 02:34 AM Well, no need to overthink it right now, just wanted to let you know I am interested in it. 28-Dec-19 02:35 AM k, stay tuned for when I get the grinder up and running 28-Dec-19 02:35 AM Will do! 28-Dec-19 02:35 AM 28-Dec-19 02:37 AM depends on how we go about it, but may be as cheap as ~$25 worth of carbide (maybe even less) .. but that seems like a decent estimate of materials on a first-no-experience-glance 28-Dec-19 02:37 AM which is the price for 1/4" diameter x 6" long rod.. so like 6+mm x 150mm 28-Dec-19 02:37 AM but, could be far less if small is all that is needed.. instead of using cross slide there may be the possibility to use the tailstock 28-Dec-19 02:37 AM but yeah, I dont really see anything wrong with the need 28-Dec-19 02:37 AM I may get into making pens at some point.. the engine turning machine I am looking at used to be in a pen factory in Geneve 28-Dec-19 10:37 AM Well, once you get confident, we can just throw money at it and see what happens (I should have a job by then) 28-Dec-19 10:37 AM XD 28-Dec-19 11:33 AM it shoulddn't require much of anything, just need to decide the format, and I will likely be stocking up on blanks at that point 28-Dec-19 12:26 PM Btw, I have plenty of broken carbide endmills, do you want them for test purposes? (not the reamer, just for your trial and error learning) 28-Dec-19 01:40 PM I have a few broken drills I could use.. they dont really look like carbide so I question what it was labelled as, may just be HSS 28-Dec-19 01:40 PM I also chewed through some HSS endmills on my first go at my setup, so I need to resharpen them 30-Dec-19 08:05 PM @GigaSquirrel I know you pointed me toward j99 spark plugs as feed throughs at one point, the thread was m14x2 on those right? (Or what tap drill size do I need for them I guess) 31-Dec-19 01:04 AM The thread on almost any given spark plug is M14x1.25; the internet seems to be on a disagreement on whether it needs a 12 or 12.8 mm hole, but from experience I can say that 13 mm is too big. 31-Dec-19 01:22 AM Bore diameter for tapping will differ based on your desired full-thread percentage, which will differ based on your materials (stock and fastener) 31-Dec-19 01:22 AM ~65% is sane for most purposes. Given the application I would go 75% and be very patient. 75% of full-thread for a 1.25 pitch, 14mm major dia fastener comes out to 12.78 hole size. Honestly I would just google a tap/drill size chart and go by that. 31-Dec-19 01:30 AM I did that, but this is where the disagreement starts 31-Dec-19 01:30 AM doesn't matter imo 31-Dec-19 01:30 AM since there isn't any mechanical load on the thread 31-Dec-19 01:33 AM still matters fitment wise I think. E.g full thread, less leak 31-Dec-19 01:34 AM ah, I just filled the whole thread with epoxy 31-Dec-19 01:34 AM or how much ptfe or whatever you wanna use hehe 31-Dec-19 01:34 AM https://gigabecquerel.wordpress.com/2019/06/02/quick-n-dirty-vacuum-feedthrough/ 31-Dec-19 01:34 AM fill 'er with epoxy - rules to live by 31-Dec-19 01:34 AM I hear the pro's attach a rod to the electrodes and hook it up to their minivan's distributor and just weld the threads shut using its own arc 31-Dec-19 12:24 PM pretty lame, but simply soldered the leads on this time.. did this test before, but never actually interfaced (plus I have another caliper on hand, so I could actually hack on this one..) 31-Dec-19 12:24 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0803-DCDC5.jpg 31-Dec-19 12:24 PM talk about el-cheapo 31-Dec-19 12:24 PM anywho, LSB first 31-Dec-19 12:24 PM there is cheapo thoughts about doing like BLE (I have some decent all-in-one module chips for it) to an android tablet 31-Dec-19 05:09 PM hah, finally got some carbide end mills, already broke the 5mm on some 4142 test peice.. I think I have a problem with reduced diameter cutters, ie, that had a 6mm shank and it broke pretty near the reduction... but also... it's a lathe/mill combo, and even with the X direction "locked" with screw feed, there is sometimes backlash in those gears that get taken up during cutting.. then all of a sudden the whole carriage moves a visible amount..it's a pretty bad issue - and still thinking ways to solve it, such as an adaptable X slide which leadnut/ballscrew is relatively easy to attach/detach and simply use a different feed mechanism than the rack-pinion/screw cutting 31-Dec-19 06:36 PM on a manual mill like that you should only ever be running one axis at once, keep the other locked 31-Dec-19 06:36 PM and never climb cut 31-Dec-19 06:36 PM also...was at a guy's shop today picking up an ebay impulse buy and got to see his really nice optical shop, had a 4' diameter cast iron lapping machine he uses to make optical flats, mirrors, and lenses 31-Dec-19 07:31 PM hah, nice! 31-Dec-19 07:31 PM the point about the combo machine though, is you cant really lock it 31-Dec-19 07:31 PM I can tighten the gibs in the Y direction, but I dont think so in the X 31-Dec-19 07:31 PM it's rack-pinion style there, as it's a lathe.. so the idea is actually to figure out mounting out a 'zero' backlash ballscrew to it 31-Dec-19 07:31 PM but yeah, there isnt really a way to specifically lock it 31-Dec-19 07:31 PM I have some idea based on the Y direction leadscrew from the grinder.. it was basically cantilevered and was pretty easy to attach/detach 31-Dec-19 07:31 PM I have a few ballsccrews laying around, so could potentially rig something up as an example, and then just get the proper length desired after 31-Dec-19 07:31 PM I have a feeling the one smaller ballscrew I have I specifically got a thicker one for Z axis travel... will dig through the garrage for the box of them (+linear bearings) tomorrow 31-Dec-19 07:31 PM again though, there isn't a real lock-out.. and I completely dissagree with tightening gibs(even from a locking nut).. again from the grinder I may borrow the X direction brake idea as it was pretty simple 31-Dec-19 07:43 PM maybe that should be a first project, some way to lock the ways 31-Dec-19 07:43 PM if you try to make any ambitious cuts you will really need that or things will walk all over the place on you 31-Dec-19 07:43 PM no need to put in all the work for a ball screw conversion 31-Dec-19 07:43 PM better uses of your time if you are mindful about keeping things conventional cuts 31-Dec-19 07:45 PM I do have a swiss jig borer waiting for me back east.. that certainly has proper lockouts 31-Dec-19 07:45 PM but, jig borers should not mill 31-Dec-19 07:45 PM they commonly do not have uplift protection 31-Dec-19 07:45 PM honestly though, I do not know what the ways are configured as, may be box.. likely need a full rebuild anywho 31-Dec-19 07:45 PM I havent actually seen it in person, but a buddy checked it out for me and said to go for it 31-Dec-19 07:45 PM anywho, so this is the mill I got now.. 31-Dec-19 07:47 PM yeah the combo machine you have is a good learning machine 31-Dec-19 07:47 PM wouldnt sweat anything until you start running into the practical limits of it 31-Dec-19 07:48 PM one reason I would swap over to a detachable ballscrew is because the handwheel travels quite fast on the carriage 31-Dec-19 07:48 PM yeah, nothing will just be told to me, I gotta push it, of capabilities more than just load 31-Dec-19 07:49 PM can you stick a handwheel on the leadscrew and use that to drive the X 31-Dec-19 07:49 PM the milling head could be removed and installed onto an XY table.. (it was actually sold as such, known as the Emco FB2) 31-Dec-19 07:50 PM just scrolled up to look at the photo again 31-Dec-19 07:50 PM I should be able to.. you can push the carriage with your hand 31-Dec-19 07:50 PM so, it wouldnt bind up 31-Dec-19 07:50 PM especially with decent force 31-Dec-19 07:50 PM that solves the feed issue but you still will want to find a way to lock it... 31-Dec-19 07:50 PM gravity even makes it "fall" down if the table were tilted 31-Dec-19 07:50 PM maybe just clamps opposite sides on the saddle to the underside of the ways 31-Dec-19 07:50 PM pretty janky tho 31-Dec-19 07:51 PM well, with "mechanical advantage" of a lead screw.. 31-Dec-19 07:51 PM it -somewhat- self locks 31-Dec-19 07:51 PM yeah, there's some backlash, but meh 31-Dec-19 07:51 PM yeah what i am telling you to avoid is vibration induced "walking" 31-Dec-19 07:51 PM yeah, what is currently happening is more extreme than that 31-Dec-19 07:51 PM things will turn and move on their own which is not good 31-Dec-19 07:51 PM yeah whats happening now is just you have to not climb cut 31-Dec-19 07:52 PM more of jumping 31-Dec-19 07:52 PM i think 31-Dec-19 07:52 PM hrmm 31-Dec-19 07:52 PM like you crank into the cut and then it grabs the work 31-Dec-19 07:52 PM thats from climb cuts 31-Dec-19 07:52 PM not great on manual mills besides very small finish cuts 31-Dec-19 07:53 PM I think it's not just climb, but going from climb to conventional to climb 31-Dec-19 07:53 PM imo you should try to only conventional mill if at all possible 31-Dec-19 07:53 PM plan your operations around that 31-Dec-19 07:53 PM yeah, simply getting used to the mill 31-Dec-19 07:53 PM climb cut only when necessary 31-Dec-19 07:53 PM getting a feel for it 31-Dec-19 07:53 PM and materials 31-Dec-19 07:54 PM yeah just wanted to hammer that home to save you endmills and frustration 31-Dec-19 07:54 PM I am fine breaking a bunch of bits, but the issue is somewhere else 31-Dec-19 07:54 PM it's part of learning 31-Dec-19 07:54 PM with a learning curve that is about like / any leg up helps with machining stuff 31-Dec-19 07:55 PM Depends on the rigidity of your machine, tightness of the gibs, quill runout, etc etc. but the biggest variable on climb cut overbite is the material you are cutting 31-Dec-19 07:55 PM tool pull out will be another thing but that is more of a learn by doing problem 31-Dec-19 07:55 PM hrm, just thought of a tailstock like thing to connect to he carriage for replacing the rack-pinion during milling 31-Dec-19 07:55 PM I'll look into all this more.. but yeah, would rather mod this to make it work as I dont really have the space here to stick a mill in 31-Dec-19 07:55 PM there is one other moderatly big machine I may be getting, but it's for decoration stuff 31-Dec-19 07:55 PM (before I move back east) 31-Dec-19 07:55 PM oh.. also.. carbide does not need coolant.. its more for cooling the actual work piece + chip evacuation, right? 31-Dec-19 07:55 PM like you arent going to thermally shock/temper carbide any time soon 31-Dec-19 07:58 PM Depends. Generally you do not need coolant for 12L14 or other soft stuff. If you are cutting tool steel you still need to flood 31-Dec-19 07:58 PM And you should probably be using ti coated or carbide anyways 31-Dec-19 07:59 PM to keep it from work/temperature hardening? 31-Dec-19 07:59 PM To keep it from sticking to the tool 31-Dec-19 07:59 PM I was cutting some 4142 earlier 31-Dec-19 07:59 PM ah 31-Dec-19 07:59 PM pre-annealed 31-Dec-19 08:00 PM the main thing with carbide is chip evacuation 31-Dec-19 08:00 PM yeah, too brittle that large chips will kill it 31-Dec-19 08:00 PM ideally you will be cutting hard enough to put the heat into the chips 31-Dec-19 08:00 PM yeah, I wasnt pushing it hard enough to turn them blue, yet 31-Dec-19 08:00 PM they should come off and turn blue/gold 31-Dec-19 08:00 PM as I said, still getting used to it wll.. I only got the carbide endmills today 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM but thats mostly something to look for with cnc feed/speeds 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM i mostly deal with cnc stuff 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM I can configure powerfeed (through the lathe) 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM and try to avoid jobs in steel heh 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM hah 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM well, I cant do that 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM mostly do aluminum/plastic 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM I cut aluminum first, actually, as it was still inthe vise 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM went like butter 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM 4142? Were you like using a piece off of tool or something? Kinda tough stuff to work with. Usually forged and ground to shape 31-Dec-19 08:01 PM yeah i love machining it, jobs go so fast 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM I do not like ths smell of Aluminum being cut, though 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM only times i really machine steel is when im making tools or people pay extra 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM pre-ground annealed 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM Continuous cast brass or bronze is like machine therapy. Hahaha 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM 4142.. I have a foot of 0.5x1" 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM what smell? 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM 6061 seems to have a smell 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM what were you using as lube/coolant? 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM might be that 31-Dec-19 08:02 PM AW-46 when I need to 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM metals dont really have a smell 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM Never noticed it being any different than other aluminum in smell. 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM no, it certianly is a distinct smell when I cut Al 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM in comparison to the steel 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM Oh metals defiantly have smells 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM I actually know the chemical which gives the metal smell/taste 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM well the oils/cutting fluids/etc have smells but not the metals themselves 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oct-1-en-3-one 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM Usually the problem I have with aluminum is turning it on the lathe and cutoff chatter 31-Dec-19 08:03 PM maybe the aluminum youre cutting has mill funk on it 31-Dec-19 08:04 PM yeah, maybe.. came from onlinemetals 31-Dec-19 08:04 PM when i go to my metal place locally that i get rems i always wear gloves otherwise my hands end up black 31-Dec-19 08:04 PM It’s probably got a water based protectant on it. Give it a wash next time before you cut it 31-Dec-19 08:04 PM oh, time to turn off froggy lights, going to glance over the lathe again just to refresh my mind.. 31-Dec-19 08:05 PM could also be paint if it was near one of the ends 31-Dec-19 08:05 PM I make a habit of biting everything with brake cleaner then soap and water before clamping and chucking. Makes life easier 31-Dec-19 08:07 PM depends what im doing but usually i do not clean up stock 31-Dec-19 08:07 PM just the parts at various stages of work 31-Dec-19 08:07 PM so.. there is this post thing on the carriage I may want to use.. looking through the manual to see if it has a use.. maybe for the taper turning attachment 31-Dec-19 08:07 PM maybe a locating pin for the grinding attachment 31-Dec-19 08:07 PM manual didnt point anything out 31-Dec-19 08:07 PM oh wow, basically my machine but with the backsplash on ebay.. https://www.ebay.com/itm/EMCO-MAXIMAT-SUPER-11-LATHE-W-VERTICAL-MILLING-HEAD-2-CHUCKS-TOOL-POST-MORE/303421301692?hash=item46a551a3bc:g:cvcAAOSwXIheBm0g 31-Dec-19 08:07 PM that looks to be in rough shape though 31-Dec-19 08:07 PM some of those attachments are real nice/expensive 31-Dec-19 08:17 PM i need to get a bigger lathe...someday 31-Dec-19 08:17 PM ive got two small ones at the moment that i am constantly pushing to and beyond their limits haha 31-Dec-19 08:17 PM and its an hour drive + diesel for the generator to use my friend's lathe... 31-Dec-19 08:33 PM @Noxz one of my best purchases was a d-bit style tool cutter/grinder. I use primarily carbide insert tooling but when I dont plan my passes properly and need a real shallow cut I fall back to hss and being able to just whip up whatever-you-need is huge. Especially when running a fair amount of parts when you can make a form tool, etc. They're great machines in general and dont take up much space. Has made my lathe work substantially more productive and less aggravating. 31-Dec-19 08:34 PM I'm able to do everything it can do with my tool grinder 31-Dec-19 08:34 PM but, not as freindly 31-Dec-19 08:34 PM still - very capable 31-Dec-19 08:35 PM I'm looking forward to getting this deposition situation sorted out and start playing with cutting tool coatings!! 31-Dec-19 08:36 PM ah, nice 31-Dec-19 08:37 PM that would be a cool thing to be able to do on demand 31-Dec-19 08:40 PM looked through the manual and parts manual, and all I have is a name of 'groved pin' for the thing on the carriage, and no other reference 31-Dec-19 08:40 PM got a photo? 31-Dec-19 08:41 PM lemme snag one.. excuse the crummy lense.. 31-Dec-19 08:41 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0804-80420.JPG 31-Dec-19 08:41 PM wow, that is a terrible photo 31-Dec-19 08:41 PM I actually almost wonder if it is a 'stop' to inhibit hitting the tailstock base or something 31-Dec-19 08:41 PM or rather, to hit a very specific spot 31-Dec-19 08:41 PM (the pin is between the two rails) 31-Dec-19 08:41 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/cross_slide-537A7.jpg 31-Dec-19 08:41 PM number 29.. doesnt connect to anything 31-Dec-19 08:41 PM I'm more so looking at it as a point of attachment 31-Dec-19 08:53 PM oh that is odd 31-Dec-19 08:53 PM just a bumper? 31-Dec-19 08:53 PM yeah thats what i was typing 31-Dec-19 08:53 PM like a physical end stop 31-Dec-19 08:53 PM to keep from crashing the saddle 31-Dec-19 08:54 PM That is usually a threaded hole for clamping the carriage, err crosslide via compressing the gib. Weird. 31-Dec-19 08:56 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0805-7E90F.JPG 31-Dec-19 08:56 PM slapped the tailstock on there.. seems like yeah, bumps right there 31-Dec-19 08:56 PM physical stop it is 31-Dec-19 08:56 PM Yea since it's on the actual saddle, too, I'd say you're right 31-Dec-19 08:57 PM so, keeps the carriage from coming off during power feeding away from the headstock 31-Dec-19 08:57 PM so long as teh tailstock is on there 31-Dec-19 08:58 PM I imagine you'd hit thread end or feed rod support prior! 31-Dec-19 08:58 PM thread end sounds like a rougher bump 31-Dec-19 08:59 PM Indeed 31-Dec-19 08:59 PM and.. because of where the half nut is, you'll actually hit the screw + power feed shaft supporting bracket (bearings) before you reach the end 31-Dec-19 08:59 PM which is one reason they also have an aluminum/whatever shear pin for screw cutting 31-Dec-19 08:59 PM for crashes 31-Dec-19 08:59 PM anywho... yeah, just looking at "non usefull" things I could tap onto 05-Jan-20 01:00 PM ugh i really cannot part off on my mini lathe 05-Jan-20 01:00 PM aluminum binds up every time, motors stops, part sometimes gets shifted in chuck 05-Jan-20 02:12 PM how sharp is the cut off tool? 05-Jan-20 02:12 PM may need a new grind 05-Jan-20 02:12 PM and make sure it's running perfectly parallel/perpendicular on the cross slide 05-Jan-20 02:31 PM i grinded the top edge before using, but honestly i've only recently gotten a lathe and have just been learning for youtube so i could be doing things totally wrong 05-Jan-20 02:31 PM i also flattened the tool post to the chuck to get it as parallel as possible 05-Jan-20 02:51 PM how mini is the mini lathe? 05-Jan-20 03:24 PM after grinding the top of a cut off blank, you may need to touch up the front face, which is actually the only place you really should grind after flattening the top .. also make sure your back releif has enough clearance, that it's "choked" up in the holder to the point where you can get get the radius, is at center height.. etc 05-Jan-20 03:24 PM I actually only recently got some cut off blades and they performed decently well, but, I still have some work to do on them 05-Jan-20 03:24 PM you may need to hold the hand wheel for the X/table direction as your part off, it may be trying to walk on you 05-Jan-20 03:24 PM unless you have a way to lock it, holding it still is about the best you can get 05-Jan-20 03:24 PM the part shifting in the chuck almost says you are rubbing on the side, possibly due to walking 05-Jan-20 03:24 PM because you should have no axial load when parting, only radial 05-Jan-20 04:09 PM i think the advice for his lathe might depend on how big or small it is... and the diameter of the work he is trying to part 05-Jan-20 04:09 PM on most all lathes that could be described as "mini" you will really want to stick with HSS for almost everything aluminum (imo) 05-Jan-20 04:09 PM and you want sharper cut off tools than you think with fairly delicate geometries as you get smaller 05-Jan-20 04:09 PM flat cut off tools are not great for small aluminum stuff... really want a hook shape to get nice rolled chips that will not bind up in the groove 05-Jan-20 04:09 PM just my experience tho 05-Jan-20 04:19 PM And always remember to set cut-off tool height properly 05-Jan-20 04:19 PM @LRM 7x14 (Grizzly G0765) 05-Jan-20 04:23 PM what diameter are you trying to part off? 05-Jan-20 04:23 PM @Noxz i lock the carriage handwheel (though it has some slop) and hold the compound rest handwheel since i have seen it move a little...and 2nd hand slowly moves the cross slide handwheel. is there a shape you found best for the tool? 05-Jan-20 04:23 PM i think you might just have bad tool geometry...unless you are trying to part something huge 05-Jan-20 04:23 PM OR you need to relieve your cuts more to cut down on the tool getting sandwiched 05-Jan-20 04:24 PM @LRM i was trying to cut 35mm aluminum stock, it bound up 5+ times while doing it, then i just sawed off the other half -- was trying at both 2000RPM and 1000RPM on low gear 05-Jan-20 04:25 PM that is at the larger range of what those lathes are capable of effectively working 05-Jan-20 04:25 PM you definitely will need to plan to cut around 1.5x the width of the cut off tool for those kind of depths in my experience 05-Jan-20 04:25 PM otherwise any little chip that binds up at the deeper cuts will cause either your tool to break or the lathe to bind up and stop 05-Jan-20 04:27 PM just go in 1mm at a time, back out, go back in slightly offset? 05-Jan-20 04:27 PM you could probably be more aggressive than 1mm at a time but that is exactly the idea 05-Jan-20 04:27 PM i see 05-Jan-20 04:28 PM also, some tape that will not leave adhesive residue on the compound rest dials can save you some work holding onto that 05-Jan-20 04:28 PM just have to watch to make sure there is no vibration induced movement 05-Jan-20 04:29 PM @samy get the cutoff inserts I told you, they will cut the aluminium very easily. 05-Jan-20 04:33 PM @Nixie sorry, i didn't see that, have link? 05-Jan-20 04:33 PM @LRM ahh good idea 05-Jan-20 04:37 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Screenshot_20200106-013629-10E87.png 05-Jan-20 04:37 PM thoughts on upgrading the motor, will that help turn faster in general? i've upgraded the gears to metal and the motor pulley broke the other day so upgraded to a better version. it's been a lot of fun but wish i could make parts a bit faster 05-Jan-20 04:37 PM MGGN inserts 05-Jan-20 04:37 PM Is yours a brushless or brushed one? @samy 05-Jan-20 04:37 PM @Deleted User brushed 05-Jan-20 04:38 PM I have a brushed one too 05-Jan-20 04:38 PM I'd upgrade to a servo motor 05-Jan-20 04:38 PM @Nixie thanks! 05-Jan-20 04:38 PM why did you "upgrade" the gears? those are meant to be the failure point if you ever really screw something up afaik... 05-Jan-20 04:38 PM Yeah that's also a point 05-Jan-20 04:38 PM Plastic is quieter and will fail before destroying your lathe 05-Jan-20 04:38 PM I'd also ditch the gears and replace it with an electronic leadscrew but that costs serious money 05-Jan-20 04:39 PM if you do not have space for a bigger lathe at all...go as far as you want to with upgrading the little lathe 05-Jan-20 04:39 PM if you DO have space for a bigger one i would not bother 05-Jan-20 04:39 PM lot better options to pour money into out there 05-Jan-20 04:39 PM the 7x10/7x14/7x21 lathes are amazing starter/learning lathes and can be great machines if you take everything apart and spend a few hours tuning everything up 05-Jan-20 04:39 PM but they will never be rigid enough to do many things 05-Jan-20 04:40 PM i'll need a mill next...small CNCs can't do much for newer projects i'm working on 05-Jan-20 04:41 PM There's a Russian dude that made an amazing upgrade video @LRM 05-Jan-20 04:41 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w-OHSqLpHo 05-Jan-20 04:41 PM not sure if i have seen it but I have had a 7x10 for using and abusing for more than 15 yrs at this point 05-Jan-20 04:42 PM Only automatic subtitles, but even without audio it's really neat to watch 05-Jan-20 04:42 PM i do things on it that i would never admit to haha 05-Jan-20 04:42 PM Dude upgrades it an order of magnitude in terms of accuracy and rigidity 05-Jan-20 04:42 PM crimes against machining and all lathe kind...except the chinesium cast stuff 05-Jan-20 04:42 PM did he do the granite epoxy fill of the base and everything? 05-Jan-20 04:43 PM Nope 05-Jan-20 04:43 PM will check out the video in a few mins 05-Jan-20 04:43 PM @samy if you need CNC stuff done as one offs and it does not require any crazy work holding i might be able to help out 05-Jan-20 04:43 PM but your stuff might require more fine tuning than shopping it out to someone else would allow, not sure 05-Jan-20 04:45 PM @LRM i appreciate it! i'm pretty bad at planning and more likely to actually work on things if i'm able to do the project but i may hit you up if there are specific things 05-Jan-20 04:45 PM for example was making KF16 to NPT 1/4" yesterday and didn't have a great way to give the NPT side a hex shape...just sanded two sides so i could grab on with something 05-Jan-20 04:50 PM wow this guy went through all the trouble of scraping the ways and everything? thats way more than i would probably do these days even if it was a great learning experience when i was a lot younger 05-Jan-20 04:50 PM have done it on some bigger stuff since then and tiny stuff is just a nightmare in comparison 05-Jan-20 04:50 PM using the 123 blocks as clamps is amusing too 05-Jan-20 05:06 PM surprised me he didnt do the mod where you put a thin plate over the gearing in the apron to keep chips out 05-Jan-20 05:06 PM that is one of the most essential mods in my opinion 05-Jan-20 05:12 PM Well, he did upgrade the machine from the lowest precision class to the special high precision class 05-Jan-20 05:12 PM The best you can get in Russia, pretty equivalent to ISO 05-Jan-20 05:23 PM definitely an impressive tune up for sure, did not intend to come across like i was knocking his work! 07-Jan-20 09:36 AM I am frankensetining a new rear axel for my bicycle.. th old freehub body broke (bearing exploded) and I am using other freehubs I have on hand, so need ot interface them.. Drive side done, now onto non-drive side and should go quick enough 07-Jan-20 09:36 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0905-7D98A.jpg 07-Jan-20 05:04 PM bike worked great! rock solid! 07-Jan-20 05:04 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0909-EF3C6.jpg 07-Jan-20 05:06 PM nice Noxz! 07-Jan-20 05:18 PM was able to crank one out in ~5hrs of work (part of that is no DRO, and inch machine with metric measurements).. instead of waiting a week and paying $75 for a new one.. the inner race of the old bearing is actually seized on th eold axel, will need to stick it in the lathe and turn it off 07-Jan-20 05:20 PM ahh nice 07-Jan-20 05:20 PM what machine is that in the bg? 07-Jan-20 05:21 PM the lathe is an Emco Maximat Super 11 with the milling head - same type (minus milling) as Stefan Gotteswinter on youtube 07-Jan-20 05:21 PM to the right is a Strausak 57U Universal Tool & Cutter Grinder that is not yet in operation - but nearly there!.. and in the back corner is a covered 600x900x75mm granite surface plate on proper stand 07-Jan-20 05:21 PM that's basically all the "toolroom" is right now 07-Jan-20 05:21 PM k, dog walking time 07-Jan-20 05:31 PM ahh very cool 07-Jan-20 05:31 PM i'd like to add DRO to the mini lathe 08-Jan-20 12:49 AM Question: Can I use diffusion pump oil to lubricate micro bearings inside the vacuum chamber? 08-Jan-20 12:49 AM (that is, get micro bearings, strip them clean of anything (grease, oil, whatever) then oil them with that, so they don't rust between jobs. 08-Jan-20 06:13 AM how micro are we talking about? and will it live in the vac chamber or ou tin the real world? 08-Jan-20 07:09 AM live in the vac chamber, 3x1x1 and 5x2x2 bearings for my manipulator arm inside the chamber. 08-Jan-20 07:09 AM (but it will have extended periods of time not at vacuum) 08-Jan-20 11:48 AM I would go with a dry MoS2 08-Jan-20 11:49 AM Why lubricate at all? 08-Jan-20 11:49 AM Just go with hard ceramic dry bearings 08-Jan-20 12:56 PM Because dry steel bearings will rust, and ceramic bearings in those sizes are incredibky expensive. 08-Jan-20 07:00 PM .. what about watch oil? 08-Jan-20 07:00 PM also, how fast acting is it? 08-Jan-20 07:00 PM maybe picture, even on a napkin, of said manipulator arm 08-Jan-20 07:01 PM just get a more pumping speed and go with air bearings :P 08-Jan-20 07:03 PM I've been doing a little maths of fluid film bearings, ie, hydrostatic.. specifically for spindles but also linear motion 08-Jan-20 07:03 PM got a great book on them from the 70s or 80s, includes like BASIC computer code for some of the stuff, I need to make it more modern... like perl 08-Jan-20 07:11 PM oh my god... my cyclist freinds online just made a meme of me... 08-Jan-20 07:11 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/yDZJP70-074A4.png 08-Jan-20 07:11 PM the one who actually put in the effort to make it used to be my boss' boss' boss 08-Jan-20 07:11 PM and, for reference, it would have cost a cyclist over $100 to buy OEM replacement parts to fix it.. vs .. say.. 3hrs of billable shop time, and yeah, like $5 of steel 08-Jan-20 07:11 PM not that I am trying to save face, but yeah 08-Jan-20 07:14 PM I got a pretty neat PowerTap hub that measures torque and thus power for $80 08-Jan-20 07:14 PM Measures cadance and ground speed as well, wireless via ANT+ 08-Jan-20 07:15 PM I have a SRM power meter crank 08-Jan-20 07:15 PM and yeah, ANT+ 08-Jan-20 07:15 PM but, closer to like $3k? 08-Jan-20 07:15 PM I forget.. I use dinsurrance money to pay for it 08-Jan-20 07:16 PM Oh... yeah my whole bike is worth less than $300 with the power meter... 08-Jan-20 07:16 PM Well maybe a bit more if I do sell it 08-Jan-20 07:17 PM hahaha.. mine is a limitted edition team reissue.. so neat paintjob (but sneaky) and good components 08-Jan-20 07:17 PM orig had carbon wheels, that's where the replacement freehub came from 08-Jan-20 07:17 PM those wheels broke a while ago 08-Jan-20 07:17 PM so, the new axel I machined had to fit the different sized freehub bearings, essentially 08-Jan-20 07:17 PM it was a great project.. a necesity due to it being my only bike and I commute with it.. ride it 4x a day to/fro school 08-Jan-20 07:19 PM I actually don't ride with the powermeter regularly, since it's on a superlight climbing wheel that might break like your carbon set 08-Jan-20 07:20 PM I didnt have the head unit on the bike last year during shcool untill new years.. so I've logged a year of it thus far.. but it's short trips 08-Jan-20 07:20 PM I used to go on 100+ mi 6000+ ft of ascent rides 08-Jan-20 07:20 PM before I moved 08-Jan-20 07:21 PM I did like 500 km per week for full 3 months last summer 08-Jan-20 07:21 PM Had a pretty nasty crash and a slight concussion lol 08-Jan-20 07:21 PM example ride of mine.. https://www.strava.com/activities/2048858848 08-Jan-20 07:21 PM just up and down a mountain a few times 08-Jan-20 07:21 PM that is 1/3 of everest (wird metric, but yeah) 08-Jan-20 07:21 PM I want to eventually do a 1/2 everest ride.. doubt I will ever be able to do a full one without sleeping 08-Jan-20 07:22 PM The steeper the hill the better when going for the climbing altitude records 08-Jan-20 07:25 PM the faster the descent too, such as taking a different route on the way down and looping 08-Jan-20 07:25 PM technical descents suck, lots of braking, etc 08-Jan-20 07:25 PM plus I am not a racer, but yeah 09-Jan-20 03:12 AM @Noxz for you: 09-Jan-20 03:12 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAEBNEscL0c 09-Jan-20 04:35 PM You bike nerds. I ride a frankenbike (road). Sram group set, campagnolo wheels, zipp vumaquad cranks. 09-Jan-20 11:40 PM hey all, so i've been having a wonderful time on the mini lathe (g0765) and i think it's time for a mill to improve some projects. any suggestions on a small mill to start working primarily on aluminum and brass and steel here and there? 09-Jan-20 11:40 PM i have a small CNC for PCBs and smaller wood/plastic projects but not enough power/speed/work holding capability for the metal projects i'd like 09-Jan-20 11:41 PM too bad you didnt ask a few months ago... 09-Jan-20 11:41 PM anyway depends on your budget 09-Jan-20 11:41 PM and space 09-Jan-20 11:41 PM also depends if you want to do minor restorations or buy a new machine 09-Jan-20 11:43 PM i only learned about this place a few weeks ago 09-Jan-20 11:44 PM yeah i was just saying that because my uncle had a nice smaller clausing mill he got from his neighbor that he was getting rid of 09-Jan-20 11:44 PM if you are tight on space those are great little mills 09-Jan-20 11:44 PM i usually prefer getting used stuff and learning a little about it by fixing/improving it, but i have a bunch of things i could immediately just start using a mill for that i think new makes more sense. space...i can make space for the right thing! 09-Jan-20 11:44 PM oh cool 09-Jan-20 11:46 PM new your options are like...grizzly, bolton, or one of the direct chinese imports 09-Jan-20 11:46 PM i probably wouldn't want it to take more space than the 7x14 lathe 09-Jan-20 11:46 PM oh you are talking small desk top stuff then? 09-Jan-20 11:46 PM that is smaller than i can give advice on 09-Jan-20 11:46 PM i mean, width wise height can be anything within reason and depth can be bigger 09-Jan-20 11:46 PM how big are the mills you're thinking of? 09-Jan-20 11:47 PM for a smaller very nice mill look into the Clausing 8530 or 8520 but those are still things that go on a stand 09-Jan-20 11:47 PM and take up a decent amount of space 09-Jan-20 11:47 PM Grizzly and Harbor Freight sell chinese copies of them (i think, been awhile since I last checked) 09-Jan-20 11:48 PM ahh 09-Jan-20 11:48 PM stuff that is smaller than those you really run into some rigidity issues, in my opinion, but some people do not mind that at all and work around it 09-Jan-20 11:48 PM others might have some input on desktop CNC mill options but all i am familiar with is the Sherline stuff 09-Jan-20 11:48 PM those get around the rigidity issues via cnc heh 09-Jan-20 11:48 PM lots of tiny cuts 09-Jan-20 11:58 PM ahh i see 09-Jan-20 11:58 PM my old roommate worked at sherline so always had one in the house but i wasn't into this stuff back then unfortunately 10-Jan-20 03:03 AM @piGuy sadly I only have Half a bicycle |--Ø 10-Jan-20 03:03 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/D9hVHNJX4AMFzLe-E6449.png 10-Jan-20 04:07 AM Hrm I guess I need to get a 6.75" conflat blank, machine out a 4" hole then get a 6" flange or see if I have one and get a 4" SS tube cut-off and get a welder and weld it up 10-Jan-20 04:07 AM fun 10-Jan-20 04:07 AM means I need a lathe and a tig yay 10-Jan-20 06:12 AM You get the best excuses to buy equipment. 10-Jan-20 06:12 AM XDDDD 10-Jan-20 06:17 AM lmao, excuses don't generate the money to do so though :P 10-Jan-20 06:17 AM But a good job does. 10-Jan-20 06:17 AM I have all the excuses, just none of the money or when I do have it I buy something else instead because it seems like a better deal... 10-Jan-20 06:17 AM Like buying a new Tig welder is one thing... prices will either stay the same or get cheaper as time goes on 10-Jan-20 06:17 AM but a massive conflat chamber for 300 bucks shipped... thats a steal I can't pass 10-Jan-20 06:17 AM Also been trying to improve the house a little... 10-Jan-20 06:17 AM those shelves I put up cost like 300 bucks 10-Jan-20 06:17 AM I got a new faucet for the kitchen and need to buy a sink too 10-Jan-20 06:17 AM that's going to be about 500 dollars in the end after I get all the bits 10-Jan-20 06:19 AM Well, you know me, I'm more of the "buy tools, do it yourself" so I can easily pass on good chamber deals, and save to build my own as I like it. 10-Jan-20 06:19 AM Yeah, houses are a sink 10-Jan-20 06:19 AM XD 10-Jan-20 06:19 AM especially the kitchen sink :P 10-Jan-20 06:19 AM especially 10-Jan-20 06:19 AM but eh its kinda just slowly trying to make myself realize, right this is my house 10-Jan-20 06:19 AM I can enjoy it instead of using it as a project grounds 10-Jan-20 06:20 AM Totally 10-Jan-20 06:20 AM how much time have you been in? 10-Jan-20 06:20 AM I've lived here for just over 2 years now I think? 10-Jan-20 06:20 AM maybe coming up on 3? I can't remember anymore lol 10-Jan-20 06:20 AM yea I think three in the fall 10-Jan-20 06:20 AM Yeah, just little enough to begin to realize 10-Jan-20 06:20 AM In any case, leave space for visitors! 10-Jan-20 06:21 AM haha I always have a guest room open 10-Jan-20 06:21 AM like, a path between the door, a bed and a bathroom. 10-Jan-20 06:21 AM pft haha its not THAT bad 10-Jan-20 06:21 AM But it could! 10-Jan-20 06:21 AM just get more stuff! 10-Jan-20 06:21 AM I have a friend that can be that bad... 10-Jan-20 06:21 AM its kinda a reminder to not 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM Lucky you. 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM XD 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM Not really because me and a few of his friends are forced to try and help him not be so much of a hoarder... 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM litterally he needs help 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM Oh 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM yea... he uh has way too much stuff 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM well, no jokes about that then. 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM like to the point he could be selling stuff probably for the next 20 years and live off it 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM LMAO... 10-Jan-20 06:22 AM yeah, big problem 10-Jan-20 06:23 AM that's not the big problem honestly I think its great he could live handling the equipment he likes 10-Jan-20 06:23 AM the problem is he can't let go of things 10-Jan-20 06:23 AM (you haven't slept today, right? XD) 10-Jan-20 06:23 AM he NEEDS to have the stuff 10-Jan-20 06:23 AM I mean 10-Jan-20 06:23 AM I woke up 12 hours ago? 10-Jan-20 06:23 AM or so? 10-Jan-20 06:23 AM Ah 10-Jan-20 06:23 AM I'm a bit off on what time is it over there 10-Jan-20 06:24 AM its 9:23am... 10-Jan-20 06:24 AM i any case, I can feel his trouble 10-Jan-20 06:24 AM XD, so yes, you stayed awake all night, just woke up very lathe the day before. 10-Jan-20 06:24 AM yea honestly looking at his situation makes me just want to just get a dumpster and throw EVERYTHING out somedays 10-Jan-20 06:24 AM Well... 10-Jan-20 06:24 AM @GigaSquirrel has space 10-Jan-20 06:24 AM XD 10-Jan-20 06:25 AM I've kinda seriously considered dumping my vintage computer hobby and focusing on the stuff I do here 10-Jan-20 06:25 AM problem is I don't want to regret it 10-Jan-20 06:25 AM some of the stuff I have would be nearly impossible to get again and or its just getting harder and harder as time goes on 10-Jan-20 06:25 AM its kinda one of those things once you leave coming back will only be difficult 10-Jan-20 06:26 AM Someone has to do it, I guess. (saving such things) 10-Jan-20 06:26 AM and well I've always loved being knowledgeable in the field and unfortunately dropping it like that basically makes you lose all your cred 10-Jan-20 06:27 AM ^^U 10-Jan-20 06:27 AM I do? 10-Jan-20 06:27 AM where? XD 10-Jan-20 06:27 AM You have more than I have. 10-Jan-20 06:27 AM It's just a way of thinking, @Conmega it passes and then one enjoys the feeling of it all again. 10-Jan-20 06:27 AM XDD, I thought this was reps 10-Jan-20 08:16 AM @Conmega I wonder if you could loan your vintage stuff to a computer museum. Then you would be rid of it, but maybe have the option of taking it back later... 10-Jan-20 08:44 AM Unfortunately most "museums" I know are private collections basically, if they go there you never see them again... 10-Jan-20 08:44 AM the one museum on the east coast I am a part of currently has no climate controlled environment and I have seen artifacts destroyed there on more than one occasion 10-Jan-20 08:44 AM its just... not worth it unless its something REALLY large and basically guaranteed to not move in storage, frees up a lot of space and yea 10-Jan-20 08:44 AM but yea that museum is getting better... the one guy who screwed a lot of stuff up is gone now but yea... 10-Jan-20 08:44 AM still don't trust them that much 10-Jan-20 10:07 AM My lathe died. 10-Jan-20 10:16 AM f 10-Jan-20 10:19 AM how did your lathe die? 10-Jan-20 10:19 AM fall off a truck? 10-Jan-20 10:19 AM the front fell off 10-Jan-20 10:35 AM Nah, I'm being dramatic. 10-Jan-20 10:35 AM The electronic speed controller probably failed. 10-Jan-20 10:35 AM (or one of the brushes broke) 10-Jan-20 10:35 AM it's been giving me trouble here and there the last months, but the PCB showed no sign, hopefully now it will. 10-Jan-20 10:37 AM thats not something you hear often...people hoping their PCBs show failure points 10-Jan-20 10:40 AM just put one of those 15 kW BLDCs in there 10-Jan-20 01:12 PM Oh no. What lathe and how did it die? And like total death or just electronics related? 10-Jan-20 01:12 PM Ohh nevermind. Saw the rest of the message. Yeah. New motor setup time. 10-Jan-20 01:15 PM @Nixie https://www.ebay.com/itm/220V-AC-Nema34-80ST-04025-4N-M-1KW-Brake-ac-servo-engine-motor-servo-driver-kit/174016515942 10-Jan-20 01:15 PM :^) 10-Jan-20 01:15 PM perfect replacement for them 10-Jan-20 01:15 PM (if you have a mini lathe, 1kw is generally good for those) 10-Jan-20 02:41 PM I can't justify the cost of this without a job (otherwise is perfect for a future replacement). I will have to repair the current controller board. :( 10-Jan-20 02:41 PM Thanks, btw. 10-Jan-20 02:44 PM heh yeah it's an expensive upgrade 10-Jan-20 02:44 PM but I see a lot of people spend the same amount of money on a 3ph motor and a VFD 10-Jan-20 02:44 PM when they could get positional and closed loop torque control with stall detection for the same amount of money 10-Jan-20 02:44 PM not to mention high stall torque 10-Jan-20 06:48 PM hopefully your lathe gets fixed without too much hassle, Nixie 10-Jan-20 06:48 PM I was able to pickup a brand new set of change gears for mine.. so I will finally be able to do every metric thread (imperial machine) 10-Jan-20 06:48 PM I was limitted to super basic ones.. nothign small enough for watch work 10-Jan-20 06:48 PM watchmaking taps/dies are super expensive for no good reason 11-Jan-20 01:16 AM Will let you kmow how it goes. 11-Jan-20 01:16 AM I mean, I have a full electronics lab, I should be able to repair it unless it's using something obsolete. 11-Jan-20 01:45 AM The controllers are pretty simple for the dc lathes 11-Jan-20 11:32 AM looking at bellow actuators.. jsut came across a neat way to make them.. machine a mandrel out of Aluminum, then ectroplate some other material over it.. and "etch"/dissolve the aluminum away 11-Jan-20 11:32 AM super neat, sacrificial mandrels 11-Jan-20 11:32 AM good for small/thin 11-Jan-20 11:32 AM I bet plating whatever aluminum form/mandrel with a standard material (like nickel) to some degree of thickness is not too expensive if you outsource that bit 13-Jan-20 04:03 PM why the heck do my change gears need a signature 13-Jan-20 04:03 PM ugh 14-Jan-20 08:06 AM a signature? 14-Jan-20 08:06 AM you mean the package? 14-Jan-20 08:08 AM I'd assume so and yea I hate that 14-Jan-20 08:08 AM sometimes you can create an account with the shipper, and "sign online" and they will just leave it 14-Jan-20 09:41 AM yeah, signature for receiving t he package 14-Jan-20 09:41 AM I mean, it was somewhat pricey 14-Jan-20 09:41 AM but if it fits inthe mailbox? 14-Jan-20 09:41 AM also, it may not be able to fit in mailbox, unsure 14-Jan-20 09:41 AM some ofthe gears are big 14-Jan-20 02:53 PM First attempt at injection molding with a 3D printed (SLA) mold. 14-Jan-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-3C0E4.jpg 14-Jan-20 03:04 PM nice! 14-Jan-20 03:09 PM Discoloration is from preview owner using orange resin. It's mostly flushed out now. Detail from the printed mold seems to be really good (Form 3 with High Temp resin) 14-Jan-20 03:25 PM Lovely! 14-Jan-20 03:33 PM got my change gears, w00t 15-Jan-20 02:50 AM go, go, go! 17-Jan-20 10:52 AM dang KF16 to CF 2.75" is pricey (to connect foreline trap). is CF easy enough to turn on lathe? i'm unsure about that knife edge 17-Jan-20 10:53 AM its not really... and just keep an eye on eBay in my opinion, stuff sometimes appears cheap, and worst case consider CF to KF anything, and just get KF adapters 17-Jan-20 10:53 AM like KF25 and KF40 are more common 17-Jan-20 10:53 AM just get a reducer 17-Jan-20 10:53 AM but yea those adapters to finish off a project are what add up 17-Jan-20 10:55 AM yeah i'm trying to stick to KF but the trap was cheap and CF 17-Jan-20 10:55 AM should have took connectors into consideration, though it appeared KF from the pics and didn't mention. i'll validate that next time 17-Jan-20 11:02 AM something something machining something something chuck the CF into a lathe something something 19-Jan-20 01:24 AM Any suggestion on a new mini mill to get? 19-Jan-20 01:24 AM That I could perhaps easily upgrade in the future, perhaps CNC or other improvements that might be common 19-Jan-20 07:39 AM I am not sure about mini-mills. You'll probably be spending at-least 2-4 grand for a decent mini-mill though. Or if you can get the space, 1-2 grand for a decent full-sized mill. At-least from what I've seen 19-Jan-20 09:21 AM i still think that a mini mill will frustrate you with the lack of rigidity and the fairly limited working area... but for the desktop size most people look at one of these options: https://littlemachineshop.com/info/minimill_compare.php 19-Jan-20 09:21 AM you probably have seen that already but there really is not much variety in that specific size range 19-Jan-20 01:26 PM and of course you need a mill to build your own mill 19-Jan-20 01:26 PM just like a lathe to make a lathe 19-Jan-20 01:26 PM I'm making some advances on my swiss-type lathe design 19-Jan-20 01:26 PM all on mapkins t hus far, but will eventually get some stuff in some sorta CAD 19-Jan-20 01:26 PM more so still learning some "basics" of preciscion machine design 19-Jan-20 01:28 PM if i had the money to build a lathe oooooh man let me find the video i would base most of it off of 19-Jan-20 01:28 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFrVdoOhu1Q 19-Jan-20 01:28 PM such an amazing machine 19-Jan-20 01:28 PM yup, I have seen all of his vids I think 19-Jan-20 01:28 PM I plan on hydrostatic bearings 19-Jan-20 01:28 PM lookup 2.72 lathe .. it's a MIT class that makes a complicated benchtop lathe.. the professor wrote one of the books (and has AMAZING vids) that I am actively reading 19-Jan-20 01:28 PM they use a compliant cross slide 19-Jan-20 01:30 PM i really like his idea of using the granite straight edges as component parts 19-Jan-20 01:30 PM ie, flexures 19-Jan-20 01:30 PM oh, also, for my swiss type lathe.. I really am aiming at watch staffs.. so think that I wouldnt really need fore tham maybe 15mm of travel, max 19-Jan-20 01:30 PM which puts some other things into perspective 19-Jan-20 01:30 PM there are tons of student website son their 2.72 lathe design/results, I think it was part of the class requirement 19-Jan-20 01:30 PM so, dude talks about micron accuracy, and that's essentially my goal as well 19-Jan-20 01:32 PM yeah for your watch parts you can get away with a lot more in a much smaller footprint than a lot more general machines 19-Jan-20 01:32 PM at least for turning, since I will be hardening (if it isnt already) followed by pivot polishing 19-Jan-20 01:32 PM also, I dont like how modern swiss-type lathes try to cram so many different tools in there 19-Jan-20 01:32 PM like, I dont need all that fancy stuff 19-Jan-20 01:32 PM maybe one live tool for cuting the square on the stems 19-Jan-20 01:32 PM but yeah, may not even need a second spindle to pickup and work on the backside (maybe) 19-Jan-20 01:34 PM you can probably design/plan your order of operations around not needing that 19-Jan-20 01:34 PM actually, no, I think I will, to get the fine point of the other end pivot 19-Jan-20 01:34 PM Dan's video series is really good.. he is a big proponent on water jet for prototypes 19-Jan-20 01:34 PM if you standardize on a few shaft sizes you could just get collets to grab the stubs 19-Jan-20 01:34 PM amongst other things 19-Jan-20 01:34 PM collets arent the issue.. it's more of just not wanting a million things to make t he machine so universal 19-Jan-20 01:34 PM I dont need an entire turning center 19-Jan-20 02:02 PM i'm open to full size mill as well 19-Jan-20 02:02 PM dang these machines are so big, not even sure they'll fit through my front door...i don't have a garage so all the machines go into a room 19-Jan-20 02:09 PM on some you can take the table off pretty easily which makes them more maneuverable 19-Jan-20 02:09 PM just can be a project 19-Jan-20 02:09 PM ive seen a ton of photos of people who got full size bridgeports into their basements though 19-Jan-20 02:09 PM usually with the head squeezed in between floor joists 19-Jan-20 02:35 PM How big is the room? 19-Jan-20 02:44 PM a little bigger than 3x4m, though a bit of stuff in it, should reorganize 19-Jan-20 02:46 PM Then you should have plenty of space... 19-Jan-20 02:46 PM This is my workshop on a space similar to yours: 19-Jan-20 02:46 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/0-33B50.png 19-Jan-20 02:46 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/0-61190.png 19-Jan-20 02:46 PM Central table has wheels if I really need to have space on the electronics bench or on the machining side. 19-Jan-20 02:49 PM ahh nice 19-Jan-20 02:49 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_8656-3D653.JPG 19-Jan-20 02:49 PM so need to clean up and make space for mill + tig 19-Jan-20 03:36 PM Yeah, the lathe table is too big, for example, If you had a table the size of the lathe, you could put side by side a mill with it's own table. 19-Jan-20 03:36 PM For example. 19-Jan-20 03:36 PM also, you need lots of shelves, as many as you can cram in between the tools (but allowing space to work, of course) 19-Jan-20 03:36 PM Looks like a space with very good potential! 19-Jan-20 03:51 PM agree, need shelving. ahh interesting point on the table 19-Jan-20 03:51 PM and i need to resolve the ventilation between the fume hood and laser cutter -- i added one way ducts to each so they can't pump dirty air into the other but the one way valves have holes on the outside, need to cover it or improve that...and adjust the exit ducting from just being taped to the window :\ 19-Jan-20 03:59 PM I 3D printed a holder for that purpose, but also made a piece of wood that fit exactly my window. 19-Jan-20 03:59 PM (vertically wise) 19-Jan-20 03:59 PM Also I used PVC flexy tubes instead of aluminium ones, I am always afraid of those work hardening and breaking.^^U 19-Jan-20 04:22 PM ahh, i was concerned with some of the gasses used in the fume hood messing with plastic 19-Jan-20 04:22 PM the 3d printed holder holds the vent by the window? 19-Jan-20 11:37 PM took me a while to actually dig up the correct channel for this.. https://www.youtube.com/user/275MITx/videos 19-Jan-20 11:37 PM dude is a lil nuts, but you'll get the hang of him 20-Jan-20 12:00 AM hah awesome 20-Jan-20 12:00 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lUhBJF-3Zo amazing 20-Jan-20 02:29 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200120_112821_5-DBE66.jpg 20-Jan-20 02:29 AM I have the fan on the outside, so, if any damage would to occur, still would make everything work at negative pressure, so, little risk. 20-Jan-20 02:29 AM I also threaded one tube inside of the other for double walled peace of mind. 20-Jan-20 03:45 AM Wound up in a work holding nightmare this weekend repairing threads I mushroomed while pulling bearings on that pump I was refurbishing. Didn't think to take pics but had the entire rotor stack chucked up on the lathe to chase the left-handed threads. 20-Jan-20 03:45 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20200120_054658-F87C4.jpg 20-Jan-20 03:45 AM When I was working them by hand. Had about 1/4" to grab on to of the rotor face. Luckily it has blind threaded holes for balancing weights (set screws) that let me fab up a chuckable piece that I could then thread through to mount the rotor. 20-Jan-20 03:45 AM A bit butt-puckering to say the least 20-Jan-20 03:45 AM Really need to get a center and dogs for my lathe as turning between centers would have been way less work and given more confidence. Then again the tail stock center would have been an issue as the mushrooming put it off center. 20-Jan-20 05:48 AM WOah 20-Jan-20 05:48 AM How are you going to balane it at the end? 20-Jan-20 06:00 AM We use these tables to 'poise' balance wheels (without hairspring) 20-Jan-20 06:00 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/usedpos3-49C74.jpg 20-Jan-20 06:00 AM industrially there are ones out there that will vibrate a little (straight AC mains on a solenoid) and naturally the heavy spot will drop to the bottom 20-Jan-20 06:00 AM the table needs a long cat whisker (or similar) to push the balance wheel around 20-Jan-20 06:00 AM my tool & cutter grinder manual shows a larger version of the table for balancing grinding wheels, once attached to arbors 20-Jan-20 06:06 AM pretty! 20-Jan-20 06:06 AM the rolling surface straight edges are synthetic ruby 20-Jan-20 06:06 AM machine that vibrates: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpbLxova2hI 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM @Nixie I shouldn't need to re-balance anything as the assembly as pictured is monolithic (it's not, but I didn't take it all the way down) and the rotor blades haven't slipped or anything 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM surely there will be a slight error just from having to re-form the threads, but that is at the center point and also very close, axially, to a bearing. I don't anticipate needing to do any balancing.. if I DO then I'll probably attempt rigging up a grey-code style reflective rotary encoder and piezo transducer near the bearing and correlate waveform with rotor position or similar (idea being to spool it up and measure vibration with relation to rotor position). I have a laser and photodiode setup quick enough to do vibrometry if necessary as well. I really, really, don't anticipate needing to do anything of the sort, though 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20200120_090741-94EFF.jpg 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM As for the actual balancing mechanism there are 4 tiers total that use set screws as weights. You can see 3 of them in this photo - radial holes at bottom and pair at top. 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20200120_091204-4CAAC.jpg 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM This bearing is interesting too. Fairly certain it serves as a crash bearing in case things go catastrophic-like. 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM The labyrinth seal of the rotor+housing is neat too. The rotor part is shown in the above picture and then here is the mating housing side. 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20200120_091532-6114B.jpg 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM I couldn't find an exact match of the original main bearing, identification as Barden U1HX312. X indicates "special" according to Barden's catalogs and I'm assuming indicates a special coating - likely silver. I'm replacing with Fafnir 2MMVC9101WI's 20-Jan-20 07:00 AM Not identical but same load angle and is used in the more modern turbos with same category of oil 20-Jan-20 07:25 AM Nice! 20-Jan-20 07:25 AM The balancing ring just looks gorgeous 20-Jan-20 12:23 PM @Nixie ahh nice 20-Jan-20 12:23 PM re ducting 20-Jan-20 01:01 PM i'm looking at welders that i can use inside -- any suggestions? i'd like to do aluminum and steel and want to work inside so thinking TIG...though if it had plasma cutting that would be awesome 20-Jan-20 01:09 PM You should be-able to use any welder inside like a garage space... 20-Jan-20 01:09 PM If you mean like indoors in a house... uhm I wouldn't recommend it unless you like starting fires. 20-Jan-20 01:11 PM TIG is really the only type of welding you can do indoors safely 20-Jan-20 01:11 PM The rest are too toxic/sparky 20-Jan-20 01:12 PM Well TIG is the type you want anyway. But $$$ 20-Jan-20 01:14 PM TIG for sure on aluminum. Just plain more versatile and can get better aesthetics as well. MIG wins for long welds outdoors and price but that's it. 20-Jan-20 01:16 PM A good gas shielded MIG yea. A cheap fluxcore is bleh 20-Jan-20 01:16 PM I mean it WORKS but its not very nice 20-Jan-20 01:16 PM I don't have a garage I can work in so inside it is 20-Jan-20 01:17 PM Just realize if your making metal molten, if something drips on like wood floor or carpet you'll easily start a fire... in what I would assume to be a house made of wood... 20-Jan-20 01:17 PM So just yaknow... make your enviroment setup for such a process 20-Jan-20 01:17 PM TIG + full metal box for doing it in 20-Jan-20 01:17 PM i removed the wood floor from my work room so that it's concrete 20-Jan-20 01:17 PM With a small edge on the front to prevent hot things from rolling off 20-Jan-20 01:19 PM Ah then your probably fine I suppose, didn't realize you were just on a slab or something. 20-Jan-20 01:42 PM cool 20-Jan-20 02:06 PM just make sure you are doing some fume extraction 20-Jan-20 02:06 PM not as big a deal with TIG as other things but still not something you really want to do in an area without good airflow 20-Jan-20 03:45 PM k 20-Jan-20 06:13 PM Also be mindful of simpler things like welding galvanized metal where you have a risk of zinc poisoning which is not pleasant. You'd surely come across it while reading up on technique if you haven't already but figured I'd mention it anyway. 20-Jan-20 09:12 PM oh interesting, didn't know about that 20-Jan-20 09:18 PM i almost mentioned that but assumed everyone knew...definitely avoid zinc anything 20-Jan-20 09:18 PM you will feel sick for weeks 20-Jan-20 09:24 PM that's good to know...definitely have some galvanized stuff i was considering welding. will need to set up a test to validate what is and isn't 20-Jan-20 09:24 PM "Lick the sample of steel if you are still unsure whether or not your sample has undergone the galvanization process" okay... 20-Jan-20 09:26 PM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_fume_fever 20-Jan-20 09:26 PM thats the more general name for that type of "illness" 20-Jan-20 09:26 PM and why you need fume extraction for welding 20-Jan-20 11:08 PM i see 20-Jan-20 11:08 PM will need to look at better fume extraction 20-Jan-20 11:26 PM @samy TIG at home is totally doable. You only need a metal top desk, or a metal sheet (as thick as you can manage) to weld on top. Also clamps. I go by with a simple aluminium sheet, for example (but it's less than ideal). 20-Jan-20 11:26 PM PLASMA cutting at home is doable, but you will need to build a water bucket with a grid support. 20-Jan-20 11:26 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-2DF57.png 20-Jan-20 11:26 PM ("bucket" in a very loose term, I mean a watertight metal case) 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM ahh 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM Note the central support is angled, to deflect sparks and not bounce them upwards: 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-07E7F.png 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM Guides made out of lasercut wood: 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-0F4E3.png 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-71F59.png 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM (my first cuts, not exactly amazing, but worked good enough) 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-F6003.png 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM Once you get the hang of the cutter, a new world of sheet metal cutting possibilities opens up, it's amazing. 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM BTW, it's not like you are not going to make sparks, so, I would recommend getting a CO2 fire extinguisher. Especially when you start a hole, sparks are going to fly sideways until the hole is all the way through. 20-Jan-20 11:30 PM Also, for the TIG, check bottle pricings first. In my old homewotn it was near impossible for an individual to get a charge of Argon, whereas in my current town, It's super easy and cheap (800km difference in the same country) 21-Jan-20 07:35 AM For metals I use a company down the road from us. Central Cal Metals. They do mostly laser and water jet cutting. Now all the lasers are fiber. Wow what a difference. Many times faster and cleaner. They replaced like 20 old@lasers with like 5 fiber lasers and their throughput is higher! 21-Jan-20 08:45 AM way less maintenance/trouble too so they'll have less downtime as well 21-Jan-20 01:39 PM ahh nice 21-Jan-20 01:39 PM i ordered a tank of Argon on amazon...it was cheaper than buying it at Airgas down the street 21-Jan-20 01:39 PM cheaper for a larger bottle delivered than picking up a small bottle locally 21-Jan-20 01:54 PM America and its conveniences 21-Jan-20 01:54 PM Order a tank of argon with a click of a button 21-Jan-20 01:54 PM I need to get a good job and move ASAP 22-Jan-20 03:42 AM <__ice9#6039> I just use a supplied air respirator for welding and plasma cutting. Plasma cutting works far nicer with the part partly submerged in water also. 22-Jan-20 03:42 AM <__ice9#6039> Hmm the Amazon method only works if you need to buy a tank as well. I bought my first one locally (old ugly 125ft3) and did a trade in elsewhere for $35 for a full one, which turned out to be a super nice shiny new tank 22-Jan-20 03:42 AM <__ice9#6039> Hmm unfortunately I only see Ar and Ar-25CO2, no helium. Still want some helium. 22-Jan-20 07:07 AM Helium is starting to get very expensive, and for obvious reasons. With peak petroleum production, they finally realized we are also at peak helium production! Be brave. Use hydrogen for your balloons! Hahahahaha. It can liven up your parties and add the element of chance and danger to any day! 22-Jan-20 08:06 AM Y'all got me wondering what with me living in rural podunk northwest florida. Gonna call up my local airgas and see what I have available. What should I check for aside from argon, hydrogen, oxygen, co2, helium without getting laughed at or put on a list? 22-Jan-20 08:06 AM Surely fluorine is out of the question and SF6 requires some permit I would think what with the environmental effects. 22-Jan-20 10:44 AM krypton, xenon, deuterium, neon 22-Jan-20 10:44 AM @Charles we actually have a ton of helium still in the reserves 22-Jan-20 10:44 AM the US even has a huge reserve they're not selling 22-Jan-20 10:44 AM but it's 100% finite 22-Jan-20 10:47 AM Thang goodness argon has the decency to hang around mixed in the atmosphere. Otherwise we would have a real crisis coming one day. 22-Jan-20 10:47 AM Otherwise it would take a very long hose to reach Neptune! 22-Jan-20 11:08 AM @Deleted User My understanding was that the US exactly was selling the reserves since mid nineties 22-Jan-20 11:08 AM And that was one of the reasons why none ware capturing helium, the dumped helium was so cheap. 22-Jan-20 11:08 AM And now that dumping is nearing the end it seems, as helium price is starting to rise to a more natural level. 22-Jan-20 11:10 AM Yeah, but the prices are still totally fine 22-Jan-20 11:10 AM $150 for 40l at 150-200 bar 22-Jan-20 11:10 AM (at least here) 22-Jan-20 11:10 AM that's enough helium to last an entire nixie factory a few years 22-Jan-20 03:47 PM <__ice9#6039> If it weren't for potassium-40, we wouldn't have any argon either. Neon is actually very abundant in space, but nearly all of it was blown away early in the planet's history. Helium of course has its own issues given low mass. 22-Jan-20 03:47 PM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/1579736720669-B7829.png 23-Jan-20 10:57 AM @Metanoic I know a guy locally who got CF4 from Linde, I think, delivered to his house 23-Jan-20 04:44 PM wow.. what a nice ebay seller! 23-Jan-20 04:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0941-DA2F0.jpg 23-Jan-20 04:44 PM new Aloris knurler on a quick change tool post.. flippin solid 23-Jan-20 04:50 PM wow, thats never happened before lol 23-Jan-20 04:50 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0942-BC68B.jpg 23-Jan-20 04:50 PM max 2" diameter 23-Jan-20 04:50 PM looks to have never been used, beyond dude putting his name 24-Jan-20 08:47 AM Oh! That's some old person selling that for sure. (never heard of anyone younger doing that!) 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Discussions on casting large objects from castable steel alloys-- it turns out coils can be made for induction heaters that are large enough to fit around a 150mm diameter casting and the surrounding mold and insulation without an excessive increase in coil inductance, for mine anyway. 2μH with the current coil, 2μH with a much wider one having only 3 turns and being tall enough to wrap the entire casting mold. So there is no need for a separate melting+pouring furnace (ladles were always out of the question as well), improving safety. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> ~15kW input power down to about 12kW output or thereabouts should be adequate to melt the steel. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> The smaller one is intended for casting refractory metals into magnesia molds under argon, so it needed to be smaller. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Having a single mold for melting and casting also makes it easier to adequately shield the melt, with a smaller amount of argon 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Stirring can be done with an alumina tube; drilling a couple holes in the sides near the bottom with a diamond dental drill or similar (they are very cheap on eBay, great for glass cutting) allows for also using it to degas the melt by bubbling in argon (also helps further with stirring) 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> That in turn can be routed through a lid over the mold, minimizing splashing 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> There are major practical differences between casting aluminum or bronze vs. casting steel, and for castings of a few hundred grams vs. e.g. 10-20kg or larger. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Refractory failures and violent splashing are much more likely for steel and for larger melts. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Castings must be made in a single pour or melt. Multiple pours will not fuse correctly in most cases due to oxide layers and inability to melt the upper surface of a previous pour to weld the two, and even if they do, thermal stress is usually severe and welding usually incomplete. So it needs to be done all at once. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Shielding is never complete fwiw and some oxides usually still do form, unless you are operating in a vacuum chamber. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Aluminum/bronze also let you get away with using sand based molds in many cases. Steel does not. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> On the outside yes but not for the facing surfaces or regions close behind them 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Refractory cement is ok though, provided it is rated to the necessary temperatures 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Hmm I also just made what amounts to a pass-through to put a TIG torch into a vacuum chamber. That enables partial vacuum arc welding and arc melting, though the latter also needs a water-cooled copper stage. It wasn't too difficult: just run a copper rod soldered to a monel tube through a KF baffle, attach one end to a TIG torch, attach the other end to a KF flange connected to the baffle and filled with epoxy, then make a handle around the end sticking out past the flange seal (containing the hose and cable feeding the tube/rod to the torch). 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bH8kkxZqzhE 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> This design is a bit different, but the principle is the same. Notice how shiny the fused ingots come out. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> The process is actually done in only a partial vacuum, in argon. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Still much much better than the local and imperfect shielding provided by a bare TIG torch in air 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Note the pass-through tube/rod must be insulated fairly well to prevent arcover to the baffle/flange/chamber wall. Forgot to mention that above but it's not difficult 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Goes without saying that filtering the exhaust to the pump and using DCEN power configuration are both mandatory as well. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> If not using a custom refractory mold for a steel melt, then a zirconia or thick nested alumina crucible would be recommended. Some graphite based crucibles are ferrous-rated, but they pretty much all will still leach carbon into the melt, which is very undesirable for many stainless alloys. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Alumina is not as tolerant to thermal shock... so heating and cooling must be done gradually. And it is best to avoid leaving leftover metal in it or it will usually shatter as well. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Coating with a releasing agent can help somewhat depending on the alloy 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> I also finally have a sealed tungsten element nearly ready to test in air, but final bake-out is currently still in process. Then the ends can be sealed with silicone. I came up with a slightly better design in the meantime in case this one still fails due to gas leakage, but I want to try it first and see. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Old Mac Pro cases are great for large power electronics devices 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> The design is based on an alumina tube containing a tungsten coil in the center region of the tube curved up against the tube walls, spot-welded along multiple twists to a thicker electrode extending into the tube. The tube is then filled with stabilized zirconia powder, compacted in isopropanol, which is then evaporated back out with gentle heating. The ends of the tube are plugged with 3000F aluminosilicate mortar followed by silicone sealant at the very end. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Permeability should be not much worse than fused silica. Operating temperatures of up to about 1800-1900C should be hittable. But we will see. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> If it works, it could be used as a cheaper and tougher substitute for MoSi2 with a more convenient cylindrical form factor and higher resistance element. 25-Jan-20 02:06 AM <__ice9#6039> 0.25mm tungsten can take about 6A or so. Power loading is up to about 40W/cm² 25-Jan-20 03:04 AM <__ice9#6039> Planned test rig is just burying the tube in a good amount of alumina powder alongside a type C WRe thermocouple and feeding it about 300-400W with an SCR controller to see how hot it can get and whether it fails. 25-Jan-20 03:04 AM <__ice9#6039> Tungsten has a fairly steep temperature dependent resistivity, so using an inline relay through a power resistor (think e.g. a water heater element) for initial preheat before main power is helpful in minimizing coil damage on startup and avoiding tripping a breaker. 25-Jan-20 03:04 AM <__ice9#6039> Here a normal 100W one for a few seconds is probably ok though. 25-Jan-20 09:25 AM You should write this as a full article, I will read it in full later tonight. 25-Jan-20 09:25 AM But looks super interesting. 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM Fixed my quick change tool post bolt from slipping when being tightened, and tested out the new knurler! 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0949-489DC.jpg 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0950-F3C4D.jpg 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0951-42D0C.jpg 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0952-63333.jpg 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0944-0AA7F.jpg 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0945-73BA0.jpg 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0946-18196.jpg 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0947-1F93D.jpg 25-Jan-20 05:44 PM doh, images got rearranged on me... why discord.. why 26-Jan-20 12:48 AM Because it has word document genes. 26-Jan-20 12:48 AM Damn knurlers...the finish is so pretty. 26-Jan-20 07:18 AM hey guys, what's your fav UHV/XHV Al, still 6061? 26-Jan-20 07:18 AM sry for xpost, not sure where the righterish place is 26-Jan-20 10:59 AM a friend gave me this LMS mill (free) last night...i have some work to do 26-Jan-20 10:59 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-ACB44.png 26-Jan-20 10:59 AM Oh man... You sure this is worth your time? 26-Jan-20 11:00 AM i'm not sure 26-Jan-20 11:00 AM probably not, but this server is terrible 26-Jan-20 11:00 AM and i now have a few more hobbies than i did yesterday 26-Jan-20 11:00 AM expensive hobbies 26-Jan-20 11:00 AM Rebuilding a new import machine is not that much more expensive and you'll end up with something you can use long term 26-Jan-20 11:01 AM it looks mostly like surface rust, it actually moves pretty smoothly, so i'll probably just try some evaporust 26-Jan-20 11:02 AM Can you at least inspect the condition of the ways and leadscrews? 26-Jan-20 11:02 AM (and by terrible, i mean i love this server, but my wish list has grown quite a bit from it) 26-Jan-20 11:04 AM @Mason_Yu if it was free it probably is worth the time to take the table off and give things an inspection at the very least 26-Jan-20 11:05 AM Yeah, but rebuilding it and return it to somewhat reasonble condition is another story 26-Jan-20 11:05 AM those little mills are pretty decently made but lacking in overall rigidity/size...still will work for most small things with very conservative cuts 26-Jan-20 11:05 AM yeah all depends how the ways look under the bellows 26-Jan-20 11:05 AM I believe people fill that base and column with epoxy granite to improve rigidity and provide vibration dampening 26-Jan-20 11:06 AM column looks rough but that isnt very critical as you will never be moving the head while also milling 26-Jan-20 11:06 AM cant tell how the quill looks which might be an issue 26-Jan-20 11:06 AM pretty pitted at the base there so who knows how it is inside 26-Jan-20 11:06 AM also i think this is the size down from where people start doing epoxy granite fills...but it has been awhile since i worked on one 26-Jan-20 11:07 AM Also, what caused this to end up in the garbage in the first place? 26-Jan-20 11:08 AM that's the trunk of his car. he bought it, didn't have a place for it, and it stayed in the trunk of his car for a few years 26-Jan-20 11:10 AM So it rusted in the rain for a few years? 26-Jan-20 11:10 AM from humidity - the trunk has been closed 26-Jan-20 11:11 AM Oh okay, that's potentially salvageable 26-Jan-20 11:11 AM i think the bellow covers on the ways might be his saving grace 26-Jan-20 11:27 AM will let you know how it goes 26-Jan-20 11:38 AM re: rebuilding.. I loved this quote: If you want to run a lathe, then get a lathe that runs 26-Jan-20 07:58 PM mounting rotation bearings using only a waterjet and drill press, what's the best design? 26-Jan-20 08:04 PM Bearing size? What material do you need to mount it in? What's the application and bearing load? 26-Jan-20 08:13 PM If the bearing is not too large you can try drilling and reaming on a drill press and waterjet small retaining plates. Don't use the drill press to press the bearing in though 26-Jan-20 08:29 PM ~2" OD with ~1" ID, very small load 26-Jan-20 08:29 PM any material, aluminum is nice 26-Jan-20 08:29 PM That's a bit too large to ream on the drill press. You might get away with no reams and just a big drill 26-Jan-20 08:29 PM Plus a bit of loctite green 26-Jan-20 08:29 PM Do you have a hand press or access to a manual mill? 26-Jan-20 08:30 PM Can use a bridgeport mill, don't really enjoy it though 26-Jan-20 08:30 PM much prefer waterjetting what I can 26-Jan-20 08:30 PM even if things aren't that precise. 26-Jan-20 08:32 PM You need a precise hole if you want a good bearing fit. If you have a boring head on that mill it's a no-brainer 26-Jan-20 08:32 PM It can be also used as a bearing press too 26-Jan-20 08:32 PM I don't think I need a good bearing fit 26-Jan-20 08:32 PM It's to mount a waveplate 26-Jan-20 08:32 PM I need to spin it pretty fast with no indexing 26-Jan-20 08:36 PM I'd just waterjet an aluminum plate with a 2" hole, drill out the 2" hole with the closest drill size you can find, put some loctite green around the outer race and press the bearing in on the mill 26-Jan-20 08:36 PM I would add a retaining plate to constrain the bearing axially just in case, you can cut that out on the waterjet pretty easily too. Just add a few through-holes around the bearing and bolt on a plate that covers the outer race 26-Jan-20 08:36 PM But lots of bearing blocks are on eBay, McMaster and Amazon, why do you have to make this custom mount? 26-Jan-20 08:36 PM https://www.mcmaster.com/pillow-block-bearings 26-Jan-20 08:36 PM A bit pricey but it can save you a few hours of work 26-Jan-20 10:09 PM Progress thus far, a very small shoulder which allows the movement to be placed in without bottoming out, good for before the winding stem is installed (sometimes very first thing which then gives you something to hold onto when flipping the movement over) .. the other side will not have/need the shoulder.. then some slitting saw work to make some flexures to hold the movement sturdy.. progrees 26-Jan-20 10:09 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0956-EEB06.jpg 26-Jan-20 10:09 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0958-4E0E2.jpg 26-Jan-20 10:09 PM and yeah.. that's a 1.5" diam knurl going on there 26-Jan-20 10:17 PM shouldered movement 26-Jan-20 10:17 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0957-E3EF7.jpg 26-Jan-20 10:17 PM that's all for tonight 26-Jan-20 11:40 PM thats wristwatch stuff inside? 26-Jan-20 11:40 PM do you also make those tiny fiddly structures? 27-Jan-20 05:58 AM Pretty! 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM there is a mainplate for an ETA 2824 in there.. and the goal will be to eventually make my own.. but this is just a movement holder so I can assemble them 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM knurls knurls knurls 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0954-20CFB.jpg 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM new knurler is amazing 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM dunno if I even want to show you the universal one we use for that size dmovement.. well.. there's sort of two, but they both pull vacuum (suck) 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM excuse the strobe, but this is it 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0129-DCBD3.jpg 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM the issue is that it can tip over when applyiong pressure when screwing something down 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM and you end up scratching everything 27-Jan-20 06:02 AM so yeah, just making something more solid 27-Jan-20 07:56 AM nice 27-Jan-20 03:15 PM i tore down the rusty mill and put all the small components in evaporust, now I'm going to wash it all off and dry it, any suggestions on drying a ton of iron/steel fasteners without air drying (as I'm afraid rust will form again)? 27-Jan-20 03:15 PM I only have a small sparkfun heat gun...maybe i could put it in the oven and evaporate it there. or perhaps throw it all in vacuum chamber with foreline trap and pump down? 27-Jan-20 03:33 PM wipe them down with oil? 27-Jan-20 03:44 PM Yeah, wipe them down with paper towel and then coat with small amount of oil will prevent rust. Don't put it in your vacuum chamber, you don't want too much water vapour going through your pump if this isn't necessary 27-Jan-20 03:46 PM get a can of Fluid Film and a big jug of WD-40 27-Jan-20 03:46 PM soak in the wd-40 27-Jan-20 03:46 PM Maybe an alcohol wash, then WD40 27-Jan-20 03:46 PM spray with the fluid film 27-Jan-20 03:46 PM wd-40 was developed as a water displacing fluid 27-Jan-20 03:46 PM fluid film is lanolin based amazing in a can 27-Jan-20 03:46 PM once you get used to the smell anyway 27-Jan-20 05:34 PM ok, thanks all! 27-Jan-20 07:28 PM i removed all the rust, washed everything, mostly dried with towels and put everything under a heat lamp...rust already forming in the grooves of screws :\ i don't have wd40/fluid film but ordered some 27-Jan-20 07:28 PM however in general everything is looking good. i think this machine will have some new life 27-Jan-20 07:28 PM well - life, i don't think it had any in the first place 28-Jan-20 08:07 PM Favourite ideas on how to make a nice flat surface on the end of a ruby laser rod? ~4mm diameter. 28-Jan-20 08:08 PM send it to someone who specializes in glass 28-Jan-20 08:08 PM probably doable yourself if you are willing to spend time/money for a similar or slightly lower cost but i doubt something that small would cost a whole lot to get cleaned up 28-Jan-20 08:10 PM sanding, polishing, lapping/honing, in that order 28-Jan-20 08:10 PM beware of the angle you do them at though, don't want to make a perfectly flat but crooked window 28-Jan-20 08:10 PM you can use an optical flat for the last steps, they're cheap on ebay 28-Jan-20 08:56 PM Awesome 28-Jan-20 08:56 PM Probably have access to some of that 28-Jan-20 09:03 PM Does hand lapping on a piece of glass and optical flat make a difference? 28-Jan-20 09:03 PM an optical flat is optically flatter 28-Jan-20 09:03 PM I would've thought that the technique is by far the most significant variable here 28-Jan-20 09:04 PM you'd definitely need a jig to hold it in the right orientation 28-Jan-20 09:04 PM That reminds me to make a fiber lapping jig 28-Jan-20 09:04 PM But even then, I'd be super impressed if you can get a measurably better result 28-Jan-20 09:10 PM A jig is simple though, just surface stock in a lathe and then bore a hole the perfect size, add a set screw 28-Jan-20 09:22 PM A jig will help to make sure you have a relatively precise angle, but you still need an even distribution of force to remove material evenly across the surface. That relies on your technique. Also remember that since part of your jig must be touching the lapping surface, you may have an uneven surface simply because your jig is not perfectly flat, and since material removal rate is so slow, it can take forever to ensure that you are actually (fully) polishing the face of the crystal 28-Jan-20 09:22 PM A set screw here would be a bad idea, you just want the jig to help maintain a vertical angle, not to constrain the crystal axially as well 28-Jan-20 09:48 PM honestly...on something that thin i think you are likely to do more harm than good without a jig 28-Jan-20 09:48 PM also not sure if bore a hole and use a set screw is a proper jig for that sort of thing...depends how accurate you need things i suppose and if you are only fixing one end of it 28-Jan-20 10:15 PM anyone happen to have much input on the subject of lathe drives? thinking about putting together a glass working lathe but i am stuck on that aspect of things 28-Jan-20 10:15 PM was considering a belt but i am not sure if temperatures might start to be an issue 28-Jan-20 10:15 PM then was considering a chain drive (electric scooter size) 28-Jan-20 10:15 PM not sure if that would have issues with not being smooth enough 28-Jan-20 10:15 PM was planning to use a pair of slew bearings to have a large through hole on the spindle 28-Jan-20 10:28 PM would be trying to polish each end down to a flatness as close to 60nm as max deviation as possible 28-Jan-20 10:28 PM that's where it stops helping at all 28-Jan-20 10:34 PM so you do not just need flatness you also need the ends parallel dont you? 28-Jan-20 10:34 PM that is why i was saying it might make more sense to send it off 28-Jan-20 10:38 PM finished the other side, need to sand it a bit more, then onto milling 28-Jan-20 10:38 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0960-8817E.jpg 28-Jan-20 11:03 PM Yes, LRM 28-Jan-20 11:44 PM because it's never too lathe 28-Jan-20 11:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/video0-0C71A.mov 29-Jan-20 09:56 AM <__ice9#6039> Do not use a chain drive for a lathe!! 29-Jan-20 09:56 AM <__ice9#6039> Think of the implications.... 29-Jan-20 09:56 AM <__ice9#6039> Belts are the standard 29-Jan-20 09:56 AM <__ice9#6039> That way there can be small amounts of slippage in the event of a serious failure 29-Jan-20 09:56 AM <__ice9#6039> And it is a lot smoother 29-Jan-20 09:56 AM <__ice9#6039> Less vibration 29-Jan-20 09:56 AM <__ice9#6039> vee-belts usually 29-Jan-20 09:59 AM yes that was my concern too but i am not sure how much heat might impact that if i am using a torch on glass tubing 29-Jan-20 09:59 AM thats why i was unwillingly considering other options than belts 29-Jan-20 10:06 AM <__ice9#6039> Literally just aim a fan at it, if your actual lathe is getting hot enough to melt rubber 29-Jan-20 10:06 AM <__ice9#6039> I think in practice you may find that heat transfer through glass is abysmally low compared to carbon steel, however 29-Jan-20 10:06 AM <__ice9#6039> And that only having 3 thin lines of contact between the chuck and the glass is an important further limitation 29-Jan-20 10:08 AM guess i will just try the belt thing and change things down the road if necessary 29-Jan-20 10:09 AM <__ice9#6039> Usually stuff in the general vicinity of an oxyfuel torch does not become 150-200C unless the torch is actually being aimed at a part of the object in question. Most of the heat goes forward rather than sideways. Though there is some radiative transfer, it's likely only a fraction of a kilowatt for some random object sitting off to the side 29-Jan-20 10:09 AM <__ice9#6039> For context I once pointed a 3kW propane torch directly at a large aluminum heat sink and the temps 8 inches away on the heat sink were below 80C 29-Jan-20 10:10 AM maybe i am overthinking it then and worried about something that isnt really going to be an issue 29-Jan-20 10:11 AM <__ice9#6039> Yeah people use torches on glass in lathes all the time, including oxyfuel on quartz glass. It's fine. 29-Jan-20 05:08 PM Speaking of -- is it worth getting a ~cheap oxyacetylene torch setup for cutting if I plan to get an AlphaTIG or somesuch multiprocess welder in the ~medium term future? 29-Jan-20 05:08 PM I don't know if those tend to be any good for 'just cut this thing apart' 29-Jan-20 05:36 PM think you need to say how cheap and maybe what you are thinking you will be cutting 29-Jan-20 05:36 PM my main takeaway from oxyacetylene torch stuff is that cutting blows through oxygen very very fast so you need to be a bit strategic if you do not live near a gas supplier 29-Jan-20 05:41 PM mm, well. I'm looking to build some support structures for my vacuum systems, and getting some angle/channel iron and sticking it together seems like a good and relatively inexpensive way to build a forever-structure for it. In particular I was thinking that I could get some big bits of angle iron and torch through it to make cutouts that e.g. CF pipes can solidly rest in 29-Jan-20 05:41 PM i freely admit there may be better ways to go about this -- my kingdom for a hundred pounds of 80/20 to fall in my lap -- but i'm also not sure if this is totally stupid either 29-Jan-20 05:41 PM but as for cheapness, well, >.> harbor freight has an oxyacetylene bottles + regulators + torch + cart thing kit for <$300 29-Jan-20 05:41 PM so i had my eye on that, though perhaps that may be disastrously cheap 29-Jan-20 05:47 PM not sure how large of pipes we are talking but that sounds like more of a job for some well thought out jigs and a hole saw 29-Jan-20 05:47 PM oh, perhaps 29-Jan-20 05:47 PM most of my setup is 6" CF, so 4" pipe 29-Jan-20 05:47 PM some stuff probably larger 29-Jan-20 05:47 PM .. oh, yeah, huh. i have an angle grinder too 29-Jan-20 05:47 PM that would probably work also 29-Jan-20 05:52 PM yeah might be hard to cut the curve but you could block it out and then grind to shape 29-Jan-20 05:52 PM just do that all outside! grinding dust murders tools/most things 29-Jan-20 05:52 PM oh for sure 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> Oxyacetylene is good for cutting steel. It is not for cutting aluminum or stainless. It can be used for rapidly heating glass, though care should be taken to avoid excessive thermal shock. 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> For simply cutting random metals, a 50-60A plasma cutter is likely to be a better bet, but make sure to get one with HF start (not scratch start), and either a built-in pilot arc or you can just add one yourself by connecting e.g. 4x 100W 3Ω power resistors in series between the torch pilot arc lead and ground. 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> For welding, imo TIG is the easiest and most enjoyable. It is also far less messy than stick welding, and less extremely hot in the vicinity than MIG. Imo by far the most durable electrodes are slightly oversized thoriated (red color code) tungsten. I usually use 3/32 or 1/8. 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> For aluminum, though, stick welders with a positive electrode or AC TIG are usually easiest. It is possible to build an adaptor to make an ordinary DC or pulsed DC TIG welder run the electrode positive, though it needs an unusually thick electrode and will not handle heavy current. 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> It is also possible to just graft a TIG torch and a solenoid onto an old AC buzz box if you want AC TIG for less than $600. I've done it and it does work, even if it is a little bit silly looking. Continuous HF HV overlay may be necessary given the output is no longer a square wave, but can be added without much trouble using an inverter-driven neon sign transformer, a bypass capacitor, and a blocking inductor. 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> AC is also necessary for atomic hydrogen torches-- which are hotter than oxyacetylene, are reducing instead of oxidizing, and require only hydrogen gas to run. 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> If you want to use oxyfuel without the hassle and hazards of acetylene tanks, consider oxy-propane or oxy-propylene. 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm -- reading through that use case, personally, I would 100% just use a plasma torch. Point and click, done. 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> Plasma cutting a part submerged in water just below or just above the surface completely eliminates thermal distortion when cutting stainless plates, incidentally-- apart from greatly reducing the amount of residual heat involved. Flying gloppy jets of molten burning steel are very very hot. 29-Jan-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> The process produces a lot more fumes than TIG welding, for obvious reasons. Strongly recommend a good mask or a cheap supplied air respirator kit. Manganese fumes are particularly hazardous. 30-Jan-20 10:25 PM Prototype Movement Holder #1... works! 30-Jan-20 10:25 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0963-579CC.jpg 30-Jan-20 10:25 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0964-46C03.jpg 30-Jan-20 10:25 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0965-0D075.jpg 30-Jan-20 10:25 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0966-2AB91.jpg 30-Jan-20 10:25 PM last pic is upside down with a ETA 2824 mainplate held in with the flexure 31-Jan-20 04:00 AM Pretty! 31-Jan-20 08:38 PM What do you do when you want to mill gears? 31-Jan-20 08:38 PM https://youtu.be/EefFxEGVbWo 31-Jan-20 08:38 PM Correct, you just spin the whole work up in sync with the mill. 31-Jan-20 10:04 PM that needs a NSFW flag 31-Jan-20 10:04 PM way too neat 01-Feb-20 03:52 AM WOW 01-Feb-20 06:18 AM oh jeez 01-Feb-20 06:18 AM need a nice cnc machine 01-Feb-20 06:18 AM Noxz: how did you make the cuts? 01-Feb-20 06:18 AM with a saw? 01-Feb-20 06:18 AM I currently need some for springs/flexures - I guess I need more practice 01-Feb-20 06:18 AM any suggestions for decent saws? 01-Feb-20 06:18 AM ok, I guess it's primarily my inability ^^ 01-Feb-20 07:56 AM <__ice9#6039> Experimental shielded tungsten heating element connection. Spot-welding failed on the last one-- the metal is too brittle below 150C and the welds were not very good quality so they broke. Wire twisting is another classic method for high temperature electrical connections to metal heating elements. The terminal conductor is half of a 3mm lanthanated tungsten welding electrode on each side of the element. The element this time is 2.2m of 0.4mm tungsten wire, which at 40W/cm² should be able to dissipate just over 1kW. Cold resistance is about 1.28Ω, which should increase to about 12Ω when hot. 01-Feb-20 07:56 AM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/signal-2020-02-01-094354-F49C7.jpg 01-Feb-20 07:56 AM <__ice9#6039> One end of the high density sintered alumina tube has been sealed with silicone caulk. Once it has cured and been baked out, a slurry of calcia-stabilized zirconia powder will be poured in from the other end, baked out gently to consolidate it, and the process repeated until the resulting settled ceramic packing is close enough to the end of the tube to seal it as well. The heating element coil does not begin until about 5cm in on each side, which should leave enough space to prevent the silicone from failing, but more will likely be added over the ends on each side as well. 01-Feb-20 07:56 AM <__ice9#6039> The goal is to reliably hit 1800C in air without destroying the element 01-Feb-20 07:56 AM <__ice9#6039> Zirconia was chosen as the anti-vaporization packing material because it expands less than magnesia and alumina when heated, will not melt at 1800C and corrode the tube, but will still sinter around the element wire and thereby hopefully further reduce vaporization. 01-Feb-20 07:56 AM <__ice9#6039> The lifetime limiting factor will probably still be oxygen diffusion through the walls, but I want to find out. 01-Feb-20 07:56 AM <__ice9#6039> It's also possible that current flow directly through the zirconia shielding may further increase the element's power dissipation capacity 01-Feb-20 10:05 AM @N00N slitting saw on the milling head.. basically a circular saw blade you put on mills 01-Feb-20 10:05 AM this was my first time ever using them.. alignment is an issue, only a few teeth were cutting, but it worked, obviously 01-Feb-20 10:05 AM chip evacuation is important as with any cutting, so lubrication to cary the chips away is helpful 01-Feb-20 10:05 AM plus a bit more friction so it helps 01-Feb-20 10:05 AM also, when sitting a rod, you sometimes need to put in a soft (ie brass) rod in the center before hand to stop the tube from closing onto the cutter when finishing the cut.. sometimes it opens, sometimes it closes, based on internal stresses 01-Feb-20 10:05 AM I did not do this, it was small enough that I was not worried 01-Feb-20 10:38 AM hmm okay! 01-Feb-20 10:38 AM maybe I shoud redesign everything to make it reachable for a circular saw on the mill 01-Feb-20 10:38 AM (I have no edm or waterjet :() 01-Feb-20 11:21 AM <__ice9#6039> It's possible to build a sinker EDM PSU without too much difficulty, and oil pumps as well, but in practice having a nice CNC machine to actually move it around for you is pretty important 01-Feb-20 11:23 AM I love the idea of EDM.... for cutting certain materials + prototyping.. it doesnt really seem feasable for production (which is something I need to push myself towards, for my goals).. old technology is sometimes simple and effective 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM <__ice9#6039> Deep drilling stainless is one obvious use case 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM <__ice9#6039> Or even more disagreeable materials 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM yeah, again, that's not really something I need to do 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM and sorry to move the conversation in that direction 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM but just pointing out 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM personal reasons 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM I'd like a lot of machines.. but it comes down to: what do you need to do and how much 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM accuracy/precision is my #1 goal 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM given I'm basically operating on the micron level 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM or at least that is the end goal 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM I also have the annoying issue of trying to be traditional (watchmaking) to some degree... but know I wont get there doing thigns manually 01-Feb-20 11:24 AM tough line to walk 01-Feb-20 02:50 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xSlW-1vEUA 01-Feb-20 02:50 PM This guy does some pretty amazing work on his mill-turn 01-Feb-20 02:50 PM Makes some insane parts for the oil and gas industry 01-Feb-20 02:50 PM What's manufacturability if you can just spend tens of thousands on one part? 01-Feb-20 02:50 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-FC33D.png 01-Feb-20 02:50 PM That's in titanium by the way. The guy also had to delete videos on some of the most complicated parts because the customer was complaining 01-Feb-20 02:50 PM I'd actually love to know how much they paid for this one part 01-Feb-20 02:50 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-DAF73.png 01-Feb-20 03:21 PM he has had to delete a bunch of videos in the time I have been watching him 01-Feb-20 03:21 PM The parts he makes are very well planned out. Someday I hope that I can plan out operations as well as he can but the budgets his clients are working with is probably many times my usual stuff 01-Feb-20 03:24 PM Yeah I think he had some inconel parts that were on the same level of complexity as this 01-Feb-20 03:24 PM I'd like to learn his approach to fixturing and jigging for complex operations, also grinding custom form tool is super neat 01-Feb-20 03:25 PM That capability would be amazing to have at your fingertips wouldn't it? 01-Feb-20 03:25 PM I have made exactly 1 part in titanium and it was not as bad as I expected but I am charging 3 times as much next time. 01-Feb-20 03:25 PM The learning curve is basically | 01-Feb-20 03:25 PM Oh those feeds in that corner are not quite right? Goodbye endmill...lets grab another one 01-Feb-20 03:28 PM Lots of coolant and use insert tooling if you can is what I'm told 01-Feb-20 03:28 PM Try your best to prevent work hardening by taking decent sized cuts 01-Feb-20 03:28 PM We had some titanium parts on a hot exhaust manifold, and they turned the prettiest colors 01-Feb-20 03:29 PM Yep, I just did not quote it at high enough rate for 1) the stress 2) the frustration 3) the risk of titanium chip fires 01-Feb-20 03:35 PM I know a welder who's really good with Ti sheet metal (in a purge chamber). 01-Feb-20 03:35 PM And he made this 01-Feb-20 03:35 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/pixlr_20171112004416525-01-7634B.jpeg 01-Feb-20 03:35 PM That's a full titanium muffler 01-Feb-20 03:36 PM damn talk about overkill 01-Feb-20 03:36 PM but beautiful overkill 01-Feb-20 03:37 PM Yeah actually it didn't cost us that much, he volunteered to do it lol 01-Feb-20 03:37 PM i have some little titanium sheet metal pieces that someday i will find a use for 01-Feb-20 03:37 PM no idea what the original purpose was but there are 5 about 3x3inch squares with a hole punched near a corner 01-Feb-20 03:37 PM at least they are labeled titanium and were in some of my chemist/jeweler relative's stuff I was given after he passed 01-Feb-20 03:37 PM has the muffler continued to change colors? i am assuming so... 01-Feb-20 03:37 PM i bet after a few years that will look even cooler 01-Feb-20 03:40 PM We had a bunch of Ti sheet scrap as well, so we cut as many pieces out of it as possible and used them as clamps and adaptors, the exhaust nozzles are held on by Ti plates here 01-Feb-20 03:40 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20171104_000732-6E5BB.jpg 01-Feb-20 03:40 PM It stopped at white 01-Feb-20 03:40 PM And we only used it for ~30 hours and it had to be taken out and repacked 01-Feb-20 03:40 PM There were also an obscene amout of Ti hardware inside this engine 01-Feb-20 03:41 PM any mechanical/performance reason or just because they can? 01-Feb-20 03:42 PM The hardware alone would be more than the cost of the 2nd hand engine in the first place lol 01-Feb-20 03:42 PM Well it saves a heck of a lot of weight 01-Feb-20 03:42 PM And we have the hardware for free from a sponsor so why not? 01-Feb-20 03:43 PM so a little of both? sounds good to me 01-Feb-20 03:43 PM also free hardware = all the titanium, obviously 01-Feb-20 03:45 PM Well up to a point. I didn't replace all the bolts with Ti when I was rebuilding this one, but I did go all out on another engine 01-Feb-20 03:45 PM Including bolts for the head (not torque to yield, strangely) 01-Feb-20 03:45 PM The weld stayed gold while the thinner sheet turned purple and finally white 01-Feb-20 03:45 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20180421_184528-88B10.jpg 01-Feb-20 03:48 PM titanium is just too pretty, getting aluminum anodized in as nice of colors is really hard 01-Feb-20 03:49 PM And unless you get it anodized the oxide color does not stay 01-Feb-20 03:49 PM Scruff it and it looks really quite bad 01-Feb-20 05:06 PM <__ice9#6039> All that oxidation is not a good sign for welding titanium-- but it looks like it probably happened afterward during cooling or later use rather than during the actual weld 01-Feb-20 05:06 PM <__ice9#6039> Yeah it's clearly from ordinary use afterward 01-Feb-20 05:07 PM Yeah it looked nothing like this when new, the oxides built up during a long 5 hour dyno run 01-Feb-20 05:09 PM <__ice9#6039> Good purge chamber 01-Feb-20 05:09 PM <__ice9#6039> Titanium is infamously difficult to weld 01-Feb-20 05:09 PM <__ice9#6039> That and magnesium 01-Feb-20 05:11 PM Laser welders here would be super useful 01-Feb-20 05:11 PM There's an internal plate inside the muffler that was hard to do with a TIG torch, it eventually warped under the constant heating and cooling cycles and the weld failed 01-Feb-20 05:36 PM <__ice9#6039> I wonder what kind of pulse profile is needed for laser welding. 01-Feb-20 05:36 PM <__ice9#6039> https://www.ebindustries.com/cw-and-pulsed-laser-welding/ This article suggests milliseconds, so Q-switching might be too fast 01-Feb-20 05:36 PM <__ice9#6039> Tends to vaporize stuff 01-Feb-20 05:36 PM <__ice9#6039> Flashtubes might work though 01-Feb-20 05:39 PM Nanosecond q-switched fiber lasers can be used for welding, even at a low average power 01-Feb-20 05:39 PM <__ice9#6039> Huh interesting 01-Feb-20 05:39 PM <__ice9#6039> YAG should work too then 01-Feb-20 05:39 PM You need really high rep rates 01-Feb-20 05:39 PM Let me find the reference from SPI 01-Feb-20 05:39 PM https://www.spilasers.com/whitepapers/pulsed-ns-fiber-lasers-they-can-weld-too/ 01-Feb-20 05:39 PM YAG rods are usually a bit too large to produce super fast pulses 01-Feb-20 05:41 PM <__ice9#6039> >Having typically less than a few millijoules in pulse energy pulses and up to 100W of average power Yeah this is the key issue 01-Feb-20 05:41 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes I agree 01-Feb-20 05:42 PM But it's possible, something I'd like to try when my laser arrives 01-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> YAG Q-switch pulses tend to be Joules, not mJ 01-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> For passive anyway 01-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> If you use RF there is more control 01-Feb-20 05:42 PM Well to get one joule you'd need a big YAG rod 01-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> Not really 01-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> Even those silly eBay tattoo removal machines dump about a Joule per pulse and the rod is pretty typical sized, maybe a bit on the small side 01-Feb-20 05:44 PM Well typically sized is ~3 mm diameter, ~8 cm in length? 01-Feb-20 05:45 PM <__ice9#6039> I checked the cap energy against the xenon flashtube spectrum screened for the YAG absorption region and accounted for the overall light efficiency of the flashtube and resistive losses and the estimate came out to pretty close to what the video author claimed as well 01-Feb-20 05:45 PM <__ice9#6039> Yeah 01-Feb-20 05:45 PM <__ice9#6039> I don't own one. Just watched someone demonstrate on video 01-Feb-20 05:45 PM <__ice9#6039> Lots of surface vaporization 01-Feb-20 05:46 PM Oh this is the wrong channel lol... But there is definetely an advantage to flashlamp pumping when you only care about pulse energy 01-Feb-20 05:47 PM <__ice9#6039> (I do not watch high powered lasers in person, even with goggles. Only remote camera.) 01-Feb-20 05:47 PM <__ice9#6039> Yeah definitely 01-Feb-20 05:47 PM <__ice9#6039> The machine paired it with a passive Q-switching crystal 01-Feb-20 05:47 PM -> #lasers_and_optics ? 01-Feb-20 05:47 PM <__ice9#6039> Simplest method 01-Feb-20 05:47 PM <__ice9#6039> Sure, was discussing usable types for laser welding, but yes 01-Feb-20 05:53 PM you can weld metal to glass with ultrafast lasers 01-Feb-20 06:21 PM Do you need femptosecond lasers for that? 01-Feb-20 06:32 PM picosecond apparently 01-Feb-20 06:32 PM https://www.lasersystemseurope.com/news/ultrafast-laser-used-successfully-weld-glass-metal 01-Feb-20 06:32 PM Low picoseconds yeah 02-Feb-20 10:29 AM YESS 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> Experimental shielded tungsten heating element failed from thermal stress during preheat at 400W. No vapor explosion or apparent overpressure. Just gently cracked through almost the exact middle (hottest part) and sagged. Sintered alumina cannot be used in a manner similar to quartz. Sapphire likely could, granted, but fused sapphire tubes are rather less often available. 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> I knew the thermal shock tolerance was bad, but I didn't know it was that bad. The thing wasn't even glowing externally yet, nor were the inner walls of the tube as seen through the split. 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> Guess it's up to the graphite argon furnace to go beyond 1400C uniformly 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> I may try sticking the remains into a quartz outer tube and trying again, not caring if the tube melts around it like SiC element oxide layers do, but in practice it would still be limited to about 1600C at best. 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> I have torched these things with a propylene torch to about 1000C as a test and had some fractures at that point, but I did not expect this. It's possible that perhaps they may need to be annealed at 1400-1700C for a few hours. Perhaps they were low temperature sintered and retain too much internal stress. 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> High temperature sintering usually produces a stronger resulting object as well 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> At about 1850-1900C, it is possible with prolonged heating to convert sintered polycrystalline alumina objects into single crystals. 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> Single crystal sapphire has much better thermal shock resistance than polycrystalline sintered alumina. So converting some of those tubes may be a project for the graphite furnace. 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> But a setter plate of some kind will be needed to prevent contamination 02-Feb-20 05:42 PM <__ice9#6039> Probably with a suitably chosen refractory metal carbide 02-Feb-20 06:16 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm actually plain old zirconia is probably good enough for this 02-Feb-20 06:16 PM <__ice9#6039> The bottom may get contaminated with zirconium carbide, but given a melting point of 3530C, that's comparable to the graphite itself 02-Feb-20 08:08 PM only a few extra components after rebuild :\ 02-Feb-20 08:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-16EED.png 02-Feb-20 08:54 PM that went from looking like scrap to something worthwhile 02-Feb-20 09:00 PM looks great! 02-Feb-20 09:00 PM hopefully the extra bits are not anything important 02-Feb-20 09:00 PM did you look up the parts diagram? not sure what model you have exactly but they have that in the end of each manual https://littlemachineshop.com/Info/docs.php?type=ug 02-Feb-20 09:11 PM Wow looks amazing compared to its original state! 02-Feb-20 09:11 PM How was the condition of the ways? 02-Feb-20 09:28 PM @LRM yeah, unfortunately the diagram doesn't label anything about the fasteners -- eg it just says "screw" and nothing else for each screw, "washer", etc 02-Feb-20 09:28 PM @Mason_Yu pretty good after 24 hours of evaporust...vinegar didn't do much in some tests. i did scrub the ways a bit afterwards to still remove some of the cruft 02-Feb-20 09:30 PM Oh, do you have a good straight edge? 02-Feb-20 09:30 PM Could be worth it put the straight edge along the ways and see if there are spots where light shines though 02-Feb-20 09:31 PM i have a square, ahh good idea 02-Feb-20 09:32 PM But it's hard to do much about damaged ways without scraping them, which is impossible without a surface plate and probably not worth it for this small mill 02-Feb-20 09:32 PM If it works though, then don't worry about it too much, the frame is not made for precision or heavy cuts in the first place anyway 02-Feb-20 09:32 PM This reminds me to pick out a surface plate 02-Feb-20 09:41 PM If you have a good indicator, then running the bed under it over the x and y axes and measuring the variation in height is a good idea. It will tell you if things are flat and parallel overall 02-Feb-20 10:25 PM ahh i'll see if i can mount one 02-Feb-20 11:18 PM <__ice9#6039> That's really impressive 03-Feb-20 01:12 AM My favorite is that it appears to have been reassembled in his kitchen. Reminds me of cleaning my dirt bike engine in a dishwasher to remove all the metal flakes from a top end failure. 03-Feb-20 11:39 AM hah, does it dry it well enough not to cause rust? 03-Feb-20 11:40 AM no, it required pretty well immediate wipe down with oil 03-Feb-20 11:40 AM thankfully all the large parts were aluminum and the intricate parts lived in oil anyhow 03-Feb-20 12:10 PM ahh 03-Feb-20 09:27 PM <__ice9#6039> I mentioned this in iirc #radiation, but: Tungsten is not fundamentally a brittle metal. It merely has a ductile-brittle transition at 150C. If you heat it a bit with a torch, particularly if you go ahead and get it a nice red hot, it will bend about as easily as a stiff steel wire. 03-Feb-20 09:27 PM <__ice9#6039> Granted it will oxidize a bit at the surface, especially if you go to orange/yellow heat by accident, so try to work reasonably quickly. Red with brief excursions to orange leaves only a relatively thin colorful oxide film. Yellow gets thicker and spalls, white will outright evaporate. 03-Feb-20 09:33 PM As far as I know there's a region where tungsten really doesn't like being, when used as a thermionic filament 03-Feb-20 09:33 PM <__ice9#6039> 600C is bad 03-Feb-20 09:34 PM Why 600 specifically? 03-Feb-20 09:34 PM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Screenshot_20200203-233426-57BED.png 03-Feb-20 09:34 PM <__ice9#6039> Oxide differences 03-Feb-20 09:35 PM I don't mean in atmosphere 03-Feb-20 09:35 PM I mean in vacuum 03-Feb-20 09:35 PM <__ice9#6039> Oh lol I should have realized that 03-Feb-20 09:35 PM <__ice9#6039> Not sure, may be related to grain growth 03-Feb-20 09:35 PM From tidbits of info I've read, tungsten doesn't want to sit too cold 03-Feb-20 09:35 PM obviously too warm kills it but that's common sense, it'll sag or melt 03-Feb-20 09:35 PM most vacuum tubes, especially x-ray, seem to be operated from "serious red hot" to "white hot" 03-Feb-20 09:36 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm yeah thermionic emission near the melting point would be very intense regardless 03-Feb-20 09:36 PM <__ice9#6039> Also it will evaporate rapidly by that point 03-Feb-20 09:37 PM where being near the middle extends the life of the tube, going up decreases it dramatically 03-Feb-20 09:37 PM but also... going lower, does that? 03-Feb-20 09:37 PM there seems to be this region of happiness 03-Feb-20 09:38 PM <__ice9#6039> That's interesting. It may have something to do with ductility. Not sure. I do know that heating enough will recrystallize the material, and that molybdenum vacuum furnace heating elements can become very brittle in some thermal cycling patterns 03-Feb-20 09:39 PM cycling definitely seems to be an issue too 03-Feb-20 09:39 PM <__ice9#6039> Speaking of which calcia-stabilized zirconia has a temperature region in which it becomes destabilized 03-Feb-20 09:39 PM I wonder if laser filaments could be useful for x-ray tubes 03-Feb-20 09:39 PM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/19630001112_1-10C79.pdf 03-Feb-20 09:39 PM I think they've been made experimentally 03-Feb-20 09:40 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm how does that work? Just heat a patch of metal with a laser? 03-Feb-20 09:40 PM not heated, but photocathode 03-Feb-20 09:40 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Chapter2_p14_eng-56AE7.png 03-Feb-20 09:40 PM apparently this 03-Feb-20 09:40 PM I don't think air-stable photocathodes are common, or exist at all 03-Feb-20 09:40 PM so it's a bit out of a hobbyist's reach 03-Feb-20 09:41 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm interesting 03-Feb-20 09:41 PM <__ice9#6039> Well there is always lanthanum hexaboride. 03-Feb-20 09:42 PM isn't that a FEG thing, not photocathode? 03-Feb-20 09:42 PM yeah it's FEG 03-Feb-20 09:42 PM <__ice9#6039> I meant as a tungsten filament alternative 03-Feb-20 09:42 PM sure, but it's even more fragile 03-Feb-20 09:42 PM chromium I believe is suitable, and you don't need it exposed directly to air anyhow as a good pulse will send electrons right through a thin film coating 03-Feb-20 09:42 PM chromium and deep UV has been used I think, lemme look 03-Feb-20 09:42 PM <__ice9#6039> Huh interesting 03-Feb-20 09:43 PM there are other ways too though like laser through plasma 03-Feb-20 09:43 PM highly collimated intense xray generation 03-Feb-20 09:43 PM I have a 1700nm focus tube that doesn't even really use collimation 03-Feb-20 09:43 PM produces a whopping 26mW, and has a really weird mechanical construction 03-Feb-20 09:43 PM something definitely for #machining 03-Feb-20 09:43 PM lol 03-Feb-20 09:44 PM <__ice9#6039> https://avs.scitation.org/doi/abs/10.1116/1.1539070?journalCode=jvn This is really impressive 03-Feb-20 09:44 PM <__ice9#6039> 9% optical to x-ray efficiency 03-Feb-20 09:44 PM that is very powerful 03-Feb-20 09:44 PM the laser wakefield acceleration stuff is neat too 03-Feb-20 09:45 PM <__ice9#6039> And it's directed 03-Feb-20 09:45 PM and you can feed through without ridiculous dielectric isolation 03-Feb-20 09:46 PM <__ice9#6039> Granted these are soft x-rays so more useful for semiconductor fab than imaging 03-Feb-20 09:46 PM throw in "intense" and "pulsed" to your terms hehe 03-Feb-20 09:46 PM should probably move this to #radiation 03-Feb-20 09:46 PM agreed 04-Feb-20 12:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Anyone ever made float glass? 04-Feb-20 12:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Kind of want to try melting old leaded crystal and casting small windows out of it 04-Feb-20 04:40 PM is there a reason to need float glass instead of grinding things flat/parallel? i think on small scale the grinding/polishing/lapping might be easier than that...certainly could be wrong 04-Feb-20 08:48 PM <__ice9#6039> Based on thermal expansion coefficients it looks like just dumping tin into a graphite crucible and chunks of broken glass onto it and firing with a cover until the glass melts to prevent tin oxide contamination, then letting it cool (tin and glass pull away from the walls) should be adequate 04-Feb-20 08:49 PM i have never heard of that being done but it would be an easy way to make a lot of handy things if it works 04-Feb-20 08:54 PM <__ice9#6039> I think I will try it. It will be a good test run for my latest furnace before going to argon shielded fume extraction with catalytic exhaust oxidation for carbonization 04-Feb-20 08:54 PM <__ice9#6039> In other words I have to test whether the thing gets up to proper operating temp before testing the whole system, may as well have something inside at the time 04-Feb-20 08:55 PM so something i just thought of 04-Feb-20 08:55 PM would it even be possible to do tin float with lead glass? 04-Feb-20 08:56 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes 04-Feb-20 08:56 PM wont the lead glass absorb a bunch of tin and stick? 04-Feb-20 08:56 PM <__ice9#6039> Oh I don't know about absorption 04-Feb-20 08:56 PM <__ice9#6039> That's an interesting question 04-Feb-20 08:56 PM <__ice9#6039> I'm actually pretty new at this 04-Feb-20 08:56 PM <__ice9#6039> I have done more with technical ceramics than common glasses 04-Feb-20 08:57 PM i only know glass stuff a tiny bit from an exgf haha 04-Feb-20 08:57 PM <__ice9#6039> Useful 04-Feb-20 08:57 PM but i know that lead glass is very easy to color because the lead makes it absorb a whole lot of things 04-Feb-20 08:57 PM <__ice9#6039> Interesting, researching.... 04-Feb-20 08:57 PM lot easier to get an even mix with it for stained glass working 04-Feb-20 08:58 PM <__ice9#6039> Apparently yes it does do that 04-Feb-20 08:58 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm don't really want to use my nice galinstan here 04-Feb-20 08:58 PM <__ice9#6039> That stuff is expensive 04-Feb-20 08:58 PM <__ice9#6039> Wonder whether any other metals work 04-Feb-20 08:59 PM i think you can just cast the glass and then finish grind it 04-Feb-20 08:59 PM not sure how to ensure you do not get bubbles but maybe a baking process? 04-Feb-20 08:59 PM <__ice9#6039> Yeah I just really dislike grinding silicates 04-Feb-20 08:59 PM <__ice9#6039> Oh that part is easier-- just use a lot of superheat and let it cool slowly in the molds 04-Feb-20 09:00 PM not a favorite of mine either, gotta keep it all wet and the residue gets everywhere 04-Feb-20 09:02 PM <__ice9#6039> https://www.uqgoptics.com/catalogue/optical-windows/windows/lead-glass-windows-plates/ I think you are right. Looks like they polish it. 04-Feb-20 09:02 PM <__ice9#6039> And grind it 04-Feb-20 09:02 PM <__ice9#6039> Tin boils at 2600C. Wonder whether it reacts with quartz. 04-Feb-20 09:02 PM <__ice9#6039> There is some solubility, yes. Oh well. 04-Feb-20 09:02 PM <__ice9#6039> Wonder about alumina though. Lol sapphire float glass 04-Feb-20 09:02 PM <__ice9#6039> The graphite furnace is going to be great. I made this current carbonization furnace to make the insulation to build the graphite furnace, and for making glassy carbon and spare parts etc 04-Feb-20 09:07 PM maybe you could press a window out of not quite fluid glass 04-Feb-20 09:07 PM then finish polish it 05-Feb-20 05:42 PM If transparent glass is not a requirement, one can do artificial leaded granite: lead glass ground to chunks of different size (10mm to sand), cast in epoxy. 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> Yeah at that point I would just cast the lead 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> I meant for a viewing window for an ebeam 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> And for certain uses with x-ray tubes 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> For e.g. checking whether the tube is arcing etc 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> During tests 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> ebeam PVD makes a lot of soft x-rays unfortunately 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> The entire chamber is all stainless steel but there is a quartz viewport 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> And I want that covered in leaded glass too 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> Huh. Actually I guess I could just use a thicker layer of any random glass on top of the quartz viewport. It's only 10kV 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Screenshot_20200205-202222-35524.png 05-Feb-20 06:18 PM <__ice9#6039> That doesn't really work for viewing an operating x-ray tube, though. That needs lead glass and it should be pretty thick in its own right 07-Feb-20 10:23 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/60245877697__D61116F7-3DC2-41A8-8124-D2AA8-9AFD0.JPG 07-Feb-20 11:06 AM Using my taig CNC mill... Unenclosed... on a carpeted floor.... Equal time spent machining and vacuuming chips out of the carpet... 07-Feb-20 11:07 AM you're never gonna get rid of those chips in your carpet 07-Feb-20 11:09 AM The carpet is 40 years old and we're planning to replace it anyways. 07-Feb-20 11:17 AM I want to fill a pool with that 07-Feb-20 11:17 AM go swimming in razor blades 08-Feb-20 02:08 AM you could make some solder iron strippy pads 08-Feb-20 02:08 AM or a high abrasive tooth paste 08-Feb-20 01:36 PM movement holder v2.0 .. milled one, waiting to do the slitting saw, but waiting on new nitrile gloves to be delivered because I ran out 08-Feb-20 01:36 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0988-A12D8.jpg 08-Feb-20 03:17 PM any thoughts on how to gauge how much current (@ 240VAC) i really need for welding some aluminum or steel? i was given a Lincoln 175 and it uses a NEMA 6-50 outlet and uses 230VAC -- I know I have two 240VACs in my place for AC unit with 40A breaker (not sure where this is honestly, I'm guessing goes to the outdoor fan unit on my roof) and another 15A breaker which is much more accessible...so trying to determine if I could get away with the 15A outlet for small work 08-Feb-20 03:17 PM (not sure if there's a more appropriate channel for this) 08-Feb-20 03:18 PM Just limit the welder to that input current and tinker 08-Feb-20 03:22 PM since the welder output voltage is much diff, do i just assume ~90% power efficiency and convert wattage to figure that out? 08-Feb-20 03:22 PM Or just measure it live 08-Feb-20 03:23 PM good idea 08-Feb-20 03:23 PM What is the welder rated at? 08-Feb-20 03:23 PM Input current wise 08-Feb-20 03:23 PM what sort of proximity is your welding work area to your breaker box? 08-Feb-20 03:23 PM i'm confused by the input current 08-Feb-20 03:23 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Screenshot_2020-02-08_15.23.41-52AD4.png 08-Feb-20 03:23 PM @LRM 6 meters maybe 08-Feb-20 03:23 PM confused by those current ratings as the NEMA 6-50 makes me assume 50A should be max...or maybe those make sense if it's a low duty cycle? 08-Feb-20 03:28 PM i do not think you will be doing much besides getting frustrated trying to run that on the 15A breaker 08-Feb-20 03:28 PM especially with 6m of 14awg (12awg if you are lucky) providing the current 08-Feb-20 03:28 PM are you able to consider running a dedicated circuit for the welder? 08-Feb-20 03:28 PM pretty easy to add breakers if you have space in your box 08-Feb-20 03:30 PM i could try...would be fun to learn how. there are a few spots in the breaker 08-Feb-20 03:31 PM it is very very easy, the hardest part when i have done it is dealing with the city if you are doing it all legit with permits and stuff 08-Feb-20 03:31 PM the paperwork cost almost as much as the materials for running the new circuit did for some stupid reason 08-Feb-20 03:32 PM ahh 08-Feb-20 03:33 PM it is basically just thread the wire through conduit 08-Feb-20 03:33 PM and screw the wire into screw terminals on the outlet/breaker 08-Feb-20 03:33 PM oh maybe a little math to make sure you do not overfill the conduit 08-Feb-20 03:33 PM but i was lucky and just ran it along the wall in my garage 08-Feb-20 03:35 PM hmm do i need to be licensed to get a permit? 08-Feb-20 03:35 PM nope 08-Feb-20 03:35 PM i emailed my city's building/planning people and they walked me through it 08-Feb-20 03:35 PM nice, where are you located? 08-Feb-20 03:35 PM cool 08-Feb-20 03:35 PM i'm west hollywood, not terribly far 08-Feb-20 03:36 PM <__ice9#6039> I've run a TIG welder briefly up to about 100A on a 220V 15A circuit before. You will trip it occasionally. But NEMA actually allows welders to use much more current intermittently than the circuit is rated for, because of the low duty cycle. The breakers are designed not to trip for a while. 08-Feb-20 03:36 PM the guy who came out to do the inspection was geeking out at my mill and some of the other stuff i had out 08-Feb-20 03:36 PM haha nice 08-Feb-20 03:36 PM hopefully there's no issue running a TIG inside 08-Feb-20 03:37 PM <__ice9#6039> I later obtained a much larger circuit at a new residence. I have had no such hassles subsequently. 08-Feb-20 03:37 PM <__ice9#6039> I do not recommend doing it inside, though it is possible 08-Feb-20 03:37 PM avoid galvanized metals and definitely have alright airflow...probably okay 08-Feb-20 03:37 PM usually people use fume extraction gear indoors though 08-Feb-20 03:37 PM <__ice9#6039> It is very important to have good ventilation and please consider using a supplied air respirator 08-Feb-20 03:37 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes that's correct. 08-Feb-20 03:37 PM <__ice9#6039> A large fan with a carbon filter is a good cheap approach 08-Feb-20 03:38 PM any suggestions on good ventilation? 08-Feb-20 03:38 PM cool 08-Feb-20 03:38 PM <__ice9#6039> look on eBay for supplied air respirator 08-Feb-20 03:38 PM <__ice9#6039> They run on an air compressor 08-Feb-20 03:38 PM or set up a giant sized soldering exhaust system 08-Feb-20 03:38 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes that's what I just described re: fan 08-Feb-20 03:39 PM i've set up a fume hood but probably difficult to weld in it 08-Feb-20 03:39 PM yeah i just wanted to give him more of a mental image of tube + fan instead of just box fan + filter 08-Feb-20 03:39 PM <__ice9#6039> Lol true 08-Feb-20 03:39 PM <__ice9#6039> If you use a big enough box fan it doesn't matter though 08-Feb-20 03:39 PM both would probably work...just one is more efficient 08-Feb-20 03:39 PM exactly 08-Feb-20 03:40 PM if i just get a good fan and adjustable ducting, i assume i wouldn't need the respirator? 08-Feb-20 03:40 PM that is what i would personally do 08-Feb-20 03:40 PM as i'd rather just evacuate any fumes (so when i remove respirator i don't deal with any fumes) 08-Feb-20 03:40 PM <__ice9#6039> Some other things: aluminum is pretty benign. Carbon steel is also pretty benign. But stainless and galvanized both produce hazardous fumes. 08-Feb-20 03:40 PM <__ice9#6039> Stainless: chromium, manganese 08-Feb-20 03:40 PM you will need to play with the fan power/distance to make sure that you are not sucking away your shielding gas 08-Feb-20 03:41 PM <__ice9#6039> Galvanized obviously zinc 08-Feb-20 03:41 PM <__ice9#6039> Chrome plated also obviously chromium 08-Feb-20 03:41 PM <__ice9#6039> A supplied air respirator can be obtained for only about $40 and a few pipe fittings 08-Feb-20 03:41 PM <__ice9#6039> It will also keep you cool under the helmet 08-Feb-20 03:41 PM <__ice9#6039> Another trick I learned is to wear UV laser safety glasses under the helmet and use a slightly lighter tinted shade 08-Feb-20 03:41 PM <__ice9#6039> It provides better visibility and better protection than the standard shade 08-Feb-20 03:43 PM polycarbonate safety glasses will work to provide minor flash protection too...from the UV not the brightness 08-Feb-20 03:43 PM <__ice9#6039> Does not compare to OD7+ laser specs 08-Feb-20 03:43 PM auto darkening helmets are awesome too if you get a decent deal on them...always love borrowing my friend's 08-Feb-20 03:44 PM <__ice9#6039> Though tbf polycarbonate is still pretty good 08-Feb-20 03:44 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm what else 08-Feb-20 03:44 PM <__ice9#6039> Kevlar knit gloves are cheap on eBay and work well underneath the usual leather welding gloves 08-Feb-20 03:44 PM <__ice9#6039> Get welding gloves with aluminized backing 08-Feb-20 03:44 PM <__ice9#6039> They really help when you are running at like 120-200A or plasma cutting 08-Feb-20 03:44 PM <__ice9#6039> Or MIG welding 08-Feb-20 03:44 PM <__ice9#6039> Buy some UV blocking arm sleeves like for what runners wear 08-Feb-20 03:44 PM <__ice9#6039> And make sure your helmet covers your neck or get a neck sleeve 08-Feb-20 03:44 PM <__ice9#6039> Unless you want stripes 08-Feb-20 03:49 PM also, this might seem stupidly obvious but things get way hotter than you might expect them to 08-Feb-20 03:49 PM dont hold onto anything you just welded even with really nice welding gloves 08-Feb-20 04:00 PM <__ice9#6039> >confused by those current ratings as the NEMA 6-50 makes me assume 50A should be max...or maybe those make sense if it's a low duty cycle? Welders don't use 220V output voltage. 08-Feb-20 04:00 PM <__ice9#6039> For plasma cutters, the arc voltage is usually about 80-160V depending on what the specific torch is designed to use 08-Feb-20 04:00 PM <__ice9#6039> For welders it can be under 40V 08-Feb-20 04:01 PM @__ice9 it says "input current" so assuming that meant the current on the input power side 08-Feb-20 04:01 PM <__ice9#6039> Oh you meant that. 08-Feb-20 04:01 PM <__ice9#6039> Yeah that's the NEMA intermittent use thing I mentioned, yes 08-Feb-20 04:01 PM i see 08-Feb-20 04:31 PM i have a 350W fume extractor/air filter meant for laser cutter (100mm flange) -- it doesn't exhaust outside, it just exhausts into the room after filtering -- would that suffice? 08-Feb-20 04:48 PM <__ice9#6039> It's better to have a cross-wind 08-Feb-20 05:02 PM k 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> On the subject of my recent digression in #swap-meet about hydrofluoric acid: inorganic stainless steel soldering fluxes consisting of buffered HCl, HF, and chloride and fluoride salts are also excellent for soldering to Kanthal wire. 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> Unfortunately, they rapidly corrode and blacken aluminum wire if you accidentally try to use them on it. For aluminum, I find that cadmium based solders and brazing rods like e.g. Muggy Weld (lol yes that one) are actually pretty effective if you have the patience for dealing with their weird blobby clinging behavior and narrow temperature range messy flux. But wear a respirator. Cadmium is toxic. 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> Empirically, I have found that it isn't really necessary with the stainless fluxes. The amount of liberated vapors is quite small and I think traces of them smell rather nice tbh. But it may be useful if working with larger quantities-- at which point long gloves and a face mask are probably also advisable. 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> This is the one I use. Note it should be used with a solder containing at least a few percent silver. 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200209_000039-AB704.jpg 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> Tinned copper to Kanthal-A1 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200208_235227-07B30.jpg 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> (before cleaning) 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> lol this one ate some of the glass 08-Feb-20 09:55 PM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200208_234848-A910D.jpg 09-Feb-20 02:37 AM says it contains HF :P 09-Feb-20 02:37 AM but why solder to the wire instead of just clamping/crimping to it? any benefit? actually... wait... wouldn't it melt when it heats up? lol 09-Feb-20 02:40 AM yeah you usally want to crimp kanthal for that exact reason 09-Feb-20 10:45 AM spot/contact welding to molybdinum electrodes may work 09-Feb-20 10:45 AM iirc that is how Tungsten electrodes are made 09-Feb-20 10:56 AM <__ice9#6039> You act like I haven't done this dozens of times before. 09-Feb-20 10:56 AM <__ice9#6039> No, it does not melt. 09-Feb-20 10:56 AM <__ice9#6039> Crimps tend to get loose when the wire oxidizes and they make poor contact and spark if the crimp surface isn't wide enough. 09-Feb-20 10:56 AM <__ice9#6039> The crimping metal also tends to oxidize badly at the contact site and eventually fail, accelerated by thermal expansion differences and high temperature gradients across the joint 09-Feb-20 10:56 AM <__ice9#6039> If you need to join to Kanthal in a hot zone, you don't crimp it. You twist it. 09-Feb-20 10:59 AM how I attached Nichrome for a little tube style furnace I made once was to wrap it around bolts that had a nut tightened to it, that then went through the kiln bricks where I would attach the lectricity to (as feed throughs) .. that is my only exp 09-Feb-20 10:59 AM it worked 09-Feb-20 11:01 AM <__ice9#6039> If you need to join to Kanthal heating elements at their ends, where there isn't 10 inches of wire to twist or you want a more compact joint, soldering is fine. Why? Because it's outside the hot zone, the joint is against 2-3x wraps of the element at once which minimizes local heating due to lower resistance, and the copper is thermally coupled so well that it carries the heat away. 09-Feb-20 11:01 AM <__ice9#6039> That works also @Noxz 09-Feb-20 11:02 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0305-3AAC2.jpg 09-Feb-20 11:02 AM under powered cords, but it was an initial test 09-Feb-20 11:02 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0306-7DD3B.jpg 09-Feb-20 11:02 AM <__ice9#6039> But not crimps. Screws preferably with lock washers. 09-Feb-20 11:02 AM lock washers would have been nice 09-Feb-20 11:02 AM I may look into making a heat treat oven in the nearish future 09-Feb-20 11:02 AM also, that was my very first attempt at such a thing 09-Feb-20 11:02 AM so please dont critisize it too much 09-Feb-20 11:05 AM <__ice9#6039> Another thing that works, for larger bar shaped heating elements, is gravity or a belt clasp against a thick copper or aluminum strap. That's how SiC Starbars and MoSi2 MolyD (Kanthal Super) elements are driven. 09-Feb-20 11:05 AM <__ice9#6039> Actually it looks perfectly reasonable and I'm happy to chat about furnace design and construction. I've built 6 of them so far and will be doing a 7th soon 09-Feb-20 11:05 AM <__ice9#6039> My first one used crimps. They failed on oxidation, arced over to the element, and melted it at the end, repeatedly. And then I stopped using crimps. 09-Feb-20 11:14 AM was finishing up brunch, dishes, and laundry (typical Sunday).. 09-Feb-20 11:14 AM What advantages does vacuum furnaces give you (for tool steel hardening+tempering) ? 09-Feb-20 11:15 AM <__ice9#6039> Illustration of solder not melting even when I forgot to double back the element first 09-Feb-20 11:15 AM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200128_132548-FEB16.jpg 09-Feb-20 11:15 AM <__ice9#6039> Thermal coupling prevents it. But this is strictly viable when the contacts are not behind any insulation. 09-Feb-20 11:15 AM <__ice9#6039> But: you should always double back the ends regardless of what joining method is chosen. 09-Feb-20 11:15 AM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum furnaces are mainly useful for preventing atmospheric contamination of sensitive materials 09-Feb-20 11:15 AM <__ice9#6039> So for instance, in the example cited, they would prevent discoloration 09-Feb-20 11:18 AM we would use Brownells at scool to coat the part prior to hardening so it owuldnt get that oxide layer.. so then we could temper afterwards to the correct 'color' without really needing to sand off the oxide layer to see 09-Feb-20 11:18 AM <__ice9#6039> Yep that's another approach 09-Feb-20 11:18 AM I think it was Boron powder? 09-Feb-20 11:20 AM <__ice9#6039> One tip about element contacts with bolts, though: stainless is only rated to 900C, so it's usually best to keep the joint outside the furnace insulation. It's ok to have part of the element extending outside the insulation to reach the joint. That's preferable as it ensures contiguous material crossing through the rather extreme thermal gradient through the insulation. 09-Feb-20 11:21 AM yeah, I actually have stainless heating wire 09-Feb-20 11:21 AM haven't tried it yet, I got it for flat ribbon wire/spring 09-Feb-20 11:21 AM <__ice9#6039> Oh ok then there is no issue with using stainless bolts 09-Feb-20 11:21 AM <__ice9#6039> As much as I have looked, no one makes Kanthal bolts and nuts that I have found. I have thought about casting a crucible out of it though. 09-Feb-20 11:21 AM <__ice9#6039> The limiting factor on stainless is mainly oxidation performance btw. In inert atmosphere it is ok in very lightly loaded applications to at least about 1200C. 09-Feb-20 11:21 AM <__ice9#6039> Monel is better. 09-Feb-20 11:24 AM if Kanthal is available as rod, I could machine whatever.. but not entirely sure the purpose, beyond compatability 09-Feb-20 11:28 AM <__ice9#6039> The closest I have found that didn't cost a fortune was 9 AWG kiln support wire from a pottery shop 09-Feb-20 11:28 AM <__ice9#6039> I forgot to mention: sometimes it's useful to connect to a very hot element by first using a thicker piece of the same material welded (or sintered, cast, fused, etc.) onto it, in order to make electrical contact with something else having a lower melting point. 09-Feb-20 11:28 AM <__ice9#6039> That's the more general analogy with my comment about doubling back Kanthal elements 09-Feb-20 11:28 AM <__ice9#6039> Example: this is a MoSi2 element 09-Feb-20 11:28 AM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/download_24-F254D.jpeg 09-Feb-20 11:28 AM <__ice9#6039> The thicker parts dissipate much less power by Joule heating, due to having lower resistance-- I²R 09-Feb-20 11:28 AM <__ice9#6039> So they are cool enough to contact with aluminum, even though the thin part is up to 1800C 09-Feb-20 11:32 AM I've also noticed that nichrome wont 'glow' towards the connection points, only a few cm from it 09-Feb-20 11:32 AM <__ice9#6039> Correct, the same phenomenon is evident in the photo I posted above. Bolts should be able to achieve better thermal contact than ordinary crimp connectors. 09-Feb-20 11:32 AM <__ice9#6039> Inside very high temperature resistively heated furnaces, in argon (which can go higher than vacuum because it limits evaporation of material), graphite and tungsten panel heading elements using respectively graphite and tungsten oversized bolts and nuts are actually pretty common. 09-Feb-20 11:32 AM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/ImageForArticle_127911-CBC46.jpg 09-Feb-20 11:32 AM <__ice9#6039> The pass throughs are usually water-cooled copper 09-Feb-20 11:32 AM <__ice9#6039> Here's the all-metal version 09-Feb-20 11:32 AM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/2-octagonal-1_1-00A20.gif 09-Feb-20 11:41 AM pretty 09-Feb-20 11:41 AM <__ice9#6039> Each one of those rectangular panels can cost over $400 though 09-Feb-20 11:41 AM <__ice9#6039> And it is like 4 layers thick 09-Feb-20 11:42 AM watercooled copper, like how a bit of the inductions heaters are done? 09-Feb-20 11:42 AM <__ice9#6039> As you can see around the outside -- successive spaced layers polished to a mirror finish to insulate against radiated heat 09-Feb-20 11:42 AM <__ice9#6039> At temperatures of 2000C and above, the vast majority of heat transfer inside the furnace is by direct radiation 09-Feb-20 11:42 AM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/3-Vertical-heating_1-BAE90.gif 09-Feb-20 11:42 AM <__ice9#6039> Pass-throughs 09-Feb-20 11:42 AM <__ice9#6039> Strips are used instead of single wires because wires have a positive feedback failure mode-- one spot gets thinner, develops more resistance, heats more, evaporates more, gets even thinner, and eventually fails like a lightbulb filament 09-Feb-20 11:44 AM ohh, that's smart, just more distributed points if one does fail, or better feedback /target, rather 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM <__ice9#6039> Other alternatives are mesh screen elements (much better surface area to cross sectional area ratio, means you can drive at higher voltage so the PSU design is easier) and twisted cables, which mostly solve the issue with single wires but aren't quite as good for surface area 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM almsot like how tesla batteries stuck with many small size vs one large cell 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM and ea one had a small wire from it as a fuse 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM so you could lose one tiny battery, not an entire cell 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM <__ice9#6039> Yeah it has more internal redundancy 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM terms, yeah 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM what pressures are usually obtained in vacuum furnaces (for heat treating) ? I asked once before if a simple roughing pump could do it and the answer was: yes 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM it was then something like: what we do in this channel is to remove that last 0.01% 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM but like.. would 50torr be low enough? 09-Feb-20 11:45 AM purpose is to remove oxygen and the insulating air 09-Feb-20 11:49 AM <__ice9#6039> Depends entirely on how much oxygen you can tolerate 09-Feb-20 11:49 AM <__ice9#6039> A vacuum arc furnace only needs low vacuum 09-Feb-20 11:49 AM <__ice9#6039> Plus argon purge though 09-Feb-20 11:49 AM this isnt a reaction per say, just heat treating steel 09-Feb-20 11:49 AM yeah, I have a tank of argon 09-Feb-20 11:50 AM <__ice9#6039> A vacuum heat treatment furnace needs a better vacuum or, again, argon 09-Feb-20 11:50 AM <__ice9#6039> Heating steel in atmosphere is a reaction lol 09-Feb-20 11:50 AM <__ice9#6039> An ebeam PVD furnace needs high vacuum 09-Feb-20 11:50 AM <__ice9#6039> A vacuum resistive furnace needs high vacuum if you want your materials to last 09-Feb-20 11:50 AM <__ice9#6039> So it depends 09-Feb-20 11:51 AM a closed steel container larger than whatever you are heat treating can work well to avoid the oxidizing issues some heat treat processes run into...or the more expensive stainless foil option 09-Feb-20 11:51 AM <__ice9#6039> None of them need UHV unless your process is incredibly sensitive though 09-Feb-20 11:51 AM <__ice9#6039> That's correct. 09-Feb-20 11:52 AM argon works too of course just wanted to mention the other options 09-Feb-20 11:52 AM <__ice9#6039> As long as you don't mind the residual oxygen attacking your surface in the meantime. 09-Feb-20 11:52 AM <__ice9#6039> You can put a couple lumps of charcoal in the corner to scavenge the oxygen if you want though 09-Feb-20 11:52 AM yeah thats what i have done in the past 09-Feb-20 11:52 AM yeah, I've seen that and a piece of paper used before 09-Feb-20 11:52 AM which burns up all the reamining oxygen 09-Feb-20 11:53 AM <__ice9#6039> Best covered with something to prevent reactive carbon contamination if that matters to you 09-Feb-20 11:53 AM i have a stainless lunch box that fits in my furnace 09-Feb-20 11:53 AM <__ice9#6039> Yes 09-Feb-20 11:53 AM <__ice9#6039> Exactly 09-Feb-20 11:53 AM toss in a charcoal pellet and away it goes 09-Feb-20 11:53 AM interesting 09-Feb-20 11:53 AM <__ice9#6039> The carbonization furnace I am finishing up right now is just a much bigger and more controllable version of that principle 09-Feb-20 11:53 AM not sure how far away I am from building one.. maybe wihtin the year? half year? 09-Feb-20 11:53 AM I have a dozen or so kiln bricks on hand, still 09-Feb-20 11:54 AM <__ice9#6039> For making glassy carbon and graphite precursor materials for use in the graphite furnace 09-Feb-20 11:54 AM would be nice to set something up 09-Feb-20 11:54 AM that is a pretty intense project, the graphite furnace 09-Feb-20 11:54 AM would be cool to be able to custom make graphite objects so i understand the allure though 09-Feb-20 11:54 AM I'm really curious how permeable glassy carbon is for high vacuum 09-Feb-20 11:54 AM It'd make an awesome x-ray window if it's not 09-Feb-20 11:54 AM <__ice9#6039> Yeah at this point I build mostly top-loaders in huge stainless steel stockpots for structural support and atmospheric control, using felt based insulation 09-Feb-20 11:54 AM <__ice9#6039> They are also more portable 09-Feb-20 11:55 AM Way cheaper than diamond sheet and electrically conductive 09-Feb-20 11:55 AM <__ice9#6039> Bricks are good for fixed installations though 09-Feb-20 11:55 AM <__ice9#6039> It's very slightly permeable because it had to outgas during its formation, but permeability declines again at lower temperatures. It may be best used with a thin sealant layer on one side if you want to use it as an actual vacuum window. I'm not certain. 09-Feb-20 11:55 AM <__ice9#6039> The last trace outgassing occurs at like 2000C 09-Feb-20 11:55 AM <__ice9#6039> Anyway after the felt insulation usually refractory mortar facing layer. And usually pour some suitable castable I mixed up for the purpose as the bottom layer, with a lot of porosity enhancing aggregate for lower thermal conductivity, often over a layer of Kaowool etc 09-Feb-20 11:58 AM Perhaps a glassy carbon target anode, deposited with a tungsten dot, and then a polyimide film sealed on the outside for protection? 09-Feb-20 11:58 AM <__ice9#6039> That would almost certainly work well 09-Feb-20 11:58 AM Though at this point you might as well go with lithium windows 09-Feb-20 11:58 AM Since polyimide will act as the seal 09-Feb-20 11:59 AM <__ice9#6039> Melting point 09-Feb-20 11:59 AM 180C 09-Feb-20 11:59 AM would it ever get to that? 09-Feb-20 11:59 AM I doubt it 09-Feb-20 11:59 AM I was about to say, pass water between the lithium and polyimide, but then I realized that is the worst thing you could do 09-Feb-20 12:03 PM <__ice9#6039> Lol yes 09-Feb-20 12:06 PM https://www.researchgate.net/publication/333355556_In-Situ_Characterization_of_Lithium_Native_Passivation_Layer_in_A_High_Vacuum_Scanning_Electron_Microscope 09-Feb-20 12:06 PM Oh no 09-Feb-20 12:06 PM I think using lithium would be a tad too hard 09-Feb-20 12:06 PM considering the entire process from foil to evacuation has to be airless and waterless 09-Feb-20 12:06 PM something tells me I've seen this picture before :P 09-Feb-20 12:08 PM <__ice9#6039> Oh nuts I posted this before 09-Feb-20 12:08 PM <__ice9#6039> Oops 09-Feb-20 12:08 PM <__ice9#6039> Sorry I forgot where that was 09-Feb-20 12:08 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes I agree regarding lithium 09-Feb-20 12:10 PM https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1503/1503.03327.pdf 09-Feb-20 12:10 PM maybe you could try something like that for the window 09-Feb-20 12:10 PM growing graphenic carbon on silicon then etching away the silicon 09-Feb-20 12:11 PM sadly here it can't be just a window 09-Feb-20 12:11 PM it also has to be the target 09-Feb-20 12:11 PM if it was just a window, I'd stretch some polyimide over it 09-Feb-20 12:11 PM https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/file?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0156224&type=printable 09-Feb-20 12:11 PM This is the idea 09-Feb-20 12:12 PM isnt the target going to be a tiny bit of tungsten deposited onto the window? 09-Feb-20 12:12 PM yeah, but it has to be conductive to at least heat 09-Feb-20 12:12 PM electrical isn't very necessary since it can be a transmissive anode 09-Feb-20 12:12 PM To un-hijack the conversation: which is the best pourable material for high temp furnaces? 09-Feb-20 12:19 PM <__ice9#6039> All of this stuff will conduct at 10-100kV just fine 09-Feb-20 12:20 PM Needs to be an actual conductor 09-Feb-20 12:20 PM <__ice9#6039> "best" depends on what you mean 09-Feb-20 12:20 PM Stuff that doesn't eat itself after a while 09-Feb-20 12:20 PM <__ice9#6039> Sure but conductors vary widely at higher current. At low current and high voltage, they really don't. 09-Feb-20 12:20 PM <__ice9#6039> Ok what temp do you need? Do you want it to be hard and tough, or light and insulating 09-Feb-20 12:20 PM <__ice9#6039> ? 09-Feb-20 12:20 PM <__ice9#6039> What atmosphere do you want to run? 09-Feb-20 12:20 PM <__ice9#6039> Is it for a corrosive process? 09-Feb-20 12:21 PM insulating is probably the best quality 09-Feb-20 12:21 PM <__ice9#6039> Etc 09-Feb-20 12:21 PM air and inert 09-Feb-20 12:21 PM interchangeable 09-Feb-20 12:21 PM <__ice9#6039> Ok but not H2/CO/O2 at least 09-Feb-20 12:21 PM <__ice9#6039> What temp...? 09-Feb-20 12:21 PM well, o2 is going to be in air 09-Feb-20 12:22 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes, versus pure oxygen, which is also a thing 09-Feb-20 12:22 PM I'm talking about a theoretical furnace, but probably over 1000c 09-Feb-20 12:22 PM is there a reason you want it pourable? i am assuming there is some reason not to use kaowool/fire bricks in your question 09-Feb-20 12:22 PM <__ice9#6039> Ok Kanthal elements will take you to about 1300C easily and 1400C with some careful power control and good insulation 09-Feb-20 12:23 PM kaowool is not perfectly insulating 09-Feb-20 12:23 PM <__ice9#6039> So is that high enough? 09-Feb-20 12:23 PM yeah 09-Feb-20 12:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Kaowool is amazing and so much better than any castable 09-Feb-20 12:23 PM really? 09-Feb-20 12:23 PM <__ice9#6039> 0.05 thermal conductivity or something 09-Feb-20 12:23 PM hm 09-Feb-20 12:23 PM yeah sometimes people will put a layer of refractory mortar on top to give it more strength but kaowool is great stuff 09-Feb-20 12:24 PM <__ice9#6039> I have routinely run thermal gradients of over 800C/inch through that stuff 09-Feb-20 12:24 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes I highly recommend coating the facing layer 09-Feb-20 12:24 PM <__ice9#6039> It will make the 2600F kind survive an inner surface temp of 3000F 09-Feb-20 12:24 PM I guess it's just more thicker more better 09-Feb-20 12:26 PM <__ice9#6039> I use castables for two things: 1) the bottom layer of the furnace on the inward facing side, where stuff sits so it needs to be hard and contiguous against leaks, 2) as mortar at temperatures higher than any mortar I can buy affordably, in this case custom stuff I mix with stabilized zirconia and quicklime 09-Feb-20 12:28 PM if you get unglazed ceramic tiles those work really well for the bottom of furnaces in my experience 09-Feb-20 12:28 PM just the 1/4" thick ones are enough to provide a nice protective layer and stop anything poking a hole in kaowool/firebricks 09-Feb-20 12:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Still need to cut them to fit and mortar between them. I prefer just pouring caustic ceramic slop in the bottom and waiting a day. 09-Feb-20 12:29 PM oh i just set them on top of the bricks in mine and a friend has a big one we set in the bottom of his kaowool kiln 09-Feb-20 12:29 PM no mortar needed if you fit them well 09-Feb-20 12:29 PM do you have any cheap alternatives to refractory mortar? or recipes to make it? 09-Feb-20 12:29 PM that stuff is stupidly expensive 09-Feb-20 01:59 PM <__ice9#6039> Historically I have usually bought Meeco 3000F refractory mortar for about $33/gallon, where a gallon is usually enough for an entire furnace. You can save the leftovers by pouring a small amount of distilled water over the top, smoothing it over, and sealing the lid tightly. 09-Feb-20 01:59 PM <__ice9#6039> However lately I determined their recipe 09-Feb-20 01:59 PM <__ice9#6039> So I can clone it myself now, though the resulting price isn't hugely lower since it's not that costly to begin with (whereas zirconia mortar can be $400/gallon which is just laughable) 09-Feb-20 01:59 PM <__ice9#6039> Just a minute, will get you the recipe too 09-Feb-20 01:59 PM <__ice9#6039> Here you go. The first item is just an overly formal name for mullite. 09-Feb-20 01:59 PM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/signal-2020-01-27-151031-8AAC9.jpg 09-Feb-20 01:59 PM <__ice9#6039> Cristobalite is a rather nice material and I'm not sure how much of it they use, but it's ok to substitute something else like zircopax or just more quartz. You should also add about 1% fumed silica and like 0.05% trisodium phosphate or so. 09-Feb-20 01:59 PM <__ice9#6039> @LRM the fumed silica is for further enhanced binding and the TSP lets you use much less water to make it flow-- which in turn makes it less susceptible to cracking. 09-Feb-20 03:40 PM thanks, that seems fairly straight forward to mix up 09-Feb-20 05:22 PM i'm trying to find a list of metals and which are likely or not likely to produce toxic fumes when heated - anyone know of any? tried searching, now just going through MSDS sheets 09-Feb-20 05:31 PM also trying to determine if heating titanium up to the point it begins changing colors produces toxic fumes or not - titanium oxide seems to not be good 09-Feb-20 05:31 PM http://www.ilocis.org/documents/chpt63e.htm has some good info 09-Feb-20 05:35 PM basically all welding fumes are terrible for you afaik just some are worse than others (zinc for example) 09-Feb-20 06:00 PM <__ice9#6039> Just buy a respirator. 09-Feb-20 06:00 PM <__ice9#6039> https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F312370628578 09-Feb-20 06:00 PM <__ice9#6039> Use with this mask 3M Half Facepiece Reusable Respirator 6100, Gases, Vapors, Dust, Paint, Cleaning, Grinding, Sawing, Sanding, Welding, Small https://www.amazon.com/dp/B007JZ1NIM/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_3NlqEbP6YBAT5 09-Feb-20 06:04 PM TiO2 is a food colorant and is edible 09-Feb-20 06:04 PM <__ice9#6039> Then you just connect it to an air compressor using your choice of brass fittings 09-Feb-20 06:04 PM it's also used as paint 09-Feb-20 06:04 PM "titanium white" 09-Feb-20 06:05 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes I know that. Though inhaling it is a bad idea. I'm speaking more generally about welding fumes however. 09-Feb-20 06:05 PM It's not a good idea to weld in a supplier air respirator 09-Feb-20 06:05 PM <__ice9#6039> Excuse me what? 09-Feb-20 06:05 PM When you take it off, all the crap is still in the air 09-Feb-20 06:05 PM <__ice9#6039> You don't take it off...? 09-Feb-20 06:05 PM <__ice9#6039> ??? 09-Feb-20 06:05 PM And live in it? 09-Feb-20 06:06 PM <__ice9#6039> No, use a ventilation fan.... 09-Feb-20 06:06 PM Yes, and vent the entire room 09-Feb-20 06:06 PM <__ice9#6039> Same as with a mask 09-Feb-20 06:06 PM He's planning to weld indoors 09-Feb-20 06:09 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes, you need both a cross-wind to clear the air over time and a mask to keep yourself safe during the process itself 09-Feb-20 06:09 PM <__ice9#6039> This is particularly relevant for metals like stainless steel, where the TLV for manganese is in the range of micrograms per m³ and cumulative toxicity exists. 09-Feb-20 06:09 PM <__ice9#6039> https://www.thefabricator.com/thefabricator/article/arcwelding/new-guideline-reduces-manganese-exposure-limit-dramatically etc 09-Feb-20 06:09 PM <__ice9#6039> I find that an N95 mask still allows some of the smell, N99 gets too hot, and supplied air is both a complete solution and adds some cooling effect under the welding face shield 09-Feb-20 06:09 PM <__ice9#6039> Also @samy if titanium changes colors while being welded, you made a mistake. 09-Feb-20 06:17 PM @__ice9 i'm asking because i'd like to make a little display in my place and have a metal like copper or titanium in a constant state of heat 09-Feb-20 06:17 PM <__ice9#6039> Huh 09-Feb-20 06:17 PM you mean a light bulb? :P 09-Feb-20 06:17 PM <__ice9#6039> Both will catastrophically oxidize beyond a certain point.... 09-Feb-20 06:17 PM <__ice9#6039> Have you considered Kanthal or silver? 09-Feb-20 06:17 PM <__ice9#6039> Or even stainless or monel, depending on how hot? 09-Feb-20 06:17 PM <__ice9#6039> How hot do you want to make it? 09-Feb-20 06:19 PM i'd like to see a sheet of some metal that goes through heat color changes backed by a PCB with a bunch of addressable electrodes and have it randomly go through color changes by conducting current and temp monitoring 09-Feb-20 06:19 PM the oxides only grow once 09-Feb-20 06:19 PM that would be a fun art project for the wall but i don't want people to die and the such 09-Feb-20 06:19 PM the less heat the better, the goal is (repeatable) color change 09-Feb-20 06:20 PM if you want it as a permanent display of going through oxide colors, that won't work 09-Feb-20 06:21 PM because of the oxides? 09-Feb-20 06:21 PM well, yeah, they'd go through the colorful phase and you'll end up with a gray piece of metal 09-Feb-20 06:22 PM what if it's washed off or cleaned off somehow? 09-Feb-20 06:22 PM that's going to be hard to do reliably 09-Feb-20 06:22 PM since you'd also need to dry it quickly 09-Feb-20 06:22 PM why? 09-Feb-20 06:22 PM residues 09-Feb-20 06:22 PM plus your metal would be a heavy consumable 09-Feb-20 06:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Yeah this isn't possible 09-Feb-20 06:23 PM if it's cheap that's okay 09-Feb-20 06:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Unless you are planning to burn it back off with lye or something every time 09-Feb-20 06:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Which would be just absurd 09-Feb-20 06:23 PM i'm okay with that 09-Feb-20 06:23 PM <__ice9#6039> ??? 09-Feb-20 06:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Ok I guess just do a lot of testing.... 09-Feb-20 06:24 PM your effect will be a lot more subtle than you think 09-Feb-20 06:24 PM <__ice9#6039> This seems like it may have a low probability of working reliably and not making a mess though 09-Feb-20 06:24 PM you could attempt something with titanium and an acid spray wash 09-Feb-20 06:24 PM will definitely make a mess though 09-Feb-20 06:24 PM <__ice9#6039> Certain acids will also work, but again it will need testing 09-Feb-20 06:24 PM <__ice9#6039> And please consider the implications of spraying/waterfalling strong bases or acids in an open display 09-Feb-20 06:25 PM it'd have to be completely enclosed 09-Feb-20 06:26 PM <__ice9#6039> Some release toxic corrosive fumes as well, HCl especially, HNO3 to a more limited extent (I kind of like the smell of nitric though), and technical grade H2SO4 is often sulfur smelling 09-Feb-20 06:26 PM <__ice9#6039> Meanwhile NaOH/KOH are actually worse safety hazards than the strong acids listed here. The reasons have to do with saponification. 09-Feb-20 06:26 PM <__ice9#6039> But yeah it would need enclosure during the etch cycle. 09-Feb-20 06:27 PM yeah, would like to keep this as safe as possible but definitely going to explore it 09-Feb-20 06:27 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm well good luck at least, it may be possible if it's worth it to you 09-Feb-20 06:28 PM could you maybe try anodizing and then etching that off? 09-Feb-20 06:28 PM <__ice9#6039> I'm planning to make a waterfall fountain out of molten silver at some point, so you aren't the only one interested in things like this 09-Feb-20 06:28 PM unless i just have to deal with toxic fumes, in which case that makes it not reasonable for me 09-Feb-20 06:28 PM ooh that sounds cool @__ice9! 09-Feb-20 06:28 PM i mean, hot 09-Feb-20 06:28 PM @LRM interesting...that'll require dyes i believe 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Anodizing is a reasonable thing to try. You will need a way to dunk the sheet into an electrolyte tank though 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM so the color change may not be so quick 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM <__ice9#6039> No it does not 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM no dye needed 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM oh 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM titanium has a huge color spectrum 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM ah sorry was thinking aluminum 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM think you could basically just do it all in a tank of sulfuric acid 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Moreover if you want to remove oxide, you can cathodize it 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Yep 09-Feb-20 06:29 PM <__ice9#6039> H2SO4 works great 09-Feb-20 06:30 PM lot less sketchy than turning a sheet of titanium into a resistance heating element art project imo 09-Feb-20 06:30 PM oh yeah that's an interesting idea 09-Feb-20 06:30 PM <__ice9#6039> The best colors of metal are the glowing ones anyway ^^ 09-Feb-20 06:30 PM what if you could do split electrode cathodization/anodization? 09-Feb-20 06:30 PM submerged in a vat of extremely mild non-bubbly slow electrolyte 09-Feb-20 06:30 PM one electrode anodizes it slowly through the voltage ranges(up to 200V for the rainbow) 09-Feb-20 06:30 PM then it auto resets with another sacrificial electrode 09-Feb-20 06:33 PM i'd like to have multiple electrodes as well so i can move the color "source" around 09-Feb-20 06:33 PM not how it works sadly, it'll oxidize more or less evenly 09-Feb-20 06:34 PM ahh 09-Feb-20 06:34 PM but you could experiment with a tiny needle and bringing it very close 09-Feb-20 06:34 PM you can get uneven hotspots that way 09-Feb-20 06:34 PM ah interesting 09-Feb-20 06:34 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/titanium_spectrum_web_2-D70E3.png 09-Feb-20 06:37 PM <__ice9#6039> On the subject of open air heating: Nernst elements can be made from platinum, SiC, preheated yttria-stabilized zirconia, MoSi2, and to at least some extent Kanthal-A1 09-Feb-20 06:37 PM <__ice9#6039> Also iridium and iridosmine, but I do not recommend using a high osmium alloy due to formation of OsO4 09-Feb-20 06:37 PM <__ice9#6039> Lightbulb without a bulb 09-Feb-20 06:39 PM I just found a local(ish, they ship via mail) supplier of all the metals! 09-Feb-20 06:39 PM <__ice9#6039> From personal testing, thoria and alumina do not work well-- thermal shock tolerance is quite poor and preheat is excessive 09-Feb-20 06:39 PM <__ice9#6039> Huh interesting 09-Feb-20 06:39 PM Aluminium, duralumin, brass, bronze, titanium, all the good stuff 09-Feb-20 06:39 PM A bit pricy, a 30x650mm piece of dural is $22.5 09-Feb-20 06:39 PM but I can live with it 09-Feb-20 06:39 PM 100x1000mm is $300 ouch 09-Feb-20 06:39 PM not that I'd have a use for that 09-Feb-20 06:42 PM <__ice9#6039> I haven't actually worked with duralumin before. What do you use it for? 09-Feb-20 06:42 PM anything, it's super common here 09-Feb-20 06:42 PM <__ice9#6039> Huh that's pretty cool 09-Feb-20 06:42 PM slightly harder to machine than alu but... more dura..ble, lol 09-Feb-20 06:45 PM <__ice9#6039> Just about done with the carbonization furnace. Need to finish the exhaust fume extraction duct still. Redid the catalytic converter and air intake there so that it fits into the rim of the furnace now, should be less risk of breaking. Power and control box is done pending testing. 09-Feb-20 06:45 PM <__ice9#6039> Might want to attach some support feet under it as well but will test on firebricks initially 09-Feb-20 06:45 PM <__ice9#6039> For low temp runs outdoors it should be fine to use cheap CO2 as a shield gas instead of more costly argon 09-Feb-20 06:45 PM <__ice9#6039> Above about 1000C or during long runs, the oxidative erosion of objects inside will make that infeasible though. In particular, making glassy carbon needs argon or vacuum 09-Feb-20 06:45 PM <__ice9#6039> With any luck I may be able to get some sample carbon felt and expanded carbon foam tiles tonight 09-Feb-20 06:59 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm actually I think I can make that duct out of nickel foil instead of messing with forming it from refractory cement. I need more sheet metal on hand for stuff like this. 10-Feb-20 07:32 PM <__ice9#6039> Huh so that pretty much worked. Exhaust port has airflow. Some leaks near the start that need to be patched up a bit, but the exhaust gas tube runs in much deeper so it shouldn't matter if that's incomplete. This should work to burn up any CO/HCN/NCCN/CH2O/etc that comes out-- though this is still an outdoor-only furnace. Merely attempting to be a good neighbor. 10-Feb-20 07:32 PM <__ice9#6039> As a side note, graphite furnaces should also be outdoor only or equipped with heavy surrounding fume extractors and area cross-flow ventilation. The reason there has less to do with behavior during normal operation and more to do with behavior during catastrophic failure. Hot graphite, beyond about 1400C, produces large amounts of cyanogen when exposed to nitrogen, though the process is accelerated by an intense UV source and by a high enough gas flow rate to dislodge and cool the product gas before it can burn up in the oxygen in the air. The graphite itself reacts with the oxygen before the nitrogen, so the potential reaction zone is already hypoxic enough to avoid immediate cyanogen oxidation. 10-Feb-20 07:38 PM So what's the product in a catastrophic failure? 10-Feb-20 07:38 PM <__ice9#6039> Cyanogen and carbon monoxide. 10-Feb-20 07:38 PM Fun 10-Feb-20 07:50 PM <__ice9#6039> This isn't merely theoretical. I once inadvertently produced it while testing an expendable graphite arc heating element. NCCN smells of burnt almonds-- more sharp and burnt-smelling than HCN. That was enough to encourage considerable caution when dealing with hot graphite in the future. 10-Feb-20 07:50 PM <__ice9#6039> It also polymerizes black onto surfaces near the formation site, particularly under intense deep UV exposure as produced by e.g. an arc 10-Feb-20 07:50 PM <__ice9#6039> The presumed polymerized paracyanogen also smelled of burnt almonds. The plate and cathode rod both had to be discarded as a result, apart from evacuating the area etc. I was wearing a supplied air respirator pumped from a long distance at the time, so I didn't even notice until things were cooling down and I tried taking off the mask. 10-Feb-20 07:50 PM <__ice9#6039> So if you figure an active surface area of half a square meter instead of a few square centimeters, the potential hazards are considerably heightened. 10-Feb-20 07:50 PM <__ice9#6039> Tungsten lined high temperature furnaces, by comparison, are relatively safe-- a catastrophic failure will produce only a very expensive replacement requirement as the internal surfaces burn up 10-Feb-20 07:50 PM <__ice9#6039> Molybdenum linings are not safe however. Toxic yellowish colored molybdenum trioxide smoke forms profusely when hot molybdenum surfaces are exposed to air. 10-Feb-20 07:50 PM <__ice9#6039> These types of super high temperature furnaces present significantly greater potential hazards than your usual standard air-atmosphere oxide-ceramic-lined Kanthal-heated kilns and lab muffle furnaces and tube furnaces. 10-Feb-20 08:10 PM <__ice9#6039> Incidentally: the exact same reactions are also potential hazards if a vacuum chamber containing these materials at high temperature fails and vents to atmosphere. Likewise worth being aware of. 11-Feb-20 12:26 AM <__ice9#6039> Carbonization furnace is almost done also. Waiting for the cement finishing sealing the exhaust fume extraction blower and aerator for the catalytic converter tube to cure. Then lid fit can be tailored and the internal lining touched up. 11-Feb-20 12:26 AM <__ice9#6039> Planning to try firing a few things on the first run-- those two graphite blocks I just tried to glue together with cloned Aremco graphite-phenolic cement, some cotton batting to try to make graphite wool/felt insulation, a piece of bread (actually very pure carbon after firing, analogous to the sugar charcoal used by Moissan) to make a carbon foam tile, a small phenolic cast crucible to see if it turns into glassy carbon, etc. to about 1000C or so under simple CO2 shielding outdoors with a few pieces of charcoal to help absorb residual oxygen. Later will try with argon. Ran out and need to get more. 11-Feb-20 12:26 AM <__ice9#6039> Argon is better. Beyond about 1000C, the reaction CO2 + C --> 2CO becomes increasingly favorable, which oxidatively ablates objects and generates a toxic gas. 1200C would carbonize more thoroughly given proper fully inert shielding. 11-Feb-20 12:26 AM <__ice9#6039> ... actually, I could just use nitrogen instead. The reaction to cyanogen requires temperatures of at least about 1400C, which is slightly above the planned service temperature for this furnace anyway. 11-Feb-20 12:41 AM <__ice9#6039> Interesting-- apparently activated charcoal is often made using nitrogen shielding gas, for exactly this reason. The temps reached are not high enough for N2 + 2C --> NCCN to start becoming a problem. So that settles it, will just hook up the nitrogen concentrator instead. 11-Feb-20 11:40 AM @LRM unfortunately city of west hollywood requires me to be a licensed contractor to pull a permit 11-Feb-20 11:41 AM that is nuts...talk about regulatory capture 11-Feb-20 11:50 AM just did a quick google search because that did not sit right with me and it looks like you just have to check the exemption box. this assumes that you own the property though and do not plan to sell it within the next year? 11-Feb-20 11:50 AM " I, as owner of the property, or my employees with wages as their sole compensation, will do the work, and the structure is not intended or offered for sale. (Sec. 7044, Business and Professions Code: The Contractors License Law does not apply to an owner of property who builds or improves thereon, and who does such work himself or herself or through his or her employees, provided that such improvements are not intended or offered for sale. If, however, the building or improvement is sold within one year of completion, the owner-builder will have the burden of proving that he or she did not build or improve for the purpose of sale). " 11-Feb-20 11:50 AM no license needed if you are doing the improvements yourself, the form in my area has similar language 11-Feb-20 11:50 AM https://www.weho.org/Home/ShowDocument?id=16809 11-Feb-20 11:50 AM thats the form 11-Feb-20 12:04 PM thanks, yeah i went through the form but contacted the Building & Safety Permit Technician at City Hall and he told me "Need to be a Licensed Contractor for that trade to pull the permit." - i'll try submitting and see what happens 11-Feb-20 12:04 PM yeah, i own (well the bank owns it and i pay them and don't plan to sell in the next year 11-Feb-20 12:05 PM hmm could just be that they just do not see people doing work themselves very often? 11-Feb-20 12:06 PM i assumed so, i told him i was an EE and deal with HV normally cough we'll see what happens 11-Feb-20 12:07 PM the smaller the town the more you can get away with, being in some massive place though lol good luck 11-Feb-20 12:07 PM like in the small town my friend lives in he asked the town for electrical records... they were like uh we have none... 11-Feb-20 12:07 PM and he mentioned oh he wanted to do work, and they were like... welll...... don't tell us and we won't care... 11-Feb-20 12:07 PM basically 11-Feb-20 12:07 PM the place was owned by the electric company before him though and they did shitty ass wiring jobs so uh 11-Feb-20 12:07 PM he is going to make it well above code 11-Feb-20 12:08 PM i'm wondering if i should paste him the part to get guidance on the form because honestly i don't know what to fill out on the right hand side, or if i'm just more likely to get myself into making this more difficult 11-Feb-20 12:10 PM that would probably be what i would do...but first i would try to talk to someone else in the same department if you can 11-Feb-20 12:10 PM ok, thanks 11-Feb-20 12:10 PM it might just be that person 11-Feb-20 12:10 PM i did see one other name of someone in that dept 11-Feb-20 12:10 PM I mean... Adam McCombs the certified electrician (tm) helped me install the 30 amp circuit for my SEM hehehe 11-Feb-20 12:11 PM you could mention the bit on the form and that you would like to do the work yourself too so they do not just dismiss it 11-Feb-20 12:11 PM then again my house was built in 1952 and most of the electrical is original so... not like I was going to make anything worse... 11-Feb-20 12:11 PM trying to run a SEM on the original wiring could have made things worse 11-Feb-20 12:12 PM there was no 30 amp circuit available before that 11-Feb-20 12:12 PM only like a 20A I think it was? 11-Feb-20 12:12 PM and it was in a weird place with an OLLLLDDD plug lol 11-Feb-20 12:13 PM i would not trust most wiring put in when homes are built for anything more than about 10A no matter the breaker size because you just do not know what is in the wall unless you check 11-Feb-20 12:13 PM well... 11-Feb-20 12:13 PM I mean my house was built by the guy who lived in it... and he built a few of the houses in the area... 11-Feb-20 12:13 PM it was really well taken care of and honestly most of all the electrical was done to code and is nice 11-Feb-20 12:13 PM Like I have no problem with it 11-Feb-20 12:13 PM but I wish it was more that 15A circuits around the house... 11-Feb-20 12:13 PM and more than a... gosh I forgot already... 11-Feb-20 12:13 PM 150A panel? 11-Feb-20 12:13 PM I think is all I have 11-Feb-20 12:15 PM in case you need to find out what's in the walls 11-Feb-20 12:15 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/sub-buzz-19134-1475861668-1-89E0F.png 12-Feb-20 05:41 AM I ran/dug a 100A circuit to my work shed and just installed everything then had the city send out an inspector which checked my cable depth and sub panel wiring; he said peachy then I just finger-poked the 100A breaker into the main; good to go. 12-Feb-20 05:41 AM The I proceeded to put a lathe directly in front of the panel in my shop a week later =D 12-Feb-20 05:41 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20200212_074428-79363.jpg 12-Feb-20 05:41 AM Can still get to it if you're in a hurry. Does make running new circuits a bit of a pain though. Nowhere else to put the lathe - wasn't just horribleness for the sake of horrible! 12-Feb-20 01:42 PM @Metanoic nice! 12-Feb-20 01:42 PM I went to West Hollywood City Hall this morning and they also told me I need a licensed person to run a circuit :\ CC @LRM - I asked them politely to show me where as the documentation shows I can do it myself but they'd said I'd have to wait a bit and had to run, so going to keep chatting to one of the people over email first 12-Feb-20 01:48 PM I think regulations in my workplace is like 2 ft clearance in front of electrical panels. 12-Feb-20 01:48 PM Nice 12-Feb-20 02:00 PM @samy that is pretty ridiculous. no need for things to be so complicated to just get a permit for a new circuit 12-Feb-20 02:07 PM @Laughing yea that's pretty standard all around. I'm absolutely doing a no-no there. However, there was nowhere else for the lathe and I do all the electric work so I've only inconvenienced myself and violated code. 12-Feb-20 02:07 PM mind you this is also an out-building, so you've got this panel with its main breaker as well as a 100A breaker at the mains panel in case of emergency. Fire or other such catastrophe, the responders will just hit the mains panel main breaker which will cut this panel's circuit as well. 12-Feb-20 02:38 PM Good backup, one panel to another 12-Feb-20 03:26 PM <__ice9#6039> I like the 2-panel idea as well. 13-Feb-20 01:45 AM so if I get a 12" diameter pipe, and wanted to use a 1" thick piece of acrylic for a loading door and viewport... an o-ring is the best seal right (for non UHV)? vs flat gasket, right? 13-Feb-20 01:45 AM and if so... I can only imagine the trouble getting a 12" pipe that's 3 or so ft long onto a lathe to try cutting a groove on the end of it 13-Feb-20 01:45 AM additionally, if the seller of the pipe is just plasma cutting it to size, how do I ensure it's very flat on that end? or will I not need to thanks to the o-ring, just ensure it's smooth? 13-Feb-20 01:45 AM is it best to have the o-ring on the end of the pipe, or in the acrylic viewport/endcap? 13-Feb-20 01:45 AM seems like I could get a groove/trench cut in the acrylic a lot easier than the end of the pipe 13-Feb-20 01:45 AM was reading that parker-hannifin dovetail grooves are best (some random webforum) but that seemed to be if you care about the o-ring not falling out... seems like I don't care as long as I've got gravity to hold it into the top end of the pipe 13-Feb-20 04:46 AM <__ice9#6039> Usually they saw them to size for that reason-- makes it easier to fit into fittings. But maybe the seller does not. Best to check. 13-Feb-20 08:22 AM O ring or flat gasket can do -1 torr really easily if you have any pumping. You have to really have a bad seal for that to matter. 13-Feb-20 08:22 AM I have some aluminum groove o ring stuff we machined, but I generally just go for ISO rings rather than o ring grooves 13-Feb-20 10:04 AM our entire department has 5 shared solidworks licenses, including the machine shop which has four full-time machinists and a tech director 13-Feb-20 10:04 AM oof 13-Feb-20 10:56 AM @__ice9 they don't have a saw, they have a plasma torch to cut it 13-Feb-20 12:13 PM Wow iso320 centering o ring is more than $200!! 13-Feb-20 12:45 PM $150 CAD from lesker? 13-Feb-20 12:45 PM That's a big ring 13-Feb-20 12:45 PM it weighs 2 lbs lol 13-Feb-20 12:45 PM I've never heard someone regret going with a standard vacuum connector 13-Feb-20 02:19 PM I checked a few sites, not eBay tho 14-Feb-20 12:04 PM Is 6061 aluminum ok for machining and vac chambers? 14-Feb-20 12:05 PM Yep 14-Feb-20 12:08 PM How to mate stainless flanges to aluminum? Or do I need to find aluminum flanges? 14-Feb-20 12:09 PM with bolting and gaskets 14-Feb-20 12:09 PM maybe brazing 14-Feb-20 12:12 PM Bolts and standard gaskets are the best solution 14-Feb-20 12:12 PM I'm going to make a 6061 aluminum plate adaptor to the stainless flange of the cyropump 14-Feb-20 12:12 PM It just needs a few blind tapped holes and an o-ring groove. With a CNC this is trivial, with manual machining it takes an afternoon 14-Feb-20 12:23 PM just be careful of using stainless hardware in aluminum...you can end up with some nasty galvanic corrosion problems 14-Feb-20 12:23 PM should be okay with just mating the flanges together as there will be the oring and stuff 14-Feb-20 12:36 PM Cool, thanks 14-Feb-20 01:57 PM Can you Tig weld aluminum and stainless? 14-Feb-20 02:00 PM not fusion 14-Feb-20 02:00 PM ... that feels like a Google question. 14-Feb-20 02:00 PM I mean Tig weld with a good enough seal for uhv 14-Feb-20 02:00 PM kinda - in the sense that you can but you'll wind up with a super brittle joint 14-Feb-20 02:00 PM you can tig Al and SS, but you can't tig them together 14-Feb-20 02:00 PM better off brazing, or using a transitory metal between the al and ss 14-Feb-20 02:01 PM explosion welding! 14-Feb-20 02:01 PM Can brass work? 14-Feb-20 02:01 PM Throwing things out there 14-Feb-20 02:02 PM don't think so. What's your application/task? I would recommend brazing 14-Feb-20 02:02 PM I've never done brazing, so i kinda want to look into that. 14-Feb-20 02:02 PM I know flanges exist that you can effectively weld onto SS pipes in the interest of making your own sorta chamber. 14-Feb-20 02:03 PM in a vac system I would do fasteners and face seals for al to ss 14-Feb-20 02:03 PM I've been meaning to take a CC welding class for a while 14-Feb-20 02:05 PM I don't like having dissimilar materials inseparable in case I wind up needing to do something that corrodes one species 15-Feb-20 02:27 PM Yeah. Al to SS is tough. As mentioned there are some braze fillers to do it, but stresses have to be taken into account and the different COE may cause issues. If you can do it with mechanical seal means or o rings you may be better off. 15-Feb-20 09:03 PM <__ice9#6039> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNpFN__16CM 16-Feb-20 03:29 PM just paid for an accesory for the grinder, will hopefully show it off in the near future 17-Feb-20 05:58 PM <__ice9#6039> Silver brazing with e.g. Harris black flux and a propylene torch seems to work great for attaching copper cooling tubing to stainless steel vessels 17-Feb-20 05:58 PM <__ice9#6039> Much better than ordinary silver solder. Joint is significantly stronger against thermal expansion mismatch 17-Feb-20 09:08 PM I got a TIG welder but the torch (left) appears to be missing a keyed piece of some sort (the right side is electrode for stick welding i think) - is that normal? ie an additional piece that needs to go in there to lock it in? 17-Feb-20 09:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-60D46.png 17-Feb-20 09:48 PM i tried connecting it anyway even though it doesn't lock in without the key. when i hit the pedal i would expect to hear some gas released (which i do when i turn the machine on, and manual states it will release gas for 15 secs upon turning on)...so i'm not sure if the pedal is busted or if it's simply not doing anything because it knows there's not a torch locked in 17-Feb-20 09:48 PM (it's used) 18-Feb-20 03:47 PM You've got any gas hooked up? Could have a pressure interlock 18-Feb-20 03:47 PM @samy ^ 18-Feb-20 03:54 PM @nmz787 yeah I have a tank of Argon hooked up. when i turn on the welder, it clearly lets some out (I can hear it and see the gauges change) 18-Feb-20 03:54 PM "There will be a 15 second gas flow when the power is turned on." according to manual, so that part is good 19-Feb-20 04:01 AM <__ice9#6039> I have never seen a TIG connector that looked like that 19-Feb-20 04:01 AM <__ice9#6039> Normally they look like the part at the top of this one. It looks like your welding machine uses a non-standard connector. 19-Feb-20 04:01 AM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/tig-torch-adaptor-35-50-38-AE0DD.jpg 19-Feb-20 04:01 AM <__ice9#6039> Incidentally, the device shown here can be used to force a TIG welder to run with the electrode positive for welding aluminum, though current needs to be low and a very wide electrode must be used 19-Feb-20 04:01 AM <__ice9#6039> It can also be used to turn an old buzz-box into an AC TIG welder very cheaply, given a solenoid valve and some supporting hardware 19-Feb-20 04:01 AM <__ice9#6039> The peg on the middle is called a DIN connector and they come in a few different sizes depending on their current rating in amps 19-Feb-20 04:45 AM USA and Europe might also have differences in the connectors. but who knows. 19-Feb-20 05:44 AM <__ice9#6039> Worth pointing out-- using the kind of DCEP hack I just mentioned does not set the torch positive w.r.t. neutral. It just flips ground and negative/power. So arc start applies HV to the entire workpiece. 19-Feb-20 05:44 AM <__ice9#6039> It's fine as long as it stays insulated and you don't ground yourself. 19-Feb-20 05:44 AM <__ice9#6039> >In Soviet Russia, workpiece welds you 19-Feb-20 10:54 AM interesting 19-Feb-20 07:42 PM Movement Holder v3.. 19-Feb-20 07:42 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1005-FA413.JPG 19-Feb-20 07:42 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1006-1B305.JPG 19-Feb-20 07:42 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1007-675ED.JPG 19-Feb-20 11:02 PM <__ice9#6039> Question (possibly silly): is there any practical means of fusing two sealed glass tubes, each containing a particular useful gas, to each other via a narrower tube, such that the two gasses can mix in both tubes without leaking in air? 19-Feb-20 11:02 PM <__ice9#6039> Context: krypton-chlorine and krypton-bromine excimer lamps at 207nm/222nm have been repeatedly demonstrated to eradicate airborne pathogens with no damage to mammalian skin or eyes. 19-Feb-20 11:02 PM <__ice9#6039> Chlorine and bromine vapors are fairly easy to produce, and with a little extra effort can be purified and trapped under glass. But krypton cylinders are quite expensive. Meanwhile small krypton tubes meant for electrodeless ionization by Tesla coils and similar RF sources are very affordable, and I already have one. 19-Feb-20 11:02 PM <__ice9#6039> I have already made chlorine gas many times, and bromine vapors once. But krypton is such a tiny component of atmospheric air that there is no realistic prospect for concentrating or cryo-distilling it myself. 19-Feb-20 11:02 PM <__ice9#6039> Alternately, forget the narrow bridging tube-- can the two containers just be fused to each other directly? That seems less likely to produce a leak. 19-Feb-20 11:02 PM <__ice9#6039> Then again, this thread makes it sound quite difficult to properly fill gas ampoules at all, and other discussions are generally consistent with that impression. Not sure whether fusing two of them (if possible) is any easier. http://www.sciencemadness.org/talk/viewthread.php?tid=65375 19-Feb-20 11:02 PM <__ice9#6039> Granted, I recognize the most sensible method for making such a thing is to buy cylinders of both gasses and mix them through a high vacuum assembly, with several flushing passes before sealing. I could probably manage to get the chlorine or bromine into a flask in a reasonably pure state to substitute for a cylinder, which I doubt anyone would sell to me directly, but that still leaves the krypton cost issue. 19-Feb-20 11:19 PM you could put it into a tiny ampoule that shatters under electric current or shock 19-Feb-20 11:19 PM that's how IN-18s did it for mercury 19-Feb-20 11:19 PM an ampoule with a coil that you pulse with current, it cracks, mercury releases 19-Feb-20 11:20 PM <__ice9#6039> Releases into a chamber with another ampoule already attached and ready for sealing? 19-Feb-20 11:20 PM no, in the finished thing 19-Feb-20 11:20 PM <__ice9#6039> Huh interesting 19-Feb-20 11:20 PM <__ice9#6039> Mercury vapor has the advantage of enormous compressibility, though, via a liquid. Krypton does not. 19-Feb-20 11:20 PM <__ice9#6039> Bromine does. But then it becomes difficult to get the bromine into a container with the krypton. 19-Feb-20 11:22 PM there's a seller in russia that sells pure krypton 19-Feb-20 11:22 PM https://www.ebay.com/itm/Krypton-gas-10-liters-pure-element-sample-disposable-can-bottle-cylinder-99-99/312685583826 19-Feb-20 11:22 PM <__ice9#6039> In cylinders? Cheapest I have seen is $400 for a tiny lecture bottle 19-Feb-20 11:22 PM this dude 19-Feb-20 11:22 PM in cylinders 19-Feb-20 11:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Wow 19-Feb-20 11:23 PM <__ice9#6039> That's really cheap 19-Feb-20 11:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Ok no issue then huh 19-Feb-20 11:23 PM note that it's only 10 liters 19-Feb-20 11:23 PM not full 150 bar 19-Feb-20 11:23 PM that's 10 st liters 19-Feb-20 11:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Yes, but only a tiny amount is needed 19-Feb-20 11:23 PM <__ice9#6039> Several mL at stp 19-Feb-20 11:24 PM I've talked to him through their local classifieds site, he seems pretty nice 19-Feb-20 11:24 PM ask him for adapters too 19-Feb-20 11:24 PM he can make a vcr adapter to that cylinder for you 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Yeah he's probably selling off bottles filled from a larger one like 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/1582183772949-864B8.png 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Interesting 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Huh I definitely underestimated the usefulness of VCR fittings in an earlier discussion. 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Would still need adaptors to KF 16 though, might be better to just go straight to that. 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Granted KF won't handle as hard of vacuum, but given my turbo is DN 100 ISO-K it's moot 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm. If attempting this the 'proper' way, more research into methods is needed. Also a lot more practice with basic techniques. 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Thanks though-- this is a very interesting listing 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm also need those oxy-propylene tips to arrive. Not here yet. Don't try to run oxy-propylene/propane through an oxy-acetylene Victor torch tip. 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Very difficult to get a stable flame, even harder to prevent an orange reducing region from floating above/around the torch outlet just above the actual neutral jet 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Propane/propylene tips have long, narrow channels that eject the gas at higher velocity and at an inward angle, probably to prevent this. Acetylene tips just have round holes. 19-Feb-20 11:29 PM <__ice9#6039> Hmm. At this rate, I should probably just see if I can find someone who already knows how to do this and has the correct equipment to make a custom one. Likely cheaper than acquiring it all personally. 20-Feb-20 08:26 AM Everything would be VCR if steel were cheap 20-Feb-20 08:26 AM They’re easy to make and don’t have super tight tolerances. They’re just huge. 20-Feb-20 08:26 AM (And require welding to attach them in the first place) 20-Feb-20 08:49 AM <__ice9#6039> Everything requires either welding or a pre-machined adaptor. They are more complicated than KF flange fittings, and tend to impose a narrower bore at a given cost, but look more approachable than CF for small diameter UHV applications and appear particularly suitable for applications requiring minimal dead space (e.g. rare gas fill equipment) 20-Feb-20 08:59 AM I believe the ultra torr seals we just talked about prove you wrong 20-Feb-20 08:59 AM They are essentially push-to-connect vacuum fittings 20-Feb-20 08:59 AM I have used them at -7 torr 20-Feb-20 08:59 AM I like VCR for repeatability in high pressure environments 20-Feb-20 08:59 AM Properly done swagelok tube fittings are great and all, but probably 1/20 are kinda bad in my experience of working with stuff other people have made. VCR never. 20-Feb-20 09:22 PM <__ice9#6039> KF will do -7 as well 20-Feb-20 09:22 PM <__ice9#6039> Perhaps my comment was misunderstood, in that sense 20-Feb-20 09:22 PM <__ice9#6039> The distinction was simply metal vs elastomer seals 21-Feb-20 10:15 AM Mixed feelings. I tent to avoid KF fittings on the high vacuum side. VCR I have not had great luck with for longevity. Same with Swagelock. As you said a small portion of swagelock joints are just leaky. I have always assumed it is from imperfections in the tubing itself. I have had better luck with the brass fitting, copper tube swagelock than stainless. Flare fittings with easy bend brake like is generally the most reliable I have found. If you are willing to run around and leak test the system any of them can be made to work but it’s a pain in the butt. I am lazy and just braze OFC copper fittings for my systems. 21-Feb-20 10:32 AM What on earth are you doing where VCR has poor longevity? 21-Feb-20 10:51 AM Interesting. I guess flare is still a metal to metal seal. 21-Feb-20 10:51 AM And yeah monel 90/10 brake line is super useful in general 21-Feb-20 07:27 PM I read VCR like a VHS video tape.. I've been looking to magnetic tape scales for the machines, and maybe even making my own.. 21-Feb-20 08:52 PM misread as 'magnetic tape seals' lolol 22-Feb-20 12:46 AM XDDD 22-Feb-20 12:46 AM Wich reminds me, I bought viton o-rings to seal Triclamp. 22-Feb-20 12:46 AM XDDDDD 22-Feb-20 12:46 AM (some weird thing I'm doing with a triclamp tube and a hot plate) 22-Feb-20 03:50 PM to follow up on my tig woes, I milled a brass key for the pseudo-DINSE torch so it locks in now but still didn't work and surprised no gas came out when hitting pedal still. opened up pedal, limit switch wasn't closing upon depress so added some material to it and now it all seems to work 24-Feb-20 06:06 PM Form grinding awaits! 24-Feb-20 06:06 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1051-E4A9B.JPG 24-Feb-20 06:06 PM Diaform 10:1 pantograph wheel dresser 24-Feb-20 06:06 PM so now I can form grind cycloidal gear cutters for watch gears 24-Feb-20 06:10 PM Oh wow. 24-Feb-20 06:10 PM I started learning watchmaking a number of years ago but I never got anywhere near the level of cutting my own gears. 24-Feb-20 06:13 PM I'm in a 2 year tradeschool style watchmaking program.. and tomorrow is cert exam 3 of 4! 24-Feb-20 06:13 PM this isn't just cutting my own gears, but form grinding the correct profile for the cutter itself 24-Feb-20 06:13 PM so, yeah, I'm a step or two deeper 24-Feb-20 06:15 PM Wow you are waaaaay beyond me. 24-Feb-20 06:16 PM saved up to go to back to school for it, career change 24-Feb-20 06:16 PM but hte program is more for ":watchmaking" which is servicing 24-Feb-20 06:16 PM oilchanges and adjustments 24-Feb-20 06:16 PM not manufacturing 24-Feb-20 06:16 PM we learn some manu, but not enough to be credible anywhere 24-Feb-20 06:16 PM Right now I’ve got a Hamilton 2974B WWII vintage naval comparing watch disassembled. 24-Feb-20 06:16 PM thus why I am pursueing very deep topics myself 24-Feb-20 06:16 PM put it back together! 24-Feb-20 06:16 PM get'r tickin 24-Feb-20 06:17 PM I’ve got,at least one jewel to replace. 24-Feb-20 06:17 PM I have a Seitz kit to do it. 24-Feb-20 06:17 PM ah, I have yet to grind my own jewels, that is on the list 24-Feb-20 06:17 PM yup, we use a simple Horia pusher 24-Feb-20 06:18 PM But there’s... inertia and other projects. 24-Feb-20 06:18 PM but we have seitz sets as well 24-Feb-20 06:18 PM oh, yeah< I feel you 24-Feb-20 06:19 PM Like my cleaning machine may be older than that. I’ve replaced a bearing in the motor, but the insulation is just falling off the wires. I need to rewire it from the ground up. 24-Feb-20 06:19 PM I need my own cleaner.. spent half the day replacing all the solutions for the exam tomorrow 24-Feb-20 06:20 PM Also is there a good reference for lubricating old school pocket watches with modern oils / greases? 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM umm.. moebius' chart may be the best? 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM there's also simple rules of thumb 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM ie, barrel, center, and 3rd wheel get D5 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM 4th and escape wheel get 9010 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM etc etc 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM + balance 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM pallet gets 9415 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM those are the 3 basic, plus then there's a grease 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM I've been liking Rolex's MR4 grease 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM been using it near all second year 24-Feb-20 06:21 PM ayo, just won a hairspring vibrating tool, been wanting one for a while 24-Feb-20 08:15 PM Thanks, I need to keep that in mind. 02-Mar-20 06:24 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> How repeatable do y’all think a cam would be? I want a triangle-wave reciprocating motion and figure I’d drive a stepper and circular cam with an arcsine curve 02-Mar-20 06:24 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I just want a centimeter or so of travel 02-Mar-20 06:24 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> But it needs to be backlash-free and good to about 10 microns. 03-Mar-20 01:20 PM Enlarging 5mm holes to 6mm holes in copper without a drill press or proper mount? Surprisingly easy 03-Mar-20 01:20 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-2C068.jpg 03-Mar-20 01:20 PM Are they round? Nope who cares! 03-Mar-20 01:41 PM shear 'em out with an appropriately-sized screwdriver and some tactical wiggle-grinding 03-Mar-20 01:41 PM #Precision 03-Mar-20 05:54 PM cringes 03-Mar-20 08:02 PM Value nothing over speed 04-Mar-20 07:33 AM I was going to say, reamers are designed to do this while still preserving concentricity. 04-Mar-20 07:33 AM I have a very smol set for watchmaking. 04-Mar-20 01:27 PM cutting ruby 04-Mar-20 01:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_3543-0A90D.JPG 04-Mar-20 01:27 PM quite a nice result 04-Mar-20 01:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_3546-AC563.JPG 04-Mar-20 01:29 PM looks like fun 04-Mar-20 01:29 PM decided to do it yourself? 04-Mar-20 01:31 PM Not exactly 04-Mar-20 01:31 PM But will be trying it myself anyways 04-Mar-20 01:31 PM I'm going to attempt making a cavity for the rod (which had jagged edges initially) but also cut a slice just to try the random laser thing since I was using the saw anyways 04-Mar-20 01:34 PM do you guys have any metrology gear to check how parallel the ends are? 04-Mar-20 01:35 PM I don't think it's possible it would be anything other than "not very at all, but to the eye you can't tell" 04-Mar-20 01:36 PM depends how rigid that saw setup is and how well it is/was aligned 04-Mar-20 01:37 PM "not very" 04-Mar-20 01:37 PM ahh heh well hopefully you do not need things to be too precise 04-Mar-20 02:28 PM Building a cavity. Brave soul. 04-Mar-20 05:13 PM I used to do gem cutting. Synthetic ruby and sapphire made pretty stones. 04-Mar-20 05:13 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-E2842.jpg 04-Mar-20 05:13 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-8B569.jpg 04-Mar-20 05:13 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-9EF89.jpg 04-Mar-20 05:13 PM I can now safely say I qualify as a primate. I can make simple tools (with a CNC machine). 04-Mar-20 05:13 PM This is a simple scanner to open the lower bearing compression ring (which is going to need WD-40; even with that block in a vise grips, it’s still not budging) and the upper cap the secures the magnetic bearing. 04-Mar-20 06:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> @Noxz or anyone else with watchmaking skills... what's the trick to deburring tiny stainless parts? 04-Mar-20 06:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I really want to use something that's more abrasive than cutting 04-Mar-20 06:19 PM like sandpaper or not? 04-Mar-20 06:19 PM we also use 'de-gussit stones' 04-Mar-20 06:19 PM which is a super fine grain ceramic stone 04-Mar-20 07:32 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> oh these look perfect. 04-Mar-20 07:32 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> how do people feel about tormach? I've so far been pretty unimpressed 04-Mar-20 07:32 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> but a lot of people seem to like them? 04-Mar-20 08:54 PM I know electropolishing was popular for deburing nickel steel copper and inconel parts. Not sure about straight stainless. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM I have mixed thoughts. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM I learned on a Fadal 4020 with 10 HP. That was a beefy machine. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM I wanted the makerspace to spend some extra and get a Haas. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM The Tormach is much less powerful. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM It does not have rigid tapping. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM I’ve been told that it’s not good for tapping, period. Even with a tapping head. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM It’s got a small work area and only a 10 tool changer. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM It’s also stepper driven, not servo. This means in a crash, it will miss steps. But it’s also open loop feedback, so in a crash, it won’t realize it’s crashing, whereas a servomotor will realize that torque was commanded and the shaft isn’t spinning, and fault. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM I wonder if this is going to be better in an environment with users who aren’t professional machinists. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM Also, so much of industry (in the US) uses Haas that knowing Haas’ interface is a useful resume skill. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM Tormachs are marketed towards hobbyists and education. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM It works well with Fusion 360. Fadal has one of the worst user interfaces. It is totally non-intuitive. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM I had to reach out to Autodesk to fix the post processor for Fadal. It simply didn’t work out of the box. And rigid tapping was broken. Autodesk was extremely responsive, and my changes made it into a release rapidly. 05-Mar-20 05:35 AM Tormach’s interface is very intuitive. I had no problem picking it up. 05-Mar-20 05:55 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Yeah tormach has a good but rather limited interface. 05-Mar-20 05:55 AM Now my most difficult project was trying to fix a Bridgeport Interact that the makerspace acquired. This thing was a lemon. It had a Heidenhain controller that said it was made in West Germany. 05-Mar-20 05:55 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> I think tormach’s clearpath stuff is all linuxcnc 05-Mar-20 05:55 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> With a custom GUI 05-Mar-20 05:56 AM It’s definitely Linux. 05-Mar-20 05:56 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Oh I have a design question 05-Mar-20 05:56 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> I need motion over a quarter inch with 10 micron repeatability... zero backlash. I’m trying to think of a cheap way to do this 05-Mar-20 05:56 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> The obvious thing is a very short ball screw 05-Mar-20 05:56 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> But there has to be something cheaper 05-Mar-20 05:56 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> The loads are very light 05-Mar-20 05:56 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Maybe a cam? Maybe a metal belt? 05-Mar-20 05:56 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Like they used in those old hard drive head traverse mechanisms. 05-Mar-20 05:56 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Hell I wonder if a cable could do it. The cable would be very short so maybe it could do it. 05-Mar-20 06:01 AM Does this have to run in a vacuum? 05-Mar-20 06:02 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> No. 05-Mar-20 06:06 AM What would drive the cable? A stepper? 05-Mar-20 06:06 AM I’m thinking step size + diameter of pulley and what you’d need for 10 micron steps. 05-Mar-20 06:08 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> 10 micron repeatability, not resolution. 05-Mar-20 06:09 AM Oh, that’s much better. 05-Mar-20 06:09 AM 3D printers typically use belts. 05-Mar-20 06:09 AM I’d look at 3D printer gantries. 05-Mar-20 06:10 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> 2000 steps per rev at 10x microstepping, 2pi(5 mm)/2000 is 15 microns. 05-Mar-20 06:10 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> So a 1 cm pulley would be fine. 05-Mar-20 06:12 AM Typical 3D printers print at 50 micron layer height. 05-Mar-20 06:14 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Yeah maybe it’s ok. 05-Mar-20 06:14 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Using belts I mean. 05-Mar-20 06:25 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> I might try this! https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Moshe_Shoham/publication/245366541_Twisting_Wire_Actuator/links/546dbbe50cf2193b94c5a6d4/Twisting-Wire-Actuator.pdf?origin=publication_detail 05-Mar-20 06:25 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Or maybe a friction drive. 05-Mar-20 07:30 AM GT2/GT3 belt, or a UHMPE rope (specifically; dyneema dm20 based, for zero creep under load) 05-Mar-20 07:41 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Okay I think what I really want is a way to do some calculations and make an error budget here comparing ball screws and gt2 belt. 05-Mar-20 07:41 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Because I can keep going in circles here or whatever looking at different things but I think I’m trained to not be happy until I see the math. 06-Mar-20 11:50 AM @𝓕ermion voice coil? 06-Mar-20 12:03 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Expensive. 06-Mar-20 01:59 PM Nah, rip open a cdrom drive, or get an old radio speaker 06-Mar-20 01:59 PM Oh sorry, i read 10 micron range, not quarter inch... A big big speaker might do that though 06-Mar-20 05:00 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I so want to find something that doesn’t require closed loop control. 07-Mar-20 10:45 AM if I want an inexpensive optical flat and lapping device, will any one do on ebay or any suggestions of something specific? just to help make and measure flatness of small things i make 07-Mar-20 11:23 AM have you watched OxToolCo video(s) on laps? 07-Mar-20 11:23 AM https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=oxtool+lapping 07-Mar-20 11:23 AM also for inexpensive optical flats the soviet surplus flats are pretty nice on eBay (if they are still around) 07-Mar-20 11:26 AM ahh awesome, thanks 07-Mar-20 02:43 PM Man I desperately need a decent CNC mill. My Taig setup just isn't cutting it (no pun intended) 07-Mar-20 02:46 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Yeah Taigs are ok but they're pretty limited. 07-Mar-20 02:46 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I've had a taig CNC since I was 14 and I can't tell you how good it is to start playing with a proper VMC... or even a conversational control bedmill 07-Mar-20 02:46 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> but for small aluminum parts they're surprisingly capable. 07-Mar-20 02:48 PM My garage has a low ceiling so it's hard finding something decent that will fit. 07-Mar-20 02:48 PM Even a Haas Mini Mill would go into the ceiling. 07-Mar-20 02:48 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> the one upgrade I did to my taig was replacing the spindle with a high speed one. I figured i'd be only making tiny things so the high speed spindle let me run tiny cutters in aluminum at the proper speeds 07-Mar-20 02:48 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> ballscrews would have been very nice 07-Mar-20 02:48 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> but they didn't have that option back then 07-Mar-20 02:49 PM I have the taig with ballscrews. I'm using fanuc servo motors on it. But my servo drives use a firewire connection that seems to drop all the time. 07-Mar-20 02:49 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> lol damn that's OP 07-Mar-20 02:49 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> how'd you get the fanuc servos? 07-Mar-20 02:50 PM eBay 07-Mar-20 02:50 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I'm assuming they were either cheap/a deal or so, or you wanted to pay for something OP 07-Mar-20 02:50 PM I don't really even use it as a CNC because I can't get through a whole gcode program without the connection dropping. 07-Mar-20 02:50 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> jeez 07-Mar-20 02:50 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> how much is each motor/drive combo? 07-Mar-20 02:50 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> or rather, how much did you get it for 07-Mar-20 02:51 PM I think the motors were about $100 each and the drives maybe $200 each 07-Mar-20 02:52 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I run geckodrives and steppers and mach3 07-Mar-20 02:52 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> and it's super reliable 07-Mar-20 02:52 PM Maybe I should just get different drives. 07-Mar-20 02:53 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> clearpath maybe 07-Mar-20 02:53 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> 250/axis new. 07-Mar-20 02:53 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> if that's your pricepoint... 07-Mar-20 02:54 PM Probably a cheaper option than the Haas CM-1 I dream about. 07-Mar-20 02:54 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> there's really nowhere you can put the thing? 07-Mar-20 02:54 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> dig a pit in the garage lol. 07-Mar-20 02:56 PM I heard people just position the z-column between the beams in the ceiling so the column can go up between the beams. 07-Mar-20 02:56 PM Maybe that's worth the hassle. 07-Mar-20 02:56 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> just 07-Mar-20 02:56 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> don't raise the z 07-Mar-20 02:56 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> sit on top g0 z100 break through the floor "hi honey what's for dinner?" 07-Mar-20 02:57 PM Haha 07-Mar-20 02:57 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> oh... 07-Mar-20 02:57 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> tormach pcncs are ok. 07-Mar-20 02:57 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I just did a small stainless steel part on a 440 07-Mar-20 02:57 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> they're not great machines. 07-Mar-20 02:57 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> but I found the 440 infinitely more pleasant to work on than my taig 07-Mar-20 02:58 PM I mostly want to make tooling, and I've heard tormachs kind of suck at producing good 3d surface finishes 07-Mar-20 02:59 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> ah... 07-Mar-20 02:59 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yeah then get a haas or a nice bed mill 07-Mar-20 03:00 PM Haas CM-1 is on sale for 25% off right now. Not sure if I can convince the wife that $45k for a CNC mill is a good deal. 07-Mar-20 03:00 PM I heard the 440 was the worst tormach 07-Mar-20 03:00 PM Lower accuracy ballscrews than the 770/1100 or something 07-Mar-20 03:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> there's a 1.5x safety factor on the spindle bearings 07-Mar-20 03:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> people blow them up all the time 07-Mar-20 03:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> also there's door switch on the spindle head to detect if the door is open or closed 07-Mar-20 03:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> make sure the spindle doesn't start 07-Mar-20 03:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> but 07-Mar-20 03:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> you can still drop the Z through the panel with the door open. 07-Mar-20 03:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> and the panel isn't big enough to let the open door through, so the door catches and bends 07-Mar-20 03:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> so this is obnoxious 07-Mar-20 03:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> but furthermore, you can't remove the door or the hinge panel trivially... so if you bend the whole panel you can get it off and straighten it easily 07-Mar-20 03:07 PM sounds annoying 07-Mar-20 03:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yeah... I'm happy to use someone else's but buying one feels hard to justify. 07-Mar-20 03:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> the thing I'm most happy to have access to now is a water jet 07-Mar-20 03:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> those things are stupid useful 07-Mar-20 03:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I guess tormach machines use clearpath servo 07-Mar-20 03:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> or so it looks 07-Mar-20 03:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> anyway I'd feel weird putting 750 bucks worth of servos on a machine worth about that much lol 07-Mar-20 03:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> sieg and syil make good machines 07-Mar-20 03:28 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I guess syil isn't making small machines anymore. That's a shame 07-Mar-20 03:30 PM Syil and Sieg are both chinese machines like Tormach, right? 07-Mar-20 03:30 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Yep. 07-Mar-20 03:30 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> everything is chinese though basically. 07-Mar-20 03:41 PM I've run my taig at 300ipm with servos. 07-Mar-20 03:54 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> you caaaan but the inertial forces are so huge and the machine so wiggly that I can't imagine why you'd do that 09-Mar-20 03:12 PM so who are my bearing people? I think I figured out what I was interested in, but there still may be some gaps in my knowlegede (about angular contact bearings) that I want to double check 10-Mar-20 09:50 AM so we need some tiny gaskets made from gold 10-Mar-20 09:50 AM 3mm diameter and then we put our own 1/32" hole in the middle 10-Mar-20 09:50 AM In academia; if you can buy it, buy it. One place wants $60/gasket for 18k gold, the other wants $4/gasket for 14k gold but "won't do it in 18k because it's not worth it" but then says if it's anything over $10/gasket for 18k "you're getting hosed" 10-Mar-20 09:50 AM But also will not do 18k for us 10-Mar-20 10:13 AM i wonder why they wont work with 18k...it can be rather squishy stuff. 14k is really nice to work with in my limited experience. 10-Mar-20 10:13 AM also that sounds like a problem fairly easily solved by buying a sheet and a set of punches 10-Mar-20 10:13 AM if you cannot get them made for $4-$10 anyway 10-Mar-20 10:46 AM their 14k ones are "a standard part" so they make tons 10-Mar-20 10:46 AM we tried punching our own, didn't work very nicely. 10-Mar-20 11:02 AM thats too bad, too inconsistent results or something else? 10-Mar-20 01:11 PM Everything in india is 24k... Wonder if there's a supplier there 10-Mar-20 01:11 PM Does gold work well for something like conflat? 10-Mar-20 04:21 PM Well we’re using it between platinum and copper 10-Mar-20 04:21 PM It has to fit nicely into an alignment groove 12-Mar-20 01:56 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-A0227.png 12-Mar-20 01:56 PM gold washer drilling 12-Mar-20 01:56 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-10A16.png 12-Mar-20 01:56 PM Some trash, some beauty 12-Mar-20 01:56 PM not super circular. 12-Mar-20 02:15 PM that seems like a perfect place for a couple 3d printed jigs 12-Mar-20 02:15 PM one on the table and another that you can move out from under the drill to swap rounds 12-Mar-20 02:15 PM tedious work there 12-Mar-20 05:04 PM true 12-Mar-20 10:24 PM is that one clamp? oxtools had a somewhat recent saying on a video: one is none (ie, it can shift and twist) 12-Mar-20 11:11 PM we only have one 13-Mar-20 12:24 PM got a new watchmakers sensitive drill press, a Boley BE2.. will be the restoration project during this extended spring break 13-Mar-20 12:24 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1071-75F33.jpg 13-Mar-20 12:24 PM 1" mit digital mics on ther efor ocmparison, and also my 3 gang'd single work head dixi sensitive drill press for scale 13-Mar-20 08:20 PM I am guessing that is exactly the machine I needed at some point where I was fighting with a wiggling quill on some drill press hopelessly trying to place precision holes. 15-Mar-20 12:16 AM I was able to get the spindle out of the grinder work head, finally.. the bearings were near completely dry, so will be replacing them, I may do a test with putting new lube in these just as a baseline to compare - will cost half as much as the grinder was, heh 24-Mar-20 07:21 PM and just paid for this.. Optical dividing head + accesories on original t slot table 24-Mar-20 07:21 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/s-l1600-9C632.jpg 24-Mar-20 07:21 PM will be for final grinding of index plates, amongst other things 24-Mar-20 07:24 PM nice! 24-Mar-20 09:19 PM toolmaker's microscope shipped, and I also paid for the internal bore measuring head that goes on it, which should be shipped shortly 24-Mar-20 09:19 PM deciding if I want to go with an old jig borer's X/Y/Rotary table to mount my milling head to, to get it off the lathe bed and more accurate 24-Mar-20 09:19 PM price is kinda up there though, there are somewhat cheaper alternatives.. but I also have linear rails + ballscrews chilling in the garage from an unfinished project that I am thinking about scrounging up together to make it all work 24-Mar-20 09:19 PM would still be lacking an initial rotary table though 25-Mar-20 05:20 PM Nifty: 25-Mar-20 05:20 PM https://vancouver.craigslist.org/bnc/zip/d/burnaby-1920s-home-built-table-saw/7098946001.html 25-Mar-20 05:20 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/01212_hbcQ2IyOydg_600x450-B22CF.png 26-Mar-20 10:34 AM scheduled toolmaker's microscope delivery for tomorrow afternoon 28-Mar-20 02:15 PM if i wanted to make an oven for heat treating / annealing metals, would this be good? (i can pick it up) https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vacuum-Chamber-Custom-made-30-x-28-x-21-Stainless-Steel/274319854852?hash=item3fdebccd04:g:qAsAAOSwTSpefk-o 28-Mar-20 02:16 PM looks like its lacking a looooot of insulation 28-Mar-20 02:16 PM and its not made for much above 200, maybe 300 °C 28-Mar-20 02:17 PM i just mean as the shell (i assume i would put fire brick inside), or would i be better off building the shell around something custom? 28-Mar-20 02:57 PM You don't need a vacuum chamber. 28-Mar-20 02:57 PM Can you weld? 28-Mar-20 02:57 PM Angle iron + mild steel + fire brick works. I had helped a friend build a small kiln for doing metal pours. All he had was a flux core welder, but that was just fine. 28-Mar-20 03:05 PM it just seemed like cheap metal 28-Mar-20 03:05 PM in a useful form 28-Mar-20 03:05 PM started practicing TIG, need to find a metal supply 28-Mar-20 03:05 PM also will want to use this inside as i don't have a good area outside (without my neighbors calling the police on me) 28-Mar-20 10:08 PM Well ovens certainly aren't illegal. Little old ladies do ceramic arts and crafts all the time with them. 28-Mar-20 10:08 PM My guess is with the virus, the police would hang up on your neighbors anyway. 28-Mar-20 10:18 PM the idea of running a heat treat oven inside makes me a bit uncomfortable but i suppose it is alright if you are careful to monitor the radiated heat on the walls/ceiling and are careful about what you put into it 28-Mar-20 10:18 PM definitely nothing with anything volatile or possibly toxic 28-Mar-20 10:53 PM makes sense, i could run it on a little balcony outside - just don't have a lot of space outside 28-Mar-20 11:37 PM Ovens aren't illegal in and of themselves. What you use them for might be. Make sure you have firebrick backstops so that you don't accidentally turn the fascia of your apartment's balcony into dry kindling. Even little old ladies doing ceramics can run afoul of the fire marshal and their property management company. If you get exotic, look into filtration media for exhaust. 28-Mar-20 11:37 PM Basically, please don't get yourself evicted for your hobby. Especially not right now. 28-Mar-20 11:44 PM the kiln in the pottery studio at my university used to be on carpet 28-Mar-20 11:44 PM the carpet ceased to exist 28-Mar-20 11:47 PM I’m not sure where you’re located, but I find people will frequently give away kilns on Craigslist, priority to whoever can haul them out first. You might be able to find something better fit for purpose. 28-Mar-20 11:47 PM Vacuum chambers are probably made of stainless. If this is a project to get better at TIG, well cool, but path of least resistance is probably cheap mild steel and MIG, flux core, or stick. 29-Mar-20 10:01 AM ahh...i do TIG inside as well where MIG might be a bit splattery. i'll see if stick is reasonable inside or not 29-Mar-20 10:01 AM i'm in los angeles, i'll start looking 29-Mar-20 10:01 AM thanks @funranium - these enclosed ovens i'm seeing look attractive (like Hotshot 360 that This Old Tony just had avid on) and ideally i'd like to build/find/mod one into something like that 29-Mar-20 10:01 AM http://www.barzindustrial.com/Hotshot-Ovens.aspx 29-Mar-20 11:10 AM If you get a used one, it's worth checking for heat leaks as that'll make cold spots in your oven for projects (which is no bueno) and the other end of that leak is where you'll set the patio on fire (also no bueno). In general, setting it on brick and making backstops if you're going to put it near walls is a good idea. 29-Mar-20 11:14 AM ahh, okay, i'll read up on backstops/placement, thanks! 29-Mar-20 11:19 AM @samy sorry, I didn't see you were welding indoors. Stick is worse than MIG. 29-Mar-20 11:19 AM It's banned at the makerspace because of ventilation. 29-Mar-20 11:19 AM TIG is to scalpel as MIG is to box cutter as stick is to chainsaw. 29-Mar-20 11:24 AM haha, got it, thanks 29-Mar-20 11:27 AM Stick gets used a lot in industry. Welding big honkin' pipes together. It's relatively fast. TIG is slow and fiddly. 29-Mar-20 11:27 AM But here's what I did with my friend: 29-Mar-20 11:27 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200329_132539-BB231.jpg 29-Mar-20 11:27 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200329_132514-C7447.jpg 29-Mar-20 11:29 AM nice! the metal is mostly to keep the structure? 29-Mar-20 11:29 AM Yes, just to hold the fire brick together. 29-Mar-20 11:30 AM interesting triangular fire bricks 29-Mar-20 11:30 AM our walls are lined with fire bricks because we didn't have anywhere else to store them 29-Mar-20 11:30 AM we also have them all individually wrapped in aluminum foil because ugh that dust 29-Mar-20 11:31 AM This design calls for two octagons of angle iron. Some tabs will be welded to the outside, and threaded rod will bolt them together, holding everything in place. 29-Mar-20 11:31 AM The triangular ones were cut on a table saw. 29-Mar-20 11:31 AM They did not come that way.... 29-Mar-20 11:32 AM Why bother? 29-Mar-20 11:32 AM looks pretty 29-Mar-20 11:33 AM More insulation? 29-Mar-20 11:33 AM No I meant why cut them instead of just having a weird bit sticking out 29-Mar-20 11:33 AM The design came from something online that my friend found, I was just fabricating it according to his specs. 29-Mar-20 11:34 AM ah 29-Mar-20 11:34 AM well you get another symmetry out of it, so that's nice 29-Mar-20 11:35 AM Come to think of it, yeah, make that square and I have half the welds.... 29-Mar-20 11:35 AM *wouldn't get to do as much welding 29-Mar-20 11:36 AM The idea is that a graphite crucible would fit inside there. 29-Mar-20 11:36 AM How did your casting go? 29-Mar-20 11:40 AM Some links to the design: 29-Mar-20 11:40 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cte_LSYflAE 29-Mar-20 11:40 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fvBzlrlKl0 29-Mar-20 11:40 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7uSGXR8NDs&t=627s 29-Mar-20 11:40 AM As for the pour I did, it was only only partially successful. 29-Mar-20 11:40 AM Was trying to cast a crow skull. 29-Mar-20 11:40 AM The beak didn't cast at all.... 29-Mar-20 11:40 AM Probably not enough sprues. This is kind of a dark art. 29-Mar-20 11:46 AM there are a lot of great casting youtube channels with tons of information 29-Mar-20 11:46 AM but casting is definitely a finicky business 29-Mar-20 11:46 AM https://maritime.org/doc/foundry/index.htm - a great resource more intended for functional castings rather than investment/detail 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-03121.jpg 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image1-0A739.jpg 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image2-553BD.jpg 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM This is what I was trying to cast. 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-8589D.jpg 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image1-5F0CD.jpg 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM More beak sprues are needed. I’m also looking at making the skull hollow if possible. 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM So we don’t need as much metal. 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM The riser block might not be needed, either, if I go that route. Not sure. 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM Unfortunately, Fusion 360 has... issues... when I import the STL of the skull. 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM It won’t let me convert the mesh to a solid body. 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM 3/4 million triangles will do that. 29-Mar-20 11:47 AM I want to be able to design the sprue and riser in CAD and 3D print it that way, so no need to sprue with wax rods the old fashioned way. 29-Mar-20 11:53 AM if you want me to play around with trying to get a solid body in solidworks I can give it a try 29-Mar-20 12:05 PM any suggestions on corrosion resistance of fasteners after i've used vinegar/evaporust/electrolysis on them? eg phosphate coatings vs other methods i can do at home? 29-Mar-20 12:13 PM @rdpierce cool build - do you think that thing could run inside? 29-Mar-20 01:06 PM From a heat standpoint, sure. 29-Mar-20 01:06 PM Whatever metal and flux you are using, and what ventilation requirements it needs, may be a different matter. 29-Mar-20 01:09 PM ah 29-Mar-20 01:11 PM I uncovered my kiln bricks recently 29-Mar-20 01:12 PM I was a bit uncomfortable while my buddy was sawing those bricks. I stayed out until the dust, literally speaking, settled. 29-Mar-20 01:13 PM I drilled 2 of mine, easily enough 29-Mar-20 01:13 PM Again - all our bricks are wrapped in foil because that dust is nasty. Not viable at very high temps though. 29-Mar-20 01:13 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0306-00259.jpg 29-Mar-20 01:13 PM wound nichrome in the middle, small test tube furnace 29-Mar-20 01:13 PM got it to over 700 C 29-Mar-20 01:13 PM first attempt at ever making something like that, worked well enough 29-Mar-20 01:14 PM You drilled into the bricks? 29-Mar-20 01:14 PM Yes 29-Mar-20 01:14 PM standard drill 29-Mar-20 01:14 PM nothing fancy 29-Mar-20 01:14 PM I dont think I even owned a vacuum at the time 29-Mar-20 01:14 PM for the test tube I did use a much larger drill 29-Mar-20 01:15 PM I would not want to be the one doing that 29-Mar-20 01:15 PM I may have had a respirator on, but I dont think so 29-Mar-20 01:15 PM may have been outside.. but I dont think so 29-Mar-20 01:15 PM I dont think it was bad at all 29-Mar-20 01:15 PM I mean, I was working in a fume hood near every night, so a lil dust was meh 29-Mar-20 01:17 PM That's what, a 50 or 100w linear power supply? 29-Mar-20 01:17 PM Looks like 1-3 amp, 0-30V or thereabouts? 29-Mar-20 01:18 PM 5 amp 29-Mar-20 01:18 PM (didn't google it, just basing on what mine looks like) 29-Mar-20 01:18 PM 30v 29-Mar-20 01:18 PM i think 5 amp at least 29-Mar-20 01:18 PM 305 is in the model name, so yeah 29-Mar-20 01:18 PM that thing has worked well enough so far.. hasn't died with all I've thrown at it 29-Mar-20 01:27 PM I do not envy your lungs 29-Mar-20 01:27 PM who knows what is actually in them, but I bicycle several times a day, my lungs are pretty decent fitness wise 29-Mar-20 01:27 PM my mother is a stained glass artist, so I grew up around various dusts and fumes 29-Mar-20 01:27 PM it's fun when you are told to get the solder out of the car.. and it's 120lbs worth 29-Mar-20 01:29 PM It's more of a cumulative long-term problem rather than a "I just did it yesterday and feel bad for a few weeks" thing 29-Mar-20 01:29 PM right, which is kinda why I brought up being around a bit more stuff growing up 29-Mar-20 01:29 PM it's more of a hazard for her than me, obviously 29-Mar-20 01:31 PM An anecdote of someone doing something different isn't really a good excuse, or an excuse at all really 29-Mar-20 01:31 PM https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens/as-it-happens-tuesday-edition-1.4931720/this-sculptor-got-heavy-metal-poisoning-from-working-with-mussel-shells-1.4930128 29-Mar-20 01:32 PM ughf.. 29-Mar-20 01:32 PM swear word removed 29-Mar-20 01:32 PM so, I was stating of a response that the last clockmaker of tall clocks left in america responded to someone who called him out on insta for not wearing safety goggles as he was stamping out parts on the press 29-Mar-20 01:32 PM if you are in a teaching environment, and responsible to others, then sure 29-Mar-20 01:32 PM or if you are worried you may get something in your eyes 29-Mar-20 01:34 PM "Keep buying lottery tickets, it works!" - man who won lottery 29-Mar-20 01:34 PM no no no 29-Mar-20 01:34 PM wrong odds 29-Mar-20 01:34 PM try a different one 29-Mar-20 01:34 PM that didnt work 29-Mar-20 01:34 PM and dont reach 29-Mar-20 01:34 PM Nah, I'm done. 29-Mar-20 01:34 PM They're your lungs. 29-Mar-20 01:35 PM it's funny when people put like NSFW tags on statements or images like that 29-Mar-20 01:35 PM like... that is someone's job that they're doing 29-Mar-20 01:35 PM his response, btw, was like: well, I gues sour shop is bad then, but it's the last one 29-Mar-20 01:37 PM Well if you were working in a fume hood, isn't all the dust going outside to hurt the neighbors, not you? :P 29-Mar-20 01:37 PM haha, the dude removed his comment 29-Mar-20 01:37 PM that would be a fume extractor.. there were filters and neutralization stuff 29-Mar-20 01:37 PM a spray down tube, etc 29-Mar-20 01:37 PM so particles werent really going outside 29-Mar-20 01:37 PM kinda, but meh 29-Mar-20 01:37 PM also, I am sure I did not have it on as I was "just" drilling some bricks 29-Mar-20 01:39 PM Well surely people in 3rd world do wayyy worse stuff all the time, at least you've got good health care available (except not now due to bed shortage) 29-Mar-20 01:40 PM if I was sawing through the bricks everyday I may reconsider my levels of caution 29-Mar-20 01:40 PM but it's not a concern 29-Mar-20 01:40 PM I was amazed when I drove past a welding shop in india and they weren't wearing any eye or other protection at all 29-Mar-20 01:40 PM even people who do construction stuff everyday are hardly bothered 29-Mar-20 01:40 PM Welding in flip flops and shorts, staring right at the emissions 29-Mar-20 01:40 PM professional welders may have a different story though 29-Mar-20 01:40 PM the proof is in what goes out the door was part of the response 29-Mar-20 01:40 PM (found it) 29-Mar-20 06:25 PM India's industrial safety culture is not to be admired, encouraged, or emulated. 29-Mar-20 06:25 PM They're trying awfully hard to break what is still a mostly caste based culture of disregard of industrial safety for most workers. 29-Mar-20 09:33 PM I hope I didn't come off as suggesting admiration, encouragement, or emulation. My point was that, in the words of the Jurassic Park guy "life, finds a way". 29-Mar-20 09:33 PM I'd be interested to know what you know about them trying awfully hard to break their poor safety culture. Honestly it seems pretty significantly tied to having an "expendable population" where people are cheaper than safety measures, and corruption is rampant enough to squander any funds which might be rightfully used for safety measures (including good quality building materials). 29-Mar-20 09:33 PM (source, my wife is Indian) 29-Mar-20 09:57 PM I think there are quite a few people who have that same view on how things go on in the US, too 29-Mar-20 10:30 PM Hmm, idk, people don't go around wearing flip flops on any construction sites I've ever seen (been to quite a few since my dad does drywall and used to remodel houses). Never seen anyone here welding without at least some goggles, definitely not visible from the public streets. Never heard "oh that road failed because they used cheap concrete because the builder stole a bunch of money" 29-Mar-20 10:31 PM Your wife has the pulse of why things aren’t improving on a large scale. Gotta start with “everyone is worth taking care of”. 29-Mar-20 10:31 PM Never seen overpasses crumble with the same excuse 29-Mar-20 10:31 PM Well, it's pretty hard to take care of everyone when there are so many. I'm not sure it's actually solvable by human means. 29-Mar-20 10:31 PM Maybe with a few hundred more years 29-Mar-20 10:31 PM Time seems to solve everything 29-Mar-20 10:33 PM Efforts have focused on skilled labor and trades for the most part. Piecework and day labor is still treated mostly as disposable. :( But this is #off-topic-thats-sometimes-on-topic 31-Mar-20 01:02 PM https://www.reddit.com/r/ManufacturingPorn/comments/fs9how/machining_of_a_part_made_of_beryllium_10240768/ 31-Mar-20 01:02 PM Anyone has an idea of what it could be? 31-Mar-20 02:09 PM looks vaguely like a part of a helical gear pump but im not sure what those holes would be doing 31-Mar-20 02:09 PM or why they would use beryllium 31-Mar-20 02:09 PM also... in the comments someone asking what safety precautions they are talking and the answer is "Basically, not to inhale the dust. Really really really not to inhale it!! From what I can gather, it's absolutely deadly by that route!" 31-Mar-20 02:09 PM yikes 31-Mar-20 04:44 PM I love this shot 31-Mar-20 04:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1146-7FC58.jpg 31-Mar-20 04:44 PM air 31-Mar-20 04:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1138-028B3.jpg 01-Apr-20 06:18 PM vintage heidenhain scales, anyone? 01-Apr-20 06:18 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1152-3B495.jpg 01-Apr-20 06:18 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1153-25A12.jpg 01-Apr-20 06:53 PM nice 01-Apr-20 07:23 PM 40 microns of movement 01-Apr-20 07:23 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1154-6A46F.jpg 01-Apr-20 07:30 PM "i said don't move!" 01-Apr-20 07:46 PM (I turned the knob to move it) 01-Apr-20 08:08 PM Glad that they seem to work. Replacing the incandescent light bulbs in a Heidenhain encoder is Not Fun(TM) 01-Apr-20 08:14 PM @Noxz is that a carpeted machine shop? 01-Apr-20 08:33 PM uhhh... it's not really a machine shop 01-Apr-20 08:33 PM it's a "wet bar" 01-Apr-20 08:33 PM basically a full kitchen 01-Apr-20 08:33 PM and, everythng except for the giant grinder is on linoleum 01-Apr-20 08:33 PM but yeah, chips end up in the carpet.. it's all going to be thrown out when I make that the actual kitchen 01-Apr-20 08:33 PM the upstairs kitchen will become master bedroom+bath 01-Apr-20 08:33 PM you use what you got.. right 01-Apr-20 11:54 PM Ah, heh now I see the stove! And is that an engine lift? 01-Apr-20 11:54 PM Whatever the crane looking thing is, would have been useful ( though not required) when i had to unload a few cast iron woodstoves I picked up last weekend. 02-Apr-20 04:47 PM yeah, the engine hoist was used to lift the microscope onto the wooden stand I built, as it's ~300lbs 02-Apr-20 04:47 PM maybe 200.. but certainly not something you want to attempt by hand by yourself 02-Apr-20 04:55 PM Bah I have hard-drives that weigh more than that :P 02-Apr-20 05:18 PM hoarding rope memory? 02-Apr-20 05:20 PM lol no actual disk pack drives... I have an old DG drive thats 5MB fixed platter and 5MB removable platter... the entire thing is basically one big cast aluminum block... 02-Apr-20 05:20 PM was just able to detect the reference mark on one of th e scales, so that all seems fine.. I think replacements were found on ebay in case something was scratchy or similar 02-Apr-20 05:20 PM its like 300 lbs of aluminum and then a massive iron core voice-coil 02-Apr-20 05:25 PM a few microns.. 02-Apr-20 05:25 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1155-D6051.jpg 02-Apr-20 05:25 PM end to end, that was maybe like 18 microns 02-Apr-20 05:25 PM need to figure out eithe rmaking a decoder, or.. yeah 02-Apr-20 05:34 PM very cool 02-Apr-20 08:20 PM ESP32 may be in it's future, but I have another bluetooth module on hand 04-Apr-20 04:25 PM just bought new bearings for the grinder spindle 04-Apr-20 04:25 PM found a decent match 08-Apr-20 03:32 AM Cursed idea number n+: 08-Apr-20 03:32 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/EVEx7CrU4AIwbpy-CBF3A.png 08-Apr-20 03:32 AM The top cap needs a KF16 fitting and a helium connector. 08-Apr-20 03:32 AM This will be used to dismantle the front end of the vidicon tube under helium atmosphere. (yes, I plan to do a vacuum, turn it upside down, purge with helium, more vacuum, more helium, until I'm satisfied and I put it vertical, then apply heat. 08-Apr-20 12:33 PM Is there some holder inside such that when you heat it, the front desolders and drops off? 08-Apr-20 12:33 PM What do you do with it then? How do you plan to reattach it to something else, or get it into and then out of a larger vacuum chamber? 08-Apr-20 02:14 PM Gonna make it an infrared/x-ray vidicon? 08-Apr-20 03:34 PM think it's for e-beam litho, right? 08-Apr-20 05:12 PM I thought e-beam imaging 08-Apr-20 05:12 PM And maybe litho after 08-Apr-20 05:45 PM directly e-beam litho. 08-Apr-20 05:45 PM @nmz787 the idea is to heat the hot plate under vacuum and then allow the pressure to rise very slowly, hopefully, bringing the tube to atmosphere, but with a charge of helium. If succesful, then you can remove the whole contraption and re-melt the solder that holds the front glass until it falls off. The helium will keep the filament safe of O2. 08-Apr-20 05:45 PM If unsuccesful that way, I'll fabricate some leaf springs to pull the tube body upwards 08-Apr-20 05:49 PM Aren't you gonna need imaging to focus the beam on the surface? 08-Apr-20 05:50 PM I plan to use the beam to one side to do the focusing, like a very crappy electron microscope 08-Apr-20 05:50 PM You mean TEM? 08-Apr-20 05:50 PM umm, not sure. 08-Apr-20 05:50 PM I'm unclear as to why you're heating the tube in vacuum/helium 08-Apr-20 05:51 PM (about denominations) 08-Apr-20 05:51 PM Well SEM imaging is what I was suggesting, you sound like you're talking TEM style imaging 08-Apr-20 05:51 PM The tube filament gets damaged easily with air/oxygen/water vapor. The front of the tube is held by soft solder tht melts at about 150ºC or something like that, maybe less. 08-Apr-20 05:52 PM Tem works like a projector going through a specimen, then you look at a plate where the spot lies 08-Apr-20 05:52 PM then like a SEM, 08-Apr-20 05:53 PM If you're gonna look at a spot, making some phosphor glow, then that's like a TEM 08-Apr-20 05:53 PM SEM uses a grid to attract electrons no matter where the beam has scanned to 08-Apr-20 05:53 PM Then correlates the signal collected by the detector with the beam scan position, and that's how it builds an image 08-Apr-20 05:53 PM @Nixie regarding the heating, it sounds like you're going to take the contents out of the tube but you're going to do that in an air environment? 08-Apr-20 05:53 PM Is it correct that you just want to bring it up to pressure without air, but then you're going to open it up and expose it to air anyway? 08-Apr-20 05:57 PM Yes, SEM is the idea here (looking up the schematic, can't find it now). 08-Apr-20 05:57 PM What I want to do is bring the tube to atmospheric pressure, but with a charge of helium, so, as long as the tube is held upright, the helium remains inside protecting the innards from corrosion. 08-Apr-20 05:57 PM Once installed, it will be brought to high vacuum through a turbopump. 08-Apr-20 05:58 PM Hmm, now I'm confused since you said you wanted to go directly to litho, but now you're saying you're doin "crappy SEM" 08-Apr-20 05:58 PM I only need to do two SEM things. 08-Apr-20 05:58 PM Ah, so you're not taking the contents out of the tube 08-Apr-20 05:59 PM one, make sure it's focused, two, find fiducials in the silicon target. 08-Apr-20 05:59 PM I do not intend to go full SEM and image the sample 08-Apr-20 05:59 PM Litho is SEM with photoresist as the specimen, and better DACs 08-Apr-20 05:59 PM If you're including imaging for focus and fiducial finding 08-Apr-20 05:59 PM Finding fiducials with the e beam sounds like imaging to me, similarly with the focusing... unless you were just looking at a glowing spot using say your eyes or an optical microscope through the side of the chamber 08-Apr-20 06:00 PM No 08-Apr-20 06:00 PM The fiducial finding will be as follows: 08-Apr-20 06:00 PM The fiducials will be holes in the SiO2 insulating layer. The silicon itself is conductive. I only need to move the beam around until a current is measured through the conductive silicon. The SiO2 will charge and repel the electrons. 08-Apr-20 06:00 PM It's not optical imaging like in SMT machinery 08-Apr-20 06:03 PM I mean optically looking for focus 08-Apr-20 06:04 PM I want to try the focus part with different sized holes in silicon too, but that's a wild idea I haven't even checked with Adam. 08-Apr-20 06:04 PM I.e. you have se phosphor on the side of your specimen, or the stage, and you dilate/contract the beam while optically watching the spot size, finding the minimia 08-Apr-20 06:04 PM Apertures could work, but will limit your power a lot 08-Apr-20 06:04 PM Also they'd need to be near field 08-Apr-20 06:05 PM I am not sure I will be able to see a spot 10um in size, to be honest. 08-Apr-20 06:05 PM I.e. really close to your specimen 08-Apr-20 06:05 PM No, I didn't mean apertures 08-Apr-20 06:05 PM 10uM is def in optical range 08-Apr-20 06:05 PM Hole== aperture 08-Apr-20 06:05 PM But I still suggest you get it running well as a SEM first. You're going to have a lot of calibration to take care of 08-Apr-20 06:05 PM Making sure your raster system evenly images and rasters as you expect 08-Apr-20 06:05 PM Also stuff like hysteresis 08-Apr-20 06:06 PM I meant a different piece of silicon with various sized holes in the insulating layer. If the beam is too wide for the hole, the current will be smaller (or no current at all). rinse and repeat until the smallest hole says the beam is ok. 08-Apr-20 06:07 PM Ah 08-Apr-20 06:07 PM But as said, that is a wild idea I have not checked with anyone yeet. 08-Apr-20 06:07 PM I already made my own 12bit CNC to analog converters for the raster part. 08-Apr-20 06:07 PM https://www.tindie.com/products/ElectronicMercenary/cnc-to-analog-converter-bare-board/ 08-Apr-20 06:08 PM But you could have focus changes as you raster around, would most easily detect and compensate for by imaging a grid 08-Apr-20 06:08 PM I'm not sure 12 bit is enough, but that all depends on you resolution, field of view size, bandwidth requirements 08-Apr-20 06:10 PM Thats the thing, I only want to raster 10x10mm max, smaller than the area of the vidicon raster. 08-Apr-20 06:10 PM That's quite huge by SEM standards 08-Apr-20 06:10 PM Sem/litho machines 08-Apr-20 06:10 PM but I'm not working at SEM resolutions. 08-Apr-20 06:10 PM Understood 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM The whole contraption is to avoid using photosensitive resist 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM Is the vidicon screen perfectly flat? 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM Sure 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM yes 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM Ok so maybe they already compensated for focus changes as things raster around 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM "perfectly" as in a very flat piece of glass. 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM XD 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM Or maybe it's insufficient for you needs 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM You'll find out 08-Apr-20 06:11 PM Either imaging a grid first, or lithoing it then imaging after (optically it seems ) 08-Apr-20 06:12 PM Sure 08-Apr-20 06:12 PM don't worry, I'll make a big fuss about it when I'm ready to test 08-Apr-20 06:12 PM and we can all enjoy the fireworks of failure. 08-Apr-20 06:12 PM XDDDDD 08-Apr-20 06:13 PM I'm excited for you :) 08-Apr-20 06:13 PM I wish I had more time and energy to get my SEM fixed 08-Apr-20 06:13 PM Hopefully you do sometime soon. 08-Apr-20 06:13 PM I envy all of you that have a real SEM 08-Apr-20 06:13 PM I've barely got enough time to use my FIB for imaging 08-Apr-20 06:13 PM Someone asked me a week ago to image graphene they sent me, applied to some paper towel 08-Apr-20 06:13 PM For covid stuff 08-Apr-20 06:13 PM And I've not gotten out to the garage for that 08-Apr-20 06:19 PM Ohh 08-Apr-20 06:19 PM any photos you could share? 08-Apr-20 07:00 PM @Nixie https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=10opPaHEyVBJQnFhYhxeR32zXJdBXG6uo 08-Apr-20 07:16 PM Ooooohhhhh 08-Apr-20 07:16 PM Pretty! 08-Apr-20 07:24 PM I wonder how well you could denoise those 08-Apr-20 07:59 PM @idmb eh, idk, most of the noise is from lack of signal as far as I know... And being FIB focus and astigmatism adjustment is pretty hard since you constantly erode the sample as you image 08-Apr-20 07:59 PM Using an e-beam would produce much better images, I'm told 08-Apr-20 09:28 PM yeah FIB is tough to image with 08-Apr-20 09:28 PM we have cross beam so mainly the FIB is just for milling, I know some people use it for quick imaging but never for anything super high resolution 09-Apr-20 12:53 AM Hehe, it's all I've got experience with so far 09-Apr-20 12:53 AM Two different single beams, since about 7 years ago 09-Apr-20 12:53 AM It's certainly wayyyyy better resolution than optical, at least 09-Apr-20 12:53 AM I definitely want to try my hand at some autofocus and auto-de-astigmatism algorithms if I can ever manage to reverse engineer enough of my FIB to be able to programmatically control it 09-Apr-20 12:53 AM (another project I haven't invested too much time in since like 6 months ago) 09-Apr-20 10:26 AM good image processing can do a lot in terms of denoising, but you're right that that's "shot noise" from low signal. Like high ISO on a camera 09-Apr-20 03:24 PM ugh, the bearings that arrived had their plastic wrapper completely cut open, so who knows how many contaminations got in them... will likely have to clean them a bit in a solvent bath, thinking w/ a stir bar (vs ultrasonic, which I dont think would be good for ball bearings installed in their raceway) 09-Apr-20 03:33 PM I don't think ultrasound is gonna hurt metal 09-Apr-20 03:33 PM Both ideas seem good 09-Apr-20 03:33 PM As long as there's nothing plastic solvent seems fine 09-Apr-20 03:33 PM You'll need replacement oil 09-Apr-20 06:55 PM it micro brinells if it bumps the balls against the races 09-Apr-20 06:55 PM and yeah, the manual spec'd out a certain grease, I will look into it further, but may just go with a SKF or THK grease 10-Apr-20 12:53 AM Hmm, I guess I assumed the balls would have preload holding them 10-Apr-20 01:41 PM any suggestions on drying lots of fasteners/steel parts and preventing rust without manually drying each piece? i will oil everything but i don't want to oil if there's any liquid 10-Apr-20 01:41 PM i was thinking mostly drying off with air from compressor, then throwing it in the oven for a little, then covering with oil 10-Apr-20 01:41 PM but the less effort the better 10-Apr-20 01:41 PM these will ultimately go back into vacuum pump 10-Apr-20 01:47 PM I always dried by hand then immediately coated in pump oil... if some water gets in the oil its not a big deal because ideally after putting fresh oil in a pump your going to run it for 30 minutes or so at-least with the inlet closed off to a chamber or a valve or something and ballast full open to let it get up to temp and drive off any residual water in the pump and in the new oil. 10-Apr-20 01:47 PM ahh 12-Apr-20 09:57 AM A rather poignant machining safety reminder from Adam Savage: 12-Apr-20 09:57 AM https://youtu.be/eaGnyaR2B7s 12-Apr-20 01:10 PM Homemade turbo guy : https://www.reddit.com/r/Machinists/comments/fg1o07/things_that_make_me_want_a_4th_axis/ 12-Apr-20 01:11 PM How I wish I have a Haas VF2SS at home 12-Apr-20 01:12 PM Yeah I think OP was saying he is using the machines at his job 12-Apr-20 01:12 PM going to be going 50k+ RPM. 12-Apr-20 01:12 PM Why would you start with 50k rpm for your first try? 12-Apr-20 01:12 PM w^2 RIP 12-Apr-20 01:12 PM I also don't know if a crankshaft balancing machine is going to work with this 12-Apr-20 01:13 PM I guess it's a mix between high energy rotation 12-Apr-20 01:13 PM and wanting a lot of rotational inertia 12-Apr-20 01:14 PM The vibrations are very very tiny. Relatively speaking automotive balancing rigs can have huge errors on them because turbopumps are just on a different level of precision entirely 12-Apr-20 01:15 PM Housing is 1/2” thick aluminum, and I have a whole yard of Kevlar I’m going to wrap around the thing. 12-Apr-20 01:15 PM LOL 12-Apr-20 01:15 PM ah they're an MIT student 12-Apr-20 01:15 PM I would have loved to use that Haas VF-2 for the rest of the project, but right after this MIT evacuated all their undergraduates, so the rest of the machining work will be done on my Hermle UWF 1000 at home or done manually 12-Apr-20 01:15 PM Still quite a machine lol 12-Apr-20 01:15 PM At my house, we have a small 12kW powerhouse where we generate electricity through a traditional rankine cycle. 12-Apr-20 02:09 PM @idmb I don't see that on the reddit page, did you have to find his other posts first? 12-Apr-20 02:15 PM https://dominiczino.github.io/Portfolio/ 12-Apr-20 02:33 PM Oh cool 12-Apr-20 02:33 PM Much better format than reddit 13-Apr-20 11:04 AM I sent him an invite by email 13-Apr-20 11:56 AM ooh 14-Apr-20 11:08 AM I dont fully like the idea of a monocoque/single unit 14-Apr-20 11:08 AM and only because I've looked a bit into hirth and curvic couplings 20-Apr-20 09:58 AM Sooo I want to pull the trigger on buying this https://www.everlastgenerators.com/product/tig-stick/powertig-255ext 20-Apr-20 09:58 AM Any naysayers? 20-Apr-20 10:04 AM yikes that's a bit expensive 20-Apr-20 10:04 AM is everlast a company you know? 20-Apr-20 10:04 AM 'cause my tig looks about exactly the same and was ~600 20-Apr-20 10:08 AM Not familiar with that model but it appears to be similar to my Lincoln TIG 200 which had been a great unit and was only 1,299 20-Apr-20 10:08 AM Oh wait.... 20-Apr-20 10:08 AM Reading specs 20-Apr-20 10:08 AM OK... now I see 20-Apr-20 10:08 AM If the build quality is good that’s quite the machine 20-Apr-20 10:08 AM It’s basically a Dynasty from like a decade ago which were fantastic machines 20-Apr-20 10:08 AM Ok. Now I want a full report if you buy it. Hahaha 20-Apr-20 10:08 AM 200 amp@continuous duty cycle. That’s really good for a small machine if true. 20-Apr-20 10:30 AM but do you need that? 20-Apr-20 10:30 AM mine is like 150A 25% and I never got any issues 20-Apr-20 10:32 AM All reviews I've read (multi year owners included) are all great 20-Apr-20 10:32 AM I basically don't want to waste money on a machine that's incapable at anytime in the future... Especially thinking about going offgrid and thinking in terms of structural welding 20-Apr-20 10:32 AM The max thickness is the feature that seems most unlikely for me to use (1 inch) 20-Apr-20 10:32 AM The thinness is what I like 20-Apr-20 10:32 AM I've onpy welded stick a few times like 12 years ago, and MIG a handful of times (I have a MIG that I haven't used in probably 7 or 8 years) 20-Apr-20 10:32 AM (it needed a new wirefeed liner, or something, and it made it unpleasant to use) 20-Apr-20 10:39 AM Personally I use my mig machine much more than TIG. But that’s mostly for steel fabrication at the shop. The TIG machine lives here at home with me. Actually I found myself using it as a stick welder more recently to do steel work that I did not want to drag to the shop across town and did not need it to look pretty. Just sticking steel together. 20-Apr-20 10:51 AM Hmm, isn't tig better than mig in terms of weld quality? 20-Apr-20 10:51 AM For vacuum stuff anyway, it's all non-filler welds from what I've seen, so MIG is out of the question 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM Our makerspace bought an Everlast TIG. 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM It didn't everlast. 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM Failed fairly quickly. 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM Support was an absolute nightmare. 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM Would not recommend. 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM We then spent $5k on a Miller AC/DC machine. Has given us solid service. 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM In general: TIG gives excellent welds, but there's a very high learning curve 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM It's all about hood time. 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM Stainless welding can be a problem because the other side of the weld wands to get hot, oxidize, and "sugar". You may need shield gas on both sides. 20-Apr-20 12:02 PM Also, heat changes the properties of stainless. You may need to re-passivate it. 20-Apr-20 12:12 PM Support nightmare in what sense? 20-Apr-20 12:12 PM Their claimed warranty periods look pretty decent 20-Apr-20 12:13 PM For UHV, if you can get away with it, only weld the inside of the camber. 20-Apr-20 12:13 PM Yeah inside weld is the common recommendation I've read 20-Apr-20 12:14 PM does anyone even try to do high vacuum welding without a ton of argon? 20-Apr-20 12:14 PM No virtual leaks 20-Apr-20 12:14 PM you should always weld vessels from the inside 20-Apr-20 12:14 PM If you must weld both the inside and the outside for strength, use a broken bead on the outside. 20-Apr-20 12:14 PM @idmb that's what I was thinking 20-Apr-20 12:14 PM if you're welding both sides for strength your welds must be terrible? 20-Apr-20 12:14 PM I've never seen a vacuum chamber with a weld on the outside 20-Apr-20 12:15 PM Or you're welding a thick, huge chamber. 20-Apr-20 12:15 PM I've seen it rarely at Argonne APS on beam lines. 20-Apr-20 12:15 PM These are chambers that are easily a meter in each dimension. Massively thick stainless. 20-Apr-20 12:16 PM @rdpierce how long did your space have the everlast, and what was the support nightmare? 20-Apr-20 12:16 PM It broke in a matter of months of very light use 20-Apr-20 12:16 PM It seems the US "support" was a front for a Chinese company. 20-Apr-20 12:17 PM It is no hidden fact it's a Chinese company 20-Apr-20 12:17 PM Unless you mean they wanted you to ship it to china for warranty work 20-Apr-20 12:18 PM Because a member acquired it through a purchase by their employer, they refused to honor the warranty, even though it was within the warranty period. 20-Apr-20 12:19 PM Oh, well a lot of warranties are like that 20-Apr-20 12:20 PM We said we'd make it clear just how awful their support was, and they threatend to sue us. 20-Apr-20 12:20 PM That seems like not a candidate issue for me, since I'll be purchasing directly if I do 20-Apr-20 12:20 PM Lol 20-Apr-20 12:20 PM Geez 20-Apr-20 12:20 PM The last time I said that to a company like a week or two ago, I later got the info I wanted from them (a datasheet) 20-Apr-20 12:20 PM Well, user manual actually 20-Apr-20 12:21 PM I wasn't directly involved with this. 20-Apr-20 12:21 PM what was the failure mode of the welder? 20-Apr-20 12:22 PM This was a number of years ago, let me see if I still have emails. 20-Apr-20 12:22 PM I also recall things took a very long time. 20-Apr-20 12:22 PM no need to go digging for anything, just was curious if it was some catastrophic failure or what 20-Apr-20 12:23 PM Latency of warranty seems to the loudest complaint with actual reasons behind it, from Google searches 20-Apr-20 12:23 PM 2 week latency seems fine to me tho 20-Apr-20 12:23 PM I'm not planning to make money with it 20-Apr-20 12:24 PM just make your own welder 20-Apr-20 12:24 PM Lol 20-Apr-20 12:24 PM No 20-Apr-20 12:24 PM I have a decade of projects in backlog 20-Apr-20 12:24 PM One commenter even said if they could make enough money with the everlast to buy a lincoln/Miller, then they'd make the switch. Seems reasonable to me as well 20-Apr-20 12:24 PM A few vacuum chambers or deposition systems could give me enough profit for that 20-Apr-20 12:24 PM And even then, if the unit was working, I'd likely stick with it until trouble arose 20-Apr-20 12:24 PM In a pinch, there's a guy 5 mins from me that I could use his TIG 20-Apr-20 12:27 PM Looking though emails 20-Apr-20 12:27 PM Which is another non Lincoln/miller 20-Apr-20 12:28 PM On 1/26/14: 20-Apr-20 12:28 PM My efforts to contact Everlast by email & phone have been ignored for the last 2 months. As of today they have had our TIG for 184 days, still no estimate. 20-Apr-20 12:28 PM On 1/27 after another atempt to contact them, we heard back that it was not economical to repair, and they tried to sell us a new welder. 20-Apr-20 12:28 PM From the email list: 20-Apr-20 12:28 PM Being turned down for warranty service right away based on transfer of ownership policy is one thing, that is just policy. Being told the machine is not economically repairable is another, and while it isn't the answer anyone here wants, it's an answer at least. Being told that calls and emails have been returned and questions answered when obviously they have not been ... I want to know what "records" this guy has that "show" they've done good customer service, even if that was being the bearer of bad news. 20-Apr-20 12:28 PM Huh, on 1/28 we hear again that it is repairable for $680. 20-Apr-20 12:36 PM Oof 184 days is not too reasonable 20-Apr-20 12:36 PM Spending $5k on welder is also out of scope at this point, being mostly for funsies 20-Apr-20 12:36 PM Projects planned for a nice welder are: vacuum chamber for plasma processing and deposition... Motorcycle frame repair for my travel luggage box.... Adding a frame above the canopy/too on the back of my pickup truck, to mount a rooftop tent 20-Apr-20 12:40 PM Have you TIG welded before? 20-Apr-20 12:40 PM Looking through further emails.... they were just plain snotty. 20-Apr-20 12:52 PM Nah 20-Apr-20 12:52 PM Only stick and MIG 20-Apr-20 12:52 PM But for vacuum I need TIG... Sooo 20-Apr-20 01:25 PM That's good. 20-Apr-20 01:25 PM Starting with TIG is difficult. 20-Apr-20 01:25 PM We have people who come into the makerspace who have never welded a piece of metal in their lives who want to start with thin tubular aluminum bike frames. 20-Apr-20 01:45 PM Hehe, I've definitely punched through thin metal 20-Apr-20 01:45 PM The stainless pipe I'm looking to buy from Craigslist is 3/16" 20-Apr-20 01:45 PM Figure I'll jist need to weld a plate onto one end, but it might be even easier if I decide to just use iso o rings 21-Apr-20 11:26 AM simple/decent overview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19duYMdiXi0 21-Apr-20 04:19 PM oiled escapement through toolmaker's mciroscope at 100x: https://photos.app.goo.gl/M8LGinpivN6S5wkh8 21-Apr-20 04:19 PM that minuscus on the corner is what you want 21-Apr-20 04:19 PM this was dynamically oils.. ie, as the watch was running I had a bead of oil on an oler and I brought it into contact w/ escapewheel teeth and it picked some up.. traditional oiling is to apply the oil to the pallet stones, which you need to do a few times and advance it, typically a bit messier, etc 21-Apr-20 06:36 PM Someone sent me this. 21-Apr-20 06:36 PM I LOLed really hard. 21-Apr-20 06:36 PM https://imgur.com/gallery/AUtRjAJ 21-Apr-20 07:06 PM oh yes 21-Apr-20 10:14 PM Looking through further emails.... they were just plain snotty. @rdpierce well snotty or not, 184 days latency is crazy. I'm hearing some mixed reviews on a local hacker/maker mailing list. Someone recommended HTP welders 21-Apr-20 10:14 PM https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/dorkbotpdx-blabber/Rb_XM_j8Gn0 24-Apr-20 05:23 AM @rdpierce LMFAO. 24-Apr-20 05:23 AM Slightly on-topic (welding). 24-Apr-20 05:23 AM I just made a micro steel cable spot welder: 24-Apr-20 05:23 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/butt-welder-002-DB089.png 24-Apr-20 05:23 AM First careless test was not bad, actually: 24-Apr-20 05:23 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/butt-welder-005-e1587729513863-EA71B.png 24-Apr-20 05:23 AM (using 20V 3.5A discharge from my bench power supply before CC kicks in), NO shaped anvils on either side of the weld, just flat surfaces. 24-Apr-20 05:23 AM Pull test with skin-pain threshold was succesful. Also rolling test on 9mm diameter and over-under pass around a pulley, was acceptablish. 24-Apr-20 07:34 AM A friend did something similar. 24-Apr-20 07:34 AM He’s in the SCA. One of those people who makes armor and beats on other people with sticks. 24-Apr-20 07:34 AM He created a spot welder to weld shut chain mail rings. It’s a nifty idea. 24-Apr-20 08:12 AM His probably works better than mine. Right now it's more like explosion welding. XD 24-Apr-20 08:12 AM I need more current and less voltage. 24-Apr-20 08:12 AM But I'll have to make do with what I have. For tests at least it works well enough. 24-Apr-20 09:31 AM @Nixie what zoom is that digital microscope? 24-Apr-20 09:31 AM $45 on banggood, no specs on the zoom though 24-Apr-20 09:31 AM what I want to do is setup an image sensor int he toolmaker's microscope.. I actually just thought of where to place it.. hrmm.. will likely initially be from a webcam 24-Apr-20 09:31 AM so, related to that.. what android tablets out there have a full style USB port so I can insert a USB webcam into? 24-Apr-20 09:35 AM image noise scales strongly with sensor size 24-Apr-20 09:35 AM so if you're rigging it up yourself, an older micro four thirds mirrorless camera might do better 24-Apr-20 09:37 AM I should measure the resulting image size from the various objectives 24-Apr-20 09:37 AM I think it says 600x, but that's just chinese being hopeful 24-Apr-20 09:38 AM stuff like this exists: https://www.telescopeadapters.com/for-microscopes/542-olympus-panasonic-micro-43-fixed-magnification-2x-microscope-camera-adapter.html 24-Apr-20 09:38 AM well, it's not a standard microscope 24-Apr-20 09:38 AM I see a few 4/3 stuff on ebay for around the $200 USD range 24-Apr-20 09:40 AM Yeah just the image noise / amount of light you need scales with the area of the sensor. so going from a few mm diagonally to a few cm makes a HUGE difference 24-Apr-20 09:40 AM by stuff do you mean camera bodies or adapters? 24-Apr-20 09:41 AM actually, the body only seems ot be available for much cheaper 24-Apr-20 09:41 AM stuff = bodies 24-Apr-20 09:41 AM a gf2 or similarly aged camera body should only be around $50 USD, ebay might be more 24-Apr-20 09:41 AM yeah, that's actually what I just searched for 24-Apr-20 09:41 AM I'll look into it more later in time, I still dont have the lgihting setup too well yet 24-Apr-20 09:41 AM it has a built in optical comparator thing (with some kind of film exposure unit, I think, as the shutter speed can be adjusted on that unit).. and simply replacing one of the mirrors with a camera [adapter] is very feasible 24-Apr-20 09:41 AM maybe even replacing the glass screen with a tablet is also very reasonable 24-Apr-20 09:41 AM I'd like to think at 12MP the eye cant really tell the difference on a 6x4 screen or thereabouts (I forget actual size) 24-Apr-20 09:49 AM 8MP wouldn't be limiting, even. Certainly won't be the biggest loss factor in your signal chain 24-Apr-20 09:51 AM 4k = 8.5MP, interesting 24-Apr-20 09:51 AM gotta get ready for school meeting 24-Apr-20 04:46 PM Well just bought a TIG+stick+plasma-cutter combo 24-Apr-20 04:46 PM The 10" stainless pipe I found on Craigslist is 1.5 hours drive away... Might do that tomorrow 24-Apr-20 04:47 PM how long? 24-Apr-20 04:47 PM Need some plate to finish up a chamber, I guess 24-Apr-20 04:47 PM Like 70 or 80 miles one way 24-Apr-20 04:47 PM Oh the pipe, 15.5 ft 24-Apr-20 04:48 PM wall thickness? 24-Apr-20 04:48 PM 3/16 24-Apr-20 04:48 PM radially or by diameter? 24-Apr-20 04:48 PM Calculations show that should be the safe /overprotected zone 24-Apr-20 04:48 PM Umm 24-Apr-20 04:48 PM I think as measured with calipers 24-Apr-20 04:48 PM Cool 24-Apr-20 04:48 PM yeah that's certainly thick enough 24-Apr-20 04:48 PM beware people get wall thickness wrong all the time lol 24-Apr-20 04:49 PM Only issue I came across might be that its probably cold rolled then welded at the seam 24-Apr-20 04:49 PM So the porosity of that weld might not be great 24-Apr-20 04:49 PM Idk 24-Apr-20 04:50 PM you're still only going for rough vacuum with this right? 24-Apr-20 04:50 PM Norcal says they have some fancy pants stock for the Chambers they build 24-Apr-20 04:50 PM Eh if I have 15ft... I'd like it to be useful for a few things 24-Apr-20 04:50 PM But yeah like 1mTorr would be great 24-Apr-20 04:50 PM Leak rate I'd appreciate to be as low as possible, just because it means less open ended questions on the process chemistry happening in the chamber 24-Apr-20 04:50 PM But i gotta start somewhere, I suppose 24-Apr-20 04:51 PM is it stainless or ? 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM I could always cut these apart and use the pipe for a chimney for a wood stove 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM Yeah 304 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM nice 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM Price is right at $465 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM Comparing to other suppliers 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM Anyway 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM just make sure you clean it before pumping, and don't have any metal shavings obviously 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM Mmm 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM I think @GigaSquirrel has an electropolisher he DIYed 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM Was thinking of asking for plans 24-Apr-20 04:52 PM (haven't googled it yet) 24-Apr-20 04:53 PM seriously not necessary for 1mtorr 24-Apr-20 04:53 PM hit that with PVC 24-Apr-20 04:53 PM "electrolopisher" "diy" Giving me a bit too much credit here 24-Apr-20 04:53 PM If I want to build a custom SEM chamber or something tho 24-Apr-20 04:53 PM (or try hacking my FIB chamber) 24-Apr-20 04:54 PM it's a carbon fiber brush, some phosphoric acid with a dash of sulphuric acid and 5 or 10 amps 24-Apr-20 04:54 PM Ooo 24-Apr-20 04:54 PM Good to know 24-Apr-20 04:54 PM I just saw sulfuric at the foodservice supply store last weekend 24-Apr-20 04:55 PM honestly to clean my -9 torr chambers that were sitting on the ground for years and had literal dust 24-Apr-20 04:55 PM I just used boiling water + soap, followed by lots of water, followed by heatgun, then acetone, then heat gun 24-Apr-20 04:55 PM Well cleaning is diff tho than polishing, i read it preferentially knocks down peaks in machined/rough metal 24-Apr-20 04:55 PM Leading to faster pumpdown and lower ultimate pressure due to less virtual leak 24-Apr-20 04:56 PM have a waterjet piece of aluminum in my -10 torr chamber rn 24-Apr-20 04:56 PM Pumped for how long? 24-Apr-20 04:56 PM that's about 2 weeks now 24-Apr-20 04:56 PM Hahah 24-Apr-20 04:56 PM but it hit -7 torr same day 24-Apr-20 04:56 PM That's crazy 24-Apr-20 04:56 PM Ah, that's ok 24-Apr-20 04:57 PM but are you aiming for -3 torr with just the oil pump? 24-Apr-20 04:57 PM Cause the pumping speed of that is gonna be an order of magnitude worse than a small turbo 24-Apr-20 05:17 PM Well I've got a dry pumping station for my home projects 24-Apr-20 05:17 PM And a little turbo that needs at least oil and a controller 24-Apr-20 05:17 PM Probably gonna make a little chamber first , say a foot tall 24-Apr-20 05:17 PM Just for a test station 24-Apr-20 05:17 PM The dry station has a membrane pump and drag 24-Apr-20 05:19 PM I looked into this microscope+camera deal a little more.. Sony has a full remote (wifi direct) API published, and could stream vga quality (viewfinder) to android tablet, until the correct location (via DRO feedback) is achieved, take a hi res photo, send it to the tablet, where it can compare/detect sizes (CMM style, is my goal) 24-Apr-20 05:20 PM Cmm? 24-Apr-20 05:20 PM there were also this 'DSLR Dashboard' thing that was opensource, but I think I may have more luck with this direct spi thing from sony 24-Apr-20 05:20 PM co-ordinant measuring machine 24-Apr-20 05:20 PM basically I want a QC station 24-Apr-20 05:20 PM of tiny watch parts 24-Apr-20 05:21 PM Ah 24-Apr-20 05:21 PM my toolmaker's microscope has decent scales on it (factory, digital version) 24-Apr-20 05:21 PM and a decent way to maybe stick a camera inside 24-Apr-20 05:21 PM Do you have a tele-centric lens system set up? 24-Apr-20 05:21 PM add streaming to a tablet, and tadah 24-Apr-20 05:22 PM I picked one up on eBay for pretty cheap a few months back, for droplet hydrophobicity testing to measure the contact angle 24-Apr-20 05:22 PM Oo, I'd love to measure that sometime, for oleophobic coatings 24-Apr-20 05:22 PM It was c mount 24-Apr-20 05:22 PM also, thanks for giving them the rundown on those other guys 24-Apr-20 05:22 PM people who think the world is only what they can find on YT is meh 24-Apr-20 05:23 PM Heh 24-Apr-20 05:23 PM the current lense setup is not like that 24-Apr-20 05:23 PM can be hard to focus, but it's also designed for silhouettes (backlighting) for measuring 24-Apr-20 05:23 PM I wonder if the german manual shows the lightpaths at all.. 24-Apr-20 05:23 PM just realized that is a crummy shot... 24-Apr-20 05:23 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1293-41A60.jpg 24-Apr-20 05:23 PM also, early evening is here, time to do some things around the house.. and maybe get dinner going 24-Apr-20 05:23 PM buuut... the idea of slapping a camera with an available API and an android tablet just got easier 24-Apr-20 05:34 PM Kinda funny - as a photographer I always see wifi on your camera as a bit of a gimmick, but here's a perfect time to use it! 24-Apr-20 05:35 PM we actually set it up on the new Zeiss Stemi 305 microscope we got at school 24-Apr-20 05:35 PM requires a special app, but it's all just REST 24-Apr-20 05:35 PM (I'd assume) 24-Apr-20 05:35 PM the biggest thing is keeping the camera cool, as that is a problem? 24-Apr-20 05:35 PM and power to it, which is simple 24-Apr-20 05:36 PM if you are actually worried about lighting on your microscope and don't mind spending more $$$, you could go for a full frame mirrorless camera for even more gains 24-Apr-20 05:36 PM but, I would want something that can be on all day long without any issues 24-Apr-20 05:36 PM ah 24-Apr-20 05:36 PM yeah, micro 4/3 was mentioned before.. but really - anything that works 24-Apr-20 05:36 PM as long as the tablet/whatever gets an image at the end, then no worries 24-Apr-20 05:36 PM Personally I would approach cooling by treating the camera as consumable. 24-Apr-20 05:37 PM just a small calibration surface, advance 10microns or whatever on DRO, take another photo, and use that distace of pixels as the standard 24-Apr-20 05:37 PM maybe even put steppers on the thing 24-Apr-20 05:37 PM oh, I do have some AG-LS25s too! 24-Apr-20 05:37 PM buuuut... 24-Apr-20 05:37 PM yeah, optical CMM for QC of small watch parts 24-Apr-20 05:37 PM from mainplate holes to width of burnished pivots 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM yeah, the wifi thing is starting to pay off.. I think early on it wasnt all that usable, but they've had a decade or so to get it right 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM I figured there had to be some sort of interface for it, now it would come down to who does it the best.. the Sony docs are done well enough, but I'd like to think other camera mfgrs also do it, just havent looked into it any more than at the surface 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM kinda got excited about all of this, actually.. also, afaik, theree is no real open source visual based CMM 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM there is: https://github.com/hzeller/augenmass 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM which is pretty darn close 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM or could serve as the basis, rather 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM Not every camera mfgr exposes their API.. so definitely a win for Sony for that.. like, I can get more than 'good enough' quality from Sony stuff, so why look further? 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM oh, found Nikon's page on it.. 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM canon claims it to, okay, easy enough 24-Apr-20 05:57 PM so, a simple one to start out with is in order.. 24-Apr-20 06:16 PM wouldn't you mostly just want images imported to python and then to use functions there? 24-Apr-20 06:16 PM I don't python 24-Apr-20 06:16 PM I perl 24-Apr-20 06:16 PM and java and c++ 24-Apr-20 06:17 PM same thing 24-Apr-20 06:17 PM but yes, just image processing 24-Apr-20 06:17 PM but having a realtime display (even if vga resolution for general locating) on a tablet is moreso a goal 24-Apr-20 06:18 PM they have HDMI outputs typically 24-Apr-20 06:18 PM I saw that too.. but most people had bad hacks to get it to work on android 24-Apr-20 06:18 PM I think they also typically have RCA still 24-Apr-20 06:18 PM thus why a wifi direct one should be seamless 24-Apr-20 06:18 PM but then I need what, a video capture capability on a tablet??? why?? 24-Apr-20 06:18 PM what do I gain 24-Apr-20 06:18 PM I want more than just a monitor output 24-Apr-20 06:18 PM I want to compare the features discovered with a known good one, to tell me if parts are in or out of tollerance 24-Apr-20 06:19 PM well why a tablet? why not just a raspberry pi with a usb capture card? 24-Apr-20 06:19 PM the screen 24-Apr-20 06:20 PM pi with a touchscreen though 24-Apr-20 06:20 PM underpowered 24-Apr-20 06:20 PM or atleast earlier versions were 24-Apr-20 06:20 PM newer ones are pretty comparable to android tablets ? 24-Apr-20 06:20 PM I dont see the appeal though 24-Apr-20 06:20 PM for breakout pins? maybe 24-Apr-20 06:21 PM not having to struggle with a janky API 24-Apr-20 06:21 PM android + wifi direct solves everything though, why add anything more 24-Apr-20 06:21 PM most video outputs that I saw were bad though, like you dont get the photo resoltuion 24-Apr-20 06:21 PM it's downsampled, etc 24-Apr-20 06:21 PM also do you know the API is janky yet? 24-Apr-20 06:21 PM you cant claim that if you havent touched it 24-Apr-20 06:22 PM pessimistic 24-Apr-20 06:22 PM hah 24-Apr-20 06:22 PM I think adding more layers is kinda bad.. 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM true enough 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM I mean, I am looking at making my own interfacing controller/broadcaster thing for the old Heidenhain scales 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM to use the tablet as a DRO 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM so, maybe the idea of having actual pins would be nice and all... 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM but at the same time, BLE solves miswiring anything 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM I love to DIY this and that, but it's not like tablets are expensive nowadays 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM for what is required.. wifi direct, REST calls, and some relatively simple image processing 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM pushing those calculations off to a server or rather non-android specific app would be slightly better, and just use the display, but if it is capable, then why not? 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM I'd like to make it all work, and easily upgradeable if need be 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM there was a time I hated the idea of cameras on phones, coming from a artistic family and such 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM but the lines blurred a while ago 24-Apr-20 06:23 PM what kind of visual CMM stuff exists for SEMs? I usually just see a bar line specifying: X nm 24-Apr-20 06:29 PM Android seems fine if it's just a webapp 24-Apr-20 06:29 PM If you need to compile anything, don't expect it to last until the device stops running (electrically). Android likes to cripple the build system every few years, updates cause older apps to stop working 24-Apr-20 06:29 PM It's basically the reason I dropped any effort for Android development 24-Apr-20 06:31 PM ahh, I actually have a bluetooth bathroom scale that stopped working on an android upgrade.. took the devs like 9mo to make anupdated app 24-Apr-20 06:31 PM but, I wont be automatically updating 24-Apr-20 06:31 PM it'll be a production machine at the end of the day, not serving anyone but me 24-Apr-20 06:36 PM get a medium format film camera 24-Apr-20 06:38 PM heh, the microscope has a shutter built in it.. I havent decoded enough of the relatively small german manual to figure out what/where/how 24-Apr-20 06:38 PM but know the setting to go to to keep it open, then just setup new age camera uptop 24-Apr-20 06:38 PM I love the idea.. but it's just old 24-Apr-20 06:38 PM and I wont be hacking on the microscope any, it will all be with proper adapters/replacements 24-Apr-20 06:38 PM if I can figure out a camera (+lense) for this mod for sub $100 USD, I'd be in business 24-Apr-20 07:41 PM I suppose any mini computer (rpi, etc) can wifi direct to the camera, do the image processing, etc, post to databases, and run a webserver for a tablet browser application - that way you remove all android beyond screen layout preference 24-Apr-20 07:50 PM and, just by going through the initial compatiblity list, and what is available, the QX10 may be a decent first go.. it was actually designed with a mount to go directly onto a smartphone, so no screen/viewfinder at all.. ebay has them for ~$50 .. if it's decent upgrading to the QX1 which has interchangeable lenses and a larger sensor may be the way to go 24-Apr-20 07:50 PM it's format is actually just a lens .. kinda neat to see.. no need for a handle or screen etc.. doesnt need to look like a camera (whatever that is) at all in that format 24-Apr-20 07:50 PM about to head out for the evening.. but this is all pretty interesting to me.. I see the old optical comparator part as completely obsulete and digitizing it is the perfect way to go, just need an accesible API to get that image 24-Apr-20 07:50 PM also, rpi may actually be a decent inbetween box the more I am looking at it 24-Apr-20 08:11 PM The Qx10 is 1/2.3” sensor 24-Apr-20 08:11 PM If you’re at all worried about light... bigger is much much better. 24-Apr-20 08:11 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-18368.png 24-Apr-20 08:11 PM If you’re not going at least m43 then tbh just get a raspberry pi v2 cam 24-Apr-20 08:11 PM It’s 3.7mmx2.8mm 24-Apr-20 08:18 PM The raspi v2 cam is indeed pretty nice 24-Apr-20 09:10 PM What is the best way to separate a copper tube from high vacuum without the cut point leaking, and without going above about 100C if possible? 24-Apr-20 09:10 PM I tried pinching it shut in a few successive places and then cutting the last pinch point, but it still leaked. 24-Apr-20 09:10 PM I am thinking about trying a short length of indium tubing at the cut point, but maybe I am just doing something wrong in the first place. 24-Apr-20 09:10 PM Using molten glass instead isn't feasible, because the glass involved is fused quartz. So instead I sealed it to copper on both ends. The seals seem to hold ok. The leak appears to be either at the cut point or from damaging the seals while cutting. 24-Apr-20 09:14 PM Grease? 24-Apr-20 09:14 PM ... huh. Should have thought of that.... 24-Apr-20 09:14 PM Yeah I was planning to solder along the seam and I think I was maybe too optimistic about the pinch points actually being vacuum tight. 24-Apr-20 09:16 PM As long as the grease doesn't bother whatever it is you're trying to accomplish inside, and aren't opening and closing the greased seal/edge... 24-Apr-20 09:16 PM Silicone grease is good to like 10-6 torr 24-Apr-20 09:16 PM Yeah it's a vapor discharge lamp, internal pressure equilibrium is about 1 torr, so that would work 24-Apr-20 09:16 PM Maybe I could have gotten away with just coating the endcap seams in Hysol epoxy after sealing them with galinstan instead of trying to get clean wet surfaces with indium hmm 24-Apr-20 09:17 PM Worst case then I think is it could glassify 24-Apr-20 09:17 PM Should be the same either way 24-Apr-20 09:17 PM I.e. go to silicon dioxide 24-Apr-20 09:18 PM Yeah it doesn't even get all that hot 24-Apr-20 09:18 PM I was thinking just more from the plasma hanging out inside while the lamp is on 24-Apr-20 09:19 PM Hmm valid point 24-Apr-20 09:19 PM But glass could be a good enough seal 24-Apr-20 09:19 PM And how deep it would oxidize, idk, could take a while 24-Apr-20 09:19 PM But once the initial seal is good, I can just copper tape over it and coat it with solder 24-Apr-20 09:19 PM Then it will last indefinitely 24-Apr-20 09:19 PM I think I will try making galinstan seals under epoxy for the endcaps on the next attempt. Should be a lot less costly and frustrating than excessive amounts of indium. 24-Apr-20 09:19 PM I was avoiding anything other than metal and glass, since it needs to hold a hard seal without a pump, but coating a layer of liquid metal with high vac epoxy should still be ok. 24-Apr-20 09:19 PM The other option for endcaps would probably be just giving up and hot dip coating the quartz with indium. Need to use a heat gun instead of a torch when working those joints also. Kept having carbon issues. 24-Apr-20 09:19 PM Or indium foil onto the end up to a galinstan ring painted around the tube. 24-Apr-20 09:26 PM I have not done it myself but I have seen the tool and it has been explained to me for the manufacture of metal ceramic tubes. It must be dead soft OFC copper tube. They used a Starrett End nipper tool with special blunt jaws that would basically cold flow the copper shut. Alternate methods were to fold the copper over and then press it with a hand held hydraulic press. Then it’s dipped in a solder pot just to make sure. 24-Apr-20 09:27 PM Hmm yes. I was doing it by hand with diagonal pliers. I have a hydraulic crimper. That would be a much better choice. 24-Apr-20 09:27 PM I probably just didn't squeeze it hard enough. 24-Apr-20 09:27 PM I have heard some HVAC tools get very close. The critical thing is very clean and soft copper. 24-Apr-20 09:27 PM Regular copper tubing will not work. 24-Apr-20 09:28 PM Ah I see 24-Apr-20 09:28 PM They would hydrogen fire the copper to clean it I believe 24-Apr-20 09:28 PM Actually scratch that 24-Apr-20 09:28 PM Not hydrogen 24-Apr-20 09:28 PM I also tried coating the inside of the tubing with galinstan, but I couldn't see inside well enough to check completeness 24-Apr-20 09:28 PM Of layer 24-Apr-20 09:29 PM Maybe it was vacuum fire it 24-Apr-20 09:29 PM A reducing hydrogen flame might be decent idk, but cooling without oxidizing again gets tricky 24-Apr-20 09:29 PM Yeah probably vacuum fire. Hydrogen firing copper is a no no 24-Apr-20 09:29 PM Hmm I see 24-Apr-20 09:30 PM Copper becomes permeable to hydrogen at red heat so yeah. That’s a no go 24-Apr-20 09:30 PM Totally forgot about that. 24-Apr-20 09:30 PM Hmm does that work well enough to act as a substitute for palladium for hydrogen separation? I guess probably not, given the other gas is almost always oxygen. 24-Apr-20 09:31 PM I know a sealed copper capsule of hydrogen and a RF heater could be used to dose small amounts of hydrogen into a sealed tube 24-Apr-20 09:31 PM Some hydrogen thyratrons used schemes like that. 24-Apr-20 09:33 PM Huh interesting. That's rather clever. 24-Apr-20 09:34 PM You can’t go the assembly with glass? Or seal a small tube of glass onto the copper tube? That’s a relatively easy seal to make. 24-Apr-20 09:34 PM Quartz. 24-Apr-20 09:35 PM Just use a quartz tubeulation 24-Apr-20 09:35 PM Like a halogen lamp 24-Apr-20 09:35 PM I guess I could go quartz-to-copper-to-glass but heating the glass enough to twist off may destroy the seal to the copper. 24-Apr-20 09:35 PM Copper and quartz is not a good seal. Gotta go quartz to moly, then braze that to dipper 24-Apr-20 09:35 PM Copper 24-Apr-20 09:36 PM I omitted mentioning the indium in the middle 24-Apr-20 09:36 PM Oic 24-Apr-20 09:36 PM Do you have to use pure quartz? How about a boro glass of some kind? 24-Apr-20 09:37 PM Far UV. 24-Apr-20 09:37 PM Ohhhhhh 24-Apr-20 09:37 PM So yes. 24-Apr-20 09:37 PM Ok. Nevermind 24-Apr-20 09:37 PM I would just use quartz or vycor with quartz tubeulation and moly ribbon seals. Many commercial glass parts manufacturers can do that for you. 24-Apr-20 09:37 PM If you are in the US I might try Richland glass company. They may have something they are already making that would work for you 24-Apr-20 09:37 PM Fredricks too, however I am not sure they are actively looking for new business anymore. 24-Apr-20 09:37 PM Vapor light labs might also sell you some of the parts they use for their UV lamps. 24-Apr-20 09:41 PM Likely to be expensive. I already have quartz tubes and figured out how to make good seals to copper with indium and galinstan. They can't tolerate high temperatures, but this type of lamp barely even gets warm. 24-Apr-20 09:41 PM Ok 24-Apr-20 09:42 PM This was a helpful discussion though. I think I can make the endcap seals more easily now. 24-Apr-20 09:42 PM And using wider copper tubing would allow for properly coating the inside with galinstan, so that crimping it actually seals this time. 24-Apr-20 09:42 PM Covering the outside with grease should also help during the cut. 24-Apr-20 09:43 PM Even contact is what they stressed was key 24-Apr-20 09:44 PM Yes, need to use the hydraulic tool I think. If the inside is coated with galinstan then it will give a bit more safety margin before soldering foil around it as well. 24-Apr-20 09:46 PM Maybe even try heating it just a bit before sealing 24-Apr-20 09:46 PM Are you using mercury in them? 24-Apr-20 09:47 PM No. Different material. 24-Apr-20 09:47 PM Heat is a reasonable suggestion, though. Helps galinstan flow a bit better. 24-Apr-20 09:47 PM I was amused to find that my ionization gauge has an entry in the correction factors table for using a chamber with an atmosphere of mercury vapor, though, so someone out there is apparently doing it. 24-Apr-20 09:47 PM The lamp worked, though. Before the failed pinch anyway. 24-Apr-20 09:52 PM It’s still used a lot. Every fluorescent lamp and many other devices. SEAS still makes dosing tabs. 24-Apr-20 09:52 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/1587790312857-60769.png 24-Apr-20 09:52 PM Of course. Probably easier to handle as a high vapor pressure amalgam instead of liquid, but I do see liquid in some lamps (e.g. high pressure short arc ones). 24-Apr-20 09:52 PM It isn't blue in person. Deep violet. 24-Apr-20 09:55 PM Heh are you sure you can trust your eyes with all the UV :p 24-Apr-20 09:55 PM Camera perceives far UV as this weird fluorescent blue. May be literally fluorescing on the CCD, not sure. Mercury lamps look like this as well, while they somewhat lack the otherworldly hue in person (and are quite painful to look at by accident-- whereas this one is not). 24-Apr-20 09:55 PM 206nm is blocked by the tear layer of the eye. 24-Apr-20 09:55 PM And keratin. 24-Apr-20 09:55 PM It's also skin safe. 24-Apr-20 09:55 PM But it still kills pathogens. 24-Apr-20 09:57 PM Well, it only absorbs until it is degraded 24-Apr-20 09:58 PM https://www.google.com/search?q=207nm+pubmed 24-Apr-20 09:58 PM This one is 206nm. Presumably the results generalize. 24-Apr-20 09:58 PM The violet color is probably from the other line, though. 342nm. That's less ideal. 24-Apr-20 10:01 PM Huh, the first link used "in vitro" when I think they meant "in vivo" but it's interesting nonetheless 24-Apr-20 10:01 PM Are you aiming for excimer? 24-Apr-20 10:01 PM Or gonna add filters? 24-Apr-20 10:03 PM In vitro is correct. Skin in a Petri dish. See: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28225654/ 24-Apr-20 10:03 PM The filters are sadly quite costly for large ones. I will probably just let the UV-A come with it. 24-Apr-20 10:03 PM I haven't seen any results for how to remove that extra line at 342nm. I'm not sure if it's possible under ambient conditions. 24-Apr-20 10:03 PM As in prevent it from being emitted 24-Apr-20 10:03 PM Hmm using a higher voltage or a higher frequency or both may help with that. Not sure. 342nm is from an excimer. 206nm is ordinary ionic. Russians suggest capacitive discharge may achieve more complete ionization. 24-Apr-20 10:13 PM Nah the paper I read used nude mice 24-Apr-20 10:13 PM https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27275949/ 24-Apr-20 10:14 PM Thought you meant this line-- kills bacteria without apparent harm to human skin tissue in vitro. 24-Apr-20 10:14 PM Yep 24-Apr-20 10:14 PM Oh, sorta didn't notice it said human 24-Apr-20 10:14 PM I was expecting the methods to use human cell culture 24-Apr-20 10:14 PM But then it was mice 24-Apr-20 10:14 PM And i was like wut 24-Apr-20 10:15 PM Yeah they included some of the lit review in the abstract. 24-Apr-20 10:15 PM This is the group that is handling the research side for Ushio's new Care222 lamps 24-Apr-20 10:15 PM Personally I think 207 from their other paper would have been a better choice, but it is a trade-off between time of exposure, power, and trace ozone emission I suppose. All else held constant, 207 (or 206) should work about as well as 222 for area sanitizing purposes. 24-Apr-20 10:57 PM Apparently it's possible to use 52In/48Sn to bond to glass as well 24-Apr-20 10:57 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/bonding_nonmetallic_materials_using_indium-25A86.pdf 25-Apr-20 09:02 AM tried looking for the biggest sensor camera, with wifi, at lowest price.. didn't come to any conclusion last night before going to bed 25-Apr-20 10:45 AM I've got an old DSLR that only has USB 25-Apr-20 10:45 AM Used python to hook it up to automate via my laptop 25-Apr-20 10:45 AM It's a good decade old 25-Apr-20 10:45 AM Make that a raspi etc, now it "looks" like a wifi camera to an ignorant observer 25-Apr-20 10:48 AM ah, interesting.. at $50 for an entry level (small sensor) camera + lens with wifi makes it easy to get started in all of this 25-Apr-20 10:48 AM $250 is about the pirce I am seeing for APS-C, and 500 for full frame 25-Apr-20 11:02 AM Heh, got my DSLR for free 25-Apr-20 11:03 AM neener neener 25-Apr-20 11:04 AM @nmz787 what dslr? 25-Apr-20 11:06 AM Umm canon rebel something 25-Apr-20 11:08 AM canons's wifi enable ddevices are far fewer than other comapnies, from what I saw 25-Apr-20 11:08 AM nikon and sony have a decent amount 25-Apr-20 11:18 AM I had no idea you could trigger the shutter over USB 25-Apr-20 11:28 AM https://github.com/nmz787/glowing_tobacco_cam 25-Apr-20 11:28 AM says there I have an EOS 350D 25-Apr-20 11:28 AM Relevant line to click shutter is 25-Apr-20 11:28 AM gphoto2 --port usb: --capture-image 25-Apr-20 11:28 AM Preceded by gphoto2 --set-config /main/settings/shutterspeed=15 25-Apr-20 11:32 AM https://developercommunity.usa.canon.com/canon?sys_id=4a1d83b4db3d2b00a18b4b8b0b961986&view=sp&id=kb_article&table=kb_knowledge 25-Apr-20 11:32 AM atachments to the right, of current wifi compat ones 25-Apr-20 11:32 AM nikons list: https://sdk.nikonimaging.com/apply/ 25-Apr-20 11:32 AM sony's https://developer.sony.com/develop/cameras/api-information/supported-devices 25-Apr-20 11:32 AM they have a newer v2 with very few supported devices, not going to get any of the new stuff second hand any time soon 25-Apr-20 11:32 AM ILCE-7RM4 and ILCE-9M2 25-Apr-20 11:37 AM Raspi zero plus any old cam with usb for the win! 25-Apr-20 11:37 AM hah, I actually recently dug out my 720p webcam from my chem barcode scanner project, as school is doing Zoom meetings 25-Apr-20 11:37 AM I may look into that library (ZXing, "Zebra Crossing") in a bit for some of the visual detection of this "CMM".. I did before as I was integrating it.. basically takes an image, turns it to gray scale, ups the contrast, then black and white, then some fancy math to look for barcodes 25-Apr-20 11:37 AM since I wll be working with silhouettes, it will be very similar 25-Apr-20 11:41 AM I like opencv for machine vision stuff 25-Apr-20 11:41 AM yeah, I'll have to look into all posbilities 25-Apr-20 11:41 AM just no real exp with them yet 25-Apr-20 11:41 AM beyond barcodes 25-Apr-20 11:41 AM You can do opencv from python 25-Apr-20 11:41 AM (c++ too) 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM (I dont python!!!) 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM Python is basically english! 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM I do perl, dude 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM :D 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM Ewq 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM you cant force me to use whitespace 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM Eew 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM We can't be friends anymore 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM if t hat's how it's going to be... during this splitup you can have Olivia 25-Apr-20 11:42 AM Hahaha 25-Apr-20 11:43 AM I have spent weeks debugging a perl line that would have taken me line 30 seconds in Python 25-Apr-20 11:43 AM Even perl experts have discouraged me from going down the perl route 25-Apr-20 11:43 AM oh, I dont encourage it at all 25-Apr-20 11:43 AM Saying basically the docs are all written for experts 25-Apr-20 11:43 AM it was perfect for when I first started to use it 25-Apr-20 11:43 AM IT hadnt built out my computer yet and coworker dropped off two books on perl, said: Learn Perl, and left 25-Apr-20 11:43 AM upon being hired 25-Apr-20 11:44 AM Lol 25-Apr-20 11:44 AM it was heavy RegEx 25-Apr-20 11:44 AM when I worked for CAS, Chemical Abstracts, converting chem catalogs 25-Apr-20 11:44 AM Yeah regex is portable to other langs tho 25-Apr-20 11:44 AM so, it trumps all with that 25-Apr-20 11:44 AM it just does it so much better 25-Apr-20 11:44 AM .. anywho 25-Apr-20 11:44 AM it worked, and it was in place already 25-Apr-20 11:45 AM Mm 25-Apr-20 11:45 AM Well you'll always have a job somewhere waiting for you if you need 25-Apr-20 11:45 AM yes, which is why I dont encourage others 25-Apr-20 11:45 AM job security through obfuscation 25-Apr-20 11:45 AM so... if the microscope has lenses, etc... does the camera for this need a lens? 25-Apr-20 11:45 AM or can the image simply hit the sensor 25-Apr-20 11:45 AM I may draw a pic of the setup/idea 25-Apr-20 11:49 AM Usually you need a lens to match the image plane sizes 25-Apr-20 11:49 AM Usually you need a lens to match the image plane sizes 25-Apr-20 11:49 AM Thats why a cell phone in microscope objective usually has black areas around the periphery 25-Apr-20 11:50 AM I removed the second to last mirror last night, in the optical comparator/projector path, shined a light through the objective/target location, and was getting more than the circular cutout worth of light (ie, to the limit, which was like 75mm diameter) out 25-Apr-20 11:50 AM also, the glass screen from end to end (not visible area, as there was a border) was 125x155mm ... if that matters 25-Apr-20 11:50 AM I could crudly measure the distance, if that matters at all 25-Apr-20 11:50 AM my idea is to remove that second to last mirror and insert the camera.. but yeah, the idea of if there is more than enough light hitting the sensor, etc 25-Apr-20 11:50 AM but if the sensor is picking up the black ring around, well yeah, then I guess a lens 25-Apr-20 11:50 AM I dont know enough about optics 25-Apr-20 11:50 AM obviously 25-Apr-20 11:50 AM is the projector in focus during the full path if there is not any lenses? 25-Apr-20 11:50 AM just mirrors 25-Apr-20 12:41 PM Just bought a 15' section of stainless pipe in Washington... Now to drive up there ~2 hours 25-Apr-20 12:41 PM Guy says he has some thinner plate and 1" pipe too, which I'll probably haggle with him on when I get there (for practice welding on) 25-Apr-20 12:49 PM how heavy is that? 25-Apr-20 06:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200425_180052-C7FE9.jpg 25-Apr-20 06:05 PM Each 5ft section was relatively easy for me to move on my own 25-Apr-20 06:05 PM Maybe 50 lbs, I can weigh when I get home 25-Apr-20 06:05 PM Got 10ft of 1" and about the same of some 1/4" or thereabouts 25-Apr-20 06:05 PM Small plate that I can make some endcaps for the 1" with 25-Apr-20 06:05 PM The guy was a 3rd generation moonshiner that has made over 6000 vacuum stills for drinking alcohol 25-Apr-20 06:05 PM Said he's got stills in just about every country around the world 25-Apr-20 06:05 PM He was like 79 or 80 years young 25-Apr-20 06:14 PM noice 25-Apr-20 06:51 PM looked up dimensions of the QX1/QX10 and they can fit in the 75mm hole I have - just barely though! 25-Apr-20 06:51 PM also a question of how far would I need to go in, if I would need to go in at all 25-Apr-20 06:51 PM didnt find a real API ref for panasonic/Lumix cameras, but did find some apis and how to get a list of the supports features, which is almsot the same 25-Apr-20 11:50 PM almost forgot I wanted to also beam a projection through the lens, for photolithgraphy.. makes having a camera in there as well a little more difficult 26-Apr-20 10:14 AM Ideally you'd have both, so you can use the camera to focus 26-Apr-20 10:14 AM (focus the projection) 26-Apr-20 10:14 AM Also you can use a different color of light, a non exposing one, to navigate and align exposures to one another if you need to stitch fields-of-view 26-Apr-20 10:55 AM yeah, just trying to figure out how to do that.. maybe replace the mirror I am talking about w/ dichroic, so the camera can see through yet it could reflect in the path of the projector 26-Apr-20 10:55 AM also.. so during this whole projection path, the image gets larger, of course.. putting a projector at one end really wont make it get smaller unless there is a lense that tells it to 26-Apr-20 10:55 AM and, because it is enlarging, the idea of needing to stick the camera [lens/senor] further down the line for a small image makes some sense, right? hard to take a photo of 100mmx100mm projection if only 25mm square is hitting the sensor, right? 26-Apr-20 10:55 AM I barely enough enough optics.. sigh 28-Apr-20 03:45 PM How likely is it that plugging a welder into the same 220VAC power panel will cause issues for my FIB? 28-Apr-20 03:45 PM I don't really want to turn off my FIB just to weld... But at the same time I haven't really been using the FIB much lately and it's just leaking my nitrogen tank slowly 28-Apr-20 04:35 PM a welder sounds like EMI city 28-Apr-20 04:35 PM i'd err on the side of not, solely from gut feeling 28-Apr-20 04:35 PM also, unrelated -- is there such a thing as an ultrasonic cleaner where the transducer goes on a 'wand' and you move it around a submerged part? dunno if there's a name for this 28-Apr-20 04:35 PM i have some big parts i'd like to clean up and i don't have a cleaner large enough to hold them, but i could maybe "scrub" it in a larger tank 28-Apr-20 05:17 PM @qualia they certainly make ultrasonicators for biology labs where you lift a beaker of cells into a wand/stick sort of thing, not unlike those commercial milk shake mixers look like 28-Apr-20 05:17 PM Presumably you could remove the wand from the stand and move it around instead 28-Apr-20 05:18 PM ah, maybe.. i want something more like a planar disk emitter tho. ultrasonic scrub brush 28-Apr-20 05:18 PM maybe could just use a bare transducer in a waterproof enclosure 28-Apr-20 05:18 PM https://proscientific.com/hand-held-homogenizers/bio-gen-pro200-homogenizer/ 28-Apr-20 05:18 PM Googled cell sonicator 28-Apr-20 05:19 PM the other side of that is that i just want a light (but thorough) surface cleaner.. bonus points if i can also not sonicate my own cells while doing so ^^ 28-Apr-20 05:19 PM also that definitely looks exactly like a rebranded Dremel 28-Apr-20 05:21 PM UltraDremel! 28-Apr-20 05:27 PM it's the same motor wattage and rpm range too... extremely suspicious 28-Apr-20 05:27 PM (that is, fwiw, not an ultrasonic homogenizer, afaict) 28-Apr-20 05:35 PM Looks pretty similar to the kinds used back in biotech college 28-Apr-20 05:35 PM Does say " Requires a generator probe to use." 28-Apr-20 05:35 PM https://www.fishersci.com/us/en/browse/90180023/sonicators 28-Apr-20 05:35 PM Pricier ones 28-Apr-20 05:35 PM 300cf argon tank has been acquired, as has the new TIG! 28-Apr-20 06:13 PM If you have the square footage.... 28-Apr-20 06:13 PM A friend bought a medical sonicator the size of a small washing machine at a medical surplus auction for cheap. Ultimate machine shop sonicator. 29-Apr-20 03:07 PM I have a few ultrasonic homogenizers 29-Apr-20 03:07 PM Branson 250 and.. 400? 29-Apr-20 03:07 PM fine tips ("horn") and the larger/standard one 29-Apr-20 06:25 PM You can use those for ultrasonic soldering with a solder bath, too, fwiw-- just make sure the horn material is compatible or coat it with something first. Much cheaper than an actual ultrasonic iron. 29-Apr-20 06:25 PM Active solder is still needed if you are trying to solder to glass, though. You can use In52-Sn48, or copy some other alloy by Indium Corp or S-Bond. The magnesium containing ones can be made in a vacuum furnace at fairly accessible temperatures. The titanium containing ones are more difficult. 29-Apr-20 06:25 PM The glass needs to be cleaned rigorously with acetone and then hot concentrated NaOH (or piranha solution) and distilled water repeatedly first, and rough ends should preferably be polished and lapped. 29-Apr-20 06:25 PM But I did manage to finally hermetically seal one end of a quartz tube metallically this way, without recourse to extreme temperatures. 29-Apr-20 06:25 PM I think fused silver chloride may be easier when one wishes to attach another metal piece that needs to be subsequently soldered, though. The melting points of In100, In52-Sn48, etc. are too low to make that straightforward; attempting to use an iron usually just un-wets the quartz and contaminates it. Waiting for materials to try it and see. 29-Apr-20 06:25 PM Also oxyhydrogen torches or tube furnaces work much better for heating the quartz than ordinary hydrocarbon torches-- carbon contamination causes difficulty. 30-Apr-20 12:04 AM Interesting update: dissolving metallic lithium in a pot of ordinary lead-free solder also wets quartz glass, and does so extremely well. I tried it. It works, faster and stronger and more easily than indium based alloys, albeit with some caveats (lots of surface oxides, likely only viable by solder pot rather than iron). May be more brittle. Looks possibly better for attachment-- not clear if better for sealing. Hybridizing may be best, but formation of large amounts of slag is a waste of indium. https://patents.google.com/patent/US5120498A/en May try magnesium next. Unwilling to attempt sodium. 10-May-20 12:55 PM @Noxz https://twitter.com/LoialOtter/status/1259560970877194240?s=20 10-May-20 01:36 PM chocolate clock? 10-May-20 01:38 PM Yum yum 10-May-20 01:38 PM "My clock broke again cause I got hungry" 11-May-20 03:18 AM Ugh I just wanted to find a good air filter and dryer/dessicant thing for my air compressor tonight, and all the online reviews just confused me as to how much money to spend and or what to get. 11-May-20 03:18 AM Like, one thing indicated that you need a filter after the dessicant to remove and contamination from silica particles. But in most items, the dessicant was the last canister in the line of filter/dryer/dessicant 11-May-20 03:18 AM And then rave reviews next to "it's crap and broke too soon" 11-May-20 03:18 AM And like, nothing apparently made in USA (or etc) to over engineered standards 11-May-20 03:18 AM At least not on Amazon or first page of google hits 11-May-20 03:18 AM Any suggestions? 11-May-20 03:18 AM I'm not painting cars, just for my plasma cutter and maybe pneumatic valves in the future 11-May-20 05:42 AM Usually the canisters contain filter plates at the end. I will find the one I used. Just a minute. 11-May-20 05:42 AM Finest-Filters Refillable Inline Housing Reverse Osmosis RO Unit for Di Resin/Carbon https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0178G62PA/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_dJuUEb5WZ9B33 I paid less than this, but it's this basic design. 11-May-20 05:42 AM There are also some purple polycarbonate ones that are somewhat tougher but narrower 11-May-20 05:42 AM Not sure where that link is, but you may encounter them while looking also. Only one end of those opens iirc, whereas both ends of these ones do. 11-May-20 05:42 AM Anyway there are filter panels on each end. And the sharp crushed bits of silica gel that tend to accumulate near the ends genuinely can be a threat to equipment. The filter plates really are needed. 11-May-20 05:42 AM The other thing you can use is a reverse osmosis filter housing, but you will need to add your own filter plate on each end, and those have 3 ports instead of 2. 11-May-20 05:42 AM I've found many uses for these overall 11-May-20 03:25 PM Looks good except for shipping time 12-May-20 07:18 AM Yeah. For my plasma cutter I just used a regular in line hardware store silica filter. The little screen in the end is more than enough. Just when you change or dry and put the media back in you just let air blow through it bot a few seconds so anything that would blow through and into your cutter just harmlessly blows through into nothing! 12-May-20 08:20 AM I got the one @niflheim posted but will use argon until i receive it 12-May-20 09:19 AM Fwiw plasma cutters can also run nicely on nitrogen, though argon tends to make particularly strong and reliable arcs. 12-May-20 12:14 PM I've got nitrogen but it's inside my plastic enclosed portion of the garage 12-May-20 12:14 PM Went to harbor freight today while my truck's oil was getting changed, picked up their cheapo pneumatic filter and inline dessicant filter, along with some more gloves and a soapstone marking thing (which says its for marking metal for welding projects... Though i didn't really think about needing something like it before, so it might be a waste) 12-May-20 12:14 PM Their welding table looked a little too cheap tho, and didn't end up getting a table mount vise 12-May-20 12:14 PM Stopped at a pawn shop on the way home, they had a harbor freight drill press for $45 so I got that 13-May-20 10:32 AM Question: suppose that you have a long length of 4500 psi line containing a cryogenic gas passing through a chamber, and suppose that you can test for any grossly apparent leaks at room temperature but that you cannot easily test all of the joints at cryogenic temperatures until it is in the actual chamber. Suppose further that all joints can be permanent. Under such conditions, might it make any sense to attempt to silver-braze an NPT fitting? 17-May-20 10:13 PM Plasma cutter is pretty damn satisfying to use 17-May-20 10:13 PM First thing I cut was a soda can, then a piece of rod that came with some hinges to remove the hinge pins 18-May-20 01:25 AM Swapped the cutter torch for the TIG, but then realized I didn't have a grinder to sharpen the electrode... So I ended up just using it unsharpened on a piece of mild steel. It worked, but very poorly. I'm sure sharpening the tip will feel pretty good in terms of improvement :D 18-May-20 01:36 AM Used some old wire for my old wire feed welder as filler metal, since I cut the piece I was welding at a slant (and old broken woodworking clamp). 18-May-20 01:36 AM Used a magnetic weld angle holder I got a couple years ago at harbor freight for a few bucks 18-May-20 01:36 AM Worked well enough to weld the piece of the clamp back on at a 90 degree angle, but the cone of spark/plasma wandered a lot, and was basically impossible to control exactly where it landed 18-May-20 09:42 PM A properly sharpened tungsten makes a night vs. day difference. 18-May-20 09:42 PM Of course, a new welding student is going to dip tungstens in the puddle like crazy, so an entire sharpened box will need to be resharpened quickly.... 19-May-20 01:44 AM Agree entirely 19-May-20 01:44 AM Personally I strongly prefer the 'red' thoriated tungsten electrodes, which keep a sharp point for longer and stand up much better to accidental dips into the weld puddle, but opinions vary regarding the implications of the radioactivity of the thorium. Alternatives I tried, e.g. 'blue' lanthanated electrodes, were much less robust in testing. 19-May-20 01:44 AM Anecdotally, 'purple' mixed rare earth oxide electrodes may be slightly better than blues 19-May-20 01:44 AM A grinding cylinder tool for a Dremel works if you don't have space for a larger grinder. Just be careful about the dust if you also use red electrodes. 19-May-20 11:57 AM made riser legs 19-May-20 11:57 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1409-62168.jpg 19-May-20 11:57 AM instead of the 2x4 blocks visible to the left 19-May-20 11:57 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1410-826A9.jpg 19-May-20 05:12 PM @niflheim i see on ebay there are some 3d printed dremel jigs with a clear window to contain dust, for $25 19-May-20 05:12 PM Seems reasonable 19-May-20 05:12 PM But a few reviews say the holes are on the wrong side for the rotation of their rotary tool (i.e. grinding toward the rod insteadof away) 19-May-20 09:03 PM I usually grind them toward the end...? That way they can't get sucked into the bench grinder and fling pieces at high speeds. Don't use too coarse of a grinding wheel and it's fine. 19-May-20 09:03 PM The tip should be just a little blunt anyway, especially at high current. They don't need to be needle sharp. 20-May-20 12:25 AM oh, hmm, something I was reading said if you grind towards you, rather than towards the tip... you'll embed impurities into the rod 20-May-20 12:25 AM which doesn't completely make sense when you think about it a few times, but maybe I am not thinking about it enough 20-May-20 07:55 PM If so then they are probably microscopic. I don't think a few minuscule alumina or SiC particles would result in any apparent contamination. 20-May-20 07:55 PM Alumina boils at 2977C so any such particles will likely just melt and cling to the tungsten instead of vaporizing into the melt pool 21-May-20 12:14 PM Ok so maybe I was wrong and people are only saying not to grind it sideways, just longitudinally 21-May-20 08:56 PM Alumina wets quite well to clean tungsten in vacuum. It makes a great filament coating. It will actually even sinter below melting temp. 22-May-20 01:15 AM Yes don't grind them sideways. The resulting surface grooves should be aligned with the rod. 22-May-20 01:15 AM Hmm yes that sounds about right-- useful to keep in mind for argon furnace 22-May-20 02:16 PM Most of the stuff I've seen use diamond wheels, not alumina 22-May-20 02:33 PM I think my arms got sunburned while plasma cutting and/or TIG welding... Just a slit between the welding sleeves I was wearing and the t-shirt I had on 22-May-20 10:16 PM Very possible. Depending one the quality of weave on some shirts, you may get interesting interference burn patterns on your skin. UV is tricksy that way. 22-May-20 10:53 PM Worst sunburn burn I have ever had was from a TIG welder. Right smack in the middle of my chest. I was young and did not have any clue. It was a total reverse farmers tan. Just had a tee shirt on but a helmet and gloves up to my elbows and was at it all day. Like lobster to purple type burn! 23-May-20 10:56 AM Wow! I'll definitely cover up more sufficiently in the future 23-May-20 02:06 PM I'm thinking about Kreosan doing stick welding in a Pripyat apartment, without a welding hood. Ur doin it wrong. 23-May-20 02:06 PM Trying to stick weld while shielding your eyes with your hand? Uhhh... no.... 23-May-20 02:06 PM And their portable battery setup had no current limiting. So when the “experienced” welder fused the stick to the workpiece and everything caught fire? Interesting Russian vocabulary ensued. 24-May-20 12:14 AM @nmz787 that happened to me once when my arm protector sleeve slipped. The banded pattern lasted for several months as what looked like a slightly odd shaped suntan. Not good. Skin cancer risk. Bought another set of sleeves to doubly cover that area overlapping with other fabric on both sides. Hasn't happened again. 24-May-20 01:24 PM A friend gave me some tight woven Kevlar sleeves. Good stuff. 25-May-20 05:04 AM Ah yeah I love the Kevlar gloves, too. Great for brazing stuff, also a good layer under normal welding gloves. 25-May-20 05:04 AM Decent against knives too when opening a bunch of packages in a row 28-May-20 10:55 AM I am still leaning towards the Sony QX1 as the camera/sensor for microscope.. I discovered the Olympus Air A01 as an alternative, but the API doesnt seem as open/easy to implement 28-May-20 11:05 AM if I could figure putting a bigger sensor in ther I would, just not so hype on photography in general, and the ability to put the entire QX1 in the projection body is very attractive, and makes obtaining the full image a bit easier 28-May-20 11:22 AM availability of it isnt that great though 29-May-20 09:03 AM Question: is there a simple aproximation formula for gyroscopic torque based on mass, diameter and RPM? 29-May-20 09:03 AM (APROXIMATION, just to know the ballpark of the forces) 29-May-20 09:05 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/hqdefault-34F98.png 29-May-20 09:06 AM I think it should be dL/dt no? 29-May-20 09:06 AM Torque is rate of change of angular momentum, and angular momentum depends on the body's moment of inertia and angular velocity 29-May-20 09:08 AM Yes, I saw the general formula to calculate the torque 29-May-20 09:08 AM but I don't know how to get the moment of inertia of the giant ball bearing I want to use 29-May-20 09:09 AM If it's big enough to ignore the thickness, use this 29-May-20 09:09 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-0E899.png 29-May-20 09:09 AM If not, use this 29-May-20 09:09 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-0A291.png 29-May-20 09:10 AM Umm...the bearing is 240mm in diameter or whereabouts 29-May-20 09:10 AM mass is about 3Kg? (can't weigh it) 29-May-20 09:10 AM so I would be moment of inertia? 29-May-20 09:10 AM (in the thin walled model) 29-May-20 09:12 AM Well you have to know it's mass and dimensions, and then just plug into the 2nd formula for a thick cylinder to get moment of inertia. The angular momentum is simply product of moment of inertia and the angular velocity 29-May-20 09:13 AM getting a bit lost 29-May-20 09:13 AM ^^U 29-May-20 09:13 AM Will look at it later again 29-May-20 09:15 AM Woops, took the wrong snippet there, this is what you want for the thick cylindrical tube. You're interested in the moment of inertia about the z-axis 29-May-20 09:15 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-D5CEC.png 29-May-20 09:26 AM oh 29-May-20 09:26 AM The moment of inertia on the Z-axis is the "resistive torque" that the gyro will present when an external force is applied? 29-May-20 09:28 AM No, you'll have to multiply the moment of inertia by the angular velocity to get the angular momentum. You will have to apply a force/torque to change the angular momentum 29-May-20 09:28 AM So for a bearing, you should only use the spinning mass (total mass minus the inner race should be a good enough approximation), and to convert rpm to angular velocity in units of radians/sec, just multiply by 0.105 29-May-20 09:32 AM Let me try to digest all this 29-May-20 09:32 AM I'm missing how to link this to a gimballed gyroscope, that will resist movement in a certain axis 29-May-20 09:36 AM Hopefully this clarifies it a bit, L is the angular momentum, and it's given by the moment of inertia I times the angular velocity omega 29-May-20 09:36 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-5F3E0.png 29-May-20 09:36 AM When you apply a force to change the axis of rotation, a torque is produced in the direction perpendicular to the change in direction of the angular momentum 29-May-20 09:43 AM Yes, I can visualize that (remembering the experiment with the bicycle wheel at the science museum helps) 29-May-20 09:43 AM So, to "translate" (not literally) that, what I want to calculate is actually how much force I can apply to the gyro, that does not exceed a certain value of L, past wich would mean that the gyro is not resisting that much of the movement 29-May-20 09:43 AM Like: X newtons -> very small L: ok 10X newtons -> small L: ok 100x newtons -> L becomes large: NOT ok 29-May-20 09:43 AM (until the gyro rotates 90º and gets gimball locked, of course( 29-May-20 09:46 AM The angular momentum is really only dependent on the speed of the gyro 29-May-20 09:46 AM Applying a force won't slow it down that much, the thing that produces the torque is the change in direction of L (which is a vector) 29-May-20 09:47 AM ah 29-May-20 09:47 AM so it's the ratio of change (degrees per s, a small number is ok, a large number is not ok) 29-May-20 09:47 AM ? 29-May-20 09:49 AM Yeah, imagine really quickly twisting axis of rotation, you'll get a large torque feed back. Also, the larger L is (heavy spinning mass + high speed of rotation), the larger the torque you get after you apply a certain force 29-May-20 09:50 AM trying to think of an easier household object 29-May-20 09:50 AM to let them experiment with it 29-May-20 09:50 AM since I feel like understanding that part is a little easier when you have it in your hand and see that the faster you spin something in front of you, the harder it is to rotate your arm and spin it above your head 29-May-20 09:51 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-0F337.png 29-May-20 09:51 AM hard drives 29-May-20 09:51 AM is the blue bit that confuses me 29-May-20 09:51 AM I mean 29-May-20 09:51 AM I apply an external force to the gimballed gyro. 29-May-20 09:51 AM a small mass (let's keep RPM constant) will have a large L, meaning it will reach gimbal lock faster, than a large mass, that will have a small L 29-May-20 09:51 AM is that correct? 29-May-20 09:53 AM No, a small mass will have a smaller L at the same speed 29-May-20 09:53 AM "the more angular momentum something has about one axis, the more it wants to keep spinning about that axis" 29-May-20 09:53 AM ( @idmb https://twitter.com/nixie_guy/status/1266002684991148032 ) 29-May-20 09:53 AM ahh, sorry, I'm getting confused. 29-May-20 09:53 AM let's try again: I have a gyro with X mass, and low rpm. Same gyro wit high rpm will resist a lot harder (it's not linear, like energy squared or something) for me to rotate it (assuming free gimbal) that part I get righ, do I? 29-May-20 09:56 AM Yes 29-May-20 09:57 AM Yes, but the resistance is directly proportional to speed for the same mass 29-May-20 09:57 AM ah, ok 29-May-20 09:57 AM then linear. 29-May-20 09:57 AM (sorry, had to attend incoming gf) 29-May-20 09:57 AM so, here's where I get lost. Is the resistance the gyro is going to offer to the rotation, named angular momentum? 29-May-20 09:57 AM (I mean, practically, I get how the gyro behaves, but the math names just go over my head) 29-May-20 09:57 AM (and then I get lost because I don't know what is what) 29-May-20 10:06 AM Well to be precise, the resistance is the torque, which is produced by the change in direction of the angular momentum. In a matter of speaking, you can say that the angular momentum resist change by producing a torque in response 29-May-20 10:07 AM can we cycle that back to the concept of inertia (which makes tons of sense with 1D linear motion) and the definition of moment of inertia for rotation? 29-May-20 10:09 AM thewhat? 29-May-20 10:09 AM so, the resistive torque would not be measured in newtons? 29-May-20 10:09 AM no, cancel that 29-May-20 10:09 AM XD 29-May-20 10:09 AM agh 29-May-20 10:10 AM To draw analogy to 1D motion: Force => torque, mass => moment of inertia, speed => angular velocity, momentum => angular momentum 29-May-20 10:12 AM So, when I apply a torque to the gimballed gyro, the giro applies a torque back, right? (but they can't be equal, and the difference is what makes the gyro precess EDITED: the forces are equal, until gimbal lock) (super convoluted way of describing it, stay with me here) 29-May-20 10:12 AM (in that description, an infinitely large gyro would apply almost all the force back, you would not be able to turn it) 29-May-20 10:12 AM What I'm trying to get my head around is, if the force I apply, equals a contrary force + some rotation rate (around the gimballed axis) 29-May-20 10:12 AM That is, if I apply a small force to the spinning gyro (constant mass and RPM) the gyro will counteract with...ah, no wait, the SAME force, BUT a small rotation rate around the gimbal. For a larger force, the gyro rotation rate (around the gimbal axis) will be faster. 29-May-20 10:32 AM Well, if you take a closer look at the figure I sent (and also through this link here: http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/rotv2.html#rvec6) The torque produced is perpendicular to the change in direction of the angular momentum. And because torque is equal to dL/dt, you can say the torque produced is the same as the torque you used to change the axis of rotation in the first place 29-May-20 10:33 AM aha! 29-May-20 10:33 AM XD 29-May-20 10:33 AM ahh, that I understand 29-May-20 10:34 AM I find just plugging things into the equations (making sure all the units are right), applying right hand rule when necessary, is often simpler and more straight forward 29-May-20 10:34 AM but you are much smarter than me 29-May-20 10:34 AM equations kinda boggle my mind 29-May-20 10:34 AM I know I can understand them in the long term, but I need explanations for 5 year olds. 29-May-20 10:35 AM Well, just some research into vector multiplication rules will help a lot I think. It'll help you transform intuitive understanding in linear motion to rotational motion 29-May-20 10:35 AM An there you lost me. 29-May-20 10:35 AM Sorry. 29-May-20 10:35 AM (I mean, I kinda understand the meaning of what you said, but I am not sure I have the matematical comprehension to understand it) 29-May-20 10:35 AM like, just diving into it 29-May-20 10:35 AM Anyways, thankyou very much for the help 29-May-20 10:35 AM I'll see what I can do, come back with answers, or more questions. 29-May-20 10:35 AM ^^U 30-May-20 11:34 PM Vector calculus was such a useful course for diy projects in this realm/field 30-May-20 11:34 PM I need to retake it due to skipping most of the homework since I got overwhelmed with day job and my kid 31-May-20 12:12 AM Sooo, my plasma torch (or the portion of the machine) stopped working today after just a minute or less of cutting 31-May-20 12:12 AM I'm not sure if it's the torch/handle portion or a circuit board 31-May-20 12:12 AM But if the torch, does anyone have a good cheap replacement torch that they'd recommend? 31-May-20 11:19 AM the one brand I was looking at that has a bit, that is relatively cheap is Eastwood 31-May-20 11:19 AM I have never got any of thei rproducts, but 've been meaning to pickup t he DC200 TIG unit 31-May-20 11:19 AM not sure I will need AC, if I dont plan on doing aluminum 31-May-20 11:25 AM I would first pull the torch tip apart and see if the consumables are worn or closed up. 31-May-20 11:25 AM hrm, they always have sales, but one is going on right now 31-May-20 11:25 AM looks like it would still cost 800 or so for everything I would need to get started 31-May-20 11:25 AM maybe more 31-May-20 11:26 AM Usually the problem in not with the machine itself but something interfering with it 31-May-20 11:26 AM I have a tank of argon, so there's that 31-May-20 11:26 AM @Charles I half forget... but you do glass-lathe stuff, right? 31-May-20 11:27 AM Yes 31-May-20 11:27 AM do you do anything with ground glass joints? 31-May-20 11:27 AM ie, 24/40 etc 31-May-20 11:27 AM Not currently. A shop I used to go too made them but China kind of took the wind out of the sales of that market 31-May-20 11:28 AM I know the actualy joints/whatnot are purchasable from various companies, so you can simply add them to whatever vessel you are making 31-May-20 11:28 AM Correct. 31-May-20 11:28 AM The irony is you need a glass blower to put them together when a good glass blower could just make the whole thing anyways. 31-May-20 11:29 AM basically, a few days ago I started some Aphid cultures, and based on one paper I want to follow, they had some neat setup for them, and I was trying to not get into custom glass to do it, but rather plastic cups and funnels, etc, as custom glass would be a higher barrier of entry for other frog hobbyists looking for another feeder 31-May-20 11:29 AM I had some custom things made a few years ago, but it was from a pipe-blower.. and he had to order the 24/40 stuff 31-May-20 11:29 AM he did a fine job, it was basically just a long test tube with female 24/40 31-May-20 11:29 AM didnt charge me too much neither 31-May-20 11:30 AM That is typical. The ground joints require very expensive machines 31-May-20 11:30 AM yeah, I watched a few videos on it, basically a special grinding apparatus 31-May-20 11:30 AM Easier to buy ready made 31-May-20 11:30 AM right 31-May-20 11:30 AM the question was not if you make the joints, but if you use them 31-May-20 11:32 AM Apart from a AliExpress dittos distillation rig I got no. I do everything in metal or just tubular pyrex. 31-May-20 11:32 AM ah, okay 31-May-20 11:33 AM Diffusion oil got translated to dittos in iPhone speak! 31-May-20 11:33 AM haha 31-May-20 11:33 AM I was curious about that 31-May-20 11:33 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/fig1-3AEA4.jpg 31-May-20 11:33 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/fig2-D4D91.jpg 31-May-20 11:33 AM the apparatus I want to recreate 31-May-20 11:33 AM membrane is Parafilm M 31-May-20 11:33 AM which I have on hand - thuis why I am running with this idea 31-May-20 11:33 AM and likely just going to go with plastic cups used for fruitfly culturing, and an upside down funnel 31-May-20 11:33 AM gasket is used to parafilm does not stick to the glass upper chamber 31-May-20 11:33 AM I can also turn the top part out of anything.. I have a metal lathe 31-May-20 11:33 AM but the idea of trying to get other hobbyists (froggers) to make cultures as well, the idea of an upside down funnel, etc, is much easier 31-May-20 11:33 AM there is also a lack of motivation, because fruitflies work.. we always dust them with nutrients, so why even both culturing anything else if they work fine 31-May-20 11:33 AM basically got them down to a science 31-May-20 11:33 AM but, variety exists, and they also attack my rose, so why not give it a go one season 31-May-20 11:33 AM the idea on that chamber is to fill inebtween the membrane and the diet chamber a liquid diet, mostly based on yeas extract.. then every week or so suck it out with a syringe, rinsie it a few times, and put new stuff in 31-May-20 11:33 AM the aphids will punctur ethe mebrane and drink 31-May-20 11:33 AM (this is from a published paper) 31-May-20 12:24 PM that seems like you might be able to 3d print the main body of the feeder to make it accessible to people without lathes? 31-May-20 12:29 PM maybe.. no 3d printer on hand though.. really a funnel and hotglue would be ideal I think 31-May-20 12:36 PM i wonder if it can be simplified even further and try something similar to how mosquitoes are fed in labs 31-May-20 12:36 PM sausage casing + blood and you lay it on top of the mesh cages 31-May-20 12:36 PM could try just giving them access to packets of food inside parafilm packets 31-May-20 12:59 PM ohh, that's a neat idea, did not know it 31-May-20 12:59 PM but, similar 31-May-20 12:59 PM the aphids dont really fly away when removing the food source though, many are wingless - which is why this refilling idea works 31-May-20 12:59 PM that the aphids stay on the membrane then the liquid is simply changed out 31-May-20 01:07 PM Clear 3D printing would be awesome for this 31-May-20 01:08 PM it really doesnt need to be clear except to check the status of how they are doing, since no plants no need for sunlight.. I assume the bugs would like sunlight, but you never really know 31-May-20 01:08 PM anywho.. task number one is to cultivate them on pea sprouts - first 31-May-20 01:08 PM establish a population - then try a liquid diet (plan is to use diluted Vegemite!) 31-May-20 01:17 PM it would be a pretty simple machining job of plastic.. a tapered concave on one side, with a through hole,and the other side hardly needs that double stopper in place, that was just to rpevent more contaminations, but could easily be done 31-May-20 01:17 PM but, we would be talking about ~2 operations, and would certainly take less time than a 3d printer 31-May-20 01:17 PM if a double stopper is wanted, then bore out the other side, basically one other operation (+flip the part) 31-May-20 01:17 PM no need for a thin side wall.. that was simply a glass version 31-May-20 01:17 PM I may look into doing a turned example first, then work towards a hack method if needed.. but yeah, just a small bug culturing project 31-May-20 01:17 PM I need to make frog food food (fruitfly culture medium) now .. based on banana and brown rice flour and instant mashed potatos 31-May-20 03:05 PM sunday chores.. 04-Jun-20 03:43 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200604_121917-485C7.jpg 04-Jun-20 03:43 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200604_122203-CEBEC.jpg 04-Jun-20 03:43 AM cheap holesaws are surprisingly good for 1.4301 04-Jun-20 03:56 AM not quite on the line ;), it looks reasonably horrible for the drill ^^ 04-Jun-20 04:09 AM Yeah, it's not ideal 04-Jun-20 04:09 AM but close enough 04-Jun-20 04:09 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200604_131419-74B3F.jpg 04-Jun-20 04:09 AM the weld isn't great either 04-Jun-20 04:09 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200604_131540-4B4E7.jpg 04-Jun-20 04:09 AM but it will work just fine, I'm sure 04-Jun-20 09:47 AM 1.4301 == 304 stainless 04-Jun-20 09:47 AM I want some wire rod of 38Cr2 ( 1.7003 ) and C50D2 (1.1171) 04-Jun-20 09:47 AM 38Cr2 is planned to be my screws, and the C50D2 the pinions 04-Jun-20 09:47 AM based on the alloy ID I had done, those were pretty darn close 04-Jun-20 09:47 AM so, just obtaining them (importing?) into the US is really next bit 04-Jun-20 09:47 AM I figured someone else already did the legwork (namely, Rolex and ETA) on what steel to use, so why should I bother figuring it out myself? 04-Jun-20 09:47 AM also, ever use diamond hole saws? I use them for adding a misting nozzlee to my frog vivariums (glass) 04-Jun-20 04:08 PM Hole on the right is the amount of machining I did today 04-Jun-20 04:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1516-25875.JPG 04-Jun-20 04:08 PM I had to add one more hole at the bottom, but very slight 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM Well the tig/plasma combo I got had the plasma die after 3 cuts 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM i was using argon instead of air, which I only read was more wasteful monetarily speaking 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM But someone later told me it ionizes more easily than air 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM So maybe I overloaded something 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM Got the company to agree to exchange the unit for a tig/mig combo which they say should be less questionable 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM And should be $300 in refund 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM Sooo I guess I'll just look for a good brand cutter on Craigslist, or mayyybe convince myself+wife to drop another hefty chunk of change on a new "good" one (hypertherm) 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM Already have an old MIG so that isn't too interesting, but I guess I can always offload that at some point to recoup another $100 and a little garage space 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM The plasma cutter was fun while it lasted :/ 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM Tried debugging a bit last night, but didn't get too far since all my probing was "in circuit" 04-Jun-20 04:21 PM Maybe an IGBT, maybe a relay, maybe who knows 05-Jun-20 08:07 AM Big machining! 05-Jun-20 08:07 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-9FADB.png 05-Jun-20 08:07 AM sent my iso250 flange out for some holes 05-Jun-20 08:11 AM Interesting chip clearing 05-Jun-20 09:55 AM not sure I will get to any machning today 05-Jun-20 09:55 AM I have dozens of screwdrivers (handle) to make 05-Jun-20 09:55 AM but I want coolant/cutting fluid running for it as I will be doing lots of knurling 05-Jun-20 09:55 AM and squeezing a bottle by hand is no bueno 05-Jun-20 11:09 AM screwdriver handles? 05-Jun-20 11:09 AM replacing original handles or making new screwdrivers? 05-Jun-20 02:20 PM Oh wow. That is one awesome bit of machining, @Noxz . It looks like a lot of material removed to get it to balance. 05-Jun-20 03:12 PM two tiny holes.. the balance is 9mm diameter, and the rim is 0.45mm wide, so the holes er under .4mm 05-Jun-20 03:12 PM maybe 0.02grams removed? Glucydur is kinda heavy 06-Jun-20 03:59 AM the weld isn't great either @GigaSquirrel jup ok is totally fine 06-Jun-20 04:02 AM second weld looks better and it closer to the line 06-Jun-20 04:02 AM dont put to many holes it in there is quite the force acting on those flanges even if you weld things into the holes, i saw one that collapsed because of that was not so nice 06-Jun-20 04:02 AM first weld was just too hot 06-Jun-20 04:02 AM they look quite good 06-Jun-20 04:03 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200606_130259-A28FC.jpg 06-Jun-20 04:03 AM and it's closer to the line 06-Jun-20 04:04 AM nice XD 09-Jun-20 11:45 AM So again, people who weld: how do I design this to make it easy for the shop to weld it? 09-Jun-20 11:45 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-F8B6D.png 09-Jun-20 11:45 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-7B9CA.png 09-Jun-20 11:45 AM Matching tube thickness with plate thickness.. Plate on inside or outside of tube... ? 09-Jun-20 11:45 AM Inside will be atmospheric pressure, outside will be vacuum. 09-Jun-20 11:47 AM so you'll want all outside diameters 09-Jun-20 11:47 AM that makes it manageable 09-Jun-20 11:47 AM I'd make the last mm or so of your disks the same diameter as the od of your tube so they sit flush 09-Jun-20 11:58 AM not sure what you mean by "all outside diameters" 09-Jun-20 12:37 PM sorry was a brainfart, I meant all outside welds 09-Jun-20 12:37 PM you always want welds to be on the vacuum side 09-Jun-20 02:07 PM Yeah it's designed that way! 09-Jun-20 02:07 PM I've been told that making grooves like o-ring grooves such that there's a little lip with matched thickness to the tubes is the way to go 09-Jun-20 02:07 PM makes sense to me 09-Jun-20 02:10 PM quick question, what is this? ^^ 09-Jun-20 02:12 PM LN2 cryopump 09-Jun-20 02:12 PM molecular beam passes through the middle 09-Jun-20 02:14 PM oh and the two tubes are inlet / outlet? 09-Jun-20 02:15 PM more like "inlet and exhaust" The second is partially to make it easier to weld onto a CF flange at a fixed orientation, and partially so that when you pour LN2 in there's somewhere for the air to go 09-Jun-20 02:15 PM the tubes are big so that you can freely pour with a funnel quickly 09-Jun-20 02:15 PM and the bottom is chunky for thermal mass 09-Jun-20 02:15 PM so that we can fill it in the morning and leave it all day 09-Jun-20 02:15 PM ahh, I see 09-Jun-20 02:15 PM cool! 09-Jun-20 02:56 PM in situ: 09-Jun-20 02:56 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-85200.png 09-Jun-20 07:07 PM Where does the Vibranium go??? Or the dilithium crystals? Ok I could not resist. Sorry. 10-Jun-20 02:40 AM Is this what I'd need to attach a turbo to a chamber I'm trying to weld up? https://www.ebay.com/itm/SS304-ISO63-ISO80-ISO100-ISO160-Vacuum-Flange/193215774484 10-Jun-20 05:59 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200610_145542-33CEB.jpg 10-Jun-20 05:59 AM weld on flanges! 10-Jun-20 05:59 AM the CF40 are recycled from another chamber, the iso 100 are new, but I messed up and bought 108 instead of 104 mm tubing for them so I had to make the hole bigger on the lathe 10-Jun-20 05:59 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200610_150112-FEDDF.jpg 10-Jun-20 05:59 AM so that was... fun 10-Jun-20 05:59 AM @nmz787 as you can see it is what I'm using to attach a turbo to my chamber ^^ 10-Jun-20 10:23 AM @GigaSquirrel so I have to do one weld NOT on the vacuum side 10-Jun-20 10:23 AM but... the other people making the same item also had to do that 10-Jun-20 10:23 AM what's the secret? anything anyone here know of that I should keep in mind when drawing that? 10-Jun-20 10:25 AM why would you have to weld on the air side? 10-Jun-20 10:25 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-325F0.png 10-Jun-20 10:25 AM to do the nested tubes 10-Jun-20 10:25 AM ahh 10-Jun-20 10:25 AM it's not that bad 10-Jun-20 10:26 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-41DAD.png 10-Jun-20 10:26 AM just may cause some virtual leaks 10-Jun-20 10:26 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200610_192523-03AEF.jpg 10-Jun-20 10:26 AM just did my four flanges 10-Jun-20 10:26 AM the isos didn't turn out very nice but they should still be tight 10-Jun-20 01:21 PM So I'd just buy that iso ring, weld on the side opposite of the o-ring/clamp portion? 10-Jun-20 01:21 PM @GigaSquirrel seems you made your own iso flange?? 10-Jun-20 01:22 PM no, I bought it, but I had to modify it to fit the tube I got 10-Jun-20 01:22 PM but machining iso is pretty easy tbh 10-Jun-20 01:26 PM machining ISO = easy machining stainless = less easy 10-Jun-20 01:27 PM yep 10-Jun-20 01:27 PM esp. on a terrible lathe like mine 10-Jun-20 01:44 PM At $20 each I would weld... 10-Jun-20 02:13 PM Yep ^^ 11-Jun-20 09:16 AM looking at getting an electromagnetic chuck for the grinder.. will wait for auction to end and then offer the guy to relist it lower 11-Jun-20 09:16 AM also, siding for the house being delivered today, so it's going to be a rough couple of weeks 11-Jun-20 09:31 AM 3500lbs of cement fiber siding 11-Jun-20 09:42 AM Man I need to paint my house this summer 11-Jun-20 09:42 AM Bought a paint sprayer last spring 11-Jun-20 09:42 AM Did not use it last year 11-Jun-20 09:42 AM this will be primed, but I did spec out the paint to be RAL6009, forest greeen 11-Jun-20 09:42 AM but of course RAL is not standard in the US 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM I think I'm gonna take a leave of absence from day job for a year 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM I havent worked for 2 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM but, school 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM ends in 2mo 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM roughly 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM My kid plus entrepreneurship ideas are too interesting compared to day job 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM My work is too easy, and not terribly meaningful 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM I keep getting awards and raises tho, so the money aspect fueling my hobby purchases has been addictive 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM But then like no time to work on the hobbies 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM (aka long term startup ideas) 11-Jun-20 09:43 AM At this point I'm close to being able to offe FIB machining services 11-Jun-20 09:45 AM I hear that.. stocks did pretty good for me after Q1 earnings 11-Jun-20 09:45 AM And with a little more work, maybe even mems prototyping 11-Jun-20 09:45 AM I was dumb and didn't pour a bunch of cash into stocks when lockdown hit 11-Jun-20 09:46 AM I think I will try some toolmaker microscope projector photoresist exposure thing for tiny gears at first.. if I figure out I need something better.. well... we'll get there 11-Jun-20 09:46 AM I would never invest in an economic crises 11-Jun-20 09:47 AM The rich people got richer 11-Jun-20 09:47 AM I had to pull some out during, just because my cash ran low.. but I basically cashed out 50% recently 11-Jun-20 09:47 AM I figured why shouldn't I 11-Jun-20 09:47 AM and my main stock is at the highest it's ever been 11-Jun-20 09:47 AM if you can, and have faith in the system, then sure 11-Jun-20 09:47 AM But then, don't know enough about stocks and spent time reading my normal reading instead of stock market stuff 11-Jun-20 09:48 AM yeah, I am not diversified at all.. I go on a rollercoaster ever day looking at prices of it 11-Jun-20 09:48 AM Haha 11-Jun-20 09:48 AM :/ 11-Jun-20 09:48 AM it was mostly employee stock 11-Jun-20 09:48 AM We only have Intel aside from our 401ks 11-Jun-20 09:48 AM Same here, plus they have a discounted purchase plan 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM yup, 15% off or so was for 'us' 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM Yeah 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM with a maybe of like 10% of your paycheck? 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM I wish I could have got more 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM but they limit 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM I think its 5% max of salary here 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM that may be it 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM again, it's been 2 years 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM Same, we've got it maxed 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM yeah, it's stupid not to 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM even if you sell it immedietly, that is a 15% gain 11-Jun-20 09:49 AM anywhho, yeah, house work 11-Jun-20 09:50 AM Yeah 11-Jun-20 09:50 AM Ttyl 11-Jun-20 09:50 AM well, I'm still around, I was just shifting the conversation away from stocks 11-Jun-20 09:50 AM waiting on the delivery 11-Jun-20 09:50 AM shaving.. about to shower, etc 11-Jun-20 06:16 PM all of my siding arrived, got it off the truck then into the sideyard, took a few hours, certainly took another shower after that, still pretty tired.. thankfully I dont have all the hardware for a few days so I get to relax until it comes in 11-Jun-20 06:16 PM got somee concrete siding shears that are powered by any electric screwdriver/impact driver - should be interesting to try out, and no dust 14-Jun-20 11:37 AM just got (delivered) a pretty good jbar for moving machinery 14-Jun-20 03:44 PM Google shows jbar is a rapper and nothing more really 14-Jun-20 03:44 PM I guess his music didn't pan out ;) 15-Jun-20 08:57 AM https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200674385_200674385 15-Jun-20 08:57 AM real cheap for what it is 15-Jun-20 08:57 AM slightly tall though, so if in a tight corner it may not be easy to actually use 15-Jun-20 09:52 AM That’s a J bar and the handle is supposed to be long. I have one that’s about 7 foot long and I consider that to be a minimum for its intended use 15-Jun-20 11:06 AM the j-bar adam had and used with my grinder was maybe 4ft? 15-Jun-20 11:06 AM it certainly looked like it was bending, heh, but worked admirably 16-Jun-20 11:19 AM Longer the handle the more control you have and less likelihood you will loose your grip and have it spring up and hit you. 16-Jun-20 10:18 PM that's what she said 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM My welder+plasma cutter got returned the the UPS store last Friday, and until today was "lost" in their system 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM Looks like its nearing the destination back to the company now 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM Hopefully I'll get my replacement (without plasma cutter) soon. 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM Ordered a bunch of welding rods and stuff two nights ago, as well as a new wire liner for my MIG welder 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM Considering now if I want to drop another $2k+ on a top of the line plasma cutter 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM Not sure what I'll use it for besides occasionally cutting stuff 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM Like, not sure if I'd really ever make any money with it 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM Thinking the Hypertherm powermax 45xp 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM It can be upgraded later with an rs485 control board for CNC integration 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM Confirmed on a forum post by a hypertherm company person that you don't need a 6CFM air supply, just needs to be 90psi and if the CFM is too low, your cut time will be short (when the air runs out or gets too low pressure the plasma will stop) 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM Which seems fine for my usage 17-Jun-20 02:18 AM I can always just get another air tank as a buffer if needed 19-Jun-20 02:59 PM was able to snag the correct backsplash for my lathe+stand.. and at a moderate price - would have likely cost as much if not more to custom fab something 19-Jun-20 03:08 PM just rare for it to pop up, glad to get it though 27-Jun-20 02:12 PM Whee, just got my replacement TIG welder 27-Jun-20 05:29 PM That time I TIG welded some wires because soldering wasn't working out 27-Jun-20 05:29 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/JPEG_20200627_172946-752DB.jpg 27-Jun-20 05:29 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/JPEG_20200627_173005-9858E.jpg 27-Jun-20 10:23 PM haha nice 27-Jun-20 10:23 PM love that 3rd hand (i have it as well, then removed the paint and black plastidipped it, such fun stuff). i want to try attaching a suction cup to the bottom of those 3rd hands and see how they fare. my desk is glass so just being able to quickly grab a single arm and get strong grip without taking a ton of space would be nice 27-Jun-20 10:53 PM Oh cool, yeah it was an impulse buy a few years ago when I saw it mentioned in some hackaday article or YouTube video, something like that. Definitely been nice as far as third-hands go 27-Jun-20 10:53 PM I realized that if I weld wires again, I probably should do it resting on something like a piece of ceramic tile, since the wire melted and dripped away a few times and that added some unexpected challenge 27-Jun-20 11:01 PM i've been wondering faster ways to solder thicker gauge wires...maybe braising with a supr small torch? 28-Jun-20 09:19 AM just electrical tape them together what could go wrong? 28-Jun-20 09:30 AM for large gauge wires I usually splice the strands together sorta like this: https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.476311/page/n128/mode/1up 28-Jun-20 12:15 PM In this case I wanted the individual strands to be connected, because it's for a ground line for my welder, and I figured if the concern was high frequency (from the HF arc start) then isn't that gonna be transported by the skin effect, and if so, I guess I want the skin to be contiguous 28-Jun-20 12:15 PM Although the strands were twisted together out of the package, so maybe that makes my reasoning invalid, idk 28-Jun-20 12:15 PM It was fun practice tho, and I've never welded copper before 01-Jul-20 02:41 AM Heh, and I might have given myself a sunburn again while TIG welding... Had my visor on but then my 2 year old woke up, so I gave it to him and used goggles, then he went away but I didn't switch back immediately 01-Jul-20 02:41 AM This time the burn seems like it's on my forehead, but it's a little hard to tell, we'll see tomorrow I guess 01-Jul-20 02:41 AM Was welding for a good 3 or 4 hours, on and off with metal prep (grinding) in between 01-Jul-20 04:34 PM @samy What gauge wires are you talking about? Also, do you have a soldering iron with a cartridge tip, or do you have an old style one where the tips are just hunks of metal? 01-Jul-20 04:39 PM @transorbs i have a Weller WES51, atm i have a larger chisel tip on it (it's removable, I assume that's what you mean by cartridge tip?), though that by itself is a little annoying as I switch between larger gauge soldering vs fine tip SMD work, but not a huge deal. i think the other day I was using 12 or 16AWG 01-Jul-20 04:39 PM ohhh yeah, that is not going to be great for thicker wire 01-Jul-20 04:40 PM it's sort of a fat chisel tip, but i ended up just using a butane torch and smearing solder everywhere. it wasn't pretty 01-Jul-20 04:40 PM So, newer soldering irons are switching to tips with the heater bonded directly to the tips. Much, much better power transfer so much easier to solder beefy connections. 01-Jul-20 04:40 PM for wires like that the weller "gun" typpe soldering irons work well 01-Jul-20 04:40 PM It is also easier to swap tips since a lot of them use quick connections instead of a screw ferrule setup 01-Jul-20 04:40 PM downsides: they are pricier. The cheapest reasonable one is the pace ADS200, which sits at about $250. The tips are also a bit more expensive. 01-Jul-20 04:40 PM A lot of people like the TS100/TS80 which use these style of tips and run closer to $90. They have their flaws though. 01-Jul-20 04:40 PM You would see a pretty significant improvement with the TS100 fwiw 01-Jul-20 04:48 PM i'd be okay to invest in a new iron. i've had the WES51 since i was a teenager. works well but i'd be delighted with some improvements for a device that sits next to me daily. if i do get something, it'd also be nice to have solder "tongs" for easier IC/component removal as well 01-Jul-20 04:48 PM checking those out now 01-Jul-20 04:56 PM Here is what a cartridge looks like: https://www.accessotronik.com/v/vspfiles/assets/images/cartridges.jpg (those are JBC cartridges) 01-Jul-20 04:56 PM Lots of info on the pros/cons of the TS80, the Pace ADS200 is supposedly decent, but it is still kind of new so dunno, and the two brands that are rock solid are JBC and Metcal, but wow are they expensive. 01-Jul-20 04:56 PM I believe the TS80 actually uses JBC tips 01-Jul-20 04:56 PM would not suggest Weller, haven't heard good things about their stuff in the last 10-15 years. 01-Jul-20 05:00 PM ahh interesting 01-Jul-20 05:00 PM The discount metcal is thermaltronics 01-Jul-20 05:00 PM Similar tech and by former metcal engineers 01-Jul-20 05:00 PM And yeah current wellers are mid tier 01-Jul-20 05:00 PM They are ok, but there are better options 01-Jul-20 05:04 PM @rfs ah yes, I remember hearing about them, but totally forgot they existed. 01-Jul-20 05:04 PM Tbh I'd put the thermaltronics station on par with the wellers I have used 01-Jul-20 07:57 PM We have them all in production. For smt assembly rework you cannot beat Metcal. Their plating holds up way better than anybody else’s. We have tried Others and they just can’t put the heat down. For through hole we always go back to Weller WTCP units. They just outlast everything else and the thermal mass is more than anybody else. We had Hakko and they just sit in boxes now. The plating on their tips is not what it used to be. 01-Jul-20 07:57 PM JCB is just too expensive for what you get 01-Jul-20 07:57 PM I use the MX blade Metcal cartridge more than anything. 01-Jul-20 07:57 PM The one I use the most is .750” wide! Then a small bent hoof tip for surface mount rework. 01-Jul-20 07:57 PM I get them all on 800 degree. I want max heat all the time and just work faster! 01-Jul-20 09:00 PM I have a JBC and it's amaaaaaazing 01-Jul-20 10:25 PM hmm cool 02-Jul-20 05:53 AM we've got a pair of jbc's at the hackerspace here, switched from aoyue/wellers to them and they are indeed amazing 02-Jul-20 05:53 AM great temperature regulation and very quick startup (from idle temp to work temp in a few seconds) 02-Jul-20 05:53 AM not cheap though, i think we paid around 400 euros for the JBC with a digital controller, less for the simple knob based one 02-Jul-20 10:52 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> I've had the same metcal iron forever and it's great 02-Jul-20 07:51 PM I use a Hakko as my primary soldering iron. 02-Jul-20 07:51 PM I totally got spoiled on constant temperature control. 02-Jul-20 09:16 PM JBC has that as well. hard to live without 03-Jul-20 11:33 AM how about a ts-100 09-Jul-20 03:01 AM https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6415292/ 09-Jul-20 12:26 PM That is why we tell people to cover up and also put up the welding filter barriers at the work area. It isn't just to keep sparks out of your arm hair. 09-Jul-20 04:47 PM Worst sunburn I have ever had was from tig welding with no shirt on. It was super hot out and I simply did not know any better. I remember thinking of sweet. No weld splatter. Off came the shirt. I was like lobster color. 09-Jul-20 06:09 PM Seems like the harbor freight welding masks are no less safe than the "name" brands 09-Jul-20 06:09 PM But that was my concern that lead me to that paper 09-Jul-20 06:09 PM I was welding last week with my TIG for several hours and when my kid came out I gave him the mask and was just using goggles... He left and I didn't switch back for a while longer, ended up with some light burning around the outside of my face and near the hairline 09-Jul-20 06:09 PM Enough to cause some minor peeling 09-Jul-20 06:34 PM i kinda wish someone would've thrown a welding helmet or goggles or even some sunglasses at young-me before i'd spent most of my teen years ogling electrical arcs >_>' 09-Jul-20 06:34 PM fuzzies & floaters ahoy 09-Jul-20 06:34 PM live and learn ig 10-Jul-20 12:35 AM fuzzies & floaters ahoy @qualia I thought they were a completley normal thing? Not related to high light stuff 10-Jul-20 01:08 AM a few floaters definitely are; i have a bunch and i'm not sure if that's totally related. i do have some, like, very small/subtle optical deadzones where i can't resolve details well unless i look 'around' them, and i think that's the actual optical damage there 10-Jul-20 01:10 AM heh, I've realized the same for me, whenever I look for a really weak light source I tend to look a bit above it as I am more sensitive below my center of vision 10-Jul-20 01:10 AM or i'm nuts and my eyes just suck more than usual, but i can't imagine it was any good for me in any event 10-Jul-20 01:11 AM flash yourself many times just a bit so your body can build up a resistance 10-Jul-20 01:18 AM @GigaSquirrel This is normal... On retina, distribution of color and BW receptors is not homogenous. Color receptors are more situated in center of FoV, BW receptors are more around the edges. And as BW receptors are far more sensitive, so its perfectly normal to have more "sensitive" vision out of center.... 10-Jul-20 01:19 AM TIL 10-Jul-20 01:19 AM Thanks 10-Jul-20 01:20 AM @bkralik that was exactly my first thought after reading @GigaSquirrel reply 10-Jul-20 01:21 AM Yep tho that doesnt discount qualias explanation, damaged areas on the retina present no different from natural weak spots 10-Jul-20 01:21 AM I've had a pretty bad "burn in" from looking at what was practically a flashbang (stupid neighbor messing with explosives...) and that took weeks to fade, matches their description perfectly 10-Jul-20 01:21 AM At first the dark spot was noticeable but i got used to it very quickly and soon i only noticed i had to look just next to something to really see it 10-Jul-20 01:21 AM Tldr: dont go near idiots with diy pyrotechnics if you value your eyes (or ears, or limbs for that matter) 10-Jul-20 01:21 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/JPEG_20200710_102557-0F37A.jpg 10-Jul-20 01:21 AM (Luckily no permanemt loss of function ) 11-Jul-20 06:35 AM I was stupid and followed some people at the makerspace out into the alley at 1 am to watch them ignite thermite. 11-Jul-20 06:35 AM I didn’t realize at the time that dilated eyes plus thermite was a bad combination. I don’t think any significant injury resulted, but in hind sight I should have grabbed a welding helmet. 11-Jul-20 06:38 AM Ouch 11-Jul-20 06:38 AM It feels like it’s the magnesium if it’s being used is what really gets people from when friends used to do it in the fire pit by my dorm a few years ago 11-Jul-20 06:53 AM Yeah, they use a magnesium ribbon to ignite it. 12-Jul-20 05:25 PM @Noxz 12-Jul-20 05:25 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/JPEG_20200712_172459-BDD02.jpg 12-Jul-20 06:42 PM I'm a NAWCC member 12-Jul-20 09:44 PM It’s on my eventual to do list.... 12-Jul-20 10:52 PM figured you might be, this was just in a stack of papers in my office... and I'm going through things for taxes 12-Jul-20 10:52 PM I want to say I got this at the local science center when they had a mini maker faire 12-Jul-20 10:52 PM which was I guess 3 years ago 14-Jul-20 06:04 AM the AWCI just booted their executive director 14-Jul-20 06:04 AM apparently they werent making enough money in certain departments and borrowing from others to fund them 18-Jul-20 09:24 AM Had a bit of a misshap today on the CNC router. 18-Jul-20 09:24 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/EdN2fePX0AAZoVj-F79BC.png 18-Jul-20 09:24 AM Forgot to measure my stock and assumed it was 4mm thick, (was 3) and the file also assumed that the milling started 1mm over the actual piece. Result, paper thin bottom! 18-Jul-20 09:24 AM (That's the test for a PVC keychain I'll be making to sell while I'm jobless, something very nerdy, not sure what yet) 18-Jul-20 09:55 AM The PVC catches the details really well, and that's without thinning: 18-Jul-20 09:55 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/EdODr3nXsAAnRqm-64AD8.png 18-Jul-20 09:55 AM (R1 ball endmill, stepover is 0,2mm) 18-Jul-20 11:36 AM @Nixie what is this shape? 19-Jul-20 01:03 AM This oarticular one, just a failure. 19-Jul-20 07:59 AM Through the magic of editing: 19-Jul-20 07:59 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/EdS8UoOWAAAaOZK-FF6A2.png 19-Jul-20 07:59 AM (I forgot to make the mold inverted, so the real piece is mirrored, but the machining is very okay for a 3020) 19-Jul-20 03:23 PM Prototype cad for layering: 19-Jul-20 03:23 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200719_233623-808A3.jpg 19-Jul-20 03:23 PM The grid has to be made smaller, and the top nipple has to be fixed (change the color and shadow) 19-Jul-20 03:23 PM But I like it enough to keep pushing it's making. 19-Jul-20 04:13 PM nice 19-Jul-20 04:44 PM Wow. Cool design. 20-Jul-20 03:07 PM Thanks, a work in progress still, many details to polish before it's a sellable keychain. 20-Jul-20 10:39 PM Oh, it's not going to be a real tube! I thought the projects were separate ideas 21-Jul-20 05:46 PM I did machining today 21-Jul-20 05:46 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1717-3CB98.jpg 21-Jul-20 05:46 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1720-789C0.jpg 21-Jul-20 05:46 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1726-C387E.jpg 21-Jul-20 05:46 PM gave a small 1.20mm screw a shoulder for creating 'end shake' of a lever on a post [screw hole] that had none, against the screw head 21-Jul-20 07:07 PM Oh wow. 21-Jul-20 07:08 PM cute little lathe 21-Jul-20 07:08 PM love seeing those watchmaking/jewelers size tools 21-Jul-20 07:11 PM I’ve looked into getting a watch lathe. 21-Jul-20 07:11 PM The trouble is the collet set can be the largest expense. 21-Jul-20 07:11 PM I acquired a staking tool set a while back, but there’s a lot of surface rust. I’m not sure if it’s a lost cause or if I should try the hack of doing some electrochemistry to turn the iron oxide back to iron. 21-Jul-20 07:14 PM probably depends on the design of the actual tool itself to know if the surface condition will impact the function 21-Jul-20 07:14 PM always nice when you get lucky and rust is confined to mostly nonworking surfaces 21-Jul-20 07:14 PM wish that was more common than rust making things a huge ordeal but we cannot always be so lucky 21-Jul-20 07:28 PM staking sets dont need to be aboslutely tight in the spindle.. you hit it with a hammer if that says anything - you just dont want it to pop out, so you only hit it once, reallign, hit it again.. never hit it twice without making sure you are still on spot 21-Jul-20 07:28 PM screws in older chronographs were designed to be cut as such, for creating more end shake - really cool if you ask me.. requires more specialized tools to fix things.. I am not always a fan of filing down on a hammer to get it to fit right, but the idea is sound 21-Jul-20 07:28 PM the whole reason for adjustability is actually due to manufacturing tolerances 21-Jul-20 07:28 PM so, cheaper to manufacture, and then takes a part of t he day to really tweak in, vs expensive mfgr 21-Jul-20 07:28 PM I guess filing down on stuff is part of manufacturing, in a way.. but other adjustments with eccentrics, jewel depth, etc, is all manual 22-Jul-20 03:11 PM @Noxz what is this? a screw for ants? 22-Jul-20 03:12 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1732-8D14D.JPG 22-Jul-20 03:12 PM For that lever 22-Jul-20 05:41 PM What movement? 22-Jul-20 05:41 PM I see Incabloc. 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM Zenith 420 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM that is the release lever for the instaneeous date jump 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM a spring goes against the post to it's top left, and a wheel with a cutout & a moveable postgoes towards teh hammer end, connected through another gear to then the hour wheel, rotates once every 24hrs 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM and basically as pressure builds up on the post+hammer with thee spring, it will eventually slide and release 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM and... that's not an Incabloc.. it's a Kif spring/block 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM which is the same type Rolex used to use - they now make their own 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM only Kif and Incabloc were/are the big players for shock settings, I got a small 40pg pamphlet from the 60s or so on incabloc 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM @rdpierce btw, I just reset that seconds hand of yours to be a bit closer to 12'o'clock.. let's let it run over the weekend then I'll likely be able to send it out 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM oh, and another tidbit - rolex actually used a specialized zenith calibre of this 4xx series for their Daytonas for a little while 22-Jul-20 06:24 PM like during the 90s? 22-Jul-20 06:51 PM Awesome, thanks!!! 23-Jul-20 08:14 PM anyone in PA want to pickup a watchmaking machine that is asking to be saved by someone who can get it going again? 24-Jul-20 07:00 AM @Noxz so cute that lathe 24-Jul-20 07:00 AM @nmz787 nah, it was going to be a keychain (wich I might still do, for the kicks) but yesterday's job interview went very well, and I think I might get hired, so no need for the selling of those anymore 24-Jul-20 07:02 AM Yes, it's sad I hardly got a chance to use it much this year 24-Jul-20 07:02 AM we never switched over to the 1st year side/manufacturing, but I did find a project or two to do 24-Jul-20 07:02 AM I stil neeed to repivot the 4th wheel that the chronograph wheel frictions onto 24-Jul-20 07:02 AM maybe for today 24-Jul-20 07:09 AM ordered some stainless and plastic last night to get a few projects going.. scrwedriver dresser and a mount for the grinder's new bearings to pack grease in before install 24-Jul-20 09:01 AM When you can't find any push to connect plugs but have a CNC lathe lying around 24-Jul-20 09:01 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200724_100109-13B52.jpg 24-Jul-20 04:32 PM homemade lathe? retro fitted? or cnc from factory? 24-Jul-20 08:49 PM I bought it from a friend, I think it was previously used for teaching students at a tech school. I gutted out most of the old electronics 24-Jul-20 08:49 PM It's a bench top lathe, so these are about the biggest parts I tend to make 25-Jul-20 11:52 AM First test on the rubber nixie keychain: 25-Jul-20 11:52 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/EdyvAM_WkAUGp0w-1F40C.png 25-Jul-20 11:52 AM I need to liquefy the ink to avoid the bubbles, and I'm missing the thin engraving bits yet. (that was done with a 2mm ball endmill) 27-Jul-20 05:59 PM Any tips for welding thin aluminum sheet metal? Like 22 or 23 gauge, I think 27-Jul-20 07:19 PM I've got a hand amptrol (amp control) and foot pedal (never tried that yet)... As well as the spot weld time feature 27-Jul-20 07:19 PM Earlier I was trying an overlap joint, but I think next I'll try a butt joint 27-Jul-20 07:19 PM From reading it seems I need to switch to a smaller tungsten rod 27-Jul-20 08:16 PM TIG welding? 28-Jul-20 02:38 AM Yeah 28-Jul-20 02:38 AM Read that I need to get much smaller filler rod, basically 0.025" mig wire 28-Jul-20 02:38 AM Just ordered some of that 28-Jul-20 02:39 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJksVs2QT5Q Maybe this helps? 28-Jul-20 11:35 AM Hmm I'd watched that twice before including a week or two ago 28-Jul-20 11:35 AM Guess I'll watch again 28-Jul-20 11:35 AM Ordered some ceriated tungsten last night at 0.040" thick, which another purchaser said made their thin sheet welding a breeze 28-Jul-20 12:46 PM Aluminum TIG welding is its own form of misery. 28-Jul-20 12:46 PM Welding thin stock is a different form of misery. 28-Jul-20 12:46 PM Both at the same time? May the gods be with you. 28-Jul-20 04:14 PM I managed to get it going, not pretty, but I'm sure with some thinner rod and electrodes and more practice it'll get better 28-Jul-20 07:26 PM repainted some RAL6011 from some rust, as prevention for further (after wire-wheeling and priming).. as this is a backsplash for the lathe, so coolant will be around. Will have it professionally fully sandblasteed at a later date, this was just from what I had on hand to stop further rust, and keep it looking somewhat okay, but noticeable where it was repainted 28-Jul-20 07:26 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1767-EB0C7.jpg 28-Jul-20 07:26 PM thinking about maybe RAL3032 ("Pearl Ruby Red") for a specific task lathe - cutting matching sized holes in brass (or gold?) chattons for ruby jewels 29-Jul-20 02:50 PM Such small tungsten! 29-Jul-20 02:50 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/MVIMG_20200729_145015-F225C.jpg 29-Jul-20 06:28 PM MTS has tungsten down to sub .001” I am going to be placing an order with them for some 1% thoriated. I’m pretty sure they still have it. 30-Jul-20 02:36 AM Oh, wow 30-Jul-20 02:36 AM Unfortunately as soon as I sharpened one, I realized I needed a suitable chuck, actually called collet, and I guess a collet holder (I think that's the term). 30-Jul-20 02:36 AM So ordered a set of those with 0.040" sizes in it, should have tomorrow or Friday I think 30-Jul-20 02:36 AM So can continue trying to weld my aluminum sheet metal then 30-Jul-20 02:36 AM Also picked up some offset tin snips that should make cutting my failures apart easier 30-Jul-20 02:36 AM Am considering whether I want to drop $70 on a nibbler, which from what I can tell makes really nice edges, I'm less sure if it makes the device get through the metal cut any easier 30-Jul-20 02:36 AM (what I mean is, my aviation shears I was using today, kind of kept getting stuck/caught on the sheet metal as it was cut and being pushed up/down) 30-Jul-20 02:36 AM Not the blade edges themselves, but the fatter part of the blade body 30-Jul-20 02:36 AM Just getting in the way 30-Jul-20 03:28 AM Nibbler is amazing tool! Definitely recommends if you work with sheet metal frequently... 30-Jul-20 03:35 AM I recently got a cheap one 30-Jul-20 03:35 AM for making holes in cases for displays mainly. 30-Jul-20 06:51 PM new machine day.. 30-Jul-20 06:51 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1777-1833B.jpg 30-Jul-20 06:51 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1780-F8B46.jpg 30-Jul-20 06:51 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1781-00854.jpg 30-Jul-20 06:51 PM vintage swiss made pad printer for printing watch dials 30-Jul-20 09:04 PM Cool 31-Jul-20 12:32 AM @Noxz just read a story last night by Jim Williams in a white paper sort of book about the Marine chronometer 31-Jul-20 12:32 AM https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/B9780750670623500182 31-Jul-20 12:32 AM Oh, I guess only certain technical parts of that book were written by Jim 01-Aug-20 01:23 PM Was able to do some nice and easy butt joints on the aluminum sheet metal. So far I'm not really understanding why people like to complain about TIGing aluminum. It just has some lag/hysteresis from my experience so far. 01-Aug-20 03:55 PM thus far today, made 4x 50mm long 6x12 316SS blocks, that will be milled out "small" 2mm etc channels to be flexure units as linear "bearings" for the screwdriver dresser 01-Aug-20 03:55 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1799-ECF98.jpg 01-Aug-20 03:55 PM so far I am having just fine luck working with stainless.. first time 01-Aug-20 05:22 PM Ok i take back what i said about aluminum, I had a different experience today than last night 01-Aug-20 05:22 PM Not sure how it compares to steel though as I haven't welded sheet steel yet 01-Aug-20 05:37 PM I just broke 3 2mm 2 flute carbide end mills, nearly consequtively 01-Aug-20 05:37 PM climb milling and simply pulled the table/lead more than what I was wanting to rotate/dial it in, and snap 01-Aug-20 05:37 PM will continue on this piece, though I noticed one other issue, and will mostly use it as practice - but I only have 2 more end mills, so might as well order another set or two or three... 01-Aug-20 05:37 PM also, it's starting to get hot down there.. 01-Aug-20 05:37 PM basically I forgot to lockdown the cross slide, so while climbing it also pulled in like half a mm... which was the feature size of the thing I was up against, so meh 01-Aug-20 05:37 PM I did hit the 0.5mm wall/feature (flexure) at the end, against the vise, so that was fine 01-Aug-20 06:44 PM I actually have 15x 1mm end mills I got for this project, but decided I wanted to go the larger route at last minute.. may just switch back to those if I have plenty.. I dont really feel like I can accomplish the project with just 2 remaining of 2mm.. still a lot of learning to figure 01-Aug-20 10:13 PM just did the same feature on the reverse side w/ the 2mm at full DOC, 1 pass, with no real issues 01-Aug-20 10:13 PM beyond the fact the cross slide's dial is x2 because it's a lathe/combo mill.. so one tick on a lathe == 2 ticks on diameter 02-Aug-20 11:58 AM aaand just broke my last 2mm 02-Aug-20 11:58 AM pretty sure I will go for 3mm, stronger plus that is the slot width, so why not 04-Aug-20 08:06 PM I had to go for 1/8" .. for quick enough delivery - will get back at it today, with slightly new dimensions 04-Aug-20 09:01 PM I would love to see what you’re doing. I’ve been wanting a better alternative for screwdriver sharpening. 04-Aug-20 09:01 PM As for me, I just acquired some new friends. Clearly Chinese in origin. A set of 16 adjustable size reamers. 04-Aug-20 09:01 PM Something to clean up the inside bores for my 3D printed bagpipes. 04-Aug-20 09:01 PM And the inside of ferrules and projecting mounts so they fit. 04-Aug-20 11:59 PM apparently the 2mm end mills I thought I ordered, were 1.5mm.. broke all but one before I figured it out... the 1/8ths performed admirably 04-Aug-20 11:59 PM once i have a working model of this folded felxure linear bearing I'll post some info on it 06-Aug-20 08:45 PM another attempt.. 06-Aug-20 08:45 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1812-A340F.jpg 06-Aug-20 08:45 PM ~0.5mm walls 06-Aug-20 08:45 PM 316SS 06-Aug-20 10:17 PM Pretty 07-Aug-20 03:38 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1815-EDFEA.jpg 07-Aug-20 03:38 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1816-97E2B.jpg 07-Aug-20 03:38 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1820-29192.jpg 07-Aug-20 03:38 PM folded flexure linear bearing - zero stick-slip within the unit 07-Aug-20 03:38 PM max travel of 1.2mm, witha force of 19N to get there 07-Aug-20 03:38 PM this one is not usable - but I learned a bit making it, and I may change thee length from 50mm to 60mm 07-Aug-20 03:38 PM last pic shows a piece of flat brass flexing it 07-Aug-20 03:38 PM hard to see with keyboard, I suppose 07-Aug-20 03:38 PM but, it will support the round grinding stones in the background 07-Aug-20 03:47 PM https://photos.app.goo.gl/U26JKYSTHE8PbRuH9 07-Aug-20 03:47 PM flexing it with a piece of flat brass 07-Aug-20 03:47 PM one handed, due to phone recording 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM That's pretty amazing! 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM I fired my cnc lately and have been soing things too 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200801_201455-089F5.jpg 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200726_213052-2B0C9.jpg 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_t7mqf1-BFE49.jpg 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM That's my first double sided part 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM (it's a heatsink for my Nixie-CAM 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM Top part is a two part mould for a uSD card cover in pvc rubber. 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200801_204448-04143.jpg 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200801_201543-CE788.jpg 07-Aug-20 04:27 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200801_204435-DC7CA.jpg 07-Aug-20 04:49 PM nice! 07-Aug-20 04:49 PM mine was manual.. I may consider using powerfeed, but I dont have the stops (it can slip at slops just fine) so needing to turn it off when it gets to a position is kinda -meh- ... I should make a stop 09-Aug-20 10:21 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-CE670.jpg 09-Aug-20 10:21 AM Using an adjustable hand reamer on 3D printed parts. Bagpipes!!! 09-Aug-20 10:58 AM "hand reamer" hmmm 09-Aug-20 10:58 AM that doesn't seem like words that should go together, haha 09-Aug-20 12:38 PM They are designed to be used by hand, in a tap wrench. 09-Aug-20 12:38 PM As opposed to reamers designed to be chucked in a mill or lathe. 11-Aug-20 12:40 AM bagpipes! 11-Aug-20 06:17 AM Yes! 3D printed bagpipes! 14-Aug-20 02:29 AM \o/ 15-Aug-20 03:54 PM tin lapping plate, showing slight reflection from the turned finish 15-Aug-20 03:54 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1855-BD0C4.jpg 15-Aug-20 03:54 PM this one has a shoulder underneath for better re-facing 15-Aug-20 04:09 PM and is also for a fellow student 16-Aug-20 10:20 AM fancy 16-Aug-20 10:35 AM for black polishing small parts, such as screw heads 24-Aug-20 11:07 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> what's a dirt cheap ER collet chuck that has a short shank for which I can make an adaptor for a rotary table? 24-Aug-20 11:07 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> there's these 24-Aug-20 11:07 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/s-l500-CE90C.png 24-Aug-20 11:07 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> but the shank is a bit too long for my application... my rotary table can't take shanks all the way through the bore 24-Aug-20 11:07 AM <𝓕ermion#6024> ideally I'd just cut this down and glue it into something with some super-loctite-adhesive, but it's case hardened so i can't just part it off short. 24-Aug-20 12:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> maybe I'll just do this :/ 24-Aug-20 12:04 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-9B975.png 24-Aug-20 12:24 PM Does not sound like you need things to be super precision if you want things dirt cheap so why not get one of the long ones, wrap it in tape, and cut the excess length off with an abrasive chop saw or angle grinder? Clean it up a bit on a bench grinder or a file to make sure you remove any burrs obviously... 24-Aug-20 03:44 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> good idea. 25-Aug-20 05:11 AM I want to make a brass version of the beam splitter block for my DIY microscope, plan was to lost-PLA cast it 25-Aug-20 05:11 AM One problem i foresee is making the ports to which the turret and microscope head attach parallel 25-Aug-20 05:11 AM I dont know a lot of machining, but would first milling down the cnc bed to a flat finish, then one port, flip it around mill the other work? 25-Aug-20 05:11 AM Or would you guys say its better to just use trimscrews to align the ports? I only have access to a very simple pcb mill 25-Aug-20 05:11 AM It can do brass/alu as well but im not sure how good its tolerances are 25-Aug-20 10:39 AM for a better clue of what i want to build, this is a cross section render of the lasercut pmma part i want to replace (the screw+hole ports need to be flat and parallel, the flange the EF lens ring sits on also needs to be parallel with the bottom port., structure of cast part will be totally different except for the port positions and beamsplitter position.) 25-Aug-20 10:39 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-71C4E.png 25-Aug-20 10:39 AM easier to interpret, maybe 25-Aug-20 10:39 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-36E57.png 31-Aug-20 06:53 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> @Noxz maybe? Or anyone, really. This is a pretty nasty looking KF blank with feedthrus that has some apprentice marks on it. What's a good way to polish that inner area? 31-Aug-20 06:53 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-35AC5.png 31-Aug-20 06:53 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I'm thinking drill press, light pressure, and a cratex stick or something 31-Aug-20 07:05 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> actually cratex sticks don't really go to a particularly high grit 31-Aug-20 07:08 PM do you neeed to face it off flat? 31-Aug-20 07:08 PM we use crateex sticks for creating a brush finish on cases 31-Aug-20 07:10 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I just need that inner recessed area to be flat 31-Aug-20 07:10 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> the surface with the hexes. 31-Aug-20 07:10 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I mean not even flat flat 31-Aug-20 07:10 PM do you have a lathe? 31-Aug-20 07:10 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yep. 31-Aug-20 07:10 PM I'd chuck it up and face it 31-Aug-20 07:10 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> a lathe will leave lots of little grooves 31-Aug-20 07:10 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I think it's gotta be polished. 31-Aug-20 07:11 PM use a large radius, and feed slowly 31-Aug-20 07:11 PM what material is that? 31-Aug-20 07:11 PM it almost looks like brazing 31-Aug-20 07:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> it's brass. 31-Aug-20 07:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> it's just very tarnished 31-Aug-20 07:12 PM oh, yeah, a large radius should do fine 31-Aug-20 07:12 PM brass is soft enough you dont really getr ridges all to omuch 31-Aug-20 07:12 PM it burshes pretty well, too 31-Aug-20 07:12 PM burnishes 31-Aug-20 07:12 PM I'd give it a go in the lathe, just try to skim it off 31-Aug-20 07:12 PM or just sandpaper 31-Aug-20 07:12 PM go to progressively finer 31-Aug-20 07:13 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yeah I think I'm a bigger fan of an abrasive solution. 31-Aug-20 07:13 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I don't think i have a super good way to chuck it up, but I water jet cut a nice fixture for the mill 31-Aug-20 07:13 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I'm tempted to glue a piece of sandpaper on the end of a faced aluminum rod 31-Aug-20 07:13 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> and just stick the rod in a drill press 31-Aug-20 07:14 PM I mean, may as well do it by hand if that's the case 31-Aug-20 07:14 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> and use light pressure on the quill 31-Aug-20 07:14 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yeah maybe... 31-Aug-20 07:14 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yeah the sandpaper is just gonna fill up really quickly 31-Aug-20 07:14 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> that might only work with a slurry 31-Aug-20 07:14 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I have a foredom handpiece and some abrasive brushes 31-Aug-20 07:14 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> maybe that'll be ok? 31-Aug-20 07:14 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> actually I will just glue this thing to a mandrel on the lathe. 31-Aug-20 07:19 PM yeah, use oil of some sorts 31-Aug-20 07:19 PM we do 50/50 of kerosene and mineral spirits 31-Aug-20 07:19 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> what's a good glue? 31-Aug-20 07:19 PM uhh, for quick jobs like that we use super glue 31-Aug-20 07:19 PM or a 3M adhesive spray 31-Aug-20 07:19 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> hmm okay. 31-Aug-20 07:20 PM since it'll get used and you want to rip it off to put a new piece on 31-Aug-20 07:20 PM the adhesive spray works well enough for that 31-Aug-20 07:20 PM basically aerosolized rubber cement 31-Aug-20 07:20 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I have this pitch-like wax... but I guess why complicate it. 31-Aug-20 07:20 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> super glue is fine and will come off no problem 31-Aug-20 07:21 PM give it a go 31-Aug-20 07:21 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> what would you run the spindle at? 31-Aug-20 07:21 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> it's about 1" in diameter. 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM the entire amount you want to clean up? 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yep. 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM oh, smaller than I was imagining 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM I was thinking it was a good 4-6" 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> no it's quite tiny. 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM you can go pretty quick then 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM just light touchees, back off, examine it 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> okay! 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I'm a litttle worried about the center where the SFM is low 31-Aug-20 07:22 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> fortunately there's a hole there. 31-Aug-20 07:23 PM if the abbrasive is smaller then you can target the inside a bit more 31-Aug-20 07:23 PM but also, the outside will simply get loaded up fastere 31-Aug-20 07:23 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> hmm ok 31-Aug-20 07:23 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> what would you hold the abrasive on? 31-Aug-20 07:24 PM glue.. of some sort 31-Aug-20 07:24 PM or just do it by hand 31-Aug-20 07:24 PM 1" is small enough you shouldnt get hurt too bad 31-Aug-20 07:24 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yeah I guess I'll just fold it into little squares or something and go in there 31-Aug-20 07:25 PM we sometimes use a "slip" 31-Aug-20 07:25 PM which is basically a rod or similar with sandpaper wrapped around it 31-Aug-20 07:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> typically I use a needle file to support my sandpaper but I'm not sure when I'm trying to get at a slightly recessed disc 31-Aug-20 07:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> it's like I want to remove material with the tip of something 31-Aug-20 07:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I think I'm just overthinking it. 31-Aug-20 07:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I'll stick it on the lathe tomorrow. 31-Aug-20 07:26 PM yeah, just go at it.. it's brass, fairly forgiving 31-Aug-20 10:45 PM this might sound funny but if you have not already tried something more aggressive 31-Aug-20 10:45 PM try a pencil eraser 31-Aug-20 10:45 PM sometimes that cleans up brass like magic 31-Aug-20 10:45 PM depends what exactly the corrosion/residue is 31-Aug-20 11:05 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> oh there's dents 31-Aug-20 11:05 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I need to remove material. 31-Aug-20 11:05 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> If I just wanted to get the corrosion off I'd use pikal polish. 01-Sep-20 12:06 AM ahhh then yeah sandpaper and then a rotary tool and cotton wheel w/ some finer abrasive would work 01-Sep-20 11:49 AM brought my watchmaker's lathe homee today from school 01-Sep-20 11:49 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1897-EE47E.jpg 01-Sep-20 11:49 AM obviously not setup 01-Sep-20 05:08 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Lorch lathes are 02-Sep-20 01:26 PM I've been fairly happy with that, hasnt got much use inthe past year as second year doesnt have manufacturing involved, but yeah, glad to have it home because the Emco Super 11 is too large for much of the work I expect to do 02-Sep-20 01:26 PM the most annoying thing about this lathe is the leadscrews are 0.75mm per turn or similar, 0.5 or even 1 would be much better so I dont have to do maths across larger distances 02-Sep-20 01:26 PM would half consider some sort of DRO for it, but not the standard hackjob of a digital caliper or micrometer hack, because those are mostly non deterministic... and I am all about the 'proof of precision' nowadays 02-Sep-20 01:26 PM I actually went through my Hanbook of Dimensional Measurement yesterday 02-Sep-20 01:26 PM which is early in comparison to what is done nowadays 04-Sep-20 07:55 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> @Noxz what's something good to back sandpaper with in a sanding mandrel so it's a little compliant? 04-Sep-20 07:55 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> maybe a rubber sheet or something 04-Sep-20 07:55 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> or felt? 04-Sep-20 07:55 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I'm making a "sanding counterbore" 04-Sep-20 07:55 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> so I can make score marks that are circular where an o-ring sits. 04-Sep-20 07:55 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> and a hole sits in the center 04-Sep-20 08:04 PM umm, "they" make spring loaded 'centers' for tailstocks and whatnot, that would be an initial idea, but yeah, I dont htink I have eever used or needed s omething like it 04-Sep-20 08:04 PM well, I heave spring loaded headstocks for the pivot burnisher/polisher 04-Sep-20 08:04 PM but nothing too fancy, as it is just for opening the collet 04-Sep-20 08:05 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> hmm I don't think I've explained myself well 04-Sep-20 08:05 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/unknown-45E2C.png 04-Sep-20 08:05 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> just trying to sand in circles around the hole 04-Sep-20 08:09 PM is there a need for a guide bar? 04-Sep-20 08:09 PM ie, would just a sandpaper disk work 04-Sep-20 08:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I think it'd be nice. 04-Sep-20 08:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> also the mandrel is about 3/8" in diameter. 04-Sep-20 08:09 PM some of the self adhesive sandpaper stuff have some give 04-Sep-20 08:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> oh hmm. 04-Sep-20 08:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yeah I just want it to have a little give. 04-Sep-20 08:09 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> if there was a much tighter, finer weave of scotchbrite, I'd use that. 04-Sep-20 08:10 PM when black polishing you neeed it very rigid 04-Sep-20 08:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> oh yeah not trying to do that at all 04-Sep-20 08:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> just trying to sand to 600 grit. 04-Sep-20 08:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> maybe 1000 grit. 04-Sep-20 08:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> it's just crucial that the sanding marks go in circles around the hole 06-Sep-20 01:06 AM @Noxz I went and dug out my old watch tools for working on pocketwatches... https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/499873492477411339/752076429650559006/image0.jpg 06-Sep-20 02:32 AM neat, I dont have a set of mainspring winders, if I work on them at home, I hand wind 06-Sep-20 02:32 AM which can get messy with greases, especially automatic, but if I make my own movements I'll obviously have all the tools needed 13-Sep-20 02:16 PM was looking into small (including miniature!) punch/OBI presses this morning 13-Sep-20 02:16 PM found a few calculations, and based on shaped and max thickness I wouldn't neeed anything more than 10 ton 13-Sep-20 02:16 PM the idea is to stamp out parts 13-Sep-20 02:16 PM which will still neeed further work, but I can get that shape cranked out without the need to mill anything more than the die 13-Sep-20 02:16 PM not great if I am prototyping, but for production 13-Sep-20 02:17 PM Hello fellow scientists! I am trying to source a glass round, 11.5 inches in diameter, which I can use inside a 13.25" conflat flange with a gasket, for a large vacuum chamber window. It seems like something which is a bit tricky to find, and I am looking for pointers or, someone who could help me source such a weird thing. No one makes COTs windows of this size sadly. 13-Sep-20 02:18 PM lime/soda glass? fused quartz? sapphire? 13-Sep-20 02:21 PM yes 13-Sep-20 02:21 PM hah i don't really care tbh 13-Sep-20 02:21 PM it just needs to not implode 13-Sep-20 10:33 PM A bunch of my antique watch tools are rusted. Specifically, a staking set and mainspring winders. I’ve considered trying the trick of using electricity in a solution to revert the iron oxide to iron. 13-Sep-20 10:33 PM double irony? 13-Sep-20 10:34 PM Hahahaha 13-Sep-20 10:34 PM As for that brass thing, that just screams sand blasting to me. 13-Sep-20 10:34 PM Just went through the makerspace auth today for the new powder coating oven. 13-Sep-20 10:34 PM Big one, able to hold a bicycle frame. 13-Sep-20 10:34 PM Did some welding today.... had the wire feed rate set too high on the MIG welder. 13-Sep-20 10:34 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-C9E30.jpg 13-Sep-20 10:34 PM I'm trying to rebuild a poorly constructed aircraft tug. 13-Sep-20 10:34 PM They used square tubular steel and made a hinge joint by drilling a hole through it and installing a bolt. 13-Sep-20 10:34 PM This aircraft tug almost certainly had been used to death in a commercial operation. 13-Sep-20 10:43 PM isn't that how heavy duty machine hinges often are? Have definitely seen that on some serious boat trailers before 13-Sep-20 10:43 PM at a certain thickness you just go "what shear force?" 13-Sep-20 10:43 PM The bolt wore against the steel, making the hole diameters wider, causing so much play that the aircraft nose wheel would slip free of the tug when turning. 13-Sep-20 10:43 PM Ohhhh lol 13-Sep-20 10:43 PM I've seen it with additional replacable plates 13-Sep-20 10:43 PM so you drill a hole and then add a plate 13-Sep-20 10:44 PM What I'm doing: milled out the 3/8" hole to 5/8". 13-Sep-20 10:44 PM Installed a steel sleeve. 13-Sep-20 10:44 PM Welded. Now the bolt has the entire length of the sleeve to make contact. 13-Sep-20 10:44 PM That's going to reduce wear. 13-Sep-20 10:44 PM And given that I had to tear the whole thing apart, I'm tempted to sandblast it and powder coat it some custom color. 13-Sep-20 10:44 PM Red makes it go faster? 14-Sep-20 10:36 AM That’s the 4th law of motion right? 14-Sep-20 10:38 AM Red makes it go faster? @rdpierce depends on if it's moving towards or away from you 14-Sep-20 10:39 AM Considering adding racing stripes. 14-Sep-20 10:39 AM Or Adidas stripes so it can be properly Gopnik. 14-Sep-20 10:40 AM I was just going to recommend them 14-Sep-20 10:41 AM Ahhhhhh nu cheeki breeki i v damke! 14-Sep-20 10:41 AM Although when tugging a 1700 lb aircraft in and out of a hangar, fast may not be what I want. Controlled and able to stop, yes. Fast, no. 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM pic dump.. I needed to make a new rivet for the chrono seconds hand on my graduation watch.. 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1918-2A49D.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1920-DB6E7.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1923-EE4A7.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1925-364B2.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1927-A33FB.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1929-854E6.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1933-71B6C.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1934-75017.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1935-3D7CE.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1936-C8F3C.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1939-6A988.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1940-BB85D.jpg 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM 0.70mm outer, 0.50mm shoulder, and a 0.20mm hole all the way through, will be broached to 0.25mm on the chrono runner staff 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM I also will paint the topside red to hide the non-plated brass, and to match the other chrono stuffs 14-Sep-20 02:53 PM not sure why it wasnt red to begin with, whichever 14-Sep-20 05:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200914_182134-4742A.jpg 14-Sep-20 05:08 PM The hinge with the newly welded sleeve (post reaming) is a success! 16-Sep-20 08:27 AM Just got a quote, including shipping, for the guilloche machine in switzerland 19-Sep-20 08:12 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-6E89D.png 19-Sep-20 11:00 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Screenshot_20200919-104242_Signal-F7BD8.jpg 19-Sep-20 11:00 AM What's the best way to fill tiny gaps in stainless? I have a few knife edge dings in one of the valves from rough handling 19-Sep-20 11:06 AM You will have to wait for someone with more CF knife edge experience than I have to know if that ding is too much to get things sealing with copper gaskets or not. As far as I know there are not really ways to fill in a knife edge ding without machining a new knife edge (usually a lathe job) 19-Sep-20 11:06 AM You might be able to just use a viton gasket if you do not need UHV 19-Sep-20 11:06 AM Consider indium gaskets 19-Sep-20 11:07 AM I always forget that is an option. Definitely would squish into that void better than copper 19-Sep-20 11:07 AM But then you basically lose the option of baking your chamber 19-Sep-20 11:07 AM Which is a bit pointless because you need to bake to get to UHV 19-Sep-20 11:13 AM Sort of 19-Sep-20 11:13 AM More like to get into UHV, you can get to it ok 19-Sep-20 01:31 PM @LRM it seems to me like TIG welding and careful filing would do fine 19-Sep-20 01:40 PM You must be a much better welder than I am 19-Sep-20 01:42 PM No I'm terrible at it but I have friends who are supposedly good 19-Sep-20 01:42 PM For all the other seals I fixed so far I just hammered the metal back into place and sanded them smooth, but it looks like in this case corrosion actually removed the metal so I can't really hammer it back 19-Sep-20 01:42 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Screenshot_20200918-195303_Signal-09A27.jpg 19-Sep-20 01:42 PM Started like this 19-Sep-20 02:10 PM When assesing damage to CF knife, it is useful to mount it to fresh copper gasket and see resulting profile in gasket - usually you can clearly see how bad it is. And with welding the knife I would be careful, not to soften the material all around. If we have dent and it is severe enough, we usually turn whole flange on lathe. If it can't be mounted on lathe, then we give it someone with CNC mill... 19-Sep-20 04:24 PM You can also use the o-rings instead if you're not going UHV, and they work on really gnarly gaskets 20-Sep-20 08:01 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20200920_195958-2CDC1.jpg 20-Sep-20 08:01 PM I think I fixed it 20-Sep-20 08:03 PM what 20-Sep-20 08:03 PM do you have same angle before/after comparisons? 20-Sep-20 08:33 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20200918_195114-9DECD.jpg 20-Sep-20 08:36 PM Ah so mostly just dirty 20-Sep-20 08:36 PM I thought you had a huge gash 21-Sep-20 02:32 AM https://youtu.be/QP3KnX4ywAM 22-Sep-20 11:05 AM I've been sketching out a new system/machine lately.. 22-Sep-20 11:05 AM basically a swiss-type MILL, not lathe.. with essentially a boring head with infeed capabilities, designed similar to th e Moore jig grinder 22-Sep-20 11:05 AM of course you need a sub spindle to pick off the part inside the main one then, in order to work on the backside.. and tool changes are "expensive" so the idea of mounting several of these OD boring bars on the main spindle, and being able to index to them, at speed, have been my sketches lately 22-Sep-20 11:05 AM so, thee swiss-type area is basically a wire rod (or let's just call it rod) feed from the bottom through a bushing, but it doesnt rotate (this works well for the case of a wire rod, consider 100+ft of coil instead of a 12ft rod and bar feeder, also takes up less horizontal space, and no need to load up bars here and there) 22-Sep-20 11:05 AM it should work well enough due to the relatively small size of wire rod I would need (~3mm) 22-Sep-20 11:11 AM what sort of parts are the end goal? 22-Sep-20 11:12 AM small watch pinons (so a gear on a shaft where a brass gear gets rivetted to, with fine pivots at the end for the jewel bearings) 22-Sep-20 11:12 AM typically made on swiss-type lathes, but I am trying to get around the idea of the bar feeder due to space issues 22-Sep-20 11:12 AM so, jus tmoving the cutting tool to be live, and the part stationary, like any boring head milling application 22-Sep-20 11:12 AM same action in the end, but figuring out infeed of a rotating headstock is interesting (already solved by Moore) 22-Sep-20 11:12 AM modern version in regular swiss format: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJ5Avvs_wHU 22-Sep-20 11:15 AM i have only seen that sort of thing done in production machines where the part is kept stationary 22-Sep-20 11:16 AM well, this will be production, just my production nnumbers is planned ot be 100-200 full movements a year 22-Sep-20 11:16 AM not sure how much force parts that tiny can handle but clamping as you press forward onto the part is usually how that is done 22-Sep-20 11:16 AM you can often set it up where the end of the part presses the mechanism to clamp down around it and as soon as pressure on the spindle is removed the clamps disengage 22-Sep-20 11:16 AM do not think i am allowed to share the one model i have of a part like that because it is not my design... (customer part) 22-Sep-20 11:17 AM it basically needs to be a bushing at that size though, where the rod gets fed in and out 22-Sep-20 11:17 AM I have thoughts of like hydrostating bearing type bushings to keep it 'center' (due to needing clearance) 22-Sep-20 11:17 AM the bushing isnt the problem as much as the main spindle/headstock, I think 22-Sep-20 11:17 AM but fundamentally different than the swiss lathes on the market, because, well, it's a mill 22-Sep-20 11:31 AM i might not be understanding this yet but are you just trying to cut the basic shape of the pinions and then the gear teeth later? 22-Sep-20 11:31 AM the gears will be done on a different machine 22-Sep-20 11:31 AM this is for the pinion/staffs 22-Sep-20 11:32 AM that simplifies things a lot then, will have to see if i can find photos of something similar to what i made for someone or whip up a quick 3d model to show you 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM napkin sketch is good enough, that's what I've been working with lately 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM I can take a photo of a balance staff footprint from a book, too, to give a deceent idea 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1958-ACD67.JPG 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM excuse the rotation .. but consider max OD of something like 3mm 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM that would be a very typical part 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_1948-AA933.jpg 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM and that is kind of the concept of the machine 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM stock rod is fed through a bushing, which can feed in/out, so there is always max support near the opening (like any follower rest) 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM and then the cutting tool is in a boring head which you can, via CNC, adjust infeed 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM there would also be a sub spindle inside the main for part pick off during parting, and then for working on the backside as well 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM the table could easily have more stationary/live tooling, such as a slitting saw for making screw heads 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM what this solves is: ability to use a wire rod instead of the typical bar feeder, thus less waste and less loading, but adds/changes the loader aspect as you now need a straightener 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM then additionally to have multiple boring tools on the main spindle so you dont waste time stopping it, swapping out, and starting it back up 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM nothing is really on the market like this, yet.. since "everyone" has space and just use a standard bar loader and a swiss lathe 22-Sep-20 11:33 AM which are proven 22-Sep-20 11:51 AM not totally sure this would work depending on how exact you need the parts and this is drastically over simplified just to give an idea of the clamping sort of mechanism i mean 22-Sep-20 11:51 AM you would need to work out how to have it release fully once the profile is cut and etc 22-Sep-20 11:51 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_20200922_114925-48229.jpg 22-Sep-20 11:51 AM center pin gets pushed by the work piece and it clamps the two profile forming plates onto the bar 22-Sep-20 11:51 AM of course you need the range of motion of the pin and the forming plates to have clearance at all stages and this is just the most basic of sketches to convey the idea 22-Sep-20 11:54 AM that isn't too far off from the infeed boring head 22-Sep-20 11:54 AM part pickoff with a subspindle in the middle I think is what you are more so talking about though 22-Sep-20 11:54 AM which is simple enough - especially since the part isnt rotating, so no need to match speeds 22-Sep-20 11:54 AM just collet based, I was actually thinking 8mm watchmakers lathes collets would be perfect, maybe even oversized! 22-Sep-20 11:55 AM that sketch is drastically simplified from a tool i made for someone who wanted to profile wooden dowels using a hand drill heh 22-Sep-20 11:55 AM there were 4 of the profile cutting plates and they just pressed it onto the end of the dowel to have it cut 22-Sep-20 11:59 AM I was thinking, because my lathe uses camlock headstock, that a D1-4 (same type) chuck which has N boring heads/tools on it, and a subspindle in the center, would actually be quite easy to setup and install/remove, and you could have several chucks setup for various different staffs, mostly you are swapping out many tools at once 22-Sep-20 11:59 AM the multiple boring heads, in an accurate fashion, has been a 'problem' area 22-Sep-20 12:01 PM a turret setup sounds like what you probably will want eventually 22-Sep-20 12:01 PM at least in conceptual phase, but I have figured a bit out 22-Sep-20 12:01 PM right, that's kinda it 22-Sep-20 12:01 PM tried to calculate if I had enough space for a flexure based boring head (instead of dovetail interface) and not sure I do 22-Sep-20 12:01 PM the amount of travel needed is actually pretty low.. I mean, if we are talking about a 3mm diameter, that is 1.5mm infeed needed, pretty small 22-Sep-20 12:01 PM but, clearance and whatnot as well, that's just the minimum 22-Sep-20 02:19 PM oh, and I figure no more than 1kw for main spindle needed for 0.5% carbon steel 3mm rod, heh 22-Sep-20 06:50 PM just won this lil girl: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQV1S5Kpw4A .. and he is traveling here in a few weeks for business, so it'll be hand delivered (or I go to the airport, but better than it getting kicked across country) 27-Sep-20 03:35 PM How is your screwdriver sharpener coming? 27-Sep-20 04:29 PM I replaced a part on the lathe/combo mill today, bracket for the feed+screw cutting shafts.. I had broken the original and JB welded it soon after getting the machine, got a replacement many months ago and only now replacing it. I need to practice a few of the dimensions (I figured out various clearances that I am able to hit, plus backlash numbers) and still remaining is the middle bit, then I need to make 4 of them to size 27-Sep-20 04:29 PM lots of parts associated with it, actually 27-Sep-20 04:29 PM past few days I have been reading some original (year 1905) books on ornamental turning (such as rose engine turning) as the machine I was looking at sold, so half thinking about building my own 27-Sep-20 04:29 PM it's mostly just an indexing head, then a special carriagee/slide rest 27-Sep-20 04:29 PM the only time they are connected is when doing thread or spiraling - of which the later the slidereest powers the headstock (through gearing) not the other way around which is how normal lathes do it 27-Sep-20 04:29 PM there is a modern maker (I took classes from him) but, again, time/money equation 27-Sep-20 04:29 PM going to restart on house work tomorrow, as it'll be dry for 1+wk 27-Sep-20 04:29 PM my first production thing planned is a clock type of thing, and as accesories I want to engine/ornamntal turn some things, so it's a preetty desireable machine for me 27-Sep-20 04:29 PM I was actually thinking about making a headstock adapter to my Super 11 lathe, basically a multi-start threading adapter at the headstock, so I can ignore the leadscrew and simply keep it engaged 27-Sep-20 06:38 PM If I had those machining skills and wanted to build a clock, I know exactly what it would be. 27-Sep-20 06:38 PM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shortt–Synchronome_clock 04-Oct-20 12:34 PM going through old photos... These machines were just sort of dumped into a scrap heap / parking lot beside a local grocery store a few years ago. Love them 04-Oct-20 12:34 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_2179-1E06D.JPG 04-Oct-20 12:34 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_2177-BF47F.JPG 04-Oct-20 12:34 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_2180-6A0AA.JPG 04-Oct-20 12:34 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_2176-8219B.JPG 04-Oct-20 12:34 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_2183-65DB4.JPG 04-Oct-20 12:34 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_2178-FC575.JPG 04-Oct-20 02:32 PM Is that second to last one a saw? Interesting design if so...never seen one with that spherical thing on top 04-Oct-20 02:32 PM Too bad they left the lathes outside like that...could have easily kept them looking nice for a long time with just a thing coat of wax but the fairly advanced rusting they have developed makes them not worth much besides as literal scrap metal or to part out some of the less damaged bits 05-Oct-20 03:18 AM GROSS machinery 06-Oct-20 07:52 AM https://twitter.com/robin7331/status/1313362440353132546?s=20 06-Oct-20 07:52 AM What happens when you have a good amount of power machining plastic, haha 06-Oct-20 07:53 AM next time aim for the bin 06-Oct-20 08:13 AM haha, truth 06-Oct-20 08:57 AM yes 06-Oct-20 12:54 PM that lathe looks very familiar 10-Oct-20 05:30 PM Isn't it possible to repair nicked conflat flanges by turning them on a lathe and aiming your cutter at the precise angle necessary, then finishing off the surrounding outer and inner bits to match depth lost? 10-Oct-20 06:08 PM Depends how nicked 10-Oct-20 06:34 PM I repaired a lot of conflat in this past couple weeks and all you need is sandpaper 10-Oct-20 06:34 PM If the nick is deep but metal wasn't removed, just displaced, you can use a chisel and soft hammer to put it back into shape then do sanding 10-Oct-20 06:34 PM I thought I needed to turn it down but it proved completely not needed 10-Oct-20 06:37 PM Depends what you mean by repair. Almost anything will get to -7 torr with a little pumping. -8 needs a bit cleaner and not much of a leak. -9, better at least be a good rubber gasket... -10/-11/-12 you basically need conflat with a properly sealed gasket 11-Oct-20 02:21 AM @Laughing Yes, proper way how to repair nicked conflat is turning them down. However as @idmb says, for smaller dents or higher pressures sometimes using sandpaper or alternative ways is sufficient. If you would really turn it, just beware that "top angle" of knife should be 90 degrees (short side of knife is not perpendicular to groove bottom) 12-Oct-20 12:13 PM so, I am in the bidding for another watchmaker machine, and the leadscrews are 10 TPI... but BIG dials so you get some resolution (it also has a super neat compensation plate for accuracy) 12-Oct-20 12:13 PM surprised it was so coarse 12-Oct-20 12:24 PM $10,000 motorized translation stages for lasers often only have 2mm pitch 12-Oct-20 12:24 PM dang 12-Oct-20 12:24 PM The quality of the machining is much more important than the pitch. 12-Oct-20 12:24 PM because it's actually an imperial machine (yet Swiss made, metric machines exist, but hard to come by) I may consider attempting to make accurate metric based ones with the compensation plates 12-Oct-20 12:24 PM sure 12-Oct-20 12:24 PM but yeah, you put a 100mm dial on a 2mm pitch thread and you can gain some resolution 12-Oct-20 12:25 PM in this case, a 400 step stepper motor 12-Oct-20 12:26 PM w/ microstepping, 1/16th? 12-Oct-20 12:26 PM w/ = ++ 12-Oct-20 12:26 PM It's more about backlash than anything. Stages holding laser mirrors cannot wiggle. 12-Oct-20 12:26 PM IDK, we have the $5000 controller with the $10,000 stage 12-Oct-20 12:26 PM sure, this is a jig borer, so the idea is once you set X/Y you lock it down 12-Oct-20 12:26 PM throughout the manual it talks about trying to keep the machie away from big vibration machines, etc.. was thinking about pneamutic dampening a stand for it 12-Oct-20 12:26 PM some sort of vibration isolator 12-Oct-20 12:26 PM I was actually trying to lookup the equations a few weeks ago of the amount of interferrance based on screw pitch + depth 12-Oct-20 12:26 PM oh, also the idea of still using a coarser threead, like 2mm, but having it be 2 start, so the threads are 1mm apart, but your lead is still 2mm, and the outcome of that 14-Oct-20 02:16 PM Won the auction for the small watchmaker's jig borer 14-Oct-20 02:16 PM a Hauser M1 14-Oct-20 02:16 PM will have a freeind pick it up and freeight it across country to me 14-Oct-20 06:29 PM Any ideas for diamond stylus milling? 15-Oct-20 11:04 AM Someone was showing off I guess 15-Oct-20 11:04 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-998B1.jpg 15-Oct-20 11:04 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image1-0EBB3.jpg 15-Oct-20 11:06 AM Might be a final project, those are a common one 15-Oct-20 11:06 AM "Turner's cube" or "Machinist's cube" 15-Oct-20 11:06 AM If you are careful you can get the cubes floating trapped inside of each other at the end 15-Oct-20 11:44 AM 'chinese ball' is another term.. it's popular amongst ornmental turners. It basically usees a special curved cutter, and in this case, available as a kit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wYXjo0bzqE 15-Oct-20 11:44 AM without a radius device, they just use the outside of the object itself as a rest/stop 16-Oct-20 11:46 AM new sensitive watchmaker's tapping machine (drill sharpener behind) 16-Oct-20 11:46 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_2119-EA51D.jpg 16-Oct-20 11:46 AM I think I need to make cone clutches for it, actually 16-Oct-20 11:59 AM Used my lathe for the first time yesterday on some PVC pipe... Owned it for like a year and a half and hadn't touched it since bringing it home then 16-Oct-20 11:59 AM ! 16-Oct-20 11:59 AM almost reminds me of my milling attachment.. took a year to get ER25 collets for it 16-Oct-20 11:59 AM I cleared out space to access my lathe/mill yesterday. Housworking tools were in front of it for the past few weeks 16-Oct-20 12:00 PM I need to watch some videos on lathe techniques 16-Oct-20 12:00 PM arranged them a bit better, added a bunch of nails to hang things that can hang 16-Oct-20 12:01 PM How to orient the cutting bits 16-Oct-20 12:01 PM and practice... that's what it comes down to, really 16-Oct-20 12:01 PM experience 16-Oct-20 12:01 PM Coming up with (extension cord based) power for the shed after 5 years of living here has been very fruitful 16-Oct-20 12:02 PM for some reason I keep tripping the GFCI plug where the lathe is, so I Have a long extension cord running from that downstairs bathroom (also gfci) for it that doesnt trip 16-Oct-20 02:49 PM I figured out it did already have the cone clutches, adjusted slightly to have a gap between them a bit more, and appears to be more functional 16-Oct-20 02:49 PM did a simple wrap + light oil cleaning as well 16-Oct-20 02:49 PM it's such a simple and nice design.. and none of my other drill presses/mills have reverse, so I needed this for tapping 16-Oct-20 02:49 PM deciding if I want to go with threaded bushings or tap the mainplates/bridges 16-Oct-20 02:49 PM mainplates is far more.. haute 16-Oct-20 02:49 PM bushings is more engineering and relatively easily replaceable/fixable 16-Oct-20 02:49 PM but it can look awkward seeing the shoulder 16-Oct-20 03:05 PM but, I can have a single jig in the tapping machine for a (each) certain bushing size (OD) (actually, it has a flexing clamp for "one" size currently) and easily do a whole bunch of bushings, without the need to thread on a lathe, instead of a separate locating jig for every single threaded hole of a mainplate 16-Oct-20 03:05 PM there are actually simple ways (beyond X/Y) to make an adjustable lcoating jig for the mainplate.. only reason to make a solid jig would strenght (not needed here) or if I had many taping machines going with different locations and able to do better throughput (and, of course, (3 reasons I guess) to have a jig that you dont need to adjust to get working, just pull it off the storage shelf and it's already setup) 24-Oct-20 01:45 PM w00t, my buddy in NC picked up that Hauser M1, watchmaker's jig borer that I receently won.. he will palletize it and ship it to a depot here, then a fellow graduate will help me pick it up and take it inside 27-Oct-20 09:43 AM crated 27-Oct-20 09:43 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_2175-F59AA.jpg 27-Oct-20 09:43 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/625352534-64C1E.jpg 27-Oct-20 09:43 AM he stacked that ontop of another pallet, so forlifts' forks stay away from main box 27-Oct-20 09:43 AM he's def getting a handmade watch for his efforts 31-Oct-20 07:55 PM so I am building a Nd:YAG laser device of sorts, and I have just bought a case for it 31-Oct-20 07:55 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201031_230953-D970D.png 31-Oct-20 07:55 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201031_231047-3BC55.png 31-Oct-20 07:55 PM I am thinking of getting my 3018 CNC to mill out the faceplate 31-Oct-20 07:55 PM seems like it should be able to do aluminium 31-Oct-20 07:55 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKCokjYhGCY 31-Oct-20 07:55 PM the back plate also needs holes like IEC connector, power switch, etc holes done 31-Oct-20 07:55 PM not exactly sure what sort of material it is, I think it is iron or something 31-Oct-20 07:55 PM I am not so sure the 3018 can do it 01-Nov-20 03:22 AM I'm not sure how I feel about rack cases with sloped frontpanels. 01-Nov-20 03:47 AM There's going to be a touchscreen 01-Nov-20 03:47 AM Hence the slope 01-Nov-20 04:06 AM at min 16:14 a bearing wanders out of the spindle mount :3 01-Nov-20 11:52 AM I received a whole new spindle/quill assembly for my combo mill, and will be working towards to replacement of it in the next few days, during the rain 01-Nov-20 11:52 AM current one has more play than I would want 01-Nov-20 11:52 AM found rust on the grinder spindle housing yesterday.. it must have condensated down there.. working on sealing up the front window today, somethign I've put off for a while, but the adjoining room still has an old window, working towards getting that replaced soon enough. I have a can of Great Stuff that I may apply around that window to ensure a seal 01-Nov-20 11:52 AM cant have my machinery rust! 01-Nov-20 11:52 AM oh, it's also not heated down there anymore 01-Nov-20 01:20 PM -and- sealed up both windows.. 01-Nov-20 01:23 PM Fluid Film on all the surfaces is my solution to that 01-Nov-20 01:23 PM You get used to the smell pretty quick but it definitely has an odor from the lanolin 01-Nov-20 06:10 PM I remember loading up the hole in the housing for this sleve with oil, not sure why the sleve didnt get it 04-Nov-20 06:46 AM @SleepyOwl Joyce yes, those small machines do aluminium (I have a 3020) 04-Nov-20 06:46 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/El1YlGmX0AAAzJV-33A63.png 04-Nov-20 06:46 AM can only recommend them if they are equiped with ballscrews, tho. 04-Nov-20 06:46 AM (for zero backlash) 04-Nov-20 06:46 AM On a different note, I made a pretty puny thing today: 04-Nov-20 06:46 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/El-lrB9WkAAg4d1-C77E6.png 04-Nov-20 06:46 AM It's a miniature oil mister and air blast for chip clearing on the CNC 04-Nov-20 06:50 AM Ooh, cool! 04-Nov-20 06:50 AM admittedly while I have assembled it I haven't done any milling on it yet 04-Nov-20 07:01 AM XD 04-Nov-20 07:01 AM I'm pushing mine really hard 04-Nov-20 07:01 AM any photos on your 3018? 04-Nov-20 07:04 AM https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/765091910947438624/765868998062505984/ae41bfc5-9b97-4906-9778-86e5d76c6560.png 04-Nov-20 07:04 AM this is some cheap chinese 3018 mill 04-Nov-20 07:04 AM as we speak I am trying to figure out milling bits for this 04-Nov-20 07:04 AM the parts list shows that the bits it came with are 20 deg, 0.1 mm bits 04-Nov-20 07:04 AM I also need to figure out the software for this 04-Nov-20 07:04 AM since I am using Linux 04-Nov-20 07:04 AM but I think I should be able to Google something quickly 04-Nov-20 07:04 AM (or at least I hope so) 04-Nov-20 07:18 AM If it runs GRBL, then I recommend https://github.com/vlachoudis/bCNC 04-Nov-20 07:29 AM I'll try that out! Thanks for the link! 04-Nov-20 08:44 AM I don't think that can do aluminium in any heavy form. (it will engrave, sure) 04-Nov-20 08:48 AM Yeah a lot of the aesthetically pleasing cheap stuff is quite bad 04-Nov-20 08:48 AM some of the designs from MIT students are as cheap to build, but with more thought into the mechanics and can actually cut pretty well though. 05-Nov-20 07:04 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bLj5Pj_H9E 05-Nov-20 08:30 AM how much HP are on those smaller machines that you are talking about? I have a geared workhead but only 1/3hp and I can do 316-stainless, although slowly 05-Nov-20 08:30 AM I imagine it's a different beast though 05-Nov-20 08:30 AM nearly tabletop, but not? 05-Nov-20 08:30 AM also, watchmaker's jig borer is on a trailer enroute to this city, w00t 05-Nov-20 08:36 AM @Noxz According to my knowledge power is not an issue - most of small/cheap/diy CNC are just not rigid enough. 05-Nov-20 08:36 AM nods 05-Nov-20 08:36 AM btw, I did this yesterday/day before: https://photos.app.goo.gl/PChuHaQdtcSvpjb26 05-Nov-20 08:37 AM Yeah rigidity is what limits it usually 05-Nov-20 08:37 AM People who don’t know better buy bigger and bigger spindles 05-Nov-20 08:37 AM quill had a little bit of sideshake, was able to snag a replacement that was more rigid, now I can rebuild the old one and have a 'spare' 05-Nov-20 08:37 AM But that just helps you break your tools faster 05-Nov-20 08:39 AM I lost my highest gear, or so I thought, yesterday took it all apart and rechecked everything, took bit by bit off and retested.. apparently it just had to run in and warm up some 05-Nov-20 08:39 AM tried this morning, no high gear, lol 05-Nov-20 08:39 AM a few moments of running it would gain it back though 05-Nov-20 08:39 AM anywho, that should be a decent pic dump of what I am working with 05-Nov-20 08:39 AM and I am now out of gloves, so I dont think I will do any work with it till I order more 05-Nov-20 08:39 AM the machine is very serviceable 05-Nov-20 08:39 AM minus the quill, not designed to really be disassembled too much 05-Nov-20 08:39 AM and yeah, no angular bearings, another fail point 05-Nov-20 09:01 AM My 3020 has about 1HP (800W brushless) 05-Nov-20 09:01 AM my milling machine more or less the same, but it has high and low gear. 05-Nov-20 09:02 AM hrm, interesting 05-Nov-20 09:02 AM so just rigidity, eh? 05-Nov-20 09:02 AM or lack thereof 05-Nov-20 11:32 PM lack of it, yes. 05-Nov-20 11:32 PM Sometimes I think I want to change the round bar rails in the smol CNC for supported rails (basically rebuild the mechanics)...but then I have a perfectly good milling machine next to it that I could convert into CNC...but then again that machine has a slow spindle... 05-Nov-20 11:32 PM it would take more or less the same amount of money to upgrade the router, than to convert the milling machine to CNC 05-Nov-20 11:32 PM and I'm always undecided 05-Nov-20 11:32 PM (because I like to do small machining, with 1mm endmills, so it requires a really fast spindle... 09-Nov-20 02:16 PM oi, buddy from Ohio around the corneer (and up 2 or 3 blocks) has a truck and will help me pickup the new watchmaking jig borer + optical dividing head, w00t 11-Nov-20 10:08 AM Anyone here happen to have any experience with Precision Matthews machines? In the market for a lathe and not really feeling the used options that I am seeing on the market for the prices but I have heard a lot of good things about PM 11-Nov-20 10:24 AM Definitely not an expert, but I thought ~90% of what makes a lathe good or bad hasn't changed... And so if you're comparing at the same price, the used ones are generally a lot better. Like the basic colchesters and stuff 11-Nov-20 10:26 AM Unfortunately not really true with the older used ones 11-Nov-20 10:26 AM You have to be a very discerning buyer with old lathes, in my opinion 11-Nov-20 10:26 AM Very easy to drop 2-3K on a lathe and then discover some gremlins that require you to spend that amount all over again 11-Nov-20 10:26 AM Especially with gear head lathes 11-Nov-20 10:27 AM Oh yeah for sure you should assume old = needs work 11-Nov-20 10:27 AM but you can pay people to do the work, so like 4k new lathe vs 2k used lathe + estimated 2k work, or something 11-Nov-20 10:27 AM transport nightmare, of course 11-Nov-20 10:28 AM I wish it was that cheap to pay for machine rebuilding haha 11-Nov-20 10:28 AM You are talking probably 50-100hrs of labor + parts for going over your average 13/14in swing x 40in bed lathe 11-Nov-20 07:01 PM jig borer inside 11-Nov-20 07:01 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_2217-D5A41.jpg 11-Nov-20 08:18 PM @Noxz How is the grinding machine we move going? 11-Nov-20 08:20 PM Adam!! 11-Nov-20 08:20 PM Hey! 11-Nov-20 08:20 PM It is out of frame in the photo, it hasn't moved but I have a j-bar and sterable machinery skates now for when thee time comes 11-Nov-20 08:20 PM Lol are you going to rip out the carpet this time? 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM I am rebuilding the spindle currently, I have the housing next to me, as it got a small coat of surface rust when temps dropped because it wasnt heated down there 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM haha, it's on the list 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM Ah damn 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM I have 2 windows left to replace on the house 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM I have the new bearings and 'special' grease on hand 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM Yeah I have that happen to me in my shop during a power outage 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM I cover my scopes with plastic when I leave on trips now 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM but yeeah, it took me weeks just to get that spindle full removed 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM Ooof 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM oh man, that must have sucked 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM It wasnt to bad 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM But I did walk in with my SEM covered in dew 11-Nov-20 08:21 PM so that was not fun 11-Nov-20 08:22 PM a simplle TLDR is: I graduated school and I am officially a SAWTA Certified Watchmaker! 11-Nov-20 08:22 PM Hell yeah! 11-Nov-20 08:22 PM but, that doesnt mean much if I want to make my own watches, it's more for the service industry 11-Nov-20 08:22 PM Stating in Seattle for bit then or? 11-Nov-20 08:22 PM *staying 11-Nov-20 08:23 PM spring wuarter was entirely from home, going into school once a wek to pickup maladjusted movements, but summer qtr was on campu, was basically us and phlembotomy 11-Nov-20 08:23 PM I am staying here etill the house is done 11-Nov-20 08:23 PM that's kind of always been the plan 11-Nov-20 08:23 PM I only came up here for school 11-Nov-20 08:23 PM I est 6-9 mo of house work, at least 11-Nov-20 08:24 PM Its house work so double that lol 11-Nov-20 08:24 PM yup 11-Nov-20 08:24 PM but no worrie,s because our housing market is stupid [hot] 11-Nov-20 08:24 PM plus zero interests rates recently? 11-Nov-20 08:25 PM Want to move to off topic? 11-Nov-20 08:25 PM yeah, I am half unaware where I am half the time 11-Nov-20 08:25 PM lol same 12-Nov-20 08:03 AM I may try to make a quick stand/desk thing for the jig borer before the rain comes 12-Nov-20 04:13 PM https://photos.app.goo.gl/PtfLNWHWmGSdiLaN8 12-Nov-20 04:13 PM Look how cute and tiny these oilers are! 12-Nov-20 04:13 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_2228-756FC.jpg 12-Nov-20 05:25 PM readout is to the tenths 12-Nov-20 05:25 PM as in ten-thousandths of an inch, or 2.54 microns 12-Nov-20 05:25 PM with a compensated mechanism of the leadscrew mapped out (I should show how they do this, mechanically) 13-Nov-20 10:54 AM @Noxz Any suggestions for ways to bend the pointer hand of a dial indicator so that it does not rub against the dial? Seems like it is very springy spring steel. I would rather not remove it or have there be an obvious bend in it but so far my attempts at gently bending it upwards have not been a success 13-Nov-20 10:54 AM Not exactly clock related but close enough I figure you might have suggestions 13-Nov-20 11:11 AM we did a whole week or so on correcting hands, in fact, some exams we arent alloweed to ask for new hands and they are purposfully foobar'd.. other times we can ask for as many new ones as we like (till thee teacher gets mad) ... more or less you just grab it with tweezers (maybe wrap them with Kapton first so it doesnt scratch) and give it a little bend.. also maybe a skewer/ped wood from underneath and massage it down/over 13-Nov-20 11:11 AM given the dial is in the way it can take some practice 13-Nov-20 11:41 AM Guess I was not being quite aggressive enough with my attempts to bend it. Will have to mess around with that this weekend. Random 0.0005" indicator that was in a box at my grandpa's garage we are cleaning out. 13-Nov-20 11:41 AM Starrett branded too, not sure why he had it at all. 15-Nov-20 06:00 PM just got an optical dividing head + t slot table inside! will build a stand for it oon the next dry day 15-Nov-20 06:00 PM will be used to make master indexing plates for gear cutting 15-Nov-20 06:00 PM reads out to 2 arc seconds - which can eeasily be divided to 1 16-Nov-20 11:21 AM just checked the optical path with a LED as light source, everything is operating nice and smoothly, clear path! ... deciding if I want [to buy] an original Leitz transformer (4-8V AC) and use the incandescent bulbs (that came with the machine) or if I should just retrofit LEDs 19-Nov-20 03:47 PM built the shelf for the optical dividing head, awaiting on retractable casters, on the truck being delivered, before I place the table + head onto it 19-Nov-20 03:47 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_2253-24C1F.jpg 19-Nov-20 03:47 PM it will likely have a lower shelf, but I foobar'd the wood I had set aside for it.. I have plenty more, but yeah 20-Nov-20 01:34 PM https://photos.app.goo.gl/dY7rpqiu5ocNfYTD7 20-Nov-20 01:34 PM I should have asked for help 20-Nov-20 01:34 PM but, it's there 20-Nov-20 01:34 PM without the head and such, it was easy enough to roll around, on the carpet, without any metal sheets.. I put some metal sheets down on the top, and should likely put them under the feet, too 20-Nov-20 01:34 PM but, it's also about 2" taller than the grinder.. the plan was same height so I could move it on/off with ease 20-Nov-20 01:34 PM so, that'll be a revision for next time/move, because I am not taking it off 20-Nov-20 02:23 PM you could leave the table and everything on top, block it up to support it by whatever is structurally sound (crossbeams?), and then shorten the legs/reinstall casters before removing the blocks 20-Nov-20 02:23 PM lot easier than trying to make the legs longer after it is all together at least 20-Nov-20 02:29 PM so... I actually figured it out 20-Nov-20 02:29 PM build a riser platform on the grinder to match the height... the center slot of the grinder is at like a 45deg angle anyways, so make something that connects that to a straight slot thing for the dividing head, and matches the hegiht 20-Nov-20 02:29 PM and I like this solution 20-Nov-20 02:29 PM I can actually raise the dividing table up quite a bit, so it's just a matter of getting a big chunk of metal that may live on/near the grinder 20-Nov-20 02:29 PM the side it is currently on was planned for a mag chuck.. but this house is not designed anywhere near having it in their forever spots 20-Nov-20 02:29 PM it was more of adam saying: where do you want it 20-Nov-20 02:29 PM and plopping it down 20-Nov-20 02:29 PM anywho, yes, a riser/adapter plate for the grinder->dividing head that matches the height of the dividing table 20-Nov-20 02:29 PM also, nothing toppled over during the dog walk, so that's good, lol 20-Nov-20 02:32 PM thats an option too for sure. all depends what is already at the most comfortable working height 20-Nov-20 02:32 PM the new table or the grinder 20-Nov-20 02:32 PM at least that would be my approach to deciding 20-Nov-20 02:34 PM angled slot 20-Nov-20 02:34 PM it does have normal ones, but still.. I could make something 20-Nov-20 02:34 PM plus a lip or two so it always registers straight/center 20-Nov-20 02:34 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_0689-F9CB8.jpg 20-Nov-20 02:34 PM so, one method costs money of material, the other not so much, but time and fear of toppling over 20-Nov-20 02:34 PM k, I basically have no excuse to not get the grinder spindle rebuilt sooner than later now 20-Nov-20 02:34 PM I have everything for it, just bleh 20-Nov-20 02:34 PM that took a lot out of me, ugh, I should have asked for help 22-Nov-20 12:28 PM hey all, i'd like to perform electrolysis and capture the hydrogen in an ampoule to then measure its emission spectrum though don't know the best way to capture + seal it off...figured i could make a Hofmann apparatus but worried about closing off a pipette with hydrogen with a torch 22-Nov-20 02:28 PM If your plan is really to measure the emission spectrum of hydrogen from electrolysis think you might also need to vent/purge the air from the apparatus before trying to collect hydrogen. You also need to evacuate the tube you plan to seal off so there isn't contamination and you can vent in just enough hydrogen to get it going before sealing it off at the end. Not sure about the safety concerns or how to address them for sealing up the tube though. 22-Nov-20 07:17 PM ahh 22-Nov-20 10:28 PM wow neat https://www.mcmaster.com/8-32-screws/length~3-4-2/material~stainless-steel/vented-socket-head-screws-6/ 22-Nov-20 10:34 PM Yeah I use those and the ones from leaker. They also have vented set screws 22-Nov-20 10:34 PM If you’re not cycling or don’t have dozens of holes, and don’t care about going below 1E-8 torr, unnecessary. The air pocket will vent quick enough with a normal bolt. 22-Nov-20 11:51 PM I wish I could buy from McMaster in Australia... they seem so good, like mechanical DigiKey 22-Nov-20 11:51 PM same 22-Nov-20 11:51 PM well, not for AUS 22-Nov-20 11:59 PM Maybe easier to capture the hydrogen in a glass tube with a valve, those Teflon valves like you would use on a Schlenk line 23-Nov-20 10:57 AM McMaster is truly amazing, whatever you need either shows up tomorrow or the day after 23-Nov-20 10:58 AM Wish they had better shipping options 23-Nov-20 10:58 AM sometimes they have stuff at reasonable prices... but you gotta pay 5x the item cost for next day shipping, because they have no cheaper options 23-Nov-20 10:59 AM I don't even get shipping options they just send it to me and then like bill me $12 afterward 23-Nov-20 11:00 AM $12 isn't bad 23-Nov-20 11:00 AM I think we got a $70 bill for ~$25 of stuff. Nothing huge 23-Nov-20 11:00 AM Their customer service is great though. 23-Nov-20 11:00 AM I mentioned a while back I had some valves break... We agree it was a combination of user error / having much worse safety margin on the valves than most plumbing fittings, but they still refunded everything even though I didn't ask them to 23-Nov-20 11:08 AM McMaster is awesome when someone else is footing the bill 23-Nov-20 12:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC06676-0843F.JPG 23-Nov-20 12:08 PM Two foot 750lb turbo pump 23-Nov-20 12:46 PM That’s like space simulator size. 23-Nov-20 12:53 PM it can be yours if you show up to california with a forklift 24-Nov-20 06:54 AM I am in California with a forklift but I just don’t have the space for it or the time to deal with it! 29-Nov-20 07:43 PM got the leitz variac in, 4-8vac, repaired it (brush broke off) and got it working with the lamp for the dividing head, all installed and functioning well 29-Nov-20 07:43 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_2305-B2B63.JPG 29-Nov-20 07:43 PM again, the ticks on the bottom are 2 arc seconds.. split them for 1 arc second 02-Dec-20 11:42 AM Do you hate mounting penning gauges with regular tools as much as me? It made me get non-magnetic stainless steel wrenches laser-cut (because it is impossible to buy some) 02-Dec-20 11:42 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-47679.jpg 02-Dec-20 11:55 AM Yeah we 3d printed a bunch at work 02-Dec-20 12:55 PM I like this a lot 02-Dec-20 12:55 PM And yeah they suck to mount 02-Dec-20 03:45 PM Why does it suck? 02-Dec-20 03:46 PM The magnets in the guage really like to grab the tool 02-Dec-20 03:51 PM Ooo 02-Dec-20 04:04 PM one feature though 02-Dec-20 04:04 PM the magnets hold the bolts in place!!! 02-Dec-20 04:04 PM but also on ours, the magnets can be removed easily 02-Dec-20 04:04 PM so you can mount with a normal wrench 02-Dec-20 04:04 PM thanks MKS, for doing one thing nice? 02-Dec-20 04:05 PM welp, i got the pump 02-Dec-20 04:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201202_113505-0341F.jpg 02-Dec-20 04:05 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201202_123119-ADD9A.jpg 02-Dec-20 04:05 PM as far as I have been able to tell this is the biggest turbo ever made 02-Dec-20 04:05 PM a biggg chungus at 340kg 02-Dec-20 04:09 PM https://www.ipp.mpg.de/1124570/launcher?page=1 02-Dec-20 04:09 PM They use one for that 02-Dec-20 04:24 PM my nakpin math suggests the pump stores 1 megajoule at full speed, wowza 02-Dec-20 04:40 PM That size of turbo is when they go far beyond the "this needs a dedicated containment vessel" size for rotor failures 02-Dec-20 04:40 PM Any idea what sort of voltages/phases the motor is? 02-Dec-20 04:53 PM i think it's a 3 phase 230v motor, but I don't know the pinout. circular connector 02-Dec-20 04:53 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/Rebuilt-Pfeiffer-TPH062-KF40-1-F98AE.png 02-Dec-20 04:53 PM this sort of connector 02-Dec-20 04:55 PM one of the fun mil spec Amphenol things 02-Dec-20 05:14 PM a crash is equal two M67 hand grenades on the lower end of my estimate and the upper end is 10 of them, depending on the actual moment of inertia. 02-Dec-20 05:44 PM Yeah you definitely will need a steel lined concrete block enclosure around that for safety imo 02-Dec-20 06:12 PM As the safety professional, I'll second that. That's the kind of unit we give a room of its own. 02-Dec-20 06:28 PM What is the diameter of that thing?? 03-Dec-20 10:20 AM 24 in 05-Dec-20 05:30 PM anyone know where i could get (or recover) small amounts (10s/100s of grams) of iridium for cheap? 05-Dec-20 05:38 PM How valuable is your time? 05-Dec-20 06:30 PM depends what i'm doing...happy to spend a lot more time to learn something (or learn how not to do something) if it will save me some dollars 05-Dec-20 08:41 PM has anyone played with rhenium? 05-Dec-20 09:59 PM Well the lowest cost path to iridium in the 10s or 100s of gram quantity is to go meteorite hunting and get lucky finding one that is iridium rich 05-Dec-20 09:59 PM Otherwise I think you gotta consider buying it 05-Dec-20 09:59 PM Not really one of the platinum group metals that gets used for a whole lot afaik? 05-Dec-20 10:14 PM As filament for a thermal ionization mass spec system. Why? 06-Dec-20 07:37 AM That turbomolecular pump is a chonker. 06-Dec-20 07:37 AM What are you going to do with it? 06-Dec-20 09:50 AM Wall-Art 06-Dec-20 10:38 AM Yes wall art for now 06-Dec-20 10:38 AM Maybe eventually bolt it to a 500 gallon propane tank and make an atom smasher 06-Dec-20 05:39 PM seems like a fun metal, at least in density...much cheaper than platinum, curious to see if i can mill or cast it 07-Dec-20 09:17 PM @samy My only use for rhenium is in non sag tungsten wire. It’s typically 3% rhenium. It makes a decent base metal if prepared properly for barium carbonate. Makes an easy to activate oxide coated filament. 07-Dec-20 09:41 PM We use rhenium for electron emission filaments. The prof insists it is better than tungsten and lasts longer. 07-Dec-20 10:08 PM We used rhenium for F A N C Y filaments in the TIMS system. Tantalum happened for the other mass spec. 07-Dec-20 11:22 PM Interesting thing on the rhenium vs tungsten comparison... Never realized that one has a higher melting point (W) but the other has a higher boiling point (Re). Which matters most for filaments? 08-Dec-20 12:07 AM melting, and vapor pressure 08-Dec-20 05:06 PM Rhenium helps prevent embrittlement. It does nothing for emission but it does not really hurt it. 10-Dec-20 12:12 AM latest machine I may acquire, a rose engine lathe (guilloche) 10-Dec-20 12:12 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/336476fd38caa62637bb8561a8436236bf57920e-E7FCB.jpg 10-Dec-20 12:12 AM old ones rarely become available for sale 10-Dec-20 06:51 AM Sweet. What you gonna do with it? Engrave some watch bezels? 10-Dec-20 08:49 AM Dials 10-Dec-20 08:49 AM it also has the straight line chuck adapter, so it's like two machines in one.. though results doing straight line on a rose are usually subpar in comparison, I think part of that is just t h e rosette design 10-Dec-20 08:49 AM straight line machines are typically available, but rose engines just rarely become available 10-Dec-20 09:21 AM I'm looking forward to seeing what you do with that 10-Dec-20 09:21 AM I've wanted to take them at engine class in Seattle for a while now 10-Dec-20 09:22 AM It's a beautiful piece of equipment, if nothing else. 10-Dec-20 01:55 PM I took 3 classes from Brittany + David 10-Dec-20 01:55 PM David restored one of t hose exact models 11 years ago 10-Dec-20 01:55 PM I dont think it's the exact one, but there arent many 10-Dec-20 01:55 PM the guy selling it says he may know someone with an Armbruster Mark II if I wanted to go that route 10-Dec-20 01:55 PM but that is more like $60k 10-Dec-20 01:55 PM which is certainly better than 100+ for a MADE lathe (which is David lindow + others premier new one) 10-Dec-20 01:55 PM examples of what I have made before on her machines 10-Dec-20 01:55 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_2331-0B1B1.jpg 10-Dec-20 02:46 PM Oh wow 10-Dec-20 03:08 PM an older shot, which shows the grid (basket weave/parquet) a bit better but still not quite so good, along with a pen 10-Dec-20 03:08 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_4790-96DDD.jpg 10-Dec-20 03:08 PM the design that he does here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDR1mSm59lk 11-Dec-20 10:46 AM I think I know the answer to this, but I would need something along the lines of an oxypropane torch to significantly bend a standard cheapo allen wrench, right? 11-Dec-20 11:03 AM Mapp gas might do the trick 11-Dec-20 11:06 AM Cheapo allen wrench can be easilly bent with little help of suitable pipe or bigger pliers. Cheaper ones are probably made from butter and not steel... 11-Dec-20 11:07 AM The hardened ones seem to have more of a tendency to just snap, but yeah depending on what specific varity of cheap we are talking about here 11-Dec-20 11:19 AM How cheap we're talking is a good question. It's more a pile of a bunch of wrenches 11-Dec-20 11:19 AM But bending cold by hand is easier than cutting one to make it fit, so I'll try that first 11-Dec-20 11:31 AM What sort of place are you trying to fit it? 11-Dec-20 11:31 AM Cutting off hex wrenches is pretty easy with abrasive cut off wheels if you just need the already short side of the L shape to fit somewhere 11-Dec-20 11:31 AM Just make sure it isn't your only one in that size 11-Dec-20 11:31 AM If you are in the USA consider just getting a disposable set from HarborFreight for a few dollars instead of cutting up a nice american made wrench over something of mystery quality 11-Dec-20 11:31 AM https://www.harborfreight.com/36-piece-sae-metric-hex-key-set-94725.html $7.99 -20% https://www.hfqpdb.com/coupons/20_percent_off_1604954039.9228.JPG 11-Dec-20 11:45 AM I cut an m5 one the other day, took about 3 minutes with a hacksaw + vice 11-Dec-20 11:45 AM one of the ones that came with a laser, so like, not chinesium ? 11-Dec-20 11:45 AM (but also maybe?) 11-Dec-20 11:48 AM I dunno, last time I did hacksaw and vice it worked, but it also took like 4 hours 11-Dec-20 11:48 AM And I need to loosen a screw to take off a YAG rod for inspection 11-Dec-20 11:48 AM And it's too deep for the short end of a hex key 11-Dec-20 11:48 AM And the angle doesn't work for a long straight anything 11-Dec-20 11:48 AM So I figured my two options are tiny straight hex key rod with some makeshift grip or bend a hex key to fit in the space 11-Dec-20 11:51 AM wait 11-Dec-20 11:51 AM you don't have hex goosenecks? 11-Dec-20 11:51 AM I assumed this was to get it in a small gap 11-Dec-20 11:51 AM tiny straight hex key rod with some makeshift grip you can just use a 1/4-20 bolt with two nuts locked together for this 11-Dec-20 11:51 AM as a grip 11-Dec-20 11:59 AM I'm not really sure how a gooseneck would help. It's a pretty tight space that I need to hit at basically 90 degrees 11-Dec-20 11:59 AM If the standard hex wrench was like...a millimeter longer on the bent side it would work, but they're not and I can't find any long enough 11-Dec-20 12:02 PM do you have any really short hex bits from a socket set or something that fit? 11-Dec-20 12:02 PM because if so then just use that + bolt + nuts? 11-Dec-20 12:03 PM You def do not want to cut a hex wrench with a hack saw...that sounds painful. Dremel or angle grinder and abrasive cut off wheel (please wear proper PPE) will have it done in less than a minute. 11-Dec-20 12:04 PM Took me less time with a hack saw than it takes to walk to the room with either of those tools. 11-Dec-20 12:05 PM That surprises me. Either very soft hex wrenches or way better hacksaw blades than I buy 11-Dec-20 12:05 PM None appear to be the right size 11-Dec-20 12:05 PM or too much experience cutting steel 5/16 threaded rod 11-Dec-20 12:06 PM Honestly, I have no idea how they even assembled this laser unless it's quite literally an oscillator that's pre built/aligned that is then plopped into a shell 11-Dec-20 12:06 PM here's an idea 11-Dec-20 12:06 PM Because there are a lot of idiosyncrasies in it like this 11-Dec-20 12:06 PM drill a hole in the casing that's blocking you? 11-Dec-20 12:06 PM Where you can't actually reach the screw with standard tools 11-Dec-20 12:07 PM Our coherent system has many holes for similar reasons, though mostly to be able to align it while it's on with the lids closed 11-Dec-20 12:07 PM because air moves too much 11-Dec-20 12:07 PM Thought about it. Might do it if the alternative is taking the entire oscillator out which was another idea 11-Dec-20 12:07 PM Actually nevermind I forgot about the structural rod. That won't work 11-Dec-20 12:07 PM That's the problem 11-Dec-20 12:07 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201211_151505-C64FC.jpg 11-Dec-20 12:29 PM which hole do you need to get at? 11-Dec-20 12:29 PM the one in the wheel? 11-Dec-20 12:30 PM Yes 11-Dec-20 12:30 PM And the actual screw is quite deep in there 11-Dec-20 12:30 PM That space is about 2 cms btw. So not big but also not fiendishly small 11-Dec-20 12:33 PM but that's a tiny hex key then? 11-Dec-20 12:33 PM like not even 9/64? 11-Dec-20 12:33 PM I think it's a 1.5 mm but I can't say for sure because it would be out by now if I knew 11-Dec-20 12:33 PM But tiny yes 11-Dec-20 12:33 PM jeez, just use a hacksaw 11-Dec-20 12:33 PM get it over with 11-Dec-20 12:34 PM I may just do it anyway with a new set, but there's not actually the right size anywhere in that pile 16-Dec-20 09:11 PM I learned from Lindow too, but only on the fly at an NAWCC convention in 2013. I turned my sample (with mistake) into a custom Jendritzki balance tack. 16-Dec-20 09:11 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201203_154217-3B423.jpg 16-Dec-20 09:11 PM I've run into him @ cabin fever before. Kinda aloof. He's on the board of the AWCI now. I did not expect to run into a watchmaker in this place but I remember now someone mentioned you to me. It may be why he graciously added me. 16-Dec-20 09:11 PM I've met Cox at the Harmon estate, she's super nice. I've always wanted to take the classes they do- and I have no idea where you found a rose engine, though I have seen them up for sale before, rare, yes. 16-Dec-20 10:30 PM @Ophiuchus Hiya, nice to meet you. There are a few others interested in watch repair here, but I think I am the only one with formal education. Is it just a hobby for you or something more? I actually own a few machines from the Harmon estate, but I did not go, simply some reselling going on from a non-horologist. I actually have not seen it in person yet, it's being held for me (automatic wheel/pinion cutting engines). both David and Brittany have a hard time responding to [my] emails. I understand they have their job to do so they cant be bothered too much, but an email a month shouldn't be terribly hard to write up, even basic responses, but I don't get a lot from them which really bums me out as I put in a bit of effort into the questions and whatnot.. I'm actually designing a clock project that I want to debut at the NAWCC national convention, but not sure if I'll have it done for this coming one (~210 days says my countdown clock).. The rose engine was discovered simply by searching for the brand name and coming across a single forum post - in a non engine turning forum, but posted back in March so I emailed asking if it was still available and whatnot.. I am actually still on the fence about it because I can make one that actually suites me a bit better 16-Dec-20 10:50 PM Mine is a complicated tale. 16-Dec-20 10:50 PM I may not fully publicly discuss. 16-Dec-20 10:50 PM But I do have formal education from an American school that was SAWTA accredited. It is not currently my occupation 16-Dec-20 10:50 PM So, I actually know and have taken the tests you have 16-Dec-20 10:50 PM based on what I've said publicly only so far today here, a smart person with your background could actually track me down by what I've said. 16-Dec-20 10:50 PM We may have even met before 16-Dec-20 10:57 PM It's possible.. I also try not to stalk people too hard 16-Dec-20 10:57 PM I'm sad but glad it wasn't just my experience with Lindow- I think his fame has gotten the better of him 16-Dec-20 10:57 PM he's very aloof unless you're somebody known I think. At least that was my impression. 16-Dec-20 10:58 PM he seemed great during the classes.. I mean, his wife even watched my puppy for one of them 16-Dec-20 10:58 PM Oh, yeah, guess that was weird of me lol. I never meet other people who might be actual AWCI 16-Dec-20 10:59 PM since I am planning on moving back to Ohio I have thought about trying to contribute to the AWCI, since their offices are there, but at the same time I need to first establish myself 16-Dec-20 10:59 PM No, he's very nice, he's just very aloof if you run into him in my experience. He actually denied his own identity when I explained I had a professional relation to him I thought that was extremely arrogant 16-Dec-20 10:59 PM btw, I just graduated this past year, not sure if that was conveyed 16-Dec-20 11:00 PM I read upwards. That was the last thing I expected to see here or much of anywhere 16-Dec-20 11:00 PM heh, another student stated a similar thing of mutual interest 16-Dec-20 11:00 PM about low level assembly/reverse engineering of computer software 16-Dec-20 11:00 PM not expecting to meet someone in watchmaking school who uses IDA, etc 16-Dec-20 11:00 PM you'll bump into some nice coincidences 16-Dec-20 11:02 PM Well, the big shocker with me 16-Dec-20 11:02 PM I made it through mechanical chronographs and didn't finish, though I had an A average. 16-Dec-20 11:02 PM Health problems took me out of commission at the time 16-Dec-20 11:03 PM life gets in the way sometimes 16-Dec-20 11:04 PM I'm AWCI. But I'm not an accredited watchmaker. I have the training of one though. 16-Dec-20 11:04 PM certification is for service centers, imo 16-Dec-20 11:04 PM I have no need for it if what I want to do is make my own movements 16-Dec-20 11:04 PM I don't have certification what I normally work in either which is the field of Machining 16-Dec-20 11:05 PM not having a computer degree made it difficult to get my foot in the door initially though 16-Dec-20 11:05 PM I'm one of those incredibly odd people who doesn't have professional certifications but my skills speak for themselves 16-Dec-20 11:05 PM lots of regrets of dropping out of college first time around 16-Dec-20 11:05 PM I have a degree from before I went into Machining and watch making 16-Dec-20 11:06 PM once you get that 5 yr experience at a big name company it gets better though 16-Dec-20 11:06 PM 'in lieu of a degree' 16-Dec-20 11:06 PM And if the name Herman means anything to you and I know it does and strikes fear into your heart probably he could have identified me by what I would tell you is my degree 16-Dec-20 11:06 PM hah, yeah, I met him a few times 16-Dec-20 11:06 PM we had no actual graduation due to covid this time around, so prob last time I saw him was for last year's graduation 16-Dec-20 11:07 PM Because according to him I was only in a handful of people in the United States with my background quite literally a handful 16-Dec-20 11:07 PM I didn't even think of that how covid would affect the graduation in a watchmaking school 16-Dec-20 11:08 PM so... Spring quarter we did everything from home, but we were allwoed back for summer (final) quarter 16-Dec-20 11:08 PM My degree was in Japanese language and literature. I'm bilingual 16-Dec-20 11:08 PM the exams were done with cameras mounted to our desk lamps 16-Dec-20 11:09 PM I met a lot of people that thought like this as a student. 16-Dec-20 11:10 PM yeah, there is a pretty sharp/visible line of who is capable, both physically and financially, to pursue such a thing 16-Dec-20 11:10 PM I cannot judge it, I only know what my own goals are 16-Dec-20 11:10 PM you are correct 16-Dec-20 11:10 PM that's actually one reason I try not to look at other watches nowadays 16-Dec-20 11:10 PM I don't even wear a watch 16-Dec-20 11:10 PM I want to make something that looks like such-and-such 16-Dec-20 11:10 PM and try not to compare it to others 16-Dec-20 11:10 PM hehah, I feel naked without my daily 16-Dec-20 11:11 PM I have several of course but I don't have the collector mindset I have the opposite 16-Dec-20 11:11 PM number one it makes no sense to wear a watch in a machine shop 16-Dec-20 11:11 PM I mostly wear this one.. I have a few other fun ones and such, but I dont wear many of them 16-Dec-20 11:11 PM heck, during winter quarter I wore a casio to school everyday just to see if anyone noticed 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM Number two I have such a developed sense of Aesthetics for the mechanics I just have no desire to wear a normal watch I have really specific taste 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM oh, yeah, a sapphire caseback for a 7750 is a bad idea, lol 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM That sounds really pompous but basically I only look at the mechanics and I don't really want to wear anything enthusiastically unless it's my own design 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM even if it is decorated 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM I dont have an exhibition caseback on anything I wear 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM I would prefer not to see under the skirt 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM because I like mechanisms too much 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM project number one is a desk clock type of idea, then following that will be a watch movement, based on a vintage one but with my own tweaks 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM I am also very interested in a substantial number being manufactured over a handful a year 16-Dec-20 11:12 PM ie, 100 vs 12 16-Dec-20 11:15 PM I have this laying around. Meh. 16-Dec-20 11:15 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20200904_144117-20FF1.jpg 16-Dec-20 11:15 PM my graduation watch isnt even fully assembled anymore, never wore it 16-Dec-20 11:16 PM I never finished mine. I tried to go too Fastoldt/Vacheron on it 16-Dec-20 11:16 PM by graduation I mean the purchasable watch, not the school watch 16-Dec-20 11:16 PM It functioned. I have a pic of it. 16-Dec-20 11:16 PM which is basically not even in the ciriculum anymore 16-Dec-20 11:17 PM Ahh, yeah, didn't get one of those. A Tudor 16-Dec-20 11:17 PM we never even cut a single gear, it was pretty bad if that's what you wanted to do.. but SAWTA doesnt care if you know how to do that 16-Dec-20 11:17 PM Exactly 16-Dec-20 11:17 PM it did not and neither did I 16-Dec-20 11:17 PM yeah, they changed the model for this year, better but still realllly bad 16-Dec-20 11:17 PM completely flat crystal, so it catch light and makes it impossible to read in certain positions 16-Dec-20 11:18 PM Students going to watch making School thinking they're going to learn how to actually make a watch and that does not happen 16-Dec-20 11:18 PM amongst other nuances 16-Dec-20 11:18 PM right.. the prooblem is more so ciriculum 16-Dec-20 11:18 PM It's one of the big draws of watchmaking school to find people to encourage that misconception 16-Dec-20 11:18 PM and also that the instructors are watchmakers, not machinists 16-Dec-20 11:18 PM Yes but some know Machining quite well 16-Dec-20 11:18 PM they are not qualified to teach you to make a movement 16-Dec-20 11:18 PM Herman is an excellent machinist from what I know 16-Dec-20 11:18 PM Lititz is different they get special treatment 16-Dec-20 11:19 PM I spoke to him about a machine or two that I had acquired, but he didnt have much to say, he was in the office area and whatnot 16-Dec-20 11:19 PM yeah, Seattle gets pushed aside 16-Dec-20 11:19 PM They have gone into gear cutting and advanced Machining there but you have to do that on your own time and they already grind people to dust particularly in that one but that's part of what comes with the reputation 16-Dec-20 11:20 PM I still dont believe that many of them know how to approach things in a production mindset 16-Dec-20 11:20 PM one-offs are a joke to me 16-Dec-20 11:20 PM and I grew up with art 16-Dec-20 11:20 PM (my mother is an artist, it's what fed me) 16-Dec-20 11:21 PM I ironically did not go into school with the idea of starting a watch making brand 16-Dec-20 11:21 PM But I definitely knew that I wanted to make at least one watch for myself completely 16-Dec-20 11:21 PM And when I knew more about some areas of machining then my first-year professor it upset him. He's very skilled though. 16-Dec-20 11:21 PM I more or less did.. but it was: What am I looking to get out of this program and what can I get out of it? 16-Dec-20 11:21 PM He's an excellent teacher though 16-Dec-20 11:21 PM He's now the education director for the awci 16-Dec-20 11:22 PM yeah, luckily we had a knife-maker student who was able to show up the first year instructor in nearly every area of the micromachining topics 16-Dec-20 11:22 PM I went to Oklahoma which no longer exists 16-Dec-20 11:22 PM Almost 10 years ago 16-Dec-20 11:22 PM ahh, yeah, they shut down this past year 16-Dec-20 11:22 PM I've seen things you wouldn't believe 16-Dec-20 11:22 PM I think I was told because the sintructors were offered a job at a service center teaching program thing in Paris TX or similar?? 16-Dec-20 11:22 PM and who wants to move to Oklahoma? 16-Dec-20 11:22 PM people say the same thing about Ohio, so whatever 16-Dec-20 11:24 PM The barbecue there is pretty awesome and Tulsa is beautiful but the rest of the state other than Broken Bow the river there yeah it's pretty desolate 16-Dec-20 11:24 PM I know more than I can publicly say I still keep in touch with one of my professors 16-Dec-20 11:24 PM The second-year professor who was the program director 16-Dec-20 11:24 PM Exceedingly nice man and utterly brilliant 16-Dec-20 11:25 PM yeah, I'm not really asking for any info neither, that's just what I heard through the grapevine 16-Dec-20 11:27 PM No it's okay because my story is strange compared to most and the fact that I found you here I never know who else may be out there 16-Dec-20 11:27 PM it's not my business to know other people's business, but I don't mind sharring what I was told 16-Dec-20 11:27 PM hah, no worries, and if you ever want to go into private chat or whatever lmk 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM I'm happy to talk more privately, but from what I've seen there are some people interested in this rather rare area so I'll try to talk publicly 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM I talk a bit about my watchmaking machining advents in here and a few other places, nothing on instagram yet, etc 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM more so just collecting the machinery at this moment 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM the secret society of hobbyist watchmakers 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM latest acquisition was a Hauser M1 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM Hey he's a professional don't knock that 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM well, I dont get paid 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM I don't mean that meanly 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM I'm certified 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM but a professional? not yet 16-Dec-20 11:28 PM maybe in a year or two 16-Dec-20 11:29 PM he's legit. SAWTA is difficult. 16-Dec-20 11:29 PM amateur? enthusiast? 16-Dec-20 11:29 PM sure 16-Dec-20 11:29 PM I dont knock it for what it is 16-Dec-20 11:29 PM but if a pro is someone who gets paid, that is not me, yet 16-Dec-20 11:30 PM I failed SAWTA 3 test by 0.01mm of lack of endshake (play to normal people) on a single component, my pallet bridge, on the ETA 2824-2. Herman told me the rest of my watch was flawlessly clean 16-Dec-20 11:30 PM I DNF my first time around of the sawta 3 16-Dec-20 11:30 PM the pallet stones kept moving on me when depthing 16-Dec-20 11:30 PM and it took a while 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM number 3 failed a lot of people 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM the retake was done before the sawat 4, thanks to covid and whatnot 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM 2824 bridges are too damn flexible. 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM yeah, the other guy that failed number 3 with me was due to not enough oil here and there 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM I also failed the first sawta 4 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM had to retake it 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM I bent my reverser click spring 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM upon taking it down to half wind to time it out 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM it wasnt bent when I assembled it, so nothing was wrong.. right?!? 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM on the retake I ensured to do half wind first 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM then tok it up to full and go tthe timing sheet on it 16-Dec-20 11:31 PM I actually should have failed eveery single test first time around, but they gave it to me on 1 and 2 16-Dec-20 11:33 PM I think only one person from my actual class that started with around 12 people actually passed SAWTA, or CW21 for that matter. He was good. Very fast. but exceptionally arrogant 16-Dec-20 11:33 PM 2 I had oil on the pallet stones, just hardly 16-Dec-20 11:33 PM Oh this is a fun conversation 16-Dec-20 11:33 PM when I left there were only 5 remaining. Only 3 or 4 made it thru from what I heard. I did not keep in contact with them 16-Dec-20 11:33 PM yeah, you'll get a mixed bag of people 16-Dec-20 11:33 PM there were only 5 people in my class at the start 16-Dec-20 11:33 PM still 5 at the end, but one didnt quite make it through the certs, but he needed it the least 16-Dec-20 11:33 PM some people couldnt understand why you would take the class and not want/need the cert though 16-Dec-20 11:33 PM even being told the reason they stood by their question 16-Dec-20 11:34 PM When I was there I was the Federal watchmaking work-study for the watchmaking wing the only one in the country at one point 16-Dec-20 11:34 PM I was a federal employee overseeing a watchmaking laboratory it was pretty badass but I wish shit at managing people 16-Dec-20 11:35 PM Interesting and probably accurate typo 16-Dec-20 11:35 PM Having more certifications is always helpful it can't hurt 16-Dec-20 11:36 PM right, it cant hurt 16-Dec-20 11:36 PM This is one thing I will say thats really brutally honest 16-Dec-20 11:36 PM I thought about getting various IT certs 16-Dec-20 11:36 PM I deeply regret not making it through school especially with what happened 16-Dec-20 11:36 PM It took me many years to get over 16-Dec-20 11:37 PM sucks man.. 16-Dec-20 11:37 PM I regret not getting through college the first time around (computer science) 16-Dec-20 11:37 PM I don't go to conventions anymore because I feel like a joke 16-Dec-20 11:37 PM that program was not for me though 16-Dec-20 11:37 PM Very few people know what actually happened to me 16-Dec-20 11:37 PM I think I prefer it that way 16-Dec-20 11:37 PM I have yet to go to a watch convention 16-Dec-20 11:37 PM heh, I dont do social media (yet) so I am pretty disconnected from everyone 16-Dec-20 11:38 PM they are worth it go they are more than worth the cost 16-Dec-20 11:38 PM I still use email 16-Dec-20 11:38 PM and irc 16-Dec-20 11:39 PM My class went to Denver for the first time a watch making class went to an awci convention and I got to meet Archie Perkins while he was still alive and Stephen Forsey of Greubel Forsey. I talked gear cutting with him and he let me wear his $500,000 prototype tourbillon watch. 16-Dec-20 11:39 PM it was like meeting 2 gods 16-Dec-20 11:39 PM I'll never regret trying in all of it. 16-Dec-20 11:39 PM is there... a watchmaker's discord server? 16-Dec-20 11:40 PM If there is I am not familiar but I was only specially added by invite to Discord about a week ago through the kindness of a very wonderful maker in Spain 16-Dec-20 11:40 PM Apparently I've gotten to know people because I'm pretty honest and met several really nice people who have invited me to what I consider some pretty deep rabbit holes 16-Dec-20 11:41 PM There is, I think a fellow student (the 18 year old) started one 16-Dec-20 11:41 PM If there is such a server I'm not sure if I would be anxious to join or embarrassed to be a part with my background and I have no idea how you would search for such a thing 16-Dec-20 11:42 PM I am not in it, because I was kind of told how it was going and whatnot 16-Dec-20 11:42 PM I also asked if they made any jokes about me in there because you can read up upon joining 16-Dec-20 11:42 PM lol 16-Dec-20 11:42 PM this was early on 16-Dec-20 11:42 PM I forget where the main link is, maybe via reddit, iunno 16-Dec-20 11:43 PM Part of me prefers to be unknown to many I'm kind of the Phantom of the Opera of watchmakers except not as impressive 16-Dec-20 11:43 PM the first year instructor spends massive amount of time on watchmaking facebook groups 16-Dec-20 11:43 PM I'm also very out of practice 16-Dec-20 11:43 PM I stay the fuck off Facebook and social media in general other than a hackerspace slack I just left earlier this week because I left my hackerspace and it makes me sad 16-Dec-20 11:43 PM Now where can I blow shit up unsupervised at 3 in the morning for fun 16-Dec-20 11:44 PM I need to part a few IRC stuff 16-Dec-20 11:44 PM I used to be romanticized by one-off 'handmade' watches.. it's still impressive and whatnot, but from a science/engineer perspective I don't buy it anymore 16-Dec-20 11:45 PM I hope this conversation is interesting to a few people normal people never really get to see watchmakers. Let alone hear them bullshit. 16-Dec-20 11:46 PM and the reason of that is there is zero publicized equations necessary to actually make advancements, not just escape angles and whatnot 16-Dec-20 11:46 PM I am only slightly interested in watches (planning to repair one actually) and this has been very amusing... 16-Dec-20 11:46 PM there is a working title for a ... book? .. in my head to correct some of this 16-Dec-20 11:46 PM but first there must be a watch (a hundred) made 16-Dec-20 11:46 PM My main work is machining so it is all similar concepts just different applications 16-Dec-20 11:47 PM funny when people talk about making chips larger than a part you are making 16-Dec-20 11:47 PM Earlier today I was actually messing around with this: https://github.com/vacaboja/tg 16-Dec-20 11:47 PM Pretty impressive for free software 16-Dec-20 11:47 PM hmm. gonna have to check it out 16-Dec-20 11:47 PM Yeah the features necessary for that repair are way smaller than the tolerances on some parts I make 16-Dec-20 11:48 PM There are absolutely equations my friend 16-Dec-20 11:48 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201217_024819-0D1E1.jpg 16-Dec-20 11:49 PM hrm, I don't know why I do not own that book already 16-Dec-20 11:49 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201217_024920-4B07F.jpg 16-Dec-20 11:49 PM Did you know it existed before I told you about it 16-Dec-20 11:49 PM My specialty is rare books and knowledge 16-Dec-20 11:49 PM Antoine Simonin is me as an old rich man:joy: 16-Dec-20 11:50 PM I cant recall the title 16-Dec-20 11:50 PM I got a few vintage books recently 16-Dec-20 11:50 PM I got the whole 5 volume set of Holtzapffel yesterday 16-Dec-20 11:51 PM I actually found this after years of searching from a comment from Stanley of the Paris Texas Richmont school, the guy who trained both my former professors 16-Dec-20 11:51 PM digitally available for free, but hardcopies ~200 years old has a certain thing about it 16-Dec-20 11:51 PM I'e been translating an old book from Caspari, mostly in regards to the effect of hairspring mounting angles 16-Dec-20 11:52 PM Yes, but do you have the Ted Crom books? 16-Dec-20 11:52 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201217_025224-C86A3.jpg 16-Dec-20 11:52 PM i have digital versions iirc 16-Dec-20 11:52 PM I got them directly from his estate his widow sold them to me 16-Dec-20 11:53 PM ahh, nice 16-Dec-20 11:54 PM God damn kids and your .pdfs and your mumble rap! when I was young we had real rap, Eric B. & Rakim! and none of that fancy lossless format shit 16-Dec-20 11:54 PM I'm 37 now lol 16-Dec-20 11:55 PM heh, I recall trying to get colors working in a Solaris terminal [terminal emulator] and a fellow coworker was like: gosh, we've only had color monitors for 20 years! 16-Dec-20 11:55 PM I no longer use colors, mostly because I was then a sysadmin, and jumping on ~50k bare metal servers means you do not take your configs with you 16-Dec-20 11:56 PM I use Linux, I am trying to design a watch in freecad only because I hate proprietary software 16-Dec-20 11:56 PM big proponent of foss 16-Dec-20 11:57 PM yeah, most of us here are 16-Dec-20 11:57 PM I know inventor very well though and Mastercam as well and I have used SolidWorks in Fusion 360 it's more of an ethos thing 16-Dec-20 11:57 PM I don't trust Autodesk with something that's going to take me a couple years to design 16-Dec-20 11:57 PM cool. Glad to know I'm not entirely nuts 16-Dec-20 11:58 PM well... being with people who are also nuts doesnt make you not nuts 16-Dec-20 11:59 PM I have the capability as it stands right now of skill-wise making everything in the watch except the hair spring and I'm thinking of going to Firehouse horology when I get that far for a silicon hairspring 16-Dec-20 11:59 PM firehouse folded from what I understand 17-Dec-20 12:00 AM I just can't settle on a final design 17-Dec-20 12:00 AM I was told they did, at least 17-Dec-20 12:00 AM I have not heard this in that would be news to me 17-Dec-20 12:00 AM they arent really searchable anymore 17-Dec-20 12:00 AM no more website 17-Dec-20 12:00 AM etc 17-Dec-20 12:00 AM Well when the fuck did that happened I just searched for them a couple months ago 17-Dec-20 12:00 AM this past year or so.. I was looking at them too 17-Dec-20 12:00 AM Fuck. 17-Dec-20 12:01 AM yeah... so maybe finding s omeone here to etch you some silicon is all you need? 17-Dec-20 12:01 AM heh 17-Dec-20 12:01 AM do you need equations and whatnot done 17-Dec-20 12:01 AM I like silicon hairsprings, my daily has it 17-Dec-20 12:01 AM lololololol if that's the case this is probably the right place to find them that's pretty incredible coincidence 17-Dec-20 12:01 AM I am likely going the route of making/using Si 17-Dec-20 12:01 AM just not there yet 17-Dec-20 12:01 AM also, trying to find a US seller of that french book 17-Dec-20 12:02 AM I'd like to make the hairspring too, I just know how metallurgically crazy that would be, to even source the material 17-Dec-20 12:02 AM oh, yeah, I actually ran into this same sort of topic recently 17-Dec-20 12:02 AM you won't 17-Dec-20 12:02 AM Simonin books in Switzerland. 17-Dec-20 12:02 AM of why for my desk clock idea thing I may do weight driven.. so I dont have to use some crazy mainspring alloy 17-Dec-20 12:03 AM https://www.booksimonin.ch/ 17-Dec-20 12:03 AM nods 17-Dec-20 12:03 AM If you don't know who that is or why the person who runs that Bookshop is famous you need to go back to school 17-Dec-20 12:03 AM he literally wrote your textbook 17-Dec-20 12:03 AM The man is the librarian to watchmakers for a reason. He used to head WOSTEP itself 17-Dec-20 12:04 AM we arent taught much of the industry.. and the book we used (Theory of Horology) does not list him as one of the 4 main authors 17-Dec-20 12:05 AM Trust me- he helped write it. 17-Dec-20 12:05 AM He's known for that among many other things 17-Dec-20 12:05 AM I've thought of doing a glass hairspring, I researched them extensively in school, but they devitrify. Anthony Randal did it, his writings show they were too erratic, even when coated in gold sputter. 17-Dec-20 12:07 AM "glass" 17-Dec-20 12:07 AM yup. 17-Dec-20 12:07 AM I want to do a Zerodur balance 17-Dec-20 12:07 AM He tested zerodur glass for hairspring I do believe. 17-Dec-20 12:08 AM zero expansion doesnt mean zero change in elasticity at various temps 17-Dec-20 12:08 AM Yes things that crazy have been done 17-Dec-20 12:08 AM Correct 17-Dec-20 12:08 AM just misconceptions 17-Dec-20 12:09 AM that's why CE Guillaume invented both Elinvar and Invar 17-Dec-20 12:09 AM I made my specialty horological research and tools 17-Dec-20 12:09 AM There were times where I would lecture the teachers on certain topics and they would listen a little 17-Dec-20 12:10 AM I am all about the science behind it, too.. but I am no metalurgist 17-Dec-20 12:10 AM It doesn't mean I was a an exceptional watchmaker though I was very slow but I was a perfectionist 17-Dec-20 12:10 AM example, I paid to have a modern Rolex screw and ETA pinion alayzed and matched it up to alloys 17-Dec-20 12:11 AM nice 17-Dec-20 12:11 AM yeah, decent $250/per spent 17-Dec-20 12:11 AM to not wonder: what should I use for screws 17-Dec-20 12:11 AM oh thats easy 17-Dec-20 12:11 AM use Sandvik AP20 17-Dec-20 12:11 AM or Sandvik Finemac 17-Dec-20 12:11 AM The first one is a leaded free Machining metrological tool steel common in the watchmaking industry but being phased out for the second which isn't quite as easy to machine but it has no lead 17-Dec-20 12:11 AM I've never actually gotten a hold of either I can't find a source for them but I've never really inquired super hard I'm sure I could find it if I asked the right people 17-Dec-20 12:13 AM oi, they do coil-wire too! 17-Dec-20 12:13 AM I am designing a machine akin to a swiss-type/moving headstock lathe, but more int he milling/boring head effect, with wire feed of material, so no need for bars 17-Dec-20 12:13 AM if limitted on space 17-Dec-20 12:13 AM I've contacted them directly and they wouldn't tell me who I could buy it from the fuckers 17-Dec-20 12:13 AM oh you are my new best friend 17-Dec-20 12:14 AM haha 17-Dec-20 12:14 AM btw, that carbon ccontent, on the first one you stated, is 1.0, whereas the Rolex is ~0.40 17-Dec-20 12:14 AM It's just nice to get to talk with someone about the shit again seriously because most people I've met don't actually understand even a tenth of what I was in 17-Dec-20 12:14 AM Rolex has its own proprietary alloys 17-Dec-20 12:14 AM That is because they have their own metallurgical Foundry 17-Dec-20 12:15 AM That's interesting 17-Dec-20 12:15 AM yeah, I was told that was more for their tstainless cases though 17-Dec-20 12:15 AM Rolex rolexes harder. 17-Dec-20 12:15 AM no one like them 17-Dec-20 12:16 AM Also interesting, but not terribly surprising that the preferred material is a specialty from Sweden. 17-Dec-20 12:16 AM I had to stop talking about my interests at school, because I learned all the other students were wankers and the instructors couldnt tell me which way to cross the street 17-Dec-20 12:16 AM Yes they're stainless 314L alloy is actually proprietary even though that alloy is available 17-Dec-20 12:16 AM for lack of dumbing them down or not 17-Dec-20 12:16 AM Apparently they had extra things to it 17-Dec-20 12:16 AM yeah, it's 9xx series iirc? 17-Dec-20 12:16 AM whatever that means 17-Dec-20 12:16 AM yep 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM oh, we got to put together a brand new rolly before covid happened 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM Sandvik makes excellent hacksaw blades :P 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM guy came out and walked us through a day or two of it 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM which is where that screw came from 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM That's about my experience with them 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM dissappeared under my desk, found it later 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM their pallets and escapewheels are made via LIGA 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM pallet forks, that is 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM still jewels for the pallets iirc 17-Dec-20 12:17 AM it was actually a pretty slick movement 17-Dec-20 12:18 AM I have a lot of experience on that kind of thing the second they find out you're actually seriously trying to do it they won't engage you on it because they're trying to create people who will fix what is out there not make more 17-Dec-20 12:18 AM yuuuuup 17-Dec-20 12:18 AM From their perspective that's rational 17-Dec-20 12:18 AM "what can I get out of this program" 17-Dec-20 12:18 AM "what do I want to get out of it" 17-Dec-20 12:18 AM and it really is rational, but you end up with them not knowing anythign because they arent engineers 17-Dec-20 12:19 AM But at the same time there are very few people I met as students over a period of three years that could actually do it. The people who have not only the knowledge but the skill to actually pull it off are very few 17-Dec-20 12:19 AM And then the third thing is critical the right set up with money or just insane lifetime dedication like me 17-Dec-20 12:19 AM Like I'm going to walk into the fucking grave doing this shit no matter who gets in front of me 17-Dec-20 12:20 AM yeah.. 17-Dec-20 12:20 AM the first year instructor would be like: why would you buy the gear cutters? you dont need any unles syou want to make your own watch" ... and this is after 1.5years 17-Dec-20 12:20 AM that somehow he didnt even remember who wants to do what 17-Dec-20 12:21 AM facepalm 17-Dec-20 12:21 AM we started joking about him hard on the second year side 17-Dec-20 12:21 AM of that typical response 17-Dec-20 12:21 AM pp Thornton, or make a eureka tool and make your own gear cutters 17-Dec-20 12:21 AM "hey guess what I just got, a _" 17-Dec-20 12:21 AM and if his response was: why would you need that?.. then yeah 17-Dec-20 12:22 AM there is actually a specialist in gear cutting or at least thread Milling in New England who shows up at cabin fever but you really have to know who he is to look for him and even David lindow bows before him 17-Dec-20 12:22 AM I've been to his shop it's one of the most ridiculous things I will ever see 17-Dec-20 12:22 AM does your french book talk about Hertz contact forces? 17-Dec-20 12:22 AM I will not name him publicly 17-Dec-20 12:22 AM Fuck if I know I don't speak French 17-Dec-20 12:23 AM The plan was to learn French 17-Dec-20 12:23 AM I made zero effor tto learn german for the Caspari book 17-Dec-20 12:23 AM well, to some degree.. I learned certain watch related terms 17-Dec-20 12:23 AM but I mostly use google translate 17-Dec-20 12:23 AM it's also 'lower german' 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM for the Caspari effect on the pinning point? 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM so even many people on here, from germany, are like: wtf 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM Yes 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM it's a pretty old book 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM tooka moment to track it down 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM there may be one in french? 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM I speak Japanese but I need to learn French and German 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM I need to get back to it, I havent got to the interesting part yet 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM need 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM lol 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM @ you 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM I need to cut some gears 17-Dec-20 12:24 AM I dont need to learn german 17-Dec-20 12:25 AM ah, gotcha. at 3am? 17-Dec-20 12:25 AM only 12:30am here 17-Dec-20 12:25 AM Oh I'm in Pittsburgh PA USA 17-Dec-20 12:25 AM Consider yourself special because you're interesting enough for me to forego sleeping 17-Dec-20 12:26 AM plus I have espresso on hand if I so choose 17-Dec-20 12:26 AM I can sleep when I'm fucking dead 17-Dec-20 12:26 AM it came days late, got stuck in the mail, was aterrible few days 17-Dec-20 12:26 AM we can also chit-chat at any point.. I am mostly open time wise.. I work on this house when I can, but rain till monday hinders doing outdoor stuff 17-Dec-20 12:27 AM https://bhi.co.uk/about-us/derekpratt/ 17-Dec-20 12:27 AM Oh yeah speaking of watchmakers 17-Dec-20 12:27 AM I am a huge derek pratt fan 17-Dec-20 12:27 AM The local watchmaking school here is constantly struggling 17-Dec-20 12:27 AM Yes. Get that. 17-Dec-20 12:27 AM But they interestingly train a Finnish specialty: Micro mechanics 17-Dec-20 12:27 AM is that Gem City perhaps 17-Dec-20 12:28 AM Finland, so likely not 17-Dec-20 12:28 AM Yeah I forget you guys are all over the world which makes it more interesting 17-Dec-20 12:28 AM Sorry the two of us for monopolizing thread at 3 in the morning 17-Dec-20 12:28 AM I know that there's a really good school in Finland actually 17-Dec-20 12:28 AM We had one of the micro mechanic students at work over a summer designing some jigs and fixtures for some stuff we did. 17-Dec-20 12:28 AM 10:28 here 17-Dec-20 12:28 AM and imo, on topic traffic is just a good thing 17-Dec-20 12:29 AM Micromechanics was the entire 1st year of my program 17-Dec-20 12:29 AM the clockmaker holding an automatic wheel&pinion cutter for me has a Hauser P325 jig borer (as in the same one in Daniels' book) that got it through the guy who made the dial for pratt's h4 or something along those lines? 17-Dec-20 12:29 AM so I only know of 3 in the wild 17-Dec-20 12:29 AM daniels/smiths, that dude, and SIP6A of practical Machnist 17-Dec-20 12:30 AM Yeah I know exactly what you're talkin about I've been always wondering specifically about that exact machine 17-Dec-20 12:30 AM yar, I gotta become best friend with this clockmaker, especially otwards when his time isup 17-Dec-20 12:30 AM lol 17-Dec-20 12:31 AM Some of this stuff honestly even if you know it exists it's purposeless to acquire because the tooling is so rare or there other machines that work just as well 17-Dec-20 12:31 AM Usually both specifically the first 17-Dec-20 12:31 AM I'm also a rare tool whore 17-Dec-20 12:31 AM yeeeaaaahhh... so, I will never pass up an oppoutunity for one 17-Dec-20 12:32 AM I have several places where I know to look but I'm always looking for more places to look I am always keenly aware of what I lack or I would have never even found this place eventually 17-Dec-20 12:32 AM like.. why did I buy a Hauser M1? they arent even all that great 17-Dec-20 12:32 AM horological significance amongst other things 17-Dec-20 12:32 AM exactly 17-Dec-20 12:32 AM I had to get stuck with a W25 schaublin 102 17-Dec-20 12:32 AM I have a giant SIP jig borer capable of the same "tolerances" 17-Dec-20 12:32 AM "stuck with a schaublin" 17-Dec-20 12:32 AM riiight 17-Dec-20 12:32 AM That did not have metric saddle 17-Dec-20 12:33 AM oh, yeah, this machine is imperial :/ 17-Dec-20 12:33 AM And has a busted tailstock nut and it's not the nice lever tailstock I want 17-Dec-20 12:33 AM But my asshole of a father bought it for me because he believed in me before he became a massive fucking drunk so I guess it means something to me 17-Dec-20 12:34 AM heh, I wish my dad would have bought me a schaublin 17-Dec-20 12:34 AM havent seen him in 4+ years or soo, since last time I flew back to ohio, for a wedding 17-Dec-20 12:34 AM I'll remember that if he ever becomes not an asshole 17-Dec-20 12:34 AM it takes awedding for me to visit 17-Dec-20 12:34 AM but the plan is to return, so whatever 17-Dec-20 12:34 AM I dont even get calls or texts from him 17-Dec-20 12:34 AM rarely at least, a happy birthday and such 17-Dec-20 12:34 AM just not enough 17-Dec-20 12:35 AM I disowned mine but that's a whole nother can of worms 17-Dec-20 12:35 AM No one in my family actually understands any of what I do 17-Dec-20 12:35 AM Including all of my friends 17-Dec-20 12:35 AM This is the first time I've talked at this level with someone in years about any of this 17-Dec-20 12:35 AM I feel shity for writing so much in a thread but really happy that I found here 17-Dec-20 12:37 AM sometimes people will yell at us to take it to the offtopic channel, but until they do it's mostlyw whatever 17-Dec-20 12:38 AM Like I said earlier part of the reason I chose to do this publicly was I figured it would be an introduction for some people to learn a bit about me see that I'm serious but mainly because I thought it might be interesting to them to hear such a discussion 17-Dec-20 12:38 AM I can only imagine what the other people on here are like if anyone is reading this you don't need to be a watchmaker to interest me you just need to be someone very passionate about what you do 17-Dec-20 12:38 AM like my friend @UkieGeno, a madman of high voltage and singing tesla coils 17-Dec-20 12:38 AM I'd like to take a second to thank @GigaSquirrel a man with excellent taste in music for serendipitously inviting me here & @Nixie for prodding my ass on to Dischord. both are pretty awesome people. 17-Dec-20 12:41 AM some people don't like being pinged lol 17-Dec-20 12:41 AM so turn off notifications 17-Dec-20 12:41 AM when you tag them it notifies them 17-Dec-20 12:41 AM idc 17-Dec-20 12:41 AM got it 17-Dec-20 12:42 AM anyways watchmaking seems very cool 17-Dec-20 12:42 AM and is a good use of the machining channel 17-Dec-20 12:43 AM I hope I did not piss him off I don't know what that emoji is 17-Dec-20 12:43 AM I cannot figure out why there doesn't seem to be a way to hover over an emoji to see what is written 17-Dec-20 12:45 AM on the PC i do just that, I move the cursor over 17-Dec-20 12:45 AM it's a nuclear reactor, which is pretty damn cool XD 17-Dec-20 12:46 AM Oh shit you had me worried 17-Dec-20 12:46 AM I really was worried I pissed you off 17-Dec-20 12:46 AM I will shut off every notification I can find I don't want to upset anyone 17-Dec-20 12:46 AM lol, I think people will tell you if you pissed them off 17-Dec-20 12:47 AM once you get used to Discord you'll develop your settings and netiquette 17-Dec-20 12:48 AM nods 17-Dec-20 12:48 AM I'm basiclaly on a chemistry homework server, kinda as an admin, and owuld get pinged all throughout the day 17-Dec-20 12:48 AM even though rules say to ask in channels 17-Dec-20 12:48 AM "I HAVE AN EXAM IN 3 HRS PLZ HELP ME" 17-Dec-20 12:49 AM lololol 17-Dec-20 12:49 AM and I'm trying to bend a dog leg on a hairspring 17-Dec-20 12:49 AM @Noxz can I ping you? 17-Dec-20 12:49 AM oh fuck, hope you got good old stock pith for that 17-Dec-20 12:49 AM I think this server works on that.. all depends on where my phone is, too 17-Dec-20 12:49 AM we only did overcoils once or twice, I dont htink we ever timed it out? 17-Dec-20 12:51 AM I've not made one, but I've worked on stuff that had them 17-Dec-20 12:51 AM old stuff. Like old English fusees 17-Dec-20 12:52 AM my Longines stuff has em, and Rolex uses 'em 17-Dec-20 12:52 AM I went to work with a man of questionable ethics after school basically for free to work on very old watches in kind of not the best way in his case and I spent a lot of time trying to fix his bad habits 17-Dec-20 12:52 AM btw, I am a fan of vintage Longines 17-Dec-20 12:52 AM God bless him though he's gone now 17-Dec-20 12:52 AM Yes I like those as well 17-Dec-20 12:52 AM I have a 12.68Z 'Stop Seconds'... it's a continuous chrono that has a single flyback/reset button, no stop/start 17-Dec-20 12:53 AM I like Jaeger myself 17-Dec-20 12:53 AM yeah.... I own a jeager 101.. smallest movement ever made 17-Dec-20 12:53 AM one urge of coming here (from a previous "home cmos" channel) is to make a smaller movement 17-Dec-20 12:53 AM fuuuuuuuuck 17-Dec-20 12:53 AM and I needed a standard... right? 17-Dec-20 12:53 AM You're nuts. I like that kind of nuts. 17-Dec-20 12:54 AM the italian watchmaker who serviced (and sold to me) took a photo during 17-Dec-20 12:54 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/BD39608F-2F6A-4093-BB41-BDF9CE609B3A-87E5F.jpg 17-Dec-20 12:54 AM I have taken it out of the case (golden bracelet) twice, but have not taken it apart 17-Dec-20 12:55 AM just......arrrrrghhhhggg 17-Dec-20 12:55 AM You need to look at Paul Gerber. I think he holds the record for the world's smallest movement 17-Dec-20 12:55 AM I dont have a large collection, that is nearly it 17-Dec-20 12:55 AM yup, I like his moonphase thing inside the watch strap 17-Dec-20 12:55 AM I have one of the smallest automatics 17-Dec-20 12:56 AM he holds the record foor "most complicated" by number of parts 17-Dec-20 12:56 AM iirc 17-Dec-20 12:56 AM Can't remember the make, its a Bulova A51 something 17-Dec-20 12:56 AM About as big as the penny 17-Dec-20 12:57 AM d'you enjoy servicing quartz movements? 17-Dec-20 12:57 AM Fuck no. who does 17-Dec-20 12:57 AM hehah 17-Dec-20 12:57 AM I actually just had somebody give me an entire bag of them here 17-Dec-20 12:57 AM They look like they are all still in actual movement containers 17-Dec-20 12:57 AM I fixed someone's from here.. it included a geiger counter or whatever actual specific type 17-Dec-20 12:57 AM I'm actually not sure what these are worth they are old stock 17-Dec-20 12:57 AM just dry/old/little oil 17-Dec-20 12:58 AM I have no desire to work on anything powered by a battery unless it has Patek Philippe on it but that's incredibly pompous 17-Dec-20 12:58 AM and it had been months since I had done quartz, so I had to get the feel for oiling back, heh 17-Dec-20 12:58 AM But if I could make money doing it I still wouldn't 17-Dec-20 12:59 AM if you needed to make money, then whatever 17-Dec-20 12:59 AM The kind of customer that comes with quartz timepieces unless you're doing it full-time with mechanical and high-end stuff in there too too much grief 17-Dec-20 12:59 AM I've seen it 17-Dec-20 12:59 AM I really don't fix things for anyone anymore I don't work on watches that much for the last few years I'm looking to change that soon 17-Dec-20 01:00 AM I've only fixed a few watches for actual people.. but recently graduated 17-Dec-20 01:00 AM the plan was never to service watches 17-Dec-20 01:00 AM I actually can't imagine becoming a full-time watchmaker in America right now with the parts situation that much worse and not solved 17-Dec-20 01:00 AM otherwise I would have bench tested at Omega and places already 17-Dec-20 01:00 AM well, service center job is what you would get started at 17-Dec-20 01:00 AM you cant really build a shop from scratch anymore 17-Dec-20 01:01 AM You can you just have to be insane 17-Dec-20 01:01 AM Or have a lot of money 17-Dec-20 01:01 AM And really want to show off 17-Dec-20 01:01 AM yeah, I mean, Rolex will give you an account, after a 500 point inspection 17-Dec-20 01:01 AM and if no other shops around service/carry rolex 17-Dec-20 01:01 AM Oh believe me I am aware of the bullshit behind that 17-Dec-20 01:01 AM heh 17-Dec-20 01:01 AM I always have mixed feelings of it 17-Dec-20 01:01 AM I get what they are trying to fix 17-Dec-20 01:02 AM Let's just say it's not only students that affects 17-Dec-20 01:02 AM oh, yeah, tons of mom'n'pops jewelry stores got screwed 17-Dec-20 01:02 AM especialy when rolex is the bread and butter 17-Dec-20 01:03 AM If you've ever been to an nawcc Mart and you bring up Rolex you will have every old man in the place ready to strangle someone because a lot of them have been fucked over by the way the industry handled Parts accounts for a lot of watchmakers in good standing at the time 17-Dec-20 01:03 AM sure.. 17-Dec-20 01:03 AM I think I am going to make a PB&J.. one moment 17-Dec-20 01:03 AM A lot of those guys used to do it professionally until they lost their parts account sometimes for very good and valid reasons a lot of times not but it's hard to tell anymore with all the grief over many years but I've heard similar stories from people around the country I've traveled related to watch making a lot 17-Dec-20 01:03 AM no prob 17-Dec-20 01:10 AM Mmmm 17-Dec-20 01:10 AM we heard plenty about rolex's business practices in school 17-Dec-20 01:13 AM honestly we did too 17-Dec-20 01:13 AM but as much as I hate their stodgy af design, and chemically hardened pivots, I respect that they gave me a scholarship 17-Dec-20 01:15 AM heh 17-Dec-20 01:15 AM That they do fund education is about the only thing I like about them. 17-Dec-20 01:15 AM I'd never be caught dead wearing one, even as a gift 17-Dec-20 01:15 AM without them our school would have folded 17-Dec-20 01:15 AM not my style. Screams douche. 17-Dec-20 01:15 AM Seattle I interviewed at. 17-Dec-20 01:16 AM I've been looking at getting a Cellini Prince, 5443, for a while now 17-Dec-20 01:16 AM I interviewed at Lititz first 17-Dec-20 01:16 AM I applied to Lititz, got a letter months later saying: try again 17-Dec-20 01:17 AM I interviewed at NJ what used to be Hayek school 2nd or 3rd 17-Dec-20 01:17 AM OSUIT 4th. OSUIT was actually the best equipped by FAR 17-Dec-20 01:17 AM One of the fun things about getting in was seeing the guy who rejected me at Lititz trying to scare me happily talking to me as part of our programs board 17-Dec-20 01:17 AM It was like haha you german motherfucker you were wrong! (good Germans who led me here excluded) I can do this and now you see my tenacity is real 17-Dec-20 01:17 AM and now you see my watch making is clean and precise 17-Dec-20 01:18 AM I am pretty sure lititz rejected my letter due to wanting to make watches, not servicing them 17-Dec-20 01:18 AM He was still right though about the fact that I was slow 17-Dec-20 01:18 AM Yeah I figured that one out pretty quick in the interview when I told him that and he told me in detail how Andreas Strehler was the only watchmaker in the world that actually completely made the watch from scratch every single part but I'm still not sure if that's actually true 17-Dec-20 01:20 AM I had come up to seattle for frog convention thing (I have like 100 poison dart frogs) and was able to visit theschool up here.. and basically nodded after that and within 6mo got a house and moved up here.. worked for another ~2 before starting school 17-Dec-20 01:20 AM I will say that I respect the man and he is actually a nice person once he sees how serious you are if you really show your enthusiasm and don't fuck around 17-Dec-20 01:20 AM I didn't believe the students before me for telling me that but they were correct he is honestly just in a very difficult position and has to weed out the bullshit constantly 17-Dec-20 01:21 AM yeah, I get it 17-Dec-20 01:22 AM who has 100 poison darts frogs? 17-Dec-20 01:22 AM ~12 diff species/locales 17-Dec-20 01:22 AM noxz does 17-Dec-20 01:22 AM some are "thumbnail" size 17-Dec-20 01:22 AM I once reluctantly participated in creating a pocket watch with a poisoned dagger in it. 17-Dec-20 01:23 AM so.. there are enough people with 100+ that they have conference type of things 17-Dec-20 01:23 AM and people fly out for it 17-Dec-20 01:23 AM As a gag, but it wasn't actually poisoned. There was a long needle in the crown and a pot inside. I pray to God no one ever gets assassinated with it 17-Dec-20 01:23 AM The guy I worked for as I mentioned had questionable ethics and interesting sales tactics:joy: 17-Dec-20 01:23 AM I mean that's not watchmaking that's just goofiness 17-Dec-20 01:24 AM sure 17-Dec-20 01:24 AM also, they arent poisonous in captivity 17-Dec-20 01:24 AM just for reference 17-Dec-20 01:25 AM So I will connect with you later because it's 4:30 in the morning where I live but like many right now I'm out of work so it's not as big a deal 17-Dec-20 01:25 AM I worked as a tool and die maker until recently when covid losses wiped out the workload in my Aerospace and medical titanium forging facility 17-Dec-20 01:26 AM rain tomorrow, so cant really do house work.. I do need to finish rebuilding the grinder spindle this week, which is the main goal 17-Dec-20 01:27 AM it was really nice to meet you I hope that was intriguing yes there are very odd hidden people like me out there 17-Dec-20 01:27 AM ah, so - yeah, I want to stamp out various parts 17-Dec-20 01:27 AM heh, nice chatting with you as well 17-Dec-20 01:27 AM I really enjoyed that it was worth the lack of sleep 17-Dec-20 01:27 AM When you spend years of your life trying to learn something and then finally go to school for it and then you never get to talk to anybody again about what you did it's pretty sad 17-Dec-20 01:28 AM and it's such a niche subject matter 17-Dec-20 01:28 AM and mostly defunct 17-Dec-20 01:29 AM it only appears that way. 17-Dec-20 01:29 AM The people who are still interested in it have Technologies at their disposals to make it a reality much easier than in the past especially with all the old equipment being available if you know where to look 17-Dec-20 01:30 AM yeah, I am kind of a tool collector, but it needs to be practical 17-Dec-20 01:30 AM in any case I hope people enjoyed hearing this I will have to pm you sometime when I have more sleep 17-Dec-20 01:38 AM That's blue light from cherenkov radiation in an open nuclear reactor 17-Dec-20 01:38 AM @Ophiuchus 17-Dec-20 01:52 AM Ahh. I do know what that is 17-Dec-20 01:52 AM And now I know I need to drug myself to go to sleep 17-Dec-20 10:53 AM heh, coffee time 17-Dec-20 10:53 AM there is a chance I will turn some delrin today, as a temp arbor for loading up new bearings for the universal tool&cutter grinder w/ grease 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_2342-E1D0A.JPG 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_2343-D34B1.JPG 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM just a plastic arbor to hold a bearing, and spin in, as grease is loaded into it.. that is the old bearing tested for size 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM same method Robin Renzetti posted of about a year ago 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM I still need to clean up the spindle sleeve/housing, as well as all of the labrinth nuts and whatnot 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM I also have the arbor covered now, but will ensure no chips/dust around.. 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM luckily the lathe was relatively clean from the vertical milling attachment quill replacement I did recently 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM and yeah, I know the overall workstation is messy, there is a lack of organization down there 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM but I will have 4 of those angular contact bearings to load up with ~1cc of grease 17-Dec-20 12:24 PM (30mm ID, 65mm OD, if curious) 17-Dec-20 02:56 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> how is it that all roads lead to robin renzetti? 17-Dec-20 02:56 PM or Stephan Gottewinter 17-Dec-20 02:57 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I feel like stephan does everything carefully and thoughtfully and robin has more "innovative" content. 17-Dec-20 02:58 PM Both good machinists.. Robin tries to relay certain theoories, but I rarely see appropriate math from anyone 17-Dec-20 02:58 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> stephan is like "that's how you'd do it if you were to do it exactly right" 17-Dec-20 02:58 PM machinists, not engineers 17-Dec-20 02:58 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> and robin is like "that's how you'd do it if you really overdid it." 17-Dec-20 02:58 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> yeah they aren't engineers 17-Dec-20 02:58 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> the kelvin connecting box thing that robin made struck me as very odd. 17-Dec-20 02:58 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I didn't understand why you'd build it that way... 17-Dec-20 02:58 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> but it was certainly beautifully made 17-Dec-20 02:59 PM I may need to watch the vids on it, not aware 17-Dec-20 02:59 PM but yeah, t hat's my biggest problem at the moment... making good setups is nice and all, necessary, but there is some underlining math/concepts that are amiss.. and it's no real fault to any of them.. it brings me back to my standard question: What do I want to get out of this, and what can I? 17-Dec-20 03:04 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201217_150420-9953D.jpg 17-Dec-20 03:04 PM drilling out those amazon shaft couplings worked well 17-Dec-20 03:05 PM did you drill the round one radially? and if so, how did you support it? a V-block + strap? 17-Dec-20 03:06 PM i bought a 6mm shaft coupling and then drilled its center out to 6.35mm 17-Dec-20 03:06 PM to remove the anodization 17-Dec-20 03:06 PM then turned it with some sand paper to remove more anodization (which I marred up so it looked bad) 17-Dec-20 03:08 PM so these are solid couplings, yeah? is the alignment of the two shafts perfect? ie, commonly stepper->leadscrew couplings are of a few types that allow a little 'compliance' for misalignment 17-Dec-20 03:08 PM well the extension shaft hasnt arrived yet 17-Dec-20 03:08 PM so unclear 17-Dec-20 03:08 PM i doubt it will be perfect but it is likely good enough 17-Dec-20 03:08 PM it's more of the mounting, also if it is very long then the amount of flex on it may be unimportant 17-Dec-20 03:08 PM right, good enough for a while is all that matters 17-Dec-20 03:09 PM oh it's definitely /solid/ but maybe not /true/ 17-Dec-20 03:09 PM roger. 17-Dec-20 03:09 PM mostly because some ape bent the copper feedthroughs 17-Dec-20 03:09 PM i bent them back the best I could 17-Dec-20 03:09 PM im actually shocked how poorly people treat vacuum hardware 17-Dec-20 03:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I'm tempted to make some videos documenting my build of this honeycomb coil winder 17-Dec-20 03:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> and I have very little free time so I'm trying to do it as efficiently and kinda hacked, but with well thought out hacks 17-Dec-20 03:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> lots of water jet cut parts with simple second ops... lots of chinesium purchased on ebay and then hacked and modified to suit my needs 17-Dec-20 03:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> robin renzetti's tips work in rare circumstances... usually given infinite time, and rarely is infinite time appropriate for a project 17-Dec-20 03:11 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> and doing the math can certainly narrow down how much effort should be dedicated to a task. 17-Dec-20 03:13 PM he's a job shop, so yeah, time is money 17-Dec-20 03:24 PM @𝓕ermion I'm sure I just missed it but what's the honeycomb coil winder for? 17-Dec-20 03:24 PM Im always just curios about different types of coil winders. 17-Dec-20 03:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> rewinding the coils for my old tektronix scopes 17-Dec-20 03:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> my 556 and 547 17-Dec-20 03:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> it uses 100 micron wire and will have two servo tensioners so it can do bifilar winds 17-Dec-20 03:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I've finished the spindle and the arm... the arm is on flexure bearings, the spindle is a newport optical rotary positioner 17-Dec-20 03:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> with an ER collet chuck attached 17-Dec-20 03:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I have handy a harmonic drive spindle and a linear motor that I might switch to one day, or might just get used for another project that actually needs them. 17-Dec-20 03:25 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I still need to make the jewel bearing stylus and do the tensioners. 17-Dec-20 04:15 PM At MU we had over 30 400 and early 500 series scopes most on carts. Ulmer the owner just kept finding them at friends places and bringing them home so to speak! I tried giving them away but only had a few takers. 17-Dec-20 04:15 PM The better looking ones are now sitting in a storage warehouse in the desert but the rutty ones went to an electronic scraping company. 17-Dec-20 05:26 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I could use another 556 17-Dec-20 05:26 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> lol 17-Dec-20 05:26 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> just wanna save 'em all 17-Dec-20 05:42 PM I agree. 17-Dec-20 06:36 PM spindle stuff mostly cleaned, then oiled 17-Dec-20 06:36 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/DSC_2345-FB679.jpg 17-Dec-20 06:36 PM I think I may get it all rebuilt and installed tomorrow 17-Dec-20 06:36 PM still no mag chuck.. that's on the list to get 18-Dec-20 09:15 AM @Ophiuchus got a response from Simonin's wife about that traite de construction book - they say it is definitely out of print and the publisher does not foresee making another run, but they gave me a decent list of others (that are "even better") to get 18-Dec-20 09:57 AM Here is a representative sample. I deleted most of the rest of the photos. 18-Dec-20 09:57 AM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-21225.jpg 18-Dec-20 09:57 AM Every corner of the place had a few 18-Dec-20 09:59 AM haha 18-Dec-20 09:59 AM the place i did my undergrad, we had some "relatively modern" analog scopes for our labs 18-Dec-20 09:59 AM but the shelves in the hall 18-Dec-20 09:59 AM had dozens if not hundreds 18-Dec-20 09:59 AM of "definitely not very modern" analog scopes 18-Dec-20 12:00 PM I'd be interested to hear them. I got my copy maybe 2 years ago. I still can't read it, but it's really meant for those to design a piece going into serial production. 18-Dec-20 12:01 PM which is my goal... 18-Dec-20 12:01 PM I'd certainly throw money at you if you scan it, all 1000+ pages of it 18-Dec-20 12:01 PM they recommended Théorie générale de l'horlogerie by Defossez 18-Dec-20 12:02 PM Funny you should mention that. I've been meaning to build a book scanner. Smartphones make this much easier now 18-Dec-20 12:03 PM google made an incredible one 18-Dec-20 12:04 PM It's pointless though to serially produce watches if you realistically want to make them repairable. There's a reason, many in fact, that there's no point to it in my mind, unless you're willing to do certain things 18-Dec-20 12:07 PM Serially actually is not the term I was going for.. but production 18-Dec-20 12:07 PM more of batch processes, I suppose 18-Dec-20 12:07 PM serially means one by one - agreed? 18-Dec-20 12:11 PM I meant, if you want to make a watch brand. 18-Dec-20 12:11 PM However you phrase that 18-Dec-20 12:11 PM First of all, customers are idiots, and you have to educate them 18-Dec-20 12:11 PM The more technical your work, the more what you make is a luxury and not actually needed in a pure sense, and the more competitors there are, the more why your product matters in the first place needs to be different, useful, and explained to fools 18-Dec-20 12:14 PM I'd certainly like a more production approach to things, over serially made bespoke custom timepieces.. but not mass produced junk, I'd settle for mediocre 18-Dec-20 12:14 PM never settle 18-Dec-20 12:14 PM but yeah, what would make somone buy mine instead of somethign eith ETA? 18-Dec-20 12:14 PM never for mediocre most of all. 18-Dec-20 12:14 PM USA made is a big point 18-Dec-20 12:14 PM but made by one person isnt exactly creating jobs, neither 18-Dec-20 12:14 PM one person is somewhat of a selling point as well, though 18-Dec-20 12:15 PM don't be like 100+ brands pulling that shit and only making a case dial and hands like 99% of them for a Swiss movement 18-Dec-20 12:15 PM yeah - that's disgusting to me 18-Dec-20 12:16 PM Its easy to sell craftsmanship compared to mass produced 18-Dec-20 12:16 PM singular watches by nature are innately more understood as a marketable item intrinsically for what they are 18-Dec-20 12:17 PM how would you rate 100 movements a year? it's not "micro", I guess it may be "small" or "mild" .. below "medium" for sure 18-Dec-20 12:17 PM ~100/yr is a number goal of mine, btw 18-Dec-20 12:17 PM still not easy to find someone willing to pay 6 figures for a watch. I don't do it with intent to sell. I do this for myself 18-Dec-20 12:17 PM The engineering required is a constant 18-Dec-20 12:18 PM the idea of a price point changed for me when reading up on Chaykin's Joker watch a bit 18-Dec-20 12:18 PM I understand he uses an ETA base movement, and yada yada... 18-Dec-20 12:18 PM So to settle for mediocre, you already lessen the end value of your own design work 18-Dec-20 12:18 PM but you then lower the price point accepting more buyers 18-Dec-20 12:18 PM I dont want one million dollar sale.. I'd rather go for 100 $10k sales 18-Dec-20 12:19 PM @Noxz have you actually made a working wristwatch yet? 18-Dec-20 12:19 PM nope, we didnt get a chance to even go over to the first year side during 2nd year due to covid and whatnot 18-Dec-20 12:19 PM If I personally wanted to create a brand, something I already hate as a concept, because my brother is a high end marketer... 18-Dec-20 12:19 PM so, given I graduated just ~3mo ago, I've been busy getting machines up and going 18-Dec-20 12:20 PM I would base it in truth. 18-Dec-20 12:20 PM is there like, a writeup / youtube video of the most amateur-level person who has made a working one? 18-Dec-20 12:20 PM most of the 'student watches' are super lame and I would not even recommend watching any of them 18-Dec-20 12:20 PM No USA Made bulshitting. No branding on the watch. No inscriptions of jewel count or other bullshit. 18-Dec-20 12:20 PM like, copies of a 6497 18-Dec-20 12:20 PM oh, I dislike the jewel count stuff 18-Dec-20 12:20 PM or writting that it has a tourbillon 18-Dec-20 12:20 PM like.. yeah - I know it has one 18-Dec-20 12:21 PM so this secret hobby of watchmaking 18-Dec-20 12:21 PM I'd be fine with a little thing saying 'made in ohio', or jus t'ohio'/'columbus' 18-Dec-20 12:21 PM doesn't even have a good documentary yet? 18-Dec-20 12:22 PM well.. George Daniels' book outlines near everything 18-Dec-20 12:22 PM it just misses the engineering math 18-Dec-20 12:22 PM My personal philosophy- mystery is part of the allure of connoisseurship. Having to state something on the watch tells someone looking at it that the wearer is too stupid to know otherwise unless someone writes it on the thing. 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM I even thought about hiding my last name (if that is to be the brand) at the start of the tahcymeter scale of a chrono.. no reason to relaly put it front and center 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM I don't wanna read a book I want to look at a beautiful macro photography gallery that shows many failed attempts followed by a success 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM There are many. Look up The Watchmaker's Apprentice. but even that is an extention of marketing to sell things 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM beyond brand recogniztion 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM heh, yeah it was 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM the info on it wasnt public 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM afaik 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM it was teaching one guy who was a .... teacher? at a swiss watch school 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM or a recent grad, I forget 18-Dec-20 12:23 PM he was in the industry already 18-Dec-20 12:24 PM I don't want to see big names though 18-Dec-20 12:24 PM If your work is unique, it needs no signature. Only vain people sign their work imho 18-Dec-20 12:24 PM I want someone doing it badly in their garage 18-Dec-20 12:24 PM I have no problem stamping it on a bridge, but that's really the extent I would showcase 18-Dec-20 12:25 PM If it needs signed, put it in only a place a watchmaker will see it. That gives them an honor they will carry through in their work to repair yours long after your death 18-Dec-20 12:25 PM right - and that brings me to another point.. weird ass screw heads 18-Dec-20 12:25 PM like that S shape from.. gutheir or howeveryou spell it? 18-Dec-20 12:26 PM Romaine 18-Dec-20 12:26 PM yes. 18-Dec-20 12:26 PM Vanity. 18-Dec-20 12:26 PM Nothing of value 18-Dec-20 12:26 PM "it allows more torque" ... dude, I cant even tell you how many screws I overtightened aand broke in school 18-Dec-20 12:27 PM Its all desperate to look different from daniels 18-Dec-20 12:27 PM and each other 18-Dec-20 12:27 PM yeah, you have to "One-Up" each other 18-Dec-20 12:27 PM so, being serviceable by any normal trained watchmaker is somewhat of a goal 18-Dec-20 12:28 PM And Daniels actively copied Breguet, in the hopes he would be considered similarly. Smart thinking honestly. But pitfalls with that too. 18-Dec-20 12:28 PM oh, yeah.. 18-Dec-20 12:28 PM have you read his memoirs? 18-Dec-20 12:28 PM All In Good Time 18-Dec-20 12:28 PM one of his copies sort of t hing was accepted by the then owner of the breguet name and was allowed to be badged as such 18-Dec-20 12:29 PM https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidgsteadman/albums/72157645045616955 I just wanna see photos like this but of the start-finish process of making one 18-Dec-20 12:29 PM https://journals.aps.org/prx/pdf/10.1103/PhysRevX.1.011002 and you'll never make a watch with as much precision as what we can do with lasers 18-Dec-20 12:30 PM there is a pretty big anti-cnc ethos 18-Dec-20 12:30 PM but even Roger Smith uses a Kern nowadays 18-Dec-20 12:30 PM I am a fan of engine turning, obviously, so I love the appeal of breguet & daniels, but yeah, it's hard ot push originality when you are so traditional 18-Dec-20 12:32 PM cnc + copying a design = is that really a project? cnc + your own novel design = shame on anyone who looks down on that. 18-Dec-20 12:32 PM well, people do 18-Dec-20 12:32 PM people get shamed for it 18-Dec-20 12:32 PM yeah shame on the shamers 18-Dec-20 12:32 PM but at the same time, if youo can make a watch on a bridgeport and not a hauser, then good for you! 18-Dec-20 12:32 PM I fall victim to the trap of vintage swiss/german watchmaking machinery all the time 18-Dec-20 12:32 PM but I know about it 18-Dec-20 12:34 PM Yes- but if he told Noone, its another company essentially saying, we will give you the honor of taking credit for your work. 18-Dec-20 12:34 PM I find fault with all of them. Even Daniels 18-Dec-20 12:34 PM And I admire all of them, especially Daniels 18-Dec-20 12:35 PM I admire, but I dont Idolize 18-Dec-20 12:36 PM @idmb Even copying an existing movement, but doing it well, is a pretty big challenge as someone with a fair amount of regular scale machining experience... but what Noxz wants to do is a level beyond that in challenge afaik 18-Dec-20 12:36 PM Whole lot of people who build clocks though if you want to watch videos of that haha 18-Dec-20 12:37 PM Oh for sure! that was specific to cnc vs non-cnc though 18-Dec-20 12:37 PM so, my first wwatch movement, after an original clock, will actually be largely based on the Longines 13ZN 18-Dec-20 12:37 PM There is a serious shaming against CNC in the industry, but most use it. Daniel's was an aberration Noone can follow. He was completely different in his approach to it than anyone doing it for money would normally follow. Most of it was with the idea of reputation behind it. 18-Dec-20 12:37 PM flyback chrono 18-Dec-20 12:37 PM moving your gears a few mm around doesnt make it all new or exciting 18-Dec-20 12:37 PM bagpipes are something else where cnc vc non-cnc is a major thing 18-Dec-20 12:37 PM there are two big companies and iirc one uses cnc and has for years, the other doesn't 18-Dec-20 12:38 PM doing something 'by hand' doesnt necessarily make you a better craftsman 18-Dec-20 12:38 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/20201122_003452-B222E.jpg 18-Dec-20 12:38 PM I'm pretty sure it took quite a while for people to accept CNC's for professional saxophone mouthpieces too 18-Dec-20 12:39 PM Horrible finish. My school watch project. 18-Dec-20 12:39 PM When they don't use CNCs... do they still at least draw the files up in CAD? 18-Dec-20 12:39 PM we hardly got far at all.. plus covid and whatnot made it so we couldn't even stay late 18-Dec-20 12:39 PM Though I guess that's a bit different because even with a CNC you don't have enough precision to really get it dead on without a craftsman who knows how to finish one 18-Dec-20 12:39 PM or is it only paper sketches? 18-Dec-20 12:39 PM I gave up trying and intentionally destroyed it underneath so that I would never be tempted to finish it when already subpar 18-Dec-20 12:40 PM CNC or not CNC seems like a pretty trivial distinction from my perspective with how much work goes into getting new programs running really well and consistently 18-Dec-20 12:40 PM I dont know enough behind the scenes of what people use.. daniels used pen and paper because personal computers werent really around then 18-Dec-20 12:40 PM It was a 6497. I decided I didn't want to copy the Swiss. I had better things to spend my time on. 18-Dec-20 12:41 PM part of his must master such and such (what does he call those, hrmmm) was to be able to make technical drawings 18-Dec-20 12:41 PM Daniels Method 18-Dec-20 12:41 PM He still enlisted others to do certain calculations for his work. Mainly for astronomical geartrains. 18-Dec-20 12:41 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/daniels_method-C2D71.txt 18-Dec-20 12:42 PM waterproofing (w) just dunk it in epoxy when you're done 18-Dec-20 12:42 PM copy-pasted-saved from a post somewhere, the guy actually reached out to roger and said: you removed them from your website, what were they 18-Dec-20 12:42 PM most industry work is done in Inventor or Solidworks. TellWatch software exists as well but noone uses it. too expensive and needlessly specialized 18-Dec-20 12:43 PM what about these elitist anti-cnc hobbyists? 18-Dec-20 12:43 PM do they use solidworks still? 18-Dec-20 12:43 PM I know engineers who don't use CAD. 18-Dec-20 12:43 PM like, working ones. 18-Dec-20 12:44 PM It's complicated 18-Dec-20 12:44 PM I never learned CAD yet.. I have like 20 years experience in 3dsmax though, since version 3.1 when it was still under Discreet 3d Studio Max 18-Dec-20 12:44 PM horologists feel they are less pure if a machine crafts the actual part rather than them. 18-Dec-20 12:44 PM I do not actively use it for design stuff though 18-Dec-20 12:44 PM minimally, at least 18-Dec-20 12:45 PM That's not exclusive to them... 18-Dec-20 12:45 PM It's a very common sentiment in man vs machine 18-Dec-20 12:46 PM it's not dimensional, it's for modeling/animation, thus why I dont try to use it much anymore 18-Dec-20 12:46 PM they want individuality but perfect fit as well. Because "craftsmanship" is more unarguably pure that way. something programmed can simply be recreated by another too easily, rendering the very value of anything created by it less valuable than otherwise before ever even made. 18-Dec-20 12:46 PM I don't intend to draw. I think best in CAD. 18-Dec-20 12:47 PM You can 100% use CAD to design things, print out dimensioned drawings, and work from those for manual machining 18-Dec-20 12:47 PM handmade items can be made by machinees too 18-Dec-20 12:47 PM I havent tried CAD enough to dislike it.. I recall spending a small amount of time in Inventor before dropping out of college 18-Dec-20 12:47 PM Sometimes I do that for one off parts 18-Dec-20 12:47 PM I feel that if Breguet were actually alive, he would be using it too 18-Dec-20 12:47 PM 15 years ago 18-Dec-20 12:47 PM heh, the post that had the daniels method basically had a thread about if computers were more prevalaent during the start then using cad would likely remove making tech drawings 18-Dec-20 12:48 PM the horologists of the day were only forced to hand create. Japy's mechanization helped start free them from this as the watch tool industry was formed 18-Dec-20 12:49 PM may be time for a dog walk.. 18-Dec-20 12:49 PM bbaib 18-Dec-20 12:49 PM CAD is a tool to show intent. It creates nothing on its own 18-Dec-20 12:49 PM uh 18-Dec-20 12:49 PM the "aided" part can actually give suggestions 18-Dec-20 12:49 PM CNC is giving the act of creation to a computer, guided by another. I can understand why some choose not to use it 18-Dec-20 12:50 PM CAD can definitely be extended to "something other than the user is helping guide the design" 18-Dec-20 12:50 PM Of course 18-Dec-20 12:50 PM Those suggestions are based upon constraints that you input 18-Dec-20 12:50 PM (but at the same time, CAD can just be used to digitize a design you make) 18-Dec-20 12:50 PM Gotta know what constraints you are working from to start 18-Dec-20 12:51 PM There's no reason predictive text like in messaging can't be extended to CAD 18-Dec-20 12:51 PM but in the end my intent is what I choose it to display. CNC is the same way. The only issue with cnc is that intent can be duplicated by another exactly the same at a simple button push 18-Dec-20 12:51 PM I make my living using CNC 18-Dec-20 12:51 PM I choose to make my watch by hand 18-Dec-20 12:52 PM just because something is handmade doesn't mean it can't be digitized and replicated all the same, you're just adding a barrier to it 18-Dec-20 12:52 PM I choose to design my intent with a display that I control, CAD 18-Dec-20 12:52 PM once the part is made, deleting all your CAD / CNC files... it doesn't matter that the part was handmade or CNC in terms of how easily it can be duplicated 18-Dec-20 12:53 PM But then its not handmade 18-Dec-20 12:53 PM its literally that line that some wish to have present in the physical object 18-Dec-20 12:53 PM anything can be copied, but it all comes down to where the guidance generates from 18-Dec-20 12:54 PM Just sounds like a made-up argument. "handmade has more value because it can't be replicated with a button press," well, neither can something CNC-made if you delete the file... 18-Dec-20 12:54 PM I never said it did 18-Dec-20 12:54 PM that's only what you assumed 18-Dec-20 12:54 PM something programmed can simply be recreated by another too easily, rendering the very value of anything created by it less valuable than otherwise before ever even made. 18-Dec-20 12:54 PM Whatever that means then, lol. 18-Dec-20 12:54 PM in the mind of others 18-Dec-20 12:54 PM to me, what I create is mine 18-Dec-20 12:55 PM perceived value, yeah 18-Dec-20 12:55 PM This made me wonder where the line gets drawn w/ gear cutting... is using a dividing head "handmade"? 18-Dec-20 12:56 PM Non cnc- all it is is an absolutely unassailable perception of hand made 18-Dec-20 12:56 PM after cnc enters, perception can be argued 18-Dec-20 12:57 PM why are power tools allowed? 18-Dec-20 12:57 PM they cheapen the labour 18-Dec-20 12:58 PM In the minds of some, it is because they are mindless on their own, the hand must guide their work 18-Dec-20 12:58 PM to be clear- 18-Dec-20 12:58 PM to be clear - every hobby is full of elitists 18-Dec-20 12:58 PM It would be kinda cool to see someone make a clock using all human powered tools 18-Dec-20 12:58 PM if I did choose to make a brand, I would use cnc. But the end intent is different 18-Dec-20 12:58 PM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pole_lathe <-- stuff like that 18-Dec-20 12:59 PM Never claimed to NOT be elitist 18-Dec-20 12:59 PM similarly, I'd love to see a clock scaled up so much you could just use shitty waterjet tolerances to make it 18-Dec-20 01:00 PM I just am what I choose. If I make a watch by hand, I make it for myself and myself only. Not for money, and my intent is for my own amusement. My intent is for my own appreciation utmost 18-Dec-20 01:00 PM You could probably do that in like a 10"/25cm diameter wall clock size if you used a decent waterjet 18-Dec-20 01:00 PM Doable 18-Dec-20 01:01 PM materials costs tho 18-Dec-20 01:02 PM escapement design is what really separates the hobbiest from the horologist. There's no fiction around to make it work correctly- it's pure geometry 18-Dec-20 01:02 PM Have a sheet of acrylic? I have seen that done before for wall clocks 18-Dec-20 01:02 PM I used to work near waterjet 18-Dec-20 01:02 PM Those were lasercut but waterjet would probably work 18-Dec-20 01:03 PM you'd have to account for the tapered walls to parts. I'd rather make a clock with huge wire EDM 18-Dec-20 01:03 PM yeah waterjet cuts are excpetionally low quality, it's fun 18-Dec-20 01:03 PM in 100 years, using CNC might be the same as using a good lathe to do it all now 18-Dec-20 01:04 PM I was thinking if you used like 1/8" acrylic sheet there would be enough meat to support things but not enough thickness to have enough taper for it to be an issue 18-Dec-20 01:04 PM TBH I think the hand tools / power tools jump was much bigger than manual tools / cnc 18-Dec-20 01:04 PM acrylic isn't lovely to waterjet 18-Dec-20 01:04 PM it doesn't usually crack 18-Dec-20 01:04 PM but... sometimes... 18-Dec-20 01:05 PM aluminum is another option but not nearly as cheap 18-Dec-20 01:05 PM the bigger the clock, the sloppier the tolerances can be. But to want to make a clock out of plastic- I used to be a plastics machinist. Its the same thing with 3d printer people- stop fucking around with inferior materials for your device. Make the frame of the printer out of metal, properly, and be done with it. If you need a clock, just use something that mirrors the importance of the end product. otherwise why bother. it won't last. Why waste time making toys that don't last? I don't understand people who waste effort like that for a whim. I have no idea why so many people go to 100x the trouble to do something with more difficulty than simply using the correct materials 18-Dec-20 01:05 PM But I get free acrylic sometimes...so I have a lot of it 18-Dec-20 01:05 PM Friends in the film/tv set business are great for that 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM I don't understand people who waste effort like that for a whim. 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM clearly someone doesn't appreciate the joy 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM of seeing just how badly you can do something and still have it work 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM I just don't think that way 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM it's the opposite of sense to me 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM I spent a lifetime learning how to make something that lasts- why play with designing poorly to see how little matters? 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM when someone uses plastic- to me that says convenience was primarily. Longevity is the afterthought. 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM And I know that among all the specialty plastics I've cut- there are times when it makes sense to use them, not metal. 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM An item with a specific purpose like a timepiece, something already unneeded in the normal world, why make it even less valid? 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM Like- I want a pocketwatch entirely made of sapphire inside- 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM (similar things have been done) 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM but only so it can last forever in the sea. 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM reflect your purpose and intent with your efforts and materials. 18-Dec-20 01:09 PM If it still makes no sense, if you aren't the sort that chooses to spend their life to seriously make a watch, why argue with how someone who does chooses to? It makes no sense. 18-Dec-20 01:37 PM gatekeeping gatekeeping 18-Dec-20 01:46 PM I'm not gatekeeping shit. I'm doing as I please 18-Dec-20 01:46 PM Feel free to make a clock out of plastic 18-Dec-20 01:46 PM it's about being romanticized about certain aspects.. and being a 'maker' with a 3d printer is not very romantic 18-Dec-20 01:47 PM If it still makes no sense, if you aren't the sort that chooses to spend their life to seriously make a watch, why argue with how someone who does chooses to? It makes no sense. 18-Dec-20 01:47 PM Just don't expect me, personally, to care much. Props if you make an interesting design, but otherwise, meh 18-Dec-20 01:47 PM honestly I think the thinking behind it just pisses people off 18-Dec-20 01:47 PM Because everything is so quickly made 18-Dec-20 01:49 PM if you engineered/designed something from start to finish and printed it out and it functioned. then okay - but dont expect the watch industry to look up to you for doing this. There are many articles ad naseum about this topic - it comes down to not being haute 18-Dec-20 01:50 PM exactly 18-Dec-20 01:50 PM There's a difference though 18-Dec-20 01:50 PM Haute or Not 18-Dec-20 01:50 PM between "don't expect the watch industry to look up to you" 18-Dec-20 01:50 PM and 18-Dec-20 01:50 PM And even that shit- its tiresome 18-Dec-20 01:50 PM "don't be surprised if watchmakers come after you without provocation, going out of their way to put your work down" 18-Dec-20 01:50 PM that's the problem with a lot of hobbies 18-Dec-20 01:51 PM it's a bunch of misplaced energy 18-Dec-20 01:51 PM Yeah 18-Dec-20 01:51 PM and everyone is a critic 18-Dec-20 01:51 PM misplaced worry on your part idmb 18-Dec-20 01:51 PM people go out of their way to criticize things because they don't fit their mold 18-Dec-20 01:51 PM Misplaced because watchmakers are special and one of the only hobbies that don't do that? 18-Dec-20 01:52 PM I'm doing what I want, because it's what I admire. You do what you want, I'm not entitled to anyone's respect, you're not entitled to mine 18-Dec-20 01:52 PM But like where does that statement even come from? 18-Dec-20 01:52 PM What... what have I said that makes you think I feel entitled to your respect? 18-Dec-20 01:52 PM I just don't like generalized statements about "X way is better than Y way for Z invalid reason" 18-Dec-20 01:55 PM I shared my own opinion of what I feel like with making how I see it, it conflicts with what many think. You took it to mean I don't care- it was just my take on materials and how I make. At this point you're just concern trolling. 18-Dec-20 01:55 PM I explained my feelings on why I do what I do 18-Dec-20 01:55 PM Noone needs a damn clock, or watch 18-Dec-20 01:55 PM it's not a practical thing anymore 18-Dec-20 01:56 PM Yeah, it's a cool showcase of skill 18-Dec-20 01:56 PM Basically 18-Dec-20 01:56 PM and people hold value to unique things 18-Dec-20 01:57 PM My thinking with it, it's already unnecessary, so why make it less viable? That's why I dislike the idea of plastic in timepiece 18-Dec-20 01:57 PM the same thinking can be "it's already unnecesary, why waste more time on it" 18-Dec-20 01:57 PM idk it's always going to be a personal thing 18-Dec-20 01:58 PM For me, the purpose behind bringing something unneeded into existence, if I must, it should reflect the difficulty in creating it. With materials that will last 18-Dec-20 01:58 PM that's why there aren't many like me 18-Dec-20 01:58 PM the same arguments can extend to "if you're gonna put a lot of effort into something, might as well do something people perceive as useful" 18-Dec-20 01:58 PM a personal thing 18-Dec-20 01:59 PM and at the same time, you seem to be fascinated by us. now why is that? Is it like going to a zoo with us? 18-Dec-20 01:59 PM I study stuff on the molecular level, I like seeing small stuff 18-Dec-20 02:00 PM if we are so interesting, why criticism? I don't go to the zoo and argue with the gorillas, I just appreciate them for what they are 18-Dec-20 02:00 PM I don't feel I've criticized anything other than attitudes. 18-Dec-20 02:00 PM and walk away when they shit, because it stinks 18-Dec-20 02:00 PM and I certainly haven't meant to 18-Dec-20 02:00 PM I like art, making tiny things is an awesome form of art 18-Dec-20 02:01 PM the traditional methodology of many watchmakers pisses off a lot of people 18-Dec-20 02:01 PM now- 18-Dec-20 02:01 PM imagine being a guy that pisses off OTHER WATCHMAKERS being the same way 18-Dec-20 02:01 PM Then you have George Daniel's! His thinking still pisses off many 18-Dec-20 02:02 PM you see the same ideas in most other types of art, synths aren't music... digitally manipulated photos aren't photography... 18-Dec-20 02:03 PM there is a company, HYT, that makes timepieces using water 18-Dec-20 02:03 PM im sure theyd piss off daniels 18-Dec-20 02:03 PM its still a timepiece 18-Dec-20 02:04 PM precision machining is just overall so cool. 18-Dec-20 02:04 PM it all comes down to intent and purpose 18-Dec-20 02:04 PM watchmakers tend to cherish both of those in a very personal way, that's something most don't hold the same way anymore. Perhaps they never did 18-Dec-20 02:05 PM the long video of someone making their own nixie tubes 18-Dec-20 02:05 PM I want that, but making a watch 18-Dec-20 02:06 PM the intent isnt to make something that tells the time 18-Dec-20 02:06 PM https://youtu.be/wxL4ElboiuA 18-Dec-20 02:06 PM because anyone can fulfill that need easily on their phone 18-Dec-20 02:06 PM its to crystalize an intent, an ethos, within a given guided purpose 18-Dec-20 02:06 PM that's what a watchmaker actually stives to achieve 18-Dec-20 02:06 PM Yeah- I've chatted with Dalbor 18-Dec-20 02:06 PM I love his work. Know it well 18-Dec-20 02:08 PM but you don't know any videos like that for making a watch? 18-Dec-20 02:09 PM You aren't going to learn in any single video how to make a nixie tube. 18-Dec-20 02:09 PM or all of them. 18-Dec-20 02:09 PM the video isn't titled 18-Dec-20 02:09 PM "how to make a nixie tube" 18-Dec-20 02:10 PM There's a ton of chemistry and hidden info you'll never see displayed on camera 18-Dec-20 02:10 PM same with a watch 18-Dec-20 02:10 PM it's just a how-it's-made aesthetic timelapse 18-Dec-20 02:10 PM but it's sequential, unlike a lot of "here's how complicated watches are!" videos 18-Dec-20 02:11 PM Theres plenty of that all over youtube 18-Dec-20 02:11 PM How it's made did one on DeWitt watches i remember 18-Dec-20 02:12 PM do you have a favourite? all I see are ~5-10 minute videos 18-Dec-20 02:13 PM Explain what you want to see. 18-Dec-20 02:14 PM as much as possible of the start-finish process, edited down so that while you see a bit of everything, you're not watching someone move in slow motion for 30 seconds straight doing something boring 18-Dec-20 02:14 PM Haha that'd be cool, buy a $50,000 watch and it comes with an edited DVD of them making your specific watch 18-Dec-20 02:14 PM just put it on your digital picture frame for ultimate elitism points 18-Dec-20 02:15 PM watchmakers aren't shallow enough to make something like that. well, I'm not 18-Dec-20 02:15 PM theres plenty of videos showing different parts of the process 18-Dec-20 02:15 PM if you simply want entertainment, go watch a marketing video 18-Dec-20 02:16 PM jesus lol 18-Dec-20 02:16 PM A bespoke watchmaker would probably never make what youre describing 18-Dec-20 02:16 PM well, you got to ask me 18-Dec-20 02:16 PM no true scotsman 18-Dec-20 02:16 PM I answered you 18-Dec-20 02:17 PM More on topic... you might enjoy the Clickspring videos but I have not really looked for other people doing similar things 18-Dec-20 02:17 PM what else do you want?:joy: 18-Dec-20 02:17 PM I dislike him 18-Dec-20 02:17 PM but for irrational reasons 18-Dec-20 02:17 PM Same 18-Dec-20 02:17 PM Mostly nitpicking crap 18-Dec-20 02:17 PM And personal stylistic things 18-Dec-20 02:17 PM I cannot argue with his results so far but that might be just lack of experience in the subject matter he deals with 18-Dec-20 02:18 PM I just don't like people who change other's image of me. 18-Dec-20 02:18 PM I don't have time to reverse engineer the Antikythera mechanism. I gotta pay bills. He somehow has time. Good for him. I'm glad the thing is understood more. 18-Dec-20 02:20 PM https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZioPDnFPNsETq9h35dgQq80Ryx-beOli this but for a small watch 18-Dec-20 02:20 PM on the other side I got people changing watch batteries using screwdrivers as prybars in the mall 18-Dec-20 02:20 PM Explaining to people where I lie on that is exhausting and annoying. 18-Dec-20 02:21 PM ok but with less talking 18-Dec-20 02:21 PM and more just showing 18-Dec-20 02:21 PM like the nixie tube video 18-Dec-20 02:22 PM I made about 1 search for that sort of thing in the past, the clickspring like watchmaking video, and was disappointed how it was almost all just people using already built movements or building those up from kits... No real original works...but if it is out there I would give it my attention for at least the video length if not longer 18-Dec-20 02:22 PM explaining my whole ethos behind why i try to make a watch, or why its so hard, what it actually requires me to know to do it, also exhausting. Because most who ask don't understand at all 18-Dec-20 02:22 PM people struggle with understanding why it's so hard? 18-Dec-20 02:23 PM hmm? not sure i understand your meaning 18-Dec-20 02:23 PM you just said you sometimes have to explain why it's so hard to make a watch 18-Dec-20 02:24 PM I think theyre saying the depth of the subject matter and skillset is hard to convey to people who otherwise have no concept of such things? 18-Dec-20 02:24 PM the reason- most watchmaking companies dont want to show that they use cnc- and disclose their tooling to competitors. 18-Dec-20 02:24 PM It is also very hard to film non CNC micromachining processes because the camera is right where you need to be 18-Dec-20 02:24 PM The others- not interested in making entertainment out of their work. 18-Dec-20 02:24 PM that too 18-Dec-20 02:24 PM I normally dont bother. Because there's too much to the explanation to follow. the escapement alone requires a ridiculous understanding of math, materials, and physics. 18-Dec-20 02:24 PM the explanation would take hours 18-Dec-20 02:27 PM I can't imagine what kind of person sees a photo of the inside of a watch and doesn't think "that looks really hard to make" 18-Dec-20 02:27 PM even if they're misguided 18-Dec-20 02:27 PM as to why it's so hard 18-Dec-20 02:27 PM I get a lot of the opposite 18-Dec-20 02:27 PM I get people asking me to make them a watch for a few hundred bucks 18-Dec-20 02:27 PM I don't even bother scoffing at them 18-Dec-20 02:28 PM I think there is a whole lot of people who go from 1) there are lots of watches 2) watches have been made for a long time 3) watches must be cheap and easy to make 18-Dec-20 02:28 PM just mail them a casio 18-Dec-20 02:28 PM It is total nonsense but that happens a lot 18-Dec-20 02:28 PM I think some people think a handmade watch is just a handmade enclosure for a commercial mechanism 18-Dec-20 02:28 PM Theres just a lot of shallow people in the world. 18-Dec-20 02:29 PM FCC has no regulatioon of what is handmade, last I checked 18-Dec-20 02:29 PM Probably the majority of people who sell "handmade" watches are doing that 18-Dec-20 02:29 PM labelling as such 18-Dec-20 02:29 PM If that much 18-Dec-20 02:29 PM all the more reason to include the DVD of the process in the box 18-Dec-20 02:29 PM They might just be doing some work on the dial or band 18-Dec-20 02:30 PM They wouldnt, they deal in radio waves 18-Dec-20 02:30 PM FTC? I may be mixing up my acronyms here 18-Dec-20 02:30 PM also I have a ham license, so it's kinda always in my head 18-Dec-20 02:31 PM ahh. yes, them, perhaps 18-Dec-20 02:31 PM oh cool 18-Dec-20 02:31 PM THIS. I'm sick of it. They're using the art of the trade for a quick buck. 18-Dec-20 02:31 PM They aren't making stuff that's intended to be fixed as much 18-Dec-20 02:31 PM They're selling an image that they aren't creating 18-Dec-20 02:31 PM If they were honest about it, I wouldnt care 18-Dec-20 02:31 PM people still would buy them. But they are trying to claim they are making a watch, they aren't making the damn watch. 18-Dec-20 02:46 PM awci does a similar "build a watch" program.. service a 6497 and put it in a case with a dial/hands of your choice 18-Dec-20 02:46 PM should it be like Build-A-Bear? meh 18-Dec-20 02:46 PM it exists... and will continue 18-Dec-20 02:46 PM so, yeah, beyoond venting, it's a lot of misguided energy 18-Dec-20 03:00 PM At least, with them, it's to build exposure to the trade 18-Dec-20 03:00 PM I've been on the bus at the last SF Bay Area Maker Faire in san mateo last year 18-Dec-20 03:00 PM yeah, its like build a bear 18-Dec-20 03:00 PM but with watches 18-Dec-20 03:00 PM I mean, I guess that's fine, so long as it's recognized what you have in the end 18-Dec-20 03:00 PM The real idea is to find people interested in learning watchmaking. 18-Dec-20 03:11 PM yeah, I understand it. Also, from what I read this past year, they shut the bus down? wasnt making enough money.. didnt they also ditch their president? 18-Dec-20 03:47 PM You aren't in the AWCI? Shame on you. 18-Dec-20 03:47 PM you should already know 18-Dec-20 03:47 PM I do stand by the AWCI generally. Someone has to speak for us. Or at least guys like you. 18-Dec-20 03:47 PM The bus has been shut down during the pandemic. It cost a lot. Jordan Ficklin stepped down. 18-Dec-20 03:47 PM Lots of drama behind the scenes. some I'm privy to, most not. 18-Dec-20 03:52 PM they gave us students a free year subscription, that's how I knew.. I dont recall if I am currently a member anymore? I am of the NAWCC though 18-Dec-20 03:52 PM I read about it somewhere though, maybe via email 18-Dec-20 03:52 PM Oi! just got a response back ( a bit delayed) about the rose engine 18-Dec-20 03:52 PM rosette closeup 18-Dec-20 03:52 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/IMG_0488-9C292.jpg 18-Dec-20 03:52 PM he says the snow is not quite that bad yet (canada), maybe in another month based on info from the locals - first winter there so meh 18-Dec-20 03:52 PM it's actually not too far from me, just no passport 18-Dec-20 03:52 PM and seems to be lighter than I was expecting, interesting 18-Dec-20 04:00 PM I let mine expire, and have no cash to play with. Of course, that's when I find all the cool shit. 18-Dec-20 04:00 PM If you're doing it professionally, you should be in the AWCI in my opinion. 18-Dec-20 04:01 PM yeah, well, it's more so: graduated 3 mo ago - sort of thing 18-Dec-20 04:01 PM I used to be NAWCC 18-Dec-20 04:01 PM I miss it 18-Dec-20 04:01 PM I dont need the physical mag, being a member is good enough 18-Dec-20 04:02 PM They actually created the Student With Publications membership for me. 18-Dec-20 04:02 PM didn't exist before me 18-Dec-20 04:03 PM was it half price or anything? 18-Dec-20 04:03 PM like, they just gave us a free year 18-Dec-20 04:03 PM Can't remember. was cheaper a little 18-Dec-20 04:03 PM NAWCC is half priced or so if student 18-Dec-20 04:03 PM we got same stuff as students 18-Dec-20 04:03 PM I renewed it as such, since I was as tudent for most of the year 18-Dec-20 04:03 PM Appears this rose engine originally came from steve white who restored it 18-Dec-20 04:03 PM but not the one david lindow restored a few years later 18-Dec-20 04:05 PM I want a MADE lathe. 18-Dec-20 04:05 PM which are the only two I know of from this maker 18-Dec-20 04:05 PM oh, yeah.. the 'M' (Mike Stacey) is in columbus ohio, so it would make getting a final delivery not too hard 18-Dec-20 04:05 PM he's also holding some automatic wheel & pinion cutters for me, that he got from the harmon estate, cleaned up one, then resold 18-Dec-20 04:05 PM I forget why, no time? 18-Dec-20 04:06 PM There was an old guy who bought an entire box full of gear cutters at Harmon- for like 300$ 18-Dec-20 04:06 PM he wants me to come get them sooner than later.. which means flying out 18-Dec-20 04:06 PM yeah, I kinda wish I knew what the stuff actually sold for, heh 18-Dec-20 04:06 PM I know I didnt pay much considering what they are 18-Dec-20 04:06 PM but that's also all relative 18-Dec-20 04:06 PM the individuals who want/need such a thing are too few to make them priced high 18-Dec-20 04:06 PM when CNC will do it just fine for mass production 18-Dec-20 04:08 PM Safrag automatic pinion and gear cutting machines went for like only 1k. I was in heaven but couldnt afford much 18-Dec-20 04:08 PM yeah, Safag, I paid 3k 18-Dec-20 04:08 PM so a little return for him, but not outlandish by me 18-Dec-20 04:08 PM that also included storage for a year+ so far 18-Dec-20 04:09 PM I wanted everything in the place 18-Dec-20 04:09 PM I am sure, I am sad it wasnt when I was actively pursueing machines and whatnot 18-Dec-20 04:11 PM If I hit the lottery, I'd start a master machine tool collection in Pittsburgh, and restart the defunct Western Pennsylvania Horilogical Institute, the largest school of watchmaking that has ever existed, and make an attached building just for American bespoke artisanal watchmakers to create, free of charge 18-Dec-20 04:11 PM It originally existed in my city, Pittsburgh. I have the original school escapement drawings 18-Dec-20 04:12 PM most of what I have obtained is through ebay.. I consider myself lucky in many situations that the interest isnt ridiculous, but still high enough 18-Dec-20 04:12 PM lots of lookers, fewer buyers 18-Dec-20 04:12 PM and I have been very aggressive, but I also saved up for many years in order to go to school and tool up 18-Dec-20 04:15 PM I search the world for tools. I can't afford serious ones lately. 18-Dec-20 04:15 PM student loan debt, etc. I scrape by. 18-Dec-20 04:16 PM I had student loans hanging over my head for so long after dropping out of college the first go at it 18-Dec-20 04:16 PM and they wont let you back till they are paid off! 18-Dec-20 04:16 PM Mainly I have no place to start a proper shop yet. I rent a small home. 18-Dec-20 04:18 PM oh, yeah, I've had fun trying to get tools in here 18-Dec-20 04:18 PM I think I spec'd out a workspace back in columbus upon the move.. I still have an art studio downtown and the owner kinda owns the entire block, and there is like a detached 3 car garage thing that owuld work well enough 18-Dec-20 04:42 PM So, in any case, I think I'll pm you from now on, I don't want to overwhelm a machining thread with general stuff. 18-Dec-20 04:44 PM Pretty dead in here most of the time anyway 18-Dec-20 04:49 PM I mean, ill post stuff others would find cool here too of course 19-Dec-20 09:33 AM a few other things to do today, plus maybe board games with a neighbor, otherwise I would finish rebuilding the tool&cutter grinder's spindle 19-Dec-20 09:44 AM Machining tools, techniques, failures and success are all awesome to see here. 19-Dec-20 09:45 AM yeah, we're not very picky 19-Dec-20 10:09 AM On the watch subject, was checking out some of the people I subscribe to on youtube and came across this guy's name again: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTiPNqeMS8E 19-Dec-20 10:09 AM Could be more actual footage of making parts but it is still really well done 19-Dec-20 10:14 AM Yes- that is a fantastic video. @imdb that might be your bag 19-Dec-20 10:14 AM I saw that a while ago. I speak Japanese so I understood parts that weren't translated 19-Dec-20 10:14 AM I lived in Sapporo for nearly 2 years, I'd love to meet him. I love his work 19-Dec-20 10:14 AM I especially loved to finally see the mechanism of his wandering hours in that, it even showed flaws as he worked and him fixing them. 19-Dec-20 10:29 AM His youtube channel has some shorter clips but nothing as in depth as that NHK video https://www.youtube.com/user/MasahiroKIKUNO/videos 19-Dec-20 10:36 AM From what i understand, its not actually him 19-Dec-20 10:36 AM its someone that does it for/in interest of him 19-Dec-20 10:36 AM Really shows what you can do with a pantograph mill 19-Dec-20 11:09 AM Ah if that is the case the lack of any more at length footage makes sense 19-Dec-20 11:29 AM cool video 19-Dec-20 11:29 AM I am more into the making parts than the mistique / backstory 19-Dec-20 08:00 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Stuck one of those cheap little usb microscopes on a noga arm. Pretty convenient. 19-Dec-20 08:00 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-BFBD2.jpg 19-Dec-20 08:06 PM the real question- what the hell is that for a mag base? im curious 19-Dec-20 08:06 PM good idea though 19-Dec-20 09:09 PM @Ophiuchus What kind of CNC are you looking into?... 19-Dec-20 09:09 PM having watched someone iterate through like four designs, without seeking feedback and just trying to learn for himself... all I can say is it would be a lot faster if he sought feedback before building 19-Dec-20 09:17 PM To be honest, I'm not fully sure yet. But, if I make it, it needs to be insanely accurate or theres no point to me. 19-Dec-20 09:17 PM Electrical stuff is my great weakness, but I can do basic stuff. 19-Dec-20 09:17 PM Initial idea- something desktop, made from custom iron castings, bt 30 spindle. I'd love to do something insane like hydrostatic ways (ala Kern). Some people here who work with high pressure fluid pumps may have an idea. 19-Dec-20 09:17 PM I cast iron for fun occasionally too with a group of artist iron casters and a blast furnace, so custom castings are not crazy to me. Very doable. 19-Dec-20 09:17 PM 1 ft cube machine area or so. 19-Dec-20 09:28 PM Tiny + precise, fun 19-Dec-20 09:28 PM Gantry design 19-Dec-20 09:28 PM Think Prusa. But iron. 19-Dec-20 09:28 PM Basically, a micro Vulcan mill 19-Dec-20 09:28 PM The person I know was doing the opposite, they wanted a massive cutting area. Copying a haas mold maker 19-Dec-20 09:29 PM Would be mainly for watch and toolmaking 19-Dec-20 09:29 PM absolute rigidity & precision at all costs. 19-Dec-20 09:29 PM No compromises. No bullshit. No plastic. Likely a spindle cartridge design. 19-Dec-20 09:31 PM no 8020 19-Dec-20 09:32 PM No. Full stop. 19-Dec-20 09:32 PM Probably a matrix plate bed of tapped holes for speedlocs & pins, for various jig plates, and vacuum plates. Used to regularly run parts on a metal vacuum table. Want that back on this. 19-Dec-20 09:32 PM Is this practical or useful to anyone but me? Possibly. 19-Dec-20 09:44 PM vacuum tables are neat 19-Dec-20 09:44 PM actually - if you're doing watches, isn't 1 ft^3 huge? 19-Dec-20 09:45 PM Yeah it would be super neat to see what design you want to go with! I've always wanted an epoxy concrete CNC mill, not super precise (still using ball screws of questionable quality) but quite rigid. I built the Z-axis for it nearly a year ago, and I would want to start working on it again 19-Dec-20 09:45 PM My ideal mill also has about 1 ft^3 working area 19-Dec-20 09:47 PM I just want someone to make a miniature version of their mill with the mcmaster 1mm linear rails 19-Dec-20 09:47 PM And that is pretty huge, something that will probably weigh in at around 250 lb or so just for the base 19-Dec-20 09:47 PM and have it tethered 19-Dec-20 09:47 PM so the baby mill copies the big mill 19-Dec-20 09:59 PM reminds me a little of: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kB8LH_MOZcc 19-Dec-20 09:59 PM once I get the grinder going I'll explore some of the hydro spindle designs I've been looking into, the 20 micron gap should be simple to hit 19-Dec-20 10:09 PM 1 cubic foot would be about right for fitting in a small dividing head inside the work space and things like that on a small CNC milling center 19-Dec-20 10:13 PM the Tornos Swiss Nano is a nice example of what you can do in tiny space.. without a 12ft bar loader, that is 19-Dec-20 10:13 PM it hasa bit of business behind the working envelop, but still 19-Dec-20 10:13 PM you can certainly have auxillaries in a cabinet beneath a machine, if what is desired is a 300x300x300 working envelope 19-Dec-20 10:13 PM vs total size 19-Dec-20 10:13 PM for instance it was mentioned hydrostatic rails, and thus a pump + resevoir are needed 19-Dec-20 10:32 PM And 1 cubic foot is sort of the minimum size to have a 6" vise on the mill 19-Dec-20 10:32 PM I picked up an old 6" vise that needs to be rebuilt and cleaned up, but admittedly for any work done at home, 4" is more than enough 19-Dec-20 10:38 PM How would you fit a 6" vise in a mill with 1 cubic foot of work envelope? 19-Dec-20 10:38 PM The one I have is more than 12" in the longest dimension by a decent amount + the space necessary for a tool to run the jaws in and out 19-Dec-20 10:55 PM I define working envelope as the range a tool can actually reach on a mill 19-Dec-20 10:55 PM You don't need the spindle to reach all the way to the tip of both ends of the vise on something like a Bridgeport for example 19-Dec-20 10:55 PM You can comfortably mount a 6" vise on a mill that can't travel more than 12" in Y, although the base might not be completely supported 19-Dec-20 10:55 PM On a gantry style mill, since you have the bed moving in Y, even though the working envelope might be 12", the total length of that particular axis would have to be at least 12" + the length of the bed (at least 12") 19-Dec-20 11:02 PM Yeah I was just wondering how you were thinking of positioning things so that you could operate the vise without running into the frame/bed/electronics on something with such a small frame 19-Dec-20 11:04 PM The frame is certainly going to be quite a bit longer than 12", I am planning a machine that would be at least 3' long, and getting linear rails that are 950 mm in length for the Y axis 19-Dec-20 11:04 PM For something on that scale a fixture plate/vacuum fixturing system would make more sense than a vise imo but that also depends a lot on what you plan to be doing 19-Dec-20 11:04 PM The 1 cubic foot work volume i mean 19-Dec-20 11:07 PM If I'm building the machine to have good rigidity, stability and precision, it means I want to cut steel or at least take decent sized cuts in aluminum. In that case, the weakest link might not be the spindle or the linear motion system, it may well be the fixture. Vacuum would be too weak for most parts, and it takes time to set up the fixture plate for taller parts 19-Dec-20 11:07 PM So I guess I'm most likely going with a compromise, a cast aluminum T-slot bed that can be easily drilled and tapped, and you can put a vise on it as well. Whether that be a 6", 4" or even a small screwless grinding vise 19-Dec-20 11:07 PM I'm also thinking about building part of the machine into an existing table/workbench 19-Dec-20 11:07 PM Like using the drawers for the electronics, and since I'm planning to build this on a thick wooden bench, I'd make room for studs and drill the appropriate mounting holes to bolt the whole thing down on its Airy points 19-Dec-20 11:07 PM Might not be a good idea in the long term in terms of maintenance/cleaning under the machine, but if I'm not running loads of coolant through, hopefully it won't be too big of an issue 20-Dec-20 12:52 PM Phone died last night. Yeah- modular vac plate was what I was thinking. Not hard to make at all. 20-Dec-20 12:52 PM Metal vac table was basically just a 2" thick block of aluminum with a 1" sq groove grid on it, with shallow ball milled pattern across middles of squares to increase vac holddown area. in middle of squares, 1/8" NPT brass setscrews block drilled passages to vaccum. Where those come out of plate, black iron pipe connected to oil filled Wikai vac gauge, and ball handles to break vaccuum. Vac pump connected with wire wrapped core vac line 20-Dec-20 12:52 PM Only for parts that lend themselves to difficult workholding. 20-Dec-20 01:05 PM If you get creative you can make 3 dimensional vacuum fixtures for difficult to hold Parts as well the fixture channels the vacuum from the table to the part through the fixture and they all get sucked down equally 20-Dec-20 01:05 PM If you get very creative you can do this with 5-axis fixtures as well 20-Dec-20 01:44 PM Don't you dare leave us out, bitch. 20-Dec-20 01:49 PM wouldn't think of it 20-Dec-20 01:49 PM just didn't want to monopolize a channel with personal conversation 20-Dec-20 01:57 PM open information best information 20-Dec-20 01:58 PM There is no personal here, only us. /Comunist rabbit meme/ 20-Dec-20 02:01 PM glad my group is very into arxiv 20-Dec-20 05:08 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> @Ophiuchus have you repaired bore gages? 20-Dec-20 05:08 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I’m curious how the anvils are manufactured 20-Dec-20 05:08 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Especially the inside steps. 20-Dec-20 05:08 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> The outside surface I’m thinking could be lapped in situ but I’m very worried about rounding them the wrong way since the lap would be unsupported for much of its width. 20-Dec-20 05:08 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I think the outside surfaces are doable but the inside steps are a bit elusive to me. 20-Dec-20 05:22 PM ? pics? 20-Dec-20 05:22 PM I've done instrument repair before 20-Dec-20 05:22 PM I don't think I've done a bore gage, but I'd need to see what type you're referring to 20-Dec-20 05:33 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-6BA40.jpg 20-Dec-20 05:38 PM Oh a tri mic 20-Dec-20 05:38 PM tri point bore mic 20-Dec-20 05:38 PM Outside would be lapped by setting into a ring, and lapped to minimum od. Inner- Im not sure. I've never seen the inside form. I could figure it out if I did. 20-Dec-20 06:12 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-4D25A.jpg 20-Dec-20 06:12 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-1D4AD.jpg 20-Dec-20 06:35 PM But what contacts those? They may be artifices of a workholding op. 20-Dec-20 07:23 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> A cone with steps 20-Dec-20 07:23 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Each step nests in a step on the anvil 20-Dec-20 07:23 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> It’s like a scroll kinda 20-Dec-20 07:31 PM My guess is those were cut in a special fixture first, using the keyway as a fixturing groove. Then they were turned in a fixture for od arc, and lapped to radius, perhaps lapped to a ring gage. 20-Dec-20 07:31 PM Not hard just time consuming 20-Dec-20 07:38 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> They’re definitely hardened 20-Dec-20 07:38 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> So maybe OD ground? 20-Dec-20 07:39 PM Ground and lapped, yeah. 20-Dec-20 07:39 PM So if I actually walk through it 20-Dec-20 07:39 PM (many ways it could be done) 20-Dec-20 07:39 PM If it were me, start with centerless ground round prehardened stock, hard mill slot, place in jig, hard mill steps. Grind steps to finish dimms. Place in fixture, cylindrically grind to near finish, lap to finish in hardened gage ring. 20-Dec-20 07:46 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> It’s grinding the steps I don’t understand 20-Dec-20 07:46 PM A step in there to do those holes in the slots might change things. 20-Dec-20 07:46 PM They might be finely milled steps, but I'd bet they were ground to get smoothness of action during measuring. 20-Dec-20 07:46 PM Hard to tell without seeing mating cone and feeling how they interact. just going off what i see 20-Dec-20 07:47 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Yeah the finish looks ground. 20-Dec-20 07:47 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-18C58.jpg 20-Dec-20 07:51 PM yeah- those steps might be slightly different lengths from od tips- looks like theres a spiral cone to force them out. Makes sense theyd be ground for smoothness of movement. Never taken one apart to inspect 20-Dec-20 07:51 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I just wouldn’t know how to grind the steps in 20-Dec-20 07:51 PM that creates smooth constant keyed action 20-Dec-20 07:51 PM easy to do that 20-Dec-20 07:51 PM V block on mag chuck, clamp on top in slot to orient. Grind across. simple 20-Dec-20 07:51 PM dead simple 20-Dec-20 07:53 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> So I don’t have a ton of experience grinding. How do you account for the wheel wearing? 20-Dec-20 07:53 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Do you wanna grind into the step or away? 20-Dec-20 07:53 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Or top down? Probably not top down.. 20-Dec-20 07:54 PM you'd rough with mill first. they look straight across, thankfully not curved steps. 20-Dec-20 07:54 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> And is the top slide precise enough? I worry about grinding into an inside corner. 20-Dec-20 07:54 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Oh sure. 20-Dec-20 07:54 PM top slide? 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> On a grinder. The y axis. 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I usually think of the up and down being the precise axis. 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM If it were me, i'd inspect the grind lines to see where the arc is, but I'd just grind straight down and carefully step over. 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM You could do it vertically, sure, but no guarantee it would have slot exactly in line with axis that way 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM Like I said, multiple ways to do it. 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM Accounting for wear is advanced in grinding, can't explain how I do that. Experience. 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM I'm not super advanced in grinding, but I've done plenty 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM measure 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM rough grind, then touch off a known spot after redressing, then move to final dimensions, leaving 0.0005 or so for finish. 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM I finish at 0.0002" typically. Depends on what im doing. 20-Dec-20 07:55 PM then sparkout pass 20-Dec-20 08:00 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Well it’s just reminding a lot of material with just the corner 20-Dec-20 08:00 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Of the wheel 20-Dec-20 08:00 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Meaning I’ll never get all those corners nice and square 20-Dec-20 08:00 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Inside corners 20-Dec-20 08:00 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Or maybe I’m not understanding 20-Dec-20 08:02 PM It may have been done with a ram edm electrode, maybe even wire, youd need to look at it under a microscope to inspect the tooling marks. That will tell you how they did it. 20-Dec-20 08:02 PM yeah- you use a fine grit wheel. The do use special wheels in grinding, say, 0.001" diameter endmills, for example. 20-Dec-20 08:03 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/image0-81B21.png 20-Dec-20 08:03 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Ok ok that makes sense 20-Dec-20 08:03 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Really need to build myself an edm 20-Dec-20 08:04 PM https://youtu.be/gRsNvbbP2Ag 20-Dec-20 08:04 PM See 21:18 here. Harvey specializes in microtooling. They make a 0.001" dia 2 flute endmill. It's ground using special cnc and special wheels. Sharp corners are possible but difficult 20-Dec-20 08:06 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Ahhhh ok now I get what you’re saying 20-Dec-20 08:06 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> That’s a good point 20-Dec-20 08:09 PM Id kill for desktop wire edm. Someone from MIT made one, but its a one off. 20-Dec-20 08:09 PM https://baxedm.com/ 20-Dec-20 08:09 PM If you wanna do it, that's probably where you start 20-Dec-20 08:13 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I’m at mit! Maybe it’s lying around somewhere... 20-Dec-20 08:14 PM find @BestFleet and ask him how his turbo's doing 20-Dec-20 08:14 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> Hehe 20-Dec-20 08:20 PM actually - what was the company that made those teeny tiny turbopumps? I wonder how fancy a diy pump would have to be before it would rival watchmaking 20-Dec-20 09:18 PM imma have to find that project now. I desperately wanted to talk with the guy. 20-Dec-20 10:31 PM Is there some sort of handheld EDM? I need to remove a hardened bolt that broke off in a threaded hole, and no drill bits have thus far been effective 20-Dec-20 10:33 PM Sinker EDM is possible in sorta portable units for removing taps/bolts 20-Dec-20 10:33 PM Similar idea to mag drills where there is a base and then you gotta flood it with water the whole time I think? 20-Dec-20 10:38 PM Thank you for my next patent 20-Dec-20 10:38 PM There are a few ways of dealing with that 20-Dec-20 10:39 PM Hmm, yeah I was considering that the water may be needed just to prevent a bridge from being formed 20-Dec-20 10:39 PM I did similar work all the time in die shop without using my edm 20-Dec-20 10:39 PM Hmm, I'm all ears 20-Dec-20 10:40 PM Mag drill is useful 20-Dec-20 10:40 PM But how big is it? 20-Dec-20 10:40 PM Can you move it to a mill? 20-Dec-20 10:41 PM It's on the back of my motorcycle, behind the seat 20-Dec-20 10:41 PM First- soak with PB Blaster, then let sit. 20-Dec-20 10:41 PM Mostly tubular framing around it 20-Dec-20 10:41 PM It's been broken for probably 2 years or more 20-Dec-20 10:42 PM Then use hardened spike punch and brass hammer to tap it out 20-Dec-20 10:42 PM Pretty sure I've soaked it well with wd40 20-Dec-20 10:42 PM WD40 Is shit 20-Dec-20 10:42 PM Huh, I thought pb was the generic brand 20-Dec-20 10:42 PM PB Blaster- or even better is RGS 20-Dec-20 10:42 PM Really Good Shit 20-Dec-20 10:42 PM Yes, that is actually the real name. 20-Dec-20 10:43 PM Looks like a mag drill is $115 per day rental 20-Dec-20 10:43 PM I've also considered just taking the bike to a mechanic 20-Dec-20 10:43 PM I'd guess they might just cut off the nut that the bolt is broken into and weld a new one on 20-Dec-20 10:44 PM This is real. 20-Dec-20 10:44 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/16085330371207185830847398938537-13E23.jpg 20-Dec-20 10:44 PM I'd do it, but I don't want to mess it up any more... And I really think I need to sell the bike cause I don't ride after becoming a father 20-Dec-20 10:44 PM CRC makes it I think. I get it at CoolSpring Power Museum. 20-Dec-20 10:44 PM Kroil is supposed to be good too. But PB Blaster is best normal stuff you can get. 20-Dec-20 10:44 PM Actually, just post a pic here. There's always a way man. Easiest way is plunge milling with a 4 flute bull endmill. 20-Dec-20 10:46 PM Huh that's pretty close to PGH, too bad I never went there as a kid 20-Dec-20 10:47 PM That stuff above is a joke name- but it's actually what's on the can, and it really is incredibly good shit 20-Dec-20 10:47 PM anyway I got to get some sleep I'll check back tomorrow 20-Dec-20 11:19 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/PXL_20201221_070238637-E827F.jpg 20-Dec-20 11:19 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/PXL_20201221_070243556-96EB0.jpg 20-Dec-20 11:19 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/PXL_20201221_070255649-09D6C.jpg 20-Dec-20 11:19 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/PXL_20201221_070309382-D067C.jpg 20-Dec-20 11:19 PM Vacuum%20Hackers%20-%20Text%20Channels%20-%20machining%20%5B522196190347919363%5D.html_Files/PXL_20201221_070329692-4FB2A.jpg 21-Dec-20 07:29 AM If its big enough, weld a small bolt on top and wratchet out 21-Dec-20 07:29 AM Honestly, if none of that worked, carbide burr in a rotary tool- hollow out middle as much as you can to weaken, then use an easy out. 21-Dec-20 07:29 AM That takes a while- but it works. 21-Dec-20 07:29 AM Found him. Will Langford. http://fab.cba.mit.edu/classes/865.15/people/will.langford/11_final/index.html 21-Dec-20 10:06 AM neat, I enjoy seeing things like that 21-Dec-20 10:21 AM No stub sticking up to weld to. Can I just search Amazon for carbide burr? 21-Dec-20 10:25 AM I meant you would just weld down in the hole carefully. you would have to be a skilled welder 21-Dec-20 10:25 AM Have you tried just tapping it out with a punch at an angle as I suggested? You would be surprised that actually works 21-Dec-20 10:25 AM if you do go to the carbide burr route, get a small pointed one. If you can just break through the hardened area at the top you may be able to sink a drill straight through that with cutting fluid and then use an easy out 21-Dec-20 10:32 AM I've tried drilling, and also using a diamond grinding tool on a Dremel 21-Dec-20 10:32 AM It's really a small bolt, I'm not sure I could weld a substantial bolt onto it given the break location 21-Dec-20 10:32 AM It's actually a broken easy out 21-Dec-20 10:42 AM See- that's something you didnt mention. That changes things. 21-Dec-20 10:42 AM those are a lot harder than a bolt 21-Dec-20 10:42 AM You can't use an easy out on that, it won't bite. 21-Dec-20 10:42 AM https://www.mscdirect.com/product/details/77215622 21-Dec-20 10:42 AM Try one of those. Expensive- but I've used one. They work. 21-Dec-20 10:42 AM A guy near me invented them they have very interesting geometry 21-Dec-20 10:57 AM If you are careful you should be able to use that in a hand drill 21-Dec-20 10:57 AM Use cutting fluid 21-Dec-20 11:15 AM If it is an easy out you may be able to shatter it with a punch as I think was suggested before 21-Dec-20 11:34 AM That's possible, yes, but there is also a risk of destroying the hole threads 21-Dec-20 11:34 AM Honestly, if it were me, I'd split it with a cutoff wheel, and put a weld nut or something in place if I really couldnt get it out. even just split, remove, weld together, and retap 21-Dec-20 01:57 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> what's the surface you're supposed to stick sandpaper and lap on? 21-Dec-20 01:57 PM <𝓕ermion#6024> I understand you're not supposed to do that on a surface plate. 21-Dec-20 02:11 PM You can do it on a surface plate but just try to make sure it is not a nice one 21-Dec-20 02:14 PM A fairly thick glass plate (like those used for 3D printers) should work too for hand lapping 21-Dec-20 02:22 PM Get a shitty surface plate, use a diamond core drill, slug out some holes for threaded inserts. use strap clamps on them to hold down sandpaper using metal strapping on edges. 21-Dec-20 02:22 PM I lap small parts on tin float glass using 3m adhesive backed micron paper too, for watchmaking stuff 21-Dec-20 02:25 PM How about lapping films with PSA? 21-Dec-20 02:25 PM I think they are very convenient, but I never had to hand lap to get the precision, it was always just for surface finish