| --- Log opened Wed Apr 18 00:00:40 2012 | ||
| lichen | kanzure: cool cool :) | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| diginet | well | 00:01 |
| diginet | hmm | 00:01 |
| diginet | I really want to make this stuff though | 00:01 |
| yashgaroth | well there's several other syntheses so | 00:03 |
| diginet | of what? dibromoindigo? I know but the other two I've seen either require silver as a catalyst, or the paper is just unintelligibly written | 00:05 |
| yashgaroth | catalyst means you don't need a lot | 00:06 |
| diginet | I know, but silver acetate is expensive | 00:06 |
| yashgaroth | 5 grams $32.70 | 00:07 |
| diginet | from where? | 00:07 |
| yashgaroth | sigma | 00:08 |
| diginet | I assume I should be able to reuse it? | 00:08 |
| yashgaroth | no | 00:08 |
| diginet | oh, darn | 00:09 |
| diginet | well, can you take a quick look at the paper which describes the process, but that I can't understand? Because that one shows the most promise, but I swear the writing is impenetrable | 00:10 |
| yashgaroth | sure but I don't have access | 00:10 |
| diginet | I know I'm uploading it to dropbox | 00:10 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: i posted the thread, http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?p=3871045 | 00:12 |
| diginet | yashgaroth, here you go: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/58318055/tyrian.pdf | 00:13 |
| yashgaroth | this isn't the one with silver | 00:15 |
| diginet | I know | 00:16 |
| diginet | this is the one without silver that seemed promising | 00:16 |
| nmz787 | i would investigate the biosynthetic route | 00:16 |
| nmz787 | IMO GMO is cooler, less FBI in your ass | 00:16 |
| diginet | the silver one is too expensive to make any useful quantities | 00:16 |
| * yashgaroth echoes nmz787's sentiment | 00:16 | |
| diginet | what is the biosynthetic route? | 00:17 |
| nmz787 | secretion from snails | 00:17 |
| nmz787 | says it on second page | 00:17 |
| diginet | so, where am I supposed to get 12000 snails? | 00:17 |
| diginet | and that makes 1 gram | 00:17 |
| nmz787 | that means its either good to get outta the cell on its own, or has a transporter, or is shuttled through golgi or something to get into a vesicle | 00:18 |
| nmz787 | nah | 00:18 |
| nmz787 | clone/synthetic DNA | 00:18 |
| diginet | oh, right | 00:18 |
| yashgaroth | find the biosynthetic pathway | 00:18 |
| nmz787 | :P | 00:18 |
| diginet | well, I did read a paper on brominated precursors in petunias | 00:18 |
| nmz787 | find the snail, see what genes have been discovered... get 10 snails, grind up their feet or slime makers, get that sequenced (or see if its already sequenced) | 00:19 |
| nmz787 | often special compounds genes are in a locus, an area of the DNA where all required genes reside | 00:19 |
| nmz787 | but yeah, if you're no chemist, you're likely just as worth a synthetic biologist | 00:20 |
| diginet | I don't think it's nearly that simple | 00:21 |
| diginet | the biosynthetic pathway is very complicated and involves the interaction of several different types of cells | 00:21 |
| diginet | I don't think a single enzyme manufactures it | 00:21 |
| yashgaroth | of course not | 00:21 |
| diginet | so, making an artificial hypobrachial gland doesn't seem in anyway easier than direct synthesis | 00:22 |
| nmz787 | http://www.bio.purdue.edu/people/faculty/karcher/blue2000/blue.html | 00:23 |
| nmz787 | dibromoindigo from x-gluc and glucuronic acid via GUS | 00:23 |
| diginet | no, that's dibromodichloroindigo | 00:24 |
| diginet | and it's 5,5' | 00:24 |
| diginet | different isomer | 00:24 |
| nmz787 | :/ | 00:25 |
| nmz787 | pretty close | 00:25 |
| diginet | except a completely different color | 00:25 |
| nmz787 | the enzyme GUS might work on the other precursor | 00:26 |
| diginet | urgh that paper I sent yashgaroth pisses me off so much, the authors mention this "superior" method of synthesis, and then it's never brough up again | 00:26 |
| nmz787 | anyway | 00:27 |
| nmz787 | g2g sleep | 00:27 |
| diginet | whoever wrote that should be shot, I have probably tried to read it like 10 times | 00:27 |
| nmz787 | ttyl ppls | 00:27 |
| diginet | bye | 00:27 |
| nmz787 | find out what the molecule would be called if you cut the purple in half | 00:28 |
| nmz787 | let me know, i'll try to dig up more info on biosynth | 00:28 |
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| diginet | so get this, an IGEM team is working on this very project | 00:29 |
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| thylaneb | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJRzlhnQhdA&feature=related | 01:33 |
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| sylph_mako | What.. This is nuts http://www.kurzweilai.net/fullerene-c60-administration-doubles-rat-lifespan-with-no-toxicity | 04:26 |
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| sylph_mako | NUTS. Great but like.. what? Eating fullerines? That's all there is to it? | 04:27 |
| fenn | look at the comments.. they only had 6 rats | 04:28 |
| sylph_mako | uuugh | 04:29 |
| fenn | oh sorry, 60 rats | 04:30 |
| fenn | i guess they liked the number | 04:32 |
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| kanzure | heh yep i was right | 07:24 |
| kanzure | "I presume you got the information from Joseph Jackson. I'm not sure what you know about the used equipment business. Forgive me if I state the obvious. Today is not good for a visit." | 07:24 |
| kanzure | "The items that interest you have been bid in a package in excess of $150K" | 07:24 |
| kanzure | "If the deposit arrives, this is a done deal." | 07:24 |
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| kanzure | "Please join us for the FBI-DIYbio Workshop hosted by BioCurious and the FBI, June 12-14, 2012 in Mountain View, California." | 07:26 |
| kanzure | "This three day event will focus on the interface of amateur biology and law enforcement, community laboratory issues, and dual-use research. It will include presentations by representatives of the amateur biology and law enforcement communities." | 07:26 |
| kanzure | "The event will involve two days of presentations and interactive activities at NASA Ames Conference Center in Mountain View, CA and one day of laboratory activities at the BioCurious community laboratory in Sunnyvale, CA." | 07:26 |
| kanzure | "Lodging will be provided at the Hilton Garden Inn in Cupertino, California." | 07:27 |
| kanzure | nmz787: no i meant did you post the physicsforum thing | 07:28 |
| kanzure | jennicide: non-euclidean isn't exactly my specialty, but what's up? | 07:28 |
| kanzure | aha http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?p=3871045 | 07:29 |
| jennicide | essay was submitted | 07:29 |
| jennicide | but thanks | 07:29 |
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| diginet | non-euclidian is awesome | 07:55 |
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| nmz787 | kanzure: right about? | 08:09 |
| nmz787 | did my gf send you her resume? i | 08:09 |
| kanzure | nope | 08:09 |
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| nmz787 | 165 views on my post, 0 replies .... i guess its still early | 08:18 |
| nmz787 | this forum seems pretty active though | 08:18 |
| nmz787 | i posted in a bunch of the bio threads... omre activity than diybio | 08:18 |
| nmz787 | back to class... | 08:18 |
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| Cat4D | now that im out of the picture: http://hvo.wr.usgs.gov/cams/panorama.php?cam=R2cam | 08:40 |
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| kanzure | geneforge colloseum ... gary mccleleun... serpentine bio? sold their legs to geneforge? | 09:39 |
| kanzure | kaufman 192 (not commercially available- contracted with something- modified vesion for Azco to sell in China) | 09:40 |
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| kanzure | biolytics in freemont - he makes the blt 192, 384... dr. oligo | 09:40 |
| kanzure | GE AKTA | 09:40 |
| kanzure | japanese have some | 09:40 |
| kanzure | oligo company - spinoff of Blue Heron - gen9bio - | 09:40 |
| kanzure | shoemaucker.. mermaid .. jeff shoemaucker - bioautomation in austin? | 09:40 |
| kanzure | chinese have some | 09:40 |
| kanzure | dna is after-market or custom design. Illumina has their own oligo maker design. | 09:40 |
| kanzure | olligator.. biosearch in nevada. their own design. | 09:40 |
| kanzure | operon has their own design | 09:40 |
| kanzure | metavine has their own | 09:40 |
| kanzure | something in denmark ... oligomaker | 09:40 |
| kanzure | bioautomation / mermaider | 09:40 |
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| delinquentme | DNA synthesis projects? | 09:41 |
| kanzure | just companies. | 09:41 |
| kanzure | hahah 3d printed aquarium pieces | 09:43 |
| kanzure | that's quite a niche. | 09:43 |
| kanzure | fenn: so apparently azco biotech bought everything up | 09:46 |
| kanzure | 3d printed aquarium pieces: http://www.advancedaquarist.com/blog/could-your-next-protein-skimmer-be-3d-printed | 09:47 |
| kanzure | "A 3D printable Mario Brothers RC controllable Turtle Shell Racer" | 09:47 |
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| kanzure | doh it's Jeff Scheumack <jeff@bioautomation.com> | 09:58 |
| kanzure | i wonder why my meetlog.txt repo is 967 MB | 10:02 |
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| Cat4D | http://webglsamples.googlecode.com/hg/aquarium/aquarium.html | 10:19 |
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| kanzure | heh.. so you could provide an aquarium simulation along with that 3d printed part for their aquarium | 10:21 |
| Cat4D | vis the part in design | 10:21 |
| * Cat4D did a rp fab which spit out thousands of game characters, porn figures a day... for a few months peak | 10:22 | |
| Cat4D | the porn figures started getting bigger than the breakeven on the materials | 10:22 |
| kanzure | huh there's no search results for this | 10:22 |
| kanzure | why isn't anyone doing custom aquarium pieces :( | 10:22 |
| Cat4D | i dont know about the biological aspects of hotglue | 10:23 |
| Cat4D | otherwise id suggest hotglue | 10:23 |
| Cat4D | -- remember also plastics leech and are toxic | 10:23 |
| Cat4D | use fda cert plastics | 10:23 |
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| kanzure | hmm.. http://lanyrd.com/guides/diybio/ links to http://lanyrd.com/2012/openly-disruptive/ http://openlydisruptive.org/ which looks like kristina hathaway/raymond mccauley | 10:48 |
| kanzure | conference topics look a little lame | 10:48 |
| kanzure | ah it's dan reus. whatever. | 10:48 |
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| _F7_ | huh? implants? | 11:39 |
| _F7_ | Sugru? | 11:39 |
| _F7_ | not hot glue, ffs | 11:39 |
| ThomasEgi | how bout medical grade silicone^? | 11:39 |
| _F7_ | Sugru sets up well | 11:40 |
| _F7_ | siloxanes are varied | 11:40 |
| _F7_ | I wouldn't hold the findings of Lepht Anonym to highly | 11:41 |
| _F7_ | *too | 11:41 |
| _F7_ | but silicone seems like solid advice. I'd like to see an animal study on hot-glue covered crap. | 11:42 |
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| ThomasEgi | the problem with hot glue and most silicones is the variation in quality. | 11:44 |
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| ThomasEgi | while high quality of each works out rather good. you can always get a batch of hot glue/silicone that has some impurities. | 11:45 |
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| ThomasEgi | like some heavy metal traces or so. | 11:45 |
| _F7_ | ah | 11:45 |
| ThomasEgi | getting medical grade silicone is not that hard in most countries. it is often used to make molds and stuff. | 11:45 |
| ThomasEgi | altho it usualy isnt certified for implantation. at least you get a good quality controll. | 11:46 |
| _F7_ | who is implanting what? | 11:46 |
| kanzure | splicer: have you visited hackteria yet | 11:47 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: i know someone at GE healthcare, I will ask about AKTA... though i dunno if they can get that info | 11:48 |
| nmz787 | price i mean | 11:48 |
| nmz787 | hah, oligator is a pretty good name | 11:49 |
| nmz787 | kinda stupid, but funny stupid | 11:49 |
| kanzure | nah i'm sure the price is >$100k | 11:50 |
| nmz787 | would be cool to see cathal in SF | 11:51 |
| kanzure | haha chandni emailed me and introduced herself as "nathan mccorkle GF resume" | 11:53 |
| kanzure | that makes me sad.. | 11:54 |
| kanzure | she thinks i don't know her name | 11:54 |
| nmz787 | nah i told her to do that | 11:54 |
| nmz787 | so it would hopefully not get lost in the 80 billion trillion other emails you get | 11:54 |
| kanzure | my inbox is exploding today :( | 11:55 |
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| nmz787 | so i'm drivin to sf for the june meeting | 11:57 |
| nmz787 | not sure what route to take | 11:57 |
| nmz787 | i guess it depends on if I also move out at the same time | 11:57 |
| kanzure | jetblue is showing me a $50 ticket haha | 11:57 |
| nmz787 | lol | 11:57 |
| kanzure | fbi will pay you for gas i think | 11:57 |
| nmz787 | yep | 11:57 |
| nmz787 | already mentioned it | 11:57 |
| kanzure | last year i asked them if they would let me charge a private jet to them | 11:58 |
| kanzure | they weren't happy about that question | 11:58 |
| nmz787 | hahhahhahh | 11:58 |
| nmz787 | govt has enough overhead already, and you want a private jet | 11:59 |
| nmz787 | i'd be more pissed if they let you, since i didnt even think to ask that | 11:59 |
| kanzure | Cat4D: that's one long email :) thank you | 11:59 |
| Cat4D | its a horrible scribble | 11:59 |
| Cat4D | which fbi? /me is from big island! haz great crack with volcano! | 12:00 |
| nmz787 | there might be something interesting here:ftp://ftp.bbc.purdue.edu/ | 12:00 |
| kanzure | Cat4D: weapons of mass destruction directorate | 12:00 |
| nmz787 | the u.s. fbi | 12:00 |
| Cat4D | you might like http://obsama.com/#snow | 12:01 |
| kanzure | http://web.archive.org/web/20080708235522/http://www.fbi.gov/hq/nsb/wmd/images/hrtppe.jpg | 12:01 |
| Cat4D | lol ct bunnysuit | 12:02 |
| * Cat4D places floppy pancake on head, kanzure knows why, spherical! | 12:03 | |
| kanzure | oops my bad | 12:04 |
| kanzure | it's the Biological Countermeasures Unit | 12:04 |
| kanzure | under the Weapons of Mass Destruction program | 12:05 |
| Cat4D | ya, the idiots who used me as a training target for 3 years, every time i went to supermarket, they said I dispersed toxins/etc, even tried to run me over with the balloon tire catapiller truck | 12:06 |
| Cat4D | they did do a good job of proving that contagens could be introduced through food packaging, took over then entire industry | 12:11 |
| Cat4D | scratch and sniff boxes, especially | 12:11 |
| Cat4D | and honey wheat thins pictures | 12:12 |
| nmz787 | triscuits beat wheat thins IMO | 12:12 |
| Cat4D | for transporting and global distribution of bio weapons? | 12:13 |
| nmz787 | nah, taste | 12:13 |
| nmz787 | unless you're allergic to gluten, then both screw you up pretty bad | 12:13 |
| * Cat4D pets Perro, the gluton | 12:14 | |
| kanzure | http://extremelongevity.net/2012/04/18/more-on-buckyballs-and-lifespan-extension/ | 12:14 |
| kanzure | "I saw your comment: "C60 is actually available for around $40 per gram, and can even be purchased mixed into an anti-aging skin cream. In theory, a bold person could begin taking it as a supplement now. Since he saw its effects firsthand, I aksed Dr Moussa if he started to take it. ”No,” he said. ”I do not consume C60 at this time.”" | 12:14 |
| kanzure | "The way Dr. Moussa said "consume" made me wonder if there was a way to consume C60 orally. I came across this "blog", so I wonder if anyone saw this before:" | 12:14 |
| kanzure | http://smarteconomy.typepad.com/smart_economy/2010/05/novel-safe-natural-food-supplement-hydrated-fullerenes-c60hyfn-or-watersoluble-buckyballs-could-make.html | 12:14 |
| kanzure | "Novel, safe natural food supplement, hydrated fullerenes (C60-HyFn) or water-soluble buckyballs could make 50-60 % of the riskier synthetic drugs and pharmaceuticals obsolete by 2025-30" | 12:15 |
| kanzure | "UPDATE Nov 2010: HYFNs have been approved for manufacturing as Fullerene Water Solution (FWS) drink in Ukraine by the Ministry of Health as of Nov 2010. It's the first nanotech based health drink in the world. For information about availability contact me privately by email."" | 12:15 |
| * Cat4D notes c-60 erroneously in earlier context, references http://obsama.com/anfo.txt | 12:15 | |
| kanzure | Cat4D: what? hawaiin book burning due to kilauea? | 12:19 |
| Cat4D | library.royalgardens.us ? | 12:19 |
| kanzure | yeah | 12:20 |
| kanzure | what's going on | 12:20 |
| kanzure | what am i looking at | 12:20 |
| Cat4D | dunno? | 12:20 |
| * Cat4D ponders what kanzure is looking at... there's quite a few options | 12:21 | |
| nmz787 | i don't see how fullerenes can be anti-oxidants,, they would have to be reduced, meaning gaining electrons, then wouldn't they either gain an H or the oxidative group | 12:22 |
| nmz787 | i guess that could work | 12:22 |
| nmz787 | cat4d the text you sent doesn't seem to say anything at all | 12:22 |
| Cat4D | sheesh, which? | 12:22 |
| nmz787 | anfo | 12:23 |
| Cat4D | of course obsama is not conclusive, they try to kill me frequently | 12:23 |
| Cat4D | .ie consulate disposed of it recovered from see-also:books | 12:23 |
| Cat4D | the ndrf/nisp | 12:23 |
| Cat4D | more important, of course, is that dhs made that disappear from regulations.gov | 12:24 |
| Cat4D | my crew pulled most of the firining lines off the boats with the ndrf staff, see also http://fleetrevealed.com << pretty pictures | 12:25 |
| nmz787 | why were they toxic vessels? | 12:27 |
| nmz787 | toxic aesthetically? | 12:27 |
| Cat4D | big topic, | 12:27 |
| Cat4D | suisun bay water quallity control board federal court case (searching) | 12:28 |
| Cat4D | sf bay rather SFRWQCB? | 12:28 |
| Cat4D | try http://platinum-ii.in in the videos see epa | 12:28 |
| Cat4D | here http://platinum-ii.in/vid/ | 12:30 |
| Cat4D | paint chips, machine goo, oil, asbestos, pcb, any other leaking stuff | 12:31 |
| Cat4D | also that boat and the other one did the mumbai/bombay bombing attack, according to DEA who designed it (ATS.in) | 12:32 |
| nmz787 | i'm sorry to say it, thought that site has interesting pics of a sinking ship, its written horribly and seems like most people would pass it up as fake/hype | 12:33 |
| Cat4D | not to mention the ss norway ( "sister ship link) | 12:33 |
| Cat4D | yep, we've done a lot of work on this legal requirement | 12:33 |
| Cat4D | except the linguistic analysis system tends to use 1999 jargon and phrase structure | 12:33 |
| nmz787 | that still doesnt make sense | 12:33 |
| Cat4D | a syntatic analysis of all of those are generated from the same system (except anfo, but that follows the same structure) | 12:34 |
| Cat4D | http://platinum-ii.in/bn is more direct | 12:34 |
| nmz787 | why would anyone do that? | 12:35 |
| Cat4D | legal liability? these are some potent problems | 12:36 |
| Cat4D | it.never.says.anything.explicitly = true; | 12:36 |
| nmz787 | legal liability in the age of torrent? | 12:36 |
| Cat4D | not to mention view-source:obsama.com | 12:36 |
| Cat4D | go read bluenorway bn archive | 12:37 |
| Cat4D | sorry i got wrong url http://platinum-ii.in/bn/bluenorway.html | 12:37 |
| nmz787 | videos say the ship was banned by u.s. epa | 12:39 |
| nmz787 | sounds legit to me | 12:39 |
| Cat4D | legit how? | 12:39 |
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| nmz787 | that our government is keeping a ship with toxic paint out of our coasts | 12:40 |
| @kanzure | Cat4D: please stick to CAD | 12:40 |
| * Cat4D is a trans-temporal cat, sorry, got ahead for once | 12:40 | |
| Cat4D | its american | 12:40 |
| Cat4D | it wasnt allowed to leave | 12:40 |
| @kanzure | if you can't do that, you should leave | 12:40 |
| @kanzure | open knowledge foundation's hypothes.is alternative: https://github.com/okfn/annotator-store | 12:43 |
| @kanzure | well, i think it's hypothesis.is | 12:43 |
| @kanzure | something. | 12:43 |
| Cat4D | which cad/cam systems use the gpu for nurbs rendering? | 12:43 |
| @kanzure | http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3857057/nurbs-on-directx-11 | 12:46 |
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| Cat4D | nah, those are meshing functions | 12:47 |
| Cat4D | the only few that are real is the surflab and the berkeley owned by solidworks | 12:47 |
| Cat4D | (ive not checked solidworks binary if its included) | 12:48 |
| _F7_ | what is this fullerene nonsense | 12:48 |
| @kanzure | _F7_: beats me | 12:48 |
| _F7_ | It sounds like something that a highly publicized and poorly conducted study would stir up | 12:49 |
| _F7_ | soluble fullerenes? cool. In bottled water? WTF | 12:49 |
| @kanzure | haha yeah i agree it sounds fishy | 12:49 |
| ThomasEgi | ><@°‣ | 12:57 |
| ThomasEgi | fishy.. | 12:57 |
| Cat4D | what is a trans-humanist? | 12:58 |
| nmz787 | enhancing human experience through modification/technology | 12:59 |
| nmz787 | or human performance | 12:59 |
| ThomasEgi | in short: refusing to accept your limitations and push the it | 13:00 |
| * Cat4D double doses pramicetam with piramacetam and baarfs | 13:01 | |
| Cat4D | then british customs blacklists you | 13:01 |
| @kanzure | Cat4D: yep that's basically the story | 13:02 |
| nmz787 | meh, who likes britain anyway | 13:02 |
| Cat4D | qhi, but the result is an interpol listing | 13:02 |
| Cat4D | for pharmaceuticals | 13:02 |
| nmz787 | (at least their govt) (i'm U.S.... didn't we dump their tea in the harbor and call it a day) | 13:02 |
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| nmz787 | who is azonenberg? | 13:30 |
| nmz787 | he was just referenced in ##electronics | 13:30 |
| @kanzure | nmz787: he does the homecmos project | 13:31 |
| @kanzure | http://code.google.com/p/homecmos/ | 13:31 |
| nmz787 | "kludge: ask azonenberg about using a microscope objective as a beam former. It will take some machining work." | 13:32 |
| nmz787 | http://hackteria.org/?p=1186 | 13:32 |
| nmz787 | whoops | 13:32 |
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| @kanzure | hi rkos | 13:58 |
| rkos | hello | 13:58 |
| rkos | http://neuroskeptic.blogspot.com/2012/04/fixing-science-systems-and-politics.html interesting article | 13:59 |
| @kanzure | comments might be interesting on that | 14:01 |
| @kanzure | looks like 20 | 14:01 |
| @kanzure | ehh... http://openscienceframework.org/ | 14:01 |
| @kanzure | dunno why they don't team up with okfn | 14:01 |
| rkos | okfn? | 14:05 |
| rkos | well im off to sleep anyways.... | 14:05 |
| @kanzure | Pmc has 440k OA docs as a 1.2 TB FTP download, no need for bit torrent. | 14:07 |
| @kanzure | oh snap | 14:07 |
| @kanzure | pretty sure that's pubmedcentral.gvo | 14:07 |
| @kanzure | er, pubmedcentral.gov | 14:07 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: so no progress on the forum, the electronics guys think the bluray laser wont cut clear stuff (when i mentioned that to simon he said to add black carbon was an option... but then we cant do optics).... so it seems that we should use CO2, which means Simon might not be happy to help more (though that could be wrong) since its more expensive.... but also means more expensive optics | 14:08 |
| @kanzure | sounds fine to me | 14:08 |
| nmz787 | I guess I will stop by the EE shop i worked at this week to see if I can get some help | 14:08 |
| @kanzure | i am not sure why that youtube video shows a <1W bluray diode cutting things | 14:08 |
| nmz787 | i also know another guy, but he's pretty busy | 14:08 |
| nmz787 | well its black | 14:08 |
| nmz787 | so absorbs better in vis | 14:09 |
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| splicer | kanzure: on hackteria, yes I've seen it. Do you like it? | 14:20 |
| @kanzure | splicer: yeah of course | 14:20 |
| @kanzure | but no i meant have you seen them /in person/ | 14:20 |
| @kanzure | they are in switzerland | 14:20 |
| splicer | no... I'm in sweden | 14:21 |
| @kanzure | doh | 14:21 |
| splicer | ;) | 14:21 |
| @kanzure | i fail | 14:21 |
| splicer | I'd like to see someone create some form of ideology around biohacking... | 14:22 |
| @kanzure | don't we have enough biohacking ideology already? | 14:22 |
| splicer | do we have any that's new really? | 14:22 |
| splicer | that would not just be someone trying to fit some old ideology into it | 14:23 |
| @kanzure | feel free to rant about what you want to see | 14:23 |
| splicer | My problem is... I mostly know what I don't want to see | 14:23 |
| splicer | because it's already been done | 14:24 |
| splicer | biotech should give birth to something new... like info tech did | 14:24 |
| Cat4D | what is the size and material for the mill? | 14:25 |
| @kanzure | Cat4D: which mill? | 14:25 |
| Cat4D | your sanyo diode | 14:25 |
| @kanzure | doing a laser cutter | 14:25 |
| @kanzure | i think we have a >6" stage at the moment | 14:25 |
| @kanzure | <1 micron step size | 14:25 |
| @kanzure | want a laser spot size of 5-20 microns | 14:26 |
| @kanzure | well.. 1-20 microns. whatever. | 14:26 |
| Cat4D | the blue 1w sanyos from the projectors ( wickedlasers.com ) are 69 retail, but their "1w" is not comperable to 1w of ir/red bands | 14:26 |
| Cat4D | do you have enough stability to use a big condensor above? otherwise your lense (microscope?) will be an issue | 14:27 |
| @kanzure | haven't decided on lenses | 14:27 |
| Cat4D | the poly glass distorts green-blue-up bands | 14:27 |
| @kanzure | the material moves, not the laser | 14:28 |
| @kanzure | er, not the laser/mirrors | 14:28 |
| Cat4D | right, this is correct for small targets, so if you have a flat target surface, or control up stage, you can focus from outside | 14:29 |
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| Cat4D | but if you need 3d with large vert displacement, your condensor has to be designed accordingly | 14:29 |
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| @kanzure | Cat4D: are you familiar with condensors and picking out correct lenses | 14:30 |
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| @kanzure | yo yashgaroth | 14:30 |
| Cat4D | you can also code/prisim smaller sources to the same target each below cooking threshold | 14:30 |
| yashgaroth | why is the fbi meeting in the middle of the week | 14:30 |
| @kanzure | yashgaroth: because apparently nobody has jobs? | 14:30 |
| nmz787 | biz day? | 14:30 |
| nmz787 | the fbis job | 14:30 |
| nmz787 | they dont work weekends | 14:30 |
| * Cat4D schedules | 14:30 | |
| yashgaroth | bah, if I get a job I'm already taking 2 weeks in july, plus these 2 in SF, all on loaned vacation | 14:31 |
| Cat4D | kan do you have a material target profile, a range of materials, etc? | 14:31 |
| bkero | jobs? lul | 14:31 |
| @kanzure | Cat4D: pdms, acrylic, maybe glass | 14:31 |
| Cat4D | the focal point, especially at size, is your biggest issue | 14:31 |
| nmz787 | http://labs.nortd.com/lasersaur/ | 14:31 |
| Cat4D | you cant pass through something unless you plan for it | 14:32 |
| Cat4D | what type of stages? | 14:32 |
| nmz787 | custom | 14:32 |
| nmz787 | via acme screw | 14:32 |
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| Cat4D | at that resolution? | 14:33 |
| * Cat4D checks http://pi.com | 14:33 | |
| Cat4D | that fiberboard would prefer a 5w range | 14:34 |
| @kanzure | see also http://buildlog.net/cnc_laser/laser_calcs.h | 14:34 |
| @kanzure | gahh | 14:34 |
| @kanzure | http://buildlog.net/cnc_laser/laser_calcs.htm | 14:34 |
| nmz787 | we're not cutting fiberboard | 14:35 |
| nmz787 | we're cutting 50-250 microns of silicone or acrylic | 14:36 |
| nmz787 | and potentially glass | 14:36 |
| nmz787 | we'll def need a beam expander | 14:36 |
| nmz787 | from 2mm outta the laser to at least 15mm before being focused | 14:36 |
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| nmz787 | great the lasersaur wants money to get on their mailing list | 14:37 |
| @kanzure | haha ignore them | 14:38 |
| @kanzure | i remember when lasersaur was raising money | 14:38 |
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| @kanzure | http://gnusha.org/logs/2010-05-31.log | 14:38 |
| @kanzure | 2011-01-12.log:11:17 < kanzure> lasersaur got $20k and they haven't done /shit/ | 14:38 |
| @kanzure | 2011-02-04.log:10:08 < JayDugger> log.lasersaur.com redirects to a Flickr photo set | 14:38 |
| nmz787 | hmm | 14:38 |
| @kanzure | 2011-02-11.log:20:34 < kanzure> otoh, i do want to avoid situations like lasersaurus or openpcr or biocurious where people get money upfront and then sit around dicking off | 14:38 |
| nmz787 | hmm | 14:39 |
| nmz787 | lol | 14:39 |
| nmz787 | well i g2g to class | 14:39 |
| @kanzure | that was feb 2011 :( | 14:39 |
| nmz787 | ttyl | 14:39 |
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| Cat4D | lag, lemme look at specs | 14:56 |
| @kanzure | Cat4D: here's some more details.. http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?p=3871045 | 14:56 |
| Cat4D | lol thats useless without material's valuse ;) | 14:57 |
| Cat4D | anyways | 14:58 |
| Cat4D | 5w capable, depending on wavelength and material, is usually fine for small stuffs | 14:58 |
| Cat4D | i've cut circuit boards with 200 walmart 30cent pointers | 14:58 |
| Cat4D | what constraints do you have? | 14:59 |
| Cat4D | and please do NOT follow any instructions from reprap, they are disinfo | 15:00 |
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| Cat4D | the blue beam is easily focused, but you need to find out what your material responds to | 15:00 |
| @kanzure | haha yes we are ignoring reprap | 15:01 |
| Cat4D | a co2 ired generates heat | 15:01 |
| @kanzure | all custom (except linuxcnc) | 15:01 |
| Cat4D | but 1w of ired is 10x g/b | 15:01 |
| fenn | "i've cut circuit boards with 200 walmart 30cent pointers" really? how do you combine so many beams? | 15:01 |
| Cat4D | cone | 15:01 |
| Cat4D | or prism | 15:01 |
| Cat4D | 4in polarizer just in case | 15:02 |
| Cat4D | then the condensor stack | 15:02 |
| _F7_ | wait wtf you've made an array of cheap diod lasers? | 15:02 |
| fenn | i can't visualize that | 15:02 |
| Cat4D | rings | 15:02 |
| Cat4D | but 1watt r/g/b "output" are 50 $ | 15:02 |
| Cat4D | look at wickedlasers adverts | 15:03 |
| Cat4D | its a 69$ retail sanyo blue diode | 15:03 |
| Cat4D | with a good circuit and a battery | 15:03 |
| Cat4D | i use one of those for range scan in the volcano | 15:03 |
| @kanzure | sir i am in the market for an underground volcano lair | 15:03 |
| Cat4D | your typical overhead projector has the rest of the parts you need | 15:03 |
| @kanzure | do you happen to have real estate available for these purposes | 15:04 |
| Cat4D | 10k usd for 1/5 acre, 75ft of new lava surface, and very pretty views | 15:04 |
| @kanzure | thanks | 15:04 |
| @kanzure | is that per month | 15:04 |
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| fenn | location location location | 15:05 |
| fenn | you need a volcano with nearby airstrip and slope suitable for space launch railgun | 15:06 |
| yashgaroth | make sure you hire someone to check for 007s | 15:06 |
| @kanzure | hawaii? we can smoke stuff with garrett or wherever he is these days | 15:06 |
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| Cat4D_ | fking webchat | 15:06 |
| Cat4D_ | many lots alohaliving subdivision:"kalapana vacation lots" lava on one side ocean on the other, outright purchase, 25$ tax per year. | 15:06 |
| Cat4D_ | 7-12k for 1/5 acre | 15:07 |
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| @kanzure | okay cool. i was also looking at old missile silos as an option. | 15:07 |
| Cat4D_ | i got some of them too | 15:07 |
| Cat4D_ | setting up a museum in one cluster | 15:07 |
| fenn | god i hate forums | 15:07 |
| @kanzure | "A is for autoclave, B is for burner" | 15:08 |
| @kanzure | http://tequals0.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/a_is_for_autoclave1.pdf | 15:08 |
| yashgaroth | C is for cross-contamination | 15:08 |
| @kanzure | D is for drosophila? | 15:08 |
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| fenn | why does nathan want to use a blue diode instead of IR? | 15:09 |
| @kanzure | E is for ecoli | 15:09 |
| fenn | am i missing something here? | 15:09 |
| @kanzure | fenn: simon quellen field from diybio was recommending it | 15:09 |
| @kanzure | simon has some optics experience apparently | 15:09 |
| fenn | okay but why? | 15:09 |
| @kanzure | buut his answers to nathan's questions were really dismissive of using an actual laser tube | 15:09 |
| @kanzure | yeah, he sota dropped the ball on that | 15:09 |
| @kanzure | so anyway, we've been looking into it as an option | 15:09 |
| @kanzure | so far the consensus seems to be no | 15:09 |
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| fenn | i mean we are getting close to the diffraction limit for IR but still.. | 15:10 |
| fenn | "no" on what? | 15:10 |
| @kanzure | i don't know anyone with a diode-cutter anyway | 15:10 |
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| @kanzure | no on using a blue diode | 15:10 |
| fenn | why no? | 15:10 |
| @kanzure | they all seem to be <1W/mm or something | 15:11 |
| @kanzure | 1W isn't going to cut glass | 15:11 |
| fenn | we're not cutting glass | 15:11 |
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| fenn | also, the channel is tiny | 15:11 |
| Cat6D | a simple prism or mirror assy can easily merge beams, as long as you have them aligned sufficiently, otherwise you can do overlapping beam systems and have better continuity | 15:11 |
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| fenn | what is the required power density to vaporize PDMS and/or acrylic? | 15:12 |
| fenn | without these numbers we're flying blind | 15:12 |
| Cat6D | zero, fenn | 15:12 |
| Cat6D | its lim(0) | 15:12 |
| @kanzure | fenn: it might be nice to cut glass, but yes it's not a requirement | 15:12 |
| fenn | Cat6D: not true, there is thermal conductivity | 15:12 |
| @kanzure | "Petridish CEO Matt Salzberg on the Science Exchange Blog:" http://blog.scienceexchange.com/2012/03/guest-post-matt-salzberg/ | 15:12 |
| Cat6D | at point size also lim(0) | 15:12 |
| fenn | we're not dealing with points, the channel has a finite width | 15:13 |
| Cat6D | then you just flash it | 15:13 |
| fenn | ? | 15:13 |
| @kanzure | this is after pdms polymerizes | 15:14 |
| @kanzure | fenn: does this paper look useful? | 15:14 |
| @kanzure | http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpl/login.jsp?tp=&arnumber=4341853&url=http%3A%2F%2Fieeexplore.ieee.org%2Fiel5%2F4341639%2F4341640%2F04341853.pdf | 15:14 |
| @kanzure | "Relationships between laser power, pulses per inch, and laser traverse speed and ablation profile patterns are established. A strong linear relationship (R2=0.9951) between cut depth and laser power is demonstrated. " | 15:14 |
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| Cat8D | webchat is throttling... wtf | 15:15 |
| Cat8D | cut or print the mask, tie it to the ceiling mirror, which projects down through whatever lense (if needed) to the target | 15:15 |
| @kanzure | Cat8D: you could use another irc client.. what os are you on | 15:15 |
| @kanzure | Cat8D: we're not polymerizing pdms.. we're cutting it | 15:15 |
| Cat8D | its the isp above here thats the problem | 15:15 |
| Cat8D | with the fool usdoj wire taps | 15:16 |
| @kanzure | err, i mean, we're polymerizing pdms but then cutting it | 15:16 |
| fenn | i'm not sure we're inhabiting the same reality tunnel | 15:16 |
| Cat8D | so, figure out the cut energy required and your pass rate | 15:16 |
| fenn | yes exactly, that's what we're doing | 15:16 |
| Cat8D | and wether you need a direct target or passive material | 15:17 |
| @kanzure | fenn: is that the paper we need? also this should be in some charts somewhere on the interwebs.. | 15:17 |
| Cat8D | which then dictates your entry angle option | 15:17 |
| @kanzure | angle entry is perpendicular :P | 15:17 |
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| @kanzure | *entry angle | 15:17 |
| Cat8D | but you should be most concerned about the flashpoint energy, because your cut down deep will still heat the upper sections | 15:17 |
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| Cat8D | especially with micro scale films | 15:18 |
| Cat8D | or whatever you are building | 15:18 |
| @kanzure | microfluidic chips | 15:18 |
| Cat8D | dna channels | 15:18 |
| @kanzure | yep | 15:18 |
| Cat8D | why not composit them? is there much difference in layup vs cut? | 15:18 |
| Cat8D | and be sure to include what resulting surface characteristic you need, fenn | 15:18 |
| Cat8D | boiling poly makes a toxic mess | 15:19 |
| Cat8D | so your debris has to be accomoodated too, it will stick wherever you stick it | 15:19 |
| Cat8D | which means, typically, you still need two additinoal layup processes, film on both sides | 15:20 |
| Cat8D | after the cut | 15:20 |
| Cat8D | -- this has to be part of the rig | 15:20 |
| Cat8D | bonding can be done the same way | 15:20 |
| Cat8D | I assume you saw the solar furnace in the desert video last week? | 15:20 |
| * fenn grumbles about paywalls | 15:21 | |
| Cat8D | human should never be near those | 15:21 |
| fenn | here's the paper | 15:21 |
| fenn | http://fennetic.net/irc/laser_ablation_profile_power.pdf | 15:21 |
| Cat8D | yep | 15:21 |
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| Cat8D | haha not enuff pictuers in that | 15:23 |
| fenn | wtf is all this % stuff, can't they use acutal units? | 15:23 |
| Cat8D | no result graph either | 15:23 |
| Cat8D | but the words aer correct | 15:23 |
| @kanzure | gah "Power %" | 15:23 |
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| @kanzure | what the hell | 15:23 |
| @kanzure | oh fenn beat me to it | 15:23 |
| Cat8D | ok, so, you need a big tool and a gate | 15:23 |
| Cat8D | so yo udont care | 15:23 |
| Cat8D | you can always filter or sunglass the source | 15:24 |
| Cat8D | see if you can find a sufficient diode with 1-5w with controllable power | 15:24 |
| fenn | so it's a 60W CO2 laser tube running at 1060nm (prolly 1064nm) | 15:25 |
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| fenn | and 254cm/s movement | 15:25 |
| fenn | so, math time | 15:25 |
| Cat8D | ok, if you have this, great | 15:25 |
| Cat8D | 60w co2 is massive | 15:25 |
| Cat8D | what is its cut rate? | 15:25 |
| fenn | 254cm/s | 15:25 |
| Cat8D | cm2/s? | 15:25 |
| fenn | that doesn't make sense does it | 15:25 |
| @kanzure | fenn: says 60W | 15:26 |
| Cat8D | what is that example cutting? | 15:26 |
| @kanzure | damnit how is fenn reading faster than me | 15:26 |
| fenn | 2 cups of oolong :P | 15:26 |
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| Cat8D | what price for your 60w co2? couple hundred max | 15:27 |
| @kanzure | haven't picked one out yet | 15:27 |
| Cat8D | just remember your lenses have to be pure, especially at that power, you'll cook a microscope lense | 15:27 |
| @kanzure | what about 30W? | 15:27 |
| * Cat8D thinks um channels should be about 3w | 15:28 | |
| fenn | their full-depth channel is 700 microns wide, that's huge | 15:28 |
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| Cat8D | ok | 15:28 |
| Cat8D | so its blasting the entire channel one pass | 15:28 |
| Cat8D | stinky | 15:28 |
| @kanzure | yes .. although we could just cut a channel w/ edges | 15:28 |
| @kanzure | 100 micron-wide channels | 15:28 |
| @kanzure | but min. feature size involves things like curves at <100 microns | 15:29 |
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| n_bentha | yashgaroth! | 15:29 |
| yashgaroth | ! | 15:29 |
| n_bentha | you use UPS Next Day Air Saver® ? | 15:29 |
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| @kanzure | n_bentha: did he kill your colonies again | 15:29 |
| n_bentha | haha yes | 15:29 |
| Cat8D | ya, dont try to cut those, just goo them and let it settle cleanly | 15:29 |
| yashgaroth | I do occasionally why | 15:29 |
| n_bentha | but i redid the experiment w/ another minion, and they worked! | 15:29 |
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| n_bentha | yashgaroth: i was wondering around what time you expect them to deliver | 15:29 |
| @kanzure | Cat8D: "goo them"? | 15:30 |
| yashgaroth | uhh 11ish? | 15:30 |
| n_bentha | goo them! | 15:30 |
| Cat8D | vaporize debris, leave liquid material to coat the channel surface | 15:30 |
| n_bentha | 11am or pm? | 15:30 |
| yashgaroth | am | 15:30 |
| @kanzure | Cat8D: if we cut just the edges of the channels, we will probably use tape or some peel-off method to extract stuff | 15:31 |
| Cat8D | there are special mix poly for that, i assume you already checked through the options | 15:31 |
| @kanzure | no | 15:31 |
| @kanzure | don't assume anything like that :) | 15:31 |
| azonenberg | kanzure: i've done photolithography using homebrew technology at 20 micron feature sizes | 15:31 |
| @kanzure | azonenberg: so we're building a laser prototyping system so that i don't have to wait for things to set or make masks or do DLP | 15:31 |
| azonenberg | sorry for the slow response, was in a meeting on campus | 15:31 |
| azonenberg | Ok | 15:31 |
| n_bentha | :( they haven't delivered all day....stupid residential deliveries | 15:31 |
| @kanzure | azonenberg: how long was your build time? | 15:31 |
| azonenberg | kanzure: not very | 15:31 |
| @kanzure | well, more than 30min? | 15:32 |
| azonenberg | i already had a spin coater, printer, and microscope | 15:32 |
| @kanzure | no i mean per photolithographed design | 15:32 |
| azonenberg | oh | 15:32 |
| azonenberg | spin coat wafer = ~5 mins plus dry time on hot plate | 15:32 |
| @kanzure | sure sure | 15:32 |
| azonenberg | exposure depends on strength of the lamp but 5-10 mins | 15:32 |
| azonenberg | then develop is a minute or two | 15:32 |
| fenn | units '60W/(700micron*0.25*254cm/s)' = 13.5 J/cm^2 | 15:32 |
| Cat8D | cm3 fenn | 15:32 |
| azonenberg | i was etching copper about a micron thick | 15:32 |
| azonenberg | so the etch i used took like 15 seconds | 15:33 |
| @kanzure | azonenberg: exposure/curing took only 10min? | 15:33 |
| yashgaroth | oh well residential's a different matter...they don't really deliver after 3 | 15:33 |
| Cat8D | your material spec should have an energy rating that you can convert juels | 15:33 |
| azonenberg | kanzure: this is for photoresist | 15:33 |
| azonenberg | yes | 15:33 |
| azonenberg | i need a few hundred mJ/cm^2 | 15:33 |
| azonenberg | this is exposure, not ablation | 15:33 |
| n_bentha | ugh. i want to go to the gym from 6-9 | 15:33 |
| n_bentha | bastards! | 15:33 |
| @kanzure | i think we could probably use photoresist ? | 15:33 |
| azonenberg | Also, its positive resist | 15:34 |
| azonenberg | as in it starts out insoluble (in 1% NaOH) | 15:34 |
| azonenberg | upon exposure to light it becomes soluble | 15:34 |
| azonenberg | but its only meant as a masking material for acidic or neutral etches | 15:34 |
| yashgaroth | you sure you have to sign for it? | 15:34 |
| azonenberg | not for making permanent structures | 15:34 |
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| fenn | film thickness is 0.015 inch, so 3542 J/cm^3 | 15:34 |
| Cat8D | fenn reverse that math and solve based on material blasting value for the entire volume | 15:34 |
| fenn | sorry 0.0015 inch | 15:34 |
| azonenberg | other resists, like SU-8, are negative | 15:34 |
| @kanzure | azonenberg: there was this pdms / silicone polymer paper that said that typical cure time is 2 days.. unless you do 80C, then it's 4 hours | 15:34 |
| azonenberg | meaning they start out soluble | 15:34 |
| azonenberg | but become completely insoluble on exposure | 15:35 |
| azonenberg | and two days?? | 15:35 |
| Cat8D | .2m/sec is a lot of vibration too | 15:35 |
| azonenberg | normal IC fab exposure times with a ~2 kW lamp | 15:35 |
| * n_bentha is missing judo practice for this shit | 15:35 | |
| azonenberg | are like 15 seconds | 15:35 |
| @kanzure | well yeah that's 2 kW :) | 15:35 |
| @kanzure | interesting | 15:35 |
| azonenberg | i'm using a halogen which is only like 20W and doesnt emit very much UV | 15:35 |
| yashgaroth | well just judo the ups guy when he arrives | 15:35 |
| azonenberg | so after losses in the optics 10 mins is reasonable | 15:35 |
| azonenberg | but anything longer sounds totally unrealistic | 15:36 |
| azonenberg | that time, btw, is for the FOV of say a 10x microscope objective | 15:36 |
| azonenberg | larger is tricky | 15:36 |
| Cat8D | fenn what is your actual dissipation? | 15:38 |
| @kanzure | "The recommended cure time for Dow Corning Sylgard 184 is 2 hours at 65C. Increasing the process temperature increases the cure rate, so this time can be reduced to 1 hr at 75C or 30min at 85C. Similarly, decreasing the process temperature to room temperature increases the cure time to two days." | 15:38 |
| @kanzure | this is from http://gnusha.org/logs/2012-04-11.log | 15:38 |
| @kanzure | paper http://dspace.mit.edu/handle/1721.1/61615 | 15:38 |
| @kanzure | azonenberg: ^ | 15:39 |
| n_bentha | lol | 15:39 |
| @kanzure | oh actually, maybe sylgard 184 is not a photocurable? | 15:41 |
| @kanzure | that would make more sense | 15:41 |
| ParahSailin | sylgard 184 is just a two part thingy mix to cure | 15:44 |
| @kanzure | derp | 15:44 |
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| fenn | .015 inch is the correct thickness, so 354 J/cm^3 | 15:45 |
| azonenberg | kanzure: lol, that would make sense | 15:46 |
| azonenberg | because SU-8 cures in like 15 seconds of UV exposure i think | 15:46 |
| ParahSailin | su-8 needs to be cooked after exposure | 15:46 |
| azonenberg | ParahSailin: i'm talking about the exposure time | 15:46 |
| azonenberg | not post-bake and such | 15:46 |
| azonenberg | i think its comparable to normal photoresist | 15:46 |
| fenn | Cat8D: i dont know actual power dissipation, presumably it can be calculated from materials reference values | 15:46 |
| kanzure | well overall build time matters too | 15:46 |
| azonenberg | though i will say the only stuff i've actually used myself is shipley SP24D photoresist | 15:47 |
| ParahSailin | oh, yeah just misunderstood "cures" | 15:47 |
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| kanzure | laser cut for 10 minutes vs. photocure for 10min (but +2 hours baking) is way different | 15:47 |
| fenn | 2 hours is not too ba | 15:47 |
| fenn | ...d | 15:47 |
| fenn | hell i spend that long going over email and backlog each day :p | 15:48 |
| kanzure | 2 hours per compile will suck | 15:49 |
| fenn | how the hell does their laser move at 2.5 meters per second? | 15:51 |
| fenn | i'm finding this hard to believe | 15:51 |
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| kanzure | fenn: belt? | 15:53 |
| fenn | blah the manufacturer spec sheet is damaged | 15:54 |
| fenn | can anyone read this document? http://www.assuredlaser.com.au/english/laser_systems/product_line/specs/9200.pdf | 15:54 |
| Cat12D | 1982? | 15:56 |
| fenn | nevermind it probably doesn't even say what the max speed is (unusual, that) | 15:56 |
| fenn | what kind of spec sheet doesn't say how fast it goes | 15:56 |
| Cat12D | all the ones youve looked at | 15:57 |
| kanzure | OCR says it says "#$!$#*(*(*><.,,>>#@" | 15:57 |
| * Cat12D plays in lava | 15:58 | |
| ParahSailin | im not that good at regex kanzure | 15:59 |
| n_bentha | heya | 16:04 |
| n_bentha | fenn | 16:04 |
| n_bentha | i fixed ur pdf | 16:04 |
| n_bentha | i'll upload it hold on | 16:05 |
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| fenn | their spec sheets are useless, don't bother | 16:05 |
| fenn | i emailed ULS asking to verify the info from the paper | 16:05 |
| n_bentha | http://s000.tinyupload.com/?file_id=00620952405370662715 | 16:06 |
| n_bentha | and for future reference if your pdf's get jumbled: https://www.pdf-tools.com/osa/repair.aspx | 16:06 |
| n_bentha | stupid XL-9200 lazers | 16:07 |
| kanzure | the correct vernacular is lazors | 16:10 |
| n_bentha | oh. yashy: practice is at 7pm >.< | 16:11 |
| n_bentha | but still they better hurry up and deliver the goods! | 16:11 |
| kanzure | do you have a tracking number | 16:11 |
| n_bentha | yeah | 16:12 |
| Cat12D | laser lazors | 16:12 |
| fenn | i'm so sick of fucking companies and their bullshit price quote bullshit just fucking let me order it you fuckers | 16:12 |
| n_bentha | haha price quotes | 16:13 |
| kanzure | so how about a site that sits on top of these other sites | 16:13 |
| kanzure | and has pricing data from other users | 16:13 |
| fenn | "the product was not formulated for this application" SO FUCKING WHAT I WANT IT SELL IT TO ME | 16:13 |
| Cat12D | shopping.google.com has a few in the 400 range | 16:15 |
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| fenn | how can a standard dna synthesizer be so expensive? it's just valves and tubes | 16:24 |
| fenn | $150k go blow it out your ass | 16:24 |
| kanzure | fenn: i was talking with joe kaufman today about this, | 16:25 |
| kanzure | apparently he has 30 years of oligo industry experience | 16:25 |
| kanzure | it's something about purity or error rates | 16:26 |
| fenn | it's just parameter fiddling | 16:26 |
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| fenn | i could write a computer program to do it in a day | 16:26 |
| kanzure | although he also gave me the argument that nobody wants a desktop synthesizer because "you can just order it for $2 online" | 16:26 |
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| fenn | bullshit | 16:26 |
| fenn | nobody want to pay $150k for a desktop synthesizer when you can order it online | 16:26 |
| kanzure | he also claims that quake's pdms pressure valves don't work | 16:27 |
| fenn | that's a different issue | 16:28 |
| diginet | does anyone know roughly how long it would take to regenerate a pretty small plant from a callus culture? I've seen number s on the order of 2 months or so? | 16:28 |
| fenn | a bunch of valves and tubes doesn't cost $150k, plain and simple | 16:28 |
| fenn | if these machines were manufactured in the 80's, all the patents have expired by now | 16:28 |
| fenn | or $37.5k either, whatever | 16:29 |
| fenn | i imagine people would be interested in a modern device with ethernet+usb interface etc | 16:30 |
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| kanzure | yes | 16:30 |
| kanzure | also: tacking on software to old devices might be nice | 16:31 |
| fenn | oh like a interface kit? | 16:31 |
| kanzure | yes and replacing whatever version of DOS they are using :) | 16:31 |
| fenn | what happened to these companies, are they still around? | 16:32 |
| kanzure | yes there are a few | 16:32 |
| fenn | perhaps they could be persuaded to part with internal technical documentation | 16:32 |
| fenn | schematics etc | 16:32 |
| kanzure | applied bio got acquired and is no longer making them (joe k confirmed) | 16:32 |
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| kanzure | azco biotech is really just one guy who has a good site that makes him look larger | 16:32 |
| fenn | if anyone can actually find the documentation by now | 16:32 |
| kanzure | kaufman is doing a 192-column machine "not commercially available- contracted with something- modified vesion for Azco to sell in China" | 16:33 |
| kanzure | *version | 16:33 |
| kanzure | biolytics in freemont - he makes the blt 192, 384... dr. oligo | 16:33 |
| kanzure | GE bought AKTA and those are still being made http://www.gelifesciences.com/Images/highres/%C3%84KTA%20oligopilot%20w%20comp.jpg | 16:33 |
| kanzure | but this is also AKTA so i'm confused. http://www.avecia.com/Avecia/files/images/sub/pic/oligo-pic1.jpg | 16:34 |
| fenn | so many tubes | 16:34 |
| kanzure | he knew about gen9 bio (the blue heron spinoff) | 16:34 |
| fenn | dont they only need ~7 reagents | 16:34 |
| fenn | yeah the first pic looks correct | 16:35 |
| kanzure | these are still active: bioautomation, biolytics, azco, oligomaker in denmark, biosearch | 16:35 |
| kanzure | http://www.bioautomation.com/ | 16:35 |
| kanzure | http://www.biolytic.com/ | 16:36 |
| kanzure | http://www.azcobiotech.com/ | 16:36 |
| kanzure | i think this is biosearch? http://www.biosearchtech.com/ | 16:37 |
| kanzure | http://www.oligomaker.com/ | 16:37 |
| Cat12D | just take a picture of all of them, merge/solve, and make your own | 16:37 |
| kanzure | i think biosearch just does refurb | 16:37 |
| kanzure | joe k claims that the after-market is enough to support all the synthesis companies | 16:38 |
| fenn | what do these new machines cost? | 16:38 |
| kanzure | oligomaker is at least $60k euros | 16:38 |
| kanzure | joe k sold those synths i showed you yesterday for >$150k | 16:38 |
| kanzure | azco bought them or something | 16:39 |
| Cat12D | i have countries that will sponsor you if you do it good... | 16:39 |
| fenn | why is he selling used machines? | 16:39 |
| kanzure | Cat12D: orly? | 16:39 |
| kanzure | fenn: some synthesis company was liquidating | 16:39 |
| fenn | um, i mean why is azco selling used machines | 16:40 |
| fenn | he has his own product line | 16:40 |
| Cat12D | you gots some work to get clean tolerances | 16:40 |
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| n_bentha | omg i gots the package!!!! | 16:40 |
| -!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: archels, Thorbinator, malaimo | 16:40 | |
| katsmeow-afk | did the delivery guy live? | 16:40 |
| kanzure | fenn: i might have heard wrong :( | 16:41 |
| fenn | azco does sell "refurb machines" but their website sucks too much to access that page | 16:41 |
| n_bentha | i scared him real bad but i think he'll be alright | 16:41 |
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| kanzure | "Azco Biotech, Inc. 3626 Ocean Ranch Blvd, Oceanside, CA 92056" oh i thought they were in arizona | 16:42 |
| kanzure | "Prior to starting Azco, J was a Director of Business Develpment for Transgenomic from 1998 to 2004. He was a Business Development manager for Rohm and Haas from 1995 to 1998" | 16:43 |
| kanzure | huh, biz dev for haas | 16:43 |
| Cat12D | hey thats right next to my new googvoice fone number | 16:43 |
| Cat12D | kan / fenn did you find suitable parts? | 16:43 |
| fenn | i think raymond maccauley works for a synthesis company | 16:43 |
| fenn | Cat12D: what parts? | 16:43 |
| kanzure | no he worked for a sequencing company (illumina) | 16:43 |
| fenn | ah well that's boring | 16:44 |
| fenn | :) | 16:44 |
| kanzure | yep | 16:44 |
| kanzure | was it illumina? hrm | 16:44 |
| kanzure | haha google suggests "raymond mccauley illumina" as a search | 16:44 |
| kanzure | http://www.linkedin.com/in/raymondmccauley | 16:45 |
| kanzure | pfft lists him as working at genomera | 16:45 |
| kanzure | "Research Fellow, Scientific Advisory Board, DIYgenomics, 2010" | 16:45 |
| kanzure | aha yes it was illumina (solexa) | 16:45 |
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| fenn | what pdms thickness are we planning on using? | 16:47 |
| fenn | can we really spin coat whatever thickness we want? | 16:47 |
| fenn | they chose 0.015 inch film "because it was the thickest available" which seems like and odd choice | 16:48 |
| fenn | an* | 16:49 |
| kanzure | haven't determined yet | 16:49 |
| kanzure | btw, if it really only takes 10 minutes to photocure, should we do that? | 16:49 |
| kanzure | per azonenberg's experience | 16:49 |
| fenn | i was on the photocure bandwagon from the beginning | 16:50 |
| azonenberg | again this is for IC fab photoresist so i dont have any experience with photocuring polymers | 16:50 |
| azonenberg | spin coating thickness is dependent on spin speed and viscosity of the liquid | 16:51 |
| azonenberg | up to bounds where it doesnt spread uniformly | 16:51 |
| azonenberg | i've done films ranging from probably a couple of microns to tens of nm | 16:51 |
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| fenn | this method of squeezing pdms between two plates has been used to make films down to 50um: http://blogs.rsc.org/chipsandtips/2012/04/18/easy-and-inexpensive-fabrication-of-pdms-films-of-different-thicknesses/ | 16:57 |
| fenn | i'm wondering what hardness is being used | 16:57 |
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| fenn | i'm currently trying to sample some UV cure "flexible" epoxy (hardness 95 shore A) | 16:57 |
| fenn | manufacturer is being a bitch though | 16:58 |
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| kanzure | "/chipsandtips/2012/04/18/" | 17:04 |
| kanzure | 1) that's a really horrible blog name ("chips and tips".. and dip?) | 17:04 |
| kanzure | 2) from today? | 17:05 |
| fenn | apparently | 17:06 |
| fenn | there are photocure PDMS resins available, i.e. gelest RMS-033 | 17:07 |
| fenn | another terrible website.. submitted an info request | 17:07 |
| fenn | chips and tips is interesting read http://blogs.rsc.org/chipsandtips/ | 17:10 |
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| kanzure | yeah | 17:24 |
| kanzure | i like | 17:24 |
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| fenn | i'd imagine a harder material can be used if the film thickness is smaller | 17:30 |
| fenn | epoxy might not have the porosity problems of PDMS | 17:30 |
| kanzure | acrylic too :p | 17:30 |
| fenn | i guess you could make acrylic films by solvent evaporation (it dissolves in acetone i think) | 17:31 |
| kanzure | or you can just etch a depth into a thicker sheet and bond the exposed side to your other material | 17:34 |
| fenn | "We would like to acknowledge a grant provided by the Department of Science and Technology, Government of India" | 17:37 |
| fenn | why doesn't the US fund stuff like this? | 17:37 |
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| fenn | "stuff like this" = paper on how to connect tubing to microfluidics chips | 17:38 |
| kanzure | there's lots of tubing papers out there :x | 17:38 |
| fenn | i guess i'm just annoyed by the general poor quality of "how to" information | 17:39 |
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| kanzure | http://fiji.sc/cgi-bin/gitweb.cgi | 18:17 |
| kanzure | http://fiji.sc/wiki/index.php/Fiji | 18:17 |
| kanzure | imagej gui | 18:17 |
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| kanzure | hackerspace space fed / darpa call going on at the moment.. https://atrium.schoolfactory.org/spacefed/node/106574#comment-3283 | 18:40 |
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| brownies | is that about hackerspaces, or about space, that big empty thing out there? | 19:44 |
| kanzure | On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 PM, David Treadwell wrote: | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > Bryan, excellent news! | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > Why yes, I do have some experience with photocurable polymers. Some years | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > ago, I was asked to develop a dental restoration composite, which I did. It | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > never did become a commercial product, but the system worked well. | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > Trust me, if dental composites took 15 minutes to cure, or had to be baked | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > at all, no dentist would ever use them. A typical dental composite might | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > take under a minute's exposure to high-intensity blue light. Other systems | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > can be much, much faster. | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > There are a number of systems in common use based on either radical or | 19:44 |
| kanzure | > acid polymerization. There may be a few others I don't know about (yet). | 19:44 |
| kanzure | brownies: hackerspaces. some hackerspace org got a DARPA grant for space exploration. i don't know. | 19:44 |
| kanzure | fenn: implicitcad update? | 19:47 |
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| brownies | kanzure: interesting. | 19:53 |
| kanzure | nmz787: check backlog. http://gnusha.org/logs/2012-04-18.log | 19:53 |
| nmz787 | k | 19:55 |
| kanzure | http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/02/open-science-revolt-occupies-congress/ | 20:12 |
| kanzure | http://blog.okfn.org/2012/04/17/launching-the-open-data-census-2012/ | 20:15 |
| kanzure | http://www.dontpaytwice.org/ | 20:15 |
| kanzure | huh.. "The World Bank adopted an OA policy today for peer-reviewed articles, research reports, and monographs, to take effect July 1, 2012." | 20:16 |
| kanzure | http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2012/apr/09/frustrated-blogpost-boycott-scientific-journals | 20:17 |
| kanzure | what is this scraping? http://openingscience.org/archive | 20:17 |
| kanzure | it looks like it might be either (a) manually currated or (b) watching some RSS feeds | 20:18 |
| kanzure | eww it's tumblr? | 20:18 |
| kanzure | linkbaity title from figshare :| http://figshare.com/blog/A%20YouTube%20%20for%20Scientists/11 | 20:19 |
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| nmz787 | ok up to speed kanzure | 21:04 |
| kanzure | cool | 21:06 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: fenn: photocure + cast and peel won't let us do clean interconnects... becase if we have a post in the mold, the liquid PDMS will wick/surface tension up the post and will look like a volcano/mountain after being peeling, instead of just a hole | 21:06 |
| nmz787 | its good to know the quake valves have some mistrust | 21:06 |
| nmz787 | but they're all over the place in lit, so tho general concept seems alright | 21:06 |
| katsmeow-afk | coat them with something PDMSphilic and maybe won't wick | 21:07 |
| kanzure | yeh i'd like to meet someone who can explain why they are so (apparently) "terrible" | 21:07 |
| nmz787 | I can cut PDMS no prob with a 25W CO2 laser at ~110 micron spot, but I don't remember what speed that was | 21:07 |
| kanzure | what's the min. power to cut acrylic with standard laser cutters? | 21:08 |
| kanzure | i have a chart somewhere.. bleh | 21:08 |
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| nmz787 | derr | 21:13 |
| nmz787 | i dunno | 21:13 |
| nmz787 | simon said 30W/cm^2 | 21:13 |
| nmz787 | with 40W tube, 64,000 watts/sq mm into a 25*25 micron square | 21:14 |
| nmz787 | sorry he said sq mm | 21:14 |
| nmz787 | not cm | 21:14 |
| nmz787 | "If you are cutting through 3 mil plastic, you will want 30 watts persquare millimeter, and you will be able to cut over 300 millimetersper minute" | 21:15 |
| nmz787 | 3 mil is 76.2 microns | 21:15 |
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| nmz787 | we wanna cut 60-250 microns | 21:16 |
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| Cat4D | yes, thats correct | 21:22 |
| Cat4D | you can always reduce the energy both between and typically on the device | 21:23 |
| nmz787 | Cat4D: are you talkin to me ? | 21:23 |
| Cat4D | but you want to concentrate on how you will keep your edges clean and the response of the material after zapping | 21:24 |
| Cat4D | about you toward kanzure | 21:24 |
| nmz787 | not sure what you mean by reducing the energy between or on the device | 21:24 |
| Cat4D | the light poly doesnt have much tendency to deform, but if you flash it too fast, it will pull | 21:24 |
| fenn | nmz787: any reason we can't sandwich it between glass when casting? i don't think relying on surface tension for flatness is a good idea in the first place | 21:24 |
| Cat4D | filter, prism, % pass mirror, etc | 21:25 |
| fenn | just put a large circle in the photocure pattern in the first place | 21:25 |
| Cat4D | fenn, unless its bound entirely, it may still pull | 21:25 |
| Cat4D | but this can be handled with a pulse pattern | 21:26 |
| nmz787 | fenn: spin coating is a proven technique, i trust one plate vs two plates for flatness | 21:26 |
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| Cat4D | or more complex tooling shape | 21:26 |
| nmz787 | with spin coating, we know at least one side is smooth, the other side depends on the manufacturing tolerance of the surface... though i guess float glass should be pretty smooth | 21:27 |
| fenn | i figure if we have to cast it at all, might as well cast it with the pattern we want in the first place | 21:27 |
| ParahSailin | pdms will stick to float glass | 21:27 |
| nmz787 | Cat4D: we want to avoid pulsing, we don't want a dot matrix print job, we want REAL vector lines | 21:27 |
| fenn | use a mylar transfer layer | 21:27 |
| ParahSailin | the thing with pdms is that smoothness doesnt matter | 21:28 |
| ParahSailin | the stuff is an elastomer | 21:28 |
| nmz787 | Cat4D: not sure why we'd have a filter, prism, or $ pass mirror | 21:28 |
| fenn | right | 21:28 |
| Cat4D | what cooling/cure method do you need with those materials? | 21:28 |
| nmz787 | well, by smoothness i mean uniform thickness | 21:28 |
| fenn | er, wait, you're both wrong | 21:28 |
| fenn | say what you mean dammit :P | 21:29 |
| fenn | flatness doesn't matter, smoothness does matter | 21:29 |
| nmz787 | you mix PDMS with some crosslinking agent, spin-coat/press between plates in a sandwich, then bake at 80 C for two hours | 21:29 |
| Cat4D | pdms wont pull away from the channel too much? | 21:29 |
| nmz787 | uniform thickness matters to me | 21:29 |
| fenn | 2 hours? | 21:29 |
| ParahSailin | pdms deforms real easily | 21:30 |
| nmz787 | smoothness too, but that should be pretty good anyway as long as the plate is clean | 21:30 |
| ParahSailin | as long as there is no gross uniformity, it will flow to fill in | 21:30 |
| kanzure | my materials dood is saying photocuring should take less than 10min | 21:30 |
| Cat4D | if you use two modes (2d tool), you should be able to clear and then surface the target channel | 21:30 |
| nmz787 | PDMS doesnt photocure | 21:30 |
| kanzure | could we find a photocuring silicone polymer thing | 21:30 |
| fenn | yes | 21:30 |
| ParahSailin | why you want photocure? | 21:31 |
| kanzure | digital light projection | 21:31 |
| kanzure | micromirror array from texas instruments | 21:31 |
| kanzure | shine light with picoprojector | 21:31 |
| kanzure | change mask without fucken masks | 21:31 |
| fenn | gelest RMS-033 is a photocure siloxane rubber | 21:31 |
| nmz787 | then we're limited by pixel size and chip resolution | 21:31 |
| ParahSailin | i dont think pdms is very photodefinable | 21:31 |
| kanzure | nmz787: true.. but same thing with a laz0r | 21:31 |
| kanzure | i suppose smooth movement with a stage would be nice | 21:32 |
| fenn | a laser plotter would have higher resolution | 21:32 |
| ParahSailin | thought you guys were going with ablation etching | 21:32 |
| nmz787 | except lazor is being designed for 6x6inch with 0.19 micron step resolution | 21:32 |
| kanzure | so did i | 21:32 |
| fenn | DMD is just faster | 21:32 |
| fenn | anyway, i'm buying cheap stuff on ebay just to see if it works | 21:32 |
| nmz787 | oh I forgot to mention degassing | 21:32 |
| nmz787 | before spinning and baking | 21:32 |
| nmz787 | or sandwiching and baking | 21:33 |
| nmz787 | what are we talking about to see if it works? the CNC gantry? | 21:33 |
| fenn | well i have some steppers + linear slides already | 21:33 |
| fenn | so i got some $2 laser modules and lenses | 21:33 |
| nmz787 | I already have done above steps from sylgard 184 from fedex to cutting with CO2 laser and metrology with interferometer | 21:33 |
| fenn | if the spot size is so small, i don't believe the laser must have a high power | 21:34 |
| fenn | havent done the calculations yet | 21:34 |
| nmz787 | right | 21:34 |
| nmz787 | i did exp with a 25 or 30W CO2 laser with a ~100 micron spot size | 21:35 |
| nmz787 | so logically a smaller spot will work better | 21:35 |
| nmz787 | or the same with less power | 21:35 |
| fenn | you fucked up the square conversion again | 21:35 |
| nmz787 | which? | 21:35 |
| fenn | units 'sqrt(300mW/(30W/mm^2))' = 100 micron | 21:35 |
| nmz787 | dunno where you're gettin 300mW | 21:36 |
| fenn | its my $2 laser diode's rated power | 21:36 |
| ParahSailin | one of the nice things about solid photoresists is that the photoacid doesnt diffuse very quickly in solid phase | 21:36 |
| kanzure | fenn: send me ebay links to buy things :( | 21:36 |
| ParahSailin | allowing decent aspect ratios | 21:36 |
| nmz787 | the actual measured beam width that i used was ~100 microns as measured | 21:36 |
| fenn | oh sorry i misread that | 21:37 |
| nmz787 | the actual laser tube power i used was 25 or 30W | 21:37 |
| nmz787 | max power | 21:37 |
| fenn | apologies | 21:37 |
| nmz787 | k | 21:37 |
| nmz787 | sry i am up 16 hours now on 3 hours sleep | 21:37 |
| nmz787 | so i should really get to bed | 21:38 |
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| fenn | yes go to bed, i will make some cad models | 21:38 |
| nmz787 | can you please write down the maths you do | 21:38 |
| fenn | i pushed to diyhpluswiki | 21:38 |
| nmz787 | ok, what is the link :( | 21:38 |
| nmz787 | i need to bookmark it to the back of my eyelids | 21:38 |
| kanzure | history: http://diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki | 21:39 |
| fenn | http://diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/tree/projects/laser_etcher | 21:39 |
| kanzure | actual file: http://diyhpl.us/wiki/projects/laser_etcher | 21:39 |
| kanzure | ok fenn's link is prolly better | 21:39 |
| nmz787 | fenn, the paper mentioned used 1064nm, CO2 is 10600nm | 21:40 |
| fenn | i wish the u prefex for micro- worked by default in units | 21:40 |
| fenn | er, really | 21:40 |
| fenn | it was 10.6 something, guess that's not 1064 | 21:41 |
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| nmz787 | yah, 1064 is some nd:yag or crap, one of those DPSS i think | 21:41 |
| kanzure | fenn: just fyi i don't think nmz787 knows about the all mighty magic of 'units' | 21:41 |
| kanzure | but he's on ubuntu so he could install it / or already has it | 21:42 |
| nmz787 | heh, i'm on windows 7 with a dual core i7 8gb ram... with virtualbox ubuntu | 21:42 |
| nmz787 | theres also frink, which i've not learned, but a roomie uses for crazy conversions | 21:43 |
| kanzure | that sounds completely unnecessary | 21:43 |
| nmz787 | :P | 21:43 |
| nmz787 | i like oneNote | 21:43 |
| nmz787 | at least the i7 does some alright hardware virtualization support | 21:43 |
| kanzure | yeah i am using an i7 in my laptop too | 21:44 |
| nmz787 | well physicsforums.com blows... 210 views 0 replies on the laser optics question i posted | 21:44 |
| kanzure | NEWB might be throwing them off | 21:44 |
| kanzure | write it out:P it's "newbie" | 21:44 |
| nmz787 | maybe | 21:44 |
| fenn | "Frink allows Object-Oriented Programming, which allows you to create complex data structures that are still easy to use." er... okay | 21:45 |
| nmz787 | guess i'm too hacker for the physisiststststs | 21:45 |
| kanzure | or noob, n00b, newbie, etc. | 21:45 |
| yashgaroth | nub, nublar | 21:45 |
| fenn | units is just a calculator with unit conversion | 21:45 |
| kanzure | show him a demo | 21:46 |
| fenn | it doesn't have variables or arbitrary unit creation, unfortunately | 21:46 |
| kanzure | you can modify the data file | 21:46 |
| fenn | kitty:~/fab/diyhpluswiki/projects$ units inch mm * 25.4 | 21:46 |
| fenn | er, that didn't paste right | 21:46 |
| fenn | really he should just install it and try it, there's no excuse not to | 21:47 |
| nmz787 | we should tell people we're using wavelets... then they might think we are actually doing more than systems integration... | 21:47 |
| nmz787 | lol, ok, i will install tomorrow | 21:47 |
| kanzure | sudo apt-get install units | 21:48 |
| nmz787 | k | 21:48 |
| nmz787 | that package cant be authenticated | 21:48 |
| nmz787 | !!! | 21:48 |
| kanzure | aroo? | 21:48 |
| nmz787 | that garbage popped up yesterday when i installed something too | 21:49 |
| nmz787 | no idea why | 21:49 |
| fenn | maybe you messed up your keychain | 21:50 |
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| nmz787 | i think it started after i dpkg -i a .deb | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | which failed, then i aptget install -f it | 21:51 |
| kanzure | that shouldn't cause it | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | fixed the package deps | 21:51 |
| kanzure | jrayhawk: help? | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | yeah, so whatev, its not broken | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | unless my VM is somehow hacked | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | all my sandbox sekrets! | 21:51 |
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| nmz787 | so i said 5 mm | 21:57 |
| nmz787 | then said microns | 21:57 |
| nmz787 | and it spit out 5000 (newline) / 0.0002 | 21:58 |
| nmz787 | dunno what the 0.0002 is | 21:58 |
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| kanzure | oh it might be just 'micron' | 22:00 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: chandni is really good with complex maths, like all them symbols and abstract stuffs | 22:02 |
| nmz787 | so if u know anyone note in security, but needin some math translator/fluent type | 22:03 |
| nmz787 | send her resume that way too | 22:03 |
| kanzure | right | 22:11 |
| * kanzure sleeps | 22:11 | |
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| jrayhawk | apt-cache search archive-keyring | 23:32 |
| jrayhawk | oh i guess it's just ubuntu-keyring in ubuntu-land | 23:34 |
| jrayhawk | kinda sad | 23:34 |
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| --- Log closed Thu Apr 19 00:00:42 2012 | ||
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